View Full Version : Computer Update Time
Whitestuff
18-04-04, 20:51
I have a rather bothersome problem, burning in the back of my brain.
This summer, I plan to build a new computer using parts out of the 3 up to date machins I have plus a new case, mb, processor, ram, etc etc.....
Here's my problem: I don't know what to base my system on, either AMD or Intel? I have built 2 AMD systems and have been very satisfied by their performance versus my friend's Intel systsms of 2x the clock rate. However, the idea of hyperthreading technology has me intigued. So I ask, what would you do? That's the question in my poll, but I have another question too.
Should I go Linux or Windows? How hard is it to get games running ( Neocron [not for too much longer tho], UT2k4, Farcry, etc etc..) in Linux? I was going to use the free one because I don't feel like battling the FBI for the right to activate my windows xp on two machines and I would also like to switch it up. I have never used Linux b4, save one time I installed it on my friend's comp and we couldn't figure out how to getthe GUI to start again once we restarted the box (fixed that now of course...)
So any input is nice.
Whitestuff
18-04-04, 21:18
Thanks for your responses.
Any comments on Linux? Or should I just fork out the $90 for XP again?
Well, if you had trouble with "startx" for Linux, then, try Knoppix, see if you can get into it before you install it (took me 3 weeks and several installs to just get my ADSL up and running on Linux).
As for CPU, the Intel P4EE is apparently the best, the extreme edition or something silly.
/edit Unreal 2004 is on the DVD too apparently, but game wise, Windows > Linux always, coz geeks dont play puter games /me hides
Whitestuff
18-04-04, 21:31
Well, if you had trouble with "startx" for Linux, then, try Knoppix, see if you can get into it before you install it (took me 3 weeks and several installs to just get my ADSL up and running on Linux).
Yes, having only used DOS b4, seeing that Linux loading prompt frightened me. You actually should have seen it, me typing in DOS commands and getting back "invalid command". The thing was, I was fully aware that it was Linux, my brain just wouldn't let me type in the correct commands.....
aye, i got telnet/ssh access to my web hosts cgi server, recently they upgraded the whole thing to freebsd, no more dir command, which sucks, gotta use ls instead. Most good things in Linux though are command based, though it is getting easier.
For those that are telling you to get the AMD 64 btw, ignore them, you need a 64BIT OS to get anything out of it, which so far includes a few Linux distro's, and in the future, Windows will release one (the older ones are based on Intel's 64bit XEON n stuff like dat). The 32bit part of the AMD dont compare toward performance of the true 32bit's
Get a AMD 64 FX 51 > all.
Get 1gb DDR 400.
Get a next gen gfx card and you have a super computer.
Don't touch intels HT.... it saturates the cache with instructions and SLOWS DOWN non HT aware apps.
HT can also cause a lot of IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL BSODs in windoze.
Oh, and wait for PCI Express :D
PCI isnt that much faster than the first batch of super gfx cards really...i think the 6800U is something like 3.6gb/sec and PCI is 4gb/sec plus you need a new motherboard that supports them so it will probably end up costing about £500 to upgrade a gfx card here in UK because new mobo's wont come cheap.
You'll get this thread closed talking like that lol, like mods are honest and abide by laws. :rolleyes:
You'll get this thread closed talking like that lol, like mods are honest and abide by laws. :rolleyes:
i didn't say that i actually did it...
aye, i got telnet/ssh access to my web hosts cgi server, recently they upgraded the whole thing to freebsd, no more dir command, which sucks, gotta use ls instead.
try
alias "dir"=ls
if you like it, just type
echo alias "dir"=ls >> ~/.bashrc
have fun with dir :p
nah, ls is ok for me really, its just a lot easier to chmod a bunch of files thru telnet than thru ftp client, that and rm -rf = pwnz
AMD all the way. Even though I'm still not convinced of the bang/buck on AMD64 at the moment there is no doubt Intel are losing big-time currently.
Whitestuff
19-04-04, 08:42
Well I wanted to build an Intel based system, but I am not forking out big bucks for a EE Pentium 4. Screw that, I can't afford it.
@Jernau - I know AMD is pretty good. I have 2 AMD systems and they still run all the current games and apps at top speed. I can't really throw anything at them that stops them. I really wanted to see what an Intel would do. But with the suggestions, I am now leaning toward AMD again....
Does windows XP support the 64 bit technology tho? I didn't think it was available yet.. Maybe I am wrong?
xp 64 is currently in beta afaik (i could be wrong on that point, i havnt checked), mdk has a 64 bit version freely available. if you need advice on *nix talk to me on msn, im more than happy to pass on my limited knowlage :)
There is a 64-bit build of 2003 Server available which may be OK for a gaming box. I've not tried it myself but 2000 Server was in many ways a better workstation than the Pro version.
wrt Linux - I wouldn't recommend it on a home system unless you are very familiar with it. Whatever it's proponents may say it is not "ready for the desktop". Games in particular will give you many problems.
There is a 64-bit build of 2003 Server available which may be OK for a gaming box. I've not tried it myself but 2000 Server was in many ways a better workstation than the Pro version.
wrt Linux - I wouldn't recommend it on a home system unless you are very familiar with it. Whatever it's proponents may say it is not "ready for the desktop". Games in particular will give you many problems.
i think there is a 64 bit version of xp comming, i wouldent advise 2003 for anything but a server system, i have tryed it and it aint good for normal use!
@linux, i agree, i wouldent advise it tbh, if you pick the right distro and start useing it only as a second operating system who knows where it will lead :D
Yeah, there is an XP64 beta in my MSDN pack I think.
Fair enough wrt 2003 Server. They have diverged the product lines a lot more now.
/me looks around cd's laying everywhere... aye, i got the 64bit version of 2003 server, but it was made long before AMD 64, so its instruction set is geared towards XEON 64 (wont run 32bit apps at all either)
/me looks around cd's laying everywhere... aye, i got the 64bit version of 2003 server, but it was made long before AMD 64, so its instruction set is geared towards XEON 64 (wont run 32bit apps at all either)
You'd be surprised. MS have told Intel they will only support the AMD64 instruction set and that Intel have to stop fecking about and fall in line. I'm not sure whether that was before or after the AMD64 launch but as there are no viable 64bit chips from Intel yet it's possible it will work. Tbh I haven't looked into it to much, let alone tested it so don't hold me to that.
from what I heard... *looks around*... intel are designing a 64bit chip... but.... someone checked it out a fair bit.... and... it contained a heck of a lot of AMD64 instruction sets, copied straight from the AMD chip... but dont quote me on that ;)
from what I heard... *looks around*... intel are designing a 64bit chip... but.... someone checked it out a fair bit.... and... it contained a heck of a lot of AMD64 instruction sets, copied straight from the AMD chip... but dont quote me on that ;)
oops sorry :P
if true would make a nice change for amd to be the leader in the industry not playing catch up :)
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/04/07/intel_64bit/
I can't find the article about MS basically ordering them to do this but I know I've posted it on here before so maybe you can dredge it up.
From what I read, the P4Extreme, is an Xeon with P4Extreme stuck on it. It did however trash AMD's 64FX and err, the other one, in most benchmarks. Thing is, dya really want a 64bit processor at the moment? I dont, cant imagine never playing Transport Tycoon again :(
From what I read, the P4Extreme, is an Xeon with P4Extreme stuck on it. It did however trash AMD's 64FX and err, the other one, in most benchmarks. Thing is, dya really want a 64bit processor at the moment? I dont, cant imagine never playing Transport Tycoon again :(
P4EE (emergency edition as it's usually known) was a desperation move by Intel when the AMD64 came out as advertised. It isn't anywhere near as fast though although Intel tried to use the old dodgo-benchmark tactics to claim it was at first they got slammed very very hard for that once people started testing it properly.
Personally I'm not interested in moving to a 64bit platform when there aren't even any OSes I'd consider running on it available yet let alone any apps.
Scarily enough I'm playing TT right now. :)
TT still rules, in a world of 3GB games, needing 512MB ram and 64MB VGA, a little game, 11MB big, can still rule the world. Hopefully Sawyer will get off his ass and make a sequel to it one day, though iirc some fans are making 3D versions and stuff like that, but I dunno, Sawyer got a way with games that just makes them so darn addictive.
I thought they dropped the Transport Tycoon line to make Railroad Tycoon 2 and 3.
rail road any good? I got the original here somewhere, but, it looked nothing like the uber sexy VGA graphics of transport tycoon deluxe
The first one was OK at the time but Transport was miles better. I never tried 2 or 3 but I was round at a mates house yesterday and he had 3 (hence why I loaded TTD up today) and he said it was OK but had replaced gameplay with flashy 3D whizz-bangs. Pretty much normal for sequels to truly great games unfortunately. I may still try it sometime just to see for myself.
I know Lucjan's got RT 3, mite have to beat him up for his side of the gameplay too. But, really, I dont think anything can ever replace transport tycoon, it just had everything, and unlike some classic games, still stands the test of time, its, luvly
Aye, nearly 10 years old and people still modding it. Always a good sign.
Only problem at the moment is my save-games from the DOS version won't work in the abandonware 2K-patched version I DLed last night and my "old-games PC" is in storage.
2k patched? I've not had problems runnin TT on XP Pro O_o
WRT Transport Tycoon, Sawyer is apparently working on a spiritual sequel called Locomotion.
At least, that's what I saw posted on gamespot about a month ago; interview in which he mentioned that.
IIRC from what it said it's going to be a 2D game again too, but a bit hazy whether or not he really said that... I'll try and find a link to the article.
And here's the article. (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/04/02/news_6092788.html)
omg, screenshots look true to form, wasnt posted april first was it?
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2004/news/04/02/locomotion_screen003.jpg
2k patched? I've not had problems runnin TT on XP Pro O_o
I wasn't aware of it until today. I know I've run my old install under 2K before now but it wouldn't work this time for some reason so I googled and there it was.
That screenie looks like there is hope for a decent sequel :).
apparently, he is also going to be making the AI better, due to puters having more than 512k of RAM these days :D Still, i do have my doubts, when we buy a new game these days, we really expect wonderful DX9 graphics, vertex shading or whatever, can a 3D isometric view, really beat a up to date true 3D engine?
apparently, he is also going to be making the AI better, due to puters having more than 512k of RAM these days :D Still, i do have my doubts, when we buy a new game these days, we really expect wonderful DX9 graphics, vertex shading or whatever, can a 3D isometric view, really beat a up to date true 3D engine?
Yes, yes it can. Check out the Europa Universalis games. Absolutely fantastic 2D strategy games where they use all the shiny tech to make the game better, not prettier.
I was looking for a game earlier to play, an old one, conquest earth I think it is, its on some Packard Bell DVD so I gotta, err, play a little to extract the files ;) but I couldnt find it, instead I found Space Clash! and, I've never played it before hehehe, and cant, stupid thing crashes :( still, I found my Disc 2 for X-Com Aftermath, so, I'm happy, w00t, patch just downloaded hehehe
That 3rd party TT Patch is amazing Lexx. You should definitely check it out. It adds a load of new vehicles, updates and allows customisation of AI, new signalling systems, bigger stations, more event control, removes or increases production limits and a huge amount more. I spent about an hour just skimming the NFO. Search for TTDPatchW on google and you should find it.
I'm now wondering where my SC2000 disc is....
Does it add more helicopters? hehehe. SC2k? I lost my disk years ago, but got the SC2k + URK :D And, somewhere, on floppy, is Sim City + Graphics pack (the original game) plus a CD with Sim City Classic, Sim City 3k, and Sim City 4... maybe I like Sim City too much? >.<
If your planning on building this summer then wait for the nForce 3 Duel Channel PCiE boards to get the most out of the AMD 64 and X800 XT :D
If your planning on building this summer then wait for the nForce 3 Duel Channel PCiE boards to get the most out of the AMD 64 and X800 XT :D
Whats that got to do with this thread? hehehe :angel:
Ok back on topic!
Sim City > all
:p
Which one? 1, 2k, 3k, 4? :p
Which one? 1, 2k, 3k, 4? :p
I didn't like 4 because it didn't have "other cities" built-in like 3k did.
So you couldn't ferry all your crap to them, and get them to buy all your spare water and electricity :)
(That kinda annoyed me and I gave up :P)
Also, you have to "earn" the better power stations/utilities rather than just wait until a certain time to get them.
Damnit.
Eddie
2K is my favourite. Arcologies just rock and I love how you can bulldoze all the churches to put in sweatshops :D.
@Lexx - not sure about helicopters, I didn't get that far into a game yet.
@El_Muerko - PCIe isn't going to make any difference at all to this and probably even the next generation of GPUs. AGP8x has more than enough bandwidth for anything you'll ever be likely to put in a PC you built in the next year.
20th today, I've been waiting 12 hours for fileplanet to open up Ryzom :( how long do they usualy take to open the file up to all? :confused:
20th today, I've been waiting 12 hours for fileplanet to open up Ryzom :( how long do they usualy take to open the file up to all? :confused:
FileScamIt are pure evil. They are probably too busy stealing boiled sweets from grannies to upload it.
buggery, they probably all off smoking tree's or something :mad: its like almost tomorrow here, wonder if Ryzom will have any mirrors anywhere, even worse coz Kyle got the DVD, so arghhhh
/me taps foot
however the forum seems gentle there
buggery, they probably all off smoking tree's or something :mad: its like almost tomorrow here, wonder if Ryzom will have any mirrors anywhere, even worse coz Kyle got the DVD, so arghhhh
/me taps foot
however the forum seems gentle there
I'm confuddled - what are you trying to get?
Eddie
Ryzom Open Beta, it should be available from File Planet today (the 20th) only, its almost the 21st now, so in between the queue, and waiting for the evil FP to actually stick to their "release it on the 20th" thing, I'm getting slightly pissed off @ file planet, grrrrrrr <sexy growl, just for Freya
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