Very controversial idea to remove ppus

[Neallys]

I feel like Pepper park is the problem, not the PPU. People will always search for a compromised PvP zone, which is Safezone/Warzone. Back when Neocron and DoY were separated as two big alliances, you saw people pking in Pepper park all over the zones and Pro-cities going to DoY. Of course they had to bring their own PPU and stuff, but also people came alone and sniped in P1, or did stealth attacks in Pepper park, it wasn't always OP-team like.

[DIABLO666]

It's not just in PP though, in a OP war if you don't have a ppu you've already lost and often the side with more ppus wins as if 1 side has 2 ppus the other 1 then the side with 2 has 1 ppu to buff 1 to anti buff the other ppu so hes always buffing himself not his allies OR 2 ppus to anti buff the enemy ppu so he goes down quickly.

right now ppus seem to determine who wins a fight.

As for people saying it will make Op fights last 4 seconds they could make some changes to fix that, for example as I said in my post make the enemy able to hack the top GR so they have a place to quickly GR to OR have a safe building in the zone instead that can be hacked, some kind of bunker which is similar to the UG but outside of the OP in the zone. This way instead of people just constantly rezzing all fight there could be fights followed by reorganising then another attack. They could even change the SI loss so people can get into the fight more quickly. This could actually be a interesting way to do it as the defenders could counter hack the door to the bunker if they are winning convincingly to clear it out thus making it unhackable for a while so any further attacks must be done from further afield.

Edit: For hacking the bunker the hack term for it could be on the back of the bunker or somewhere out of the way, this way the person hacking could be defended as well as the person hacking the OP.

[William Antrim]

I feel like Pepper park is the problem, not the PPU. People will always search for a compromised PvP zone, which is Safezone/Warzone. Back when Neocron and DoY were separated as two big alliances, you saw people pking in Pepper park all over the zones and Pro-cities going to DoY. Of course they had to bring their own PPU and stuff, but also people came alone and sniped in P1, or did stealth attacks in Pepper park, it wasn't always OP-team like.

The community is the problem, not the zone or the class.

[The Red Guy]

You can't change community behaviour, just force them by game changes. Sadly...

[DIABLO666]

Indeed if you could get the community to change we wouldn't need fixes to exploits and a proper system to find hackers. Sadly we need both of these.

How about if we change this into ideas to properly balance ppus? The main issue I have with ppus if they determine the fight right now, was chatting about this with a clan mate and he gave the good example of if you have a 2v2 fight, 1 ppu 1 damage dealer each side who wins that fight?

Well lets look into it, if both ppus are of a equal skill the damage dealers determine it because there is no difference in the support so its as if there is no support, however if 1 of the ppus is missing every heal and every anti buff and the other is hitting every heal and anti buff the guy with the good ppu is going to win, you would need a really awful aim and to basically stand still in order to loose against a guy who basically has no buffs while you're healed.

The same thing happens in OP fights, the side with the best ppus wins. Now I can already see people saying *well thats just you complaining about being bad with ppu* but no this is me saying its ridiculous that 1 character basically decides the fight. You could have some of the best damage dealers in the game against some of the worst but if the good damager dealers in turn had some of the worst ppus in the game and the bad damage dealers had some of the best ppus, chances are the bad people would win.

As such if people are against the removal of the ppu let us discuss a way to properly balance how they affect a fight so that they are worth 1 person not 2 or 3.

One possible solution would be to change it so that ppu buffs are only say 50% as effective against human players when cast on somebody else (the actual number would need to be tweaked with proper testing), this way it wouldn't ruin pve but it would make ppu support a useful thing to have but not the be all and end all.

[William Antrim]

Foreign cast is already weaker than self cast. Thats already in game. This thread should die ideally before someone takes you seriously.

[DIABLO666]

Foreign cast is already weaker than self cast. Thats already in game. This thread should die ideally before someone takes you seriously.

Please stop trolling or don't post, I realise this, it however is not enough or did you decide to ignore everything I said? Or are you going to claim that ppu buffs make no difference at all? Hell this kind of fix could actually help make certain guns and melee more useful as a ppu wouldn't render them worthless.

[Saiyuki-]

Please stop trolling or don't post, I realise this, it however is not enough or did you decide to ignore everything I said? Or are you going to claim that ppu buffs make no difference at all? Hell this kind of fix could actually help make certain guns and melee more useful as a ppu wouldn't render them worthless.

so you're suggesting making ppu shields weaker to "balance" weaker weapons
what the.
please think about the implications of this.........

[Load_HeavyLoad]

i'd like to re-iterate what saiyuki said and to a greater extent reinforce what william say - [ edited ]

[DIABLO666]

You realise saying things like that just makes it look like your scared by a good idea that will make the game harder for you? if it really is such a bad idea you can easily think up counter arguments as to why its bad instead of just throwing around insults like a common troll.

And saiyuki I'm not saying to reduce ppu shields on a ppu just on other people as right now they have far to much of a impact on fights. And no I'm not suggesting this to balance the weaker weapons I'm suggesting it as ppus right now have the biggest impact out of anybody on a fight, 1 ppu is worth about 2 or 3 people in a fight they should be worth 1 person, I mearly mentioned that doing this might also help melee and other such weapons as a possible other benefit. I never said it will balance or fix weaker weapons, just that it could possibly help.

[Netphreak]

While I do find that some fights can just boil down to who brought the most ppu's, I do feel that a simple solution to this is by giving APU's anti buff back and fixing some of their issues.

That promotes people to play and bring apu's to fights, gives them a purpose and also stops the class/spec that can make someone very hard to kill due to buffs and heals, also being the only class that can counter/remove those buffs and heals.

[DIABLO666]

While I do find that some fights can just boil down to who brought the most ppu's, I do feel that a simple solution to this is by giving APU's anti buff back and fixing some of their issues.

That promotes people to play and bring apu's to fights, gives them a purpose and also stops the class/spec that can make someone very hard to kill due to buffs and heals, also being the only class that can counter/remove those buffs and heals.

I suggested this but a clan mate pointed out that if you did this all that would happen is people would kill the apu very quickly and then there would be no de-buffers at all which would actually make things worse. In order for it to work apus would need to be a lot more survivable as if they got anti-buff back people would make sure they go down first which they would cos they are so squishy. And of course this still doesn't fix the issue with ppus being worth 2-3 guys as unless you have a apu with a debuff ppu buffs will still be adding to much.

The real issue is just that ppus give to much of an advantage which right now is making fights more about who has the most / best ppus.

[J@ck on Cr@ck]

Too long didnt read?

My thought exactly!
Diablo you seem to always write a wall of text which, most of the times, is pretty unstructured.
Additionally your recent posts speak for themselves.

Yes PPU can be annoying at times, but thats no reason to remove them. Without them OP fights would be a waste of time. They would be over before they even really started.
I dont like the idea of removing the PPU, but you are of course entitled to your opinion.

[DIABLO666]

My thought exactly!
Diablo you seem to always write a wall of text which, most of the times, is pretty unstructured.
Additionally your recent posts speak for themselves.

Yes PPU can be annoying at times, but thats no reason to remove them. Without them OP fights would be a waste of time. They would be over before they even really started.
I dont like the idea of removing the PPU, but you are of course entitled to your opinion.

So you want me to just post *get rid of ppus noob!* or something like that with no explanation? its a controversial idea so I thought I'd explain myself properly which takes time. and if you continued to read the thread you would notice I suggested changing the idea to just a fix for them.

As I said but I will reiterate the problem with ppus is they are worth 2 or 3 guys, most fights now are determined by who has the best ppu not the best fighters as there needs to be a pretty big gap in the damage dealers skill to make a difference if 1 ppu is landing every heal and anti buff while the other misses them all.

So basically to sum up, a ppu is worth 2-3 people, no character should be worth 2-3 people just because of their class.

[Mortis]

all those whiners who are scared of changes,
like the idea, op fights would be again more thrilling and would indeed more planning than just hopping into the op