Monk aiming -not a reticle but a tweak

[Lifewaster]

We know monk aiming is extremely easy especially in 3rd person.

In a running fight/chase against a moving target a single APU will outdamage many multiple times his number of gun users simply because of runcast and inability to miss if the initial click is on target.

This difference will probably become more acute now that para is nerfed enough that you can still outmanouver non-monks if shocked.


Suggestions I have seen are :

Remove first person :- which certainly makes running click aiming harder, but I dont really wanna lose 3rd person view.

Make a monk reticle :- I really dont like this in the manner that gun reticles work.

Remove run cast totally :- make all monks need to stay still in order to fire , this would be a huge monk hit and probably too drastic, allthough is a common feature in many games.

Alter the cast lock time :- this is my preferred system, easy tweakable and not drastic . Basically , make it so in order for the spell to lock to the target, the cursor must remain inside the target box for a bit longer that it currently needs, say for half of the total cast time, but with a max of 5 seconds(so as not to require holding the target for 30 seconds during res etc)
If the cursor does not keep the target tracked for the required time then the spell fizzle etc.



I dont think this is a tremendous nerf for monks, in fact I tend to do it anyway when casting spells half the time, it would just make it that bit easier for someone to dodge, and that bit harder to land a spell on a moving target and a bit more skill to being an APU.



And in return for this, maybe let spells have their old Range and rofs back.


And yet another poll since it seems to be polls week here ....

[Shadow Dancer]

First of all, it doesn't sound like you play a monk. That's not an insult, it's just people who play monks for a good length of time differentiate between apus and ppus when they talk. Non monk people just lump all monks together, and you can't do that. They are different as night and day.


Originally posted by Lifewaster

Remove first person :- which certainly makes running click aiming harder, but I dont really wanna lose 3rd person view.



O_o

I think you meant remove third person. :D :D

I'm ok with that, but only if it happens to everyone.



Originally posted by Lifewaster

Make a monk reticle :- I really dont like this in the manner that gun reticles work.



Fine by me. They SHOULD get a reticle IMO.



Originally posted by Lifewaster

Remove run cast totally :- make all monks need to stay still in order to fire , this would be a huge monk hit and probably too drastic, allthough is a common feature in many games.



No way, not with our current damage output. Apus should deal wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more damage if they have to stand totally still to attack.



Originally posted by Lifewaster

Alter the cast lock time :- this is my preferred system, easy tweakable and not drastic . Basically , make it so in order for the spell to lock to the target, the cursor must remain inside the target box for a bit longer that it currently needs, say for half of the total cast time, but with a max of 5 seconds(so as not to require holding the target for 30 seconds during res etc)
If the cursor does not keep the target tracked for the required time then the spell fizzle etc.


This is way too drastic. I'm against this completley.


I couldn't even imagine trying to antibuff a ppu using this "system".



Originally posted by Lifewaster



And in return for this, maybe let spells have their old Range and rofs back.


Well the old rof was too fast to register all the damage. So it's not really a good thing if we get it back. I don't think apus should get their uber range back. It's totally unfair to spies and just generally overpowering.




Originally posted by Lifewaster

And yet another poll since it seems to be polls week here ....

Have their been alot of polls lately? I dunno, let's poll and find out. :p



Btw I voted for reticle. Although the third person removal would be very interesting. :D

[Devils Grace]

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[Lifewaster]

lol wtf, yes i meant remove 3rd person...

Well I play a monk atm, but he is almost equal played time as APU then PPU so I didnt want to differentiate.

I found as PPU or APU you tend to hold the target box longer anyway, but its probaly easier for PPUs to do it since their targets arent usually trying to run away :p

Thing is with a reticle your making extra delay time before the spell can land while with just increasing the cast lock time the spell casts at same speed overall.


but yeh, I guess any significant lock time above the current split second will make it very much harder to target moving runners. So maybe just a very small increase like making it 1 second of lock required would dol fine.

And also, how about is the lock misses, the spell stops animation and you can try again immediately and you dont lose the mana etc.

This would overcome the disadvantages to APU's I think , but would still be the small change needed to make it just that little bit more of a chance to not get hit by a HL provided you make the effort to move about.

[Psycho_Soldier]

Remove 3rd person and tons of people will cancel accounts including myself. I'm a tank btw.

[Promethius]

Well i don't think it would be so bad for monks to have a reticle. (certainly would put that handling to some use). Also just the mechanics of it they should have a reticle. I mean they have to AIM before they can nilly willy cast psi spells.

Though due to the nature of casting spells i think the reticle should zoom faster than regular weapons.

[Lifewaster]

Basically what I mean, is after you click in the box, the cursor needs to be kept in the box for 1 second or else the spell will miss.


If someone is strafing around you then it will be harder then if they are running directly away or towards you.


Not by much, but just enough to make it require that bit more control and aim.

[Devils Grace]

theres nottin faster then the MIND

so kuz its a mind spell, it should be as it is now.

[Promethius]

Originally posted by Lifewaster
Basically what I mean, is after you click in the box, the cursor needs to be kept in the box for 1 second or else the spell will miss.


If someone is strafing around you then it will be harder then if they are running directly away or towards you.


Not by much, but just enough to make it require that bit more control and aim.

That would seriously enrf monks or anyclass u introduce that to. If someone is trying to dodge u its very hard to keep them targeted for a full extra second.

Generally in fights its all about that split second u target them and clicking to fire/cast a spell. Also I'm sure kk would never put that in.


-Prom

[retr0n]

Originally posted by Devils Grace
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I think he nailed it.

The only thing i want fixed is length of HL animation so they dont
hit you once you think it's time to go back for heal & take cover
but instead another 2 or 3 HLs hit you and you drop like a sack
of shit.

[Lifewaster]

Originally posted by Promethius
That would seriously enrf monks or anyclass u introduce that to. If someone is trying to dodge u its very hard to keep them targeted for a full extra second.

Generally in fights its all about that split second u target them and clicking to fire/cast a spell. Also I'm sure kk would never put that in.


-Prom


Yeh I know how it is at the moment, its all about running in a close circle trying to be behind the other guy while he tries to do the same to you I'm just thinking it could be better is all.

Specially cos this method of deciding winner is really only ideal in 1v1 , add extra runners and your going to have more and more ppl in a position to land a click on you despite what you do.

This is probably why monks own so much at op wars , they just pick a semi-distant target and click , the other guy whos outmanouvering them at close range ? well he just gets clicked on by a different monk who has a better view on him.

[ino]

I will only comment on the rectangle and the one sec thing as a ppu.

Heeeell no :).. If all the ppl playing with you on your team pvm or pvp was like my close ingame friends that knows. Hey I need a heal lets stand still for half a second so the ppu can hit me, probably with the first heal then yes the rectangle could work, not the 1 sec thing tho..

But dont know if you play alot of ppu but damn that is going to be extreemly annoying for ppus with ppl that just runs arround like crazy with 10 enemies arround also.. the heal will never hit :) It might work with Apu's tho the rectangle. But I wont say it will cause I hardly play with my apu anymore. So i dont have the right to speak for the hardcore apu's..

And one other thing, the rectangle thing has to be a "skill based" thing I guess like weaponlore and probably put under the psu.. and there are lots of ppu's who dont pump every int point in psu, cause it aint needed to get atleast 50/min on heal 52/min is cap.. And to force ppu's to specc all points under intel in psu will remove lots of pokers aswell from the game :).

oh and edit.. there is one more class that dont have a rectangle.. the melee tanks.. if they would get one aswell would probably remove alot of the fun for them aswell.. But they are always super near the enemy so the rectangle would probably be pretty closed anyway, but if the melee rushes into more than one enemy they will end up missing hits cause the rectanlge breaks..

And yeah I know it is somewhat the same for all the weapon based fighters aswell but it's not exactly the same. so dont go there.

[Shujin]

heh is it just me but everytime i read a rectile... i think erectile.... then i think of those viagra commercials >.<....

[Shadow Dancer]

Originally posted by Psycho_Soldier
Remove 3rd person and tons of people will cancel accounts including myself. I'm a tank btw.


o_O


why?



Originally posted by ino
I will only comment on the rectangle and the one sec thing as a ppu.

Heeeell no :).. If all the ppl playing with you on your team pvm or pvp was like my close ingame friends that knows. Hey I need a heal lets stand still for half a second so the ppu can hit me, probably with the first heal then yes the rectangle could work, not the 1 sec thing tho..

But dont know if you play alot of ppu but damn that is going to be extreemly annoying for ppus with ppl that just runs arround like crazy with 10 enemies arround also.. the heal will never hit :) It might work with Apu's tho the rectangle. But I wont say it will cause I hardly play with my apu anymore. So i dont have the right to speak for the hardcore apu's..

And one other thing, the rectangle thing has to be a "skill based" thing I guess like weaponlore and probably put under the psu.. and there are lots of ppu's who dont pump every int point in psu, cause it aint needed to get atleast 50/min on heal 52/min is cap.. And to force ppu's to specc all points under intel in psu will remove lots of pokers aswell from the game :).

oh and edit.. there is one more class that dont have a rectangle.. the melee tanks.. if they would get one aswell would probably remove alot of the fun for them aswell.. But they are always super near the enemy so the rectangle would probably be pretty closed anyway, but if the melee rushes into more than one enemy they will end up missing hits cause the rectanlge breaks..

And yeah I know it is somewhat the same for all the weapon based fighters aswell but it's not exactly the same. so dont go there.

I would think that if KK ever implemented reticle for psi modules, it would be for apus only.


Personally, I think HL damage was fine pre-nerf, but should have gotten a reticle and LOS.


How about a reticle just for HL and FA? And energy beam/fire beam can stay without it.

[Shujin]

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
o_O


why?




I would think that if KK ever implemented reticle for psi modules, it would be for apus only.


Personally, I think HL damage was fine pre-nerf, but should have gotten a reticle and LOS.


How about a reticle just for HL and FA? And energy beam/fire beam can stay without it.

>;O EY
stop tryin to look like qd >;O its confusin

[Clownst0pper]

LOL @ Devils Grace :lol:

[n3m]

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
o_O
why?

Because it blows?


- 90 degree vision
- gun takes up half the screen
- cant see shit when on fire

Take ur pick.

[Psycho_Soldier]

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
o_O


why?

Ever tried using a CS in a op war or duel or PP fight or whatever. The fucking thing takes up half your screen. Then all the practice I did for such a long time would be for nothing.

[Glok]

alt-w used to make your gun invisible to you, but KK took it out for some reason. If that was put back in would you be down with first person only?

[Judge]

Ack... first you look like ezza and now you look like QD. I'm so confused Shadow :(

[Dezh]

Just keep it as it is, and nerf teh dev O_o

[SpawnTDK]

Originally posted by Lifewaster
blablabla

monk got nerfed like hell and now u noob will nerf em more ? go home, play with barbie

[Zanathos]

There was an extremly good idea for a monk reticle before but.... alas, it went down with a good portion of the rest of the ideas said here, into the abyss.

[Ozambabbaz]

how about an auto-zoom to shoulder view when firing a weapon?