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  1. #1
    I am BlackMaze SilentEye's Avatar
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    Default Re-Design Stealth

    I'd like to propose a re-design of the stealth tools;

    • Activating stealth is permanent;
    • You may still equip items while in stealth;
    • Activating an item exits stealth (shooting a rifle, activating a hack, not opening a door);
    • Stealthed targets may still be targeted and damaged;
    • Taking damage does not exit stealth;
    • A higher tech level means more transparency of the stealther;

    Pro's for the stealther;

    • No inconvenience for the user with timing stealth to calculate when you exit;
    • It is easier to equip the correct item to use after exiting stealth;
    • May exit stealth guns blazing so to speak;

    Pro's for the attacker;

    • The stealther is more vulnerable to attack making it a higher risk to use up close to people;
    • Stealth is no longer a guaranteed getaway;

    Let me know your thoughts
    Last edited by SilentEye; 10-04-13 at 11:19. Reason: Just added some items :)

  2. #2

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    Permanent stealth?

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  3. #3
    I am BlackMaze SilentEye's Avatar
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    Default

    Even though you will be able to target them constantly and kill them if you keep your eyes pealed?

    Think about it!

  4. #4

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    You can kill a stealthed player anyway with aoe. No need to target them. If i remember correctly plasma weapons (such as CS and first love) can hit through stealth too

  5. #5
    NC2 were u fight bugs from NC1
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    Default

    I kind of see what you are aiming at but now sure how well it would work.
    As the Tech Level determines how transparent you are and you are still target-able while stealthed the Jones stealth (which is the only stealth a PE can use) would be pointless in a combat situation and the attacker would still have a weapon lock on you when you go into stealth and due to you being reasonable visible they wouldn't lose that lock.

    Also I would think that you would need to press the stealth activator again to break stealth and then select your weapon so that it is not completely overpowered.
    TERRA:
    Master Netphreak : Rifle PE 70/65** | Netphreak : Rifle Spy 79/65**
    Jedi Master Net : Gimped Blessed Hybird Monk 62/55**
    Kid Net : Pistol PE 63/65** | Chuck Rock : 56/58* H-C tank
    Dark Eagle : 73/56** CST Pistol Spy

  6. #6
    The REAL Walker
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    This will hurt PE's the most. So Im obviously very much against.
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  7. #7
    NC2 were u fight bugs from NC1
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dropout View Post
    This will hurt PE's the most. So Im obviously very much against.
    Now if I could use a Paineaser or Libby while stealthed and stay stealthed then you might be onto something. Atleast you'd have a chance of killing people with those weapons again.
    TERRA:
    Master Netphreak : Rifle PE 70/65** | Netphreak : Rifle Spy 79/65**
    Jedi Master Net : Gimped Blessed Hybird Monk 62/55**
    Kid Net : Pistol PE 63/65** | Chuck Rock : 56/58* H-C tank
    Dark Eagle : 73/56** CST Pistol Spy

  8. #8
    Huckle Beare' Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    Default

    Remove it completely. Better idea.
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    I am BlackMaze SilentEye's Avatar
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    Default


  10. #10
    Registered User Grogor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Holliday View Post
    Remove it completely. Better idea.
    Hm I disagree. Everyone complains that the APU is too weak and gets down to fast. Have you ever considered what a Spy that has less CON and no high level Armorset like Monks goes down even faster without stealth?

    I'm also against changing the mechanics of the stealth (exept the bugs ofc). There are viable ways against stealthers. Ok, it requires a bit of skill and a second weapon, but very non-stealth class can so something about it.
    And you have to loose target with single shot weapons otherwise stealth would be almost useless if you don't activate it in the very first moment you got attacked, so you have time to trick the attacker. Seems worse than the current situation to me.
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  11. #11
    Huckle Beare' Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grogor View Post
    Hm I disagree. Everyone complains that the APU is too weak and gets down to fast. Have you ever considered what a Spy that has less CON and no high level Armorset like Monks goes down even faster without stealth?

    I'm also against changing the mechanics of the stealth (exept the bugs ofc). There are viable ways against stealthers. Ok, it requires a bit of skill and a second weapon, but very non-stealth class can so something about it.
    And you have to loose target with single shot weapons otherwise stealth would be almost useless if you don't activate it in the very first moment you got attacked, so you have time to trick the attacker. Seems worse than the current situation to me.

    you make some very valid points grogor and i agree but currently WITH stealth the spy is overpowered and the class of choice for a great many reasons. granted that removal of stealth is a true hammer blow to the class but its also a way of removing some of that overpoweredness that is inherent within the class as it is right now.

    i realise my post was short and not very discursive but it is food for thought after all.
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  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Holliday View Post
    you make some very valid points grogor and i agree but currently WITH stealth the spy is overpowered and the class of choice for a great many reasons. granted that removal of stealth is a true hammer blow to the class but its also a way of removing some of that overpoweredness that is inherent within the class as it is right now.

    i realise my post was short and not very discursive but it is food for thought after all.
    I strongly disagree!
    First of all you will take away a key characteristic of the spy class.
    Secondly the spy is not overpowered because of stealth, but because of overpowered weapons (dissy/ak).
    Taking away stealth doesn´t change that fact and therefore will only be a band aid solution.
    It also seems to me that you completly forgot about pistol spies which are not overpowered. Just because there are not many pistol spies doesn´t mean you can leave them out of the equation.

    While I find the ideas proposed by silent eye interesting I rather stick with the current stealth mechanics.
    Stealth now is not a guaranteed getaway and you are in fact vulnerable. Usually you stealth only after taking a relatively high amount of damage and can be finished off by a variety of weapons. A winding argument hurts quite a lot and you will become "visible" and can be chased. Additionally stealth doesn´t work properly at the moment and you will often appear visible while you think you are not.

    It seems to me people do not understand the underlying problem of weapon balance and try to fix this issue some other way (band aid solutions).

  13. #13

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    I think thats a bit too much.

    The only problem I see with stealth, is that its currently making spies the best choice for OP-Fights by far. But since the PvP balance pretty much doesn't exist, it's hard to say nerfing stealth is still needed in the big picture.

    My suggestion would be to add a spell/tool that you can cast on someone, like an anti heal, that stops them from using stealth and throws them out of it if casted delayed.
    Another idea that I think sounds cool, would be to have a drone that can see stealthers and can throw them out of stealth if it shoots them.

    What i dislike the most about op's idea is, that you would accidentaly see stealthers if they try to ambush you, and their hitbox appears because you randomely moved your aim over them.

  14. #14
    Huckle Beare' Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    ............

    True Sight Sanctum. Its shite. It does however exist.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aKe`cj View Post
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  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    My suggestion would be to add a spell/tool that you can cast on someone, like an anti heal, that stops them from using stealth and throws them out of it if casted delayed.
    Another idea that I think sounds cool, would be to have a drone that can see stealthers and can throw them out of stealth if it shoots them.
    As the above said, true sight santum is there but its not great. But i also like the idea of maybe making a True Sight Barrel. So like poison / fire / lightning barrels APUs get, maybe give APUs a True Sight Barrel. This would again give something to the vastly underplayed APUs. Maybe make it only last 5-10 seconds or something and cost about 100-200 psi to cast meaning that they have something to do with a large cost to do so.
    I do like the idea of an anti stealth drone, maybe make it like the punisher for how it shoots (direct ball that on hitting any surface / player sends out a AOE or sparks) and anyone hit by the sparks is revieled. Also if they can see a person in stealth as a different colour or something, make them glow red or yellow or something or just you can see the stealth cloud from a larger distance.

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