1. #1
    Loving Titan L0KI's Avatar
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    Default WoC Changes - Make it fair

    Titan is great. We love it.

    It's already becoming 'polluted' though, with the cookie-cutter, completely over-powered WoCSPYSCUMBAG class. As it stands right now, the WoC weapons (AK and Beretta, etc) are over-powered for what they are, and here's why:

    - They are pretty much the easiest weapons in the game to obtain
    - They completely out-damage their lowtech rare counterparts
    - They automatically come with 120/120/120/120 stats, fully constructed

    Rare weapons take forever to farm and obtain, then you have a large percentage chance of it being a shit-statted 0 slot weapon.

    My proposition, is that you level the playingfield by doing one of the following:

    1.
    - REMOVE ALL current WoC weapons from Titan. I have no idea how easy this would be, but I mean taking them from every player.
    - Remove all WoC weapon missions, and instead, have them drop as E parts along with normal rares, thus giving them a chance of being constructed with less than ARTIFACT stats; like any other rare.
    - Nerf damage

    2.
    - Reduce damage considerably of all WoC weapons, to make them more similar to rare weapons.


    What do you (non-WoCSPYSCUMBAGs) think?

  2. #2
    Tessier-Ashpool S.A. slith's Avatar
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    Default

    As a temporary solution this would be okay. Pitty it makes the R-C Spy a dissy only class.
    Falk Keegan (jump!)

    » A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. «
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  3. #3

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    I liked how it worked for the old xbow, before they introduced the new woc weapons. It wasn't all 120 and a xbow with top stats was one of the most expensive items.

    Also, I think you don't have to remove the runs, but make the guys farm stuff for the runs, like parts from the warbotfactoy in the xbow run. A requirement for that, would of course be that the Regants area was as hard to do as the level of the mobs suggest.


    edit: Maybe also making more use of construction/researching skill in high LvL Missions would be cool as well.

  4. #4

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    Ideally, I would like for them to recognize that this is a major issue and perform an emergency nerf on the weapons in patch 165, before doing any serious balancing consideration, which will probably come in patch 166 or later.

    If this happens, my optimism for Titan could still be restored..

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by flib View Post
    Ideally, I would like for them to recognize that this is a major issue and perform an emergency nerf on the weapons in patch 165, before doing any serious balancing consideration, which will probably come in patch 166 or later.

    If this happens, my optimism for Titan could still be restored..
    Are you talking about nerfing the runs/PvE aspect or nerfing the PvP value of the guns?

    Because in my opinion the most important thing atm is to fix the major PvE Bugs and Balance the PvE/Economy of the game. PvP might not be at it's full potential atm but it's still fun. PvE/Trading on the other hand is completely broken and reduced to farming with drones or farming broken Mobs/areas.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    Are you talking about nerfing the runs/PvE aspect or nerfing the PvP value of the guns?
    I'm talking about adjusting the damage/aiming/frequency/whatever values of the guns. This is a relatively simple task, compared to changing the missions or whatever.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    Because in my opinion the most important thing atm is to fix the major PvE Bugs and Balance the PvE/Economy of the game.
    There are shitload of fixes in 165 already. I'm talking about adding this one to the patch.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    PvP might not be at it's full potential atm but it's still fun. PvE/Trading on the other hand is completely broken and reduced to farming with drones or farming broken Mobs/areas.
    There's nothing fun about getting torn apart by a scumbag ak spy.

  7. #7
    Registered User Kane Gregory's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by slith View Post
    As a temporary solution this would be okay.
    Yep, temporarely woc should be deactivated. But it's real pity if the content would be removed forever.

    Quote Originally Posted by slith View Post
    Pitty it makes the R-C Spy a dissy only class.
    Yep and this is a huge problem. Fix the dissy damage down. <-- this statement comes from a huge dissy fan (me)

    "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." εMahatma Ghandiз

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by flib View Post
    I'm talking about adjusting the damage/aiming/frequency/whatever values of the guns. This is a relatively simple task, compared to changing the missions or whatever.
    You should think that, but the history of PvP Balancing and Neocron suggests otherwise, thats why I'm against it. Removing the AK will just make any spy change to dissy, which isn't any less op.

    Quote Originally Posted by flib View Post
    There's nothing fun about getting torn apart by a scumbag ak spy.
    Thats why everyone is playing the same op setups. Thats what i meant with "still fun". It's still fun for everyone who's playing those setups, which is almost everyone. And to be able to choose between AK and dissi ist still better than only dissi.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    You should think that, but the history of PvP Balancing and Neocron suggests otherwise, thats why I'm against it. Removing the AK will just make any spy change to dissy, which isn't any less op.
    I'm not talking about balancing. I'm talking about nerfing.



    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    Thats why everyone is playing the same op setups. Thats what i meant with "still fun". It's still fun for everyone who's playing those setups, which is almost everyone. And to be able to choose between AK and dissi ist still better than only dissi.
    Except the dissy is harder to get, especially with slots and good stats. It's going to be a while before "everyone" has a dissy. This isn't Terra.

  10. #10

    Default

    I'm against it. People will have dissis soon enough, and then we'll just end up with one less PvPable setup.

  11. #11

    Default

    One less overpowered setup that is ridiculously easy to obtain.

  12. #12

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    Then change the run. Nerfing it will result in the AK not being used anymore. Even if they change the run later, no one will play it then, bc the dissi will be better. And since the ak isn't better then the dissi, you will be torn apart just as much as before by dissi spies.

    PvP balance in Neocron isn't as easy as just nerfing one op weapon. This will just result in the disappearance of one viable option and make pvp more boring.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    Then change the run. Nerfing it will result in the AK not being used anymore. Even if they change the run later, no one will play it then, bc the dissi will be better. And since the ak isn't better then the dissi, you will be torn apart just as much as before by dissi spies.
    You realize it's not a simple matter to just "change the run", right? Whereas, I don't imagine that nerfing the AK/beretta would take much more than adjusting some values.

    I'm not saying that the AK and beretta should be completely useless forever, but right now, they NEED to be nerfed, so the game can actually be fun for all classes.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRobot View Post
    PvP balance in Neocron isn't as easy as just nerfing one op weapon. This will just result in the disappearance of one viable option and make pvp more boring.
    Eventually, everyone will have rares, and the balancing will need to be fixed, but right now, I think there's a very good chance that we'll see a totally different balance, with all sorts of things being viable again: APU, PE, H-C PE, Melee Tank/PE. But there's one thing that stands in the way of that: the AK/Beretta.

    In order to fix that, there are 2 solutions: (temporarily?) nerf them, or remove them entirely. Perhaps leave the Dome of York mission versions up, because that mission is suitably difficult, and they're slightly less overpowered.

  14. #14
    Xpertz William Antrim's Avatar
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    I say remove WOC requirement on the guns. Let us all use them.
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  15. #15
    The REAL Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by William Antrim View Post
    I say remove WOC requirement on the guns. Let us all use them.
    That is something I would agree on.
    (and for the love of.. make them harder to obtain)
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