[MERGED] CM symp/SL

[Nidhogg]

No more names. You know what happens to threads when you continue to use names.

N

[Spermy]

No more names. You know what happens to threads when you continue to use names.

N

First, they look at you funny, like there's something wrong with you.

Then they're following you around.

They watch you sleeping.

They lock your threads.

Then they end you.

<_<

[Pantho]

Which red people would those be DJ? Oh you mean red SLers? You havent gained SL for killing red SL people for as long as I have been playing NC, and certainly not now. Also as red SL is now -67 you find VERY few of them.

was in NC1 when i plaid

[Zheo]

Can you post this discussion up? Granted, as a CM you can't gank in city sectors without a SL penalty, and the same is true in reverse, but I don't see that as a major benefit.

So you did ask, so have I given:

"As far as future soullight changes are concerned, it looks like the present zone rules are here to stay,
although KK may consider minor adjustments to the amount of SL lost if they consider there to be a problem.

Please remember that for every runner now who claims the SL penalties are too harsh, there was a runner pre-evo who complained that SL penalties were a joke, and that PKers in leveling areas and elsewhere used to get off almost scot free. The SL system was changed to what it is now after long-standing demands from the community together with the desire to restrict 'newb killing'.

As a CityMerc, all runners are neutral to you, but this doesnot necessarily restrict PvP to any great extent. As it stands, you can kill whomever you wish in any outdoor sector, as these will either be a wasteland sector or a battlefield sector. You can kill anyone in the travel zones, outpost zones and DNS zones of the hacknet, providing you stay clear of the leveling 'dungeon' zones. You may kill people in outskirts sectors with only a small SL penalty and no symp loss. Outskirt sectors are: Pepper Park, Outzone, Industrial Sectors and Abandoned DoY Sectors. The only places you should not kill any runner is in any dungeon sector, apartment or City Sector: these being all Plaza, Viarosso, Military Base or occupied DoY Sector. When you think about it, these roles befit your RP status of a 'Mercenary'. Mercs can be hired by any faction as peacekeepers with a 'licenece to kill' in the lawless wastelands, but should not bring faction politics or grievances within civilised city walls.

I hope this clarifies the situation for you."

-END-

My arguement is this, I can't kill them in a city sector if I dont -100 soul light and -50 sympathy. However they cant quite happily kill me and then go and sympathy kill. Also to the last part, If you look at the RP of the game, we are 'Mercenaries' and as such get hired to do jobs, why should/would we care if that caused us to attack someone within a city? Infact we could be hired to aid an attack on either DoY or NC.

People never care if they kill me in a city sector but I have to flee if I don't have the soullight for it, and I cannot regenerate my soullight if I lose it easily like that can. For example a NExT runner could kill me in a city sector and do any of the following to gain soullight.
1. Kill enemy runners or a "soullight bitch".
2. Kill enemy npcs. (who are quite easy to kill).
3. Wait it out in a safe zone such as tech haven or their appartment.
4. Do missions for a faction (assuming sl is above -36).

A City Merc can only do 3 and 4 and waiting it out can take days! Where as killing a "Soullight bitch" will take about five minutes or so if they respawn fast.

Even if KK made killing "soullight bitchies" an exploit they couldn't stop you from killing npc's or people retending to fight back, it would just mean that the target would have to be above a certain level and have a weapon. Not they could and inforce it due to the whole fact of PvP.

I don't actually ask for much from Reakktor, but asking for the MB entrance to be an outskirt sector and changing it to where their is no penalty for killing neutral runners, isn't much to ask is it? That would pretty much solve my problem. Or a more complex idea is create a faction that is red to city mercs and neutral to all others, so we can have "Soullight bitchies" too, the fact is that soullight is open to exploitation and it is impossible to fix that without removing PvP.

The best and most complex solution is to allow clans to "war" and not lose soullight, but maybe only if both clans agree to the war so that you couldn't do it just to gang a small clan of green runners. As well as allowing city mercs to take on contracted kills so that single players could be put on a list any the person who places it pays a fee or say 100-200k (to stop people spamming it) Which GM's cant alter and delete etc if need be.

I'm not sure if any of this makes sense but there you go...

[Bugs Gunny]

Killing a soullight bitch is NOT legal.
Killing npcs is.

[Zheo]

Killing a soullight bitch is NOT legal.
Killing npcs is.

But your evil do you care?

[commerzgandalf]

Does anyone care when he has -90 sl ?

[unreal]

Make MB entrance a safe zone, you can't make the CM HQ a safe zone because of being required to kill certain individuals in the beginning, but I guess those NPC's can be cloned in sector 3 (which already happened to some degree). MB entrance is a pathetic place to fight, force people to go away from the stupid tiny box next to the zone line is all I have to say. As seen in that MB video someone posted lately of just people running round like spoons at the MB entrance zone line, it's pathetic and boring.

CM really should have at least one enemy again, so they're on an even playing ground with everyone else regarding SL/own faction symp. Everyone (including myself) whores the NPC's, some people have either trial accounts or alternate characters to let their friends whore from (the most recent one I saw was Conster Wenis in pp3), it's all a big joke, especially where symp loss is concerned.

[Bugs Gunny]

Since i have two notes attached to my account for it, as a matter of fact i DO care.
I allways tell the clannies to go kill enemy runners somewhere or preferably the biotech npcs. Heh, most of the time we're in a team doing it and the unfortunate person trying to stop us gets us another 5 sl. Although TFC have been quite annoying at times :-)

[Zheo]

Anyone notices how DoY has 5 factions and NC has 6? maybe put one of the NC factions out and make them red to CM? I don't see the need for city admin lol

[Dribble Joy]

Which red people would those be DJ? Oh you mean red SLers? You havent gained SL for killing red SL people for as long as I have been playing NC, and certainly not now. Also as red SL is now -67 you find VERY few of them.

I though they fixed this a few patches ago for killing people under a cirtain SL.


If SL was ditched for symp and some means of self defence system for killing was implemented (if you consider such a system to be conductive to the game's atmosphere), CMs would not have the trouble they do now.
Add in a simple mission system or runner - runner mission system for CMs and we could happily play mercs (or even without any integral interface). Symp losses would have to be the same as for any other neutral kill, but splitting your kills between one side and the other (or simply taking one side) would keep you good in the eyes of at least some, and not loose you symp with CM unless you start faction killing.

[John Wu]

Please remember that for every runner now who claims the SL penalties are too harsh, there was a runner pre-evo who complained that SL penalties were a joke, and that PKers in leveling areas and elsewhere used to get off almost scot free. The SL system was changed to what it is now after long-standing demands from the community together with the desire to restrict 'newb killing'.

sorry, but thats just bullshit. the long-standing demands were from parts of the community, not from the community. I would call the people where those demands came from carebears.

you are a noob? you wanna level without having to watch your back? leave your LE in.

you don't want to have an LE in your brain? welcome to the brutal world of neocron. pack some ammo, grab a gun, and take care of your fucking self.

SL rules should only apply in cities, to prevent/punish ally killing. everything else is just stupid.

edit: I went from 100 sl and 100 fac sym to 0 / 50 yesterday. why? because I was killing a ppu (who luckily tried to escape death by synching and died outside of the cave) and a PE from a clan I'm at war with. am I expected to forget who my enemies are, just because they might not want to fight at the moment? again, this is just plain stupid.

[Zheo]

sorry, but thats just bullshit. the long-standing demands were from parts of the community, not from the community. I would call the people where those demands came from carebears.

you are a noob? you wanna level without having to watch your back? leave your LE in.

you don't want to have an LE in your brain? welcome to the brutal world of neocron. pack some ammo, grab a gun, and take care of your fucking self.

SL rules should only apply in cities, to prevent/punish ally killing. everything else is just stupid.

Since when have noobs ever had the common sense to leave their le in?

And everything with the soul light issue would be absolutly fine IF city mercs had a way of recovering lost soullight other than the really slow current methods. I'm all for punishing those that kill allies, so don't get me wrong I actually like the soullight rules atm, accept for the fact that CM is neutral to all, and since we have no way of recovering from defending ourselves it's un-fair. I do try to avoid killing in city sectors etc, however it does make the game alot more difficult specially when they wont come out and play

[John Wu]

Since when have noobs ever had the common sense to leave their le in?

I'm telling every noob I meet that he better leaves his LE in, or prepares to die alot.

after getting killed 10 times everyone should have learned their lesson and put their LE back in. if not - tough luck.

And everything with the soul light issue would be absolutly fine IF city mercs had a way of recovering lost soullight other than the really slow current methods. I'm all for punishing those that kill allies, so don't get me wrong I actually like the soullight rules atm

the SL rules dont only apply for killing allies. they also apply when some CA guy comes to the dome to kill my allies and then hides in some sidestreet. I get a SL hit for killing an enemy in my own fucking city .. yeah, absolutely fine

[RogerRamjet]

sorry, but thats just bullshit. the long-standing demands were from parts of the community, not from the community. I would call the people where those demands came from carebears.

you are a noob? you wanna level without having to watch your back? leave your LE in.

you don't want to have an LE in your brain? welcome to the brutal world of neocron. pack some ammo, grab a gun, and take care of your fucking self.

SL rules should only apply in cities, to prevent/punish ally killing. everything else is just stupid.

edit: I went from 100 sl and 100 fac sym to 0 / 50 yesterday. why? because I was killing a ppu (who luckily tried to escape death by synching and died outside of the cave) and a PE from a clan I'm at war with. am I expected to forget who my enemies are, just because they might not want to fight at the moment? again, this is just plain stupid.

This post sums up my attitude also.

NC needs to move away from anything remotely care-bearish.