Hey
Let's make rifles viable and give them something equal to the mini rocket pistols.
Either Raygun or Rocket Rifles would be much appreciated.
It would make lvling as a rifler possible again.
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Hey
Let's make rifles viable and give them something equal to the mini rocket pistols.
Either Raygun or Rocket Rifles would be much appreciated.
It would make lvling as a rifler possible again.
Personally I am against AoE Rifles. The Mini Rocket Launcher is already a bit of a stretch in my eyes.
I'd rather see direct damage properly matched against AoE damage through the adjustment of mechanics.
I suggest not doing that. As it stands the mechanics are fine you shouldn't try to fix something that isn't broken.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trivaldi
Also it takes you hours to implement these new weapons. It will probably take you years to do an overhaul of mechanics.
If you implement ae rifle weaponry, you expand content, expand leveling options, make the game more multifacetted and you can do it fast.
If you overhaul mechanics you probably break half the game and it will take you years.
I really don't see how you could oppose making rifles
competitive to pistols while leveling. This is a low hanging fruit for progress and benefit. You should pluck it.
Just want to emphasise that I said personally as I'd quite like to see discussion around this and how the community might like to see it work. That doesn't mean it's the decision or the way the team sees it. :)
Again my personal opinion is that if we just give everyone a rocket launcher in a slightly different shape, we might as well just get rid of the different weapon classes and just have one set but that'd be a very boring world to live in.Quote:
If you implement ae rifle weaponry, you expand content, expand leveling options, make the game more multifacetted and you can do it fast.
Additionally I'd like to point out that thanks to the improvements we've made with 2.3 it actually takes seconds to implement new weapon variants* and rebalance the whole weapon family the variant fits into. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Odimara Orca
*weapon variants meaning no new behaviours, models or art assets are required, like we did with the new recent rare melee weapons and pistols.
Then let me point out how your reasoning is flawed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trivaldi
Your main point is that it is detrimental to plurality if every weapon family has an ae option. Actually it is the opposite:
- Rifles are worthless for leveling because they don't have an ae option -> the effect is less plurality not more.
- Rifle players are forced to LOM after WOCing with drones because it is next to impossible to reach with rifles. It isn't good gameplay and it doesn't let you build your char around your favourite kind of weapon -> the effect is less plurality not more.
So out of the current situation you get: Less plurality and bad gameplay/character progression.
If you want specifics for the different Weapon categories: You have those with different ranges and movement speeds with weapons up.
If you want more differences you are free to implement additional things like:
- A bit of force damage on every H-C weapon.
- A small critical strike chance on rifles.
- An extra bonus with pistols if you are within meele range of your enemy.
- Electric effect which gives a weak fuzzscreen on drones.
- Slight disorientation effect (like with drugs, but without fuzzscreen -> char doesn't move like you want him to sometimes) on meele weapons.
- etc.
But making one weapon family unviable as a weapon choice for leveling doesn't add a damn thing to the game, except forcing people to play to WOC with drones and then relom, instead of using rifles all the way.
You mean that for real? Holy shit... i thought i would have the worst ideas for that game when i m stoned and drunk as fuck, but that....Quote:
Originally Posted by Odimara Orca
You forgot some goodys i think when you level as rifle spy...
(sniper) rifles for example do a insane amount of dmg compared to pistol cause you can hit better (sh best pve weapon?)
the range is just nice, tried fighting a grim with liberator? good luck
AoE to grind is just not needed for new players cause they will not have any money/rareparts to get stuff later on when they only cave. When you are not a new player, you ll get carried by an apu anyhow cause leveling without apu is just stupid.
Like the GM said, aoe pistol is probably already a way in the wrong direction but okay it has been in that game for years so...
Dude what the hell are you talking about? APU? not enough money? You do realize fastest way to get money is ae grinding? And where is your critique? just "trololo beer, weed" and thats it? you disqualify yourself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dasore
AOE is overrated. Its nice to level up quickly at specific stages and rank segments, but its useless otherwise (other than hitting enemies through walls).
AoE helps you a LOT at begining of the game - in dungeons with lot of small hp enemies. Less so when you reach El Farid if you want to level there - allowing somewhat safe shooting multiple mobs. But after that - its not really advantageous.
If you farm for money, the limitation is not really how fast you kill enemies (since if you do it for money, you pick enemies you can kill quickly anyway), but your inventory space really. Thus for example APU is not actually the best class to "farm" cash - Melee tank is, or alternatively even Lowtech Spy with barter and high Transport.
And against strong mobs, when their HP begins to inflate, you`ll see single target damage trumping AoE easily. So i dont really see NEED for AoE. Its convinient - having my main pistol spy that spent lot of time with mini rocket pistol it really made my life easier, but its just a stage that passes. Rifle Spy already has advantage of huge range, and ability to level on high lvl mobs safely, something pistol spy cant, due to need to be in near melee range.
If i am wrong and there is actually highend profitable spots which REQUIRE Aoe to be most effective, please tell me i`d be glad to learn it - because currently i simply removed my rocket pistol and keep it in bank: since can kill weak enemies faster with normal weapons, and for leveling just use gatgling because it burns them down a lot faster. Which secrtet hunting location would really have AOE necessary for rifle spy? Chaos Caves? I woudnt go there with spy solo even with AoE- there are slower, but lot safer spots.
AoE is essential for capping and reaching WoC. It's the core experience of leveling.
No AoE is especially important at higher levels.
No if you farm for money you use AoE and Drones.
Yeah farming with meele tank, rofl. Because he has most TRA. What the hell are you rambling about. Nobody uses a meele tank for farming and the don't have the most inventory space. Droners do.
Single Mob leveling is 10 times slower than ae leveling, so rifle spy is at a huge disadvantage.
Cave, El Farid, Regants.
I'm sorry but you either haven't played the game in years, or you are a beginner. I don't see any other reason why you would write so much utter nonsense. Or you are playing a different game and mistakenly posted in the NC forums.
as much as i entertained myself repeatedly using AoE toys like the rocket pistol or nades of all kinds, i strictly oppose both a rare rocket pistol and AoE rifles in general. AoE is undoubtedly great for grinding exp, but not so much for playing the game. i wocced more than one char by peacefully farming warbots and other fauna by rifles and found it far less boring than drone-bombing el farid or regants. it's true that the rifle's advantage is it's range, so if you don't like the open space as much as buildings and caves, you probably will be happier using other means of destruction.
What if shotguns did an AoE cone? Would lead to lots of hilarious ally kills.
It also takes forever. I wager you didn't want to CAP and then play PvP. Leveling to WoC single target is just... not very smart.Quote:
Originally Posted by Torg
Well lets make it easy: Here's a strawpoll http://www.strawpoll.me/11832962
IMO there should be no downside to ae rifles but lets see.
If the game mechanics were different, any rapid fire weapon would be an AoE-weapon... spray and pray. Plasma weapons are already like this, why not other weapons?
Please keep voting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Odimara Orca
No. I just wanted to play the game. Repeatedly. PvP is just a small part of Neocron, and not the most interesting one. Have fun at your playstyle, though. If you want AoE, maybe rather choose to be a tank or monk. And no, since AoE is doing weaker damage than single target, the overall exp gain is not wildly different. But.. yes, play as you want to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Odimara Orca
So I won my wager great!Quote:
Originally Posted by Torg
PvP is not a small part of the game.
No, I'll just WoC with drones then LoM. Purfect game mechanic.
RK-1000 does 450 a shot with around 200 RCL. AE. Which Rifle does better?
How is the XP calculation again? You seem to have a different one from me.
You can still play your way while we have ae rifles you know.
Headsup, I'll close the Poll on Sunday 17th december 24:00.
Remove rocket pistols. They don't really make sense. A rocket rifle would make more sense than pistols.
underslung grenade launcher. modded to a rifle with a free slot. kaboom. neocron noob tube.
And then still one Option would be more viable for leveling than another. Come on why not make everything worthy as a leveling option..Quote:
Originally Posted by Apocalypsox
There is nothing left to be added.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dasore
oh wait ur talkin about dmg output... try silent hunter
You don't know anything about game mechanics.Quote:
Originally Posted by M4rK
Please keep voting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Odimara Orca
We got 20 No and twelve Yes votes.
Ingame I had quite positive feedback, but seems nobody bothered to visit the forums.
I'll make another one in a couple of months, thanks for voting.
Thread can be closed.
Your wish is my command! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Odimara Orca
/closed