View Full Version : KK, _PLZ_ don't nerf M-C private Eyes next patch!
Next patch pushes up all the requirements for the Melee rares. Great for tanks, but it sub-consiquently nerfs the M-C PE.
KK, reconsider, Please?
http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?s=&threadid=90439
As if it was hard to get a shitload of m-c anyway. o_O
Originally posted by SorkZmok
As if it was hard to get a shitload of m-c anyway. o_O I think he's talking more of the STR requirement boost. It'll be 87 for the lowest rare, and if I remember correctly, PEs can't get more than low 80's without hefty druggage.
--Stryfe
Originally posted by StryfeX
I think he's talking more of the STR requirement boost.
Exactly.
There are a few melee pe's out there. There not overpowered. In fact there slightly naff, and a slight boost would have been cool. Instead KK nerf them to fuckery. Please think about this twice before you do it kk. There must be some way to boost the M-C tank without screwing over the M-C PE.
This has already been brought up in the TS thread, damage is based on the TL of the weapon, Lupus is looking at moving some melee weapons around TL 75-80ish. Thus besides a removing a swirly from melee PE's, there is no nerf.
I asked him to just make paw of tiger just 1 tl lower... ber 2, 3, moveon, marine, st spine 3 + beast is 86 st, defualt melee pe setup.
Originally posted by VetteroX
I asked him to just make paw of tiger just 1 tl lower
God damn I hope he does. Melee pe's should at least be entitled to one rare weapon.
I would hate to be a class that isn't entitled to a swirly.
Psycho Killa
22-02-04, 08:54
ITS
JUST
A
SWIRLY
Originally posted by Benjie
Exactly.
There are a few melee pe's out there. There not overpowered. In fact there slightly naff, and a slight boost would have been cool. Instead KK nerf them to fuckery. Please think about this twice before you do it kk. There must be some way to boost the M-C tank without screwing over the M-C PE.
uh i just checked the new str reqs. damn, they should at least make the paw of tiger tl 86. Maybe even tl 81. Wont overpower PEs, would just be great to use at least 1 rare.
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
ITS
JUST
A
SWIRLY
Not so.
It's a rare: hence it's content.
Melee Pe's are as much entitled to the gameplay content of searching the WL for a _RARE_ weapon for personal use as much as any class.
Psycho Killa
22-02-04, 09:08
You have got to be kidding me...
If anything it helps melee pe's you dont have to collect parts.... you just build a weapon thats just as powerful as the rare was the patch before big deal.
Damn kill some mobs and pretend your researching rares if that excited u so much :rolleyes:
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
You have got to be kidding me...
If anything it helps melee pe's you dont have to collect parts.... you just build a weapon thats just as powerful as the rare was the patch before big deal.
Damn kill some mobs and pretend your researching rares if that excited u so much :rolleyes:
noooooooo!!!!!!
A swirly also establishes you as a powerfull player.
Whenever I see someone using a weapon without a swirly, I usually consider them a noob.
Psycho Killa
22-02-04, 09:14
A swirly doesnt establish shit it means you play the game alot it doesnt establish skill or anything.
If your only argument against the patch is lack of a swirly then you have no argument.
Hc pe's have never had a swirly what the fuck does it matter...
Please tell me your just kidding.
QuantumDelta
22-02-04, 09:15
Originally posted by Benjie
noooooooo!!!!!!
A swirly also establishes you as a powerfull player.
Whenever I see someone using a weapon without a swirly, I usually consider them a noob. Ironic.
The only rare my PPU ever owned was his PSI Core, every other spell he ever used in combat, ever, (even before para nerfs) = Non-rare.
FYI I can't confirm or deny but it's plausible the PEs will actually get a combat boost from that patch dispite losing rares.
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
I can't confirm or deny but it's plausible the PEs will actually get a combat boost from that patch dispite losing rares.
Good point. My argument was against combat nerfs, not swirlies being taken away.
But still, lowering the pob by 1 TL won't hurt. And it will give PE's one swirly.
*remembers before monks had swirlies, and how much they begged for them.*
Hopefully the next patch will make it so you'll see weapons other than rares brought out during fights.
doubtful, yes... but I remain optimistic
QuantumDelta
22-02-04, 09:23
Originally posted by Marx
Hopefully the next patch will make it so you'll see weapons other than rares brought out during fights.
doubtful, yes... but I remain optimistic Next patch I predict that PC and RC PEs will be all but useless.
Melee Tanks will be overpowered.
APUs will be back to their balanced (now balanced against only themselves and HC Tanks) State.
HC Tanks will be untouched.
If it wasn't Lupus handling this change, I'd have given up all hope and interest in it by now....
moveon
zerk3
zerk2
marine
hardend backbone3
yes - you can use all of these implants, you have to use beast to get the marine implanted but it stays active even after the drug wears off
gives you str 81, with that you can use the very nice vein ripper, also called the monk ripper, as well as the tiger claw
it's easy to get enough MC to cap the wepons, with PE buffs and the huge amount of dex they can move very very fast
after patch --------------------------- guess what, MCPE is screwed
sad for you, but I'm actually glad you posted. I was going to make a MCPE -- but not now.
This has already been brought up in the TS thread, damage is based on the TL of the weapon, Lupus is looking at moving some melee weapons around TL 75-80ish. Thus besides a removing a swirly from melee PE's, there is no nerf.
I'm not sure --- but I think that's wrong. rares are different, they are given the "rare treatment" when it comes to damage, range, weight, etc. it's not the same scale as non-rare. exceptions to this are epic items, storm lasers, soul blades, etc -- they also are on the rare scale.
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
A swirly doesnt establish shit it means you play the game alot it doesnt establish skill or anything.
If your only argument against the patch is lack of a swirly then you have no argument.
Hc pe's have never had a swirly what the fuck does it matter...
Please tell me your just kidding.
yea man, swirlys mean fuck all, infact i'd prefer not to have a swirly because you're not a walking billboard where everyone can see you even from 500 meters away
why do you think the SH dosen't have a swirly ..
Benjie, so holy lightning should be made tl40 so apu PE's can use it?
Originally posted by Benjie
God damn I hope he does. Melee pe's should at least be entitled to one rare weapon.
I would hate to be a class that isn't entitled to a swirly.
HC PE's get no bloody swirly, so its not just you that doesnt get one ;p
Heavyporker
22-02-04, 14:25
I have no sympathy to people demanding swirlies on the basis that they look cool.
If ppl think you're not worth anything without a swirly, go teach them a lesson.
Melee PEs aren't getting nerfed, far from it.
Originally posted by Benjie
Instead KK nerf them to fuckery.
welcome to neocron.
Cruzbroker
22-02-04, 15:44
Drug up if you want a swirly.
It just like PE with First Love, a PE with TPC/ Tride fusion cannon, a PE with Slasher.
ITS
JUST
A
SWIRLY
Sorry if I made it look like it echoes in here..
PE gets 90 easily with 2 drugs..
If ur goin melee, u HAVE To do that.
Originally posted by Benjie
Whenever I see someone using a weapon without a swirly, I usually consider them a noob.
And when you run from me when I stack 9 Posion beams on you...
Who is the noob then? You that runs from a non swirley weapon or me that uses one... :rolleyes:
KramerTheWeird
22-02-04, 21:16
There'll be little difference of how melee PE's are next patch. Our high end weapon won't be TL 90 anymore, the energy soulblade. It's actualy kinda annoying how every other bossmob drop item is remaining TL 90 except ESB but that's ok. It would be nice if Paw of Tiger was tl 86 instead but I could manage with Tai Chi Double edge and llb2, probably little difference.
Also consider these TL adjustments aren't set in stone, I see likely more testing and changing of TL's before they hit retail.
edit: technically r-c PE's are getting a nice bonus this patch. Stabber Pulselaser and Commando Sniper have been upped in TL so this gives a high end PE range sniping and pulselaser weapon. This will be much easier than drugging to SH and disruptor, they'll be able to keep their resists, and the gap between second and first top end weapons will be smaller.
I dunno whether to be impressed or horrified by this entire Thread...
KramerTheWeird
22-02-04, 21:22
Originally posted by Callash
I dunno whether to be impressed or horrified by this entire Thread...
hehe suprisingly the last type of class variant you'd expect bringing up controversy has been doing it plenty lately...
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/kramertheweird/forum_pics/meleepowa.jpg
Psycho Killa
22-02-04, 21:27
Omg hahaah what a whiner I fought you and didnt think differently of you then any other private eye until the damn ts guards come around :(
KramerTheWeird
22-02-04, 21:31
lol last time we fought we both died from the same TS guard hahaha :)
damage will be balanced on melee
when they push the TL, they also push the damage i think
that means: if you use a non rare melee weapon, which have got the same TL that the rare has before the patch, it will do same damage
i hope you understand what i want to say ;)
that means: if you use a non rare melee weapon, which have got the same TL that the rare has before the patch, it will do same damage
are you sure? I swear I read somewhere that rares were on a different scale
Seth Humphrey
23-02-04, 00:52
Laserblade II 39 62
Face Scratcher Claw 42 65
Special Forces Combat Knife 20 67
Tangent High Voltage Shocker 49 71
Long Laserblade 44 76
Tai Chi Double-Edge - 80
Long Laserblade II 55 83
Paw of Tiger 68 87
isnt it a alternative?
O_o
Lol Kramer. I love that picture:
Tupac: go away
Tupac: kramer
Tupac: u need to be nerfed
...
Tupac: nerf the fuckin melee pe's
:lol:
I always thought that rares did more damage than en equal TL non-rare would do. If so, then melee PE's are indeed getting nerfed (albeit I don't think it would be too bad). If it's solely based on TL then there won't be any real changes except no swirly without drugging up.
--Stryfe
Rares dont do more damage they just have higher stats so are easier to cap and since melee is stupidly easy to cap its not going to make a difference tbh since PEs can cap a DG but just cant get the str to use it.
And swirlies dont matter, and now because of whining on it I think lupus should bring all rare melee over 90 str to match other class rares so STOPWHINE.
We already talked to Lupus about this, in the testserver forum.
He indicated that damage is based on TL, so no, melee PEs wouldnt be doing less damage.
I pointed out that lowtech melee PEs have a trouble spot- it goes from SFCK at TL 67 to the Tai Chi at TL 80... and lowtech melee PEs that dont drug end up at Str 76, right in the middle. He said he would consider moving the SFCK or the Face Scratcher into that range because its silly that two lowtech melees are only 2 TL apart like that.
But otherwise, melee PEs wont be nerfed, and whining for a swirly (assuming that the non-rares at TL 68 do as much damage as the POT does now) is silly.
how much have the T-C requirments on Melee change with the TL increase? is it the same as before?
KramerTheWeird
23-02-04, 18:55
Originally posted by StryfeX
I always thought that rares did more damage than en equal TL non-rare would do. If so, then melee PE's are indeed getting nerfed (albeit I don't think it would be too bad). If it's solely based on TL then there won't be any real changes except no swirly without drugging up.
--Stryfe
I notice that Energy Soulblade, a nonrare (TL 90) Does more damage to many classes over Blade of Ceres (TL 84). I don't think any weapons outside of pistols have had a special boost in damage because they're rares.
Originally posted by Bengalmin
how much have the T-C requirments on Melee change with the TL increase? is it the same as before? Aside from the monks spells, all other weapons follow a formula for determining main skill (PC, HC, MC, RC) and subskill (TC) requirements. I would assume they would all follow that same formula.
Aside from the monks spells, all other weapons follow a formula for determining main skill (PC, HC, MC, RC) and subskill (TC) requirements. I would assume they would all follow that same formula.
Damn, this is going to be annoying and remove some speed from tanks so they can spec higher T-C for the Tech Rares :(
I suppose the trade off being tech or speed but not both
Originally posted by Bengalmin
Damn, this is going to be annoying and remove some speed from tanks so they can spec higher T-C for the Tech Rares :(
I suppose the trade off being tech or speed but not both Same trade off everyone else has.
BUT
Those runners that say "melee is fine now" could easily elect to use only the low level rares and NOT spec up for the higher ones. :)
KramerTheWeird
23-02-04, 20:53
A tank with 89 T-C (req for TL 115 high tech weapon) Would have enough to get 108 points in agility before implants. That certainly doesn't seem much of a compromise, maybe less points in CON to use.
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