Does anyone even want to play Neocron 2.2 if you could choose the version?

[Legato]

I'm sure everyone can probably remember their most fun times in Neocron. I'm also 99% positive none of those times were in version 2.2 of this game. This version has to be the worst one of all that I've played through. I really do not like how the patch notes are going. Yes, we're seeing bug fixes and such, but we're not seeing anything major. This isn't an insult to the current development team, but rather a discouragement each time I read the notes. I'm expecting bigger changes-- dramatic changes. Right now we're just getting to some fixes.

It seems like the current development team is not even allowed to modify major changes to the game. Is this true or not? I'd really like an answer from the team about this. Are you even able to fulfill the demand if players want 2.1 or 1.0 instead?

If you had your choice, which would you rather play? Neocron 1? 2.1? 2.2? You don't need to be specific about which version you like best. IE: Neocron 1 pre-monk nerf, etc... just a generalization.


To name a few things wrong with this version that make me want to stop playing:
- broken resist setups
- largely unbalanced classes
- broken weapon classes (melee)
- "random" rare part drops. Some researchers have 30+ techs to cursed soul, but 0 addtechs. That's not "random." How many times do you see in trade people asking for techs to SF, addtech to CS, etc. Those are too rare.

I'd like to see some serious discussion on this matter. Please do not lock this topic, unless you're trying to silence us.

[yavimaya]

I'm sure everyone can probably remember their most fun times in Neocron. I'm also 99% positive none of those times were in version 2.2 of this game. This version has to be the worst one of all that I've played through. I really do not like how the patch notes are going. Yes, we're seeing bug fixes and such, but we're not seeing anything major. This isn't an insult to the current development team, but rather a discouragement each time I read the notes. I'm expecting bigger changes-- dramatic changes. Right now we're just getting to some fixes.

It seems like the current development team is not even allowed to modify major changes to the game. Is this true or not? I'd really like an answer from the team about this. Are you even able to fulfill the demand if players want 2.1 or 1.0 instead?

If you had your choice, which would you rather play? Neocron 1? 2.1? 2.2? You don't need to be specific about which version you like best. IE: Neocron 1 pre-monk nerf, etc... just a generalization.


To name a few things wrong with this version that make me want to stop playing:
- broken resist setups
- largely unbalanced classes
- broken weapon classes (melee)
- "random" rare part drops. Some researchers have 30+ techs to cursed soul, but 0 addtechs. That's not "random." How many times do you see in trade people asking for techs to SF, addtech to CS, etc. Those are too rare.

I'd like to see some serious discussion on this matter. Please do not lock this topic, unless you're trying to silence us.

1. Dont mean to seem rude, but dont you remember the past? the reason the game was never balanced is because there were always "dramatic changes", we need small consice changes! if any proper bug fixes and balancing is to be done, then it needs to be done slowly!!

2. Im sure they can change anything they like, with few exceptions, however its already been stated that the game cannot be taken back to NC1, that is even if they still had the assets (which im sure they got binned years ago, probably when the NC1 DB was binned), it would take ALOT more work than simply "sticking the code back in" and that would be more work than fixing what we have.

Personally, although the part/s you listed may be too rare, i think that rares in general are far too easy to get. How is a rare gun rare when everyone has one? or has 5x (almost) all of the parts to one/each gun?

[Doc Holliday]

nc1 circa 2005. It wasnt the game that made me quit back then it was the community.

2.2 fucked my favourite class (The Lowtech No Pa wearing Rifle PE) and the supposed balance of a lot of things.

I still have hope it will one day get better.

NC2 was also ok as a 2nd choice. I love the Dome as an area to go and play in.

[Vorak]

The more changes you introduce into a game the more bugs are there are to work out.

Not to say the devs don't know what they're doing. I'm sure there's a massive amount of code for this game for the devs to comb through. As a programmer, I know what a headache (to say the least) it can be to search through and find bugs. I can only imagine some what the original devs must have left. Sometimes you have to rewrite what you've done, which really sucks!

Cudos to the current devs for how much better they've improved the game since taking over.

To answer the version question, I prefer NC 2.2.

[L0KI]

I'd go with NC1, just before the introduction of monk PAs. For anyone not around back then, monks were the second class to get PA, with tanks being the first.

From that point onward, I disliked almost every decision KK made for the game.

That being said, 2.1 was actually pretty fun. I played a hybrid in 2.1 that was actually pretty good. PE's were a little more viable, too.

***DISCLAIMER***

Despite me preferring NC1 (everyone knows this of me by now), I do NOT think we should go back to it. Or 2, or 2.1 for that matter. The reason being; the game has actually made some progress over the period that us fans of NC1 tend to forget.

In an ideal world, the current volunteer development team would take the best of NC2(.1/.2) and NC1, and create their own NC 2.3 over time, which is exactly what they're doing.

[Dropout]

2.1 Was by far the most fun I've had in NC. Loved fighting against hybrids, and shitbuffing apu/ppu teams.
And no-PA PE's were viable!!

In an ideal world, the current volunteer development team would take the best of NC2(.1/.2) and NC1, and create their own NC 2.3 over time, which is exactly what they're doing.

But.. This^

[nEo-1664]

Legato, the current volunteer developement team, have said that they cant just jump in to old code and make all the best and greated changes in 1 hit.

What they are and have been doing to great levels of success so far has been to identify and fix many server stability issues, client stability issues, exploit fixes, and generally trying to get the game back to a stable platform. Of which, I think they have done really well so far, and I am looking forward to seeing more!

As for balancing, the dev team know this is on the agenda, but it is also not something that can be fixed in 1 patch. It requires a lot of time, work and effort, of which ideally you need the stable platform they are working to achieve at the moment.

I know you said your words are not meant to be insulting, but at the same time, there has been big changes since September. Changes that will help see a better future for Neocron. Because of that, I have nothing but praise for the entire support team, and I can see that by taking these smaller steps, will allow them to have a better understanding of the Neocron 12year old coding to make the balancing phases easier to complete later down the line.

<3

[Zoltan]

Legato, the current volunteer developement team, have said that they cant just jump in to old code and make all the best and greated changes in 1 hit.

To clarify all the "switch back to NC 'insert old version here'" conversations around here. The old Neocron codebase is GONE, don't ask me why or how can it be, its a fact we have to live with because we are not able to change this.

We just working with the Neocron Evo 2.2 codebase and there is much more to do than "put a 1 here.. and a 6 there and..".

The team is currently working hard to get a nearly stable base version (for example: with a much better interpolation, fail calculations on damage outputs....). We'll rebalance the game completly to make it more fair AFTER we reach our goal of a the said stable base version.

Please understand that we dont have access to a 30 men team and it will take some time. You can enforce our development by doing some tests @ vedeena with a detailed testreport.

<3 @ all

Z

[L0KI]

To clarify all the "switch back to NC 'insert old version here'" conversations around here. The old Neocron codebase is GONE, don't ask me why or how can it be, its a fact we have to live with because we are not able to change this.

We just working with the Neocron Evo 2.2 codebase and there is much more to do than "put a 1 here.. and a 6 there and..".

The team is currently working hard to get a nearly stable base version (for example: with a much better interpolation, fail calculations on damage outputs....). We'll rebalance the game completly to make it more fair AFTER we reach our goal of a the said stable base version.

Please understand that we dont have access to a 30 men team and it will take some time. You can enforce our development by doing some tests @ vedeena with a detailed testreport.

<3 @ all

Z

Cannot say fairer than that.

I know many of us are crying out for the balance to be fixed, but when taking on a project like this, making the foundation for future updates as stable as possible simply has to be priority number 1.

[nEo-1664]

I meant by 'old code' as in the current used coding. I realise I got a couple of details wrong there. I was typing between calls at work

My bad, much love <3


PS: Can we get a <3 emote on the forums?

[Danae]

To clarify all the "switch back to NC 'insert old version here'" conversations around here. The old Neocron codebase is GONE, don't ask me why or how can it be, its a fact we have to live with because we are not able to change this. Z

I can tell you why :P Because it was literally PURGED in 2008; along with all NC1 account data that was not upgraded to NC2 - deleted, gone, buhbye, as KK warned in 2008 repeatedly until it was eventually done I am chiming in here, because I repeatedly get the same question via accounts email support demanding is just "GIVE BACK MY NC ACCOUNT NOW!" and I have repeatedly explained, it's not a matter of I won't, it's a matter of I literally cannot, it's ALL GONE relating to NC1 [UNLESS you upgraded to NC2 in which case your data was converted to NC2 compatable].

[RogerRamjet]

The formula changes NC1->NC2 messed a lot up in my opinion. Since then it seems to be the trademark sledgehammer approach. NC2 was OK as was 2.1 in my opinion. 2.2 unfortunately clearly came at a time when KK had no man power to dedicate to dealing with the issues with it's implementation.

I'd just like to see all classes being viable again. If this happens due to a slight regression, so be it.

[Mokoi]

Folks, please stop suggesting a rollback to better times.
Zoltan has already explained it cannot happen.

Downgrading to older patchlevels is technically not feasible. A "lets roll back to Patch #1337 and be jolly" is not a realistic scenario.
The only path we can take is the path forward and that means fixing the status quo.

[Torg]

for a spy NC1 was hell. there was no stealth, disruptor, silent hunter, any sniper rifles, any street rifles beyond 23, no PA. and still spys were taking part in OP wars. so ill take NC2 over NC1 any time. even 2.2, which isnt soo bad. odd imp values? so what, you'll either get to use that weapon or not. we have to remember that KK (and/or its mother company) went bankrupt more than one time, so especially 2.2 was never really finished. which is going too happen really soon, so this is the best we can get.

and i'd like more variety/individuality in our chars, too.

[RogerRamjet]

for a spy NC1 was hell. there was no stealth, disruptor, silent hunter, any sniper rifles, any street rifles beyond 23, no PA.

Maybe early NC, but I could name some extremely competent Spies. Spies were certainly very viable in NC1.