View Full Version : Red soullight IS NOT viable unless....
Psycho Killa
18-02-04, 04:19
You have 20 million dollars to burn.
Ive spent almost 10 million mass producing spells weapons and buying armor. Stealth tools etc.
No it's still viable to be criminal..
Just now people who go on killing spree's have to be a little more carful about where they hunt, as people who can challenge them are able to find them to take revenge..
People around here seem to think its possible its really not.
Sure if people werent lame as hell it would be but guess what.
They bring 4 to 8 people to kill 2 people.... WE HAVE SHITTY EQUIPMENT NO RARES and the come after us with 8 people what the fuck is this?
I mean we did this for fun just to put some excitement in the game but how fun is it when ur geting paraspammed db spammed and shot by 4 to 7 people?
Others said noone would chase you. Bullshit me and megaman where chased countless times today and people never have the balls to go without a ppu its rediculous.
Make red soullight viable!!!!
Its been 1 day and I almost dont want to continue on I thought id make fun for me and megaman and fun for people to hunt us down but 8 on 2 especialy when they have a ppu is pointless and just makes us not want to do it anymore.
If we want we can pk who we want where we want and use rare and never suffer the drop but whatever lets not have any fun.
be a droner red sl for them is nothing cus u can still use the green sl equip. lol
Psycho Killa
18-02-04, 04:25
I was thinking about that before :(
But I feel so left out of the action as a droner. And its not really good for a duo.
Im so close to mass producing ppu spells and pking with me and megaman like that.
Hell if I want to be lame I could just tag along with him and not parashock but im not going to do that if im ppuing a red criminal imma be red myself.
leGit v. 2
18-02-04, 04:34
i took out buncha people.. but not when there are ppu's around
ZoneVortex
18-02-04, 04:36
red SL sucks, not viable
i fought in pepper park for 2 hours last night with red SL....
was all cool...just ran around PP1 with NCF and Dark chasing me, never did kill me hehehe
I didn't change shit, ran around with my lib, other slotted guns, slotted spells, whatever i don't fuckin care
but...as soon as i had to zone into p3 for accidently hitting a guard there happened to be the cop on his patrol and he wasted me...grrr
i dunno if that's relevant to this post but whatever heheh
remove the damn copbots and i'll be happy
if u're just psycho u can totally waste shit with a droner... just sit with like 10 kamis in qb and launch em non stop at a group of peopel... or if u wanna be selective get ur PN up high and just snipe poeple... its great fun... then get a hovertech and stealth... then ur just ubar :D
Psycho Killa
18-02-04, 05:25
Man id make a droner but I just finished capping my private eye lol. Also collected all the rares ill need for after this soullight project o well.
Maybe if neptune ever ever comes out.
Disturbed021
18-02-04, 11:58
the 5 item drops and no safeslot for red sl is WAY to much with the tracking system now.
They should change it to like 2-3 item drops but still have a safeslot imho.
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
"A lot"
If it makes you feel better, then I donīt "Red is Dead" ;)
the 5 item drops and no safeslot for red sl is WAY to much with the tracking system now.
They should change it to like 2-3 item drops but still have a safeslot imho.
it's not JUST 5 items...it's 5 (+1 for every further negative in SL you have)...
i dont think they should have a safeslot...personally i think that should be their only con to being red...and dropping belts in warzones...
Bring a PPU with you, I hear they make you godlike.
switchback
18-02-04, 12:25
Bring a PPU with you, I hear they make you godlike.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
Its been 1 day and I almost dont want to continue on I thought id make fun for me and megaman and fun for people to hunt us down but 8 on 2 especialy when they have a ppu is pointless and just makes us not want to do it anymore.
although i agree on the fact that it isnt viable, however, you critisize them for bringing ppu(and tbh i would critisize for that to)but aint you also a PPU? if your doing this on you Pe apoligies, but if you have PPU and they have PPU doesnt really give you much right to complain in that case.
but yeah the 8v2 red SL zerg aint fun
well he's exagerating a bit - it was rather like 2-4 vs 2-3 of them, although it doesn't matter anything because with ppu on our side it could be even 2 vs 2 and they would be dead, sooner or later.
And that is frustrating, i agree.
az
Originally posted by ezza
although i agree on the fact that it isnt viable, however, you critisize them for bringing ppu(and tbh i would critisize for that to)but aint you also a PPU? if your doing this on you Pe apoligies, but if you have PPU and they have PPU doesnt really give you much right to complain in that case.
but yeah the 8v2 red SL zerg aint fun
He was on his PE
I would like to see, 100 SL all slots safe, neg. SL no slot safe. The thing is, it isnt really worth to have 100 SL as well.
There is no need for terrorists to loose 4 or more items, when they are chased and surely be killed by the whole server. Its really enough to have nothing safe and people seeing where you are!
Originally posted by Nexxy
He was on his PE k, in that case its lame having to bring a ppu
Sorry, I am gonna need an explanation on why its lame to bring a PPU to try and take down highly skilled PvPers.
Originally posted by Strych9
Sorry, I am gonna need an explanation on why its lame to bring a PPU to try and take down highly skilled PvPers. you need a explanation for that, maybe you should PvP more
Originally posted by ezza
you need a explanation for that, maybe you should PvP more Ah, no explanation, thanks.
So are you saying its lame just in the normal way that people think PPUs are lame, or is there some extra special lameness attached because of the situation?
And yes, I am aware of why people think in general a PPU is lame (odd that there are so many PPUs... :rolleyes: ).
Originally posted by Strych9
Ah, no explanation, thanks.
So are you saying its lame just in the normal way that people think PPUs are lame, or is there some extra special lameness attached because of the situation?
And yes, I am aware of why people think in general a PPU is lame (odd that there are so many PPUs... :rolleyes: ). you dont see the lameness?
2 people against 8 one if which was a PPU.
ok so remove the ppu that leaves 7 v 2 still odds against the 2, but without the PPU they have a chance.
with ppu the chance is reduced to so small a chance of winning you might miss it.
with a damage boost on and para, i dont care how good mega and PK are they are going down easy.
without the ppu they do have some chance of winning or escape
if ur complaining thats it 2 vs 8 and they have a ppu then heres how u fix it :
1 . get a PPU urself
2. get more people
duh.............
read my post
it was 2-4 of us vs 2-3 of them...
ppu+pe+mid lvl apu +spy vs tank and a PE + pain easer PE came there also.
anyway most of fights were 3 vs 2
Originally posted by Fez
if ur complaining thats it 2 vs 8 and they have a ppu then heres how u fix it :
1 . get a PPU urself
2. get more people
duh............. you are fucking dumb, to justify needing to have 8 people you say for them to get more.
lmao, mega and PK must be the greatest pkers the game has ever seen for you to need that many people or are you clueless fuckwits who cant kill people?
edit: even more funny, they didnt have rares, rofl omg howmany people have mega and pk killed like that?
Red is not viable, red is pathetically not viable.
Definately needs a change.
I am just saying... duels aside and other forms of "honorable" combat...
If I was trying to kill a runner that was much better than me, and couldnt, I would have no problem trying to get friends to help me, even if one of them was a PPU.
Remember, the presence of a superior numbers is NOT a requirement to attack a neg SL player. Its only a requirement to beat player or players that much better than you.
Since megaman and PK know what the hell they are doing, why not see this as a testament to their skill? What should the players have done, just stupidly get killed over and over by megaman and PK?
(BTW, I am not saying neg SL is viable... just going off topic on the lameness issue).
And ezza, Fez was saying that mega and PK could have gotten a PPU to help them...
Originally posted by Strych9
I am just saying... duels aside and other forms of "honorable" combat...
If I was trying to kill a runner that was much better than me, and couldnt, I would have no problem trying to get friends to help me, even if one of them was a PPU.
Remember, the presence of a superior numbers is NOT a requirement to attack a neg SL player. Its only a requirement to beat player or players that much better than you.
Since megaman and PK know what the hell they are doing, why not see this as a testament to their skill? What should the players have done, just stupidly get killed over and over by megaman and PK?
(BTW, I am not saying neg SL is viable... just going off topic on the lameness issue).
And ezza, Fez was saying that mega and PK could have gotten a PPU to help them... im sure they could of got a lot more to help them but that isnt the point, but as usual we differ in opinions so lets just leave it
edit: i dont care about honour i care about a good fight
Originally posted by ezza
you need a explanation for that, maybe you should PvP more
Of course being "Red" does not always equate to "PvP".
* Note I am in favor of a 1 drop/no safe slot rule for reds. The 5 drop is pretty character destroying once you know where they are at all times.
Originally posted by ezza
i dont care about honour i care about a good fight
yeah
it's my fault and my stupidity to get into this pointless thread. It's just my understanding of the so called therm "lame" is rather opposite than yours.
For me LAME is killing newbies at the cellars, camping all newbie lvling spots 24/7 in search of red noob, for me lame is camping GR and killing everyone who got in, for me lame is waiting for someone to start hacking a warbot and killing him when he's unable to do anything, for me LAME is ruin the fun for others and finally for me - extremely lame is the attitude of some community members who's one and only thruth is: "stfu, go playing sims online" or "fuck off this is pvp game"
So everytime noob get killed he's told to stfu and take his LE in, where he finally manage to do it he's told "stfu, leave your LE, i have no one to kill", when finally a pker get his red SL and a team of few good guys rush in to punish the criminal everyon tell them "it's lame"...
Ok calming down now (had a tough day at work...) - from now on i'll stop posting at such threads, but just for your information.
I don't care if in your eyes it's lame. Those two were pkers, griefers, murderers and hunted criminals and they deserve nothing more than death. I don't care if they are great pvpers, if i cannot fight them alone i'd bring an army to kill them. And i will kill them (and every other pker) every day untill i finish with neocron once and for good.
Keep this in mind please - everyone has free choice, if u want to pk, it's your own will, have fun and enjoy but be ready to face the consequences
az
Nothing personal, of course...
Originally posted by ezza
im sure they could of got a lot more to help them but that isnt the point, but as usual we differ in opinions so lets just leave it
edit: i dont care about honour i care about a good fight So what the hell is the point ezza?
I am saying that people try to win in combat. Thats a given.
If you have superior skill, then you will win with even numbers.
If you lack skill, then the only way to preserve a chance of winning is by increasing numbers.
Skill or numbers. You gotta have one or the other to have a chance at winning.
Megaman and PK, when PK was his PPU and Mega his tank, used to have TONS of people chasing them around. Why? Because as a twosome they were very well coordinated and very skilled. No other twosome could touch them really.
So the choices were either to never fight them or to fight them with superior numbers (which of course still never would guarantee a victory).
Well if you do the crime you deserve the time.
Hell pk all you like, youve now got a jail you can pk in even more.
If you'd have chosen your targets more carefully and attacked faction enemies - you'd have no SL problem.
In short - random 'murders' give you red SL.
Always has done, always will do.
And if you murder lots - you will be hunted down, and normally in numbers.
Attack and kill in none SL hit zones and you're SL will be fine.
Random pk - and well... im afraid you pay the price.
Originally posted by Strych9
So what the hell is the point ezza?
I am saying that people try to win in combat. Thats a given.
If you have superior skill, then you will win with even numbers.
If you lack skill, then the only way to preserve a chance of winning is by increasing numbers.
Skill or numbers. You gotta have one or the other to have a chance at winning.
Megaman and PK, when PK was his PPU and Mega his tank, used to have TONS of people chasing them around. Why? Because as a twosome they were very well coordinated and very skilled. No other twosome could touch them really.
So the choices were either to never fight them or to fight them with superior numbers (which of course still never would guarantee a victory).
are you really trying to say the people against mega and pk are that shit that they cant take 2 people down in a group?
when it was mega and pk on pPU having lots of people chase them was fine cos he had a PPU strapped to his ass so of course you need the numbers.
the point is to have good fight not to zerg them, like hahahaha there red sl lets get 1/2 the server to gank them, lame.
dont know why im bothering posting in responce cos we will always disagree
Originally posted by ezza
are you really trying to say the people against mega and pk are that shit that they cant take 2 people down in a group?
when it was mega and pk on pPU having lots of people chase them was fine cos he had a PPU strapped to his ass so of course you need the numbers.
the point is to have good fight not to zerg them, like hahahaha there red sl lets get 1/2 the server to gank them, lame.
dont know why im bothering posting in responce cos we will always disagree Come on now. All of a sudden the good PKers in the game can be taken down with no problem? Do you think me and my other inexperienced bud (non-PPU) can take you down? Or Vett? Vett has attacked my melee PE, a melee Tank, and a PPu at the same time and easily won.
GUESS WHAT ezza, we all arent as skilled as you.
If mega and PK were running around, I sure as hell would need a large group of players (of my similar skill level) to take them down.
Ganks suck. But so do GR camps. As long as people continue to camp GRs with Rhinos, kill people in the middle of a WB hack, etc... the fact that two highly skilled runners were ganked means very little in the grand scheme of things.
Sorry if my pity doesnt runneth over on this topic.
Back on topic, fix it so neg SL is at least possible. 5 dropped items is way too much.
Originally posted by evs
Well if you do the crime you deserve the time.
Hell pk all you like, youve now got a jail you can pk in even more.
If you'd have chosen your targets more carefully and attacked faction enemies - you'd have no SL problem.
In short - random 'murders' give you red SL.
Always has done, always will do.
And if you murder lots - you will be hunted down, and normally in numbers.
Attack and kill in none SL hit zones and you're SL will be fine.
Random pk - and well... im afraid you pay the price.
Well, my question to you is this.
Since SL is an artificial distinction which is only enforced by arms of the City Admin, should a TG loose sympathy and SL for killing a fellow 'Terrorist'?
Why should they continue to be viewed as and suffer the penalties of being a criminal if the wasteland is 'lawless'?
Anyway, not all red people are random PKers... and not all random PKers are red.
:rolleyes:
Originally posted by Marx
Well, my question to you is this.
Since SL is an artificial distinction which is only enforced by arms of the City Admin, should a TG loose sympathy and SL for killing a fellow 'Terrorist'?
Why should they continue to be viewed as and suffer the penalties of being a criminal if the wasteland is 'lawless'?
Anyway, not all red people are random PKers... and not all random PKers are red.
:rolleyes: Yeah, that highlights one of the big problems I think with the SL system.
Not everyone is under the jurisdiction of the SL enforcement system.
The SL system as it now is almost transcends the RP system in game, which it shouldnt do.
And as Archeus pointed out, not all red runners are PvPers.
The soullight system enforces neutrality. All it takes is one kill to wipe out your 100 sl. For negative sl, the punishment is so great that people immediatly go do missions or spend the night idling in their apartment. At some point long ago, soul light was supposed to be more of a measure of your karma so to speak. If you're a killer, you become evil. Then it was changed to be a punishment, rather then simply a division. Soul light is used to stop people from going on killing sprees, it's used to try to encourage people to fight along faction sympathies. It's used to reduce killing new players in sewers/cellars. Since it's now being used as a restriction/punishment there's no reason you would want to be evil. Infact the majority of "evil" people are currently neutral. The "good" people are also neutral, since even without killing people its easy to lose sl. Those with high sl are tradeskillers, those with negative sl are roadkill or soon to be neutral.
I don't understand why criminals are punished nomatter were they are in Neocron. In the city they have the added fun of being shot by every copbot in the area. Why are criminals also punished out inthe waste?! Is there some supreme being looking down on you all the time and enforcing your soullight? Or is it stealthed copbots? There should be no justice outside of copbot patrolled areas, period. Now if you want to take the law into your own hands and go hunt down criminals as a bounty hunter, that's great. It's fun for the criminal, as they get to kill more and it's thrilling to know that people are hunting you down. It's also fun for good aligned players, or bounty hunters, they can actualy do somethign with high sl, rather then not do something to get it(killing). Taking down Neocron's worst criminals/scum would offer some excellent rp.
We have the first step, a ncpd listing of evil sl players. Next we need to get rid of the 5item drop for evil people. They should drop just as much as anyone else, though if you must insist on them being worse off, then make it 2 items or no safeslot. 5 is totaly ridiculous. Then we create bounties of somesort, lookup current criminals, go kill them, and return with dogtags to get some cash. Maybe even if you do enough bounties you could gain a rank akin to epic's master. Maybe you'd win NCPD's favor and they'd give you a special piece of equipment (like a copbot rifle ; D ). Not only would this give sl a meaning, it would improve the role playing atmosphere in neocron, and it would add to endgame. Op fighting is nolonger the only thing you can do, go hunt down a crimnal, or be a crimnal and see how many silly bounty hunters you can take out.
Only thing 100 SL really guarantees is your belt is moderatly safe from all but the l33t'est hacker.
I routinely whack muppets now as I know I can whack 1-2 people before I have to worry about getting my SL up (which goes up by itself). You can quite happly PK one person every hour or so quite safely without missions. It allows you to smack people while stopping people from going on a rampage.
I don't think Reds should be immune from a safeslot/dropping at least 1 item anywhere. For the same reason I don't think you should get a reward for dogtags.
The current system means the Red player is supplying the reward. If they didn't then they could abuse the system to farm thier own stuff.
How about expanding on the wastelands system? Lets say they can never genrep to thier apartments or clan apartment. This means they are expelled to the wastelands. However if they die they can GR to any GR (even locked ones) except thier apartments.
Originally posted by Archeus
.....
I don't think Reds should be immune from a safeslot/dropping at least 1 item anywhere. For the same reason I don't think you should get a reward for dogtags.
The current system means the Red player is supplying the reward. If they didn't then they could abuse the system to farm thier own stuff.
How about expanding on the wastelands system? Lets say they can never genrep to thier apartments or clan apartment. This means they are expelled to the wastelands. However if they die they can GR to any GR (even locked ones) except thier apartments.
I didn't suggest they should have no penalties, at the very least they should suffer the same death penallties as the rest of us. One item in a belt. If you want to make it more severe for evil players then remove the safeslot or at most raise it to 2 items per belt. I don't see the reward from belt as a prize so much as a punishment. Is it not enough that they're effectively shut out of neocron? Tradeskiller service will be scarce for them. Instead of punishing evil so much, we should reward good. Bounties are an excellent way to encourage ganking criminals and being lawful. I mean wouldn't you think twice about going on a mb massacre run if that would put your name up available for everyone to see along with a price tag? You'd have people hunting you down whereever you go. For those that enjoy the constant pvp, being a criminal would be awesome. For those that don't it's a sucessful detterant. You could even have the bounty increase every time the criminal kills someone, thus making it possible to have criminals compete against each other for the most kills before they're taken down, and encourage people to go after the worst offenders for a large bounty.
Is it abusable? Yes totaly, but I'm sure ways to balance it could be thought out. There are plenty of mechanism in the game that people abuse all the time. That doesn't mean we should remove everything. Like people kill employees for sl, people use geography and stupid ai to kill tough mobs, people use stockx and clan funds to hold more then 20mil nc, the list goes on with things we abuse.
The key difference here is that currently the system itself enforces alignment. With a bounty system, the players enforce it. I would rather have player interaction then just following some coded rules.
Originally posted by Carinth
The soullight system enforces neutrality. All it takes is one kill to wipe out your 100 sl. For negative sl, the punishment is so great that people immediatly go do missions or spend the night idling in their apartment. At some point long ago, soul light was supposed to be more of a measure of your karma so to speak. If you're a killer, you become evil. Then it was changed to be a punishment, rather then simply a division. Soul light is used to stop people from going on killing sprees, it's used to try to encourage people to fight along faction sympathies. It's used to reduce killing new players in sewers/cellars. Since it's now being used as a restriction/punishment there's no reason you would want to be evil. Infact the majority of "evil" people are currently neutral. The "good" people are also neutral, since even without killing people its easy to lose sl. Those with high sl are tradeskillers, those with negative sl are roadkill or soon to be neutral.
I don't understand why criminals are punished nomatter were they are in Neocron. In the city they have the added fun of being shot by every copbot in the area. Why are criminals also punished out inthe waste?! Is there some supreme being looking down on you all the time and enforcing your soullight? Or is it stealthed copbots? There should be no justice outside of copbot patrolled areas, period. Now if you want to take the law into your own hands and go hunt down criminals as a bounty hunter, that's great. It's fun for the criminal, as they get to kill more and it's thrilling to know that people are hunting you down. It's also fun for good aligned players, or bounty hunters, they can actualy do somethign with high sl, rather then not do something to get it(killing). Taking down Neocron's worst criminals/scum would offer some excellent rp.
We have the first step, a ncpd listing of evil sl players. Next we need to get rid of the 5item drop for evil people. They should drop just as much as anyone else, though if you must insist on them being worse off, then make it 2 items or no safeslot. 5 is totaly ridiculous. Then we create bounties of somesort, lookup current criminals, go kill them, and return with dogtags to get some cash. Maybe even if you do enough bounties you could gain a rank akin to epic's master. Maybe you'd win NCPD's favor and they'd give you a special piece of equipment (like a copbot rifle ; D ). Not only would this give sl a meaning, it would improve the role playing atmosphere in neocron, and it would add to endgame. Op fighting is nolonger the only thing you can do, go hunt down a crimnal, or be a crimnal and see how many silly bounty hunters you can take out. Agree with 100% of this.
The factions can easily attach and pay for bounties. Then you have incentive to hunt criminals (money from bounties) but the criminals dont lose half of their possessions each time they die.
I mean wouldn't you think twice about going on a mb massacre run if that would put your name up available for everyone to see along with a price tag?
They had that system in UO. People either
a) treated the whole thing as a scoreboard (even putting money on themselves)
or
b) Farming the money via friends to kill them.
The point is to get a balance that will stop rampant killing while still allowing criminals in the game. Having the Red divvy up the reward from thier own stuff is about the only way to stop abuse.
SigmaDraconis
18-02-04, 21:54
the general hypocracy of this thread is overwhelming 8|
Originally posted by Archeus
They had that system in UO. People either
a) treated the whole thing as a scoreboard (even putting money on themselves)
or
b) Farming the money via friends to kill them.
The point is to get a balance that will stop rampant killing while still allowing criminals in the game. Having the Red divvy up the reward from thier own stuff is about the only way to stop abuse.
Your reasons against it are exploits and gambling? I seriously doubt that's enough to discount the whole idea. To prevent farming for cash, as you put it, just have the reward go down every time the criminal is killed. You could also have a rating factor for bounty hunters and criminals. Each would be how many of the other they've killed. As your bounty rating goes up, you gain less money for lower ranked criminals. Thus you hafta take on the best criminals to make cash. If you repeatedly kill someoen their reward goes down, your rating goes up, you don't make much cash. The best you could do is roll a bunch of new characters and have them each go evil and collect the bounty on them. People do that now anyway, make a new player of a certain faction and kill them over and over again.
Whats wrong with gambling? I see nothing but good from taking bets on how long a criminal will last. It is a scoreboard, most of Neocron is filled with scoreboards. This game is competative, wether you believe it or not. Theres a reason why they list the richest players, the richest clans, how many ops a clan owns, why they show the map with colors for clan ownership. These are all ways to compete, that makes the game fun.
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 22:16
Uve got more chance of platting cow shit than KK listening.
*Yawn*:o
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Uve got more chance of platting cow shit than KK listening.
*Yawn*:o hope we aint keeping you awake
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 22:24
hope we aint keeping you awake
I was just bored of the same old shit being thrown around, and KK still sick back scratching there nutt sack, and think. I know, lets make a new HUD, lets not bother with a key game dynamic.
Yes, we are the harshest community there is :angel:
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
I was just bored of the same old shit being thrown around, and KK still sick back scratching there nutt sack, and think. I know, lets make a new HUD, lets not bother with a key game dynamic.
Yes, we are the harshest community there is :angel: yeah, the hud aint the first thing on my mind of things i want changing, but they are only doing some sneak previews, maybe just maybe if were really really lucky they will have something planned for the SL system
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 22:26
yeah, the hud aint the first thing on my mind of things i want changing, but they are only doing some sneak previews, maybe just maybe if were really really lucky they will have something planned for the SL system
Pigs can fly :lol:
leGit v. 2
18-02-04, 22:27
RAWR
Those two were pkers, griefers, murderers and hunted criminals and they deserve nothing more than death. I don't care if they are great pvpers, if i cannot fight them alone i'd bring an army to kill them.
Megaman and PK, when PK was his PPU and Mega his tank, used to have TONS of people chasing them around. Why? Because as a twosome they were very well coordinated and very skilled. No other twosome could touch them really.
we are not a ppu/tank combo nomore.. we are a tank/PE combo.. but me and psycho got some plans.. lets see if it works
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 22:28
if i cannot fight them alone i'd bring an army to kill them.
Then you shouldnt get involved.
Attack what you can kill, dont overkill the situtation. :wtf:
Psycho Killa
18-02-04, 23:30
Originally posted by Archeus
Bring a PPU with you, I hear they make you godlike.
Me and mega
ALMOST NEVER LOSE WHEN ITS MY ON MY PPU
Guess what
I DONT FIND THAT FUCKING ENJOYABLE I LIKE A CHALLENGE???
Me and megaman whipe out entire armies by ourselves dont start on ppus now archeus just because your a tradeskill gimp.
A challenge not imposibility.
I could have a ppu with us if I want to so fuck off noone goes anywhere without a ppu these days and its pathetic.
I wouldnt mind help but only from red soullight runners this is a test to prove the inviability of red soullight.
Originally posted by evs
.
If you'd have chosen your targets more carefully and attacked faction enemies - you'd have no SL problem.
In short - random 'murders' give you red SL.
Always has done, always will do.
And if you murder lots - you will be hunted down, and normally in numbers.
Attack and kill in none SL hit zones and you're SL will be fine.
Random pk - and well... im afraid you pay the price.
Hey guess what i killed npc's to get my soullight down this was a test to show that red soullight was not viable because several people in another thread said it was viable. It costs me 200k atleast per death thats being conservative it could cost me up to 400k or more a death between armor stealth tool spells and weapon.
I did this on purpose YOUR SUPPOSE to be able to be a criminal its just suppose to be a harsher life style..
I think its harsh enough being hunted down by shitloads of people... not having a safe slot... and not being able to enter the city...
What so we have to lose Five PLUS items I lose like 7 items a death for crying out loud.
2 Drop max no safe slot I say is fair enough jesus you guys are rediculous.
Let me get it straight I didnt do this to pk noobs or slaughter allied faction there plenty of fucking people to kill as a black dragon and I could slaughter as many allies as I wanted to and do a couple missions or idle in my apartment.
I chose to do this to give people some fun and exciting stuff to do stalking me and mega through outzone industrial pepper park and the main sewers. I thought it would be great exciting fun for me and megaman (I havent had this kind of thrill pvping since they added the retarded safe slot) and a thrill to everyone else to chase down "criminals"
Im not asking for anyone pity strych9 I NEVER camp genereps, its a rare rare day I gank a noob and I try my best to ADD to the game and not detract from it. I only wish to add some fun to this game but as it is now within the week I will run out of supplies and money and I will be fucked until i punch enough spiders while being ganked to get my soullight back up.
Out of about 10 teams to hunt us down only one of them had the balls to not come at us with a ppu..... I just dont like people dependence on ppu's... I mean what did people do before ppu's omg they had to actualy release upon death the horror. Thats what sickens me.
Honestly I dont mind the numbers of peopel hunting me I prefer a 30 on 2 non ppu fight then a 2 on 2 ppu fight.
I agree.
I understand no backpack return, it is RP, it makes SENSE. But why would NeXT choose how many items you drop based on SL? Why?
All players regardless of SL should drop the same number of items. All players regardless of SL should/should not have a safe slot. It just makes no sense to me to have the NCPD hotlist and then make everyone shit scared to get on it because it isn't worth the risk when your targets drop shit and you drop everything.
Steve
Also pk wasn't exaggerating about the number of people chasing them like xylaz said. First off they were mostly alone and I tried to help them a few times so must of the time it was just them 2.
Also besides your clan there were 2 other monks and various other random people from other clans that were also hunting them at the same time.
Even if the individual fights were like 3 vs 2 everytime they finished one fight they would run into another 3 you are really acting like the situation was alot smaller then it was. Basically all of pp was crawling with people hunting them.
Psycho Killa
18-02-04, 23:45
Originally posted by Carinth
We have the first step, a ncpd listing of evil sl players. Next we need to get rid of the 5item drop for evil people. They should drop just as much as anyone else, though if you must insist on them being worse off, then make it 2 items or no safeslot. 5 is totaly ridiculous. Then we create bounties of somesort, lookup current criminals, go kill them, and return with dogtags to get some cash. Maybe even if you do enough bounties you could gain a rank akin to epic's master. Maybe you'd win NCPD's favor and they'd give you a special piece of equipment (like a copbot rifle ; D ). Not only would this give sl a meaning, it would improve the role playing atmosphere in neocron, and it would add to endgame. Op fighting is nolonger the only thing you can do, go hunt down a crimnal, or be a crimnal and see how many silly bounty hunters you can take out.
I love carinth thats exactly how I think it should be.
Me and megaman would do this forever if it was viable and give people FUN omg FUN in this game to hunt us down im sure they enjoyed it as much as we did or they wouldnt of been doing it time after time.
Its a great rush and a thrill that lasts about a week to the tune of almost 20 mil...
Wow I am surprised so many people chose to hunt you down. This just goes to show that being red NEEDS to be made viable.
A viable murderer = HUGE content. I mean, all those people hunting down murderers. You could form bounty hunter parties just to hunt them down. Or just imagine setting a trap. Have a red person go down into say, El Farid. And have 7 people waiting down there with him. Seriously it would add so much content into the games its almost absurd.
There can still be plenty of penalties. Losing faction sympathy for one. Imo if you have negative symp for a faction then the guards should shoot you regardless. Then I think either a loss of safe slot or a 2 item drop would be perfect. And its obvous the location finder worked if they are getting hunted so much. As far as I know PK said he was going to be hanging out deep in the Main Sewers. Thats definitely out of the way, and if people were hunting them that far, then its obvious it works.
And just in case any missed it. C-O-N-T-E-N-T.
Shadow Dancer
19-02-04, 00:05
Originally posted by Strych9
Sorry, I am gonna need an explanation on why its lame to bring a PPU to try and take down highly skilled PvPers.
You bring a ppu against me, and use that excuse and i'll be flattered.
However I seriously doubt 9999999999% of the people who bring ppus will actually admit that. More like they'll say 'omfg u sux rolfloflflof lmamaoma u cock lolo" and other assorted stupidity.
And as for what jest said, absolutely. This could be easily made into more content and more fun.
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
However I seriously doubt 9999999999% of the people who bring ppus will actually admit that. More like they'll say 'omfg u sux rolfloflflof lmamaoma u cock lolo" and other assorted stupidity.
That's what a tank PPU combo stated when braggin about bringing down my red manno.
If it takes a PPU to holy para and DB a resist-less tradeskill spy, then you're pathetic.
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Then you shouldnt get involved.
Attack what you can kill, dont overkill the situtation. :wtf: Nah I dont buy that. This is a PvP game, gritty dense cyberpunk atmosphere blah blah blah. If people only attacked when they could kill, they would never progress or learn anything.
Who would ever be challenged if people only fought those that they can kill? Who would ever fight for that matter? You can kill me, so you should fight me, but I cant kill you, so we shouldnt fight.
Gotta just stop and try to bust some ass at some point dont ya?
I honestly think that with KK adding the NCPD hotlist they are really trying to turn it into a viable lifestyle for more content. They just need to "unnerf" red-SL a little bit.
Steve
I was thinking about getting into it on my PE with the rest of the BD guys but I figured we'd just get owned. Without rares it's impossible to kill a good person on your own. Glad I didn't do it... I'd rather blow all my cash on other stuff....
Psycho Killa
19-02-04, 00:17
I was suprised to jest the first 2 hours we had almost noone we where chillin in industrial 2 for like an hour and noone came by.
Next thing I get work that theres 4 people gathering in pp3 near the ind1 border.
I got cool a fight I synch into industrial 1 and come out the other side dead with 3 pe's and a spy over my body (The only ones to come at us without a ppu)
Yes there wasnt always 8 people shooting us at a time but there where several times that atleast 5 attackers where wailing on us with a ppu in tow maybe you just werent one of the larger groups.
In total about 20 to 30 different people hunted for us throught a few hour period. It was great fun I mean I cant blame ppu to much for brining a ppu to much without being a hypocrit (Ive played a ppu forever) but it just is frustrating when adding some fun to the game its impossible to win.
If they fixed the item drop I wouldnt even care about ppus because I wouldnt mind dieing as much as I do now. As it is now I only have a limited amount of sets of items and cash to continue this and each death brings me closer to the end of the only fun ive had in neocron in who knows how long.
Its possible drake its just lame when they all bring ppu's.
We had so much plans for using the sewers but we wont get to do half the stuff we want before all our cash is blown.
Well we plan to farm mc5 after this maybe after a few weeks of that we can auction off the parts and make enough money to do this again for a very long time.
Unfortunately megaman is almost out of armor he didnt stock up enough :(
I can however hopefully do this for 2 or 3 more weeks with the stuff I have gathered but I still gotta pick up somne stuff from a guy whos been slaving over makind me 3 slotted spells and weapons.
After that I will see but im going to have to go back to my rare setup and get my soullight up.
And guess what any anti pkers I will still kill the same amount of people maybe even more but I will suffer 0 penalty because I will never carry a rare with red soullight and I will not kill enough to get red and I will do missions.
This system doesnt stop pkers it makes them be craftier. Making it so I only drop 1 item without a safeslot would make me carry a rare. You would need like what 30 to 50 hack to open the sucker? and a chance at a rare rather then a 2 slot blacksun and some shit armor...
[F6]Knight
19-02-04, 01:12
ppl who are stupid enough get red SL should deal with the fact that they will be hunted by large groups
because u have red SL u have killed innocent ppl and u simply are a criminal
whenever cops go get dangerous criminals they dont send 2 cops to capture 2 criminals if they know they are dangerous and armed
the same thing happens here
2 known murdererd (red SL) will be hunted by a larger group to assure their succes. deal with it
Psycho Killa
19-02-04, 01:18
Congradulations u win the I missed the whole point of the thread award.
I could give a shit if everyone hunted my down but that coupled with being barred from the main city and no safe slot is surely enough of a punishment/ deturrent
Do i really need to drop 7 items when i die?
Clownst0pper
19-02-04, 01:20
I thought about getting ikari's SL to -33 and using a DOY ragun. and going city admin.
That way u can never loose epic items.
*up here for thinking, down here for.....*
Psycho Killa
19-02-04, 01:24
You drop those....
Its not a real epic.
Megaman use a TSG but he still loses massive amounts of money in armor and constructed nib tank spells.
Clownst0pper
19-02-04, 01:29
You drop those....
OK that plans fucked :eek:
For any one that missed it, they went red on purpose. They purposely killed vendors to go red, to have fun with it. So ffs dont completely miss the point and say "red should not be viable because some one would be stupid to go red."
Going red is fun, especially with the NCPD most wanted list. You become a hunted criminal, and that is friggin awesome.
PK if you need me to help mass produce some Psi spells then I can btw.
sanityislost
19-02-04, 03:10
Yea the whole red thing is fucking sweet and last night after the FA vs FA war most of FA was on the ncpd list lolz
Also kk always said that having bad sl was meant to be another style of life, not a punishment.
Right now there are alot of ways to get negative sl and none of them really deserve the amount of penalties that is currently set up for the sl system.
Psycho Killa
19-02-04, 03:59
Aww suler I remember in beta when I seen you running around pepper park sewers killing mobs with your epr for soullight :eek:
Those where the days.
The spider sewer was the best because all those little ones it spawned counted as a whole monster to raise it.
I thought that system back then was good but I guess every game has to try to please the people who want people to suffer for killing them.
leGit v. 2
19-02-04, 10:38
im fucked dude.. i got negative 78 sl and iunno how im giong to get it back
I hate sl too... but I think at one point I was so negative to all factions that I simply stopped losing SL when I was kiling shit. this was a while ago but I remember something like that....
so... being the red bunch that you are...
Hows OZ8 looking these days ? :p
And am I right in thinking that to go factionless you basically kill yer own faction till you get kicked out?
SL sux... even for non-red people... like when someone accidentally walks into ur field of fire; u do like 1 dmg.. then they go off nad get pwnd.. and guess wut? U EAT TEH SHIT! there goes ur SL...
furthermore I tried being red on my droner (hell nothing to lose really other than some drones) but man...
o and factionless is when u get into a clan, then get neg symp in the faction of that clan; then u leave clan and ur faction boots u too.
Nightbrother
19-02-04, 10:54
Do you only lose the generic epic items when you have red sl, or do all epic items drop?
the generic epic item isnt classed as an epic item. Even though its a reward for an epic... go figure... (KK logic, gotta love it :p)
So, Only the generic epic items will drop, all the real epic items wont.
The Raygun you get for the generic epic used to be buyable in the shops as an alternative to the NCPD cannon and Reeza's Gaze rifle, same stats / reqs, same damage, different name. Chances are it'll be buyable again in DoY.
Nightbrother
19-02-04, 11:02
Originally posted by Elric
the generic epic item isnt classed as an epic item. Even though its a reward for an epic... go figure... (KK logic, gotta love it :p)
So, Only the generic epic items will drop, all the real epic items wont.
The Raygun you get for the generic epic used to be buyable in the shops as an alternative to the NCPD cannon and Reeza's Gaze rifle, same stats / reqs, same damage, different name. Chances are it'll be buyable again in DoY.
Splendid. Now I'm thinking of trying my hands on having a crazed murderer (with an epic item) on Pluto. He would be a resser also, although a crazed tank would probably fare a million times better than a crazed spy. Heh.
Thing is, being a spy with crap armor, next to no imps, and a TL75 Tangent Epic Rifle, you're not very likely to even dent the armor of high-level people with good armor and imps, are you? :(
leGit v. 2
19-02-04, 11:14
its not worth it
Nightbrother
19-02-04, 11:28
Originally posted by leGit v. 2
its not worth it
The spy being a murderer thing, you mean? I think I'll give it a try, and if it's too bloody hard (i.e. no fun whatsoever) and doesn't work at all I'll try something else.
Thanks for the well-thought out comment though. :p
Btw, lemme know if you need pokes, k? Remember, next 14 are free. Yes, I'm counting. ;)
i think best murderer spy is a droner... so u can kill from afar and all that... kamis, mos, pns... "The Unseen Bringer of Death"
:D
leGit v. 2
19-02-04, 11:33
the whole red sl thing is not going to work.. and its not worth it
Okay, could mega or PK outline the realistic costs we are talking about here?
I have been neg SL only because of runners in the caves not joining team and not understanding that doom beamers sometimes cause injuries. But I have never had real bad neg SL to the point that I was affected by it.
So you get the neg SL- can you give a detailed report of what its like after that in terms of cost?
Thanks.
i would expect armour alone per death is gonna be upwards of 50K a death maybe.
alsoyou lose a 5 slot spell you can spend well over 200k a go just getting another 5 slotter made
Originally posted by ezza
alsoyou lose a 5 slot spell you can spend well over 200k a go just getting another 5 slotter made
If you have the resources to do it then you can actually make a profit getting a 5 slot made. The problem is though the time involved. 5 Items over and over brings a lot of downtime trying to replace them. I guess when your red you need to choose better targets to make it profitable (and have to have a hacker in tow).
If they made Jailhouse a more red hangout area it might make it more intresting as they basically have at least two ways into OZ, one to the wasteland and one via Bump (although I am not sure if the TS guards would rip them a new one). 0 Drop for reds in Jailhouse, 1 for yellows, 5 for greens.
If that idea would be implemented Archeus, to avoid making the idea lame, it would be more as 0 drops for -33+ soullight, 5 for neutral and 10 for greens.
If people wanted to raid the jailhouse they would have to take the risk of losing items there. Unlike the red-SL criminals, the neutral and good soulight people have little risk in 99.8% elsewhere with only 1 item drops, while red-sl get to be listed on the NCPD list, unable to enter copbot-infested zones, loss of 5 items everywhere except Jailhouse, unable to hunt for rares of constant harrassment, few tradeskillers who would help a criminal, etc etc etc.
I still support my idea of Jailhouse resident hackers able to crack into your rpos signal and enable a cracked version of Safe-quickbelt belt and GR services.
Originally posted by Duder
If that idea would be implemented Archeus, to avoid making the idea lame, it would be more as 0 drops for -33+ soullight, 5 for neutral and 10 for greens.
Good point, or leave greens at 1 item, neutrals at 5 and reds at 0. It is pretty much impossible to get into jailhouse as a greenie (the guards even see stealthers).
Yes +5 for neutrals item drops, and -33 Red Soullight for 0 drops.
Why the -33 Soullight?
There will be lamers who would just go to -16 or -18 while bringing 2 ppus and a few Dev Tanks.
Psycho Killa
19-02-04, 19:29
30k Stealth 1 (Its worth it since it saves my ass alot)
20k Viper King (bought em in bulk)
20 to 30k Piece of random armor
20 to 40k or so atleast 1 slot gun.
20 to 30k Slotted spell or another piece of armor.
Anyways usualy close to 200k
Since I actualy drop I think maybe 6 or 7 items at negative 40.
Lifewaster
19-02-04, 20:21
I agree its rediculously hard.
I agree for reds, they should simply have One item drops but no safeslot.....
So you can actually bring your equips , and actually have more of a fight chance, but you do run the risk of losing the slot one item.
In todays game of slot one weapons , plus the tracking of reds, this is more than enough penalty.
Thing is, this way its even possibly more likely that a red person will drop a rare , because he will actually choose to risk carrying it.
And for those who wish to hunt reds, its better also, because instead of getting 20k resale value worth of items that wasted 200k of the Red player to get, they get a possible single "Good" item.
Lifewaster
19-02-04, 20:35
Originally posted by [F6]Knight
ppl who are stupid enough get red SL should deal with the fact that they will be hunted by large groups
Unless your a full time Pk'er , ppl usually turn red as a result of GR spamming/tunting by defeated players.
Usually, the first kill simply turns the killer yellow. And this is usually the only kill that has any cost against the victim via a belt drop etc.
Later this person can turn up with no gear or imps at a close GR, repeatedly run to the person who killed him first time and instigate various means to provoke being killed again, and repeat indefinitely.
KILLING a player who is simply GR spamming and does NOT have any belt or imps to drop, should not generate SL loss IMO.
Or else make it mean something to the guy spamming, for example if you die , when already over 50% synap , then you lose EXP or whatever.
Originally posted by Lifewaster
KILLING a player who is simply GR spamming and does NOT have any belt or imps to drop, should not generate SL loss IMO.
I disagree, they are clearly doing it to stop an idiot from GR camping. The idiot in question can leave the area and kill elsewhere.
oh shuddup about whos lame!
red aint viable, lets try to figure out a way to fix it, k?
gaah... man, im like, gonna go get wasted
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