[R#183]Trading with someone who gets overloaded

[hatmankh]

I tried trading some items between my characters in my apartment and didn't realize one of the characters couldn't carry them all. Some items were dropped and easily retrieved but others seem to have disappeared or got dropped somewhere unreachable, I don't know exactly what happened to the items but they're gone.
It was a very big trade with over 150 items, all rare parts, roughly 15-20 parts have disappeared to this bug, the others are safe and still in my possession.

The parts that disappeared were all unidentified L parts, is there any chance of these items being returned? I don't know if there's any way of tracking that. In any case this trading thing should be looked at and fixed so items don't disappear when a character gets overloaded after accepting a trade. Either all the excess items should be dropping normally or better yet the trade should not be completed if it would cause a player to be overloaded.

My guess is the "disappeared" items were dropped but because there were too many of them, some went through the floor or walls and ended up somewhere players can't get to. This is just a guess, of course I don't really know why the bug happens.

[William Antrim]

You wont get anything back that you lost due to a bug because noone can prove that you had it in the first place. I am not saying that you would make anything up but anybody with a keyboard could claim something like this to try to get money/parts out of the powers that be. To that end there is a strict policy on compensation that has been rigidly stuck to down the years. I know people who have fallen foul of it a bunch of times and it is harsh but thats life. It is better than a whole bunch of fake claims designed to just get parts for free.

All they can do is say sorry you lost stuff but as I said, because noone can prove it you just have to accept that you bodged up your trade and now those parts are gone.

[Britney]

Yes it would be nice to have some kind of a warning against getting overloaded so badly you drop stuff. The game mechanic is just fine it's only a bit hard to notice before it's too late and your valuable stuff is on the floor in plaza!

[Faid]

I thought there was an unique item limit to your inventory and if you go over that limit things get spit out onto the floor, not just the weight.

[Dropout]

I thought there was an unique item limit to your inventory and if you go over that limit things get spit out onto the floor, not just the weight.

There is, Ive run into it several times on my resser.

[Agent L]

It was a very big trade with over 150 items,

Inventory limit is about 128 items. Maybe little more. Going over this limit causes droping to the floor
After that, items on the floor limit is exactly 64 items. Once you drop 65th item, the first one disappears forever.

It's not a bug, it's a feature. Trying to shuffle 150 items at once is, well, not a right thing to do.

[hatmankh]

I know the chances of getting anything back are slim to nothing, this thread is mainly to report the glitch. This did happen today in an apartment of mine though and I've been told item resets take alot longer in apartments, my little hope is that the items were dropped and went through the walls in my apartment. If that's the case a GM might be able to retrieve them, this shouldn't fall under the no compensation policy because the items would actually be in my apartment, i.e: I can't make something like that up and if the items I said I lost are found like that, it would prove I was being honest.

Inventory limit is about 128 items. Maybe little more. Going over this limit causes droping to the floor
After that, items on the floor limit is exactly 64 items. Once you drop 65th item, the first one disappears forever.

It's not a bug, it's a feature. Trying to shuffle 150 items at once is, well, not a right thing to do.

64 items were not dropped, only about 3-5 were actually dropped on the floor, another 15-20 simply vanished. That's nowhere close to 64 dropped items so that's definitely not what happened in this case.

I know I messed up trying to trade that many items and oddly enough I never would have been able to before the trade bug was fixed, you know the one where every minute or so the trade window resets and all items get sent back to inventories. I've just never had the chance to trade like that before the old bug so there was no way for me to learn about trade bugs that happen from trading too many items.

[Agent L]

I've been told item resets take alot longer in apartments

I don't think it takes longer in apts. It's just that when the zone is empty, the counter stops. So as long as you don't use the apt, items will stay on the floor for months.
So if you ran out of apt, the items may be still there. If you stayed looking for them, they're gone : / It's like the Murphy's law: the more you search, the less likely you're going to find it.

64 items were not dropped, only about 3-5 were actually dropped on the floor, another 15-20 simply vanished.

I never tested that, but I have a theory. It is possible that when dropping items to the floor, there is a limit for number of items dropped at "once". So when you drop 3 at once, you're fine, but when you drop 20, only 3 survive the drop, rest vanishes.

Have you ever tried buying large quantities of chemicals? Same effect happens, you click "buy 249" and they are all dropped to the ground because of -400kg hard limit. But only few are to be found on the floor, rest is simply lost.

I thought a procedure test this:
- get a large (249) number of light, unstackable items. Low TL psi spells seem ideal.
- keep them on 2 chars, 125 each. Nothing in inventory except of test itmes
- trade them all to one char in one transaction
- wait for drop
- the char which is now empty picks them up from the floor
- count items on both chars.

I bet no more than 3-5 items will be dropped, rest will get simply deleted.

[hatmankh]

I think you're right. This seems like a weird limitation, it can and sometimes does get items deleted from the world forever. I know it's rare when anything valuable is lost to it but it should be looked at and hopefully fixed in some way. It's gonna be happening more often now the old trade bug is fixed.

I know this won't get much support from Neocron vets, you've all learned about it (some of you the hard way, like I did) and how to avoid it so it doesn't bother you. However it is definitely a real problem and shouldn't be ignored.

[Alduin]

There is a certain limit for items on the floor, yes! And it is by intention! Every game which allows you to drop stuff on the floor has this limit. The reasoning is pretty simple: it has to be there to prevent players from being able to crash the servers. Every single item consumes memory and CPU on the server side. If one would allow players to dump an infinite number of items onto the ground servers would blow up. That's the very same reason why items disappear after a certain amount of time (apart from the aesthetical reasoning, as well as the: I want to destroy that item reason).

As for the limit of the number of items in the inventory: it is there since the original Neocron, so yeah vets probably know their way around it. But I aggree having at least a warning when transfering too many items and/or having a visual indicator of how many items you are currently carrying would be a nice thing to have. However, this is not high on the priority list. Main topic on the priority list is sparta.

[Dropout]

main topic on the priority list is sparta.

Thats what I like to hear!

[William Antrim]

an alternative short term solution might be to have some cabinets on standby in the apartment to put your stuff into when transferring it between these 2 chars. I had to laugh at the comment where you thought that the problem was caused because someone fixed a bug ALLOWING you to move all of these items honestly. The item limit has been there forever. It says in the RPOS chat that you are nearing your inventory limit and some items will be dropped to the ground soon.

However as stated the best solution I have found to get around this problem is either get a third party to help you (someone you trust obviously) or stick the stuff straight into a cab before you continue to trade.

It is a harsh thing to happen to you and I do feel bad that you lost what could have been a SF tech but it is a bit of a school boy error.

[hatmankh]

I didn't say the problem was caused by a bug fix, I just said I would never have encountered this back when the bug still existed because I had to trade in smaller amounts or trade would get reset while I was still dragging items to the window. It's just funny how improvements to the game sometimes uncover other things. I'm still glad the trade bug was fixed, it was really annoying!

To be clear, my problem isn't with the fact that items disappear after x amount get dropped or the inventory limit, or the time limit on dropped items disappearing. The problem is this:

I never tested that, but I have a theory. It is possible that when dropping items to the floor, there is a limit for number of items dropped at "once". So when you drop 3 at once, you're fine, but when you drop 20, only 3 survive the drop, rest vanishes.

I bet no more than 3-5 items will be dropped, rest will get simply deleted.

When the game forces you to drop some items, only around 3 are actually dropped and the rest instantly vanish. This thread wouldn't exist if the 15-20 items simply dropped to the floor like they're intended to. This can only happen when a "forced drop" occurs, because no one can drag items out of their inventory fast enough to make this happen.

Just wanted it to be clear what we were talking about because people keep bringing up irrelevant things to do with dropped items. I did make a mistake with the inventory limit thing (Didn't know about it) but I'm not so stupid as to leave rare parts lying on the floor of my apartment and then come make a bug report when they disappear or get stolen.

I agree Sparta is highest priority right now and I'm glad to hear Alduin say it. I never expected or want the team to drop everything they're doing and start fixing this. I did a search and nothing on this came up so I decided to report it.