How to make Neocron great again.

[Drake6k]

LE chips... some players hate them, some players refuse to remove them. LEs were more punishing in NC1; more people took them out. There was a lot more pvp while leveling and a lot more danger. Players looked over their shoulders, traveled through unconventional routes and leveled in the middle of nowhere to escape death. It was a lot more dangerous and players formed more alliances simply out of need for protection. More people joined clans. The player politics were more interesting and the game was more difficult, more risky and more exciting... at least for me.

The Neocron city was designed to protect the people from the Wasteland. This quote is from the beginning of the Neocron 1 trailer:

"Global pollution, excessive wars and a perforated atmosphere have turned the planet into an almost lifeless sphere of toxic mud. Radiation is everywhere and most animals have either gone extinct or have mutated into bizarre monstrous creatures. The remnants of mankind seek protection from the desolate, scorched world and gathered behind the protective walls of giant cities."

I remember my first time opening the doors at Neocron's Outzone Station exit. I saw the Wasteland for the first time this way, there was no MC5 back then. I was afraid of what I might encounter out there. By leaving the "protective walls" of Neocron, I was choosing to leave that protection behind.

Can you guess where I'm going with this? Please hear me out, because while these changes are radical, I believe this would improve the experience for all players, including those who don't want to get ganked.

I propose the following:
LE chips no longer function in the Wasteland.
LE chips function normally in Neocron, Outzone, TH, MB, TG Canyon, and all connected dungeons.
LE money and xp malus removed.
LE can be re-implanted at any level. Takes an hour.
Safezones removed.
Outzone, main sewers, storages, side-streets, cellars, every leveling area that is connected to a city gets revamped. LEs keep players safe in all of these zones. More and higher level mobs added, including bosses that drop tech parts (similar to say, Chaos Queen). Farming in the Wastelands would still get you tech parts faster.

This accomplishes the following:

#1 Players will use more of the game's content. Most runners will start leveling up in the city and Outzone. It’ll be risky leveling at Regants, Elfarid, or CRP, so runners will go to Graves, Hazard Worms, DoY Tunnels, Worm Tunnels, Swamp caves, etc. Runners will sneak out of the city through the secret passages or use venture-warp, fearing being spotted by an enemy at the city exit.

#2 Neocron city feels more like a protected place. Leaving the city becomes a more significant choice, with significantly higher risk and reward. The Wasteland becomes a lawless, desolate, and dangerous place; gaining the reputation it deserves. The whole dynamic between the two areas becomes black and white, making both feel more accurately represented.

#3 Players work together more. When you must overcome the dangers of pvp, players join clans (can’t do that with an LE in!), they form alliances, they offer each other protection.

#4 Outzone, the Main Sewer, the side streets, cellars, they all get more and better spawns. Some of the coolest and least explored places in Neocron suddenly have runners exploring them. The deeper you go, the higher level the mobs and dungeons become. There is a lot of content there, and it's a damn shame that people skip it.

#5 Pvp can happen anywhere, including Plaza 1, faction HQs, and bars/clubs. The pvpers will be absolutely thrilled. Tons of people will want to come back and play again.

#6 If you want to put your LE back in go ahead. There will even be a distinct contrast between the LEd citizens and those who take it out. LE players will witness lots more pvp and may gain interest.

I want to reiterate that these changes give all players, including LE players more content. Right now, all the noobs are down at Regants or Elfarid with an LE in, grinding their eyes out, many of them even afk. That is bullshit; they should be playing the game.

If this thread should be in Brainport, please move it. I just figure that since we're such a small community, the discussion might get more people involved here.

[kazvall]

+1

No, wait.

+Infinity


Please, can we?

[saadow]

I like this idea, this seems very reasonable. My only suggestion is that perhaps we redesign the AI of protective units like CopBots to target the first hostile individual that shot at the person in question when they're in LOS for the attack, or if cop bots are a distance away, to try and path towards the source of the sound to try and see what's going on, then go off of the first shot they see in FoV and attack the shooter they see, this will keep things realistic in the city, make for a messy melee in those more "controlled" areas, but allow things like assassinations, or other player-run content, while also addressing everything you put above. I think this is a wonderful idea and it leaves recourse for people who don't look for PVP but gives them the option to take part if they have an interest in doing so.

[Drake6k]

I completely agree Saadow and thank you for your input. Some stuff like improving guard AI would be obvious improvements, probably long overdue. I think we'd look at the problems as we go. Copbots can kill LE'd players right now that get caught in crossfire, another problem that would (and should) be looked at.

[saadow]

Well, what if we changed the way LE's worked, and made it so that the enemy players couldn't put a killing blow on a character? So you could get shot by a player and injured--this could be great for RP--but not get killed by the damage, even if you're completely depleted. It would be great for crossfire realism in a public shootout, but I worry it might be abused. Maybe allow it to only go to half health? If you're caught in crossfire by a cop bot and not the bot's active target, apply the same rule? Just a thought.

These are significant changes though, they're focusing quite hard on the balance project and weapon system overhaul, and it's going swimmingly! A lot of us are testing the system and feeding them data to be involved in the process.

We all want Neocron to be better I came back after two years because there's just nothing -like- Neocron out there. At least the parts I like.

[Drake6k]

Well, what if we changed the way LE's worked, and made it so that the enemy players couldn't put a killing blow on a character? So you could get shot by a player and injured--this could be great for RP--but not get killed by the damage, even if you're completely depleted. It would be great for crossfire realism in a public shootout, but I worry it might be abused. Maybe allow it to only go to half health?

I think that would be abused. I'd just nearly or half kill every LE runner I saw as a big arrogant HAHA! If we could just make LE players immune to guard damage, then problem solved. Maybe let them pull guns in front of copbots? It would be silly, but the cops know who has an LE in, right? Not like LEs could hurt anyone. This would mean less noobs accidentally dying to copbots, and that does happen quite and bit, and confuses the noobs.

[saadow]

I think that would be abused. I'd just nearly or half kill every LE runner I saw as a big arrogant HAHA! If we could just make LE players immune to guard damage, then problem solved. Maybe let them pull guns in front of copbots? It would be silly, but the cops know who has an LE in, right? Not like LEs could hurt anyone. This would mean less noobs accidentally dying to copbots, and that does happen quite and bit, and confuses the noobs.

It would definitely be abused, that's an excellent point. I think that drawing a weapon and getting the cop bots angry is really a pivotal part of the experience, besides, waving a gun around is kinda a dumb idea in the middle of the city unless you were in a dangerous situation, say, what if mutants poured out into the street and you had to defend yourself? That might be something, but if the cops see it and they aren't fighting, I'd imagine it'd be their job to tell someone to put it away or try to lay down the law.

Maybe getting shot by crossfire isn't the end of the world? Given the LE in prevents a lot of the sting of dying, perhaps it's really a non issue? If the person stands there and gets shot, that's kind of their fault.

[Drake6k]

Maybe getting shot by crossfire isn't the end of the world? Given the LE in prevents a lot of the sting of dying, perhaps it's really a non issue? If the person stands there and gets shot, that's kind of their fault.

LEs will afk and people will gank them with copbots. This is why in NC1 the copbot rifle shot from the sky. Unfortunately they fucked up the code and it caused so much lag they had to remove the original copbot rifles from the game, and now the guards shoot regular projectiles. Basically, copbots (and other guards) need guns that do not have any crossfire.

[hatmankh]

How about changing the guard weapons mechanically into psi spells but retaining the gun models, sounds and effects. If done right, this could fix the issue without causing any new ones.

[William Antrim]

The very beginning of NC2 had no safe zones. People cried to have safe zones removed and they were removed. A few months later (after the gank fest that NC became) people cried even harder to have safe zones reimplemented. Please be careful what you wish for.

Even the "elite PvPers" want to take a break from pvp at some point. If you remove safe zones everywhere you drive what little community there is further from one another because nowhere is safe to trade. There needs to be a safe trading hub somewhere in the game to allow all people to meet and chat and roleplay and whatever other stuff they do that is not shooting each other.

[DIS]

Hi Jack,

You know we exactly how I feel about your post and I back this 100%.

Though as to what William has raised, he has a fair point as lot of traders remove LE's for various reasons, so it does not seem unreasonable that there should be a single place in the City (plaza1). The presence of City admin and the high concentration of Copbots/Storm bots would enforce that rule.

[Drake6k]

Hi Jack,

You know we exactly how I feel about your post and I back this 100%.

Though as to what William has raised, he has a fair point as lot of traders remove LE's for various reasons, so it does not seem unreasonable that there should be a single place in the City (plaza1). The presence of City admin and the high concentration of Copbots/Storm bots would enforce that rule.

I could agree with making Plaza 1 a safe zone, but still doing the other changes. I would still try to find a way to allow pvp as an option in Plaza 1, some kind of toggle or something. It would just be fun having the option to pvp there.

[kazvall]

TH safezone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[saadow]

The very beginning of NC2 had no safe zones. People cried to have safe zones removed and they were removed. A few months later (after the gank fest that NC became) people cried even harder to have safe zones reimplemented. Please be careful what you wish for.

Even the "elite PvPers" want to take a break from pvp at some point. If you remove safe zones everywhere you drive what little community there is further from one another because nowhere is safe to trade. There needs to be a safe trading hub somewhere in the game to allow all people to meet and chat and roleplay and whatever other stuff they do that is not shooting each other.

This is an excellent point, I think it's something we should carefully consider in this discussion, I think we can agree we all want to see Neocron improve

[saadow]

I could agree with making Plaza 1 a safe zone, but still doing the other changes. I would still try to find a way to allow pvp as an option in Plaza 1, some kind of toggle or something. It would just be fun having the option to pvp there.

Okay, here's a thought. I've never been in Neofrag, but, I kinda get the impression it's a sort of combat games hub, for the "civilized" PVPer. What if we had the maps like Plaza-1 and so on, 'Neofragified' for PVP fun and excitement?