Compare those two weapons.
Something is wrong here the TL 77 does 62 percent damage? what is going on?
Attachment 12664
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Compare those two weapons.
Something is wrong here the TL 77 does 62 percent damage? what is going on?
Attachment 12664
Across the Board rares are worthless and Low TL weapons perform better. Can we have an acknowledgment that this is not working as intended?
Please consider the implications.. farming rares is an important part of endgame and an integral part ot the economy...
Can you provide your setup (screenshots of F5) please?
I too have seen screwy damage. Here is my proof.
Attachment 12665
nevermind ....
Hey want some fun? Buy bad dmg of your weapons and compare their damage with your crafted ones ;) Then you will be even more WTF :)
We're certainly aware of the the effect of build quality on weapon dmg (especially on low level items).
As for the thread issue, we need more refined data. The example weapons have different frequencies (the indicated values can't be that trusted either; very old formulas).
Doesn't mean we aren't looking at it though.
Attachment 12666
Yeah but I'm almost certain something is off.
The best Weapon ATM is the TL64 Automatic for my PE and this just seems wrong when he could use a RARE weapon as well :(
Also Bragi if this is intended: It breaks linear progression to hard obtainable items (rares), it impacts half the economy and the most needed currency (rare parts) and it takes away content by removing the need to farm rares.
The problems were WoC weapons, drugging and MC5 implants beeing mandatory to pvp. Rares were never raised as an issue.
Alrite now with test from Tank
Attachment 12668
TL72 Plasma Gun:
86 Damage / Shot on Launcher Cyclops
Tl84 Plasma Gun:
94 Damage / Shot on Launcher Cyclops
Tl105 Cursed Soul:
98 Damage / Shot on Launcher Cyclops
Bit better frequency
I'm sorry but a bonus of 10 to 15 percent on rares wouldn't be to unreasonable right? This doesn't represent their price or how hard they are obtainable at all.
Edit: It seems like the fall off is way too hard after TL90 or so? What imaginative number would you need to cap a TL115 Weapon? 500 Subskill? O_o
Odimara, welcome to the forums.
As for your data: From the latest post with the HC weapons, being a tank you have very little WEP. That means you need to make up for it with lots of H-C (X-beast drug, combat buff, imps, etc). The 2 non-rare plasma cannons you OVERcap, because they're low TL. The cursed soul (21 TLs above the TL84 cannon) you are nowhere near capping since you only have only ~215 H-C. Though, it still hits a tad harder then the other cannons, BUT it fires faster = much more damage. Combine that with gaining 10 more dmg per blob from the 4-shot burst from ALMOST capping the CS, and you're firing faster than the TL 84 and doing 138 per burst.
Having much more, but not near capping the damage on a weapon doesn't mean it's going to do loads more than a non-rare right below it in TLs. THat's how things USED to be, and what the devs are getting away from. You can still make a high TL rare do far more than non-rares, but you need the combat to get that weapon close to/above cap.
PS: This is why devs shouldn't listen to forum ppl. They're always "filled with knowledge" when they're actually clueless.
Seems to be working as intended, as damage depends not just on weapon but on how your Weapon Skill, Weapon Lore and High Tech correspond its Tech Level.
Those weapons are by all means better, but you should unlock their potential
AFAIK WEP and TC has no influence on weapon damage at all now.
Frequency is a fixed weapon stat now.
For PvE you dont need a single point in WEP if you use rifles now. (tested on Titan)
This opens up some nice options.
On testserver I made a Tank with zero WEP, for PvE no problem at all. I did some WB hunting with it, works perfectly.
Damage comes only from the main skill (HC, MC, RC, PC, APU, PPU aso.)
And I think that is intended to get more variation in builds.
Low Tech Rifle/Pistol tank? Absolutely!
The flattend damage curve in the high TL range is also intended.
But maybe some additional clarification form the NST guys would be great. :)
Going to reply only to you because the others obviously don't know what they are talking about (Talking about WEP or T-C, rofl. Please guys go test a bit yourselves before trying to lecture me on mechanics)
So it's intended, that's fucking retarded.
My question still stands, what kind of H-C would I need to cap a TL115 weapon? I wager is unreachable. I wager it's unreachable on a TL105. That makes the curve to hard and Rares useless, so my point still stands.
You better get your facts straight before you say other don't have a clue ....
Besides HC, mainskill rank and WEP very much influence your damage. (it has always been like this):
Hightech Heavy Combat:
Damage (100): Base 10 %, H-C 70 %, WEP 20 %
Aim Speed (110): Base 30 %, H-C 40 %, T-C 20 %, WEP 20 %
Aim Precision (110): Base 30 %, H-C 40 %, T-C 20 %, WEP 20 %
Frequency (100): Base 20 %, H-C 30 %, T-C 30 %, WEP 20 %
Range (100): Base 20 %, H-C 20 %, T-C 30 %, WEP 30 %
Handling (110): Base 20 %, H-C 30 %, T-C 20 %, WEP 20 %, AGL 20 %
check : https://www.techhaven.org/resources/...nce-guide.html
I have just checked back with our balancing team:
The damage of your HighTech cannon is now influenced by the respective
mainskill (STR) and the respective subskill (HC) only.
This is the same for all the other weapon types as well. (for example pistols: damage influenced by DEX + pistol combat)
WEP does not influence weapondamage anymore but still changes your values for aiming, handling and range like it always did.
Frequency is a fix stat...not skill or mod influence it.
But thanks for the answer.
Mhmm alright thanks.
But it seems Mainskill is more important.
My Question still Stands what kind of stats would be needed to max out a TL105? Cused Soul for example... if 114 Str. and 216 H-C is not enough it seems to be a rather high value... and let's not forget the TL 115 Weapons who would need even higher stats.
I did not tested it, but to do the most damage with the "best" weapon, you need the best equipment (MC5).
And to top it, you need to sacrifice your defences (FOR, PRC).
With 50 in TRA, you can get to 271 HC without PPU-Buff and drug.
Now add the buff and you are at 292 HC.
With drug you are over 300 HC.
You can even steal some points form TRA, so get a tiny bit more.
216 HC is not that much in this regard.
There is no "maxing out" your weapon. High Techlevel weaponry is deliberately designed in a way that reaching 100% damage is (almost) impossible (meaning: it scales damage up at a high rate with higher skills). This ensures that there is always a noticable gain when spending more skillpoints on damage related skills - up until the level where your setup gets unrealistic - while not allowing much lower TL weapons (that reach 100% faster) to perform the same way.
Now, I'm not saying this system works perfectly - it might need some adjustments, but 216 H-C is really on the low end of the spectrum of what is possible to achieve with a Tank. It is possible that you might be better off with a lower TL variant in this case.
Creed (TL 115), Flazer mod @ 88 WEP, 115 STR, 90 T-C
200 H-C: 147 Energy, 63 Fire (74% damage)
225 H-C: 167 Energy, 71 Fire (84% damage)
250 H-C: 181 Energy, 77 Fire (91% damage)
275 H-C: 200 Energy, 85 Fire (100% damage)
300 H-C: 206 Energy, 88 Fire (103% damage)
S.T.O.R.M. Laser (TL 90), Flazer Mod @ 88 WEP, 115 STR, 90 T-C
200 H-C: 149 Energy, 63 Fire (75% damage)
225 H-C: 164 Energy, 70 Fire (82% damage)
250 H-C: 170 Energy, 73 Fire (85% damage)
275 H-C: 178 Energy, 76 Fire (89% damage)
300 H-C: 183 Energy, 78 Fire (92% damage)
Yes.. you just hit the spot where the damage is more or less equal..
If you spot issues with this please give me some detailed stats (in a private message is fine too if you dont want to share your build with others). Important info is weapons stats, your main and subskills, damage values (info window or on hit - doesnt matter)
Thank you Aegir this info is golden! Your info would be perfect for a sticky.
Also thanks for explaining the new system, this explains my issues ofc.
On the Plus Side PA's are way more attractive now.
Negative is surely that MC5 implants seem even more important than before.
And drugging seems also more important than it ever was.
Maybe we will see a rise in pocket ppu's as well?
After all 225 is reachable without much compromise.
+ PPU Buff
+ X-Beast
+ MC5 chip -> you're at 275?
Maybe the passive options will need some nerfing in the future to actually force a choice.
The difference also seems a bit low 285 to 254 at 275 H-C? so 31 Damage? Surely impressive for PvE, not so much in PvP.
I correct myself: I don't think that high TL weaponry underperforms, it seem rather that maybe low TL weaponry is performing a bit to strongly?
I'll do some additional testing.
Thank you for your answer.
Final Edit: I like the new system, it just seems to me that the progression curve might be a bit to flat. It takes away from the value of rare weapons which are after all important as endgame timesink and for the economy. On the other side rare implants get more important. Might also be i'm just stuck in 2.2.
Did you already change something? On the TL64 Automatic the weapon went down from 80/shot to 60/shot?
I'm pretty sure my setup didn't change so this is really confusing to me...
Edit: I think I'm just seeing things or remember the values wrong. Clarification would be nice for me though!