It's a spy's life [Idea, Tools]

[Q`alooaith]

The spy, sound's a like a fun class, it fill's your head with though';s of gadget's and tool's and so on all very techy and sneaky..

Get into the game, ahh high end weapons, ohhh stealth tools.. what else?
...
..
oh


Now here's my idea's to change that from a short list of tool's to a larger selection of gadgets and doo daa's that'd make James bond green with envy..


First off, these idea's are meant to be one off blast that does one task pretty well but can be avoided counter acted if prepared.. with that in mind read on.

All these tool's req's would be Tech combat unless otherwise stated.



Stuntrap,
Well basicaly a device used on the quickbelt, once used it'd drop a mini stuntrap turret not allied to the player, now being a moblie unit it's power would drain quickly (it'd lose health constantly untill it blew itself up, about 30 or so seconds of time). Basicaly a turret to drop so you can carry on running away/delay chasers.

Pros; quickly stun's anyone chasing you so you can get away
Cons; only last's a short time, will stun you too if you get too close


Medical nanites,
Basicaly retooled remoted repair nanites for healing other runners, these nanites need carful control to heal a person so can only be used on other runners..

Pros; a tech healing method more effective than medikits
Cons; can only be used on others, uses "ammo" to heal.


Anti Psi nanites,
The name is missleading as they don't protech aganist psi attack's at all, but have another much more sinister use, they psi shield's and healing from forming on the target for a limited time, they do not remove shield's or stop healing but mearly prevent it for a time.. (last's about 15-30 seconds)

Pros; cut's the target off from Psi healing and defences for a time
Cons; Does not remove Psi healing or defences, uses ammo, requires close contact (melee range), short duration



Attack nanites,
Again a missleading name, but only slightly, these nanites would cause the target to suffer a short term loss of concentration and grose motor skills.
The target's athletics, weaponlore and Psi use would be reduced by 50 for 20 seconds, this would not stack with itself.

Pros; Allow's you to outrun the target, makes the target less likley to hit you with weapons
Cons; Short duration, uses ammo, requires close contact




Ok that's all I can think of for now, might think up some more spy type toy's later feel free to add your own ideas.

[trigger hurt]

Not a bad set of ideas. I dont really like the stun trap idea though...could be dangerous in the right situation...

picture it...fighting at an op or in a group. spy stealths in, un-stealths and pops out 2 or 3 of these things. Now you have a spy with a para barrel running around.

For the medical nanites, I would want to make it where the target has to be stationary for a few seconds for the nanites to take effect, but once activated, they healing continues until the effect wears off. That way, you dont have a spy running around, healing people left and right.

No reason the change the others.

Wish somethings like this would be implemented for spies...but I know KK isnt listening.

[Q`alooaith]

Not a bad set of ideas. I dont really like the stun trap idea though...could be dangerous in the right situation...

picture it...fighting at an op or in a group. spy stealths in, un-stealths and pops out 2 or 3 of these things. Now you have a spy with a para barrel running around.


No, that'd not happen because..


The stuntrap's would only last a short time, they'd drop on the ground when used, and look like the turret of the same name..

But They would not be allied or freindly the the spy who dropped them, so the spy could run in and stun everyone, but would also be in a position to be stunned by his own droppings..

The medical nanites I was thinking more along the lines of healing while hold clicking, so you'd hold click over somone and they'd heal only so long as you held click at them.. or somthing like that..




........Wish somethings like this would be implemented for spies...but I know KK isnt listening
I disslike that attitude, it's all the negativity that stifles creatiuve thought, I mean there used to be lot's of great idea's floating around, and people shot them down and the people dreaming the idea's up with word's like "it'll never happen" and "the dev's have better thing's to do"

Take a look at recent event's and thing's that are filtering though, some idea's that people had on these forum's are comming into the game, it can happen it has happened and it will happen as long as there's a will for change and the dev's think it's a good idea that will not take up year's of time or need a total rework...

[Strych9]

Wish somethings like this would be implemented for spies...but I know KK isnt listening.LOL. You must be one of the ones that hasnt read the TS patch notes I guess? If I wasnt so tired, I could spend 2 minutes and link you to threads in the forum RECENTLY that ask for the EXACT changes in the patch notes.

Yeah, KK never listens. I guess they just get lucky.

[trigger hurt]

LOL. You must be one of the ones that hasnt read the TS patch notes I guess? If I wasnt so tired, I could spend 2 minutes and link you to threads in the forum RECENTLY that ask for the EXACT changes in the patch notes.

Yeah, KK never listens. I guess they just get lucky.
I'm speaking totally on past experiences. Great, they added a new feature someone was asking for...but what about the 3 or 4 other bugs they introduced with those additions? Where is the CONTENT we have been begging for since we capped our chars 2 months after retail release?

I'll tell you where it is. It's been pushed back to Sept 1st, or there abouts. I don't read test server patch notes anymore for the reason that when I do, i'm only bummed out when things arent brought in that I was really hoping for...and things that are brought in that I could care less about.

Dislike my attitude all you want. That's fine. But it is not what is stiffling the creativity around it. The burden of that weighs on the shoulders of the people who watched long time players ask for things, see them not get done over and over again and finally, those same players leave, taking a large chunk of the community with them. No, the server populations are not going up...they are not stabalized..they are still dropping. Whether you are blind to that or not...the reason ideas don't flow smoothly around is because people are not contributing. They aren't contributing because they are gone. They are gone because they dont like being ignored...repeatedly.

Example: How long has retail been out? And of that time, how long have they had a problem with client stability? server stability? lag? client being a system resource hog?

Remember, before you answer...KK told us to stop sending them the callstack logs not long after retail release. Not only that, but one of the planfiles that was released by Martin stated, they would spend some time working out balance and would then squash the show stopping bugs. Well, the game still isnt balanced in many aspects and those show stoppers are still there.


But They would not be allied or freindly the the spy who dropped them, so the spy could run in and stun everyone, but would also be in a position to be stunned by his own droppings..
It wouldnt matter if the spy was stunned or not. He can restealth, thus rendering everything but barrels and aoe useless...and we know what happens when you shoot your feet repeatedly. Or, he could just run (slowly) out. The stuns would be just enough time to sway the advantage of holding an outpost and being inside of it to the other side. If everyone inside the op is slowed down, even for just 30 seconds, that's alot of time in Neocron.

[Shadow Dancer]

Unbelievable. KK has proven time and time again they do listen. Just because they don't do EVERYTHING we want, doesn't mean they don't listen. o_O

[naimex]

I think you should try, and play the spy class..


really play it..


I have one of each char class, and I´ve played almost all sorts of chars...

the spy class is a fun class to play.
they dont need all sorts of gadgets and shit..

[Zaq]

spyies are getting holovest and Hacknet in bdoy, do they need any more, really? :)

[Freaky Fryd]

The medical nanites I was thinking more along the lines of healing while hold clicking, so you'd hold click over somone and they'd heal only so long as you held click at them.. or somthing like that..

I really dig that idea!
Just make sure that it's disabled while stealth is engaged...
:p
*starts obliterator*

[Q`alooaith]

It wouldnt matter if the spy was stunned or not. He can restealth, thus rendering everything but barrels and aoe useless...and we know what happens when you shoot your feet repeatedly. Or, he could just run (slowly) out. The stuns would be just enough time to sway the advantage of holding an outpost and being inside of it to the other side. If everyone inside the op is slowed down, even for just 30 seconds, that's alot of time in Neocron.
If that's how you feel you've realy missed the point.


If a spy is risking his neck going out to drop stunner's to hold up and attacking force, giveing the defending team a chance to take advantage then more power to him.

The whole point of these idea's is to give spy's extra little bit's and peices, most of them high risk to use fully, but rewarding if pulled off.


Also note, that the team getting stunned could simply shoot at the Stunner killing it off even faster.




I really dig that idea!
Just make sure that it's disabled while stealth is engaged...
:p
*starts obliterator*


Ok, I blame myself for the oversight..

All these tool's and trick's would require the spy to be out of stealth, aka visible.

[ezza]

allway though something like a scanner for spies would be cool, able to detect people in the zone over a certain radius

[winnoc]

I play my spy a lot, and i'm not for all these gadgets, we're gonna get the holovests (kinda useless with you name and faction still showing but whatever) we get hacknet, and we get to fly the gliders when they get out.
Plus now we're the only ones able to stealth, sounds like we have more things to do in teams and op wars in the future.

[Carinth]

I'm strongly in favor of Spies being the Gadget/Tool/Tech masters. They shouldn't realy be using many guns, at most the sniper rifles. A big problem with pvp balance right now is that everyone uses Guns and fights in mostly the same way. Unbalanced Monks aside, under current pvp conditions a Tank should win hands down. They're the masters of close/mid ranged combat. Tanks aren't even disadvantaged much by range, due to runspeeds. They can make nearly any fight end up being close ranged, at which they excel. I think spies should stop trying to compete in the Tank's domain and work on what they're good at. When you think about it, a spy is very similar to a monk. Both have frail bodies and rely on some special ability to let them compete with normal humans. Monks use psi, Spies should use tech.

As to what gadgets spies should have, there are tons of very cool ideas. I like most of you ideas, Q`alooaith, but I'm not to happy bout using nanites so much. Anarchy Online makes extensive use of nanites to form their magic class, I would rather not have Neocron look like AO.

A few ideas of mine:
1) Temporary force field, much like what you can place in Unreal2. Place a barrier that can be shot down with enough damage and/or that fades over time. This would be used to enhance the crappy defenses of most ops. Namely the large frickin holes in the fence : )
2) Smaller/weaker deployable turrets that don't need to be at an op.
3) Manual op turrets a spy can hop in and help defend the place.
4) An array of grenades for dif purposes, like flash/smokescreen, some aoe types, emp, etc.

On a more general level, I thought it'd be interesting if spies had subclasses like Medic and Engineer. A Medic would be more or less like a ppu, of course not a mirror image with identical abilities. But they'd have similar abilities. The important thing here is that having two classes to pick from for the support cleric role would greatly reduce many of the ppu's problems. Engineers would specialize in turrets and other deployable devices. Other specializations could be more offensively oriented, like a spec ops character. Rely on stealth and small high tech gadgets to do lots of damage.

[Clownst0pper]

Someone tell me what holovests are again, as atm there just a useless piece of junk or am I thinking of an ingenious piece of armour which not only reduces ur speed to nothing, but criples ur dexterity so u can never use a weapon without gimping urself.

My memory is shot ;) :rolleyes:

[Marx]

Give spies more tools... fine.

if

You cap their combat abilities. Say max of 125 pistol/rifle. This way yes, they have these amazingly interesting and technical material, and yes they will actually need to use it.

:p

[plague]

very nice ideas i like them all, too bad kk dont listen and will never implement them :( oh well maby there will be more funn tools in doy lets hope...

[Strych9]

I'm strongly in favor of Spies being the Gadget/Tool/Tech masters. They shouldn't realy be using many guns, at most the sniper rifles. A big problem with pvp balance right now is that everyone uses Guns and fights in mostly the same way. Unbalanced Monks aside, under current pvp conditions a Tank should win hands down. They're the masters of close/mid ranged combat. Tanks aren't even disadvantaged much by range, due to runspeeds. They can make nearly any fight end up being close ranged, at which they excel. I think spies should stop trying to compete in the Tank's domain and work on what they're good at. When you think about it, a spy is very similar to a monk. Both have frail bodies and rely on some special ability to let them compete with normal humans. Monks use psi, Spies should use tech.Agree 1000%.

However, I think the community would have a hard time adjusting to this. To a LOT of people, balance means "going 1v1 toe to toe in PvP" rather than incorporating other aspects or roles in the game. You will get people yelling that dumb "this is a PvP game" mantra as if it still means anything. This is already painfully obvious, in my mind, with the PPU. People still want to see the PPU as a combat role and get pissed they cannot defeat one 1v1 easily, instead of seeing the PPU as a support role that everyone in their right mind would want to use anyway.

If the general idea of balance could be modified to fit things like what you suggest, I think the potential of the game would be a lot greater.

[Q`alooaith]

I've tryed to ballence the idea's, so they have some battle merit..


But you try and come up with idea's on this forum, thing's that are not kill kill squish squish..

I mean you say anti PPU device and peopel scream there are enough way's to kill a PPU, even if it's not able to kill the PPU, but rather prevent the PPU from supporting everyone as effectivly..

[Clive tombstone]

I dunno If this is off topic but...


Take a look at recent event's and thing's that are filtering though, some idea's that people had on these forum's are comming into the game, it can happen it has happened and it will happen as long as there's a will for change and the dev's think it's a good idea that will not take up year's of time or need a total rework...

Do you think My Artillary vehicle will have a chance in the eyes Of KK? Im asking for a god-honest opinion, I mean, Ive been asking for public ideas, what people want, having the community have a part in the design, and drawing up a proper blueprint (as we speak)

long story short, whats my odds?