Safe zones for LE runners

[Arista Barret]

the real problem is that everybody can have a LE char for farming.

1) LE chars shouldn't be able to loot any rare item, which include
-Rare parts ( wanna farm rares? go with your not LE char, and risk to get any )
-Woc Disks ( same as before )
-Ultima and Eyes ( same as before ).
-Mc5 (same as before )

2) Stats cap ( reaching /50 should block your exp till LE is put out )
-NB: also prevent you from loming, and cheating trying to cap a specific stat

3) Safe Zones would be a problem ( harder to set up ), and with a drop table restriction and a stats cap, should not be needed.

I didn't see so many LE while both on uranus and terra.
And this is a fuckin MMOFPS.

LE was born to prevent pking on low lvl, and still that's what's worth for.
Ready to join the real neocron? Remove LE and continue your character.

You could have a point if
-Entire account with or without LE
-No multiple accounts permitted

But that's not our situation.

Why a low lvl should not be able to see the entire world and die by his own while trying to discovery ( or kill ) anything?
It brings no problems ( cause XP cap and Impossibility to get drops ).

LE actually is a problem ( also for finding a party, cause everybody has LE on ), but removing zones from LE chars is not the answer.

i'm pretty sure that with a stat cap and no chance to get rares we'll be back to Neocron immediatly.

I think more needs to be said about this guys ideas

[Shirlias]

I do - got a problem with that?

Not at all.
And as u see you're the only one who said "i like nc pve as endgame".

I would like to hear more from this guy.

Nothing more.
Is just a bit different from the nc i played years ago.

[Dope]

With regard to the original post, I have often wondered about the changes to zone safety since returning to the City.

When I began playing long ago, runners were rewarded for killing enemies in Pepper Park, but couldn't even draw a weapon in parts of plaza and VR. The LE didn't work in the OZ or the wasteland, and there were no penalties in those "completely wild" areas for killing enemies. I hovered at the Big Door in trepidation for a few minutes before venturing out to Jeriko the first time, as I recall. Knowing that I was about to cross into the wild wastes.

That kinda seems lost to us in the current state of affairs. Seems silly to worry about PvP in VR, and silly not to in Pepper Park, what gives?

[Torg]

i wonder how long this complaing about the LE will continue.

[gostly]

With regard to the original post, I have often wondered about the changes to zone safety since returning to the City.

When I began playing long ago, runners were rewarded for killing enemies in Pepper Park, but couldn't even draw a weapon in parts of plaza and VR. The LE didn't work in the OZ or the wasteland, and there were no penalties in those "completely wild" areas for killing enemies. I hovered at the Big Door in trepidation for a few minutes before venturing out to Jeriko the first time, as I recall. Knowing that I was about to cross into the wild wastes.

That kinda seems lost to us in the current state of affairs. Seems silly to worry about PvP in VR, and silly not to in Pepper Park, what gives?

Feel the same way man. It's like DoY came along, they wanted to mix things up so they changed the zones and moved copbots around but no one ever thought to undo the changes when they realized that only a small amount of players were happy with DoY.

I'd love to see zones reverted to the way things were in NC1. Plaza/VR safezones, no copbots in PP, faction HQs not being safezones. But I don't know, it's probably just wishful thinking.

i wonder how long this complaing about the LE will continue.

For as long as the LE splits the community the way it does. Don't talk about different playstyles as the reason everyone keeps the LE in either. They're not really given a choice, there are too many reasons to keep it in and not take it out. Back in NC1 when everyone removed their LE upon creating their character(or shortly after) clans were created for people who didn't really want to pvp. They were tradeskillers and if they wanted an OP they would form alliances with other clans(that did like to pvp) or pay a clan to help them take OPs. This type of playstyle I would love to see come back but instead everyone has their LE in sitting around P1 treating the game like a chatroom.

[Dope]

i wonder how long this complaing about the LE will continue.

Honestly, this comment is trollbait just as much as it would be if I threw around "carebear" to mean those of you that prefer unobstructed PvE (search my posts, not something I have often done.)

And the answer is "as long as it is a divisive and controversial mechanic." Your stance is "It works great for me! Don't change it!" and that has been made clear. But the LE does not work as it was designed, and does not work well for the entire population, thus it is a regular topic. Until someone in development comes along and says "Hey guise, shut up about LE'z cause we're not ever fixing them!" it's going to be a topic.

"Works for me!" isn't helpful in a quest for harmony. So, since your view that the LE is perfect as it stands has been stated, it's cool, we know how you feel. Slaggin on me for saying "Things used to be like this, now they are like that, why?" is pretty lame. Try an answer to the question that relates to game mechanics and intended play rather than "'Cause I like it that way." and we'll have a more productive discourse. K?

[Torg]

arguments, at least.

For as long as the LE splits the community the way it does.

you mean, like hundreds of players getting along pretty well with the current system vs 5 to 10 guys, who want to change it to their own likes? i can live with that.

Don't talk about different playstyles as the reason everyone keeps the LE in either. They're not really given a choice, there are too many reasons to keep it in and not take it out. Back in NC1 when everyone removed their LE upon creating their character(or shortly after) clans were created for people who didn't really want to pvp. They were tradeskillers and if they wanted an OP they would form alliances with other clans(that did like to pvp) or pay a clan to help them take OPs. This type of playstyle I would love to see come back but instead everyone has their LE in sitting around P1 treating the game like a chatroom.

i take it as a fact that NC needs measures to deal with the question of unconsented PvP as much as any other MMORPG. i'm not perfectly happy with the current LE system, but i'm also somewhat sure you wouldnt like my ideas either. the situation of NC 2.2 is pretty much different from NC 1.0, so i'm asking you for not getting too nostalgic about that. we cant simply pretend to be back in the days. oh, speaking of which - i remember sitting around UN-LE'd in pepper park, 'treating the game like a chatroom', because there was nearly no context-free PvP going on that time.

Honestly, this comment is trollbait just as much as it would be if I threw around "carebear" to mean those of you that prefer unobstructed PvE (search my posts, not something I have often done.)

let me answer you by replacing one word of your sentence.

Honestly, this comment is trollbait just as much as it would be if I threw around "carebear" to mean those of you that prefer unobstructed PvP...

see? some people want as much PvP as they can get, and some don't. this is in fact a matter of different playing styles. the LE is one possible measure to separate the PvP-crowd from the Non-PvP-crowd. there are other rule sets implemented to other games, and we all can think of even more exotic ways to deal with that question. as stated numerous times before, i'd prefer a totally different setup, without any LE at all. but simply attempting to make the LE less attractive and thus force people to get rid of it will fail. at least as long as we dont come up with a better system to regulate PvP.

[Dope]

I think you misunderstand me. It isn't about unrestricted PvP, as I have proposed restrictions to PvP. It's about the idea of "opting out" of PvP entirely. Is that a facet of this game? It wasn't when I began playing, or rather those that did not PvP stayed in the Pro-City protected areas and didn't go outside of them. That was simply the game as was developed. Hence, the "non-PvP gameplay" was that of a tradeskiller who stayed in the safe zones and made their money by doing non-PvP things in non-PvP areas.

I don't want "as much PvP as I can get" at all. I am, in fact, a little irritable when enemies come and frag me when all I want is a foot implant in Plaza, but that's not a good and compelling reason to turn NC into a typical western MMO simply because of genre expectation. NC launched before those MMO's that set your genre expectations, and its singular vision is part of what set it apart in my opinion.

What I do want is a way to bully my enemies off of my block (since I live in the "PvP enabled, according to player create" Pepper Park), or start a fight with them, because they are my enemy. What I don't like is having a cuppa with my mortal foe because "Hey, that's my play style, fucker." That's not the way this game was designed, and if it is the current dev target, that should be stated so that those of us that are interested in something that isn't WoW can move on and find something more suited.

Regulating PvP is precisely what has been suggested by "You may PvP here and here, but not there." and "Tradeskillers shouldn't go to primarily PvP spots." What more can we do? /duel before fighting? Not kill folks that say "Wait, I don't wanna die right now" ? Really?

[Jodo]

Not at all.
And as u see you're the only one who said "i like nc pve as endgame".

I didn't realise we needed to stand up and be counted. The PvE in this game is miles better than most, if not all, other MMO PvE. You know the ones, "Target-lock, press buttons 1 - 0, repeat". I very much enjoy the PvE in NC and have been playing the game just for that privilege for several years now (on and off). My RL close friends and family also play the game for the same reason.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean others don'. Why do you think there are so many capped LE players around?

[Shirlias]

I didn't realise we needed to stand up and be counted. The PvE in this game is miles better than most, if not all, other MMO PvE. You know the ones, "Target-lock, press buttons 1 - 0, repeat". I very much enjoy the PvE in NC and have been playing the game just for that privilege for several years now (on and off). My RL close friends and family also play the game for the same reason.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean others don'. Why do you think there are so many capped LE players around?

i didn't say this.
I contested a "if u let LE pop out u will lose 30%-50% nc population".

PVE isn't better than others MMO ( u didn't play any other mmo i suppose ), cause is only long range shots, using healing tools and scenario to fuck up mobs with a ridicolous AI. Also be lame with barrel or aoe weapon ( first monks and droners, then others ), shoting to a place and hitting all area without be seeing. This is lame, not skilled nor ok ( also with the highest resistances in the world, think about a tank, without shields now you are nothing, so let all snipe all around ).

Also talking about "target" then "press left click"... dude, this is the actual pve on nc. On others mmo u have to use multiple skills. This is a MMOFPS and u have to shot, so only aim ( not skill, against mobs ) and click.

Think you are plaiyng a different game from mine. Or at least you enjoy a bad ai ( AI is ok cause no needed in a MMOFPS based on op fights and map control ) and farming of rares... and trust me, this is ok. It's relaxing and cause bugs could be awesome as fight, sometimes

Also, what about world pvp if any1 goes rares, mc5, doy, caves and others with his LE char and goes with alt only at op fights when needed or viarosso/pepper/randomcityzone for skirmish? What about enemy factions? and alliances? I really think that die and also drop is a part of the game and i can accept that some1 like to dress up his chars, have 10 accounts and lvling every kind of spec to have a complete army, with LE on.

But it's useless and don't help in terms of life on a MMOFPS game like nc.

[Jodo]

Not at all.
And as u see you're the only one who said "i like nc pve as endgame".

[QUOTE=Shirlias;2203717]i didn't say this./QUOTE]


You did, it's your quote. ??


Anyway, I feel PvP to be a complete waste of time and get no fun from it whatsoever. However, I know others love to PvP so I don't want to change the game so dramatically that it negatively affects their experience. I don't ask for most zones to be safezones nor do I try to block game content from PvP'rs. Kindly show the same respect and understanding and leave the PvR'rs to our game.
The only issue I see with LE players is when they park on top of someones kill (this can work both ways) and there have been numerous valid suggestions to fix this.

[Shirlias]

Check the beginning of the conversation instead waste my time.
There's a reply follow one of mine that say "without LE nc gonna lose 30%-50% of his population".

Btw...
...let me understand, you join a MMOFPS based as i said on Op fights/Map conquest/trading between factions and pretent to play with no pvp? As forever passive spectator with total immunity from NC and his Environment? And pretend to not lose privileges nor to be an issue in the Game System?

Really, it can't be commented.

[phunqe]

If you ask me, the idea behind the LE is awesome. It promises to cater a broad spectrum of players, offering a midway between a 100% free for all and a heavily restricted environment (e.g. World of Warcraft).

Removing the LE completely is not a solution and I think most actually knows this, even if it's easier to just flex the muscles and exclaim remove the LE. The current population balance depends on it and will continue to do so if/when it grows.

With this said, I do believe that some changes should be considered. I'll give an example of what I think to be a valid and invalid argument.

Valid: Areas dropping something unique, like Ceres labs and MC5. You cannot fight for your right to be in these areas and you cannot go elsewhere either to get what you want. Resorting to train mob tactics onto players isn't really the way to go either. Areas providing something unique should be open to all to fight for.

Invalid: It is unfair that random player X hunts rares all day without the risk of getting killed by players. This to me is invalid, because there is absolutely nothing stopping you from doing the same and hunt rares as well since there are plenty of spots and opportunities to do so. If you by principle won't, then that it your privilege but also your problem.

If a proper survey would be conducted we would probably be surprised by the amount of players that enjoy the LE as an integral part of their game play and that they have no intention of taking it out. These players stand for a significant number on the server, but also a dynamic environment which you would loose if they were not present.

Personally I have no issue with pure trade skill clans having for example LEd alts to set them selves up. A lot don't even have a clan. While I can agree that I think this is somewhat boring, it's their choice. I can't really imagine NC consisting exclusively of PvP characters. First of all there are enough egos to go around several times and secondly trading would become more restricted/private. The buzz in p1 for example would probably be gone.

Just ranting here what's on my mind really... As I said, there are cases that need to get attention, but do remember the unique balance of characters the LE brings, so don't call for it to be removed or restricted to such a point where you cannot "make a living with it" so to speak.

For me, the main problem is being able to contest for unique areas and locations. LEd players should still be allowed here, but the LE should turn itself off when in those areas.

[pottburter]

If a proper survey would be conducted we would probably be surprised by the amount of players that enjoy the LE as an integral part of their game play and that they have no intention of taking it out.

And if asked why so, I bet most would say because they don't like to constantly being shot in the back while fighting a mob and already being low on health.
I'm not saying we need a challenging system or the like, but most of the "open world PVP" nowadays consist of being assaulted while hunting/leveling by someone already up to spec.

[gostly]

If a proper survey would be conducted we would probably be surprised by the amount of players that enjoy the LE as an integral part of their game play and that they have no intention of taking it out. These players stand for a significant number on the server, but also a dynamic environment which you would loose if they were not present.

This would have to be a survey that popped up in-game since most people don't bother with posting on the forums. I think then you might be surprised by how many players see a problem with the LE. If it was only on the forums I would not be surprised to see how many players enjoy having the LE imp in as a permanent part of their gameplay.

For me, the main problem is being able to contest for unique areas and locations. LEd players should still be allowed here, but the LE should turn itself off when in those areas.

100% Agree with you on this point. Most of the unique areas were always intended to be contended for with other players and never intended to be "peaceful" zones by any means.