[R#186] T#186-T#197 Patch Discussion

**walkman** · 25-05-14, 21:56

Originally Posted by Dasore

viable setups for pvp? i can at least give ya 10 setups for pe i already tried at vedenna.
used weapons: pot/ttepic/plasma wave/xbow/rolh/libi/wyat/tsu epic/desperado/rog with and without psi setup.

And? I saw only one good setup on PE: low tech + libby/pain easer/etc. And still, when you cut half life on tank you possible already died.

Originally Posted by Dasore

why tank got the most con and best armor? cause they cant stealth?

Tell me this again when you got 3 stacks from devo, ha!

Originally Posted by Dasore

no pvp subskills like hacking?

Xpertz shares own accounts, ask Systemshock, for instance, about that. Hacker for OP? Or for what? Multi-accounting rulez. Ask everybody on server.

Originally Posted by Dasore

tank the fastest class? run with your weapon pulled and tell me that again.

Wear/hide in less then second. This is all answer. Aim? Close to victim as possible, then wear weapon and got 100% aim in less 1 second. Then burn victim in 5 seconds and see how he doing nothing and died.

Originally Posted by Dasore

120+ athletics... plz stop trolling, thats no con setup that is total crap, no resists?

I did not said that you must spend all point in athletics. Just install implants to improve that. While other classes can't do such things. This is too expensive for them. Wear TL 70 flamer and burn everyone around you. That's future of Neocron.

Originally Posted by Dasore

Leveling as pistol is the same as with hc, you just approach the fight a bit different, raypistols at regant, rocket pistols in crp caves, beam pistols/plasmas vs warbots, firemobs. i dont see any problem.

I did not point PvE above. Try self, how aim works. Do you see any differences? I am not. All the same. I had got less misses with heavy weapons then pistol. This is my opinion.

Originally Posted by Dasore

what implants are useless? the only real useless onces are probably the +X con chips, that moveon/marine needs rebalancing is true, same with the psi implants.

Ah, yes. Tanks should be much stronger. Even when they are strongest class already.

**Drachenpaladin** · 25-05-14, 22:09

Originally Posted by walkman

Aiming speed you say? Its almost the same for all types of weapons. Especially in close range combat, i.e. 100% aim in 1-1.5 second.

With HC weapons? At what skill setup?

**walkman** · 25-05-14, 22:22

Originally Posted by Drachenpaladin

With HC weapons? At what skill setup?

With any weapons. The longest aim have only rifles. I suppose everybody read how many points spend to get best aim speed. Someone have even source code of the game.

http://www.techhaven.org/resources/w...nce-guide.html

So, if you smart enough you know how many points put in each skill to get best aiming. The only one problem here, that only few people know what "Base" value is set for each weapon. When you have found this value your setup will be clear.

I had already deinstalled the game and I have not any reason to get back. Just be a tank and everything will be ok. If you fights against another tank then this is normal situation: your hands is your main weapon.

**walkman** · 26-05-14, 00:29

How hard to use:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blFusUh6hkY

**Dasore** · 26-05-14, 02:08

is it you on the tank? i dont think so

if you cant win against a tank in pvp you should probably train to get better. Tank is the strongest class atm on titan cause the cs does too much dmg, but i dont think so on vedeena. btw flamer does less dmg when the aim is not full closed, why that flamer does so much damage atm when you hit someone is cause none specs fire, cause only flamer does real fire dmg and you hardly see someone using it cause its so hard to aim with.

**walkman** · 26-05-14, 03:24

if you cant win against a tank in pvp you should probably train to get better.

How better? When my xbow deals 48 dmg on tank, how many time I should spend to win? When I will be able to kill tank with such setup and then I switch to tank I sure you that I will able to win against 2 or even 3 tanks

What I want to say that aim mechanic does not give any advantages to other class, expect monks. The major advantage of monks is that their aim is about 0.1 second. In same time I see that any pistol have in 1.5 times less range. In 1.5 times deals less damage. Or in 8 times less ammo package in case of ionic pistol. You may search video on youtube where PE or Spy plays with pistols and you will see that their aiming even worst then your CS/Devo/etc. There are a lot of video with OP, in rare case pistol deals primary damage, most damage deals other people and not the man from video. And there are a lot of stupid/smart video where some guys came with laser rifles (which as every one know does not work in pvp), or then man hunting on the back victim, this is a real crap. In same time even with PPU shields spies/PEs has lost more then half their hp and this is total lose in duels/pairs. And you still say that I should better train? Where no real advantages?

Tell me, what are advantages of PE/pistol?

* Shields/spells?

On my setup total resist (with spells and armor) against any elemental damage (fire/energy/poison/xray) is about 48-49% versus 55+% on any tank. I have 60% against piercing, 59.5% against force, any tank have same or even better.

* Stealth?

I have real close combat, because the best pistol has 352m range and mostly I dont use it. Any tank doesnt stay in one place and move/run on me. After that I will got devo with fire stack. Use stealth and what? Right, tank stays near me with reloaded weapons and with 50% hp in best case, and he heals self with medkit + 2 injectors. While I have less 300 hp and cant do anything.

* Drugs?

Is there some special drug for PE? No. Everybody uses the same range of drugs: paratemol, desterol, redflash, whiteflash and so on.

* Can I have better speed then tank?

Yes, but I will be weak in factor of 2-3. What is point in that?

* Is a real requirement to wear PA on PE?

Yes, but good tank does not wear any PA! Who is biggest char in game? Yeah, the biggest texture in such case I have and not a tank.

* Do I have better aiming then heavy cannon?

No. In close range aiming the same.

* Do I deal better damage then heavy cannon?

No. Best pistol has 1 bullet and without 100% aiming it misses in 80%+ cases.

* Do I have better reload speed on pistol?

No. Every weapon has almost same reload time. In case of heavy cannons there are no real advantages.

* Do I have better speed with pistol in hand?

Yes, the advantage is about +5 ath and +5 agi. But time for wear/hide of any weapon is the same and takes less 1 second. So, smarty tank in any case able to get closer to you then you are able to escape and sneak from him.

* Do I have ability to remove stack with spell?

Yes, but its does nothing. I just lost a time for something better.

* Do I have ability to spend skill points in hacking/something else?

Yes. But if you spend 100 points in hacking/anything your aim will be worst in around 30% and output will be also bad. Dont spend f*** points on something except combat skills!

* Do I have some special ability?

No. This is not the WoW. No advantages, only pack of disadvantages.

**tarasm** · 26-05-14, 04:33

tl;dr walkman has no skills and complains that pistols sucks. aiming is def better on pistols than cs close combat. you can also drop a tank with a clip of bhg if you land all your shots in the head. while the cs is overpowered, as a pistol spy im not scared of any other hc weapon especially a devo. be fast, move well and have aim and youll be dropping most dev tanks.

**Dasore** · 26-05-14, 08:42

Originally Posted by tarasm

tl;dr walkman has no skills and complains that pistols sucks. aiming is def better on pistols than cs close combat. you can also drop a tank with a clip of bhg if you land all your shots in the head. while the cs is overpowered, as a pistol spy im not scared of any other hc weapon especially a devo. be fast, move well and have aim and youll be dropping most dev tanks.

finally someone who got it...

btw, monks aim in 0,1 secs? u must be drunk. if ur aim isnt closed on a monk you dont deal any real dmg, and if ur really lucky you get the good old waving hand bugs and then casting is fucked for the next 2-3 secs

if the aiming % in the weapon info is 250% aiming is capped... you get that on most setups even with subskill in int.

**walkman** · 26-05-14, 10:05

Originally Posted by Dasore

btw, monks aim in 0,1 secs? u must be drunk. if ur aim isnt closed on a monk you dont deal any real dmg, and if ur really lucky you get the good old waving hand bugs and then casting is fucked for the next 2-3 secs

So, your PPU casts on you bad buffs in OP fights, LOL. Because mechanic for PPU and APU spells are same. In next 2-3 secs I may run away, turn on 180 degree and do the same again. And trust me, victim will got all its damage. And actually this is not a bug. This is just prevent spell spuffing/spamming.

Originally Posted by Dasore

if the aiming % in the weapon info is 250% aiming is capped... you get that on most setups even with subskill in int.

There are no cap. That thing in info is just soft cap. When you reached it any adjustment has smaller effect. Read the notes from dev. In another case they are liers.

**Dasore** · 26-05-14, 10:49

Originally Posted by walkman

So, your PPU casts on you bad buffs in OP fights, LOL. Because mechanic for PPU and APU spells are same. In next 2-3 secs I may run away, turn on 180 degree and do the same again. And trust me, victim will got all its damage. And actually this is not a bug. This is just prevent spell spuffing/spamming.

thought we speaking of dmg dealers.... now you come along with ppus...

**walkman** · 26-05-14, 11:25

Originally Posted by Dasore

thought we speaking of dmg dealers.... now you come along with ppus...

I just point you that your conclusions are wrong. If APU should get aim like Spy/Tank and wait for it 2 seconds then its totally disbalance game. APU cant stay and take all damage from CS/BHG. Thats why APU is able to aim on you in 0.1 seconds, cast spell, turn around and cover somewhere. And APU do this again and again. Your BHG kills APU within 3-4 shots. And what he able to do with you? Correct, nothing. And many non-monks players like this. So, I want in that case that PPU also doing aim in 3 seconds, like my xbow does, otherwise spell should totally falls.

The another solution is give to APU ultimate DD spells, which deals 1k and more damage per cast. But where is such spell? Correct, there are no one. Where is working PSI resist skill? Nowhere. We have what we have. And still some tanks thinks that they are weak...

**Alduin** · 26-05-14, 12:11

First of all a kind and friendly reminder to everyone in this thread to be nice and polite to each other. In case you have any troubles/want to compare your e-peen with each other log in to Vedeena and resolve your problems on the battlefield!

Walkman: may I conclude from the following:

Originally Posted by walkman

I had already deinstalled the game and I have not any reason to get back. Just be a tank and everything will be ok. If you fights against another tank then this is normal situation: your hands is your main weapon.

that you have never set foot onto Vedeena?

**walkman** · 26-05-14, 12:41

Originally Posted by Alduin

that you have never set foot onto Vedeena?

I was on Veedena and did tests and all my messeges about issues rely for Vedeena. TL 70 flamer was (and possible still, i did not test last patch) overpowered in duel HC PE vs PC PE (T#193). Antidotes spell casts within 6-7 seconds, I died many times, even on success of spell, But stack killed me 1 second before then cast ended.

And currently, yes, I have deinstalled game, because I see your balance direction. Its not a funny play with pistol which deal less 120 dmg and put stack with 8 dmg. TL/DPM curve is broken in such way. The game stays same: strongest will stronger, weakest will weaker. The same thing that best pistol on PE is stays for xbow. Judge unfixed. Backup Gun unfixed. And many other usefull pistols unfixed. Look at TL 92 Pulselaser, why it deals more damage then Judge (same for Titan, same for Vedeena/T#193)? Look at TL 87 Blacksun, same thing, it deals more damage then Judge.

And now, some "hard to use" TL 70 flamer deals twice more damage then even xbow: 150 dmg own + 240dmg per stack (30dmg x 8 sec) = 390 dmg.

**Dasore** · 26-05-14, 12:44

Originally Posted by walkman

The another solution is give to APU ultimate DD spells, which deals 1k and more damage per cast. But where is such spell? Correct, there are no one. Where is working PSI resist skill? Nowhere. We have what we have. And still some tanks thinks that they are weak...

resist psi is working... [Edited] Otherwise you would have seen it in the logs

**walkman** · 26-05-14, 12:59

Originally Posted by Dasore

resist psi is working... [Edited - Consistency] Otherwise you would have seen it in the logs

[Edited]

And what about resist psi, how it works? Works like that PPU unable to heal you?

Thread: [R#186] T#186-T#197 Patch Discussion

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