1. #1

    Default Massively op play through stream.

    I sent an email to Massively about having MJ do a play stream of the game. And i got a email back saying she's interested. I hope one of you guys get in touch with them to make it happen.

  2. #2

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    That's great Shaikura, thanks very much! Could you drop me a PM with details of how you originally got in touch so I can follow up?
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  3. #3

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    Sorry i didn't get back to you. Was away for holiday. But i saw the stream and it was really bad. And it wasn't the game that made it bad it was the streamer. She was so clueless and couldn't even set the system setting up before she did the stream. It was a waste of time and seemed like it was a rush job because board posters were asking them to do one. She is so bad at it sometimes that its frustrating to watch her. And the fact that they didn't try to get in touch with you guys before is lame because they have done many streams with devs for other games. Sorry that it went this way. I was trying to help you guys out.

  4. #4

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    Simple advice though not all might like it given what kind of people it might attract : if you want to have somewhat constant stream of players trying the game, create and keep alive "Neocron 2 General" at 4chan`s /vg/ - http://boards.4chan.org/vg/

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaikura View Post
    Sorry i didn't get back to you. Was away for holiday. But i saw the stream and it was really bad. And it wasn't the game that made it bad it was the streamer. She was so clueless and couldn't even set the system setting up before she did the stream. It was a waste of time and seemed like it was a rush job because board posters were asking them to do one. She is so bad at it sometimes that its frustrating to watch her. And the fact that they didn't try to get in touch with you guys before is lame because they have done many streams with devs for other games. Sorry that it went this way. I was trying to help you guys out.
    I think the point was that she comes into a game the same way any of us do for the first time. Generally you fire it up and expect the game to teach you how to play it.

    The problem is her expectations for this approach are based on the general hand holding of todays online games. Neocron does have a tutorial, and does a little hand holding, but through no fault of her own she couldn't play it. The problem was that she went into the tutorial, found the volume was too loud, then found she had to log out of the game to adjust it. When she came back into the game the tutorial was no longer accessible.

    She had the idea of creating a new char to start the tutorial, but then got hit by the 30 min new character creation block.

    It wasn't a great stream for promoting Neocron, but it should give NST a good overview of brand new player issues.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nara View Post
    I think the point was that she comes into a game the same way any of us do for the first time. Generally you fire it up and expect the game to teach you how to play it.

    The problem is her expectations for this approach are based on the general hand holding of todays online games. Neocron does have a tutorial, and does a little hand holding, but through no fault of her own she couldn't play it. The problem was that she went into the tutorial, found the volume was too loud, then found she had to log out of the game to adjust it. When she came back into the game the tutorial was no longer accessible.

    She had the idea of creating a new char to start the tutorial, but then got hit by the 30 min new character creation block.

    It wasn't a great stream for promoting Neocron, but it should give NST a good overview of brand new player issues.
    I get what you are saying. And you make good points but i think she should have done a little more research because it wasn't a modern hand holding game like she is used to streaming. And she has done streams as a new player with devs in other games so i can't buy that as a new player like the rest of us remark. It seemed like a rushed job to appeal to players asking for a stream on their site. What i'm mad about is the fact she couldn't even finish the starter zone and get into the city proper to show it off.

  7. #7
    Xpertz William Antrim's Avatar
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    Do any of you even stream bro?

    Seriously though, it has never been my thing - I am probably too old - but are any of you guys confident enough with a mic etc to make a stream happen FOR new players but by someone with experience?

    Is it possible for the community to then artificially enhance the popularity of the stream by following it? I mean you could catapult someone into popularity through reddit etc surely?
    "dulce et decorum est pro patria mori"

  8. #8

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    I streamed quite a bit of the same game but I'm barely at 1K followers on Twitch which isn't enough I'm afraid. I have played Neocron since the very beginning, but from a streamer point of view, there are a lot of dull/void moments I have to go through whilst grinding PvE that doesn't really make it fun to watch. Waiting to be PvP ready and I'll give it another shot (people were kinda wondering wtf I was streaming at first, as I mostly stream PAYDAY 2 usually ^^)

    Can be found at twitch.tv/dorian_jay

  9. #9

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    Neocron comes from the old school of MMOs - in more ways than one.

    Back in the early 2000's virtually all MMOs were subscription based - sure you usually had a 2-4 week free trial - but you still had to purchase a physical copy, either from an online store or from a shop (as I did).
    This meant there was a degree of investment, you had a reason to persevere with the game, and learning how it worked was part of the reward, the accomplishment of discovery drove you as much as enjoying the game itself.

    Fast forward to today and there are dozens of MMOs, nearly all free to play.
    No CD/DVD required - just DL on Steam.
    So the investment in the game and learning how it works simply isn't there. If things don't fall into place straight away, frustration builds up. With no reason to push through the player doesn't see the need to do so and they feel isolated from the content.
    They uninstall, post a bad review and move on.

    How to maintain NC's steep learning curve without seeming opaque is always going to be a challenge, especially in the current gaming world. Making the early game easier may cause people to cry hand-holding, not explaining things will only annoy the modern gamer - there's probably always going to be someone who doesn't get what they want.

    As always, more feedback is good.
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  10. #10

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  11. #11
    English Lead Moderator, Community Consultant Nidhogg's Avatar
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    That made me literally laugh out loud. Loved the size of the reticle.
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  12. #12

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    Well, I know a lot of people are expecting things to be easy, but others expecting a 'deep learning curve' as you mentioned. It's not a bad thing it's that way, it's a quality rather than a flaw (there are loads of ressources to help players outside of the game too such as THWiki and th.org databases and guides!)

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bragi View Post
    Neocron comes from the old school of MMOs - in more ways than one.

    Back in the early 2000's virtually all MMOs were subscription based - sure you usually had a 2-4 week free trial - but you still had to purchase a physical copy, either from an online store or from a shop (as I did).
    This meant there was a degree of investment, you had a reason to persevere with the game, and learning how it worked was part of the reward, the accomplishment of discovery drove you as much as enjoying the game itself.

    Fast forward to today and there are dozens of MMOs, nearly all free to play.
    No CD/DVD required - just DL on Steam.
    So the investment in the game and learning how it works simply isn't there. If things don't fall into place straight away, frustration builds up. With no reason to push through the player doesn't see the need to do so and they feel isolated from the content.
    They uninstall, post a bad review and move on.

    How to maintain NC's steep learning curve without seeming opaque is always going to be a challenge, especially in the current gaming world. Making the early game easier may cause people to cry hand-holding, not explaining things will only annoy the modern gamer - there's probably always going to be someone who doesn't get what they want.

    As always, more feedback is good.
    I remember going into a shop here in Zurich back in 2004 and asking for the English version of the game and being told it's only in German. I don't remember how I got the game in the end, but buying it was even a struggle never mind playing it 😜

    But there are some things that don't make sense even back in 2004. Like having to log out to change the game volume. I played Anarchy Online before Neocron and I don't remember having to do that. This one issue really messed up the entire stream and I don't assume it's only happened to the steamer.

    Something to look into maybe 😁

  14. #14

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    But there are some things that don't make sense even back in 2004. Like having to log out to change the game volume. I played Anarchy Online before Neocron and I don't remember having to do that. This one issue really messed up the entire stream and I don't assume it's only happened to the steamer.
    I did actually mention this to the team today before I saw this.
    I have no idea how possible it is to do this, but little things like it are stuff we can do to make the both the initial and longer-term experience easier.

    Personally, I think an 'easy to grasp - hard to master' approach could work well. The basics should be laid out quite easily, but the player should be left to discover the game's finesse.
    But what should be made clear to the player from the beginning (and currently is not) is that intent: That we expect the player to discover the game for themselves.
    If primed with that information, they are going to start with the idea in the back of their mind that they will need to either have to explore the game's mechanics by themselves or ask other players for help.
    If they arrive ingame with no instruction - be it how to play or how to find out how to play - they will feel directionless, confused and put off from exploring the game and it's mechanics.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by William Antrim View Post
    Do any of you even stream bro?

    Seriously though, it has never been my thing - I am probably too old - but are any of you guys confident enough with a mic etc to make a stream happen FOR new players but by someone with experience?

    Is it possible for the community to then artificially enhance the popularity of the stream by following it? I mean you could catapult someone into popularity through reddit etc surely?
    Hi there,

    I will happily stream Neocron as many days as I can for a few hour a day or more to try and promote Neocron!

    If we have a way to attract new players into the game by streaming then more people should do it, the fact is that a lot of people still don't know Neocron is here.

    A lot of people from a gaming community I am part of don't know either, I am trying to raise awareness of Neocron within the said gaming community which has 2800+ active members, there are procedures I need to follow to get this start but hopefully I can get more people interested.

    Anyone have any questions about me streaming feel free to ask.

    Thanks
    Ajam

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