Reinstate the XP bonus for removing the LE

[Jodo]

God no! I still remember back when LE's got bugged (acted like normal imps). The GMs allowed people to get their LEs in eventhough they were capped.. It created A LOT of griefers..

Exactly. People are whinging about runners acting with impunity now, imagine what they'll do if they can gank and pop the LE back in afterwards.

[Netphreak]

Exactly. People are whinging about runners acting with impunity now, imagine what they'll do if they can gank and pop the LE back in afterwards.

You'd have to make it so only an NPC can re-implant it and there is a cooldown preventing you from getting it re-implanted say more than every 3-5 days or something.

Otherwise yes, it could get abused by those wanting to just grief.

[William Antrim]

How many of you guys played NC1?

When noone had LE's in and someone shouted on help that they had been pked literally half the server turned up for a fight. People would actively go out and "police" levelling zones. Clans meant a LOT more back then and everyone joined a good one because they knew they would get looked after by their mates.

The amount of people on this server who absolutely LOVE a good fight is huge. You guys with your LE's in probably wont have experienced that side of NC yet but really there is a lot scope for this sort of RP in the game. You would find that if you took out your les and joined one of these clans (there are a lot of great ones even now) then you would get some help from your buddies no matter what time of day it is. There is always someone looking to even a score and bash some heads in.




Is it possible to switch the LE off in certain zones? Like war zone only? This might make a good half way house for people wanting to fight and retain their status of protection in other NON-war zones?

[Ascension]

How many of you guys played NC1?

When noone had LE's in and someone shouted on help that they had been pked literally half the server turned up for a fight. People would actively go out and "police" levelling zones. Clans meant a LOT more back then and everyone joined a good one because they knew they would get looked after by their mates.

The amount of people on this server who absolutely LOVE a good fight is huge. You guys with your LE's in probably wont have experienced that side of NC yet but really there is a lot scope for this sort of RP in the game. You would find that if you took out your les and joined one of these clans (there are a lot of great ones even now) then you would get some help from your buddies no matter what time of day it is. There is always someone looking to even a score and bash some heads in.




Is it possible to switch the LE off in certain zones? Like war zone only? This might make a good half way house for people wanting to fight and retain their status of protection in other NON-war zones?

I played NC 1, and have fond memories of a pretty much LE free server, I levelled without an LE when I first started out, I remember the surge of adrenaline when seeing an enemy faction runner in the area, I remember being killed at low level and asking for help on help, I also joined a clan for support.

[Dope]

Here's another observation.

Last night on Terra I saw LE'd runner(s) cruising Pepper Park and killing all of the BD contacts. Just on the mechanical side, this is troublesome because (as I've pointed out in the bug thread) these NPCs are necessary for BD missions, so players trying to level on delivery missions and the like are being griefed by this behavior, and the LE'd TS's are getting faction symp and xp for doing it - and there is nothing anyone else can do about it.

I asked the guy (in local) why he was killing our NPCs and not going after me (I'm of lower rank and probably would have been a pushover, but maybe not) - and was told, in all caps to "halts maul!" - which is pretty rude, and shows clearly that the attitude is one of privileged impunity - knowing that they were screwing us and thumbing their nose the whole time.

(This all ignores the RP aspect wherein your enemies are having a tailgate party on your lawn but you can't even chase them off.)

What do we do about that? Should LE'd runners be allowed to kill all of the rival NPC's in a zone? That sounds a lot like

What outcomes are you making a comparison of, to say that it is unbalanced? Like, if a non-LE ganks another non-LE, there is a definite "victory" and "defeat" for both players. But, if you (without LE) encounter an LE runner, you surely don't consider that an automatic "victory" for the LE and a "defeat" for yourself, right?

In this case, yes, it is that.

[William Antrim]

I played NC 1, and have fond memories of a pretty much LE free server, I levelled without an LE when I first started out, I remember the surge of adrenaline when seeing an enemy faction runner in the area, I remember being killed at low level and asking for help on help, I also joined a clan for support.

Exactly my point. Which do you prefer? Titan or Pluto?

[BetMonty]

What outcomes are you making a comparison of, to say that it is unbalanced? Like, if a non-LE ganks another non-LE, there is a definite "victory" and "defeat" for both players. But, if you (without LE) encounter an LE runner, you surely don't consider that an automatic "victory" for the LE and a "defeat" for yourself, right?

More than once I've seen LE'd players killing all the BD contacts so we can't finish our epics. What do I do about that? If they had their LE out, I could "self-correct" that behavior with a Gatling pistol and be done with it, right? But since they're LE'd the best I can do is complain about their grief. How often have you seen that work?

I dunno that any of that is en pointe though -- the original request was to reinstate the XP bonus for removing your LE. I understand an "LE for life" player feeling like they lose out, but that doesn't make it true: The additional XP bonus comes from shouldering the extra risk of PVP; it's not free. How is it fair that pulling my LE only makes me vulnerable to other players with little to no other benefit?

That's inequity, and it's something we can solve simply by reinstating the XP bonus. It hurts no one, but rewards those who decide to shoulder extra risk. Risk you benefit from, if you factor in OP bonuses, right? Why should my risk benefit you who has done nothing to earn it, isn't that unfair, too?

The easiest route to play, which is not necessarily the most fun to be clear, is to keep your LE in; without some other incentive to pull your LE you're disincentivizing PvP, plain and simple. Even in a game like WoW, PVP earns you gear and rewards you can't get any other way: recognition of and reward for the risk you take on is sort of core to the experience.

I am all for this suggestion. Bring back the XP bonus for unchipped players!

[gostly]

One thing is clear. They have to address the LE chip in some way...

As it is right now there is absolutely no reason to remove your LE...EVER(from what I've heard) and that's a BIG problem...this game used to be about relying on clan mates and always checking your back to see who was around for fear of being pk'd. Now you level/farm in complete peace and safety. That's not the neocron I remember and fell in love with.

I'll admit that I'm a hypocrite and part of the problem, I have my LE in while I'm leveling(I was told about the LE penalty removal and how everyone keeps their LE's in nowadays so really wouldn't be fighting anyone around my level anyways) but a big part of me wants to take it out. I've almost reached a point where I'm gonna take it out (without getting capped first because I'm so fucking bored with mobs and at least now I MIGHT be able to fight someone and stand a chance even without rares).

So please devs do something about the LE, give people a reason to take it out (what was wrong with the system of removing it on your own but suffer a exp penalty if you kept it in?). PvP doesn't have to be your thing, I remember clans that didn't focus on PvP and still played the game for a long time (without LE's in)

Bottom line: too many people have their LE's in (and some keep it in waayyy after they've capped I've heard, wtf?) I remember when the game forced you to take it out after reaching /10 or /20...whatever though something needs to happen with the LE

/rant

[Naim]

This is a sensitive issue and even after one decade of NC there hasnt been found a perfect solution.

The current situation is not optimal as at the moment you can say: moving out your LE is a huge punishment and nobody instead of members of big pvp-active clans has got any incentive to do that.

Just one example to explain the situation in a better way:

At Canyon Reloading Point there were a bunch of people leveling in the cave. All but one unlucky guy had their LE installed. That unlucky guy got terrorized several times on several days. Peoples opinion about that was: "It is his own fault if he removes his LE".

The people who terrorized him are the same who are unhappy that there are so many LE-players and do not bring together the fact that they increase the incentive to keep the LE and never put it out.

As long as casual-gamers got heavily punished for removing the LE there is no reason to force them to do that.
Casual gamers are the mass and casual gamers are "not so good" in pvp what results in frustration and leaving the game if they are forced to face experienced-pvp-players.

[Kame]

Guys when i joined this game, 8 years ago, you used to have to KILL A RUNNER to complete epic run.

This meant poping out LE and saying bye bye to it, forever.

This behavior was changed somewhere between 2.1 and 2.2, by the same dev team that thought adding 100 more items was the way to fix items and pvp balance.

[Dropout]

Guys when i joined this game, 8 years ago, you used to have to KILL A RUNNER to complete epic run.

This meant poping out LE and saying bye bye to it, forever.

This behavior was changed somewhere between 2.1 and 2.2, by the same dev team that thought adding 100 more items was the way to fix items and pvp balance.

Uh yeah, I had forgotten about that... That was awesome tbh!
IIRC some people drugged up like madmen to get to the required rank, while still being able to put back in their LE after the kill..
But honestly, I didnt mind that, at least people got a taste of the awesomeness called NC-PvP

[Chuck Norris]

I dont even want to start with all the hyperbole flying around in here, a lot of I want my old server/population back mentality.

So many skewed "facts" in here that are not at all facts, seems like people/grievers are just pissed they have no one to grief during their limited amount of play time.


Would be nice to see yet another new server started with all the bug fixes/npc changes/Secret HQ safe zone changes. See some truely new legit characters being made....

This game is more like diablo to me then anything else, double exp should remain in effect indefinitely that way people will cap faster and give pvp'ers what they want more op fights, right?

People are complaining about inconveniencing other players so they will be less inconvenienced, its ludicrous

[Dope]

I believe it is a mistake to assume that PvP is an "end-game/OP only" activity. It was clearly not intended to be (and was not for a very long time.)

[Chuck Norris]

I believe it is a mistake to assume that PvP is an "end-game/OP only" activity. It was clearly not intended to be (and was not for a very long time.)

ahh yes the gank!

[DigestiveBiscui]

A massive yes from me - it'll stop so many of the problems currently in the game and if you look back at the nc1 days it was perfect back then.

Too many carebears seem to have entered this game - including whoever changed the LE