LE clans

[RogerRamjet]

Enti I get the impression you consider roleplay and pvp two mutually exclusive elements of the game. If you're disregarding the pvp side of this game, don't be upset when people disregard the role play part.

The two things should go hand in hand. Polarising your opinion on things quite frankly doesn't make your arguments sound particularly balanced or thought out.

[SynC_187]

While I understand why people want this, and I have LE in a lot of my chars during leveling, I think risk is part of the atmosphere. I think one of the devs stated recently that it is a pvp focussed game, end of.

I don't understand the roleplay arguement. How can you roleplay a harsh dangerous world, with waring factions and conflict everywhere, when you avoid the risk and conflict?

The LE is a crutch to hide behind while leveling, not an end game PVP switch.

[Netphreak]

Then perhaps LE runners should be denied voting in the faction elections, and LE clan's should not be allowed to appoint a representative to stand for election.



You forget the RPG bit of Neocron. Some people don't want to PvP.

Also what's stopping you from offering money, a nice rare etc to pull their LE out to take part in the end game? Clans and players should offering incentives, not discouraging them from playing the game.

Nothing, but if we allow people to create LE clans then why would they ever want to join someone else's guild when they can just create their own and do whatever they like with no risk/exposure to the core elements of Neocron.

We want to encourage people to pull out their LE's, work as part of a clan, have them exposed to the risk having no LE in brings and call in clan mates for support if required, all the things that gave NC1 it's feel.

[Juppe]

wait wait wait.. what happened here? earlier when there was conversation about LEs drawbacks whats the point of takin the LE out.. the only argument was you could join clan unled.. that was pretty much it. now you suddenly want to take that away..
wow, just wow.
can i ask what is it you guys want to do in this game?

actually i think you guys are trolling? right? you want to turn neocron to something it never has been.. a carebear game. Your LE post i consider as trollin/flamin..an insult to the game..
it is almost like if i went to Sims forums to suggest they add weapons so i can kill my neighbours. If someone there suggest there "hey devs we need more different paint colors to color our walls" i go there and "no we need guns.. yes, definatly more guns"

[Brammers]

Nothing, but if we allow people to create LE clans then why would they ever want to join someone else's guild when they can just create their own and do whatever they like with no risk/exposure to the core elements of Neocron.

We want to encourage people to pull out their LE's, work as part of a clan, have them exposed to the risk having no LE in brings and call in clan mates for support if required, all the things that gave NC1 it's feel.

The LE hasn't changed in function or design for the most of the part of NC1 and NC2, so they can still get killed by mobs. The latest LE penalties have made it similar to the LE at the start of Neocron 1, except the player has to now choose whether to accept the penalties while levelling after /30

Anyway, think this argument is going off topic. If a player joins a LE clan, and then decides he wants to PvP he's going to have to leave the clan and pull the LE out. The only people who benefit are RP/Tradeskill clans. And lets face it. You are not going to find a UN-le'ed tradeskiller who is going to PvP with you - as they don't normally have a gun they can use to shoot back, and they usually fall on the floor quickly for you as well. Surely you want a good fight in PvP?

Seriously, some people don't want to PvP so they choose to keep their LE in. It's a game mechanic that's been there since day one that isn't going away.

[Juppe]

Seriously, some people don't want to PvP so they choose to keep their LE in. It's a game mechanic that's been there since day one that isn't going away.

yes.. they can do that if they want to. they dont need clans tho.

[William Antrim]

My tradeskillers don't have le's in.

The law enforcer is akin to stabilisers on your bike. You don't still have them on when you're 16!

[eNTi]

Enti I get the impression you consider roleplay and pvp two mutually exclusive elements of the game. If you're disregarding the pvp side of this game, don't be upset when people disregard the role play part.

The two things should go hand in hand. Polarising your opinion on things quite frankly doesn't make your arguments sound particularly balanced or thought out.

i'm not. i'm participating in pvp. even one of my trades killers is without le. all i was saying, that most pvp oriented people in neocron don't give two fucks about rp, while there are rp clans that play WITH le. that said, the le is part of the lore and thus part of rp if you want it to be. i know that there are people who think they can't really rp if they can't shoot everyone and everything, which is complete and utter bullshit. rp is pretending. there are no restrictions to your fantasy so it really depends on how far you are willing to go. i do understand why people leave their le in. there are too many assholes who only want to have fun on the expense of others.

regarding le clans... wtf is the big deal? all you can do as a clan is having a shared app and a bigger wallet. it's not as if you are magically provided with outpost bonuses just because you are in a clan.

[Juppe]

i know that there are people who think they can't really rp if they can't shoot everyone and everything, which is complete and utter bullshit. rp is pretending. there are no restrictions to your fantasy so it really depends on how far you are willing to go.

what? yea.. for now on when i see enemy faction player i close my eyes and pretend to shoot him in the face.

what kind of rp is that you cant hurt your enemies? even if you could shoot them it doesnt mean youd have to.. if you like to rp as a person who dont like violence or whatever.. you can. i dont understand your comments man.

[Load_HeavyLoad]

i'm not. i'm participating in pvp. even one of my trades killers is without le. all i was saying, that most pvp oriented people in neocron don't give two fucks about rp, while there are rp clans that play WITH le. that said, the le is part of the lore and thus part of rp if you want it to be. i know that there are people who think they can't really rp if they can't shoot everyone and everything, which is complete and utter bullshit. rp is pretending. there are no restrictions to your fantasy so it really depends on how far you are willing to go. i do understand why people leave their le in. there are too many assholes who only want to have fun on the expense of others.

regarding le clans... wtf is the big deal? all you can do as a clan is having a shared app and a bigger wallet. it's not as if you are magically provided with outpost bonuses just because you are in a clan.

No but the idea is you either solo as an LE or you take LE out and lose the protection of the LE but gain the protection of others from the clan system. The whole idea of a clan is to be able to take an outpost if you break it down to first principles - i seriously dont see how you dont get this unless your idea of rp is the same as in the link below

http://www.demotivation.us/media/dem...6464271115.jpg

[Deus Ex Machina]

I am unsure about LE Clans, but one thing I ave to say:

In Neocron it isn't really RP unless you are ready to PvP. Why?

Situation 1) Un LEd Runner comes along and shoots at your faction guards. With LE you can nothing about that (and lets say you are Tangent or Twilight, so you are not that adverse to violence)

Situation 2) LE Runner comes along and shoots at your faction NPCs. No one can do anything about them, although that is behaviour that no one could tolerate, and that the LE should prohibit, not protect.

These situations alone say to me, that I cannot really include LE runners in RP, because they can neither stand up for their faction if there is need, nor face consequences from thinking enemies when they attack a faction.

Roleplay is about standing up for what you believe (and sometimes you believe in running, to live another day), and about facing consequences.
Everything else is just chatting. What is a threat, if you cannot in any sense at least try to follow it through?

[BlueRobot]

No.

You don't need an LE to do RP.
You don't need an LE to play a tradeskiller.
Clans don't give you any bonuses but are there to bring players together and assist in player organisation. (PvE, PvP and RP)
The LE is there to restrict player-player interaction.

If your idea of RP is living in your own bubble and having someone in your apartment to chat with once a week, you don't need a clan for that. (You don't even need the game for that, you could just use a chatroom/forum tbh)

[eNTi]

No but the idea is you either solo as an LE or you take LE out and lose the protection of the LE but gain the protection of others from the clan system. The whole idea of a clan is to be able to take an outpost if you break it down to first principles - i seriously dont see how you dont get this unless your idea of rp is the same as in the link below

http://www.demotivation.us/media/dem...6464271115.jpg

no. that's your idea of a clan. if you just want to hoard rares, show off trophies and have one appa where you can safely share items between your characters you make an le clan. i certainly would and this doesn't interfere with the rest of the game in any significant way, or does it?

[RogerRamjet]

i'm not. i'm participating in pvp. even one of my trades killers is without le. all i was saying, that most pvp oriented people in neocron don't give two fucks about rp, while there are rp clans that play WITH le. that said, the le is part of the lore and thus part of rp if you want it to be. i know that there are people who think they can't really rp if they can't shoot everyone and everything, which is complete and utter bullshit. rp is pretending. there are no restrictions to your fantasy so it really depends on how far you are willing to go. i do understand why people leave their le in. there are too many assholes who only want to have fun on the expense of others

I agree some players want the game to practically be an fps, but we've got an environment at the moment where due to shitty game mechanics no one has needed to roleplay anything for a long time (post 2.2). The actual scope in this game for pvp orientated roleplay is huge and this is the direction the game should head. It's a post apocalyptic setting where you could get blasted in the face by plasma every time you step outside a safe zone, but society, interactions and rules are still in place and it needs to be worked on as a whole.

For instance, you're an un-LEd trader or farmer. The wastes are dangerous, so you hire some heavies to watch your back. Say they fix City Mercs so this is plausible. That's the kind of stuff we should be aiming for in my eyes.

EDIT: At one point as well it was easy to be a high level conster/resser and have a very viable pistol spy pvp set up.

[Load_HeavyLoad]

no. that's your idea of a clan. if you just want to hoard rares, show off trophies and have one appa where you can safely share items between your characters you make an le clan. i certainly would and this doesn't interfere with the rest of the game in any significant way, or does it?

my idea of a clan? the ultimate end game in neocron is to control OPs thats not an assumption or my idea thats fact - all that leads up to it, farming rares, levelling, Woccing all leads into better characters and weapons for taking and holding OPs.

if you want to collect trophies thats fine just buy a big appartment tell your friends the code and you can all sit there having a circle j*rk about how many 5 slot paw of bears and copbot trophies you have

if you can form LE clans you are taking away IMHO the biggest bonus of being un-LE'd which is being in a clan. making LE'd clans is taking a massive leap backwards from the small step forward the volunteer team have made with regards to de-incentivising the LE