Make Tech Haven Relevant

[Jest]

I love Tech Haven but I've never seen it more irrelevant than it is now. What follows is a list of suggestions that I think will improve the relevance of not only Tech Haven, but also of the Military Base and the Canyon.

1. Starter apartments in Tech Haven. This cannot be said enough. I can't even fathom why the starter apartments for the Fallen Angels are in Neocron itself. It hurts just thinking about it.

2. Make an underground subway system that goes from Neocron to Tech Haven. This benefits everyone. Tech Haven is in the middle of the map. Low level runners trying to explore the wasteland cut a little bit of time off their hands. And if Fallen Angels want to run immediately to Neocron to level then they can do so.

3. New runners in the outposts can't survive without a system of tradeskill support. Give each outpost a sort of op bonus to friendly or neutral factions to encourage trade beyond Plaza 1. TH would grant +5 research, +5 construction. MB would get +10 repair. Canyon would get +10 recycle.

4. Remove the safe zone from Military Base. MB is an outpost and it should be treated as such. Because of the bunker there are already tons of people there. It doesn't need the added bonus of the safe zone to get people there. Plus, inside MB was where I got my first kill in Neocron over 10 years ago. I'd hate to rob anyone of an awesome memory like that.

5. Consolidate the trade channels (http://forum.neocron-game.com/showth...f-the-channels). If I am offering tradeskills in TH or MB right now then I'm going to be using the Neocron trade channel because that is the only one people don't have muted. By combining the channels you are increasingly the likelihood of trade beyond Plaza 1.

Combined these suggestions would bring trade outside of Plaza 1. It would bring PvP outside of Plaza 2. Everyone in Neocron benefits from a relevant Tech Haven.

[Dope]

I'm a little dubious about the subway, but only because in fiction that's a little weird. Would be totally fine with a "secret passage" that had a subway style train in it though. An FA one rather than a NEXT one? Would take some zone building.

Thumbs way up to the other ideas though. I wish, wish, wish my two FA's weren't housed in those bombed out shitholes in OZ.

[Jest]

Agreed, thematically I was thinking about something along the lines of a secret passage as well. A door could be added on each side, one in OZ station area and another in TH that would lead to the new zone. I'm not what kind of resources the dev team has these days as far as adding new zones goes but it doesn't need to be a subway. And while awesome, the passage system was more of a wish list item, whereas I'd consider the other 4 items absolutely essential for a Tech Haven recovery.

[William Antrim]

We already have 2 secret passages. Don't need any more.




Yes to everything else though. The wasteland factions need some love.

[Jest]

Fair point. And actually the more I think about it the more it makes sense to me that the "secret passage" would be a direct single zone Hacknet passage with a 0 skill requirement. It could actually almost function as a tutorial area for Hacknet itself. Access would be denied once a runner reaches the rank of **/20. Before then all they need is a hack tool and could go from TH to the OZ subway.

[Dope]

Oh, that's intriguing!
That could be as easy as an FA agent that will port young TH allies across with a "hacked genrep" or something fun like that.

Just get my FA girls out of the OZ and send them home!

[Jodo]

1: Yes absolutely. I don't think anyone in the world of NC disagrees with this idea.

2: No, it shouldn't be easy to travel like that. The "anti-city" factions have always been for the more experienced players and an experienced player can either get a ride from a friend or hike reasonably safely because they know the roads. I do this with each noob I make and feel satisfied having doing so. (more regarding this later)

3: Yes please. This idea has been mentioned a few times over the years and I would love to see it.

4: I don't really mind this too much but what about a TH safezone for trade?

5: Yes. I think the chat system and channels need an overhaul and there have been a few good suggestions about this over the last couple of months.


Regarding the subway link: I love the idea that City Admin and Fallen Angels would want to stregnthen their alliance with an E-Z Transit system (after FA properly move back to TH). But what I love more is that factions wanting to scupper the alliance (TT, BT, TG, CS etc (take your pick)) by bombing the place close to completion. It would then become a dangerous way of travelling back and forth and a place to level. The closer you are to either location the easier the mobs with maybe the middle of the journey having some level 50 - 60 mobs. Noobs could actually start levelling at the very beginning with rats, spiders, lizards, then further along mutants etc.
High level players could actually just run through and avoid most threats if they wanted to.

[Doc Holliday]

one time gr use (maybe with a small quest) to take the runner out to TH/Canyon akin to the mc5 gr to your apartment. Just a thought that came to mind.

[William Antrim]

It says in the original manual that TH MB and Canyon are places for experienced players only. Those factions should be made out to be that much tougher to give the noobs a chance to experience them before they realise how turd they call are compared to City Admin.

[Jest]

I don't think we need to consider a twelve year old game manual to be canon at this point in the game. I'd have probably left the passage idea out of the original post since it only marginally affects Tech Haven. It would actually help Neocron factions far more than Fallen Angels since it would give them easy access to a mid point in the map. I'd like to focus on the other points.

With such universal agreement on point #1 I feel compelled to ask not if this is going in, but when. Have the devs made any statements about where this falls on the priority list? Everything in the last patch was great and it may seem like such a small thing to get FA into Tech Haven but it will remain a ghost town for as long as the starting apartments are in the Outzone and even implementing ideas #3 through #5 aren't enough to make Tech Haven truly stand on it's own without #1.

[SilentEye]

I like the underground passage idea. Not a subway.

This underground passage could be a leveling phase between Aggie Cellar and MB. It wouldn't be something to stick to for too long.

You need to ask yourself this though: Do you want to take even more people away from the wastelands

[RogerRamjet]

Definitely agree with the need for runner housing for the relevant factions returned to TH and TG and giving them a reason to hang out there. Full compliments of shops etc. There used to be excellent noob caves at TG but don't know what it's like now.

Agree with removing the MB safe zone (as well as for instance OZ station). Always used to enjoy the risk of GRing in knowing there could be a squad of reds hanging around the gogo. Remove the Mercs HQ GR.

What about even making j01 a battle zone? This would promote pvp to move outside into the open. Maybe the same could happen at e13 (zone outside TG canyon).

[Trivaldi]

What else in Tech Haven would make it relevant? What type of areas would you like to see? How could the space be used? Would you consider Tech Haven to have a "unique selling point" which could be used to draw people in?

A return to Tech Haven has been suggested many, many times. What else would make it special and not just another empty zone?

[William Antrim]

If you could copy the levelling ability (in terms of runner progression) from NC to TH/MB/TG then I think more people would go there. They would need full access to a complete range of shops selling everything every class needs. They would need the exact same NPCs that NC has - in terms of runners help and faction assistants and the like.


They would need their Jones missions updating to be specifically tailored to TH, TG and MB.

They would need the people IN the faction who would now have EVERYTHING that NC has - go there and RP their faction to their hearts content.

All of the people who want TH to be viable for all people all the time need to understand that it is not just a wish list that you have to make to make TH etc just how you remember it. It also needs to have OTHER fallen angels who actually want to go there too. You guys will need to be integral in making your faction great again. You will need to hang out there yourselves and offer all of these services to the noobs to make them go there too.

If you dont then they wont bother. Lucas Kell made a thread similar to this a while ago. It raised some great ideas but imo basic human psychology will trump this nostalgia any day of the week.

If the devs put all of this work in and made all of these things happen to all 3 of the zones mentioned then they would have a legitimate shot at making them into populated areas. However Plaza 1 would still hold the trump card that is the sheep theory. Psychologically we crowd to the place that is the most popular. This will be for a multitude of reasons - it is cheaper to go there... it is convenient to go there... there are more people selling items and thus there will be a better chance of getting X trader there... there are more customers there... etc etc.


The only thing that would make it truly special is a highly dedicated, highly motivated set of individuals who are committed to RP and to making this faction live and breathe outside of the life-supported shadow that it currently is. They would need to be online around the clock (at least at peak times) to make the place look and feel lived in. They would need to be inherently good at pvp in order to defend their home base from the marauding hordes of evil people like me who do not wear an LE and they would need to be patient and kind and honest to protect/help the noobs in the faction.

It is a pretty tall order.

All that you guys can do as Devs is lead the horse to water in this one, you cannot make it drink.

[Dope]

Well, I agree to some extent, but I don't think there needs to be as much done as all that implies.

A leveling track would be nice, but I would rather it was a mostly tech progression, emphasizing hack and using mostly tech mobs as fits theme. Maaaaybe some sort of TH bum, maybe, if handled just right. Jones missions for sure would need to be fixed for TH starters.

Maybe the (also displaced) Twilight Guardian could find an RP reason to take back TH with the Fallen Angels, to concentrate some portion of the starter crowd? I don't think you need more than the basic few, allbuyer, a H.E.W. (or analog) and the appropriate weapon vendors for each potential class to level up.

I don't disagree that Plaza will still be the center of commerce, that's OK, let TH be the rebel center!

With regard to what TH offers that makes it sexy (Trivaldi's question), there are a few things.

• First of all, the apartments are sweet. It was a great aspiration for me on earlier servers to buy myself a tier 3 TH apt. Yum. My own private grav-lift? Glass floors? That place is teh sex.

• Second, it's out in the wasteyplaces, remote and out of the way for those City folk. So when grown ups from TH go into the city after growing up in in TechHaven, they won't feel any silly remorse about killin' their city enemies! (Yay!) - also vice-versa. Aloso aliances and clandestine meetings will be more thematic. At higher level gen-reps make the distance moot.

• But finally, it's a thematically appealing, mostly safe from enemies place for advanced, anti-city factions to live and grow in a smaller, but separate theatre. One with sweet apartments and a tech focus. If that tech focus was blown out so that some of the highest tech items could *only* be had at TechHaven, then you'd have an interesting dynamic between factionalism and the desire for high tech.

Anyway, that's my two cred. I just want my FA avatars to go home.