Open your Outposts please....

[brand]

hmm one of the lg guy said you should remove your ca banner doc. maybe he said it because lg is ca. and you are bd now, enemys of ca. and maybe antrim should try a new start and try to say again what he wants without his i m an veteran player shit and how great his thread is. when the thread isn t going as planned don t just wait and do niothing try to say it again but in a different way.
the middlefinger was the best answer until now. i just don t like how he says what he wants and not that he says what he wants.

[Gunshifty]

I love how something as insignificant as a forum sig is being bandied about like its a cardinal sin.

Thats my only input while i wait for someone to say something worth discussing.

Not to take away from my main post, post #43

but..

Just wanted to point out that

Oh and please change your emblem on your banner. You are no longer a City Admin and dismissed dishonorably

Was pointing out the signature because Massaker pointed it out, who if you didn't know, is part of LG (CityAdmin). Hence the "You are no longer City Admin and dismissed dishonorably". If you feel that I pointed it out "like its a cardinal sin" then I wouldn't have emphasized it toward the end of my post.

But I digress once again. Doc you stated "You all failed to answer my points on page one listed points 1,2,3. ".

I followed it up by making a "constructive" post to which you only replied with something I had thrown into the 'edit' section of my post.

I do believe I addressed a few of your points, but you have the arrogance by reply that you're still waiting for someone to say something worth discussing. How compelling.

[ancient]

I think this thread shows William's desparation regarding the GR situation for the OPs. He has written a lot about it in the last year and suggested solutions for it already too.

Maybe it would really be a good thing if GRs could not be closed anyway.

It's stupid if it hinders gameplay, especially for new or returning players who want to explore the wastes or hunt and level.

Alternatively there could be a lot more of public GRs / OPs across the wastes, to make the traveling and exploring easier.

Regards

Solution's pretty simple, at least from the perspective of a non coder type. Just split the control of the GR and the UG.

[brand]

in my opinion it s fine that op grs are closed. when they were all open there would be too many grs over the map. but like 2 more public grs on the map wouldn t hurt. it s k when you have to walk a bit to reach your destination. and vehciles would be more interesting for noobs. then they would have a goal to earn enough money for one and then cruise proudly around the wastelands with it. but i just don t like the jones quad. it make for the noobs much to easy to get a vehicle and it can t even get destroyed.

[ancient]

simple answer (simple because I know nothing about coding) let clans to be able to close UGs separately to the GRs thus opening the map but not allowing attacking clans to crowd UGs which they are able to under the current rules.

^^ just read this, sry for repeating it ... but it's right

[Doc Holliday]

I do believe I addressed a few of your points, but you have the arrogance by reply that you're still waiting for someone to say something worth discussing. How compelling.

I cant see where. i must have missed something. thats why i asked again. I did read your post thoroughly.

I will refer you back to my second post before the thread devolved in to a shit fling. We can be men or we can be pricks with a few mouse clicks. im clicking the man button.

now which part of your post did you refer to the points? Im not following it. Please elaborate because obviously i have misread or misunderstood.

i removed the sig too. In the interest of rp.

[Faid]

Sig edited because 17th said so.

You have been policed by the 17th squad

[I See Blue]

Eeeeeeek-a-Mouse

Since I have been forced to sunny Brazil for a month or so I don´t really know what´s going on in-game atm. However, I would like to pitch in in this most charming of posts.

There are some interesting things to discuss here. Let´s start with the base of the problem as Will sees it.

Closed GRs mean nonaccess to map and less chance for people to explore/play the game

Will claims the most noble of intentions, and indeed invokes the most used accusation in this game (apart from OMG haxx), you are ruining it for the noobs/new players/returned players. Now, the returned players will be used to this, closed GRs have been an issue since time first began in Neocron. Once we were allowed to close GRs, we did, as a safety measure.

As for new players, I hardly see why we should wrap them in blankets and hand them everything on a plate. The game has quite a few open GRs, which can be used to go reasonably quickly to any place on the map. This, combined with the access ASG, should provide a lovely adventure for new players, letting them explore the map instead of just going to Sewers--->Aggies---->MB---->Warbots/Firemobs/Regants, like i see most old players suggest to new people. Instead they will roam around a bit in the lovely graphics from a decade ago.

I do agree that some access to a factory and a lab should be had, and there has been most of the time. My tradeskilling clan is not in CM, and when I am home I often open Jankins or Chester Lab. And if there isn´t one open, asking nicely for it to be opened will usually work.

All this for the good of the game stuff that William sprouts is really nonsense. If we want new players, give them advice for sure, help them out with gear, and let them explore the map and learn the realities of Neocron. Sometimes you have to run for a bit, or drive, but it is mostly experienced players who see this as a drag, for new ones, this is an adventure. So I really suspect this complaint is mostly because William wants to go somewhere but is to lazy to run/drive to it. But I can´t really know his motivation, just saying it isn´t the great obstacle he claims it is to new players.

I myself came back about 4 months ago, had no GR troubles at all. The open GRs (Crest Village/TH/Battledome/DRT/El Farid/DoY) gave me ample opportunity to get around the map.

Indeed, my levling and exploring was more hindered by people in clans such as the Regulators/AD and some other minor clans who killed lowbies and allied faction members.


The closing of GRs for battle

Only someone who doesn´t know the realities of OP-Fighting would ask for all OPs to be open. The UG is meant to be a positive asset for the defending clan, not a liability where enemies lurk in every corner. By opening the UG you are giving away a great tactical advantage, which is sorely needed when you are defending in lesser numbers. It loses some of it´s importance when the numbers are even, but it still saves on alot of rezzing which frees up PPU manpower, and indeed is very important if you are to play anything other than Spy and PPU. It allows other classes an alternative to just trying to die in a decent spot for rezzing.

If you have the power (those old and experienced neocrackheads you mentioned) to do something about it, just fucking do it

This post is nothing more than a threat against established clans, who are active and fighting so they can indeed chose which GRs are open and which are closed. Accusing us in 17th of being evil maphoggers is just foolish, we fight for ops, and we hold ops so we can fight.

As for us being a sheep clan, we have been asked by quite a few players if they could join. I have personally advised them that joining another clan would be better since it would mean we have more people to fight. Even referring them to specific people in TASA/LG/that city admin tsunami clan. So why we should be considered a sheep clan is beyond me.

If you don´t want to read the whole thing

OP GRs being closed doesn´t limit your movement, there are vehicles, open GRs and Venture warp to get you around. Stop being lazy and run. The amount of times I have been asked to open an OP that would save a runner maybe 4-5 mins of travelling, it´s just lazy. Just go there, and enjoy the trip.

All OPs can´t be opened since it ruins the defensive advantage a clan has in OP fights

And stop threatening, just do something about it if you don´t like it.

And Gunshifty does make sense in his posts,

Best Regards, your favourite armsdealer/impseller

[Doc Holliday]

I think a better slogan " you have been MERKED by 17th squad" would have been better. British slang for a beating. If your gonna use slogans and stuff in the roleplay tense.

Good fights at jeriko Wednesday afternoon UK time. Im sure me sayin this flies in the face of perception of arrogance but there it is. Some of us can be mature and sensible and not just sign up to the thread to try and put the boot in.

[William Antrim]

If you want constructive criticism and duscussion take the sarcasm out chaps. I can still see too much of it and it just makes me laugh.

The point of making the thread in the tone it was set up I'm is because I don't care about owning ops. I don't care if you ninja all of ours. Because I now say this you probably will.

That will just prove my point. The lack of a mature discussion ends with ninja-ing. I'm happy to do it back.

The sxr posters thus far generally have said nothing worth of discussion so I am gonna just ignore that.

I see blue - thank you for your contribution - we clearly see things in a very different light. However judging from your forum Sig you must have been here before the ug gr was in nc and we all used to run to fight from an adjacent op to defend?


I've absolutely no use for idle threats and jibes guys. I've been to war once for real. Internet warlords are nothing by comparison. I am here to promote - more fights, more fun and more nc for everyone.

You don't like my methods clearly but hey that's cool too. Your responses are hilarious so please take the anger and jibes out of them because you're not winning anything with them.

[Gunshifty]

[ edited ]

[Nidhogg]

The topic has drifted too far into personal insults. Please save that for in-game. Thanks.

[Gunshifty]

The topic has drifted too far into personal insults. Please save that for in-game. Thanks.

Glad you actually read my post Nidhogg, and at least addressed it. More than some other people who shall not be named due to personal insulting ensuing.

Maybe people shouldn't involve personal experiences if they don't want to be personally insulted, just throwing it out there

Edit1: In response to Nidhogg's "Please save that for in-game."

I do think saving it for in-game could actually be a set-back due to new players who may have Help/OOC/Trade NC channels open possibly reading the personal insults being flung back and forth. Pretty toxic for the community if I may add. I am trying to promote a better neocron as well, but I rather not say anything that may be toxic/pollute the community.

It's better to not be right, than just obviously wrong. In other words, more harm done, than good.

[I See Blue]

I like that you feel the need to include your real life war credentials, big up. Pointless big up though. Especially considering most war these days are definitely lacking in ethics and moral purpose. I served in the army too, panzer, rated as a NATO Elite Soldier, woohoo. Chose not to go into battle tho, since I´m not such a big fan of killing people in foreign countries that really constitute no real threat to my own people or my friends and family. Instead I try to change people mindset, the pen is mightier than the sword and all that. But ok, you are a real life toughie, just saying, it´s really of no consequence here.

I do remember the golden days when to defend an OP you had to attack it, and you just had to hack once to take the damn op. It was a silly way of conducting war to say the least. But the past is the past, and that is one way we don´t want to be heading.

I still fail to see what your argument here is. You seem to think every GR being open would contribute to the game being more fun? That this in itself would create more fighting, more people etc. Yet you have provided no argument as to why you think this is so. Part of this game is trials and tribulations, making an effort, facing the challenges that it sets. I don´t want no easy as toast game, where nothing is challenging, and everyone can do everything. That´s WoW, fuck WoW.

How would having enemies in your UG in every fight promote opfighting? I can´t remember any instance of GR camping to be fun or making fights better.

Why is walking/driving such a horrible thing? It is damn fast getting around in observers/quads/revellers, why does having to travel 3 zones make the game less playable? We even have Regants as an example in game, people happily travel 3 zones from regants fortress (an op 17th have consistently kept open so people could get to Regants, often to our disadvantage in fights). Even if you sometimes have to travel a few more zones, there isn´t anyone who can´t afford a vehicle in this game, we´re so noobstarved people throw vehicles and weapons after new players. That fair enough when it is the first few items of gear, but an item earned is massively more valuable than one that is just thrown at you.

The areas of this game are easily accessible, The Open GRs give you access to the almost every zone, all you have to do is spend a couple of minutes running, it doesn´t take long travelling 2/3 zones. GR control is one of the rewards for joining in op fights, and there should be rewards for it.

By the way, you can´t really critizise others for not seeing your point when you haven´t really made a proper argument for how your suggestion would make everything better. All you´ve made an argument for is that everything should be open to everyone always, which isn´t really what Neocron is about. It´s mean, it´s unfair at times. It´s Neocron. And we keep fighting and playing it.

Also, your attacks on other clans don´t really help, I´ve seen Regulators help noobs and players, I´ve seen 17th do the same, same with SXR. You want to keep the discussion interesting and reasonable, that ain´t the way to go.

There are better ways to encourage the community to grow:

Help noobs, show them the ropes, don´t just give them shit. Give them some adventure.

Create events that brings the community together.

Arrange hunting trips with other people, bring newish players and show them that this game can reward teamwork.

Stop the whining, complaining and insults. I mean, I like a good row as well as anyone, I have fun with it. But the amounts of bile some people throw around, how do they think this looks to new players?

And last, but not least, watch Bill and Ted´s Excellent Adventure, and learn that the most important thing is to be EXCELLENT TO EACHOTHER. Let the bro-hugging commence...

[William Antrim]

I missed your point but you can pm me if you wish and I will address it.


As for your previous post I chose not to comment because youre just talking about events that happened yesterday or the day before. Next week noone will remember them. This thread is not about who won that fight there at XXX op or who owned who. It is about the game itself and changes to it.

Clearly you guys got stuck on a few comments - hence the "amount of people with feb 14 join dates" - that comment purely meant look at the people who joined the forum just to stick the boot in on this thread.

It has nothing to do with my ego or post count. You would know that if you read through my posting history. IF you just joined the forum however you wouldnt realise that, or if you just joined to stick the boot in then you definitely wouldnt realise.

I will let you continue to argue your point for now but please realise if you post in the same way I will just choose to ignore it. Its easier than getting moderated.