View Full Version : Player Killing: Why?
Disclaimer:
I have no problem with death, Player vs Player combat, being killed, killing people (In-game....), or many aspects of battle in Neocron.
With that out of the way:
There was a certain thread on a certain server asking why people felt the need to go out of their way to kill 0/7 characters, or anyone else below the level where fighting against a capped Runner is next to impossible. Before it was derailed by the "put your LE back in/'cos it's fun, LOL" crowd, it seemed to be quite an interesting discussion.
So I'm asking the very same question here.
Why do people feel the need to go out of their way, sometimes to the point of ignoring a decent fight, in order to "own" the lowbie that poses little, if any, threat to them? Why do they ignore any chance of a relatively even-matched fight to gank someone that's too low level to do anything remotely troubling?
I'm truly interested in a response to this from those who take part in this "practise". Why complain this game is "carebear" yet not bother with the Player vs Player part of the game that's relevant to your level?
I'm disregarding the Law Enforcer in this question because, to be honest, it's not about being Player Killed it's about why they get Player Killed.
Personally, I won't be responding to the "it's fun!" or "stfu"-type replies (Hell, I won't be replying for the next hour or so given the Loss Of Memory pills I'm currently downing), but...hey...it's an open thread after all.
I suppose this is a rhetorical question all things considered, but still....I'll see how it unfolds.
Peace.
-Moscow
Shadow Dancer
24-05-04, 22:33
Some just do it because they like killing someone who has no chance of fighting back. Some do it because their angry at getting owned by someone in an op fight or a 1v1. Some just do it because their jerks. Some do it because they know that lowbie is an alt of a high level char who happens to be an enemy.
Personally I think in most cases it's lame and stupid. I don't see the fun in it. The only time I do it is if it's someone I really hate and has wronged me in the past, or if it's a spy he's pretending to just pass by.
Well most pkers don't actually go out of there way to just kill low level people. A lot of pkers just go out wanting to kill just anything they see and it doesn't matter what level they are. When I pk if I see a low level char I kill them in hope that they'll tell other people in there clan or friends and higher level people will then come after me.
Dribble Joy
24-05-04, 22:38
I don't 'gank', I find the whole practice.. odd.
Though if some n00b is attacking me, and after several attempts to get him to stopp he continues to beat his tl 17 weapon on me, I will inform him of the error of his ways with some free con points.
ever had a bad day, and you just felt like destroying something ??
i dont see the reason to kill any char that poses no threat, but if a 0/2 runner would start fisting my armor, the gun comes out.
I spend a lot of my time in NF, so I can defend myself if I should get jumped in the wastes, but today, I went with some friends out feeling a kill (it was a pretty fair fight), we ended up at an OP, and suddenly we had a large "war" going on.
then when I died, and knew the others i was with had fallen too, I contacted the opponents, and thanked for a great fight.
So, as to why people gank people that pose no threat, I can only say again.
"Ever had a bad day, and you just felt like destroying something"
Psychoninja
24-05-04, 22:43
Majority of people who are lowbies aren't new comers, and are most likely leveling their alt character. The PKer hopes that he can piss off the player enough to make him log on his higher level alt and have a decent fight. Thats what it is most of the time.
If the lowbie is clanned, it can be done to get the attention of the other clanmates.
Anyways, I'm not for it or against it, but I would favor killing the newbie more than the contrary. Reasons would be, it gives the lowbie something to aim for (lvling to get back at the attacker), force them to join a clan (thats what the game is really based on, clans), and it gives them a sense of reality in the game(they know they should be careful, and who to look out for, how factions function)
There isn't really alot to convince a person not to do it except their conscience.
Saito Hajime
24-05-04, 22:47
For the chance to type some Wittisicm of such profoundess, much like "Pwned" which not only is dumb, but is goddamnanble "leetspeak".
The ones that I dont understand are the ones that camp zoneline, especially in a manner that puts them behind you when when you spawn in and blast the shit out of some person who in no way could be a threat to them, half the time of a neutral faction. Hear some great reasons for those you do. Like "bored". Or my favorite, "I'm roleplaying a homicidal maniac."
In my mind that kind of killing plain old greifing. And I dont buy Pteks thing about killing noobs to draw a big fight. Thats crap. You could go find a fight just as easy without killing a noob. And I'd be wililng to wager that you dont really take the time to see if they are even clanned and would have someone to call to. Probably just another bottom feeding greifer.
Player killing is the game, deal with it, what else is there in neocron anyway?!?!? :confused:
Edit/ Even though i dont normally kill low people unless their 1) clanned 2) give shit 3) shoot me its totally fucking fair if there red lol....
You would'nt expect to be sent to iraq and not be killed by a 36 yr old because your 18
Player Killing != Griefplay, n00bhunting, ... , ...
On Saturn, Im a pure PK. I hunt mainly at cycrow, and H_12. I did the same for 1 - 2 month on pluto, with my apu, mostly alone. It is very hard to check the average skill of my victim from the sky, and I dont really care about it anyway. If u think u cant deal with the LE anymore becoz u need 4 Brainslots / support your team or whatever, then u accept the option to let ppl attack and kill u - a very simple thing.
The reason why PKs are always at lvl spots is becoz thats the only place where we can find somebody to pk - the city is safezone, the HQs are empty or filled with guards.
Matthew.v.smith
24-05-04, 22:57
When I go hunt if ure Red ure dead or at least I attempt to make you "dead"
I dont care if i die really. a small poke and im ok.
But in general i find it fun to Pk any Reds i c regardless of Lvl :p
Matty.
P.S) It's also fun to get a Reaction ;) ok ok so i'm a l33t pkar kiddeh so sue me :p
Psychoninja
24-05-04, 23:04
I think too many people blow newb killing out of proportion.
It's not all that big of a deal, and it doesn't take long to level to a point where you can PvP.
I don't go out of my way to hunt or avoid low level players, I simply kill when an opportunity presents itself. I'm be more than glad to leave unclanned lowbies alone for example, but when a clanned red runner crosses my path then they are as good as dead no matter what rank.
I do sometimes go out of my way to kill people at say MB, but if its a low ranked player and they respawn and come for their belt then there is really little reason for me to kill them again. Its all a matter of roleplay, creating an atmosphere, etc...
Btw Moscow why do I get the feeling that you've been on the forums well before this month? o_O
Saito Hajime
24-05-04, 23:08
Pointless pk is for 12 year olds.
Mumblyfish
24-05-04, 23:11
Pointless pk is for 12 year olds.[ edited ]
;)
I PK noobs for one of a few reasons:
1) If they are CA (I leave other enemy noobs alone... but CA deserve it :p).
2) If they are in a Clan which has Kosed me.
3) If they are pissing me off.
4) If I need the SL loss to get into Jailhouse, I'll kill the first non-crahn person I see.
its just one click on a apu! but its not like i hunt em down or soo.... kinda agree with jest here...
really i think i killed like max 5 lowbies on pluto since retail....
As soon as a player has a clan they are no longer just an innocent noob. Joining a clan means that you agree with the clans political views. You also get the feeling that the 'noob' who may seem to be attacking you for fun would kill you at the first opportunity that they have.
I kill noobs sometimes :D
If they're a unclanned enemy and around rank 20 - 40 I'll hold them at gun point and ask them to do silly stuff. Usually they tell me to fuck off and of course I kill them but if they do spin around 3 times and say I'm sexy I will let them go. If it's an enemy claned runner they are just dead. If it's a monk they are dead. If a noob runs into my clan when we are leveling or whatever then they might die... or if I see them in pepper park 2/3... But if I see a 3/10 cityadmin guy at oz station I will let him go.
Clownst0pper
24-05-04, 23:58
I never do it, just because im empathic, and imagine the player at his computer who may be new to neocron, and is needing a brake, and some help.
If I kill him, he is going to have to GR, wait for impairment, get repoked, he might not have the money, he will already be slow, he might drop his only weapon (not all noobs know the safe slot)
So no, I never do it, and I especially wont when DOY hits, we need to make runners feel welcome.
Ive helped loads of lowbies on saturn, low level and faction enemies, they need all the help they can get, give them a break
ive not killed that many noobs of late, but only due to the lack of people in game full stop.
the exception isif there lowbie and they are clanned, cos then they either have a high level alt or clan members to come and help.
i kill my enemies in general because thats how i see them, as enemies.
unlike some i dont like to stand with my enemies, i feel like i will be stabbed in the back if i do, so i kill them before they get the chance.
end of the day, when i go out pking be it on my own or with other clan mates, we have a laugh about it on teamspeak, so its all good imo im having fun, and i leveled there cons a bit, we all win :D
Cruzbroker
25-05-04, 00:48
The rank should show futher away. Now you have to run right next to him to see the rank.. Which sucks..
I never shoot noobs / low level characters.. It's just ain't fun.. I don't even attack under /60 or so ppl first.. (yes, /60)
Shadow Dancer
25-05-04, 00:58
if they do spin around 3 times and say I'm sexy I will let them go.
Lmfao
evil
I pk people cos I enjoy it its not like its real life :wtf: I find it funny to blow low lvl players brains out why does it make me 12 years old ? its just a game and thats what you do in this game don't like then leave LE chip in till you can fight back. If I'm out hunting runners and I see a 0/7 or what ever with no LE in do you think I'm just gonna say "oh hi need some help" hell no he gets cut down its called RP. Kind of like so you can point your F*cking finger and say thats the bad guy stay away from him he'll kill you and it makes the game instresting.
Jesterthegreat
25-05-04, 01:27
Disclaimer:
I have no problem with death, Player vs Player combat, being killed, killing people (In-game....), or many aspects of battle in Neocron.
With that out of the way:
There was a certain thread on a certain server asking why people felt the need to go out of their way to kill 0/7 characters, or anyone else below the level where fighting against a capped Runner is next to impossible. Before it was derailed by the "put your LE back in/'cos it's fun, LOL" crowd, it seemed to be quite an interesting discussion.
So I'm asking the very same question here.
Why do people feel the need to go out of their way, sometimes to the point of ignoring a decent fight, in order to "own" the lowbie that poses little, if any, threat to them? Why do they ignore any chance of a relatively even-matched fight to gank someone that's too low level to do anything remotely troubling?
I'm truly interested in a response to this from those who take part in this "practise". Why complain this game is "carebear" yet not bother with the Player vs Player part of the game that's relevant to your level?
I'm disregarding the Law Enforcer in this question because, to be honest, it's not about being Player Killed it's about why they get Player Killed.
Personally, I won't be responding to the "it's fun!" or "stfu"-type replies (Hell, I won't be replying for the next hour or so given the Loss Of Memory pills I'm currently downing), but...hey...it's an open thread after all.
I suppose this is a rhetorical question all things considered, but still....I'll see how it unfolds.
Peace.
-Moscow
i think anyone that kills alow level people is pathetic. thats one of my biggest hates... people who kill utter noobs. especially when you reroll as often as me :)
i have *** chars, i have / chars. i know what its like for both extremes, but people killing people who dont stand a chance at defending are just lame IMO
When DOY comes I will not kill any lower lvls for at least 3 months too let new people settle into the game however if these people don't like getting pked they are never gonna enjoy the game.
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 01:40
I pk people cos I enjoy it its not like its real life :wtf: I find it funny to blow low lvl players brains out why does it make me 12 years old ? its just a game and thats what you do in this game don't like then leave LE chip in till you can fight back. If I'm out hunting runners and I see a 0/7 or what ever with no LE in do you think I'm just gonna say "oh hi need some help" hell no he gets cut down its called RP. Kind of like so you can point your F*cking finger and say thats the bad guy stay away from him he'll kill you and it makes the game instresting.the feel of the game, and it certainly isnt roleplay.
[ edited ] I dont wanna hear any lame ass excuse about how you enhance
Again its the griefer mind set (its fun) (its interesting) yea, for the greifer... what threat is a 0/7 to you man. I mean sure If the dumbass is calling ya names or humpin your mom (assuming they have really bad taste here) or shooting shit at you, waste him. If not, [ edited ]Typical griefer bullshit, I'm having fun what does anything else matter. While in another thread, I miss the old days when there were "fights" everywhere.... wonder why the people left.
sorry, but what you dont wanna hear is the answer... Its fun. I like killing other capped players more, but I also like killing any hostile players of any rank... hell, if they are bad neg SL and allied ill kill them too. I just like to kill, its just fun. Wht is chocolate a pleasing taste to 95% of people? why do people love gold? they just DO.... I just like pking people of any rank. Also, it often brings out higher lebel people to pk
[ edited ] I dont wanna hear any lame ass excuse about how you enhance the feel of the game, and it certainly isnt roleplay.
Again its the griefer mind set (its fun) (its interesting) yea, for the greifer... what threat is a 0/7 to you man. I mean sure If the dumbass is calling ya names or humpin your mom (assuming they have really bad taste here) or shooting shit at you, waste him. [ edited ].
Why thank you for the insults which is all they were saying these things at me ingame I would see it as trash talking but out of game you are clearly directing it towards me. This I feel is a breach of the rules the way I play this game does not show what kind of a person I am in RL no sir it only shows how I wish to play my character. You should lighten up it is you that is the dick like I said it is a game and I do it cos I can you don't like tough shit :rolleyes:
Psychoninja
25-05-04, 01:57
Here's an excuse for you Saito, I pay for the game there for I play it as I wish O_o
Why thank you for the insults which is all they were saying these things at me ingame I would see it as trash talking but out of game you are clearly directing it towards me. This I feel is a breach of the rules the way I play this game does not show what kind of a person I am in RL no sir it only shows how I wish to play my character. You should lighten up it is you that is the dick like I said it is a game and I do it cos I can you don't like tough shit :rolleyes:
A little Off Topic here, but even so....
No matter how many times people deny it, and no matter how strongly they deny it, EVERYONE, and I really do mean everyone expresses a small part of themselves in things like this. There's no denying it.
If you act in such a way, then you're expressing something that's deep down inside your psyche.
Peace.
-Moscow
A little Off Topic here, but even so....
No matter how many times people deny it, and no matter how strongly they deny it, EVERYONE, and I really do mean everyone expresses a small part of themselves in things like this. There's no denying it.
If you act in such a way, then you're expressing something that's deep down inside your psyche.
Peace.
-Moscow
Oh so I'm a nutter cos I pk people in a fucking game?
The same as I like to play grand theft auto and blow cars up and stuff or maybe cos I like to whatch action films with lots of killing does that show I'm insane? give me a fucking break o_O
If you must know I was a noob too at one point and very much a carebear I got bored when I capped my first char so I did op wars alot that too got boring. Now I fight just about anyone I wish because I enjoy it gunning down a low lvl player sometimes happens it no big deal
Psychoninja
25-05-04, 02:07
Whatever happened to acting and pretending?
SOME of the actions a player take MIGHT have something to do with their subconscious, but I don't think that applies to everyone.
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 02:07
Yea genius, everyone pays for the game so everyone should be allowed to enjoy it the same. Griefers remove enjoyment for other players and thus should not be allowed to PK pointlessly. Griefing is getting your enjoyment of the game at the cost of the enjoyment of players who cannot defend themselves and its for tiny bitches.
You're most welcome for the insults LiL, Private me for more if you like.
It doesnt matter who you are in real life. Why? Just like how you "roleplay" a manical killer in game... I am "roleplaying" someone who thinks youre a stupid ball-less moron. I dont know this in Real life. You could be the next superman.
[ edited ]
Crucificio
25-05-04, 02:11
I have my LE in, and I can't count how many times I have zoned into a hunting area and having anywhere from 1 -5 PK's waiting that started shooting before they even realized I had my LE in. Bodies everywhere. Didn't seem like they were roleplaying either, because they were shooting everyone that came through before they saw what faction you were or anything.
Seems like basically people get to a point in the game where they are high enough level with capped stats and uber gear, and decide to just kill anyone they come across for the fun of it just because they can.
Why do people feel the need to go out of their way, sometimes to the point of ignoring a decent fight, in order to "own" the lowbie that poses little, if any, threat to them?
Disclaimer:
I will neither condemn nor encourage lowbie PKing. I would just like to answer the question.
So why do people do it?
Because it is human nature.
The part of us that says "Dude, killing that Lowbie will be as entertaining and as rewarding as whacking a wall with a stick!" is our mind that tells our instincts to back off, because those say "YOU NEED TO WIN!!!11one". Winning is what a challenge is all about, as far as our instincts are concerned. The mind can suppress this instinct by knowing that the fun in winning will not show up if there is no challenge involved. If you let go of your rational mind and follow your instincts though, you do anything necessary to win. Lowbie Killing, Cheating, Hacking... it all comes from the same instinct. The instinct to win at all costs.
The instinct to win at all costs.Win.
btw, check your e-mail.
:p
/edit Though I personally would compare griefing to dogs humping smaller dogs to ensure alpha status in the pack. You gotta' make sure you're on top!
Psychoninja
25-05-04, 02:16
I'm going to enjoy the game as I wish. How the hell is killing ONE newb ONCE griefing? In order to be considered a griefer you'd have to follow them around the game, GR camp them, camp their apt etc... Little player who can't defend themselves? Give me a L, give me a E, whats that spell? LE!!!
They're not newbs forever.
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 02:19
I'm going to enjoy the game as I wish. How the hell is killing ONE newb ONCE griefing? In order to be considered a griefer you'd have to follow them around the game, GR camp them, camp their apt etc... Little player who can't defend themselves? Give me a L, give me a E, whats that spell? LE!!!
They're not newbs forever.
Yea, and when they arent, and they are rival faction, kill the hell out of em.
Different from what I am talking about. And try to tell me that Griefing doenst happen all the time in this game...
I'd love to see a poll of people who quit playing this game. I bet high in the running of reasons would be asshole players.
Shadow Dancer
25-05-04, 02:25
Disclaimer:
I will neither condemn nor encourage lowbie PKing. I would just like to answer the question.
So why do people do it?
Because it is human nature.
The part of us that says "Dude, killing that Lowbie will be as entertaining and as rewarding as whacking a wall with a stick!" is our mind that tells our instincts to back off, because those say "YOU NEED TO WIN!!!11one". Winning is what a challenge is all about, as far as our instincts are concerned. The mind can suppress this instinct by knowing that the fun in winning will not show up if there is no challenge involved. If you let go of your rational mind and follow your instincts though, you do anything necessary to win. Lowbie Killing, Cheating, Hacking... it all comes from the same instinct. The instinct to win at all costs.
Nice generalization there. So the people who don't do it, are just fighting the "instinct" to do it? That doesn't make sense. Or rather, it doesn't make sense to assume that of everyone. I don't feel ANY urge to kill a lowbie I don't know at all. Even if he's red. I don't see what "Winning at all costs" has to do with it. Unless the lowbie is in the way of my goal(most often times their not), why would I kill him to "win at all costs"? If I let go and just do what I please and what my instincts tell me, I still won't attack the lowbie. Because there was never a desire in the first place. O_o
I couldn't disagree more with you Call. Maybe if your post was in reply to a topic asking "Why do people drop a million turrets and noob buff?" Then you would be totally right. Or at least mostly.
But this? Nah.
Oh so I'm a nutter cos I pk people in a fucking game?
The same as I like to play grand theft auto and blow cars up and stuff or maybe cos I like to whatch action films with lots of killing does that show I'm insane? give me a fucking break o_O
If you must know I was a noob too at one point and very much a carebear I got bored when I capped my first char so I did op wars alot that too got boring. Now I fight just about anyone I wish because I enjoy it gunning down a low lvl player sometimes happens it no big deal
If you take pleasure in it, then you're obviously satisfying some deep-down desire to take part in it.
If you're feeling such emotion over this sort of thing, then you're expressing a small part of yourself; no matter how tiny. Human emotion drives your personality, after all.
Peace.
-Moscow
All I can say is chill think about it for one second is this real life ? no its a game is there a way to avoid getting killed ? yes its called the LE chip my noob chars normally have there LE's in till lvl 40 + at least then I can run away. Another way to avoid getting ganked is to find some other out of the way place to lvl as a pker I don't venture very far normaly its TG MB around the Tech Haven in the outzone near certain lvling spots. Another way is to be prepared I lvl with a vehical near me at all times so if someone comes I can drive away the hovertech is the best its only 25 vehical use and is very fast ;)
Disclaimer:
I will neither condemn nor encourage lowbie PKing. I would just like to answer the question.
So why do people do it?
Because it is human nature.
The part of us that says "Dude, killing that Lowbie will be as entertaining and as rewarding as whacking a wall with a stick!" is our mind that tells our instincts to back off, because those say "YOU NEED TO WIN!!!11one". Winning is what a challenge is all about, as far as our instincts are concerned. The mind can suppress this instinct by knowing that the fun in winning will not show up if there is no challenge involved. If you let go of your rational mind and follow your instincts though, you do anything necessary to win. Lowbie Killing, Cheating, Hacking... it all comes from the same instinct. The instinct to win at all costs.
I cant say I really appreciate that, on one hand I see what your saying, but I HATE cheaters and hackers with a passion, if it was up to me, the penatly for cheating or hacking in an online game would be death... no, Im not joking (deaths a pretty good reason not to do something, isnt it?) I am not in the pool with cheaters and hackers simply bcause I kill a hostile faction. I like winning vs people my level... vs lowbies, theres no feeling of winning, nothing to be pround of, its just "I killed my enemy... and hopefully the alt of a capped char, which is the case 9/10 times who will now come fight me.
Id like to add that at one point I was like, half carebear at least... I would only attack if attacked, or fight in op wars, and only really fight 1vs1 in NF... some people said I should pk, and I was like "why? thats mean, they did nothing to me" But then one day I tried it, and I had a blast... it was just so fun... and thatwas that. Also, all you need is one 20/20 ppu to DB you to never again spare a low level chars life.
I cant say I really appreciate that, on one hand I see what your saying, but I HATE cheaters and hackers with a passion, if it was up to me, the penatly for cheating or hacking in an online game would be death...
he says it comes from the same instinct, the instict to win..
he doesn´t say it´s the same thing.
Even though I know where you´re coming from (with your reply that is)
I dont think lowbie killing can be grouped in with cheating in any way though... maybe if you ONLY kill lowbies and run from people your level... but killing a 20/20 ppu because shes casting db on you or kiling a 18/18 spy because hes telling cms where you are, or killing an 8/8 because hes the alt of someone you dont like much, theres nothing wrong with that.
No matter how many times people deny it, and no matter how strongly they deny it, EVERYONE, and I really do mean everyone expresses a small part of themselves in things like this. There's no denying it.
I agree totally
Oh so I'm a nutter cos I pk people in a fucking game?
this isn't meant to be inflammatory, so please don't flame me for saying this... I don't think anyone thinks you're a nutter for killing people in a game... we're players, we have guns for a reason, and not just to make Decayed Horror fillet.
But killing people in a game demonstrates desire for control or domination. People duel in game because they want to show they have superior skill to other people. I think you may kill people because you want to show your skill, superior reflexes, setup, ect.
Maybe I'm going about this all wrong but I have been known to appreciate the value of a good PK, even (especially) one done to me, if it was really skillful or well-done.
Then again, if you have to resort to killing people that have no chance against you to prove your skills, you really aren't very skilled at all PKing.
One of the funniest things I've ever seen in NC was a bunch of rank 50ish players in the newb sewer (I'm not going to mention names... I'll keep that IG) in Plaza 4, PKing rank 1x/xx newbs. I was in the 30s for rank at the time, but I still managed to drop a tank, a PE and nearly off the PPU before I was dropped by a droner. they seriously SUCKED at PvP, oh sure they could take rank x/10 newbs but there is no way a half-way skilled tank should drop a spy 10 ranks lower than himself at close range.
well, i guess vetterox explained it quite good. It's just fun. People are different and have various definitions of it.
The only people capable of changing the way it works are KK employees since its their game and they can set the rules. Players just play the game as they like to play. And they are ALL entitled to do what they want (if they follow the rules), and they ALL have equal rights to do it. One's bliss can be other's curse.
i never pked lowbies, even if i should to - guess i'm too emphatic as well. People just tend to take it too personal all the time - which is good in a way as it means that they are identificate with their chars (which means KK done a good job in creating a virtual world). But its just a game - players u hate with all passion can be nice people after all. Good training to realize that is to change the faction to quite opposite to yours and then see how are those evil pkers when u're allied with them. Usually quite friendly and 'normal', despite your visions from 'the other side'.
Of course, there are lame things and lame people who really can get on your nerves sometimes. Happens in real life as well, probably often. And they do it because they like it (for various reasons, more or less mature) - but i wouldnt dare to judge them anyway.
az
I am probably the most uncompetative and mellow person alive. But that doesn't matter because due to the fact that I kill people in games I'm a psycho right? Yeah... I belive you.
Well I like to kill n00bs cause I enjoy watching them cry I enjoy laughing at them. Why? Why not? There probably is something wrong with me but hey.
I mean really why do you pk its a form of playing simple put you kill anything that moves its a way of playing the game. Maybe you enjoy annoying others maybe you wann play a visious killer.
Why do grown men RP? Go into a game pretending there a mighty dwarf warrior who is there to destroy all evil.
Why does someone pretend there a miner and play there there wares are of suppior quality and such?
Funny to see some who look down apon pks like there is something wrong with them. I think there is more wrong in RP I mean its like grown men playing house.
I mean really why do you pk its a form of playing simple put you kill anything that moves its a way of playing the game. Maybe you enjoy annoying others maybe you wann play a visious killer.
Why do grown men RP? Go into a game pretending there a mighty dwarf warrior who is there to destroy all evil.
Why does someone pretend there a miner and play there there wares are of suppior quality and such?
Why do grown men gain enjoyment from annoying others? Its sophmoric, childish. Are you a child?
=/
Anyway, do you know why MMO's are so popular? It allows people to play a role more exciting and interesting than their normal day to day fare. Most people who play MMO's are tech geeks and cubicle hogs, no surpise. Generally those that play use the game as an outlet to to expand on their character since they aren't allowed to do it at work, or at home. It's beleived that most people who play MMO's are single males, age 15-26.
If you take pleasure in it, then you're obviously satisfying some deep-down desire to take part in it.
If you're feeling such emotion over this sort of thing, then you're expressing a small part of yourself; no matter how tiny. Human emotion drives your personality, after all.
Peace.
-MoscowDo you have a doctorate in psycho anaylsis or psychology?
If not, cut the amateur psycho babble crap.
two words "Target Practice"
when I need to test my sniping skills with no chance of dying I go and find a noob hunting out in the wastes and blam blam max 2 shots and I am done. Sometimes they die, I have even died :( on such an occasion but I won't go into that.
Why do grown men gain enjoyment from annoying others? Its sophmoric, childish. Are you a child?
A child no
Immature though, for sure
Liebestoter
25-05-04, 06:02
Why? I'll tell you why.
Because I don't like your clan name. I don't like your runner's name. I don't like your character model. I don't like the stupid things you say in trade. I don't like it when you tell me not to say stupid things in trade. I don't like people who type like they're mildly retarded. I don't like people with alternating caps in their names. I don't like your clan. I don't like your faction. I don't like your class, or chosen methods of combat. I don't like the fact that when I attack you, you call your entire clan for backup. I don't like agents of the hate sharpie. I don't like the fact that you all sit around in P2 doing nothing. I don't like the fact that Neocron hasn't been patched. I don't like the fact that I don't have a cigarette. I don't like the fact that I don't like the fact that I don't have a cigarette. I don't like the fact that you whine about being killed in a fair fight. I don't like the fact that you try to put a pseudopsychological spin on player activity in an MMORPG.
... or maybe you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time when I'm feeling the need to kill someone. :D
Why? I'll tell you why.
Because I don't like your clan name. I don't like your runner's name. I don't like your character model. I don't like the stupid things you say in trade. I don't like it when you tell me not to say stupid things in trade. I don't like people who type like they're mildly retarded. I don't like people with alternating caps in their names. I don't like your clan. I don't like your faction. I don't like your class, or chosen methods of combat. I don't like the fact that when I attack you, you call your entire clan for backup. I don't like agents of the hate sharpie. I don't like the fact that you all sit around in P2 doing nothing. I don't like the fact that Neocron hasn't been patched. I don't like the fact that I don't have a cigarette. I don't like the fact that I don't like the fact that I don't have a cigarette. I don't like the fact that you whine about being killed in a fair fight. I don't like the fact that you try to put a pseudopsychological spin on player activity in an MMORPG.
... or maybe you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time when I'm feeling the need to kill someone. :D
Sorry to burst your bubble, but most pkers don't care who you are, what you've done, or anything. Only one you really got right was being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Liebestoter
25-05-04, 06:07
I know, that was my point.
Text is a poor medium for sarcasm. ;o
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 06:15
Kimmy in a strange way made a good point without even knowing it.
Not that I agree in the slightest with anything he said. But he admitted to not understanding RP. Shrug. Salright kim-boy, we didnt expect you to. Much like you dont expect me to ever understand how killing noobs/lowbs/friendly, neutral type factions is cool.
I am not ashamed to say that I have been a long time role player. I'm talkin old school paper role play. No, I never dressed up, no I never spoke in a voice which was not my own. But, I did develop alot of characters. Even more than developing and guiding a character thru a campaign, I enjoyed runnin the games. Creating the world that my players would experience. Its great, Its like being a fiction writer with most of the research done for you. Its very rewarding to make a detailed and enjoyable adventure for players to struggle thru and conquer. Its the same reason anybody does anything they dont get paid for. A diversion, something fun to pass time. Just like anything else its cool unless you go too far with it.
Which is exactly where PVP in this game is, Its too open. OR another way to look at it is. There is little to no consequence for being a total dickhead to another player whos paying the same amount each month to enjoy the game. With any luck DoY will provide with some kind of consequenses, Particularly for those players that toss concepts like faction out the window. Like the monkies in the earlier example about the guy who genrepped and found the PKers waiting... Yea real badasses those guys. Bet when he jumped back they all stroked each other off with things like "wow that noob got owned, durrr. nurr...owned."
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 06:16
Why? I'll tell you why.
Because I don't like your clan name. I don't like your runner's name. I don't like your character model. I don't like the stupid things you say in trade. I don't like it when you tell me not to say stupid things in trade. I don't like people who type like they're mildly retarded. I don't like people with alternating caps in their names. I don't like your clan. I don't like your faction. I don't like your class, or chosen methods of combat. I don't like the fact that when I attack you, you call your entire clan for backup. I don't like agents of the hate sharpie. I don't like the fact that you all sit around in P2 doing nothing. I don't like the fact that Neocron hasn't been patched. I don't like the fact that I don't have a cigarette. I don't like the fact that I don't like the fact that I don't have a cigarette. I don't like the fact that you whine about being killed in a fair fight. I don't like the fact that you try to put a pseudopsychological spin on player activity in an MMORPG.
... or maybe you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time when I'm feeling the need to kill someone. :D
[ edited ]
Mo more flaming, please.
N
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 11:06
Ok Nid.
Please help me out though. What would you call a player with that kind of attitude? Sounds like A whiner to me. And my apology was actually sincere when I realized that he was not actually thinking that way I did correct myself. Did I not?
ever had a bad day, and you just felt like destroying something ??
Every day i feel like destroying somthing beautiful.
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 11:21
So destroy a beautiful player somewhat near your lvl.
oh and the DMs you get from killing people make it worth while as well :lol:
Clownst0pper
25-05-04, 12:11
oh and the DMs you get from killing people make it worth while as well :lol:
I usually find its the high end players who direct you the worst ;)
I always look at them and I see the poor dudes looking at me, thinking what to do now.
I usually run at them and watch them run away from me. It gives me a laugh :-D
Original monk
25-05-04, 12:36
I usually find its the high end players who direct you the worst ;)
yeah :P like me when i got owned badly :)
but myself i mute direct when im on my Pkchars :)
but myself i mute direct when im on my Pkchars :)
That's like escaping from reality!
I've only pk'd a low level runner since I decided to get retail a while back umm once I believe it was. (did it on beta a bit but back then anyone with a phospher modded weapon could be damn dangerous) Only reason I did it was cause some monk accused my monk of stealing his spells which were totally low level and not needed by me. I told him it was the first time Id seen him and I was leveling, I didn't steal his spells. But he kept following me around and calling me a theif. Eventually my patience got thin and I fried him with a spell. So then he comes back and then calls me a backstabbing pk'er o_O and started advertising in zone that I'm a pk'er and everyone to watch out for me or for people to come kill me. Of course there were tons of people inthe zone Who i've leveled with and helped out so no one paid attention to him .. but eventually my patience grew thin again after about 10-15 min and I fried him again. I explained to people around why I did it and they just laughed and called him stupid. *shrugs*
It's all about circumstances for me.
The last noob i killed was when i was playing copbot with my NCPD armor and an EPR in the sewers. Found some FA noob and told her to DROP THAT WEAPON and get the hell out o my town. :)
She then insulted me in german, not knowing i could understand her. So i killed her. Then i felt bad about it. Had a nice talk with her afterwards though.
My last Pking spree was on another server at the MB, i killed some mid to high levels and just ignored everything below /40. That felt better.
unlike some i dont like to stand with my enemies, i feel like i will be stabbed in the back if i do, so i kill them before they get the chance.
LOL, thats one of the reasons i like to cave with enemies, etc.
Even though you are all helping each other, you dont know if they are going to turn on you... adds some thrills.
Original monk
25-05-04, 12:58
That's like escaping from reality!
neocron is one giant escape from reality, even worse, for some its a second reality ... when the future goes furter and there are people that play more mmorpg's then they live there normal life, then the virtual world becomes there reality :)
but thats not the answer to youre question :)
the answer to youre question is practically ... ok whinings true direct are funny :) but it keeps you away from the real deal :)
PKing more :P
for me PKing doesnt equals killing noobs, au contraire, PKing to me is looking for people of youre own strenght, this hasnt anything to do with ranks/level's or wheter youre capped or not, its looking for a balance so you can get to a fun and fair, longduring fight :)
example is my fight against Style in the beginning of retail ... me with a libby, he with a TPC :) whe both wherent capped and the fight seemed like hours and hours :) while probably it took about 5 minutes wich is still veery long for a duel :) lots of people, both <O>wnage and H.A.T.E where yust looking, they didnt start fighting with eachother, they didnt interfere, they yust looked ...
it was heaven and a struggle for every second, constantly keeping 200% even 300% focussed :) i can say that it was pure adrenaline and fun :)
fight ended with style at 4 hp and myself genrepping back to plaza :) DEAD ffcourse :P
but it was worth it yeah :) by far
i dont see the point in killing a noob, where's the adrenaline there ??
knowing you annoyed another player ?? being able to say that youre a bad guy ?? mhuahahahahaha, nibs
its the balance you achieve in a fight, its looking for that 1 excelent fight you remember for the rest of youre life :)
Nice generalization there. So the people who don't do it, are just fighting the "instinct" to do it? That doesn't make sense. Or rather, it doesn't make sense to assume that of everyone. I don't feel ANY urge to kill a lowbie I don't know at all. Even if he's red. I don't see what "Winning at all costs" has to do with it. Unless the lowbie is in the way of my goal(most often times their not), why would I kill him to "win at all costs"? If I let go and just do what I please and what my instincts tell me, I still won't attack the lowbie. Because there was never a desire in the first place. O_o
I couldn't disagree more with you Call. Maybe if your post was in reply to a topic asking "Why do people drop a million turrets and noob buff?" Then you would be totally right. Or at least mostly.
But this? Nah.
Somebody HAD to take offense and say "Well *I* do not have such instincts, KTHXBYE!" I guess :D You have to distinguish between "desire" and "instinct". Everyone has the instincts to do that. "Desire" is already a combination of instincts and the mind. If you feel no desire at all to PK Lowbies, that doesn't mean that the instinct isn't there. Remember that our instincts are pretty much the oldest part of our human nature. We pretty much still have the same instincts as the cavemen back then. The instinct to reproduce for example. If somebody is asexual, that doesn't mean he doesn't have the instinct, it means he has a personal disorder where the mind doesn't allow the sexual instinct any manifestation. There are other instincts. To hunt, to support yourself and your group, to hunt your prey. If it's weak, it's easy prey. The sailors a few centuries ago drove the Dodos to extinction, they took lots of them and their eggs on board as provision, and the imported animals were the first natural enemy the Dodo had... but also, the Sailors played interesting games: Kick-the-Dodo, He who kills the most Dodos wins, Lets watch our dogs devour a Dodo and so on. Why did they do that?
Because it's human nature.
Just because you don't feel any desire inside you doesn't mean that the instinct isn't there. Let's not forget that we are still animals. Animals with high self-control, but still animals.
neocron is one giant escape from reality, even worse, for some its a second reality ... when the future goes furter and there are people that play more mmorpg's then they live there normal life, then the virtual world becomes there reality :)
but thats not the answer to youre question :)
the answer to youre question is practically ... ok whinings true direct are funny :) but it keeps you away from the real deal :)
PKing more :P
for me PKing doesnt equals killing noobs, au contraire, PKing to me is looking for people of youre own strenght, this hasnt anything to do with ranks/level's or wheter youre capped or not, its looking for a balance so you can get to a fun and fair, longduring fight :)
example is my fight against Style in the beginning of retail ... me with a libby, he with a TPC :) whe both wherent capped and the fight seemed like hours and hours :) while probably it took about 5 minutes wich is still veery long for a duel :) lots of people, both <O>wnage and H.A.T.E where yust looking, they didnt start fighting with eachother, they didnt interfere, they yust looked ...
it was heaven and a struggle for every second, constantly keeping 200% even 300% focussed :) i can say that it was pure adrenaline and fun :)
fight ended with style at 4 hp and myself genrepping back to plaza :) DEAD ffcourse :P
but it was worth it yeah :) by far
i dont see the point in killing a noob, where's the adrenaline there ??
knowing you annoyed another player ?? being able to say that youre a bad guy ?? mhuahahahahaha, nibs
its the balance you achieve in a fight, its looking for that 1 excelent fight you remember for the rest of youre life :)
yet the very person you use in that example was also a big noob killer
This is game, I chose to kill who i want to.
This doesn't mean i killed 0/2 that's just lame but i do kill alts of people i hate which i wont name for obvious reasons.
I kill spies or people supsiciously running around your OP blatantly informing the attacking clan about when the defenders leave or something.
Sometimes I just go on a PK run cause I'm "bored" but i dont kill 0/2 or anything near that i only kill people * or above in rank.
I have a slight urge to kill droners whether high or low rank tho, I dunno why :D
Don't you guys find PKing very rewarding or you feel "wow i PWNED SOMEONE!!!" (that's good...)
That's another reason I do it , the feeling of pking all the high level people in Military base with refinforcements and not dying once, the ability of being able to kill about 20 people is quite cool 8-)
Saito Hajime
25-05-04, 13:51
Only when its a challenge my friend. Whats the pont in owning someone 20 ranks lower. or who just genrepped in. Or who just helped you in a big fight and is hurt. Explain why people think that kinda shit is cool.
As much as I am against killing noobs I nearly splattered one myself. I'm changing factions and I was running around killing sewerflies and out of boredom I busted out my 4 slot judgement launcher. I didnt know there was a 3/3 around the corner and he was lucky when the rocket wizzed past his head down the hallway. So was I, I woulda been pissed If i lost the sympathy I had just gained...
Only when its a challenge my friend. Whats the pont in owning someone 20 ranks lower. or who just genrepped in. Or who just helped you in a big fight and is hurt. Explain why people think that kinda shit is cool.
"i only kill people * or above in rank."
I find it fun, it's hard to explain...
It's like why do some people find sexing others in neocron fun ?? O_o
Original monk
25-05-04, 14:02
yet the very person you use in that example was also a big noob killer
indeed, thats why i went to OZ (where he was pking) in the first place, he killed a noobiemate of me :) (wich technically makes me a carebear :P but i dont mind being called carebear, they fastly change opinion when there lying back down face staring heaven :) )
and i dont approve noobkilling ... no adrenaline to find there :)
killing 1 million noobs doesnt get you the feeling by far you get by finding youre equal in a fight :)
and back then (its 2 years ago by now lol 8| ) style happend to be at the right spot at the right time with the right weapons :)
we had a long chat afterwords, only trouble we both had was typing: we where still a bit shaking :)
like Kimmy G said.. its just fun and funny... Its fun being on team speak, pking high levels at MB, and some noob 20/20 spy rolls up on his hover, we blow him away, and then he keeps running out from the GR, only able to say "wankers" before hes hit by HL, fire apoc, and CS all at the same time and we all laugh... its just funny. We know we arent winning some epic heroic battle by killing him, its just amusing, all there is to it.
Never killed a low level runner ever.
But if people want to, the game allows it, so its down to personal morals. Also, I think there are two key reasons for it nowadays that there wasn't before:
1) The Pker wants high level players alts to fight so kills lowbies as bait - for instance Aggie Cellars or Military Base.
2) Boredom and the recent movement of players accross servers (to a server that is foreign to them, they behave differently there) has developed a very nasty environment.
When I think back to the beginning of retail, there was a much different atmosphere. Sure there were pkers, but not as many. Yesterday I ran around Military Base on my PPU to see if I could help any levellers, and they were all wearing LE chips. Pkers are there more than they are not. This is a change, and I think it came as the game has 'matured' (ironic) and lost its influx of new players.
Promethius
25-05-04, 15:21
As said like many others people gank for a whole variety of reasons. Some bored, some angry, some just out for blood. The main reasons I use to PK was due to being bored from the down town between OP fights. It was just something to do to keep yourself busy.
-Prom
I generally avoid killing low level runners. The only times I do are either when raiding, or if they attack me. I usually give them an option to run away first. As TG, before the GR rules, I used to sit around in CRP a lot, sometimes hunting, other times just guarding it from the regular raids staged by TT runners. I would often find myself stood next to the GR when a low level Tangent runner would warp in. I'd politely ask him to leave, if he didn't, I'd kill him. 9 times out of 10 they would promptly respawn there and start talking loads of shit about how I was 12 years old and had no right to stop them levelling wherever they wanted.
On raids I would generally kill all hostiles, regardless of level. As Vet says, it's only a matter of time before that 20/20 PPU you left alone comes along and DBs you, the 0/5 spy relogs to his capped PE, the 5/9 Tank starts following you around and reporting your position over faction chat.
In Pepper though, I generally ignore them, but keep an eye on them. If they give me any shit I'll politely remind them that as CA it's my job to be killing them. If I get more, they die, simple as that. Attacking me gets a face full of plasma too. But if they're just standing there, watching, what's the harm in letting them watch? Get them thinking "Wow, I wish I was taking part in that fight," which gets them more interested in the game. Or "Hey, that guy there fighting all alone against 6 enemies actually seems to be winning!" There's little point having an ego if you kill everyone who might boost it. :p
Roleplayers think it's cool to have tea. PKers think it's cool to kill people. Everything has there own way of having fun
What i dont get is that theres so many ppl complaining about PKers yet i barely ever see it happening.
And i play a lot. o_O
Recently leveled up a tank and another spy. Had my LE in for quite a long time on the tank, did not see one person getting pked in that time. Was on saturn, not when i was in the aggie sewers, not at the MB. Just once at Cycrow when it was owned by CA they killed a midlevel TG APU in the cave, but i expected that to happen anyway...
On uranus on my spy i didnt get pked once.
Actually, the last time i got killed as a noob was loooong ago when i was playing my spy on pluto. Was rank /40 or so already when some PE ganked me while i was fighting a warbot.
/edit: Wrong, last time i got killed was on venus on my noob tank by some dicks who came from pluto just to destroy venus...
Hear someone screaming "PKER at xxx"on trade, but it doesnt really happen that often. Theres only one "real" noob PKer on uranus anyway, its some dick from jupiter and i think he just logs the PKer when he got his ass kicked over there. :)
Damn, if i knew how to set up a poll, id make one how often ppl got killed when they were noobs. :lol:
PKing is something that grows inside you this is no joke I started this game as a carebear and like Saito I saw no point in killing lower people than me. Then one day I got mixed up with some pkers and we raided the MB it felt good knowing we where surrounded by enemy players. I ran into the bunker and killed someone who was AFK leaching xp I laughed my head off when I saw the pile of backpacks scattered around since then I kill anyone regaurdless of rank. Sure its better fighting a person with the same skill same lvl and beating them but seeing some one fall to the ground what ever rank he is makes me laugh :lol: :lol:
:angel:
I hate the way that people separate roleplaying a PvP entirely.
I'm a roleplayer, but I also kill people. One depth of roleplay is to kill people of an enemy faction, the Red=Dead symdrome. I have no idea why people don't think its roleplaying... I mean for example, I'm Crahn and you expect me to walk past some CA scumbag monk who is leveling in my turf (OZ)? No way, I don't care what level they are, if they are traitorous enough to be in CA (or stupid enough not to have their LE in) then they die. I used to tell them to get out and excort them to the nearest genrep or zone border, but since CA closed all Yakarmas there is no mercy.
But that is merely one level of Roleplaying... But lets face it, in a Cyberpunk world people who are completely against PKing as part of roleplaying are not roleplaying themselves, unless they are roleplaying pacifists, as cyberpunk = violence and danger. If you can't handle that then why are you here? Or why aren't you green?
Right this is not really about noob killing is it noob killing will allways happen it allways has. The reason why they don't like PKers is because they suck at PvP and everytime they try to defend there home they get slaughtered so they vent there anger this way and call us noob killers. So many times have I owned a player my rank and he then starts DMing me with insults and stuff then there in plaza 2 sexing me calling me a noob killer and this is all down to because I beat them.
First, the original post asked about people that go out of their way to fight newbs and avoid the fights with runners of the same rank.
So for many people here, I dont think that applies. I know TONS of people will kill a newb when the opportunity presents itself, but not that many actively seek out newbs necessarily.
Some other points:
1. Drop the "it brings out alts" line PLEASE? Its silly. I have had newbs PKd several times. Either I just go about my business and laugh at the guys wasting time killing me, or I log my capped tank, and can NEVER EVER find the PKer that killed me. If you plan to use that LAME excuse as some sort of reason for killing newbs, at least stick around and fight. And then if a capped char shows up, dont cry in the forums when you get ganked because a few friends showed up as well. If you are so worried about fair fights to begin with, you wouldnt be killing newbs.
2. The "its fun" line is pretty silly too. PKers say they dont want to fight mobs or play single player games cause the AI is so dumb. Its no challenge to them. Yet they kill newbs in Neocron because "its fun"??? I am interested to know whats fun about it that doesnt concern the fact that you possibly are pissing someone else off by doing it (which is against the TOS anyway). Aside from the fact that you might annoy someone, what is fun about killing a newb? What is different about killing a newb than killing a mob?
Judge:
I'm a roleplayer, but I also kill people. One depth of roleplay is to kill people of an enemy faction, the Red=Dead symdrome. I have no idea why people don't think its roleplaying... I mean for example, I'm Crahn and you expect me to walk past some CA scumbag monk who is leveling in my turf (OZ)? No way, I don't care what level they are, if they are traitorous enough to be in CA (or stupid enough not to have their LE in) then they die. I used to tell them to get out and excort them to the nearest genrep or zone border, but since CA closed all Yakarmas there is no mercy.Its like this. People dont think red=dead is roleplaying because it requires no thought and no decision making. What if someone is RPing a Crahn sympathizer or a mole? What if someone is CA but has a real reason to ally with Crahn? What if someone is just looking to work out a trade of some sort- Crahn info for CA info?
Red=dead might as well just be carried out by robots and AI. What separates us from the computer is the ability to interact and think.
Part of RP is having it be dynamic. No human really ever functions by an absolute like "red=dead." Soldiers dont usually kill women and children or medical personnel, even though they may be "red" to them.
If Neo was real life (which is how RP is dealt with) then I doubt Crahn would want their runners killing EVERY CA runner they ever encountered, with no exception.
Toss in the fact that a lot of times people dont kill red runners cause they used to be buds, or are friends in real life (OOC reasons... thus invalidating RP) and its easy to see why people dont see red=dead as valid RP.
But that is merely one level of Roleplaying... But lets face it, in a Cyberpunk world people who are completely against PKing as part of roleplaying are not roleplaying themselves, unless they are roleplaying pacifists, as cyberpunk = violence and danger. If you can't handle that then why are you here? Or why aren't you green?Cyberpunk <> violence. If cyberpunk = violence, then the whole world would come to an end... its called nihilism.
Cyberpunk being linked to necessary violence is just some rabble that players have started spouting to justify their actions when they initially had no justification behind them.
You want to know what Cyberpunk is about? Here read this:
http://www.spedro.com/nfc_cp.html
The guy that coined the term 'cyberpunk' defines a cyberpunk as this:
a young, technologically facile, ethically vacuous, computer-adept vandal or criminal.
PK!!! PK!!!! :rolleyes:
Here is the text from the Neocron homepage:
By the end of the third millenium, Earth has changed... Global pollution, excessive wars and a perforated atmosphere have turned the planet into an almost lifeless sphere of toxic mud. Radiation is everywhere and most animals have either gone extinct or have mutated into bizarre monstrous creatures. The remnants of mankind seek protection from the desolate, scorched world and gathered behind the protective walls of giant cities. These few mega cities became the last lights of hope, in the darkness of Earth's final dusk...”
Neocron is the world's first and only MMORPG (Massively Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Game) that brings you a dense Cyberpunk atmosphere. It is also the first MMORPG that looks, feels and is almost as easy to play as a 3D first person shooter.What about that makes you think that the game is just about violence? Sounds like it more about survival... man vs everything else.
So yes the game is Cyberpunk, but that is embodied by the hacker spy moreso than the PKer.
Its a game, its allso a kill or be killed world in NC. I was PKed shit loads when i was a nOOb, HATE was around and no place was safe. But i got alot from being PKed and i think it has made me a better player.
But i wont make a point of going out and killing every nOOb out there, its if i feal like wastein the ammo! :p
I love the rush from a balanced fight, either 1 on 1 or team vs team - its similar to thrashing the living shit out of my 600 (similar but not quite there)
U dont know if ur gonna just win, own them, die pathetically or have to run for cover and regroup........................
I dont get any of that from pking low lvls, so I just dont see the point.....
but hey, this is a game, so everyone can do woteva pleases them - up to the limit of the ingame rules that is.
the only thing that does piss me off is when I win a fight that someone else started - and they bitch that i cheated/exploited etc etc even tho I never do, and usually its then that have 3 onto 1 or are exploiting - but they joy of beating those saddos usually makes up for their bitching :lol:
Well, i used to do my fair share, maybe a little more, of pking little noob chars. Various reasons, i was drunk, i was bored, i was looking for a fight. When your dog tags sell for 100k+ it's kinda cool. But then i just decided it was stupid. meh.
Bred
A lot of people of a certain faction(hi TG) feel like they have to start attacking you with whatever they got like fist or whatever, and then you ask them to stop it and they just keep it coming so at the end you get so pissed you blow the fuck out of em and then they start screaming in DM "haha fucking n00b killer" and somethinglike "nice screenshot i got there im gonna post it on the forums" etc. That really just bothers me because if he havent starting attacking i would have just run past him instead of running him over.
slaughteruall
25-05-04, 17:23
Sometimes i get tired of the same old thing (ressing/CSTing and a dead faction) so i go looking for someone to kill.
Sometimes if i had a bad day at work i do the same thing.
Sometimes i'm out hunting or lvling and i see someone form a clan i hate (CM or what not) so i kill them. I hunt in strange places that it's rare to see someone there. Nothing like shooting some unknowing CM APU and PPU in the back then logging a alt and hacking there belts.
Slaughter
Shadow Dancer
25-05-04, 17:31
Very good post Strych9.
Judge:Its like this. People dont think red=dead is roleplaying because it requires no thought and no decision making. What if someone is RPing a Crahn sympathizer or a mole? What if someone is CA but has a real reason to ally with Crahn? What if someone is just looking to work out a trade of some sort- Crahn info for CA info?
Then they should contact highlevel Crahn members to escort them through the OZ to a safe meeting place to discuss their alliances and exchange info. If a CA directed me and said that he wanted to be a mole for Crahn, or sympathised with my plight then I would be happy to get him in contact with high ranking members of my faction.
Red=dead might as well just be carried out by robots and AI. What separates us from the computer is the ability to interact and think.
Part of RP is having it be dynamic. No human really ever functions by an absolute like "red=dead." Soldiers dont usually kill women and children or medical personnel, even though they may be "red" to them.
Religious fanatics in many middle east conflicts have killed women and children because they lived in the wrong place or worshipped the wrong god.
If Neo was real life (which is how RP is dealt with) then I doubt Crahn would want their runners killing EVERY CA runner they ever encountered, with no exception.
If they are out in the wasteland or in Crahns terrritory then yes they would. Just as any Crahn sect member in Plaza 1 is shot at by the CA guards.
Toss in the fact that a lot of times people dont kill red runners cause they used to be buds, or are friends in real life (OOC reasons... thus invalidating RP) and its easy to see why people dont see red=dead as valid RP.Cyberpunk <> violence. If cyberpunk = violence, then the whole world would come to an end... its called nihilism.
Cyberpunk being linked to necessary violence is just some rabble that players have started spouting to justify their actions when they initially had no justification behind them.
Violence is inherant in any Cyberpunk world. Maybe Cyberpunk = Violence was a bit extreme. And I'll put it this way, in this cyberpunk world players have made it violent and it will continue to be so.
KK doesnt want mob killers "why are there only 5 of them for capped players??!??!?!?!?!?"
SO this game is _about_ killing all you can see if you can´t take it leave like all the others O_o
That´s the point you can´t really go out and kill WB:s for 2 years that aint fun new things new mobs, at this moment there are really new ones..... And god forbid if the inplanted maybe they need to buy a new server O_o :o
When I think back to the beginning of retail, there was a much different atmosphere. Sure there were pkers, but not as many. Yesterday I ran around Military Base on my PPU to see if I could help any levellers, and they were all wearing LE chips. Pkers are there more than they are not. This is a change, and I think it came as the game has 'matured' (ironic) and lost its influx of new players.
Maybe it was different on other servers, but for me on Pluto the beggining of Retail was Neocron at it's most Violent. A hobby of many capped Tanks was to take a trip through the sewers wiping out all the lowlvl players. Hunting grounds all over were actively hunted by gankers. I remember having to wait till off times before I could safely take a trip to the graves for some quality levelin. The difference between now and then is population numbers. Back then there were enough people that not everyone was a ganker. Those of us that survived starting forming groups/clans to return the favor. We started going after the bastards hunting noobs or other low level players. It was quite a lot of fun, because they never expect serious pvp. They curse us out when they die, because we brought friends, because we caught them by suprise, etc. The same things they laugh at the noobs for : ) It was a common occurance in plaza 1 for a half dead noob to pop up and yell "PKR IN SEWERS!" A moment later half the people would rush down to gank the ganker. It was definitly good times : )
Someone needs to fill the bad guy role, without it the good guys get bored and become bad guys too. We're at a point now were most of the good guys have gotten bored and quit or just don't have any motivation anymore. Only the bad guys are still havin fun runnin around.
Personally, I'm too nice to gank. I get taken advantage of because noone has a problem doing it too me, but oh well. The looks of relief I get when I say I don't pvp at hunting grounds are well worth it for me.
It was a common occurance in plaza 1 for a half dead noob to pop up and yell "PKR IN SEWERS!" A moment later half the people would rush down to gank the ganker. It was definitly good times : )
Haha, yes. That was fucking awesome. :D
Dribble Joy
25-05-04, 19:10
Someone needs to fill the bad guy role, without it the good guys get bored and become bad guys too. We're at a point now were most of the good guys have gotten bored and quit or just don't have any motivation anymore. Only the bad guys are still havin fun runnin around.
From what I seem to be seeing, Uranus hopefully isn't going that way, there a a few clans out there that are 'bad', so we got people to fight.
The thing that is driving people out (doc is a prime example), is the smack talk you get even after minor skirmishes. Uranus has a horrible 'culture of hate' as Fangers put it, where the stuff you get on any and all channels is really quite nasty, and often gets really really personnal. People seem to hold grudges for anything and take things way to seriously (especially a cirtain TT clan).
I'm really close to loosing my patience, which is a rare thing, but it's not with the game, KK but the fucktards who play it.
I never do it, just because im empathic, and imagine the player at his computer who may be new to neocron, and is needing a brake, and some help.
If I kill him, he is going to have to GR, wait for impairment, get repoked, he might not have the money, he will already be slow, he might drop his only weapon (not all noobs know the safe slot)
So no, I never do it, and I especially wont when DOY hits, we need to make runners feel welcome.
Ive helped loads of lowbies on saturn, low level and faction enemies, they need all the help they can get, give them a break
Count my vote on this one. Remember, everytime ppl PKs a nib without anyreason or RED=DEAD ( FUCKING ASS CAREBEAR SATURNTHINGGIE ) policy, the nib might have just joined the game, and quits the playing totally after being ganked by some asswipe who just thinks its funny..
Then they come here to whine about NC lacks players..
If you think losing new Neocronians is funny, be that way.
I have helped a lot of nibs even when they are RED, or even clanned nibs, whos not getting the information he needs from his clan. (yes - seen a couple clanned CAs who really didn't know what they were doing).
slaughteruall
25-05-04, 19:40
Count my vote on this one. Remember, everytime ppl PKs a nib without anyreason or RED=DEAD ( FUCKING ASS CAREBEAR SATURNTHINGGIE ) policy, the nib might have just joined the game, and quits the playing totally after being ganked by some asswipe who just thinks its funny..
How on earth does a RED = DEAD make saturn a carebear server? Please explain that one. If anything it's making the other server carebear not the other way around.
Slaughter
First, yes, there should always be a bad guy. Noobs should watch out for other noobs PKing them. I certainly have no problem with PKing. Its just PKing noobs that I am not fond of.
Wanna PK noobs? Roll yourself a newb, dont power level them, and go kill other newbs. Otherwise, the need for a bad guy doesnt dictate that the bad guy must be capped.
Second, sorry I forgot to explain how lame the "I was PKd a lot when I was a noob, so I do it now" excuse was. Thats basically admitting its a lame act,and that you are just trying to be "fair" about it. Whatever. If you know its lame, dont do it, even if it was done to you.
Now on to the responses from Judge:
Then they should contact highlevel Crahn members to escort them through the OZ to a safe meeting place to discuss their alliances and exchange info. If a CA directed me and said that he wanted to be a mole for Crahn, or sympathised with my plight then I would be happy to get him in contact with high ranking members of my faction.So Crahn RPers should contact every Crahn member in the game?
The idea behind RP is that you should have a reason to do what you do. Yes, CA are "enemy faction" to Crahn, but as I explained, that doesnt mean that Crahn advocates killing every CA runner on the planet- esp. since YOU CANT KILL THEM ANYWAY. All you can do is move them to the nearest genrep.
So for the sake of RP, perhaps Crahn wanted to keep the mole on the down low, and just hoped that their runners wouldnt just blindly go shooting everyone on sight.
Now if the CA runner is running through the outzone Crahn area and you see him, would you give him a chance to explain himself and his actions? If so, then you would at least present the chance for RP to exist. If he isnt RPing then you kill him. Easy enough.
But "red=dead" means if they are red, you dont look at name, faction, whatever- you just shoot. "Red=dead" does not allow for RP, it basically mandates you ignore any possible RP and just shoot.
Religious fanatics in many middle east conflicts have killed women and children because they lived in the wrong place or worshipped the wrong god.The exception proves the rule, thats fine. There are always exceptions, and you named one.
But that doesnt do anything to dispute the fact that humans are thinking creatures, and are able to adapt to a situation. They might choose to act like a robot, but thats not how we funtion by default.
I explained this above anyway- RP is about making decisions, not blindly following rules.
If they are out in the wasteland or in Crahns terrritory then yes they would. Just as any Crahn sect member in Plaza 1 is shot at by the CA guards.Not quite.
First, you admit above that its possible for Crahn to want to talk to a CA runner for a reason... then now you say Crahn will want runners to kill every CA runner on sight, no matter what. So which is it? Do you allow for RP or is Crahn such a one dimensional faction that RP like that simply isnt possible?
Second, you are comparing Crahn runners to CA factional guards inside of medicare? What is the point to that? They are not the same.
You MUST try to think beyond just the color coding of the faction window. Its more than that. DRE and NEXT have "enemy factions." Do you think that NEXT or DRE would want their runners killing every enemy runner they came across? Makes no sense.
Only way it makes sense is if you ONLY look at the colors in that window and then use that as your defense. Which is fine- but its not RP.
Violence is inherant in any Cyberpunk world. Maybe Cyberpunk = Violence was a bit extreme. And I'll put it this way, in this cyberpunk world players have made it violent and it will continue to be so.Okay, first you say that
"Violence is inherent in any Cyberpunk world"
then you say
"I'll put it this way, in this cyberpunk world players have made it violent"
Which contradict. Is the world inherently violent, or have the players made it so?
I will assume you mean the second one, since I already addressed the fact that there really isnt anything inherently dangerous about cyberpunk stuff. Cyberpunks are the nerds back in highschool with the graphing calculators.
So assuming you feel that THIS particular cyberpunk world is dangerous because the players have made it so-
That is fine. I have no problem with you saying that players have TRIED to make this world dangerous (I mean it can only be so dangerous with no actual death or death penalty, no rewards for killing, etc.).
I had a problem with you using the word "cyberpunk" to in some way show that the in-game world, because it is called cyberpunk, was "supposed" to be violent.
the feel of the game, and it certainly isnt roleplay.
[ edited ] I dont wanna hear any lame ass excuse about how you enhance
Again its the griefer mind set (its fun) (its interesting) yea, for the greifer... what threat is a 0/7 to you man. I mean sure If the dumbass is calling ya names or humpin your mom (assuming they have really bad taste here) or shooting shit at you, waste him. If not, [ edited ]Typical griefer bullshit, I'm having fun what does anything else matter. While in another thread, I miss the old days when there were "fights" everywhere.... wonder why the people left.
Because the 0/2 runnning by you... red factioned... might have capped alts in the same faction, ever think of that? duh!
Count my vote on this one. Remember, everytime ppl PKs a nib without anyreason or RED=DEAD ( FUCKING ASS CAREBEAR SATURNTHINGGIE ) policy, the nib might have just joined the game, and quits the playing totally after being ganked by some asswipe who just thinks its funny..
Then they come here to whine about NC lacks players..
If you think losing new Neocronians is funny, be that way.
I have helped a lot of nibs even when they are RED, or even clanned nibs, whos not getting the information he needs from his clan. (yes - seen a couple clanned CAs who really didn't know what they were doing).
That is not our problem.... if someone wants to get a strop on and quit because they died in a game then fine, they can fuck off elsewhere for all i care, they will only grow into a whining bitch later on, OR it will give them the insent to level so they can fight back....you would'nt mind that would you? no i didnt think so.
Because the 0/2 runnning by you... red factioned... might have capped alts in the same faction, ever think of that? duh!
So u should kill all 0/2 cause they might have alts in the KoSd clan?
DUH!?=!?!
How on earth does a RED = DEAD make saturn a carebear server? Please explain that one. If anything it's making the other server carebear not the other way around.
Ok, perhaps too hasty comment from me, IMO it aplies saturn most. More players -> more ppl -> more carebears.
The fact is just making me furious, that some ppl are so blind for the red colour.
So u should kill all 0/2 cause they might have alts in the KoSd clan?
DUH!?=!?!
Ok, perhaps too hasty comment from me, IMO it aplies saturn most. More players -> more ppl -> more carebears.
The fact is just making me furious, that some ppl are so blind for the red colour.
Well.....errr....Yeah! its a game, its a roleplay game...they have le's...if they want to take them out then they agree to pk'ers terms of being PK'ED (PLAYER KILLED IF YOU DONT KNOW)
Strych you've definitely never been BD. :p Ironically I tried really hard not to have a red=dead rule in my clan. But be BD for a while. We are at war with over half of the factions. When I see red I know one of two things is going to happen, I am going to die, or they are going to die. I got real tired real fast of letting people live only to jump you from behind or have them call in more people to attack you. (I've even had this happen to me after letting people live at the GR). So I often lay there on the ground looking at the sky yet again thinking to myself, why did I let them live in the first place?
Simple answer. If they are a threat to me in any way, then they are as good as dead, no matter what their faction is. If a red player isnt a threat to me then they can live. (I consider the aspect of a future threat to warrant attacking them though, which is why I will kill a red runner regardless of rank if they are in an enemy clan). Most red players will attack me on site. So I attack them before they even have the chance to think about it. I'm not going to just wait for them to attack me, Im not a friggin jedi with rules against first strikes. Though thats one thing I love about being a PPU. It gives me a choice of who I want to attack instead of just natural killing instinct on my PE.
When I was TT I hated TG and thought they were the bad guys, perhaps even feared them. Then I joined FA and hated TT and thought they were the bad guys. Then I joined BD and people see me as the bad guy. I didnt suddenly become an asshole in the span of a year. Its just that its SO easy to hate your enemy because he kills you, or ganks you when you are low level. But very few of us take the time to put ourselves in our enemies shoes. Dont hate me when I kill you and I promise not to do the same to you. :p
Btw the cyberpunk aspect doesnt make Neocron inherently violent. The video game aspect does. ;)
Ever had that thought that some nibs might have read old documentary and takes the LE of because they think that u get some penalty for using LE?..
That was the reason i took it off first time.
But does it give u some sortta satisfaction when u kill nibs? I rather would wait them to get some lvls, and then try taking em down when they would have a change to fight back.
Or does ppl actually think that /30 would have any change against capped tank/apu/pe/spy? Yea prolly he/she could scratch ur armor..
Life ain't fair, so don't expect online games to be fair.
Life ain't fair, so don't expect online games to be fair.
Yea but i doubt u go kicking some 5year old ass just because u can.
Yea but i doubt u go kicking some 5year old ass just because u can.
poor kid, he will never walk again.....
Now on to the responses from Judge:
So Crahn RPers should contact every Crahn member in the game?
No, I said that if a CA person wanted to roleplay a mole then they should get in contact with leaders of various Crahn clans so that people don't kill them. Additionally, if they aren't in contact with any Crahn clans or individual crahn runners then they can't actually be moles.
The idea behind RP is that you should have a reason to do what you do. Yes, CA are "enemy faction" to Crahn, but as I explained, that doesnt mean that Crahn advocates killing every CA runner on the planet- esp. since YOU CANT KILL THEM ANYWAY. All you can do is move them to the nearest genrep.
The reason I kill enemies... because my character is a religious fanatic who thinks they are told by their god to destroy its enemies, especially enemy monks. Thats the premise behind my character, thats the reason that I kill enemies.
Now if the CA runner is running through the outzone Crahn area and you see him, would you give him a chance to explain himself and his actions? If so, then you would at least present the chance for RP to exist. If he isnt RPing then you kill him. Easy enough.
Hmmm... I don't know. If it was an enemy monk then no, but if it was another enemy class then I would allow them to talk if they talked fast.
But "red=dead" means if they are red, you dont look at name, faction, whatever- you just shoot. "Red=dead" does not allow for RP, it basically mandates you ignore any possible RP and just shoot.The exception proves the rule, thats fine. There are always exceptions, and you named one.
Depends on how you define Red=Dead.
First, you admit above that its possible for Crahn to want to talk to a CA runner for a reason... then now you say Crahn will want runners to kill every CA runner on sight, no matter what. So which is it? Do you allow for RP or is Crahn such a one dimensional faction that RP like that simply isnt possible?
They direct people, they shouldn't come looking for us in OZ or PP. Thats a surefire way of getting yourself wasted.
Second, you are comparing Crahn runners to CA factional guards inside of medicare? What is the point to that? They are not the same.
I don't see why not. CA say we aren't allowed in P1, Crahn say CA aren't allowed in OZ. Simple.
You MUST try to think beyond just the color coding of the faction window. Its more than that. DRE and NEXT have "enemy factions." Do you think that NEXT or DRE would want their runners killing every enemy runner they came across? Makes no sense.
Thats because DRE and Next are business factions. They aren't fanatical religious groups like Crahn is.
Only way it makes sense is if you ONLY look at the colors in that window and then use that as your defense. Which is fine- but its not RP.Okay, first you say that
"Violence is inherent in any Cyberpunk world"
then you say
"I'll put it this way, in this cyberpunk world players have made it violent"
Which contradict. Is the world inherently violent, or have the players made it so?
Violence is inherant in any Cyberpunk world because the people make it violent. Its human nature to some extend to become violent if you don't get your way.
That is fine. I have no problem with you saying that players have TRIED to make this world dangerous (I mean it can only be so dangerous with no actual death or death penalty, no rewards for killing, etc.).
I had a problem with you using the word "cyberpunk" to in some way show that the in-game world, because it is called cyberpunk, was "supposed" to be violent.
From my viewpoint, a cyberpunk world is supposed to be violent. You're welcome to your opinion on the matter though.
Life ain't fair, so don't expect online games to be fair.
Games are supposed to be fair, because an unfair game is not enjoyble - which means it's no longer a game.
Games are supposed to be fair, because an unfair game is not enjoyble - which means it's no longer a game.
"Global pollution, excessive wars and a perforated atmosphere have turned the planet into an almost lifeless sphere of toxic mud. Radiation is everywhere and most animals have either gone extinct or have mutated into bizarre monstrous creatures. The remnants of mankind seek protection from the desolate, scorched world and gathered behind the protective walls of giant cities. These few mega cities became the last lights of hope, in the darkness of Earth's final dusk...”
You're the roleplayer. Tell me how this is suppose to be fair.
Edit: Onoz, it just hit me. The pkers are the true roleplayers in neocron. They roleplay the game like it's suppose to be. :lol:
Shadow Dancer
25-05-04, 21:20
Games are supposed to be fair, because an unfair game is not enjoyble - which means it's no longer a game.
Exactly.
Heavyporker
25-05-04, 21:26
Read that line...
The last rays of hope coming from the MegaCities...
The only hope for a stable civilization.
A civilization and society stands on the premise that its citizens shouldn't just kill each other. That kind of behavior is completely unacceptable for any kind of survival and society.
I mean, fuck, every religion, every culture, every society, every civilization puts severe penalities on murder.
Pkers SHOULD be punished. Severely.
^^ Good point
"Global pollution, excessive wars and a perforated atmosphere have turned the planet into an almost lifeless sphere of toxic mud. Radiation is everywhere and most animals have either gone extinct or have mutated into bizarre monstrous creatures. The remnants of mankind seek protection from the desolate, scorched world and gathered behind the protective walls of giant cities. These few mega cities became the last lights of hope, in the darkness of Earth's final dusk...”
You're the roleplayer. Tell me how this is suppose to be fair.
Edit: Onoz, it just hit me. The pkers are the true roleplayers in neocron. They roleplay the game like it's suppose to be. :lol:Ok, so people have to hide in cities because of radiation... I don't see where that excuses the actions of greifers.
=/
And no, PKers are not the true roleplayers, because if they were - they would grow a pair and hanker down to -100 SL instead of picking on people, regaining SL and picking on 'em again.
Read that line...
The last rays of hope coming from the MegaCities...
The only hope for a stable civilization.
A civilization and society stands on the premise that its citizens shouldn't just kill each other. That kind of behavior is completely unacceptable for any kind of survival and society.
I mean, fuck, every religion, every culture, every society, every civilization puts severe penalities on murder.
Pkers SHOULD be punished. Severely.
Every faction is fighting for survival, which means killing your enemy. And yes pkers should be punished by the players. Not complain so KK adds something in to punish them.
Ok, so people have to hide in cities because of radiation... I don't see where that excuses the actions of greifers.
excessive wars
And no, PKers are not the true roleplayers, because if they were - they would grow a pair and hanker down to -100 SL instead of picking on people, regaining SL and picking on 'em again.
Well a certain group of people had to cry and made kk make it impossible to go red. Even if a pker that wanted to go -100 couldn't becuase it's not possible.
No, I said that if a CA person wanted to roleplay a mole then they should get in contact with leaders of various Crahn clans so that people don't kill them. Additionally, if they aren't in contact with any Crahn clans or individual crahn runners then they can't actually be moles.So how would a CA that wanted this find Crahn runners? You already said you would kill on sight. Guess they are out of luck eh? No RP for them.
And if they contacted the leader of a crahn clan, how would you, the crahn lackey, know whats going on? How does the chran clan leader get the word out?
You have to make allowances. Having any sort of "no expception" rules like "red=dead" makes no sense in a game like neocron. Its a convenient excuse to justify kills, but it doesnt have anything to do with RP.
The reason I kill enemies... because my character is a religious fanatic who thinks they are told by their god to destroy its enemies, especially enemy monks. Thats the premise behind my character, thats the reason that I kill enemies.Well if you kill ALL enemies...and ALL enemy monks... including the alts of people you know and like, or possibly alts of people in your clan or whatever... and if you kill them ALL the time, even if in a hunting zone... then good. At least you are consistent. Most "red=dead" people wouldnt go to that extent to be consistent with their RP.
So is that the case?
Also, how do you let people know what your RP is? Do you ever advise runners to not come back to Crahn territory cause you are on a religious mission? Cause if the target doesnt know your RP, you might as well not have any.
Hmmm... I don't know. If it was an enemy monk then no, but if it was another enemy class then I would allow them to talk if they talked fast.Well most newbs arent skilled at talking fast. And the game doesnt lend itself to quick communication anyway.
But if you give people a chance to talk (even though you say that you kill everyone anyway) then thats better than the alternative.
Depends on how you define Red=Dead.What is there to define? It means that you kill everyone that is red to you. I.e. all factional enemy runners. What else CAN that mean?
It means ignoring who the runner is, or what they are doing, and killing them solely because of the color of the letters above their head.
They direct people, they shouldn't come looking for us in OZ or PP. Thats a surefire way of getting yourself wasted.Yeah, if you want to talk to Crahn people, you shouldnt go looking for Crahn runners. That makes no sense. :rolleyes:
But to an extent you are right. If you are en enemy of Crahn, Crahn turf should be dangerous. Hopefully it will be that way with BDOY.
So do you ever warn people to leave your holy ground? Or do you see a red runner and kill them?
I don't see why not. CA say we aren't allowed in P1, Crahn say CA aren't allowed in OZ. Simple.Well I wish you Crahn would go along with the RP, as you are always seen in P1. The game mechanics simply dont allow CA runners to remove you. Maybe once BDOY comes and the factions are shifted and rules changed, this will all be more consistent. I hope so anyway.
Thats because DRE and Next are business factions. They aren't fanatical religious groups like Crahn is.We arent talking about Crahn's RP. We are talking about red=dead. If you admit that Crahn should do that stuff, but not DRE and NEXT (even though DRE and NEXT do have "factional enemies") then you are basically against red=dead. Cause earlier you said that you think simply killing enemy runners is RP, and that red=dead is valid.
But now if you say that DRE and NEXT runners wouldnt have a reason to kill other runners, but Crahn does... then that means you have shifted basically, and now you are advocating that red=dead doesnt really make sense without looking at context. Which I agree with.
Violence is inherant in any Cyberpunk world because the people make it violent. Its human nature to some extend to become violent if you don't get your way.Maybe you should look up (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=inherent) what that word means.
The is NOTHING inherently violent about cyberpunk. I already explained that, and wont go over it again.
Now looking at this particular cyberpunk world, Neocron, there isnt too much even particularly violent about it either.
1. You get no exp or money for killing.
2. People dont stay dead
3. You have no real penalty for dying
4. You have a safe slot
5. People can heal themselves
6. There are tons of safe zones (and even still will be in BDOY)
So where is the danger? That capped runners are fond of killing newbs? That scares no one save the occasional newb. Just makes the newb killers look silly, not scary.
From my viewpoint, a cyberpunk world is supposed to be violent. You're welcome to your opinion on the matter though.Well I have my opinion, and the opinion of the people that created the very fictional universe you are talking about. Nothing wrong with differing opinions, although I still havent heard what about Cyberpunk itself is violent at all. :confused:
Every faction is fighting for survival, which means killing your enemy. And yes pkers should be punished by the players. Not complain so KK adds something in to punish them.No, every faction is not fighting for survival. They're all able to survive, what they're fighting for it profit, they use the OP's clans take to hypothetically build more, research more, etc.
Every faction has its purpose, and with DoY the anti-city factions will get the same type of purpose that all pro-city factions have in association with the City Admin.
Hmm all it seems to boil down to is that the majority of the PK'ers have absolutely no concern whatsoever for other people's enjoyment of the game. I doubt any logical argument in favour of letting the lowbies live is going to sway their opinion. By all means PvP with people who can give you a decent fight, but to drive off runners who may one day become a truly challenging opponent for you, well, all I can guess is that they don't want a decent fight, more a feeling of power. Who are we to deny them that? *shrug*
Every faction is fighting for survival, which means killing your enemy. And yes pkers should be punished by the players. Not complain so KK adds something in to punish them.Come on. Read the text. Mankind is struggling to survive against the post apocolyptic environment... it doesnt even imply that "factions struggle to keep PKing factions that appear red in their RPOS..."
ok to put a long story short this is what is in a Pkers head
"If it moves Kill it" its realy that simple Move Red Dead
simple :lol:
Come on. Read the text. Mankind is struggling to survive against the post apocolyptic environment... it doesnt even imply that "factions struggle to keep PKing factions that appear red in their RPOS..."
How about you got look at your faction window and look what it says next to the red enemy. It says enemy, now incase you don't know what that means let me tell you
One who feels hatred toward, intends injury to, or opposes the interests of another; a foe.
en·e·my ( P ) Pronunciation Key (n-m)
n. pl. en·e·mies
One who feels hatred toward, intends injury to, or opposes the interests of another; a foe.
A hostile power or force, such as a nation.
A member or unit of such a force.
A group of foes or hostile forces. See Usage Note at collective noun.
Something destructive or injurious in its effects: “Art hath an enemy called Ignorance” (Ben Jonson).
Now tell me where it says that if an enemy is weaker then you he cannot be your enemy? Now if you see an enemy and he's lower rank and you let him go fine but not everyone is as carebear as you. If I see an enemy he will die. If he's rank 20/ so fucking what. He is my enemy as simple as that.
Edit: oops, actually it says hostile, well it still applies.
How about you got look at your faction window and look what it says next to the red enemy. It says enemy, now incase you don't know what that means let me tell you
One who feels hatred toward, intends injury to, or opposes the interests of another; a foe.
en·e·my ( P ) Pronunciation Key (n-m)
n. pl. en·e·mies
One who feels hatred toward, intends injury to, or opposes the interests of another; a foe.
A hostile power or force, such as a nation.
A member or unit of such a force.
A group of foes or hostile forces. See Usage Note at collective noun.
Something destructive or injurious in its effects: “Art hath an enemy called Ignorance” (Ben Jonson).
Now tell me where it says that if an enemy is weaker then you he cannot be your enemy? Now if you see an enemy and he's lower rank and you let him go fine but not everyone is as carebear as you. If I see an enemy he will die. If he's rank 20/ so fucking what. He is my enemy as simple as that.
Edit: oops, actually it says hostile, well it still applies.
Pepsi and Coke are enemies.
=/
Pepsi and Coke are enemies.
=/
com·pet·i·tor
Heavyporker
25-05-04, 21:45
petek, read the fooking storyline!
*excessive wars* refers to 2117, and then the other one when Neocron City and the Dome of York were flush and healthy.
It doesnt refer to individual runners.
And moreover, there's nothing lamer than ppl who pk, then run to the nearest citycom for a mission.
com·pet·i·torEnemy = competitor.
It all depends on perspective. Our current perspective is different because Coke can't send a bunch of people over to blow up a Pepsi production plant. Had they been able to, they would be 'Enemies', no?
I'm sorry, but do you really think that NeXT and PP would really have small time wars between them? No - because they're competitors according to the history, yet the actions of the players go and push them into enemy status.
Enemy = competitor.
It all depends on perspective. Our current perspective is different because Coke can't send a bunch of people over to blow up a Pepsi production plant. Had they been able to, they would be 'Enemies', no?
I'm sorry, but do you really think that NeXT and PP would really have small time wars between them? No - because they're competitors according to the history, yet the actions of the players go and push them into enemy status.
Tell me, how many next and pp pkers do you see(on pluto becuase I don't know how it's like on the other servers)?
Edit: OMG, once again I prove that pkers are the real roleplayers 8|
Tell me, how many next and pp pkers do you see(on pluto becuase I don't know how it's like on the other servers)?There are some, but not many. Most PKers don't really give a damn about which faction it is they're in and which faction it is they're killing.
The simple point is, red = dead is flawed. While in some areas it is justified, i.e. CA v. TG, in most cases it isn't.
Edit: OMG, once again I prove that pkers are the real roleplayers
Yes, because having a bunch of people killing everything indiscriminantly makes sense.
I forgot all about that.
Yes, because having a bunch of people killing everything indiscriminantly makes sense.
I forgot all about that.
No, becuase most pkers are in faction that would be more likely to just kill you becuase you're an enemy.
No, becuase most pkers are in faction that would be more likely to just kill you becuase you're an enemy.Not true at all, depends on the flow of the server. On pluto now, yeah, alot are BD or TG...
What about a couple of months ago when a good number were members of a dominant TT clan and ripped up friendly factions wherever they went? The flavor of the month changes alot.
Not true at all, depends on the flow of the server. On pluto now, yeah, alot are BD or TG...
What about a couple of months ago when a good number were members of a dominant TT clan and ripped up friendly factions wherever they went? The flavor of the month changes alot.
Why woudln't TT kill enemies?
Why woudln't TT kill enemies?But hey, there's a difference between competitors and enemies, you alluded to that yourself.
:lol:
Anyway, It's a corperation which produces weapons technologies and the like, hmmm... Much like companies today, they can try to get the goverment to do their work, or perhaps hire mercenaries... So I don't think it truly makes sense for Tangent Itself to fight... But hey, this is a game and some suspension of disbeleif is neccesary.
It would make more sense for pro-city militants to join CA where it actually makes sense to be violent with their enemies, but hey, common sense gets wasted on the masses.
*shrug*
The point is
1. You are trying to justify your "RP" because of a color in the RPOS.
2. You make no attempt to deal with the fact that the factional system is flawed, and I can be a CA and have 100 FS in Crahn... i.e. a saviour of Crahn... yet the factional system still says I am hostile.
If they ever make it so factional sympathies ACTUALLY determine standing rather than the color grid, players like you will either be forced to deal with neg SL, forced to RP some, or forced to leave the game. Either way, it works for me.
What cracks me up also is when the "red=dead=rp" players then kill allied factions, also because they are just wanting to kill everything without reason and ignore RP. No handy slogan for describing that though. :rolleyes:
What cracks me up also is when the "red=dead=rp" players then kill allied factions, also because they are just wanting to kill everything without reason and ignore RP. No handy slogan for describing that though. :rolleyes:
GREEN = GRASS OVER GRAVE< ROFFLE.
:wtf:
Ever had that thought that some nibs might have read old documentary and takes the LE of because they think that u get some penalty for using LE?..
That was the reason i took it off first time.
But does it give u some sortta satisfaction when u kill nibs? I rather would wait them to get some lvls, and then try taking em down when they would have a change to fight back.
Or does ppl actually think that /30 would have any change against capped tank/apu/pe/spy? Yea prolly he/she could scratch ur armor..
Like i said. And thats our problem how? its kk's fault that people think like that about le's...its kk's fault this game fucking blows....not CDV....if kk ever got from there ass and did some work once in a blue moon then this game could be filled up...
I dont kill noobs...i already said i didnt unless they are clanned, give me shit or shoot me but i dont disagree with it, its just a game, game, game, game, game...get it, GAME!.
Like jest said about BD..well..ive been BD for about 10 months and i know how good you need to be to be that faction on uranus. The entire server is anti-BD...except BD...the 6 factions that shoot BD roleplaying-like are all the full factions..there isnt a red faction to bd that doesnt have a big clan and BD is actually the smallest faction on uranus with the least people because everyones a fucking sheep and follows eachother except me...oh shock....my own fucking clan have gone to a kos clan (in TG) just because they cant handle it so thats another 5 mates from nc that ill never talk to again because the FAT FUCKING HEADS WILL COME OUT WHEN THEY ARE WINNING. So dont fucking come at me with that shit because we have it hard so fuck noobs and fuck you *breaths out*
You can't equate Neocron to real life.
Comparing CA and TG to Pepsi employees and Coke employees is flawed. Because Coke employees don't kill Pepsi employees. (mostly). If in real life, Coke employees were often known to attack and kill Pepsi employees, then yes the comparison works.
When you throw death/killing/etc into the equation it doesn't mimic real life. If I'm a Pepsi employee and I'm out walking my dog in the park and I see a Coke employee a few meters ahead of me who wants me dead and is carrying a gun, then I'm gonna take my gun out and shoot him first.
If I'm BD out hunting at El Farid and I see a DRE member running towards me, I'm not going to give him a chance to shoot first. I'm not gonna stand there and start talking to him. At the very least I'd avoid him.
Give me a reason as a BD to not attack a red. The colors are there for a reason. Roleplaying wise the only red faction I dont have a beef with is TG, but I dislike TG on a personal level so there goes that. If I was a true roleplayer Id attack Next as well but I dont. (Do the epic). :p CA vs TG isn't the only justifiable red=dead war. I dont kill indiscriminately.
As for killing allies. I am a Black Dragon, not some Fallen Angel scientist, I kill whoever I please, and I dont need to justify it. If I dont like you, I dont care what faction you are in, you will die. Im even at war with another BD clan I dislike. ;)
The point is
1. You are trying to justify your "RP" because of a color in the RPOS.
2. You make no attempt to deal with the fact that the factional system is flawed, and I can be a CA and have 100 FS in Crahn... i.e. a saviour of Crahn... yet the factional system still says I am hostile.
If they ever make it so factional sympathies ACTUALLY determine standing rather than the color grid, players like you will either be forced to deal with neg SL, forced to RP some, or forced to leave the game. Either way, it works for me.
What cracks me up also is when the "red=dead=rp" players then kill allied factions, also because they are just wanting to kill everything without reason and ignore RP. No handy slogan for describing that though.
Sorry mighty roleplaying god. How dare me roleplay how I want, i'll never do it again. Please forgive me!!!!!
Your place tomorrow for some tea?
You can't equate Neocron to real life.
Comparing CA and TG to Pepsi employees and Coke employees is flawed. Because Coke employees don't kill Pepsi employees. (mostly). If in real life, Coke employees were often known to attack and kill Pepsi employees, then yes the comparison works. You can't compare CA and TG to pepsi and coke because CA and TG are not corperations. One is the government, the other is a terrorist group interested in toppling that government.
You can compare TT and FA to Coke and Pepsi. Does it make sense for them to kill eachother? Maybe, but not really. Yes, killing the other side would decrease their profits and increase yours, but there are much more intriguing and politically correct ways of doing so.
Sorry mighty roleplaying god. How dare me roleplay how I want, i'll never do it again. Please forgive me!!!!!
Your place tomorrow for some tea?Going away for a long weekend, sorry. But enjoy my Neocronicle articles while I'm away, seems they cause more of a stink than Callash's.
Even the most basic human society cannot exist without certain groups of people who in one way or the other strive for power over other people. Neocron and its surrounding regions are no different in this regard. The city's history is stamped by the fights between varying political, industrial, religious and scientific organizations. This struggle for power had not started with the fights between historical figures like Thor and Crahn and it will certainly not end with contemporary conflicts like the one between Neocron's CityAdmin and the rebels of the Twilight Guardian, or the hidden war between the Tsunami Syndicate and the Black Dragon Clan.
No, the battlefields where differing opponents fight for more power over the known world of Neocron are numerous and well populated. The opponents are as mercyless as they are different. From the city's administration and government to the anarchists in the Outzone, from the warring criminal gangs to the massive corporations, from mercenaries out in the wastelands to the religiously fanatic followers of Crahn... all of them ultimately want to claim their place as the most powerful faction of Neocron.
Got this from http://www.neocron.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Guide_Factions&file=index
Please pay close attention to the parts like "opponents are as mercyless as they are different".
You should send an letter to kk or something and tell them they're roleplaying wrong.
Not all 'battlefields' are under the glaring sun along a defensive line, and not all 'fights' require violence.
There are mercyless fighters just like there are mercyless buisnessmen. Why do you think all those homeless folk are homeless? They were laid off to ensure a decent corperate profit.
Power = might? It can be, but money also equals power.
What is put down can be interpreted in many ways, your interpretation suits you - fine, good for you.
What is put down can be interpreted in many ways, your interpretation suits you - fine, good for you.
I'm glad we settled this. Pkers can finally do what they want without all those carebears roleplayers whining that we aren't playing the game right. YAY
edit: Oh and about "There are mercyless fighters just like there are mercyless buisnessmen" that made me laugh. You were desperate to come up with anything weren't you? :lol:
I'm glad we settled this. Pkers can finally do what they want without all those carebears roleplayers whining that we aren't playing the game right. YAYlol
INTERPRETATION! = RIGHT ?
No.
Much like relgion where differing groups segmented due to different interpretations of history and their manuscripts... The playerbase here is segmented.
Unlike relgion though, firm rules could be put in place here which would leave no room for interpretation... It's solely up to KK to decide whether or not to add them or not.
edit: Oh and about "There are mercyless fighters just like there are mercyless buisnessmen" that made me laugh. You were desperate to come up with anything weren't you?
Nope, I play Leo Frankowski, a full tradeksill spy... While I had -100 SL, I also had 120 million credits at my disposal. If someone gave me trouble, I hired people to give them trouble.
I was a business man, I had no combat skills, yet my will was still imposed on others.
Much like relgion where differing groups segmented due to different interpretations of history and their manuscripts... The playerbase here is segmented.
Yea people in this game are different. So why is it so hard for some people to understand that some peopel want to play different ways?
Yea people in this game are different. So why is it so hard for some people to understand that some peopel want to play different ways?
You may play in a way where you like to kill lil' newbies, but does the lil' newbie play in such a way where they enjoy getting killed by people they can't even put a dent in?
The material that potential players can look at ranges from old, to very old - I'll blame that on KK folk too, but a little bit of common courtesy eliminates this problem all together.
Where's the fun in killing a person you know can't win? There's no challange, there's no need to kill them, and there's no benefit from killing them.
So since there's no need, and no benefit... Why do it?
I've killed low level players as Julia Chambers (you have to understand she is somewhat eccentric-sociopathic). It is nothing personal. Julia is almost the complete opposite compared to Archeus (Simon that is).
But with a sociopath, prey are just objects. They don't see them as people. A lot of players who play this type of character are well adjusted people in real life. I am certainly not sociopathic. ^_^
The problem is that some people can't roleplay. They see thier characters as extentions of themselves and get upset when people can't be empathic to each other.
The other extreme is the hard-core RP'ers who get upset when people don't roleplay in the context they believe of the game.
Once you realise that dying is rarely fatal in game then the other players simply don't bother you.
Alpha-Omega
25-05-04, 23:30
I don't PK. I PvP, duel etc, but i wont go around looking to wax some poor drip who took his LE out cause someone told him he gets more xp that way (cant believe some people still believe that). if some baby runner comes up n starts punching me i will leave him to it or punch him back, if he starts damaging my armor heavily tho i'll slam a clip of ammo or my claw through his skull after asking him to stop.
I have one unwritten rule i abide by, i wont intentionally kill a female runner in cold blood or even in a duel unless someone can rezz them or they expressly give me permission an absolve me from this tie for that fight. I dont like hurting women, hurting them makes me feel lower than the shit on your boots.
Oh, an and at Archaeus, i do bring my owm persona in with my characters but i dont have a problem with someone who wants to TRULY play a killer, just the people who say they are rping a mass-murderer or a maniac, just so they can kill everyone in sight.
You can't compare CA and TG to pepsi and coke because CA and TG are not corperations. One is the government, the other is a terrorist group interested in toppling that government.
Correct. Thus it makes perfect sense for CA and TG to openly fight each other. The same can also be applied to BD vs TS, two rival gangs competing for territory in a lawless region. CM vs TG, and CM vs BD, given that CM are currently in the employ of CA.
You can compare TT and FA to Coke and Pepsi. Does it make sense for them to kill eachother? Maybe, but not really. Yes, killing the other side would decrease their profits and increase yours, but there are much more intriguing and politically correct ways of doing so.
I disagree here. TT and BT are Pepsi and Coke. FA aren't part of the same society though, they keep to themselves in TH. They harbour the TG terrorists, have ties to DoY, and they poach TT scientists. Considering there are no repercussions for doing so, it makes perfect sense for the TT directors to allow their runners to actively engage FA on sight. Look at Microsoft. They currently do everything legally possible, twisting laws and exploiting loopholes, in order to bully their opposition and force them out out of competition. The only thing stopping Microsoft from using more underhanded tactics is the law. Suppose Microsoft would not be punished for planting bombs in the offices of rival companies or hacking their computers, or even killing their employees. I would not be surprised to find them taking advantage of this.
This in mind, open conflict between TT and BT doesn't, and never has made sense. BDoY will fix this, though already most BT and TT clans do not fight each other often.
I disagree here. TT and BT are Pepsi and Coke. FA aren't part of the same society though, they keep to themselves in TH. They harbour the TG terrorists, have ties to DoY, and they poach TT scientists. Considering there are no repercussions for doing so, it makes perfect sense for the TT directors to allow their runners to actively engage FA on sight. Look at Microsoft. They currently do everything legally possible, twisting laws and exploiting loopholes, in order to bully their opposition and force them out out of competition. The only thing stopping Microsoft from using more underhanded tactics is the law. Suppose Microsoft would not be punished for planting bombs in the offices of rival companies or hacking their computers, or even killing their employees. I would not be surprised to find them taking advantage of this.
I stand corrected :)
Eledhbrant
26-05-04, 01:15
As for killing allies. I am a Black Dragon, not some Fallen Angel scientist, I kill whoever I please, and I dont need to justify it. If I dont like you, I dont care what faction you are in, you will die. Im even at war with another BD clan I dislike. ;)
This should be FRAMED and put up for all to see! FINALLY SOMEONE GETS IT! Why dont some people get that you killed them because you dont like them? Especially bloody protopharms who you KNOW are in the faction just to level and will probably be enemy to you soon DM you and bitch with crap like "How dare you kill an allied faction"
As for killing allies. I am a Black Dragon, not some Fallen Angel scientist, I kill whoever I please, and I dont need to justify it. If I dont like you, I dont care what faction you are in, you will die. Im even at war with another BD clan I dislike.
hehe, indeed.. I don't know why even ppl bother to ask why pk; just cuz, why u all asking about it.. I get bored, I get me pk char, i go pk, i don't look at ranks nor factions for that matter i get to -14 i go do missions. Sertain faction i pk cuz i don't like them. It's simple as 1,2,3 i c, i don't like, i pk :D
Jest: Unfortuanetly as a PPU if you hang around to long, people will bring an army to wipe you out. In all my time as a PPU I can only recall a few times I was attacked by less then 2 people. Most often that woulda been early on before people knew much about ppu's. All in all, being nice as a PPU is very heavily punished. People wonder why ppu's become vindictive and spam parashock, well its because if we don't then we get ganked. I can't count how many times I stood aside and let people fight on their own only to have the winner materialize a ppu and apu then have all 3 come after me.
A little OT, but oh well : )
This should be FRAMED and put up for all to see! FINALLY SOMEONE GETS IT! Why dont some people get that you killed them because you dont like them? Especially bloody protopharms who you KNOW are in the faction just to level and will probably be enemy to you soon DM you and bitch with crap like "How dare you kill an allied faction"Hey, thats fine.
But everything you say supports RP and is against mindless "red=dead" justification.
You not liking someone is a HELLUVA better reason than "you are red on my screen. I dont have the ability to process anything else, so I react to color." Not liking someone at least means you put thought into whether you like them or not.
That is much better than the "red=dead."
So I am not sure if you thought you were siding with "red=dead is legit" or against it... but that goes against it.
And Pete- you PKers are so cute when you try to pretend you are RPing, and then when its point out you arent, you pull that having tea line. Yeah, I guess having an in-game, in-character reason for killing that particular runner means I sit around drinking tea in game. Thats so cute. :p
Yeah, I guess having an in-game, in-character reason for killing that particular runner means I sit around drinking tea in game. Thats so cute. :p
www.dictionary.com is your friend.
rea·son ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rzn)
n.
The basis or motive for an action, decision, or conviction. See Usage Note at because. See Usage Note at why.
If you kill someone becuase they're red then you do have a reason. You killed them becuase they were red. Now before you go using these big words know what they mean.
Shadow Dancer
26-05-04, 05:00
People wonder why ppu's become vindictive and spam parashock, well its because if we don't then we get ganked.
The sword cuts both ways. ;)
www.dictionary.com (http://www.dictionary.com/) is your friend.
rea·son ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rzn)
n.
The basis or motive for an action, decision, or conviction. See Usage Note at because. See Usage Note at why.
If you kill someone becuase they're red then you do have a reason. You killed them becuase they were red. Now before you go using these big words know what they mean.Lets not pretend that all PKers only kill people red to them.
:rolleyes:
Sure, red = dead is fine enough reason for some... I won't argue with that. Only way to prevent abuse of that is to change the system, and while that might happen with DoY, *shrug* my hopes aren't up.
I hate it when people have all different named alts in all kinds of factions.
It's ok if they rp them in different ways, but you kill someon and all of a sudden you have 3 other chars (or more) which you've never seen or heard of that kill you anytime they can.
I like to keep my alts names the same Just because i'm not that much into roleplaying (yet).
Funny though, even when i'm not templars anymore people still kill me cuz i used to be, CM, TSS, Crahn, hell even PP.
It's gone to the point where i'm getting paranoid of every runner :-)
KK doesnt want mob killers "why are there only 5 of them for capped players??!??!?!?!?!?"
SO this game is _about_ killing all you can see if you can´t take it leave like all the others O_o
Nice. Lets kill every player so they never come back and you can have the server to yourself eh
If you are thinking of purchasing this game i would think twice about it.
During most of this game you can't join a clan or participate properly coz you have le chip in.
If you decide to take chip out to participate in the game. You will get constantly ganked at genreps. As someone that is such a high lvl camps the genreps kills you everytime you want to genrep somewhere. This can make the game virtually unplayed some nights. Apart from sitting plaza 2 all night.
Very disappointed in a game that could have been very good. But is being destroyed by petty people that stop you playing the game.
KK would very nice if you could be bothered to help out the game when you get tossers that do this.
Hmmm i remember once on Uranus This was great some CA types ambushed a apu freind of mine while he was driving a noob. of course they kill the noob but my apu freind gets away. Needless to say we wouldnt let that go unanswered. Even though theres like 2 tanks 3 pes 2apus and a ppu.
Me as a ppu and 2 freinds as apus. The noob wants to come as well.
Ceres we top the hill outside and find ourselves in the middle of em. Unbuffed apus die VERY quickly :p The realy great thing was the noob the whole time was running around Yelling DIE BITCHES Shooting everybody with the poison nailgun we got him :lol:.
And the point ?
The first way isnt a fight its an example of people with minority complexes.
The second one was great because there was a real fight.
www.dictionary.com is your friend.
rea·son ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rzn)
n.
The basis or motive for an action, decision, or conviction. See Usage Note at because. See Usage Note at why.
If you kill someone becuase they're red then you do have a reason. You killed them becuase they were red. Now before you go using these big words know what they mean.Your cuteness has no bounds.
So what if you are allied with that clan, do you still kill everyone in the allied clan because they are red?
I notice you didnt mention the second and third listed definitions on that page:
2. A declaration made to explain or justify action, decision, or conviction
3. An underlying fact or cause that provides logical sense for a premise or occurrence
red=dead is a blanket excuse to ignore actually having a RP reason for killing someone.
If your reason is "they are red" then I assume you kill EVERY red you come across, regardless of who they are, and you NEVER kill non-red, correct?
Cause if you DID that, then I would buy red=dead as a reason.
Nice. Lets kill every player so they never come back and you can have the server to yourself eh Zaq that is an almost totally unrealistic example. Do you know how many times Ive been GR killed this entire year? Like, twice maybe. That example doesn't show why we shouldn't kill people, that example shows that as veteran players we aren't doing our role to educate the new players. Personally, Id rather a hard core player killer who helps new players when he can, over some one that does no PvP and keeps to himself. The first is by far the more beneficial to the server.
I'd like to take this thread in a new direction and say, why aren't people helping new players? Ignoring a newb is 100 times worse than pking him in the sewers imo. Getting pked is not usually what players leave over. What they leave from is a lack of education from vets, a lack of knowledge of the good places to hunt free from enemies. Show them around, teach them some hints from the game, offer your tradeskills for free, help them hook up with a group of players in their faction, help them with their setup, even if you've just pked them. ;) Don't just assume because some one is high level that they arent still a newb. :p
I'd like to take this thread in a new direction and say, why aren't people helping new players? Ignoring a newb is 100 times worse than pking him in the sewers imo. Getting pked is not usually what players leave over. What they leave from is a lack of education from vets, a lack of knowledge of the good places to hunt free from enemies. Show them around, teach them some hints from the game, offer your tradeskills for free, help them hook up with a group of players in their faction, help them with their setup, even if you've just pked them. ;) Don't just assume because some one is high level that they arent still a newb. :pPeople PK/grief noobs for the same reasons that alot of people can't be assed to assist them. General lack of consideration and empathy with their fellow players.
On each server there are core cadres who do help those new players but the number of them, like the population in general, gets smaller as time progresses.
Zaq that is an almost totally unrealistic example. Do you know how many times Ive been GR killed this entire year?
Which server?
My experience: On saturn it happens alot, uranus not as much, pluto - hardly at all since noones on, jupiter - sometimes. Venus? only once or twice.
In my experience of Saturn it happens very irreguarly.
In my experience of Saturn it happens very irreguarly.
It all depends on who's near you when you come through the GR. While that goes for all servers, mix saturns increased player numbers and large block of populace who enjoys killing things just for the sake of it... And the probability of your demise increases.
:lol:
Hi Jest
judging from the numerous posts by PKers in this thread, I would argue that it is not unrealistic at all.
anyway I didn't quote that nub to bring up GR killing, it was just relevant to the conversation. Especially with all the moaning about low poulations recently.
This should be FRAMED and put up for all to see! FINALLY SOMEONE GETS IT! Why dont some people get that you killed them because you dont like them? Especially bloody protopharms who you KNOW are in the faction just to level and will probably be enemy to you soon DM you and bitch with crap like "How dare you kill an allied faction"
Exactly. We are BD because we like to kill people... BD are criminals, they kill who they want, when they want. I total agree with eled on the proto killing.... they are really another faction in disguise, just trying to level peacefully and get pp chip... and peaceful leveling will not be tolerated.
Haven't even read all this thread,
: pshychopathic killing. the police'll get me soon :
Zaq, the example you quoted is just silly. If you want the solo lifestyle and avoid being pk'd then you keep your le in. If you take it out then you accept being killed. That doesn't mean you hafta bend over and take it. Talk to other players, make friends, join a clan. Most clans will gladly come to your aid if you're being killed. Even if you don't join a clan, you can talk to people. You can make contacts with stronger players and ask them for help.
Neocron: "You'll never die alone." I believe that's the main caption on the game's box. You're not alone, nor should you be expected to do everything yourself. The player you quoted must not have attempted to socialize or interact with others. He kept to himself, got mad, and quit. As far as the game is concerned, we don't need players like that.
red=dead is a blanket excuse to ignore actually having a RP reason for killing someone.
Are you stupid? Killing someone becuase they're red is a fucking rping reason. People that are red are fucking red for a reason. Becuase they are enemies of your faction. If you want to make up your own story to the damn game and be best friends with people that are in en enemy faction fine I don't give a fuck. But stop fucking questioning people that want to play this game like it's suppose to be played.
Zu (Pluto)
26-05-04, 20:32
Red = Dead is not something I agree with personally, but why is it not a perfectly valid reason to PK? You can scream "it's not RP" but if it isn't the player would be running around killing people in RL. Ultimately, if a PKer choose to kill it is for (in their opinion) a perfectly valid reason. They don't need to justify it or even explain it. The PKer owes the victim nothing. Death is a perfectly "reasonable" risk of the game. If you don't like that risk, you can keep your LE in and still be sociable and hang out with friends/clans. You can even stick to low-risk zones and virtually never see a PKer at all.
What I do have a problem with is people who grief the same character(s) repeatedly (you've killed them so you've made your point - no need to ruin someone else's fun), and people who use the game implementation to kill people (like the hiding behind a zoning line so you're behind them), etc. That just flies against the spirit of the game for me.
Ultimately - do what you will providing you are not out to stop someone else from having fun. And yes, that means some comprimises have to be made here and there (like sparing absolute newbies, and having safezones, and just let people kill whoever they like, etc).
For what it's worth...
Zu
Sigh people still arguing in this thread the thread starter asked for the reasons the pkers gave them yet the anti pkers still whine.
I Don't have that 4 slot all artifact libby to hunt mobs with I don't goto MB to stand and have a fucking chat . I'm not a roleplayer I just play the game for fun and killing people ingame is fun why can't you anti pk people just fucking STFU. I tell you what takes the piss I killed a high level droner a while back he DM'd me with " Wow that must have taking alot of skill to kill a droner with no resists " OMFG give me a fucking break you anti pvp people whine when we kill you even if your capped.
You see, its the swearing that sucks.
You can atleast talk polite.
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