View Full Version : MJS - Clarification Please
I've talked to people in-game dozens of times about this, but nobody seems to know.
When DoY is released, what is happening to Neocron and it's accounts? Here's what I've heard:
- There will be a new server that players can start a DoY character on. Existing NC servers will stay as is.
- There will be a skill release on the existing servers and the servers will stay the same.
- There will be a character wipe and the servers will stay the same.
- All characters on all servers will be wiped and existing NC customers will get a discount on "upgrading" their account to a DoY account where everyone starts off on the same level with nothing.
-----------
I personally hope the last one is the case for several reasons.
- DoY is meant to be a new product, with a new product hopefully comes new players. You can't expect a couple hundred (I'm being optimistic) new people to enjoy starting in a game where the majority of the population is already capped and has tons of cash and has apartments full of stuff. They might as well join now, hate the vetran community with too many capped/bored/egotistical dicks in it and just quit so it's over and done with.
- I don't even want to begin to imagine the technical issues with converting all existing things to the DoY schema... there was talk of a database upgrade a long time ago, I don't know if it happened. But the engine upgrade alone is enough reason to wipe all the databases and start anew.
Ok, I'm tired of typing, but that's my question. When DoY is released, what will the server setttings be and what happens to all existing player accounts? I'm all for a 100% wipe as it's being marketed as a new product and shoudl be treated as one.
Thanks in advance for any official word :)
Keyol45743241
08-02-04, 15:50
Anti NC factions will move to DoY.
There will be no Char wipes. :rolleyes:
•Super|\|ova•
08-02-04, 15:52
Hehe... the last two options wont definitely happen. That's for sure :cool:
funkeymonkey
08-02-04, 16:19
Im all for a total character wipe. Though i guess some people who have put more time into this game and worked really hard for all there mc5 chips and the like (which i just dont have time for unfortunatly) wont like the idea too much.
Would be cool to see the mb and aggie cellars full off people. See who can win the first to wear a pa race, who can get a complete rare first, etc. And lvl 3 imps wouldnt be as avaible as they are now.
Somthing that is in danger of happening though is the majority of the population going anti city so they can live in doy.
Its lame i know but we would also run the risk of people stealing others names before they get a chance to create their character.
i think there was a post that you can play with the old NC but without the new GFX and without doy. you just get the basics.
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
A) Yes, but they will miss out a lot of the fun. They won't be able to enter DoY, they won't get the engine upgrade, no new char models and pretty much all the other points on the list won't work for them, unless they are required basics.
...
Q`alooaith
08-02-04, 16:24
I'm all for a whipe..
As long as mob's dropped gun's again and the aggy celler's where removed..
Though why char's would need any change's is beyond me, BDoY will be just like a patch in term's of how if affect's char's.. you might a have a little too little in some skill's and too much in other's, but all in all you should not have to tweak much..
I fully intend to reroll all my char's with BDoY.. Though I might play my old one's a bit till I know what the high level stuff is like, then go back to rerolling every three month's....
I complete server wide wipe would be the best thing for BDOY.. Even though people will whine and complaint hat they "are going to leave" because thye lost all ther egreat and wonderful things but like FN said you cant possibly think people will enjoy this game with so many people being at max levels and have a whole bunch of money, with an over inflated economy.. BDOY Is a NEW Game not an Expansion so I can see why a server wide character/item/money wipe would be good.. Especially for the database.. Maybe it would fix alot of the lag issues as well.. I can see this game not getting very popular if they do not make a new server or wipe all the old ones of everything.. :\
Rento Webex
08-02-04, 16:44
I want DOY, but I dont want to level my chars again that would just be stupid, I want to be able to take the chars I have now into DOY.
If KK would wipe the servers for BDoY you'll see many people leave. You cant just wipe the servers coz of an addon. People invested too much time into it and that would make them really pissed. Beside, these people would also lose the trust into working anything up again as in who guarantees them it wont happen again with the next add-on...
Originally posted by Rento Webex
I want DOY, but I dont want to level my chars again that would just be stupid, I want to be able to take the chars I have now into DOY.
I agree.....
And what would be the point of even playing/leveling right now if everything was going to get wiped for BDOY......
Originally posted by Lucjan
If KK would wipe the servers for BDoY you'll see many people leave. You cant just wipe the servers coz of an addon. People invested too much time into it and that would make them really pissed. Beside, these people would also lose the trust into working anything up again as in who guarantees them it wont happen again with the next add-on...
Errm.. I thought BDOY wasn't just an addon?? People who "leave" will come back they always do.. Even the one who have lost everything came back.. I would guess the point of this thread is to make people stop thinking about themselves and maybe more about the new comers? Some people would like to be ABLE to play without playing with a bunch of people who are already completely leveled.. Remember this is Neocron last hope to stay alive and you think people will come and stay in BDOY without a server wipe or atleast a new serveR?? Maybe not a character wipe would be kind of bad but an Item/MOney wipe would be the best of things..
funkeymonkey
08-02-04, 17:01
aye actually an item/money wipe would be kind to the noobs but not totally piss off existing players. Also wouldnt have the problem i posted about people stealing each others names.
well as much fun as a character wipe would be, i dont want to level my 8 chars over again thanks:rolleyes:
Eledhbrant
08-02-04, 17:13
As posted above my opinion would be what is the point in leveling now then if its all going to be wiped?
And who's to say it won't happen AGAIN in the future?
Originally posted by n3m
A) Will Players without the Expension/BDOY be able to play?
B) Will those 'Peeks' be weekly? like every tuesday, or just random?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
[B]A) Yes, but they will miss out a lot of the fun. They won't be able to enter DoY, they won't get the engine upgrade, no new char models and pretty much all the other points on the list won't work for them, unless they are required basics.
B) No, not weekly... but we [b]try to be bi-weekly.
Originally posted by Eledhbrant
As posted above my opinion would be what is the point in leveling now then if its all going to be wiped?
And who's to say it won't happen AGAIN in the future?
BDOY Is A NEW START FOR NEOCRON!! This is why it would be a good reason for character wipe or just an item/Money wipe.. and why it wont happen again! If BDOY fails I doubt Necron will be around for Tokyo II or Irata III or any other Expansio
If there is a character wipe then KK can fuck right off.
And I think other people will think like this.
I've worked too hard and too damn long on my existing chars just for them to be wiped.
Since I know many people who would get pissed off if their characters were deleted, I'm against the wipe, if only because I want other people I know around :p
I personally wouldn't mind apart from that, I've had around 30 different characters by now, and only one of those has never been rerolled. I actually rather enjoy the newbie levelling, though it depends on how and where you do it, some places are definitely more fun then others, even if they're less good experience.
Personally, I think there should be an extra server added with the release of BDOY, or a few days after the release. This way people who want to start anew with others for BDOY will get a chance to do so.
How that server should be is a different matter, but since I think it should be recommendable for completely new Neocron players as well it probably shouldn't be a hardcore server.
comon a whipe because we are getting an addon :lol: :lol: :lol: that just cracks me up :lol:
Originally posted by Lathuc
comon a whipe because we are getting an addon :lol: :lol: :lol: that just cracks me up :lol:
Afaik that would make NC the first MMORPG to get a wipe coz of an expansion.
I thought MJS said BDOY is not an Expansion but a whole new game?? Someone correct me if I am wrong please :(
Psycho Killa
08-02-04, 17:49
They said there marketing it like its a whole new game because its more then just an expansion theyre upgrading graphics and everything.
Originally posted by Kasumi
I thought MJS said BDOY is not an Expansion but a whole new game?? Someone correct me if I am wrong please :( He said it's going to be re-aunched as a whole new game, that is, BDOY when bought is the full game, including the expansion, but people who already have Neocron will be able to get the expansion for a cheaper price then the full BDOY package.
Eledhbrant
08-02-04, 18:47
Originally posted by J. Folsom
He said it's going to be re-aunched as a whole new game, that is, BDOY when bought is the full game, including the expansion, but people who already have Neocron will be able to get the expansion for a cheaper price then the full BDOY package.
erego, visa-vi and concordedly it is an ADD-ON merely being marketed as a new game, and not an actual NEW GAME.
and wiping may be fine to some people but others have spent longer and are not casual players, they have more stuff, capped chars who are not PE's etc. that take a lot longer and to have them and their items wiped for no reason would make so many leave.
(And its spelt "wipe" not "whipe" kthx.)
Well I had.. some really rare things.(Left them with a friend when I take break from Neocron but not sure if he still have) Anyway I would careless if they all got wiped because I would rather see a bunch fo new people then a few items!! :(
The whole point of an MMORPG is that it is a persistant world where you level your character over time. If you get a wipe every year just because some expansion comes out (even if it dramatically changes the way the game is played from that point on), then that's just silly.
A money & item wipe won't work. Those with (near) capped chars will find it extremely hard to get money and decent weapons. And I severely doubt it will 'fix' any economies - the players are far more likely to be able to do that throught the player vendors.
If something is going to be done I say a new server. Then all those that want a wipe can just move to the new server - effectively a wipe for those that want it and no wipe for those that don't.
I am against any kind of wipe or skill release. I have tuned and tweaked my characters over time and I don't want all that undone because a few people want to change their setups.
Athon Solo
anyone who wants a server wipe obveously hasnt worked for mc5 chips and lots of other rares, or doesnt have 6 capped chars... totaly biased ad unfair comment to make... some people will help noobs comming in and make it easier for them... where if they had nothing, they would be more concerned with leveling and earning cash for themselvs....
Why anybody believes a word of anything they hear in game is beyond me. MJS has stated on this forum that there will be no character wipe - the rest of your points are unknowns at this time.
N
Originally posted by Kasumi
BDOY Is A NEW START FOR NEOCRON!! This is why it would be a good reason for character wipe or just an item/Money wipe.. and why it wont happen again! If BDOY fails I doubt Necron will be around for Tokyo II or Irata III or any other Expansio
As much as i like the idea of a wipe i have 3 accs, and on a few of the servers have capped chars (about 10 ) i dont wanna do em all over again. I dont wanna have to find all there stuff again, it's taken me long enough to get where i am now i dont want it to be taken away just like that.
As for the bdoy failing, well who's fault is that?
Considering we where told it should be out last year sometime, so this coming now shoulda prolly be tokyo 3 news or somthing.
Psyco Groupie
08-02-04, 20:12
BDOY is a total conversion not an addon.
chars will stay or I and everyone else with 4 or more near capped chars will go
Originally posted by Nidhogg
Why anybody believes a word of anything they hear in game is beyond me. MJS has stated on this forum that there will be no character wipe - the rest of your points are unknowns at this time.
N
good, I don't have to post stating that now. People seem to think MJS was joking when he said there wouldn't be a char wipe or maybe if people flooded the forums with char wiping request/spam he might just do it.
Shadow Dancer
08-02-04, 20:41
Then make a new server for those people who can't handle playing with others that are already advanced. That arguement doesn't even hold any water, are we going to wipe every 3 months? Or wipe every 100 new players?
I've been in several mmorpgs and their are always people saying the economy is fucked up for various reasons, and I did just fine with a bunch of rich and powerful players running around. Hell that adds some incentive.
Psycho Killa
08-02-04, 20:48
Shadow I dont think you can compare whiping every 100 players to whiping when the game is being launched as if it was a brand new game and people are going to be under the impression its brand new when they start only to find out its been out for 2 years.
The people joining well after launch will know this and wont expect to be starting a brand new game which any new players who come with doy will be thinking.
But no I dont want a whipe just a new server to start fresh on when doy comes out.
Originally posted by Nidhogg
Why anybody believes a word of anything they hear in game is beyond me. MJS has stated on this forum that there will be no character wipe - the rest of your points are unknowns at this time.
N
Good :D
DoY isnt a new game, it is a mere addon, exactly what game does doy require to play again :confused: is it neocron....puddles me why its a new game :rolleyes:
Originally posted by alig
Good :D
DoY isnt a new game, it is a mere addon, exactly what game does doy require to play again :confused: is it neocron....puddles me why its a new game :rolleyes:
hehe Umm BDOY Need sthe Tekktonic(??) engine to run NOT NEOCRON!!! ^_^
we neither need a wipe, nor a new server, rather we need the old servers to get more populat3ed... so wtf should RM release a new server?
http://www.neocron.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=NeoContent&file=index&pageID=190
beeing able to read gives a clear advantage :).
i really don't get why every time something is comming people a) yell for a wipe, b) start making up shit and c) behave like children on the eve before xmas....
it hasn't changed in 2 years, and it never will:
read what has been said (and everything HAS been said. nothing should be unclear by now), understand it.... and most important:
JUST WAIT .....
and find out thane was right. as allways. :D
over and out.
I vote for full char wipe. Or maybe it would be better to have a new server with BDoY running on it and all the old ones would stay as normal Neocron. Anyway when BDoY comes i will start a new char and wipe all the old ones and if there wont be any char wipes, then i will try to kill everyone of you high rank guys with my Good Stiletto or something :D
Oh and i hope they will fix the leveling with tradeskills. Its dumb when you cant level up without killing mobs...
Originally posted by VetteroX
anyone who wants a server wipe obveously hasnt worked for mc5 chips and lots of other rares, or doesnt have 6 capped chars... totaly biased ad unfair comment to make... some people will help noobs comming in and make it easier for them... where if they had nothing, they would be more concerned with leveling and earning cash for themselvs....
Biased and unfair? I *am* one of those people and I know dozens of other people who are rational and understand that DoY *IS NOT* a Neocron add-on. It's a new product and really should be treated like one. Now if you think every LEd player that's standing in Plaza asking for noob help is really a noob, you're incredibly niave. While there will be new players, the fake n00b factore will still hold quite true in DoY.
Originally posted by athon
The whole point of an MMORPG is that it is a persistant world where you level your character over time. If you get a wipe every year just because some expansion comes out (even if it dramatically changes the way the game is played from that point on), then that's just silly.
Again, and this is to every person who is still under the impression that DoY is "just an add on like a large patch", it is NOT. When you change the graphics engine of a game, it's not the same game (not to mention everything else in the .plan).
Originally posted by Kasumi
Well I had.. some really rare things.(Left them with a friend when I take break from Neocron but not sure if he still have) Anyway I would careless if they all got wiped because I would rather see a bunch fo new people then a few items!! :(
Now this is a level-headed response and ideally, the rest of the community would follow it, but too many people (as evident by much of the posts in this community) in the community are either immature, selfish, or simply don't get the idea of reasonably fair gameplay. Many would cry that they want their stuff to carry over with them, but ffs, it's just STUFF. You can get it all back and them some. Why everyone wants the life of everything handed to them, I will never understand, which is what it WILL be if DoY players get everything from their NC account while the real noobs, the real revitalization of Neocron, will be at a handicap. But hey, you guys continue your me, me, me, my, my, my, I worked too, I payed money hard blah blah blah crying and see how far it gets you in DoY when the game fails, not because of KK, but because too many people wanted to be a bunch of penny-pinching babies. I gave away over a million creds last night at random to "n00bs" (who knows if they really were), and I've spent just as many hours playing NC since beta 4 as many of you, and I've toiled away, completely frustrated in MC5 just like many of you... the difference is I want what's best for the game and the community. Some of you should try that sometime, it would change the game as we know it.
We need more PLAYERS, not a bunch of selfish "Vets" who think their hard "work" should be rewarded because they like to indulge in timesinks in a game. If you consider your accumlation of virtual items and money, "work", then you need to get a new "job".
BUT ANYWAY, Nid, thanks for the response :) I must've missed that (I've been not as available to NC in the past 2 months as I would've liked to have been). If that's how it goes, that's how it goes. Sounds like a good plan and I can't wait to see everyone in DoY with our uber 0/2 ranks :D
So uh, can I ask another official question? hehe, This one may not have an official answer yet, but.....
I've always felt one of the principles that really hurt NC in the beginning was KK's overambtion on number of servers. There *almost* was enough players in our first few months to create lively environments on all the servers, but over time, it was SO evident that the server-to-player ratio was just skewed. In my opnion, KK kinda screwed itself by opening up the number of servers it did to such an overwhelmingly small playerbase (in relative comparison to other MMORPGS, let's be realistic). One English, One German, One French server would've been KICK ASS. To me, the 4 Chars per server deal spits in the face of the MMO*RPG*, unless we're all suffering from a quadratic multiple-personality disorder. Pluto or whatever English server would be much more like what many players want as far as population goes if Saturn and Uranus didn't exist (why TWO 4-Player servers anyway?? again, like NC even has the numbers to support 3 English servers? :wtf: ). KK, you have no obligation to multiple char slots on any server. Just because it was like that in beta and people were used to it, doesn't mean you can't put your foot down and set limits to create an online world populated enough to be worth living in! With time, people would accept one char per account... or even better yet for KK, the true addicts would shell out the extra cash for another account like all us other Plutonians do or *gasp* learn to make class teamwork incredibly important 8|
I dunno. No char wipes I can live with since you have to start over to get into DoY, amen to that. Like anyone will stay back in the old NC :p I hope KK doens't repeat history with the server issue tho... any word on the DoY servers?
(Sorry I'm so long winded... I don't play any other games anymore, mostly due to time constraint... NC's future is just important to me since if I stop playing NC, it'll just be Solitaire when I have the time :p )
--
Originally posted by Thane
i really don't get why every time something is comming people a) yell for a wipe, b) start making up shit and c) behave like children on the eve before xmas....
it hasn't changed in 2 years, and it never will:
read what has been said (and everything HAS been said. nothing should be unclear by now), understand it....
Um, I've been gone for a few months and I read a shitload to try to catch up but a lot has happened since patch 184 :p People talk and I just wanted to clear and concise answer that's clearly labeled in the place I visit most. Hope I didn't look completely stupid here to all the oh-so-on-top-of-everything vets :rolleyes:
shodanjr_gr
08-02-04, 21:28
Id love a server wipe. Why?
One reason :
It would fix the uberly,totaly,completely fux0r3d up economy...
nuff said.
Psycho Killa
08-02-04, 21:31
What parts cost 5 mil what are you talking about thats perfectly acceptable.
THE ENONOMY IS FINE NOOB GETS SOME SKILLZ LOLZ NUFF SAID.
(sarcasm)
Originally posted by shodanjr_gr
Id love a server wipe. Why?
One reason :
It would fix the uberly,totaly,completely fux0r3d up economy...
Yet another good reason for us to start fresh...
And I just reread my post and I'm apologize for sounding like such a dick. It's just really frustrating to hear so many people complain, but for only reasons about themselves. I have yet to hear a complaint about starting over that isn't about some character or their stuff. No "my clan's apartment would be lost" or "we'd lose our faction's rep" or anything, it's all just me, me, me... and that's just kinda sad.
shodanjr_gr
08-02-04, 21:34
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
What parts cost 5 mil what are you talking about thats perfectly acceptable.
THE ENONOMY IS FINE NOOB GETS SOME SKILLZ LOLZ NUFF SAID.
(sarcasm)
The economy is NOT fine. Because prices are INSANELY high (there werent even close to what they are now a year ago when i started). Some people have insane amounts of money which was made in a way that is almost an exploit and has no reasoning( the APC thingie). The rare part drop was insane at the beginning so old players have shitloads upon shitloads of parts while it was nerfed afterwards so newer players got much fewer. And you are saying that the xp aint fubar3d??
[thats not sarcasm :)]
Um, I've been gone for a few months and I read a shitload to try to catch up but a lot has happened since patch 184 People talk and I just wanted to clear and concise answer that's clearly labeled in the place I visit most. Hope I didn't look completely stupid here to all the oh-so-on-top-of-everything vets
ummmm.... okai, i forgive you :)
and one last comment before i go to kick someone on irc:
THERE WILL BE NO WIPE.
nuff said.
There might not be a server wipe, but if you want to play DoY it's sounding like you're gonna have to start over. My take on it anyways.
-Daj
Originally posted by Kasumi
hehe Umm BDOY Need sthe Tekktonic(??) engine to run NOT NEOCRON!!! ^_^
haha :rolleyes: that still doesnt make u right, does it? cuz wots in between doy and neocron if u dont have neocron? thin air.....doy is adding onto neocron and that is that...meaning it is an addon like i already said....mjs might say there marketing it like a new game, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt a new game and everyone knows it, even mjs knows it isnt a new game...there just upgrading a few gfx and tweaking the engine doesnt make it a 'woah out of this world new ub3r upgrade like hl too hl2'.
Keyol45743241
09-02-04, 10:50
What is the hint that BDoY is not a completely new game but soley an addon? A good and big addon maybe, but still only an addon? Yes. Correct. The candidate scored 100 points! Because you can play and interact with those who haven't BDoY installed! :wtf:
why can't people accept that this is an addon not a new game? evercrap has had like a bajillion addons and i dont think they whiped the servers when they did that so meh. oh and why do people think this game has been out for 2 years its only 1 year and a few months
Well maybe it is an addon but when you buy the box, it installs Neocron: BDoY. Not just BDoY or Neocron... And it adds so much more (one new mega city, the ubah !!CyberNet!! and hellovalot more like better gfx and prolly a million of bug fixes and new !!StockX2.0!!) so i think is SHOULD be called a new game, beause you CANT play BDoY without the addon (just like the AO and the new addon). You can just play the normal NC and hey, who really wants to do that??
And about the char wipe, i am going to do that my self then. I want personally play the BDoY as it was supposed to played.
BTW have you guys ever seen the Ceres mutes? I just found a place where you can find those mean things...
BDOY is a total conversion not an addon.
It's an add-on. You do not need it to play Neocron. You can still see, interact, and shoot people who have BDOY installed.
You can just play the normal NC and hey, who really wants to do that??
Seeing as how a few of us have been playing since Neocron came on a single CD, I'd say a fair number of people do like NC the way it is. That's not to say I and others won't be upgrading, but if we didn't like NC we wouldn't be playing now...
•Super|\|ova•
09-02-04, 12:18
Originally posted by Lathuc
why can't people accept that this is an addon not a new game? evercrap has had like a bajillion addons and i dont think they whiped the servers when they did that so meh. oh and why do people think this game has been out for 2 years its only 1 year and a few months
I think it's because - sad but true - so many of ppl that play neocron are the cs-kind of players that can't just realize anything about MMORPGs; not how they was supposed to play nor anything about add-ons. If they were even a bit into MMORPGs they would realize it since every damn MMORPG which has been released like more than over a year ago has an add-on even released or to be released soon.
shodanjr_gr
09-02-04, 13:36
Originally posted by alig
haha :rolleyes: that still doesnt make u right, does it? cuz wots in between doy and neocron if u dont have neocron? thin air.....doy is adding onto neocron and that is that...meaning it is an addon like i already said....mjs might say there marketing it like a new game, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt a new game and everyone knows it, even mjs knows it isnt a new game...there just upgrading a few gfx and tweaking the engine doesnt make it a 'woah out of this world new ub3r upgrade like hl too hl2'.
DoY is essentially replacing Neocron....Thats why when it launches it will no longer be Neocron but BDoY. Neocron hasnt actually made a good name for it self on the mmorpg market (if it had we would have tons of players). When new people come and get pked over and over and over but guys like Vet, and when they cant buy any single item due to the fucked economy, they are gona think: "WTF this game has been around for two years, its soo fubar, im outa here" and leave...
shodanjr_gr
09-02-04, 13:42
Originally posted by Lathuc
why can't people accept that this is an addon not a new game? evercrap has had like a bajillion addons and i dont think they whiped the servers when they did that so meh. oh and why do people think this game has been out for 2 years its only 1 year and a few months
thats happened because each evercrap addon didnt bring the MASSES of players BDOY is supposed to bring. KK hopes for a HUGE population influx when DoY arrives, im sorry but i doubt that population is gona stick around for a long time if the situtaion on the servers remains as it is.
If anyone thinks a wipe would "fix the economy" they are sadly mistaken. Wipe or not, it takes new rules in game to fix the economy.
You think rare parts are expensive NOW???? Wait, after a wipe, no one will have a stockpile of parts, or extra rares... well there goes the supply side of it. So we will have HUGE demand and NO supply-
Oh yeah, that will drive prices WAAAAAY down
I know I know= "Strych9, but one will have a lot of money, so prices will be lower."
Wrong.
Making money is EASY in this game. And the good rares and rare parts will go to those that know how to make fast money.
You want to fix the economy, we need some actual code changes. A wipe wont do it.
And I am thankful we wont have a wipe.
Bring on a new server.
shodanjr_gr
09-02-04, 13:47
Originally posted by Strych9
If anyone thinks a wipe would "fix the economy" they are sadly mistaken. Wipe or not, it takes new rules in game to fix the economy.
You think rare parts are expensive NOW???? Wait, after a wipe, no one will have a stockpile of parts, or extra rares... well there goes the supply side of it. So we will have HUGE demand and NO supply-
Oh yeah, that will drive prices WAAAAAY down
I know I know= "Strych9, but one will have a lot of money, so prices will be lower."
Wrong.
Making money is EASY in this game. And the good rares and rare parts will go to those that know how to make fast money.
You want to fix the economy, we need some actual code changes. A wipe wont do it.
And I am thankful we wont have a wipe.
Bring on a new server.
Im sorry but if KK fixes those damn cash generators (like the APC trick) cash wont be so easy to make....thats were the millions of cash in the game have been coming from.
angelsenior
09-02-04, 14:08
My 2 cents;
BDOY is an addon to Neocron (if you buy it you get full access to everything, those who dont will get a minor patch to make some things work correctly between the 2 versions ie same engine version etc..).
A character wipe is not foreseen but I could live with it (though it would piss me off to some extent, it would also bring a new start for everyone).
It could possibly deal with a number of database errors getting wiped in the process (ie dealt with).
The player economy would benefit from a char wipe.
Everybody starting from scratch is better since it brings certain needs for items to a normal level (ie if your apt is already pouring over with a certain item/weapon/implant then a lower droprate only influences new/ low level players and not the rest and thus wont work as intended, thats why vet players have no trouble with the current prices but newer players cant tip it).
Devils Grace
09-02-04, 15:02
this is just a nerf thread like som many others...
ppl that want wipe now comes forward asking for one, even after MJS him self said that there will not be one...
but no u still want one
what about the rest that doesnt want.......u fucking selfish boy...
what u should ask, that will not harm anyone is a new server, that u r right to ask , not a fucking wipe of chars.
wipe, and im goin to be one of many to cancel the acount
kthxbye
Originally posted by Devils Grace
this is just a nerf thread like som many others...
ppl that want wipe now comes forward asking for one, even after MJS him self said that there will not be one...
but no u still want one
what about the rest that doesnt want.......u fucking selfish boy...
what u should ask, that will not harm anyone is a new server, that u r right to ask , not a fucking wipe of chars.
wipe, and im goin to be one of many to cancel the acount
kthxbye
The some of us who are agreeing on a server(s) wipe is that it would help the new comers! Most people who want a server wipe are willing to give up thing to help neocron grow! NEOCRON WILL NOT GROW with how the servers are right now... How exactly is that being selfish?? we are thinking of other people and we are being selfish? Care to explain?? Yes a new server would be good.. Cant make everyone happy I supposs.. For anyone that leaves I bet they would be replaced with 2 or 3 other people.. and for anyone that leaves at least half would come back... :\
There will not be a character wipe as already stated by the great MJS (praise allah). A money/item wipe wouldnt be welcomed, but its alot better than a character wipe. Hmm, well maybe a item and money wipe, but start everyone off with 100k. Come to think of it, it would be hard to even try to get ammo and such to even think about lvling/gaining money.
shodanjr_gr
09-02-04, 15:12
Originally posted by Devils Grace
this is just a nerf thread like som many others...
ppl that want wipe now comes forward asking for one, even after MJS him self said that there will not be one...
but no u still want one
what about the rest that doesnt want.......u fucking selfish boy...
what u should ask, that will not harm anyone is a new server, that u r right to ask , not a fucking wipe of chars.
wipe, and im goin to be one of many to cancel the acount
kthxbye
We (the people who ask for the wipe) care about our own little selves??
We are fucking selfish??
Please....
We dont gain anything from a wipe. All of us (well most of us) have shitloads of gear and capped characters. Do you think that i would really like to start from 0 again??
Nope i wouldnt, but it would be good for the tons of new players that KK hopes theyll come...and it will be good for the game it self.
On the contraty YOU people are selfish, you constantly go like "
"OMG server wipe, im gona loose MY equipment, MY little precious capped characters...etc etc"
Get my point?
Originally posted by shodanjr_gr
Im sorry but if KK fixes those damn cash generators (like the APC trick) cash wont be so easy to make....thats were the millions of cash in the game have been coming from. LOL. And you stated that in response to me saying
You want to fix the economy, we need some actual code changes. A wipe wont do it.Which means that if they fix the cash generators (i.e. change the game code) that will fix the economy. A wipe will only help for a few days before things return to normal.
However, people can STILL make plenty of money in the game without APCs. :)
Just think about the changes in DOY... like NPC vendors to sell your stuff- that will help the economy.
So right now, I have a few zerk 3s, and then BPs for zerk 2s and zerk 1s. Lets say I setup a NPC vendor after BDOY comes out. At that point, the zerk 1s will sell for what, 5k maybe? Zerk 2s for 15K or so, and Zerk 3s for 30K. Why? Because they are common to the players that know how to get them. So a newb in Neocron would be able to get all of the zerk chips for his tank for pretty cheap.
With a char wipe, do you think prices would be that low? Zerk 1s would be common, but Zerk 2s and 3s would be well protected as they will be more uncommon. And you can bank that prices on them will be much higher than what I listed above.
Same thing with rares. You can sell PoT parts for REAL cheap when you have 10 of them and so does everyone else. Then the newb that needs a PoT can get one for pretty cheap (right now on Saturn you get get a multislotted artifact PoT for like 100K-200K in price. My bud SLB got a 2 slotted Vein Ripper for 80K).
But with a wipe, every rare part is suddenly valuable (except for the melee shocker parts... hehe). There is no existing PoTs on the server, so even a PoT part is now very valuable. Prices will be higher because of this.
Just imagine the race to assemble the first Cursed Soul after a wipe. You think those parts will be sold or traded for a reasonable price? Nope.
Now the only way to counter the insane demand and small supply of stuff after a wipe is if people simply arent allowed to have a lot of money, right?
Well not really. Lets say after a wipe, the powerleveller gets 1 mil in a week instead of 18 mil. Would things be better off?
Not if the average player has less as well.
Only paying 50K for a tech part is awesome when the average player has 400K to their name. But it isnt as awesome when the average player has 100K to their name.
Point being prices for desireable items will ALWAYS be in proportion to the wealth players have. People wont EVER have 18 mil in credits and then refuse to pay higher than 50K for a tech part. Prices of desireable items will always be simply as much as people are willing to pay.
Richard Blade
09-02-04, 15:56
I don't think a server wipe will help anything.
I started retail in the USA a week after they finally managed to get a supply of games into the country. Damn CDV.
When they launched the game in Germany, they had fresh servers.
When they launched the game in the UK, they had one more new server. So, a fresh start there.
When they launched the game in the USA, we had capped tanks and monks running around speaking German. We had capped PE's who drink tea and eat "biscuits" as a snack.
But, there was no fresh server, no fair and balanced economy, no level playing field.
When I started, the conditions of the game were pretty much the same as they are now. Newbies will be able to deal with it.
Besides, what distribution plan do you think they will use? I know most people wouldn't be clamoring for a server wipe if they new that the US would get the game and hence, the jump over all the other players. Nobody wants to be last to get the game.
The powerleveling freaks would have near capped characters and the game would be in the same condition within a month.
A lot of the casual players out there aren't even capped even after playing for over a year. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't want a server wipe. But, they also aren't on the forum, or if they are, they aren't going to post, "NO! Don't do it". They will just find a different game to play.
shodanjr_gr
09-02-04, 15:57
Originally posted by Strych9
So right now, I have a few zerk 3s, and then BPs for zerk 2s and zerk 1s. Lets say I setup a NPC vendor after BDOY comes out. At that point, the zerk 1s will sell for what, 5k maybe? Zerk 2s for 15K or so, and Zerk 3s for 30K. Why? Because they are common to the players that know how to get them. So a newb in Neocron would be able to get all of the zerk chips for his tank for pretty cheap.
With a char wipe, do you think prices would be that low? Zerk 1s would be common, but Zerk 2s and 3s would be well protected as they will be more uncommon. And you can bank that prices on them will be much higher than what I listed above.
Same thing with rares. You can sell PoT parts for REAL cheap when you have 10 of them and so does everyone else. Then the newb that needs a PoT can get one for pretty cheap (right now on Saturn you get get a multislotted artifact PoT for like 100K-200K in price. My bud SLB got a 2 slotted Vein Ripper for 80K).
But with a wipe, every rare part is suddenly valuable (except for the melee shocker parts... hehe). There is no existing PoTs on the server, so even a PoT part is now very valuable. Prices will be higher because of this.
Just imagine the race to assemble the first Cursed Soul after a wipe. You think those parts will be sold or traded for a reasonable price? Nope.
Now the only way to counter the insane demand and small supply of stuff after a wipe is if people simply arent allowed to have a lot of money, right?
Well not really. Lets say after a wipe, the powerleveller gets 1 mil in a week instead of 18 mil. Would things be better off?
Not if the average player has less as well.
Only paying 50K for a tech part is awesome when the average player has 400K to their name. But it isnt as awesome when the average player has 100K to their name.
Point being prices for desireable items will ALWAYS be in proportion to the wealth players have. People wont EVER have 18 mil in credits and then refuse to pay higher than 50K for a tech part. Prices of desireable items will always be simply as much as people are willing to pay.
Can you explain how a person would get 1 mil in one week?
There will be no uber 1337 constructors. There would be no HUGE wealth to buy parts and mass build items. There will be very very few rare parts. There will be very few high level weapons (since they will have to be bought from stores). And since the money generators will be gone it will take a long time for the economy to get to a point similar to what it is now. Plus all people will start from the same level. Sure the noobies will lag behind, but not THAT much as they do now.
Dear God this is getting off track.
First off, the thread was just a question of clarification on what the status of our existing characters, the existing servers, and how they will, if at all, interact with the DoY characters and servers. That's it. I stated what I had heard and what my opinions were and that was all. This thread wasn't a nerf cry, to all those ignorant enough to think so. This wasn't a wipe the servers cry, to all those selfish enough to think so.
It was just a damn question to KK to clarify... and if you read this entire thread, other than Nid's quote, it's blatently obvious none of you know for sure what's going to happen either. Some of you think that your existing NC capped chars will be able to "enjoy" the DoY world? When 90% of us give in and start fresh on a new DoY server (if that's indeed how it will work) and you have no server population left, have fun. And when you're chasing someone who has the full DoY version installed and you almost have him dead... until he zones into some portion of the game your 'uber' NC character can't get into, have fun... so much shit still doesn't make sense, so please stop wasting my screenspace and let some *new* KK info come through instead of flaming off.
Originally posted by shodanjr_gr
Can you explain how a person would get 1 mil in one week?
There will be no uber 1337 constructors. There would be no HUGE wealth to buy parts and mass build items. There will be very very few rare parts. There will be very few high level weapons (since they will have to be bought from stores). And since the money generators will be gone it will take a long time for the economy to get to a point similar to what it is now. Plus all people will start from the same level. Sure the noobies will lag behind, but not THAT much as they do now. Have you ever spent some time down in the aggie cellars? All it takes it a tank with a lot of carrying capacity saving up all of the imps that drop. Same with Storage and the butchees/hurlers/launchers. You sell the drops and you can make some great money.
Even if 1 mil isnt made the FIRST week of the server, even if you remove the APCs it will still be easy to make a mil in 1 week.
And you are mistaken if you think it takes a long time to make an uber constructor. You can take a spy from level 0, and after making medkits and droning, have him up to uber level construction... even with droning... in 3 days of casual playing. And thats with the droner always building their own drones. All he would need is a buddy that can research them. So it wouldnt take long AT ALL for their to be uber tradeskillers around.
Esp. since that after DOY launches, I suspect that some current veterans will likely be playing it almost 24/7 for the first few days just to get to see all the new stuff.
Now regarding noobs lagging behind- that will be no different than it is now. Sure the FIRST hour of the DOY everyone would be even, but by hour two the noobs will still be attacking bees while the vets are attacking aggies or launchers.
The DIFFERENCE though would be that with a wipe, the knowledgeable players wont have as many resources to share with noobs. Noobs wouldnt have Zerk 1s and 2s just given to them like it is now. I honestly think it would be harder for a true noob to get into the game with a wipe. With or without wipe a noob will be a noob, and vets will still have capped/near capped chars in a matter of days or weeks.
The BIGGEST argument against a wipe is that if a wipe is needed to make noobs and vets even, what happens in one month, when we get more noobs? Or in 6 months? Cause as long as we get new players entering the game, those new players will have to deal with higher level players with the advantage. Thats true for EVERY MMORPG out there, bar none.
Devils Grace
09-02-04, 17:43
YOU want a fresh start, ask for a new server
YOU do not have the right to impose a char WIPE, when ppl like me that do not want a WIPE, kuz we also pay a monthly fee, and i do not want to loose 1 year payments....
SO YOU want a fresh start
NEW server...........
its the same that ppl dont want to buy BDOY
they can still play, but without the new features
get it
Forget My Name
09-02-04, 18:08
Make a new server and put up in big red letters over the new server...
NEW SERVER FOR BDOY - NEW PLAYERS SUGGESTED TO COME HERE
Biggest problem with the old servers would be the old servers HUGE economies....
Originally posted by -FN-
Biased and unfair? I *am* one of those people and I know dozens of other people who are rational and understand that DoY *IS NOT* a Neocron add-on. It's a new product and really should be treated like one. Now if you think every LEd player that's standing in Plaza asking for noob help is really a noob, you're incredibly niave. While there will be new players, the fake n00b factore will still hold quite true in DoY.
Originally posted by n3m
Will Players without the Expension/BDOY be able to play?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Yes, but they will miss out a lot of the fun. They won't be able to enter DoY, they won't get the engine upgrade, no new char models and pretty much all the other points on the list won't work for them, unless they are required basics.
That would make it an expansion
Originally posted by Strych9
Have you ever spent some time down in the aggie cellars? All it takes it a tank with a lot of carrying capacity saving up all of the imps that drop. Same with Storage and the butchees/hurlers/launchers. You sell the drops and you can make some great money.
Even if 1 mil isnt made the FIRST week of the server, even if you remove the APCs it will still be easy to make a mil in 1 week.
And you are mistaken if you think it takes a long time to make an uber constructor. You can take a spy from level 0, and after making medkits and droning, have him up to uber level construction... even with droning... in 3 days of casual playing. And thats with the droner always building their own drones. All he would need is a buddy that can research them. So it wouldnt take long AT ALL for their to be uber tradeskillers around.
Esp. since that after DOY launches, I suspect that some current veterans will likely be playing it almost 24/7 for the first few days just to get to see all the new stuff.
Now regarding noobs lagging behind- that will be no different than it is now. Sure the FIRST hour of the DOY everyone would be even, but by hour two the noobs will still be attacking bees while the vets are attacking aggies or launchers.
The DIFFERENCE though would be that with a wipe, the knowledgeable players wont have as many resources to share with noobs. Noobs wouldnt have Zerk 1s and 2s just given to them like it is now. I honestly think it would be harder for a true noob to get into the game with a wipe. With or without wipe a noob will be a noob, and vets will still have capped/near capped chars in a matter of days or weeks.
The BIGGEST argument against a wipe is that if a wipe is needed to make noobs and vets even, what happens in one month, when we get more noobs? Or in 6 months? Cause as long as we get new players entering the game, those new players will have to deal with higher level players with the advantage. Thats true for EVERY MMORPG out there, bar none.
<3 Strych9.
A wipe won't solve anything since we know how to play the game, and a n00b doesn't.
As mentioned above - which I will reiterate, an enviroment where WE are competing the the new players is NOT new player friendly... And in fact, that would probably piss off more people because they have to put up with some asshole vets.
As it stands now, the same asshole vet can easily toss a new player some item which means nothing to them - but it helps the new player alot.
Also as mentioned - there's no specific date and time that ALL newbies will start playing, so lets can that 'being equal' crap. Most players on these forums will probably be ordering it seeing as most of us are rabid fanboi's. As such, we'll get it before some person looks on the shelf and says "Hyuk, NC:BDoY".
Will we have to wipe the server every month?
Every two months?
You want a wipe, stand by your argument and delete your own dude with all your stuff. Hell, start on a new server too so you can rely on your friends - See how much easier your life is when there are actually GOOD constructors, researchers, and repairpeople.
Originally posted by KuifJe
Originally posted by n3m
Will Players without the Expension/BDOY be able to play?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Yes, but they will miss out a lot of the fun. They won't be able to enter DoY, they won't get the engine upgrade, no new char models and pretty much all the other points on the list won't work for them, unless they are required basics.
That would make it an expansion
I think another part of the clarification I'm asking for is, Yes, they can play... but can they play with people WITH the expansion. See, I take that to mean, yeah, they can still play... on the servers where everyone will be leaving their shit behind to go start playing on the new DoY servers. Will people who don't upgrade be able to play with people who do? On the same server?
Originally posted by -FN-
Will people who don't upgrade be able to play with people who do? On the same server?
Yes, but they will not be able to access certain areas or features.
Their engine will stay the same as it is now.
Easy solution. Start Neptune. ;)
By the time BDoY is out, I will have played this game for almost a year.
I wont care if my characters that are still not capped are deleted.
but its true, it wont matter if there is a data base wipe.
In the few MMOG's that I have played, I have always had to deal with high level people when I started playing it.
Originally posted by shodanjr_gr
Can you explain how a person would get 1 mil in one week?
There will be no uber 1337 constructors. There would be no HUGE wealth to buy parts and mass build items. There will be very very few rare parts. There will be very few high level weapons (since they will have to be bought from stores). And since the money generators will be gone it will take a long time for the economy to get to a point similar to what it is now. Plus all people will start from the same level. Sure the noobies will lag behind, but not THAT much as they do now.
The launch of Venus and how it was there proves all your points to be wrong with no exception.
Just an example: Venus day 1 after at the end of the day: there were two high level CSTs, clans with 10 mil+ on clan cash, runners with 6-7 millions. And the economy inside that high roller group went mad with offers like 2 mill for a techpart or lvl-2 or lvl-3 imps or traded for 4 or 5 slotted high TL weapons.
Those who know the game in and out (and there quite many of them) will be back at a reasonable level (char, cash and items) withhin a week, 10 days max. Some even after a few days. Yes, even with rare weapons, if you really want to, you can complete your rare weapon withhin a week starting from scratch.
You cant wipe the players...
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