When/If Steam Greenlight: Would you be willing to start fresh?

[yavimaya]

Yes, Odi, You can either play the game, or try to level up as fast as possible in order to cap out and then play a weaker form of Counter Strike.

Other MMOs try to adress this problem by adding new high-level content, extending exp cap, adding skills, adventures, missions to keep people playing. Unfortunately Neocron isnt backed by a rich and successful development studio, so we're not enjoying a constant flow of new ingame-content.

TBH, im very glad neocron hasnt added all that crap.
Every MMO i have played where they "extend" endgame or add more and more stuff to keep people interested, simply gets ruined by those additions, much like WOC did to neo.

Making a game with many options for endgame play and then leaving it, never fucking touching endgame again is about the best way i have seen.

[J45]

TBH, im very glad neocron hasnt added all that crap.
Every MMO i have played where they "extend" endgame or add more and more stuff to keep people interested, simply gets ruined by those additions, much like WOC did to neo.

Making a game with many options for endgame play and then leaving it, never fucking touching endgame again is about the best way i have seen.

Wait your happy with the state of Neocron? Genuine question.

[yavimaya]

I am not happy with the state of balance, npc distribution and loot tables, nor happy with wisdom of ceres, but yea, before DOY come in, neo was pretty much perfect.

[William Antrim]

I am not happy with the state of balance, npc distribution and loot tables, nor happy with wisdom of ceres, but yea, before DOY come in, neo was pretty much perfect.

I would echo this sentiment exactly. In terms of its core concept the "levelling" experience was there to A) teach you the game and B) get you out and about travelling around the world.

The real draw of the game was and still is very much the op fighting scene and the pvp generally.

That being said it does not JUST appeal to those players who like to fight but there are players (using Torg as an example) who like to find their enrichment in other forms of activity, there have even been a few ROLEPLAYERS down the years. Though thankfully they were found and quickly sent to City Admin for extermination/reeducation.

What I think Yavi is trying to say is that when you have "reached" that cap/end game this game has appeal because you can simply put your char down and go and play other games or do other stuff with your life. There is not this content-farming hamster wheel just to stay competitive. Players can be gone years and drop back in for a casual fight in pepper park and have no issues.

This is the appeal of NC.

The problem is finding time and space to balance the desires of the casual player with the desires of the hardcore player who plays all day, all week etc. Unfortunately during its developed life NC has listened too much to one side or the other and driven away part of its playerbase. This is not a microcosm of a problem with NC however, this is the way of things in all MMOs. This is just preaching to the choir.

[J45]

With all due respect if your still playing NC after all these years then yes I can understand that the current game is something you wouldn't want changed. Understand though the thousands of players who have passed through and left because of the lack of updates/bug fixes. I mean what are we left with? 100 active players if that. I feel in the current player base I am the minority who wants more pve content (not raising the cap just other mobs to kill) to give some variation to a stale game.

Just seems you wanted this game to stay unsuccessful so it would stay the same for your own needs. At the moment your not putting any money into the game and haven't for quite some time , do you think they keep the servers up for another 10 years?

[yavimaya]

95% of players who left early on couldnt stand the bugs and KKs inability to fix them (also the fact that 1 bug fix guaranteed 5 more bugs).

the reason there is no players now is because its a 10 year old game and we have all grown up and dont have time.

I dont think you understand how it all works, do you think they constantly add new features or things to do in Counter Strike? how long has that game been around? how many people still play it?
When you have a good base game, just like neocron is, you dont need to keep adding and changing, you need to get the balance right and make the game stable, that is it.

[J45]

Of course if your comparing this game to Counter Strike then no you don't need any pve content, I just feel this game could offer much more than just that though since I thought this thread was about releasing this game on steam and attracting new players since as you say most of the old players have moved on.

I realise the resources are limited so I don't hope for much, but would like to see a few hundred active players again so the game has that atmosphere back. The retexturing project at least looks promising as a remastered Neocron would be awesome.

[Divide]

95% of players who left early on couldnt stand the bugs and KKs inability to fix them (also the fact that 1 bug fix guaranteed 5 more bugs).

the reason there is no players now is because its a 10 year old game and we have all grown up and dont have time.

I dont think you understand how it all works, do you think they constantly add new features or things to do in Counter Strike? how long has that game been around? how many people still play it?
When you have a good base game, just like neocron is, you dont need to keep adding and changing, you need to get the balance right and make the game stable, that is it.

They do refresh CS. They add in content by way of maps and change playstyles by tweaking gun balance. Since CS was incepted, they have had 3 distinctly different releases each with their own merits and system requirements. CS 1.6, CS: Source, CS:GO.



People need to stop comparing this game to CS. Those who don't grasp the real substance behind Neocron's PVP are forever lost to this argument. Don't even engage.

[Faid]

Sex Divide <3

Fresh starts in NC are always fun and exciting, it's after the monotonous end game kicks in where people get completely bored and leave. End game OP fights are extremely fun and arguably the main reason to even play in the first place, it's the question of what to do when there are no fights. What do you do when you already have all the money you'll ever need, all the items you'll ever need, all the tech parts you'll ever need?

[yavimaya]

lol you guys are obviously trolling, no one could be that thick.
i clearly wasnt comparing the game to CS, simply making the point that the worlds most successful games dont change, they dont have huge additions and changes.

Divide, new maps and balance arent real changes to the way the game works, it is still the same game, every game is going to need balance tweeks.
I would hardly call a "refresh" as you call it ( new graphics engine) a new game....
thats as bad as calling a hollywood "refresh" of old movies..... a new movie....

[Divide]

/edit: /sex Faid

lol you guys are obviously trolling, no one could be that thick.
i clearly wasnt comparing the game to CS, simply making the point that the worlds most successful games dont change, they dont have huge additions and changes.

Divide, new maps and balance arent real changes to the way the game works, it is still the same game, every game is going to need balance tweeks.
I would hardly call a "refresh" as you call it ( new graphics engine) a new game....
thats as bad as calling a hollywood "refresh" of old movies..... a new movie....

Question to the universe:
Does it make sense to respond to this person?

World's most successful/recognizable games:
WoW, Halo, Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Gears of War, Doom, Wolfenstein, WHATEVER. The list goes on.

New maps and balance are the only real changes to the way CS works. It may still be the same game, but no one is asking anyone to turn CS into a racing game.

Like it or not- new engines, new stories in the same universe, they are all new experiences to some extent or another and deserve at the very least to be known as refreshes.

[J45]

I am not sure why you keep comparing Neocron to the worlds most successful games. Even at its peak it wasn't even a blip on the radar. Those games DO have a good base game to start with and were relatively polished when released. The PvP part of Neocron can be fun even with the dodgy netcode but still only appeals to a niche crowd. If Neocron was released on steam as a stable game people wouldn't even reach max level to experience OP wars. The accessibility and noob friendliness of the game is awful and without variable content people get bored fast.

My point is if you release Neocron on steam in its current form (even a stable version) you will probably see a spike in players but it would slowly return to rock bottom numbers. If you want to keep at least some of those players then more needs to be done in other areas as mentioned above.

[yavimaya]

I do agree that it shouldnt be on steam without a lot of work.... and so does the dev team....

[Doc Holliday]

With all due respect if your still playing NC after all these years then yes I can understand that the current game is something you wouldn't want changed. Understand though the thousands of players who have passed through and left because of the lack of updates/bug fixes. I mean what are we left with? 100 active players if that. I feel in the current player base I am the minority who wants more pve content (not raising the cap just other mobs to kill) to give some variation to a stale game.

Pve has needed to be unfucked for about 8 years now. Neocron 2.something fucked it royally with the "balancing" rendering so many areas as rediculous. There should be caves where you can compete with a team of randoms (like nc1 chaos caves as was) and then there should be areas where you need a healer of some form also (as regants should be) so it splits the players out to go do some stuff without limiting the fun factor of not having the right char/spec available for team composition.

Example Doy tunnels. Have levels one and two for a mixture of runners and level 3 needing a team WITH ppu support for shields etc.

Star Wars:The Old Republic did something similar where it utilizes companions to fulfill roles to be a part of the so called "holy trinity" of mmos (tank/heals/damage).

Honestly neocron could do something similar I feel if they simply adjusted the damage type or overall damage values of some of the mobs inside these areas. The question would be tuning the mob levels so that runners would get some worthwhile xp vs the challenge it requires to earn it.

One assumes here it would be simply a case of number crunching to set appropriate values to the mob characteristics for level/damage output etc.

Encourage players to wear appropriate armour types also (poison for the graves/swamp caves etc) which would make for a reason for traders to craft up armour sets for people (perhaps...) which in turn supports the populous even more.

[Torg]

Pve has needed to be unfucked for about 8 years now. ... There should be caves where you can compete with a team of randoms (like nc1 chaos caves as was) and then there should be areas where you need a healer of some form also (as regants should be) so it splits the players out to go do some stuff without limiting the fun factor of not having the right char/spec available for team composition... Example Doy tunnels....

as far as i can see all your demands are met in the vast world of Neocron. chaos caves today are for midrange groups or high-range solo players, as are warbots, etc. Doy tunnels are a team area, as are most WoC item quest places.

Star Wars:The Old Republic did something similar where it utilizes companions to fulfill roles to be a part of the so called "holy trinity" of mmos (tank/heals/damage).

Neocron is different from even-older-styled MMOs, as there is no real "tank" class, just different damage dealer subclasses and a single supporter subclass. so the composition of a team is quite different - all you need is some ppl in the front and one supporter.
"tanking" like in "old-agey" MMOs isnt viable because mob aggro is handled different by the original NC engine than most other games: you can not "draw" aggro and "tank" the mob damage, but have to handle occasional aggro switches, as the mob will mostly target whomever hits them hardest. would you want to change this fundamental game mechanic, so Neocron would more be like other games?