Neocron brainport: Your ideas, suggestions and wishes

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19-01-09, 04:37
JohnGalt

Quote:

Originally Posted by flib

That idea is fucking stupid. The game doesn't need to be any easier, if anything, it should be more difficult.

You tell them flib! 8| You are absolutely right. If anyone thinks this game needs to be easier then you do not see the greatness of this creation. It is the intellectual responsibility that makes it great. So much to learn and so many ways to do it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharper Blade

lately theres been alot of bitching about spy aoe so why not make a rare tl 92 rocket pistol? with a cool name like the pocket rocket lmao

This is great�lmao!, but I understand flibs� point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nobby

Very Mature...
The game is NOT noobie-friendly, the game help and information is atleast 3 years out of date. More subways would help greatly, like i said before, just charge a high price for the "new" subways entrance or ticket prices.
Napper has good ideas which i believe too.
flib, try getting a new guy into the game yourself and see what they say about it.

Since the very beginning NC1 it has always been �WORK� to start a noob. You need to be creative and have others heal you and fix your stuff. Team work is the fastest way to level.
A noob should do some sewer time in the beginning and then spend their time on the chat channel finding out where all the other noob's go after leveling to team. Such as the caves or another popular place would be City Merks bunker.
As far as game info, yes there are some gaps that can be filled by asking others in game questions. synegry was the old info site we used early on in NC1 and it was a life saver. Now here is www.techhaven.org and it is even greater then before. Much of the game is a learning experience and I like it that way.

JohnGalt
19-01-09, 05:28
Asurmen Spec Op

[ edited ]
19-01-09, 14:14
JohnGalt

Quote:

Originally Posted by L0KI

Idea:
Remove WoC from the game, completely. Remove WoC missions, and remove WoC requirement from weapons.
All WoC weapons will be available from rare-part drops.
This will take people out into the wastes again, and actually make rare parts valuable and sought after again.
WoC was supposed to be a status simple, not a requirement.
It doesn't work... get rid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asurmen Spec Op

marry me.

To remove WoC and WoC weapons is inappropriate. So, in a politically correct way, with a metaphoric overtone, I want to once again quote flib from an earlier page 18 post.

Not all of us want to ware panties.
It amazes me that these features and many others are VOLINTARY and not demanded of any player.

WoC is not DEMANDED, don't get the armor, don't get the weapon so what. Just play others with out WoC, lord knows that there are plenty of players with out it or waiting to BUY their way into it.

I cannot believe that there are so many that want things easier, or to take away tasks that give some a sense of achievement and or allow them to explore and play as a sole runner on a mission (Notice I did no say play with themselves.) :lol:

I always have said for years that there should be Islands that can be teleported to that would automatically even out everything for PvE and PvP action.

Then we can get back to the inequality that life on the NC mainland is all about. Actually having to work for something that allows all of us to EARN EQUALITY.

It is a game, I am clearly aware of this but, it offers a process that keeps my attention and gives me satisfaction when I am able to achieve a higher level.

It is PvP and PvE that caused this Balancing crap. There needed to be some adjustments but, it is CONSANT WHINING all the time.

If I have an obstacle and my current runner cannot overcome it, then I begin a NEW RUNNER that can over come the obstacle(s) or fight equaly with a WoC/high level monk/Tank, ect... (there is a interesting idea) and that is the simple solution.

Adapt, overcome, reinvent, adjust, create and build a new runner that IS equal, those are the options this game offers and I hope it continues this in BP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nobby

Very Mature...
The game is NOT noobie-friendly, the game help and information is atleast 3 years out of date. More subways would help greatly, like i said before, just charge a high price for the "new" subways entrance or ticket prices.
Napper has good ideas which i believe too.
flib, try getting a new guy into the game yourself and see what they say about it.

Please what is the issue? We do not get spanked here in this game because we made someone upset (except for discrimination/racist comments and activity and I support that respectfully). WoW micromanages NC GOVERNS. Sure this to has its flaws at times but, it has worked on and off for years now.

This is a free world and sure there are many pricks in the game. If you keep at it you will find that those pricks have other runners and they do not always act the same. In many cases you meet someone else that is friends or in a clan with the prick(s). When you discover this (by gossiping to your friends) your friend usually can get you left alone and in other cases the prick finds you and apologizes and then you become friends.

I have experienced the above scenario so many times I can�t count them all.

Of course you could LEAVE YOUR LAW ENFORCER IN AND LEVEL.
Just ask for help on the help channel, if you get a creditable response then ask if you can DM them. Then ask your question without anyone else sticking their nose into you business.

I assist when I can but, when noobs ask for FREE stuff or expects ME to provide everything for them because they do not want to do all the work for it I honestly say "seeya". I only help those that help themselfs or at least try to. No Bail Outs from this runner ;)

"Life is Good, Love the Game!"

JohnGalt
19-01-09, 14:42
L0KI

So, JG; after all that you just typed about WoC - I'm still not certain I understand your point.
What is it exactly?

I listed several reasons why WoC should be removed. I know it won't ever be removed, but in my opinion, it's WoC, and the un-original weapons that it introduced that started the whole balancing fiasco.

Quote:

To remove WoC and WoC weapons is inappropriate. So, in a politically correct way, with a metaphoric overtone, I want to once again quote flib from an earlier page 18 post.

Not all of us want to ware panties.

I assume this refers to your happiness with your WoC setup, metaphorically speaking, of course. I may have misunderstood though. :p

As for 'making things easier' - you have completely misunderstood my point. I have WoC. I spent day after day grinding for it. It's not about its difficulty to obtain. It's not difficult anyway, it's just a time-sink.

I never liked it, but I got it.

Quote:

If I have an obstacle and my current runner cannot overcome it, then I begin a NEW RUNNER that can over come the obstacle(s) or fight equaly with a WoC/high level monk/Tank, ect... (there is a interesting idea) and that is the simple solution.

What does that even mean?

Quote:

It is PvP and PvE that caused this Balancing crap. There needed to be some adjustments but, it is CONSANT WHINING all the time.

Again... what? Of course it's PvP and PvE that caused changes to balancing. You say it like you're shocked by this. What else would it be??? As both PvP and PvE are fundamentally responsible for balancing, it would be fair to assume that they 'caused it'

Oh wait......... WoC could be responsible :lol:

Oh, and you say whining, I say feedback.

Quote:

I always have said for years that there should be Islands that can be teleported to that would automatically even out everything for PvE and PvP action.

Seriously now. What?

--------------------------------------

So... Once again, let me explain.

Several years ago, during NC1... there were two 'acceptable' PvP routes. When I say acceptable, I mean plausible. These routes were;

- Rares + lower armour
- Non rares + higher armour

That is of course a generalisation, but hear me out.
Now, with the introduction of WoC; all it's really done is move the goal posts.
Now, I feel there are two plausible setups:

- WoC + WoC armour
- Rares + Power Armour

So; In Neocron 1, the saught after weapons - the 'ones to own' were rares. Rares were hunted by players all over the wastes. Having your rares researched, and building your weapon was an excellent/rewarding and sometimes painful experience.

Now how does it work? The weapons that people use as their 'main', are the WoC weapons. These can be obtained by running (In some cases) an incredibly simple quest.

The parts market was an important aspect of the game to me. Whether you agree or disagree, WoC reduced the value of rare parts & weapons massively.

Thus, WoC killed the rare parts market.

----------------------------------------

"Life is hard, HELP the game!"

Rabbi Fang
22-01-09, 15:17
Izeo

JohnGalt, your post kind of left me scratching my head too... L0KI is making sense to me. I also feel the same way about WoC. The whole idea of uber equipment that can be used as a SUBSTITUTE for rares DRASTICALLY depreciates the value of rares. It only makes sense that it does.

If anything, I believe WoC should ONLY be PowerArmor -- No weapons. And the WoC armor should only have slightly better stats than the normal PAs, yet some slight disadvantages (compared to the normal PAs) also.

Or, lower the stats of WoC weapons (only the weapons) (and lower the difficulty and level needed appropriately), to make the WoC weapons equal to that of Epic rewards, like the CM Speedgat. I.e., it's good, but rares are better.

--

Seriously... to continue with the direction of WoC weapons... (spending even more, a lot more, time to get better equipment solely on your own, no effect on any market or anything, just doing the quest for You..)... then, we might as well keep going, like other MMOs do.

How about we now increase the max level of characters now and add even higher level stuff, DEX/STR: 130 PAs, and so forth. So the end product is exactly the same, but we spend more time levelling. This is what WoW does in some patches, why not do that?

How about a "Premium Shop" where we can pay real money to buy slightly better equipment? To get an edge over the people who don't want to pay the extra money? Some MMOs do that too. Sound fun?

Really, let's continue the trend... :/
22-01-09, 20:17
nobby

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

Please what is the issue? We do not get spanked here in this game because we made someone upset (except for discrimination/racist comments and activity and I support that respectfully). WoW micromanages NC GOVERNS. Sure this to has its flaws at times but, it has worked on and off for years now.

This is a free world and sure there are many pricks in the game. If you keep at it you will find that those pricks have other runners and they do not always act the same. In many cases you meet someone else that is friends or in a clan with the prick(s). When you discover this (by gossiping to your friends) your friend usually can get you left alone and in other cases the prick finds you and apologizes and then you become friends.

I have experienced the above scenario so many times I can�t count them all.

Of course you could LEAVE YOUR LAW ENFORCER IN AND LEVEL.
Just ask for help on the help channel, if you get a creditable response then ask if you can DM them. Then ask your question without anyone else sticking their nose into you business.

I assist when I can but, when noobs ask for FREE stuff or expects ME to provide everything for them because they do not want to do all the work for it I honestly say "seeya". I only help those that help themselfs or at least try to. No Bail Outs from this runner ;)

"Life is Good, Love the Game!"

JohnGalt

Thanks for totally ignoring what I said and start referring to Gay of Gaycraft.
22-01-09, 21:25
L0KI

Quote:

Originally Posted by Izeo

JohnGalt, your post kind of left me scratching my head too... L0KI is making sense to me. I also feel the same way about WoC. The whole idea of uber equipment that can be used as a SUBSTITUTE for rares DRASTICALLY depreciates the value of rares. It only makes sense that it does.

If anything, I believe WoC should ONLY be PowerArmor -- No weapons. And the WoC armor should only have slightly better stats than the normal PAs, yet some slight disadvantages (compared to the normal PAs) also.

Or, lower the stats of WoC weapons (only the weapons) (and lower the difficulty and level needed appropriately), to make the WoC weapons equal to that of Epic rewards, like the CM Speedgat. I.e., it's good, but rares are better.

--

Seriously... to continue with the direction of WoC weapons... (spending even more, a lot more, time to get better equipment solely on your own, no effect on any market or anything, just doing the quest for You..)... then, we might as well keep going, like other MMOs do.

How about we now increase the max level of characters now and add even higher level stuff, DEX/STR: 130 PAs, and so forth. So the end product is exactly the same, but we spend more time levelling. This is what WoW does in some patches, why not do that?

How about a "Premium Shop" where we can pay real money to buy slightly better equipment? To get an edge over the people who don't want to pay the extra money? Some MMOs do that too. Sound fun?

Really, let's continue the trend... :/

I have to completely agree. I'm certain this wasn't the intention with WoC; but the result all the same.
23-01-09, 04:12
JohnGalt

Ok Loki...

Quote:

Originally Posted by L0KI

So, JG; after all that you just typed about WoC - I'm still not certain I understand your point.
What is it exactly?
I listed several reasons why WoC should be removed. I know it won't ever be removed, but in my opinion, it's WoC, and the un-original weapons that it introduced that started the whole balancing fiasco.

Yes you listed reason and yes you are absolutely correct. I am not looking to stir the pot and put you on the defensive, sorry about that. I like the WoC very much but, the side effects developed by players behavior to let it rule the market/game instead of accessorize the game/market is the real underling issue of all the completely valid points you made.

I liked NC b4 WoC also, and until I was able to get WoC later on, I did not completely connect the two (WoC and Balancing) as a cause and effect because I kept mostly to myself.

Yes I (in a smarty pants way) mocked your specific statement on its removal and that was my only real focus. I just did not want to see it go and hope to find a fix that will correct the path WoC has taken. I did not take the time to see how and why you thought as you did. I was in general not aware of your other posts listing the specifics until you addressed my earlier statement; then I read those comments.

Being aware of the current long endured negative effects the game has developed with the help of WoC's introduction and being myself tired of the constant efforts put into �Balancing� instead of those resources being put into other improvements; I would have commented more responsibly and simply had to agree with your thoughts; had I taken the time to look and read them all earlier. We should also remember that totaly new players have no Idea of what it was like before WoC and the fun we had before. The longer it goes uncorrected/redirected, the more difficult the change may be accepted by others.

For my ��panties.� comment I apologize to you for not properly arguing you whole debate in a responsible way and making it seem that you only said �Get Rid Of WoC� without any thought or reason. I humbly ask for your forgiveness if possible. It was not playing fair I will attempt to not do that again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by L0KI

I assume this refers to your happiness with your WoC setup, metaphorically speaking, of course. I may have misunderstood though. :p

As for the above statement: Symbolically speaking, I like very much what WoC represents in the form of achievement. As for being happy with the clearly defined effects you have stated, No I hate that it has diminished the rares market and made some of the common areas where we all met to ress, const, research etc.. much less occupied (as it appears to me). I still hunt disks over mobs when the price of them are up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

As for 'making things easier' - you have completely misunderstood my point. I have WoC. I spent day after day grinding for it. It's not about its difficulty to obtain. It's not difficult anyway, it's just a time-sink.
I never liked it, but I got it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by flib

That idea is fucking stupid. The game doesn't need to be any easier, if anything, it should be more difficult.

Now, making things easier. I saw flibs comment on page 18 (posted above) it does not directly refer to you and I was only focusing my comments on the part that stated ��The game doesn�t need to be any easier��. I skimmed on the previous page for that arguments beginning and not seeing a direct connection I �ASSUMED� someplace else there were posts written by others that I would come across eventually commenting about making the �game� easier. When I saw flibs post expressing what I think of those type of comments, I jumped on that bandwagon. You were just victim of coincidental circumstance from my point of view of what I know now, again sorry about that to.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

If I have an obstacle and my current runner cannot overcome it, then I begin a NEW RUNNER that can over come the obstacle(s) or fight equally with a WoC/high level monk/Tank, ect... (there is a interesting idea) and that is the simple solution.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

What does that even mean?

This was an attempt to say if you think it is not fair to fight a runner with WoC and the weapons and armor that come with that tile, then create a runner that can get WoC and be more of an equal to the opponent you are after. If Monks are stronger with the WoC than a PE is then make a Monk to fight and stop whining.

This comment does not take into account your negatives on the external effects that WoC has placed on the game, the rares market and the balancing bull. Just a generalization of an opinion of mine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

It is PvP and PvE that caused this Balancing crap. There needed to be some adjustments but, it is CONSANT WHINING all the time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

Again... what? Of course it's PvP and PvE that caused changes to balancing. You say it like you're shocked by this. What else would it be??? As both PvP and PvE are fundamentally responsible for balancing, it would be fair to assume that they 'caused it'

Oh wait......... WoC could be responsible :lol:

Oh, and you say whining, I say feedback. ?

Ok, to you I stated the obvious but, not all of us PvP/PvE that much and PvP/PvE is not on top of a noobs agenda list until later on. Balancing and WoC means nothing to a brand new player atm. All most want is to level and then PvP/PvE/ Clans(negotiable) become important. I did not take your posted comments into account when I wrote this because it was not directed toward anything you wrote earlier. It just was me on a tangent pointing out the obvious and how I hated all this time still dicking around with balancing. It was just a coincidence that it happened to relate improperly to your earlier posts because as I said above, I did not really read them all well with some others till you argued my previous post to this (rightfully so).[

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

I always have said for years that there should be Islands that can be teleported to that would automatically even out everything for PvE and PvP action. .

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

Seriously now. What?

In answer to �Seriously now. What?� I was attempting to explain a potential solution to correct the effects of WoC on the game. My thought was to create a new area, an �Island� in the Neocron Ocean that could be GR�d to allowing full �USE� of WoC items and conventional weapons. ALL WoC privileges would be restricted to this new location for PvP and PvE. The rest of the Neocron world would go back to the use of only the weapon base we had before WoC came out. In other words, WoC on Neocron mainland would only be a status symbol and only the old weapon base would work on the mainland no advanced WoC weps/armor. Did I explain this better this time even I you dislike the idea? I hope I cleared up the issues I created and that all is clearer now.

JohnGalt

"Life is Good, I Still Love the Game!"
23-01-09, 10:28
L0KI

I approve of your most recent post JG. ;)

Yes, it was explained far better than the previous one, which to me just seemed like an ignorant attack on my ideas. Thank you for taking the time to explain more thoroughly.

I do see your point as far as WoC is concerned, and admit that it may be a little harsh just to outright remove it. It does frustrate me though, after loving what NC was before its implementation.

As someone said in another thread recently, we (I) get worked up because of our love for the game. I too love it, but let's be honest; it needs help.
That is, after all, the purpose of this thread, which was started over a year ago.

Anyway; don't take my earlier comments personally. :)
23-01-09, 17:39
JohnGalt

Quote:

Originally Posted by L0KI

I approve of your most recent post JG. ;)
Yes, it was explained far better than the previous one, which to me just seemed like an ignorant attack on my ideas. Thank you for taking the time to explain more thoroughly.

Your welcome, thank-you.

I did not want to directly insult he very people that make NC possible either. I appreciate their efforts. My criticism without a properly explained counterpart/solution did show a perceived unawareness and I am aware of the additional programming and the such to make these suggestions come to reality. Practicality is what any decision they at the top will use to decide a solution anyway.

Players developed WoC to what it is today, just as players attempt to hide a true exploitation until it is discovered or until the have gotten their fill (remember the WoC disks dropping in the lab?). All we can do is request the staff to see if they see the same deteriorating marketplace and effects, and adjust something (possibly with another area like I mentioned leaving NC back to it old self for other improvements). This should get a real �balance� back to the game that is as core to it as the programming itself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by L0KI

Anyway; don't take my earlier comments personally. :)

If I did then that would have been my problem, you were right. Plus as if I need a bunch of Monks hunting me down like a dog for the next year or two, having to hide out in caves, beating me down at MC5, lol�I don�t think so :lol:
23-01-09, 18:40
Hell-demon

John I too think WoC should be removed. It completly unbalances the game as most woc weapons are just rifles and pistols, meaning PE's and spies have an adge. This aspect of neocron has been poorly implemented.
23-01-09, 18:56
Sharper Blade

WoC would be something good if every class had some useful weapon and a useful non WoC weapon but all the WoC weapons would really have to be the same or it would just cause more balancing issues. I think WoC should be removed and then the nc1 setups and like it was previously stated "Rares and lower armor" or "Non-rares and higher armor" type setups made viable. :lol:

I want to see people able to kill with a face scratcher claw again and the most backassward noobs setup could still compete...and not be completely blown out of the water by one of the best setups ingame.
23-01-09, 20:05
Hell-demon

Basically remove evo 2.2
24-01-09, 00:09
JohnGalt

ok, mabey just armor, imp, bone and the such for WoC.
24-01-09, 14:29
Izeo

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnGalt

ok, mabey just armor, imp, bone and the such for WoC.

Yeah, I feel it should just be armor.

(I didn't even know WoC had imps and bones... do they? !!)

If WoC armor is slightly better than a normal PA, as long as it also has a slight disadvantage as well, I think it's fine. Working towards something that gives a small advantage is fine by me. Working towards something that determines the outcome of a battle, is NOT ok by me. I'm referring to how grinding for uber armor works in other MMOs when I say that - not referring to WoC weapons there.

As long as they aren't overpowered, the WoC PAs are fine - you buy the normal PAs from a vendor, big deal. Nothing is really negatively effected as long as they aren't overpowered. But as stated the weapons make rares much less important. It seems to me that it is possible to for example ONLY use the AK! You'd never even have to bother with hunting for rares if you did fine with the AK. I imagine all the tech parts with ":(" faces on them when they think about WoC weapons, lol.

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