View Full Version : Apu unfairness.
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 20:17
OK, Why should an APU be restricted to there most effective weapon being TL 101?
We all know rare barrels are shit and inpracticle, So why, is every other weapon having a TL revision, + dmg increase, yet the most common and the best APU spell really is low TL, no longer has a good range, its ROF has been nerfed to fuck and back, and its damage on my tank is laughable.
Yet my tank recieves a devourer which is tl98 that reduces every classes defence to zero, and his CS which is only afew tl's higher than Holy Lighting hurts like a TL 115 rare.
I just think its abit 'off'
Lets see APU's get some loving instead of you all kicking them in some more. :mad:
Punisher-X
16-02-04, 20:25
Agreed.
They got a poor choice of spells, doing poor damage and generally with poor range. And thats even on a totally pure, pvp specced APU.
Watching a APUvsTank duel now is more like watching a comedy show.
I dont have, nor do I play an APU, so before anyone says it, no Im not biased.
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 20:26
I have every class.
And have recently began to play an APU.
And TBH, they have just been brutalised with nerfs.
There dmg is now laughable along with there defence.
How many do u now see at OP wars? Hardly any thats for sure! o_O
Lifewaster
16-02-04, 20:29
What about PPUs , their best weapon is TL 8 .... :p
But I really dont get whats the prob with lower TL items though, if you raised HL to higher TL what diff will it make? apart from probably requiring more stats to cap it.
Or is there some secret whereby weapon TL effects armor resist in PvP ?
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 20:31
Everyone knows a weapons dmg is based on TL.
Hence why the first love/disruptor at tl 114/115 are the hardest rifles.
The same can be said for a CS whos dmg is 10x above its TL.
Yet an APU has a TL 101 weapon (holy lighting) at there disposal, and its dmg is awful now days.
Shadow Dancer
16-02-04, 20:32
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
I have every class.
And have recently began to play an APU.
And TBH, they have just been brutalised with nerfs.
There dmg is now laughable along with there defence.
How many do u now see at OP wars? Hardly any thats for sure! o_O
Apus haven't been brutalized with nerfs. o_O
When was RoF nerfed? You mean from 150 to 120? Well not all hits would register at 150, so it's no biggie. And the damage was increased to compensate. I understand HL was overnerfed. I hate that too. But fire apoc still kicks ass.
As for apus at op wars, yup i'm seeing alot less apus now. And alot more dev tanks. 8|
I think they should get a TL 115 direct damage spell, with reaaaaaaally low rof.
well a higher tl means more damage normally.
and on topic my apu dies like to 1 or 2 bursts of cs now i took like 3 or 4 before.
Yeah? I also want an AOE weapon on my spy and a better AOE weapon for pistolers. (btw, the test server patch boosts those items a little, i dont know if its any better though)
I dont know what the problem is with apu monks because I dont have one nor have i encountered alot of apu monks.
but as far as i know, there damage and rate of fire for that damage was what got me, not their range.
Agree 100%.
CS got a good boost. Dev did too(didn't need it... but anywho). So, let's make the APU spells actually hit like their TL.
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 20:40
But fire apoc still kicks ass.
Does it? Its dmg is that insane it does 24 dmg per hit on my tank? I got holy lightning to about 40-60 variably.
With holy shelter both are next to nothing.
Its laughable.
Something needs sorting big time!
Fire Apoc needs a boost but its nice still
Shadow Dancer
16-02-04, 20:42
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Does it? Its dmg is that insane it does 24 dmg per hit on my tank? I got holy lightning to about 40-60 variably.
With fire apoc, the damage is very random. But trust me, it's powerful. I just think it's "low" random damage is to low.
Holy Shelter? I don't even waste time hitting people with holy shelter, i debuff first.
•Super|\|ova•
16-02-04, 20:45
HL still does more dmg than any tank weapon... well maybe except for the MS but it sucks in every other way.
Bring back the original *Holy Lighting*
its a bit Holy Shito atm :lol:
Love for APUs!
and then there is my melee tank whos best PvP weapon is tl 99.... and highest tl weapon is 103... I can live with it, so suck it up. :rolleyes:
Only beef I got with apus was the amount of damage they could unleash in a few seconds.
i had no problem with their range.
my suggestion for a nerf a long time ago was just reduce the rate of fire, leave the damage.
like 90 r/m rather than 105 r/m
but of course i got flamed to death.
btw, the CS got a boost?
it doesnt seem very strong, i was dueling a bunch of CS wielding tanks in neofrag on my PE.
they beat me each time but i almost got them too with my Judge.
one tank was actually using a tangent plasma cannon, he beat me too but i almost got him too. I gotta neofrag more :)
btw, that same TPC tank beat a CS tank :)
If i had my con capped my pe would be faster and perhaps I would of beaten those tanks.
(I got 7 con levels I believe left to get, all those points are going into athletics)
that devils grace on melee tanks hurts >_<
course when he attacked me he shocked me first (hint hint to other melee tanks)
Originally posted by FatDogg
and then there is my melee tank whos best PvP weapon is tl 99.... and highest tl weapon is 103... I can live with it, so suck it up. :rolleyes:
...well u live with your whatever, we want Holy Lighting back!
I will, just give me a tl 115 melee weapon and watch the dev tanks disapear from op wars
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 20:52
and then there is my melee tank whos best PvP weapon is tl 99.... and highest tl weapon is 103... I can live with it, so suck it up.
Devils Grace is soon to be tl 115
Dribble Joy
16-02-04, 20:53
Read the testserver forum....
haha, I got owned... oh man, that makes me happy to see that, I need to get on the TS more often.
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 21:01
Dont see one monk improvement in the next patch or 2.
Pretty disappointing, thinking of playing my APU over tank just to make a statement now days.
Dribble Joy
16-02-04, 21:02
I don't wanna sound like a whiney fuck, but the PE aint in a good position either.
The CS/dev/majority of rares boost was inintended, and I get the feeling it won't be changed back.
The Judge boost and libby fix was supposed to help us, but with the main tank weapons dmg increased more than the PE guns, PEs are feeling pretty low atm.
Originally posted by Thanatos
HL was indeed reduced in damage. As far as I know this was unintentional and will be rectified.
Though I hope they fix CS/ Dev dmg again... can't find a quote on that but I think they are... god I hope so.
Dribble Joy
16-02-04, 21:04
Before the last patch PE/tank/monk was pretty much right. (other than judge dmg and apu range)
Now it's a bit of a mess.
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 21:04
I agree. Nothing worse than going on, and being blasted by a dev, great random shooting weapon that needs 0 lockon :rolleyes: , and being dead in about 3 bursts or less. I love not having a chance to retaliate in those respects, it makes PvP so exciting for me :rolleyes: . Of course, tanks will continue to complain about targetting recticles when I have yet to seee a tank bothering to wait for their recticle with the dev. They draw it and start blasting away with that canon.
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Dont see one monk improvement in the next patch or 2.
Pretty disappointing, thinking of playing my APU over tank just to make a statement now days.
When the last hybrid slap came down from high I found myself back in my old school beta 4 tank again, but I honestly see strong points for APU's at op wars, especially when defending. those "useless" rare barrels can prevent lots of people from getting past you. Especially if you have a strong front line of tanks sucking up damage from a wave of hostiles. What (my opinion) I dont see enough of at op wars are PE's and spy's other than to stealth in and scope the op. They should have a place in op wars, and I do see things slowly changing, like the new PE driving class, which I think has alot of potential for op wars once we get some more ASG love. Spies are never the back row of snipers like they should be, picking off the weak, but I think everything is getting closer to how things are supposed to be. The point where I do aggree with you is that nerfs suck. KK has been nerfing everything and everyone at least once, and my question is why won't they actually give a boost to the underpowered instead of nerfing the "supposedly" overpowered classes/weapons/GM's....
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
I have every class.
And have recently began to play an APU.
And TBH, they have just been brutalised with nerfs.
There dmg is now laughable along with there defence.
How many do u now see at OP wars? Hardly any thats for sure! o_O
its funny to see that u realised that the APU got nerfed and should be boosted *AFTER* u started 1 :wtf:
Edit:
Originally posted by Dribble Joy
I don't wanna sound like a whiney fuck, but the PE aint in a good position either.
The CS/dev/majority of rares boost was inintended, and I get the feeling it won't be changed back.
The Judge boost and libby fix was supposed to help us, but with the main tank weapons dmg increased more than the PE guns, PEs are feeling pretty low atm.
so u want pistols to do the same dmg as cannons?
how about NO
TL does not currently have much to do with a weapons damage or "quality".
Lupus' current changes on TS are trying to address this but atm TL means jack shit on retail.
Only thing higher TL would do for you is make it harder to cap.
Shadow Dancer
16-02-04, 21:18
Using rare barrels to prevent people getting past you?
*sigh*
nvm, I was going to correct this statement. But it's not even worth it.
wanna know what my suggestion on a nerf to apus was?
SLIGHTLY reduce their damage, reduce the randomness of their damage and decrease there rate of fire from 105 to 90.
problem solved.
but who listens to me :rolleyes:
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 21:22
Originally posted by Zanathos
wanna know what my suggestion on a nerf to apus was?
SLIGHTLY reduce their damage, reduce the randomness of their damage and decrease there rate of fire from 105 to 90.
problem solved.
but who listens to me :rolleyes: How about giving APU's a three round burst attak like some tanks, spies, and PE's got :p
Dribble Joy
16-02-04, 21:22
Originally posted by Zanathos
but who listens to me :rolleyes:
Don't get me started on why... (ps, no offence meant)
Psycho Killa
16-02-04, 21:23
There going to redo psi spells completely at a later date calm down.
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 21:26
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
There going to redo psi spells completely at a later date calm down. When Hell freezes over maybe?
@ dribble joy
hmm?
you dont like any of the ideas ive had?
or just this one?
i see nothing wrong with the idea, reduce the damage on the apu spells, but reduce the randomness of damage their spells do, then decrease their rate of fire from 105 to 90
which means your shooting about 2 miliseconds slower :rolleyes:
in a sense, its not really a nerf, its just balancing them.
reduced damage, but the minimum and maximum damage delt by apus would be increased in minimum damage and decreased in maximum damage which means there damage output is not really touched much in this sense (other than a slight nerf)
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 21:33
Originally posted by Zanathos
@ dribble joy
hmm?
you dont like any of the ideas ive had?
or just this one?
i see nothing wrong with the idea, reduce the damage on the apu spells, but reduce the randomness of damage their spells do, then decrease their rate of fire from 105 to 90
which means your shooting about 2 miliseconds slower :rolleyes:
in a sense, its not really a nerf, its just balancing them.
reduced damage, but the minimum and maximum damage delt by apus would be increased in minimum damage and decreased in maximum damage which means there damage output is not really touched much in this sense (other than a slight nerf) KK would have to rework the system, cause a monk can't competantly runcast unless he is at 95 or better.
Shadow Dancer
16-02-04, 21:36
Yes he can nash. I run/cast fire apoc.
I think apus should get reticle, and let THAT judge damage not friggin randomness.
then let them rework it to compensate.
i dont see why my idea couldnt be used.
i think it perfectly balances them.
i know i know shadow dancer.... but :rolleyes:
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Yes he can nash. I run/cast fire apoc.
I think apus should get reticle, and let THAT judge damage not friggin randomness. Correct me if I'm wrong, but do you mean that the more the reticle is closed the more damage you do? Or just plain as with normal weapons?
It's fine for me either way.
Monks need some loving.
INT XP boost.
No more random Hl damage.
Give HL a damage boost
Give HL either a range/frequency boost
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 21:39
its funny to see that u realised that the APU got nerfed and should be boosted *AFTER* u started 1
As i always say, I only care about classes I play, now I play an APU id like something done.
As TBH, how can i comment on a class I no nothing about? Which I do now, and so can comment!
unfairness? u know what fu
u know whats unfair
-apus dont have reticle
-apu buffed with lvl 3 buffs have same frigging defence than a tank
-apus spells are way fucking overpowered than any wep
Clownst0pper
16-02-04, 21:44
apus dont have reticle
They still miss cast
-apu buffed with lvl 3 buffs have same frigging defence than a tank
Wrong, an APU can have good defence, but not better, A tank without shelter is uber defence, even more amazing with it. A monk can never have the con setup of a tank
-apus spells are way fucking overpowered than any wep
How can this be when there holy lighting does next to nothing when my tank has a holy shelter?
Please come back to the topic when u arent an 0/2 who has no idea of neocrons workings
why are you using a holy lightning on a holy sheltered tank? :rolleyes:
I can understand the problem though, debuffing takes awile.
which equals dead apu
Originally posted by Bl1nd
-apu buffed with lvl 3 buffs have same frigging defence than a tank A tank buffed with level 3 buffs has more defence then an APU, so I think that's balanced. :rolleyes:
:rolleyes: is a registered trademark of the Shadow Dancer corporation, but has in this case been used under the Fair Use laws.
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 21:50
All my tank encounters have = the same scenario. Seeing a dev whipped out and being blasted in 3 bursts or less. I watch my life start out at 278 (even with med poison belt on, which is all I can wear at the moment) go down to 126. That is 152 points of damage in first shot!!! Second shot, I go from 126 down to 26, another 100 points of damage from second shot. You can guess that third burst = me dead. I can outlast damage from fire apoc and holy lightning alot longer than I can a devourer. If anything, I prefer fighting a PE with a libby or a judge, or another capped monk, at least I know I might have a chance to kill them in my newbie APU compared a tank right now.
Tanks might need a recticle, but they really don't need it when they can just aim in the general location with AoE weapons. Hell, I wish I could cast my holy halo's and just have it hit the geenral area, instead of mis casting, like it does now. That's the trade off. I can't indirectly target you, while a tank can.
Originally posted by Nash_Brigham
at least I know I might have a chance to kill them in my newbie APU compared a tank right now.
O_o
n00b!
Shadow Dancer
16-02-04, 21:58
Originally posted by Nash_Brigham
All my tank encounters have = the same scenario. Seeing a dev whipped out and being blasted in 3 bursts or less. I watch my life start out at 278 (even with med poison belt on, which is all I can wear at the moment) go down to 126. That is 152 points of damage in first shot!!! Second shot, I go from 126 down to 26, another 100 points of damage from second shot. You can guess that third burst = me dead. I can outlast damage from fire apoc and holy lightning alot longer than I can a devourer.
I know. Devourer is fucking insane. I can't afford much poison on my apu, not unless i want him to be a turret. And the devourer does like 200 damage to me in like 1.5 seconds. :wtf:
Thank god it has short range.
Originally posted by J. Folsom
:rolleyes: is a registered trademark of the Shadow Dancer corporation, but has in this case been used under the Fair Use laws.
:lol:
Originally posted by J. Folsom
Correct me if I'm wrong, but do you mean that the more the reticle is closed the more damage you do? Or just plain as with normal weapons?
It's fine for me either way.
The former.
Originally posted by Opar
Monks need some loving.
INT XP boost.
No more random Hl damage.
Give HL a damage boost
Give HL either a range/frequency boost
INT xp boost should be mandatory for all monks. Their should even be no question about it.
HL randomness........I prefer it to be replaced by reticle.
Yes atm HL needs a damage boost, I agree.
HL does not need/deserve a range/frequency boost.
Originally posted by Bl1nd
unfairness? u know what fu
u know whats unfair
-apus dont have reticle
-apu buffed with lvl 3 buffs have same frigging defence than a tank
-apus spells are way fucking overpowered than any wep
Absolutely clueless.
-Yes no reticle. The ONLY thing you got right.
-Um no, that's not true. Unless you mean a SHELTERED apu vs an unsheltered tank. I hope you don't mean that. :rolleyes:
-Even after the massive HL nerf, you think apu spells are overpowered? Give me a damn break. :rolleyes:
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
They still miss cast
I never miss cast, unless I miss. Duh, that's why it's called a miss. :p
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Wrong, an APU can have good defence, but not better, A tank without shelter is uber defence, even more amazing with it. A monk can never have the con setup of a tank
Correct.
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Please come back to the topic when u arent an 0/2 who has no idea of neocrons workings
:lol:
Originally posted by Zanathos
why are you using a holy lightning on a holy sheltered tank? :rolleyes:
I can understand the problem though, debuffing takes awile.
which equals dead apu
That's not a problem. It only takes 3 seconds to cast a debuff. If you're sheltered, you can take the damage and then drop them really fast when they have no shelter. Devourer is a different story. But you gotta get some distance and be quick about the debuffing, or ask your PPU to heal you.
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 21:58
Originally posted by Zanathos
O_o
n00b! Uh huh, but at leat I put up a fight instead of spamming direct channels :p
Lifewaster
16-02-04, 22:01
Wierd, but I'm finding melee tanks way , way more dangerous than dev ones.
At close range, a tiny strafe makes the dev miss, over and over it will miss if you just move. Melee seems to hit way more even if your trying to avoid it.
Mebbe its just cos HC tanks dont have their short range aiming down yet ? but more likely that Dev is actually hard to aim and move with and players just need to learn to move the fuk out of the way when someone points a dev at then.
Its weapon that breaks thru shelter, and hits hard if you let someone stick it up your nose and hold it there.
Compared to HL , well if you make HL have 10 range and miss every second shot on a moving target then sure, make it do as much damage as the dev.
Only weakness with HL I've seen is against sheltered targets. Boosting it damage wont make much diff there while would make a lot against unsheltereds, so I dunno how you can really boost it without overpowering, unless you just reduce shelters instead ?
Nash_Brigham
16-02-04, 22:02
Originally posted by Lifewaster
Wierd, but I'm finding melee tanks way , way more dangerous than dev ones.
At close range, a tiny strafe makes the dev miss, over and over it will miss if you just move. Melee seems to hit way more even if your trying to avoid it.
Mebbe its just cos HC tanks dont have their short range aiming down yet ? but more likely that Dev is actually hard to aim and move with and players just need to learn to move the fuk out of the way when someone points a dev at then.
Its weapon that breaks thru shelter, and hits hard if you let someone stick it up your nose and hold it there.
Compared to HL , well if you make HL have 10 range and miss every second shot on a moving target then sure, make it do as much damage as the dev.
Only weakness with HL I've seen is against sheltered targets. Boosting it damage wont make much diff there while would make a lot against unsheltereds, so I dunno how you can really boost it without overpowering, unless you just reduce shelters instead ? I move alot when I see a tank pull out a dev, and I move around him, but a dev tank doesn't need to aim, just hit the general location near you at your feet. I dunno how many times I have been behind a tank just to see the blasts ont ehg round in front of me, and my life bar just drop insanely fast.
oh, i was reffering to the rare debuff spells.
didnt even think about the shelter debuff spell.
me spamming direct chat channels? why would i do that?
Lifewaster
16-02-04, 22:35
Well, about the dev, I dont wanna see it damage reduced, but maybe , it needs adjustment in rof, so if you dodge the burst, you get more of a chance before the next burst.
Problem is reducing rof would weaken it a lot.
So maybe, if you decreased its clip size , that will use reloading time as the effective "rof " reducer.
Good dev users could then still have say 2 or 3 shots available if they dont waste them, but less skilled users wouldnt find it so easy, if they blow 2 shots on misses they will only get one left before a significant reload delay or something etc.
Just a maybe, I've no clue what the clip size actually is atm.
Heavyporker
16-02-04, 22:51
My opinion...
lower rare barrel mana cost by 50 on each, raise their TLs a bit more, and raise their RoF by another 6/min.
that should make it somewhat possible to actually use them in a fight, not just PvM.
And unnerf APU poison. There's antidote spells and pills, there's NO POINT not to bring poison back up.
FA should have its RoF upped by another 4-8/min to at least let us stack it enough to overcome the 1/2 dmg penalty of stacked fire ticks, and reduce its mana cost by 5 ( so it's actually possble to stack it up decently without having to pop a booster by the fifth cast)
TL 115 poison beam/ball, make it more rare than a dev, then that should let things settle down.
Oh, and make APU antiheal actually have an anti-heal duration, not simply a removal of current heal process, which is simply wank.
Clownst0pper
17-02-04, 01:00
TL 115 poison beam/ball, make it more rare than a dev, then that should let things settle down
Poison certainly isnt the answer.
Id rather see a pure Xray Beam.
Oh, and make APU antiheal actually have an anti-heal duration, not simply a removal of current heal process, which is simply wank
The anti heal should cause heals on the person it was cast on inable to cast heals for a duration like 10 seconds or so. I agree
Q`alooaith
17-02-04, 02:32
I'd much rather APU's got a psi attack 3 spell...
Psi attack 2 can be deadly for it's level.
APU's to a great deal of damage, can't take much but they do a hell of a lot of damage.. well they can do a hell of a lot of damage..
Ignoreing PPU buff's and shelters, as we all know what happen's to ALL the classes when they've got a PPU blue glued to their butt's.
Tank's have a new toy and APU's are nerfed, people are moving from monk's toward's tank again, and I realy don't have a problem with this, if the dev is overpowered, which I personaly don't think it is due to it's insanely short range, it'll get ballanced out in the end..
Barrel's can be very effective, if you use them not as damage weapon's, but to force people out of well defended and covered position's, say at an op war somone's cowering behind a load of cover and healing up out of the main fight, barrel away..
APU's are not the fighter's, they are the artty, the big gun's at the back and middle, supporting the main assault force..
Originally posted by Q`alooaith
I'd much rather APU's got a psi attack 3 spell...
Psi attack 2 can be deadly for it's level.
I agree......
And there going to need it when the mobs' resists get changed....
@SD
If monks got a reticle, I'd have two open character slots to fill with more useful characters....
Originally posted by Q`alooaith
APU's are not the fighter's, they are the artty, the big gun's at the back and middle, supporting the main assault force..
Except that their range puts them on the front line.;)
Heavyporker
17-02-04, 05:45
FUcking range nerfs... grr...
I'd be more than happy to lose a TL 115 poison spell in favor of a rare Force damage lance with knockback.
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
OK, Why should an APU be restricted to there most effective weapon being TL 101?
We all know rare barrels are shit and inpracticle, So why, is every other weapon having a TL revision, + dmg increase, yet the most common and the best APU spell really is low TL, no longer has a good range, its ROF has been nerfed to fuck and back, and its damage on my tank is laughable.
Yet my tank recieves a devourer which is tl98 that reduces every classes defence to zero, and his CS which is only afew tl's higher than Holy Lighting hurts like a TL 115 rare.
I just think its abit 'off'
Lets see APU's get some loving instead of you all kicking them in some more. :mad:
How bout some stfu and we all wait for the next patch. cause i am damn sure lupus is doing a great job.
kthxbye
Totally agree :mad:
UnNerf APU's back, the range is a joke on all high lvl spells, even on the queen avalanche spell!! and the dmg has been decreasing and decreasing!
That's probably why I'm not playing my capped APU anymore...
UNNERF APUS GOD DAMN IT! :cool:
Heavyporker
17-02-04, 10:01
agreed.
I totally stopped hunting with my apu. Just... pfft.
Original monk
17-02-04, 10:17
Originally posted by Heavyporker
agreed.
I totally stopped hunting with my apu. Just... pfft.
lom to hybrid :)
Heavyporker
17-02-04, 10:20
yeah, right. weaker dmg on top of dmg nerf AND more spells to juggle in QB while hunting.. joy.
that and the interminable lengths of lomming. what pleasures.
No thanks. I think I'll settle down and become a merchant. I'm pretty much the best-known techpart vendor on Pluto :D
Well... the most willing to sell/trade his techparts, anyway :P
yes please unfuck apus.... 1v1 you dont stand a chance vs a tank anymore....
the dmg is just a joke right now....
I dont play an APU as a damage dealer any more, tanks have taken that role from me, now I use a Holy Antibuff to take down enemies defences so tanks can finish them off and I use Fire Apoc to make enemies run around in panic which is funny :)
It would be nice to make the rare barrels either last longer OR do more damage OR use less of your psi pool.
steweygrrr
17-02-04, 13:49
The main problem is having to lose about 20% of our PSI pool to get the APU/PPU reqs that have been jacked up so high. I can use HL sure, but I only got 317 PSI pool after losing the PPW bonuses from my PSI core and having to get 145 APU to use it. And I wont be able to spec any more PPW at all for the rest of my levels (base PSI 80) as I will need all the APU I can get to cap damage on that and FA.
Clownst0pper
17-02-04, 14:23
How bout some stfu and we all wait for the next patch. cause i am damn sure lupus is doing a great job.
Er, Nice maturity there from a 5 year old who obviously has no idea about Neocron. :wtf:
tl of devourer, cs and hl are to low
hl got nerfed but main problems are the tank tls, most powerfull weapons in the game has the lowest tl ...
My two cents on apus...
I have an apu almost capped and we do not make any serious damage... we cant run... we cant buff... we dont have enough defense...
ohh... I forgot, we can die
apus (and ppus) have ruled the land for a good long while now
things are just being balanced out, before the devourer tanks were reeeeeeally hurting, especially against ppus.
Q`alooaith
17-02-04, 15:51
Originally posted by jernau
Except that their range puts them on the front line.;)
So, there are many front line weapon system's that are not great in combat toe to toe..
Anyway, APU's have enough range not to be in the front, but more a middle...
Psi monk's get a lot of energy resist from armor, they get psi modules with damage type's of all but Xray (they should never get Xray damage ever BTW)
Psi monk's are finaly starting to head towards ballence, fighting an APU/PPU combo with anything but another APU/PPU combo or a greatly advantaged team was just asking for trouble.. Now psi monk's have lost much power, they are no longer the vital part in a plan, but the support to a plan.
Monk's need to be ballenced out, then the other classes can be ballenced out and so on..
I have to agree....
Monk have been nerfed way to much during the year i play. I even got killed by 3 Launcher Cyclopses a short time ago. It's a joke. If this goes on, you'll only find capped APU's playin' in the sewers having a hard time beating Sewer Rats or something like that :confused: . Monks need some loving.....
Jesterthegreat
17-02-04, 21:00
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
OK, Why should an APU be restricted to there most effective weapon being TL 101?
We all know rare barrels are shit and inpracticle, So why, is every other weapon having a TL revision, + dmg increase, yet the most common and the best APU spell really is low TL, no longer has a good range, its ROF has been nerfed to fuck and back, and its damage on my tank is laughable.
Yet my tank recieves a devourer which is tl98 that reduces every classes defence to zero, and his CS which is only afew tl's higher than Holy Lighting hurts like a TL 115 rare.
I just think its abit 'off'
Lets see APU's get some loving instead of you all kicking them in some more. :mad:
onoz! APU's need a boost!
its fine. leave it.
before you ask yes a have an APU, yes i have played near all class / weapon combo's to cap / near cap.
no your full of shit... apu really need one... they are kinda useless right now... take away debuff and they are like pistol spys... even worse now that exec does well....
yeah your right but you can't go any better than "holy", and a revision of a apu module which will have the same visuals and damage but with a different name would be stupid :|. you can't have "holy holy lighting" or a "holy thunderlight" <-- I hope you understand what I mean. I'm not against it, the latest patch really nerfed our range/damage, and I'm not against new modules, but what can I say, you already got a rare energy, fire and poison beam.
Shadow Dancer
17-02-04, 23:32
We don't have a rare poison beam, I wish we did.
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 01:06
its fine. leave it.
You obviously have no clue.
When the most 'powerfully offensive' class no longer does fuck all.
And it is infact the tank which has taken over. And in most cases every other class does more dmg, something is seriously wrong.
APU now has bad dmg and defence. Wheres the 'fine' and 'leave it' in that?
Shadow Dancer
18-02-04, 01:14
*ahem*
Clown I think you may be giving a colored view of the situation. :p
I wouldn't say that EVERY other class outdamages us.
Here let me put forth my view points. HL to me seems to do only a little more than CS, and is of course faster. Also the random damage sux. I wish we had a reticle to determine our damage instead of randomness. I think HL TL should be raised to like 107. And I think it was overnerfed.
Fire apoc does good damage. But it seems to do shitty damage to pes most of the time. I really really really suspect that shelter absorbs more fire than it does any other form of damage. Also it's slower, AND it does stack damage which is NOT A GOOD THING. Stack damage is just the entire damage broken up. It gives ppus more time to shelter up, and combine that with the slow rof and it's pretty sucky against most ppus unless they are really careless or have shitty fire resist. 1v1 fire apoc is "ok". But again it does stack damage and is slower. So sometimes that can really work against you. Also, IMO fire apoc's "low" random damage is too low. Even though the spell itself is still powerful.
HL is still ok, but I think it needs a damage boost or to be higher TL. Also, I think apus should get a rare poison beam. I also think devourer damage is a bit too close to apu damage, I don't give a shit about it's supposed low range.
One last thing. APUS ARE NOT OVERPOWERED. Ok guys? Get that through your thick skulls. Yea you could complain about range before and HL damage before, but HL damage has been significantly cut down and so has range. So don't give me that crap about apus still being overpowered. I think it's about damn time all monks got their INT fixed AND apus got some form of healing.
i laugh to myself as my holy lighting with 630% damage does 27 damage to a unbuffed tank:rolleyes:
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 01:35
i laugh to myself as my holy lighting with 630% damage does 27 damage to a unbuffed tank
I dont find it amusing :(
Clown I think you may be giving a colored view of the situation.
Never :eek: :lol:
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
I dont find it amusing :(
Never :eek: :lol:
yea i know... i was just joking,..
i really yell at my monitor and say bad things...but...o_O
Clownst0pper
18-02-04, 01:42
i really yell at my monitor and say bad things...but...
Of course, Jestthegreat thinks it fine, no doubt a PE/SPY player :rolleyes:
Q`alooaith
18-02-04, 04:38
Clown, it's been said that the last patch or two nerfed the HL, but where not meant to, so should be fixxed in a patch or two..
Anyway, just think now monk's high level feel's terible to ppl maybe you'll lose the class hoppers and you won't be paying an arm and a leg for them DS/Psi core/HL parts...
The door does swing both ways, you just have to stand back far enough to see how every change that nerfs you, also helps you in other ways..
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