View Full Version : Monk Nerf
im a bit pissed off that my apu and ppu both got nerfed pretty bad. im not completely capped yet but im like 99 psi and i used to cap my hl easy, not anymore i get like 628% i dont think that is just because of the 8 ppw drop from ds/psi core being nerfed. the patch was supposed to help the pures, because we all know kk wants specialization but it seems like they are nerfing monks AGAIN.
i have noticed i take less damage from APUs
All i noticed was that ive lost over 30 mana due to the psi core nerfage :( The loss in dmg on my spells has been minimal though so it might just be that with your setup you had a number of points over a points boost barrier in pwr. Tbh im more bothered about the mana loss, thats an extra hl in battle, can be quiet a difference in certain situations such as de-buffing.
Oh and now ive got less mana my psi capped apu has dropped from rank 73 to rank 65...more int exp for me :)
Maybe they nerfed the monks. But we dont want "Monkron" back, do we?
Monk is still very powerful and playable. So stop whining plz.
*sighs*
120 APU now required to use my Holy Energy Halo? :( Fucks sake. I saved up for that bastard from when I started and bought a nice 2 slot one for when I got to PSI 55, I'm 3 points away and at 90 APU and now I'm totally fucked till I reach 120 APU (god knows when or how long that'll take :( ) What a waste of money, may as well not have bought it.
I'm not sure what the requirement was before, but it's certainly over a 30 point increase in APU skill requirement. Talk about going overboard, bit of a hefty nerf don't you think?
Glad I made a Tank now, off to train him some more.
MayhemMike
30-01-04, 03:31
I went from 410 mana to 373 O_o
Originally posted by Organics
*sighs*
120 APU now required to use my Holy Energy Halo? :( Fucks sake. I saved up for that bastard from when I started and bought a nice 2 slot one for when I got to PSI 55, I'm 3 points away and at 90 APU and now I'm totally fucked till I reach 120 APU (god knows when or how long that'll take :( ) What a waste of money, may as well not have bought it.
I'm not sure what the requirement was before, but it's certainly over a 30 point increase in APU skill requirement. Talk about going overboard, bit of a hefty nerf don't you think?
Glad I made a Tank now, off to train him some more.
Do you have attack chips 1 and 2 in? if not they'll give +15 apu Then might just have to lom abit of pwr to use it :( They should have done a psi skill release for this reason.
Haven't look at the apu's but from the ppu spells they are a lot harder to play and level now considering the gap in spells from the normal's to the blessed's I think it's going to put a lot of people off PPU's when the find they wait that many levels for new spells
james_finn
30-01-04, 04:00
maybe thats wot KK intended? To put people off of becoming a PPU, thus removing the amount of people who call to nerf it :rolleyes: wouldnt be the first time someone has done something indirect to try to address a different problem.
I also totally agree that there should have been a PSI sub skill points release, but this is very unlikely to happen.
ALTHOUGH I must stress that the rest of the patch is pure gold dust, and tbh thats wot neocron needed especially at the moment whilst we wait for "the List"!
Delphi
Example of APU damage being nerfed:
Pre-patch - Go to bunker near MB with 127 APU and 70+ PPW, 135 PSU (with imps). Could fire 92 capped EHs per min doing 90-250 damage to a cyclops per shot.
Post-patch - Same place, same mobs. APU: 127 70+ PPW 135 PSU (with imps). Still firing 92 capped EHs per min doing 90-190 damage to a cyclops per shot.
Talk about pain in the ass. Now not only can an APU take very little hits, but now it can't do anything about it cos it hits crap.
I hope they DID nerf monks. Everyone bitches that RoLH does too much dmg, and yet my APU does 4x the dmg with a simple holy energy halo...
You know how much fun it is to be leveling in teh aggie cellars too, and an APU comes in....and there goes your mission points and/or looting rights, even if he IS lower rank than you.
APU monks were MEANT to do more dmg...
now they do less... too less
hope kk is happy when the next generation of ubar hybs are born
ZoneVortex
30-01-04, 08:56
uhhh...
damage was NOT NERFED
a capped HL still does as much damage now after patch as it did before patch, sorry to break it to ya
it's weird that some of you are finding yourselves with less damage on the spells though...since the TLs didn't change only the reqs. Lower damage on your spells now might be cuz of losing ppw from psicore and DS.
oh yeah and what the fuck is everyone bitching at
with this patch KK MEANT to bring back the hybrid. that was the purpose of it. to bring in a new uber type of hybrid that instead of using holy shelter and holy lightning it uses the midway spells for both. in otherwords it's a more balanced hybrid that before, but it may still be quite good
Point being that it's fecking hard to cap a HL now coz of the changed reqs. TL isnt everything, I need (out of the top of my head) 140+ APU to be able to use the HL, how much APU would I need to cap it now then??
And the gap between the n00b and high end spells is ridiculous IMO, 120 APU for a halo ffs.
And the bitching is because some people actually like to play pure monks, and with every solution presented for hybrids, pures got hit harder, even now when they make hybrids viable again, the pures take a hit again :mad:
the amount of points to cap the spell stayed the same, just the requ changed.
Originally posted by HumphreY
Maybe they nerfed the monks. But we dont want "Monkron" back, do we?
Monk is still very powerful and playable. So stop whining plz.
na, we have now tankocron, better this way ?`
play the apu, try to be powerfull against a tank or pe
Originally posted by Organics
*sighs*
120 APU now required to use my Holy Energy Halo? :( Fucks sake. I saved up for that bastard from when I started and bought a nice 2 slot one for when I got to PSI 55, I'm 3 points away and at 90 APU and now I'm totally fucked till I reach 120 APU (god knows when or how long that'll take :( ) What a waste of money, may as well not have bought it.
I don't know what u've done wrong but if u have set ur points out and can't use Holy nrg Halo by the time u hit psi 55 then u have done it wrong. Too many points in ppw is my guess. I have jsut lvl'd up (another) apu and could use holy nrg halo as soon as i hit psi 55 (post patch) for pures it should be no problem.
Originally posted by KuifJe
Point being that it's fecking hard to cap a HL now coz of the changed reqs. TL isnt everything, I need (out of the top of my head) 140+ APU to be able to use the HL, how much APU would I need to cap it now then??
im a pure APU, been once since i first picked up this game, my set up has remained the same (apart from me having to LoM out my ath skill as its pointless - was at 60 points) with 180 apu i cap my HL FA and all other spells bar Holy antibuff.. and i dont want to cap that (theres a good reason), the regs of them may of changed, but the % lvls havent.. if yu get the minimum regs for the HL yu'll notice that it will be quite powerful, as the cap point hasnt changed at all
the only thing i miss is the mana pool, which however aint to bad, but yu miss it anyways
Originally posted by SpawnTDK
play the apu, try to be powerfull against a tank or pe
A good apu can kill tanks without being hit or not hit very often and in 1v1 combat nothing can really kill a PE as its the best class for 1v1.
I see no one have been saying anything about range yet :)
They capped range on some spells as well so you can whine more hehe
Originally posted by Candaman
I don't know what u've done wrong but if u have set ur points out and can't use Holy nrg Halo by the time u hit psi 55 then u have done it wrong. Too many points in ppw is my guess. I have jsut lvl'd up (another) apu and could use holy nrg halo as soon as i hit psi 55 (post patch) for pures it should be no problem.
So you actually expected a raise on Holy Energy Halo from 87 APU to 120 APU. This raise is only aimed on (near)capped monks, which shows again KK gives a damn about getting new players. I know a few people who are new to the game and did get hit hard by this cuz they can't use any spells they just bought. KK should have simply released all PSI AND INT on monk class. Why also INT? My APU is capped in INT and does not feel like lomming all his IMP points just to compensate the drop in PPW. Kthxbye.
Originally posted by Mr_Snow
A good apu can kill tanks without being hit or not hit very often and in 1v1 combat nothing can really kill a PE as its the best class for 1v1.
good apu versus medium cs/dev tank
who will win ?
try it
before patch, most monks would take me, but since the patch not one monk ive taken on has beaten me, ppu or apu, i mean im fairly good fighter but not that good, ppus and apus been going down to my tank.
no offense to the monks, but id rather see tankocron than monkocron, but theres been a few imbalances created with this patch not just with the monks
edit: cos of the CS increase i was taking apus out with one clip of CS
I also prefer tank-o-cron over monk-o-cron... Since fighting is the ONLY thing tanks can do. Monks can implant, research, hacking, barter, even contruction and repair is an option for them. Tanks can only fight and maybe repair.
Tanks deserve to be better fighters then monks in 1on1.
But I totally agree that KK seriously went into the wrong direction with this spell req increase issue. They should have INCREASED the hybrid nerf to 50% or so. Not decrease it... And increase the req by only a little so hybrids can't use HL and holy heal, but blessed heal and holy halo should be no problem, you only get crap damage on them if you want them both.
Original monk
30-01-04, 13:23
after about 8+ hours of lomming im to tired to respond on this nice thread, i gonna continue back to some lomming, cu later, im still in a subcoma :P
If we want hybrids back, KK did the right thing with the increase of APU/PPU requirements on spells while keeping a small APU-PPU malus to tweak and balance new hybrids.
Yes, the psi pool loss isnt nice, but then it isnt something major and calling that a nerf is kinda too much.
Me thinks the only problem are leveling monks. My pure /34 APU will have a hard time now, too hard for new players and this is the major weakness of that new solution. As an APU can somehow solve this problem for leveling by using an APU kami chip (and thatfore these chips should be available in game again!) a leveling PPU is forced into a much worse position then he was before :mad:
This patched hurted my monk , but why didnt no1 talked about the -25 ATH on pa yet imo that hurts the most of all...
I mean i dont get it first it was the monk pa then they made it with -25 agil, but then many pa's got bugged (like monk pa had -6 con and , city admin ca pa was bugged) and after tthis patch of the so called pa fixes suddely its -25 ATH insteed of -25 AGil i mean wtf was going on here? Wouldnt make -25 agil and -6 int to the pa make more sense?
Originally posted by SpawnTDK
good apu versus medium cs/dev tank
who will win ?
try it
My tank has won yesterday. :D
Hi Lucjan,
I have to disagree with your statements above. The Psi pool for a monk is everything, any change in it affects its reload, rate of fire, versatility switching modules and effectiveness in combat.
It is a nerf. A different thing is that you dont give any importance to it, which is fair I guess, but some of us have miniaturized and exactly contabilized the ammount of mana that our modules need to be casted, when can we switch to other module, when we have to eat a psi booster and when it's a bad idea. Any minor change in my psi pool and I feel it greatly, now it has been decreased (mine in 50 points), and I wear DS.
How can you tell a monk in his face that he's not suppossed to cap PSI?
Personally I couldnt say that and not be embarrassed.
Tell a tank that he's suppossed to have low health.
Also I have done some testing this morning, and the leveling doesnt seem screwed... the major change is the mana loss IMO, but whoever did the job of increasing the requeriments in the psi modules knew what he was doing.
When LoM's work to gain levels in test server I will conclude my test, it's about 75% done, just need the LoM's working for the definitive confirmation in my tests (or to see if I am wrong).
I'm with sefran,
my apu is near capped and the ppw loss doesnt make much difference in my mana, and haven't noticed any nerf to my damage...........
but i've recently been tweaking my agl and ath to give me more health with the same runspeed, but now I'm gonna have to have a rethink.
it keeps me on my toes and interested at least ;)
good patch tho, lots of fixes :D
Devils Grace
30-01-04, 15:04
hybrids suck now
they have an offense of a past pure lvl **/40 apu
and a defense of a past pure lvl**/40 ppu
wich means that they are worse then they were with - 30%
the rest of patch has one or 2 things good
al the rest its completly fucked up
TH is closed
Punching guards exploit was not fixed and the list goes on........i think they are trying to pls all but they are doin things prety fast screwing all the good work they had done before
lower the specs in DS and core hmm i dont know....
altho i think for exemple tha advantaje of a DS from a exp psi con is only 5 int and 5 apu or ppu the rest the exp psi con 3 gives more
so if it was ment to be extreme hard to get(wich it is) it should have fucking stats, and not that hsit it has now
thats my 2 cents
and i think the patch is really bad in most of the cases
rasing the requs on spells i think its good for the reasons i stated above (hybrids) and a lvl **/40 monk isnt that strong anymore, but if u develop ur monk real good, u dont loose nottin at all, maybe a little mana but thats it
u still do the same damage and the same freq of fire
AS for the mana -8 ppw hurts already enough , i even had to lom more psi power (then put in apu ) to equal the dmg that 8 ppw gived pff...loss of much mana...
@Sleawer
I got now what you mean, I just logged in my PPU. The psi pool change isnt a major deal to my APUs (one almost capped one, one low level), but to my PPU it is :mad:
i noticed a huge nerf for my apu, not in dmg this time but in range............ i used to get like 265 m or something like that on my flame avalanche and now i get 145 WTF and my halo only gets like 165 m or something stupid like that from the same 265m originally ..... funny i didnt read anything about apu range nerf in the patch...
For all the pure combat monks the changes will be more or less minimal. I have one of these "gimped" tradeskiller PPUs and when I logged on I was not even able to cast a holy shelter. Instead of wrecking havoc and forcing the monks to be pure even beyond the means of the PSI [sub-]skills, they should have added a new skill in PSI (or replaced psi resist by it, almost noone is using that one anyway). This new skill influences the hybrid-malus, the higher the skill, the less the malus. That way the pure monks don't have that hassle with these uber requirements and the hybrids have another skill in PSI to waste their points into.
And yes, they nerfed the range on the halo spells now, parashock halo range got a hit by around 90 to 100 m (used to be more than 250 m). Even funnier is the fact, that I got told the shock effect hasn't changed at all (well, haven't checked that on my own, yet ... but if that is true ...).
But oh well, looks like we have to live with the stuff KK gave to us ... the next patch will take a bit before it hits ...
hudsonbeck
30-01-04, 16:17
Pre Patch:
I had my setup where a PSI combat 3 would allow me to cap FA.
Post Patch:
With that same setup and buff i am at like 628% Dmg and Rof is even lower.
LoMed to get FA caped.
Went to MC5 and my HL is doing way less dmg to commander.
There was a "Nerf"
Also the guards there are way more aggressive than b4.
One good thing is that they seemed to fix the "exploit" there.
Plus i am slow as all fuck with my PA on now.
Damnit,
Hudson
/edit I realize that the change in my dmg% was due to my DS and core not having PPW like it use to... I am saying it was more than that, wether is was planned or not, it doesnt matter. It was changed and should be changed back.
Is it hard to believe that while 90% of the other rares accidently got boosts, the other 10% (spells) got reductions??
Cruzbroker
30-01-04, 16:28
STOP WHINE!!
Dribble Joy
30-01-04, 16:32
Though I agree to, STOP WHINE, it was rather amusing listening to one of my clans apus go ballistic after finding out he can't use his FA for a good few levels :p
It is a bit tough on the people currently lvling, but for those capped, and those about to start, it's not too bad.
All issues of balance and power at a given level aside, it really makes no sense that a TL 55 spell has the primary skill reqs of a TL 110 spell now.
Tanks wouldnt be happy if their Unlabeled Plasma Cannon (TL55) requires as much HC as a Moonstriker (TL110). And tanks dont have three vital subskills under Str.
PEs wouldnt be happy if a Unlabeled Sunray Raypistol required as much pistol to use as a ROLH. PEs would be stressed cause they at least have PC, TC, and Agility all in Dex.
All classes would be pissed if they could no longer drug into a higher TL weapon for the sake of levelling.
Originally posted by Strych9
And tanks dont have three vital subskills under Str.
tanks have to throw all there points into heavy combat to even remotly come close to capping weapons
ZoneVortex
30-01-04, 17:04
strych9...but that's not a problem for monks.
pures can achieve it easily with minimal mana loss using the right imps, and it keeps hybrids from running around with holy this holy that flooring everything as they go.
for PEs they literally would not be able to use their weapons. they would not be able to get enough TC to like i said actually equip their weapons.
with monks though they can have enough mst and ppu/apu to use whatever as a pure and what they lose is mana which can be instantly if timed correctly recharged with psi boosters....whoppty fuckin doo
it's like stamina and why hardly anyone invests in endurance with stamina boosters around, you guys have psi boosters
yeah i know psi boosters aren't what they used to be but if you take it right before you're totally out of mana then you'll have enough mana to keep casting any spell if you keeep chuggin teh boosters
My PPU is /43. She has in Def Psi Proc 1, 2, 3, and Exp Psi Cont 3... I am positive about the first three, not sure about the last 1, but I think thats the imp.
She is BARELY able to use the spells she had in her QB... highest TL one was Holy Deflector I believe, and I had the exact number of PPU needed for that one.
Mind you my Psi is up around 80... and I overspecced (fortunately) in PPU for my level pre-patch... and now post patch I wont be able to use a TL 65 spell at Psi 80.
I am luckier than most in that I was already dependent on a low mana pool and psi boosters, as I overspecced my PPU. Now my PPU is the absolute minimum it needs be for the spells I have.. but NOWHERE near what it needs to be to use spells at my current Psi level.
Thats my only beef. I know once I am capped that I will be fine. But now I have to use spells around 20 Psi levels behind where I am to get to that point.
Originally posted by Strych9
All issues of balance and power at a given level aside, it really makes no sense that a TL 55 spell has the primary skill reqs of a TL 110 spell now.
Tanks wouldnt be happy if their Unlabeled Plasma Cannon (TL55) requires as much HC as a Moonstriker (TL110). And tanks dont have three vital subskills under Str.
PEs wouldnt be happy if a Unlabeled Sunray Raypistol required as much pistol to use as a ROLH. PEs would be stressed cause they at least have PC, TC, and Agility all in Dex.
All classes would be pissed if they could no longer drug into a higher TL weapon for the sake of levelling.
Agreed, agreed. Was going to post that myself, but I don't need to now.
For a lowish/mid level Pure APU such as myself, it's a horror nerf cos it's going to take me ages to level up to 120 APU for instance, from 94.
And yes, to whomever mentioned implants, I could use them, if I could find them. :( Personally though, I don't think I should have to rely on implants to use a spell, oh well.
Shadow Dancer
30-01-04, 17:58
Originally posted by ezza
no offense to the monks, but id rather see tankocron than monkocron, but theres been a few imbalances created with this patch not just with the monks
So you don't really care about balance then. Like most of the people in this forum you just want your own o'cron. It's all about selfish desires.
I wanted to see Neocron, not any class o'cron. Silly me, for wanting all classes to be balanced instead of my class on top. :rolleyes:
Originally posted by Maarten
I also prefer tank-o-cron over monk-o-cron... Since fighting is the ONLY thing tanks can do. Monks can implant, research, hacking, barter, even contruction and repair is an option for them. Tanks can only fight and maybe repair.
Tanks deserve to be better fighters then monks in 1on1.
That is so clueless. There is MAJOR gimpage in research and construction. ESPECIALLY repair. Only PPUs can "slightly" afford implant or hacking.
Apus cannot afford any tradeskill at all period. So a tank should be better than ANY apu 1v1 because some monks gimp themselves to tradeskill? That's stupid. The ones who tradeskill are already at a serious disadvantage pvp.
:rolleyes:
Zone, play a monk again please. I think you've forgotten what mana is like.
o_O
I don't know about you kids, but I'm putting my APU's on the shelf for awhile, till they get sorted...
I played my Saturn APU for over an hour yesterday, by the time I logged off him, I was pretty much pissed off about the gimpage.....
Nerfed runspeed(PA nerf), nerfed range, nerfed mana pool, even the PSI regen. and Medkits seemed to tick up slower....
Can anyone pile any more shit on top of that?
As for now, I cba.......
Also...
I think it's funny that there's a similar thread(APU/Monk Nerf), in both the German and French forums.......
Originally posted by Spoon
I don't know about you kids, but I'm putting my APU's on the shelf
GG hope everyone does that;)
hudsonbeck
30-01-04, 18:27
Originally posted by ezza
GG hope everyone does that;)
Pulled my tank out of the closet yesterday... saw how bad i suck at a tank and went to my PE :)
I think ill just use my PPU and APU for farming atm.
Tank PA is cool though.
Hudson
Devils Grace
30-01-04, 20:50
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
[B]So you don't really care about balance then. Like most of the people in this forum you just want your own o'cron. It's all about selfish desires.
I wanted to see Neocron, not any class o'cron. Silly me, for wanting all classes to be balanced instead of my class on top. :rolleyes:
That is so clueless. There is MAJOR gimpage in research and construction. ESPECIALLY repair. Only PPUs can "slightly" afford implant or hacking.
Apus cannot afford any tradeskill at all period. So a tank should be better than ANY apu 1v1 because some monks gimp themselves to tradeskill? That's stupid. The ones who tradeskill are already at a serious disadvantage pvp.
:rolleyes:
Zone, play a monk again please. I think you've forgotten what mana is like.
o_O
speakes the one with only one porpuse in life
the eradication of ppu's, completly
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Well if damage of a capped spell was lowered then thats kinda lame, but you can't really complain about the Willpower loss. It was only put in there when hybrids were nerfed. My PPU is already gimped so it especially sucked for me, but I wouldnt consider it a nerf, just a return to normalcy. ;)
Shadow Dancer
30-01-04, 20:59
Originally posted by Devils Grace
[ edited ]
Excellent contribution to the thread.
Originally posted by Devils Grace
speakes the one with only one porpuse in life
the eradication of ppu's, completly
That's in-game only.
:rolleyes:
Devils Grace
30-01-04, 21:00
really i must have a fucking great monk, kuz i didnt lost anything but a little mana pool
Like from 380 or 390 cant remenber to 350, but since im caped it doesnt make any diference.
stats on spells not even a tic
ppl are pissed kuz since mana is lower( = ppw) now they lost their beloved *** on rank
shame on u show off boyz
Devils Grace
30-01-04, 21:02
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Excellent contribution to the thread.
That's in-game only.
:rolleyes:
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
acording to the ingame thingy, lets pic up ur 2906 posts on wich 2905 are nerf or eradicate the ppu's
Originally posted by Devils Grace
really i must have a fucking great monk, kuz i didnt lost anything but a little mana pool
Like from 380 or 390 cant remenber to 350, but since im caped it doesnt make any diference.
stats on spells not even a tic
ppl are pissed kuz since mana is lower( = ppw) now they lost their beloved *** on rank
shame on u show off boyz Have you missed the part where 98% of the people upset about the changes are those WITHOUT a capped or near capped monk?
Yes you have a fucking great monk? Why? Cause like you say in the next sentence, its a capped.
We KNOW that the capped monks arent troubled too much, and just lose a little mana. But it sucks for those not near cap.
Shadow Dancer
30-01-04, 21:05
Originally posted by Devils Grace
[ edited ]
Who cares?
lol, you keep telling me so obviously you are dying for me to know what you think.
Originally posted by Devils Grace
acording to the ingame thingy, lets pic up ur 2906 posts on wich 2905 are nerf or eradicate the ppu's
I never asked for the eradication of ppus. One time I did ask for all monks to be hybrids, but I changed my mind. I've said time and time again I don't want ppus gone.
Pay attention, it's not that hard. :rolleyes:
Devils Grace
30-01-04, 21:13
Originally posted by Strych9
Have you missed the part where 98% of the people upset about the changes are those WITHOUT a capped or near capped monk?
Yes you have a fucking great monk? Why? Cause like you say in the next sentence, its a capped.
We KNOW that the capped monks arent troubled too much, and just lose a little mana. But it sucks for those not near cap.
yes i realise that.....but havent u guessed why yet.......
hmm i gota say this someway u wont get me wrong.
This is what i think..................me....
everyone has caped or near caped monks, those u havent either dont lioke it or never bother to have or play in one slot char...
this is for old school players or long time players....
so lets imagine that BDOY its really around the corner..
instead of nerfing them to please those u dont like them, pissing off those u like them, and problably making them to leave the game..... they did this...
"what have they done u ask"
well they made them hard to be....
"what the fuck u talking about, u dumbass"
well since we all know (including me, and i love my monk, wich is ma main char) this as become moncocron.
so with BDOY and with all our hopes, many more new players, they will go for other classes, kuz they will be much more easy to lvl and play, making that way the game more balance, not with a nerf but making new players either loose fucking loads of time to actually have one good monk, or go for other class char, wich will much likely hapen.....
its like this now...........monks fucking good and funny as hell char, very ver yhard and boring to actually have one (a good one capped) or very good balanced chars (wich i think they are now)
so what we wating is loads of Tanks and PE's and SPY's walking around
and WITHOUT ANY FUCKING NERF
do u agree with me ???
So to get balance ingame u completely fuck over one particular class' levelings path??
Correct me if I'm wrong plz :rolleyes:
P.S.
I got a capped APU and PPU so not really interested in lvling another monk, just dont get the logic in that reply
I understand you, but no I dont agree that KK wanted to make it hard to be a monk so they could cut down on the number of monks.
First of all, the level of mobs is BASED on their being support PPUs monks present. This is a documented fact. The increases over time in mob strength has been based on the increases in PPU effectiveness in protecting people from mobs.
So I dont think KK is counting on all of the existing capped PPU monks helping out all of the new players coming in. I think KK is depending on new PPU monks to be created to help the new players along.
Second, KK has been explicit with the notion that these changes were meant to hurt hybrids. They dont hurt hybrids much that are capped. Hurt em maybe more so than pure capped monks...
But these changes really SLAM new and non-capped hybrids. So mission accomplished.
However the changes also slam, but not to the same degree, new and non-capped pure monks.
If the devs ever removed the LOMs from the game, or at least stopped people from LOMming entire skills, then I promise you would see a lot more hybrids up in arms. Its virtually impossible right now to level a hyrbid as a hybrid from day one. And its now a LOT harder to level a pure from day 1 as well.
Your theory is a good one, but I dont see anything out there to suggest it might be true.
Originally posted by HumphreY
Maybe they nerfed the monks. But we dont want "Monkron" back, do we?
Monk is still very powerful and playable. So stop whining plz.
Even if that were true (which it isn't), it'd become Tank-o-cron, or spy-o-cron or pe-o-cron
It's the cycle. There probably never will be balance because people will find something that is 'unfair' or 'unbalanced' to what other classes can do.
My monk is capped since a year now, I use DS, Core, Attack 1/2. My mana was 390 and capped rof on all my spells and damage on HL and FA, now it is at 340 mana, cap rof on FA and HL, and damage only in HL.
What I wrote above from my memory shows that I care of my monk and I like every aspect of him.
Now what does your thread show Devil's... you dont even know what was your mana, let alone the damage or the rof on your spells.
It makes a difference to me, I still have those frigging three stars, for what I care anyway. When I cast a holy antibuff I want to have enought mana to hammer my enemy after straight, that's why we are damage dealers (wish someday KK decided to give tanks that role). I bet ppu monks are going to suffer from low mana pools even more.
Monks without DS have even lower psi pools, and while I agree that the DS shouldnt be a req to have good psi power, at least they could have made a way for PURE monks to have decent mana pools, it's not like we were able to cap rares AND cap mana... or that we havent suggested ways to do it ages ago.
And if you really like that theory, it only would work if all our monks were deleted and everyone had to start on under the same conditions... now we would see who likes monks and who doesnt.
lotsa pissed off monkehs :D
but for me as a capped apu i see this as the hardest hit:
1.) -ath on PA (hence why pes and tanks are more dangerous; also cuz of the "unintended" cannon boost)
2.) extra ppw bonus removed from DS/core down to orignial (hence less mana; i could care less about dmg but its the mana)
3.) (might be just me but some others have noticed too) range of output random dmg seems to have been lowered (confirmed for me on mid lvl halos/beams after doing industrial on my new monk; HL also a decrease but could have jsut been bad luck)
So now i cap HL and FA (almost FA: 647%) and have 343 pool.... used to be capped on HL and FA full and 402 pool
Shadow Dancer
30-01-04, 22:30
I wish KK boosted fire apoc.
:(
or put its rof to 105 instead of 87 :(
Cruzbroker
30-01-04, 23:13
People WILL learn to play the way it is now.
Devils Grace
01-02-04, 00:03
Originally posted by Sleawer
[B].
Now what does your thread show Devil's... you dont even know what was your mana, let alone the damage or the rof on your spells.
It makes a difference to me, I still have those frigging three stars, for what I care anyway. When I cast a holy antibuff I want to have enought mana to hammer my enemy after straight, that's why we are damage dealers (wish someday KK decided to give tanks that role). I bet ppu monks are going to suffer from low mana pools even more.
Monks without DS have even lower psi pools, and while I agree that the DS shouldnt be a req to have good psi power, at least they could have made a way for PURE monks to have decent mana pools, it's not like we were able to cap rares AND cap mana... or that we havent suggested ways to do it ages ago.
And if you really like that theory, it only would work if all our monks were deleted and everyone had to start on under the same conditions... now we would see who likes monks and who doesnt.
1st
no one loves is monk more then me, i dont know but if u played saturn u would know that i only play 2 chars
apu = Devils Grace
ppu=Marta Grace
i got a capped tank aswell wich i dont play anymore kuz i love my monk.
mana question - yes i cant remenber well my mana pool, kuz as u said u are a DS apu i only got my DS laste week kuz i never boder to have one kuz i capped all my spells cept the barrels without Psi 3 buff.... if u dont thats ur problem, rework ur setup....
so to me isnt a mana problem kuz i was lomming it anyway, for me mana is only good for lvling, pvp psi boster 3 is ur friend.
So the only thing that really worried me was if after the patch i still caped my spells wich i saw that remained the same.
i said that monks without DS have even lower mana pools, and i say its u that dont pay attentions to the facts
a EXP psi controler 3 gives more mana then a DS kuz gives +15psu and +15 ppw, and the DS gives +10 psu and + 10 ppw.
so before u try to tell others that they dont pay attention to what they say look at urself 1st, kuz u dont know what u talking about, and besides u should delete ur apu, kuz if u dont cap ur spells with a DS its pretty obvius that he is shiit, so delete him and go play a spy, a constructor one
I have been a monk in Saturn since day one, and I dont know who are you.
Mana might not be a problem for you, but it is for MANY people in this forum, so take a look outside your own point of view and realize that the world might not share your same view. I explained quite well in this forum why the mana is an issue and why it should be capped or almost capped for monks.
DS gives APU +5 MST +5 and PPW +10; which is far more than PPW +15 in Exp Psi 3.
So I suggest you fair Devil's to get a clue, I have been in these monk pants for so long that you cannot even imagine.
www.getaclue.com
-Jewish_in_Saturn
/edit: nice, didnt know that there was a page called 'getaclue', I should have figured it :D
ps: I cap damage on my important spells, aka HL, and rof in FA (oh well 647% dmg), HAB and rare barrels.. I do this in order of having decent mana pool, because more mana pool > capping damage in useless spells.
What is a shame is that PURE monks have to refuse to cap damage in all their spells to have 'ok' mana. One or either.
still gettin over 635 % on my apu didnt really noticed anything
if u ask me damage is ok but the defense is too much energy resist now monks can only be easily killed by pierciing
FA does a lot more dmg now than before.
Goddamit ! 273 mana pool down from 309 o_O Now when I cast an antibuff, by the time I have enough mana to get off a few HL blasts, a PPU can be re-shielded and healed up.
Which means I now have to shove some apu into ppw, which further decreases my damage output :mad:
Also, -ath on PA means im now slower, and therefore easier to hit by tanks and PE's, and seen as I now do lower damage (random damage HAS been nerfed) , the only way I can beat a tank is to have a ppu up my ass, or to ambush him :mad:
Edit: And I've been playing monks with various setups longer than the lot of u, so SEX you if u think im a noob.
To be honest I havent had enought time to re-test the damage of FA post patch, as I am going through a lot of testing with my spy (now 4 dex away to cap).
After I am done with him will try some numbers in FA. Two days before the patch I can tell you that it was the same underpowered FA that I knew... also the damage is random, and sometimes ridiculous, as very low.
That's one of the things that I'd like to see done in Lupus' TL weapon rework, a place in TL for FA and the damage tweaked in consequence. But this.... is going to take a good while.
/edit: Jedi the atl minus is changed for agl in next week patch, no worries I'm sure we can wait a bit.
Lifewaster
01-02-04, 02:03
Dont see how this is bad for levelling ppus to be honest.
Normally a levelling ppu gets his holy spells at about 65 psi...next thing he knows his rank is up to 70 plus and his exp gain in teams is totally retarded.
I had to put hack chips into my PPU to nerf his psi and get his rank back to under 60 just to be able to level.
So really dont see how this is any problem for PPUs at all. And BTW they can heal just fine in cave teams using blessed PPU spells, in fact they are usually better off doing so , lower rank, faster rof and lower mana costs.
Regarding APUs , so this means they level a bit slower in mid game than before, big deal, they still level ten times faster than PPUs in general.
I agree with STOP WHINE.
I still dont get it Lifewaster.. so having low mana is good because?
It affects leveling?
It affects your xp gain?
it affects PvP mostly, not PvM.
I have 3 stars on my apu also, but well that's the price we pay to have high ppw (still low mana), is something with what we have to live.
If you want to lower the rank in your ppu, then either lower the ppw or use lower TL spells. But one thing you should know: higher TL= higher xp, despite whatever is your rank. So to me sounds as your lvl'ing is screwed due your own fault trying to make it easier.
And regarding apu vs ppu xp gain.. there you have throw a stone into a controversial subject. I admit that never have done the proper tests for it, but in certain skills, like INT, ppu's seem to have it easier.
Anyway ppu's should be suffering for the low mana as much as apu's, if not more.
Lifewaster
01-02-04, 02:21
Originally posted by Sleawer
But one thing you should know: higher TL= higher xp, despite whatever is your rank.
Not for a PPU, we dont do any damage.
Its pointless for me to have a high TL holy shelter protecting several rank 40 players in a cave team, when that shelter is raising my rank to 70 and preventing me receiving any team exp.
True true, now I was thinking from my apu mentality. It shows how broken the ppu class imo, it obviously should effect the xp gain for ppu's.
Lifewaster
01-02-04, 02:29
Well maybe I need explain better. When I say nerf my psi, I mean reduced psi power and ppw. Didnt effect psi use.
IMO swapping imps was faster than lomming.
I had psi core def 2,3,1 and 90 base psi.
Reached rank 71.
Average rank in cave teams was 55, net psi exp per run was 10k psi, yes 10k, and maybe 20k cash.
After swapping imps I used same spells, but combat rank 56.
Average psi exp per run in caves was 800k and 80k cash.
I made 3 psi levels in half a day after this compared to where I would have got about 60k exp in all.
So I'm certainly not suffering for it, I can always swap back in the imps for PVP or MC5 to boost the damage on my spells.
Or you can always use Blessed spells instead Holy tho, but not sure how it will affect the performance of your team in caves.
You know.. switch spell and keep zonning until the rank resets, it should be ok. But any tactic is ok anyway if it serves you well.
Devils Grace
01-02-04, 05:23
Originally posted by Sleawer
I have been a monk in Saturn since day one, and I dont know who are you.
Mana might not be a problem for you, but it is for MANY people in this forum, so take a look outside your own point of view and realize that the world might not share your same view. I explained quite well in this forum why the mana is an issue and why it should be capped or almost capped for monks.
DS gives APU +5 MST +5 and PPW +10; which is far more than PPW +15 in Exp Psi 3.
So I suggest you fair Devil's to get a clue, I have been in these monk pants for so long that you cannot even imagine.
www.getaclue.com
-Jewish_in_Saturn
/edit: nice, didnt know that there was a page called 'getaclue', I should have figured it :D
ps: I cap damage on my important spells, aka HL, and rof in FA (oh well 647% dmg), HAB and rare barrels.. I do this in order of having decent mana pool, because more mana pool > capping damage in useless spells.
What is a shame is that PURE monks have to refuse to cap damage in all their spells to have 'ok' mana. One or either.
ahh i heard u were back and u should remenber me kuz i remenber ganking u a lot in pp before that guard bitch patch bug /exploit...
thats why...
u talking about mana pool or stats in spels given by apu
yes both (mana and apu) incrise the stats on ur spels but only PPW and PSU incrises or decreases ur mana pool...
so like i said an EXP PSI CON 3 gives MORE MANA then A DS.......
u get a fucking clue and get ur facts straitgh
i think u have been far away more time then u should
You need to lie to feel better or something?
The only time you ganked me is in your dirty dreams, which I dont want to be part anyway. Tho if you feel like trying you are always welcome, you know my name and my faction: Crahn.
And NO, Exp Psi 3 gives more ppw, which means a shit because overall the DS gives more mana.
Well I see you are trying to get out of this without humble yourself, keep trying, you are just showing your ignorance, your lack of honestity (or your cheeky lies) and that you dont know what are you talking about.
Keep that attitude, you will go very far... maybe as far as anyone else uncovers your ignorance.
ps: so you have heard of me? good, I havent heard of you, you are an unknown newb to me. That's the lot I care of you.
spikeownzu
01-02-04, 19:12
i am fucking uber pissed off
not everybody has got the time and enegry to level 4 fucking chars so that everytime KK screws up u can just chanmge char
i just have one, and hes a monk, and now hes tottaly shit
thanks a bunch Kk
Did they only up the skill requirements for spells? Because even my spells that are still capped after the patch seem to be doing a lot less damage...
Originally posted by Sleawer
And NO, Exp Psi 3 gives more ppw, which means a shit because overall the DS gives more mana.
How the hell are u working that out
Mana = PSU + PPW
DS = 10psu / 10ppw
Exp Cont3 = 15psu / 15ppw
thus the exp cont 3 gives more mana. True if u lom the 5 points u get from ds out of ur apu/ppu u will get more mana. But that ain't what u said.
Originally posted by Candaman
thus the exp cont 3 gives more mana. True if u lom the 5 points u get from ds out of ur apu/ppu u will get more mana. But that ain't what u said.
Well, what I said is written, so no discussion should emerge. Now I'm going to start quoting.
Look... I have posted this?
Originally posted by Sleawer
Monks without DS have even lower psi pools, and while I agree that the DS shouldnt be a req to have good psi power, at least they could have made a way for PURE monks to have decent mana pools, it's not like we were able to cap rares AND cap mana... or that we havent suggested ways to do it ages ago.
Hmm.. weird contradiction comes as follows, what gives more then uh?
Originally posted by Devil's Grace
i said that monks without DS have even lower mana pools, and i say its u that dont pay attentions to the facts
a EXP psi controler 3 gives more mana then a DS kuz gives +15psu and +15 ppw, and the DS gives +10 psu and + 10 ppw.
Well is hard to pay attention to the facts when he contradicts himself in two paragraphs. But hey I have a brain, so I re-stated again what I meant to say in the hope that he might notice that we are saying the same.
Originally posted bu Sleawer
DS gives APU +5 MST +5 and PPW +10; which is far more than PPW +15 in Exp Psi 3.
Now what are you trying to tell me?
I know what I said.. if anything I tried to be clear with what I posted.
And you deducted the part of lomming the 5 apu and 5 mst to add to the ppw.. so what's the part that I didnt understand?
Read the post all the times you need, I tried to be clear I asure you I did.
/edit:
Now I knew I was missing something, it was in the same paragraph that you quoted go figure.
Originally posted by Sleawer
And NO, Exp Psi 3 gives more ppw, which means a shit because overall the DS gives more mana.
What's so confusing about this?
what part of "overall the DS gives more mana" you didnt understand?
Hmm you have read what you quoted right... I am now trying to figure where I failed explaining myself really.
All monks have been nerfed to hell and are now completely
useless. Might as well reroll all them monks to something else
mmkay?
3 useless comments in 30 mins. Im on a roll.
SamuraiPizzaCat
02-02-04, 00:51
Originally posted by Rade
All monks have been nerfed to hell and are now completely
useless. Might as well reroll all them monks to something else
mmkay?
3 useless comments in 30 mins. Im on a roll.
ROFL
In a bad mood today ? :p
Originally posted by SamuraiPizzaCat
ROFL
In a bad mood today ? :p
Had a really shitty day. Deserves a thread of its own really.
**edit: whats worse is, it was sneaky shitty. Like it coulda been
real good, but wasnt. Important email about a course I need to
get grades for bounced. Everything in NC went, almost well, but
a little bad all the time. People pissing me off and just being
asses everywhere, not making much sense. Nothing good on tv.
That sort of shitty.
SamuraiPizzaCat
02-02-04, 01:04
Originally posted by Rade
Had a really shitty day. Deserves a thread of its own really.
**edit: whats worse is, it was sneaky shitty. Like it coulda been
real good, but wasnt. Important email about a course I need to
get grades for bounced. Everything in NC went, almost well, but
a little bad all the time. People pissing me off and just being
asses everywhere, not making much sense. Nothing good on tv.
That sort of shitty.
go hang out with ur GF
or
watch porn
either one works :p
Originally posted by SamuraiPizzaCat
go hang out with ur GF
or
watch porn
either one works :p
Hm, the chick Im working on is out of town. pr0n works tho. I
shoulda thought about that earlier. I always get cranky when I
forget to jerk off. And eat. Sandwhich and pr0n it is.
SamuraiPizzaCat
02-02-04, 01:10
Originally posted by Rade
Hm, the chick Im working on is out of town. pr0n works tho. I
shoulda thought about that earlier. I always get cranky when I
forget to jerk off. And eat. Sandwhich and pr0n it is.
yah my GF just left
im good now even with no neocron :p
i think wut slea meant was the 5 points in ppu,mst, and apu, when converted to possible number of ppw points, gives more than the 15 ppw total from the exp con 3.
example. Say u have base 100+ apu; and u have around 50 mst; then the 5 points in apu and hte 5 points in mst that the DS gives is total in RAW POINTS: 5*5 + 2*5 = 35. now, assuming u havve around 50 ppw natural. To increase ppw it would require 2 points of RAW POINTS per ppw point. Then the extras from the DS lomed over is: 35/2 = 17.5; call it 17 possible ppw points. That alone is greater than the 15 ppw points given by the exp con 3; and the additional 10 ppw points on DS means u get 27 ppw possible while exp con 3 gives only 15 ppw possible. (o and in my example i'm not talking about hybs. if a hyb's setup was in, u would get more points saved from ppu and give u even more ppw).
just a clarification with an example on wut slea meant.
I read the PATCH notes again just to make sure but it states no where about taking monks from behind and reaming erm good and proper
i liked my monk cause i never had to use rares all the times
i had fire and poison halo for range 313m i think it was, now its 185 sod using halo's now little difference from the fire apoc range so that was a complete waste of money getting them made id been using my fire halo even when beams were minted for range and its a total bum to have to put it back in the gogo cause of a stealth nerf
Give Halo's back there range
i probably would not mind so mutch but we never even had time to bend over ffs
ive never seen a class buggered so badly since the nerf of the hybrid
ohh yeah and i aint best please about the -25 ath
give back the one third of damage u took in this patch or give back our psi pool ffs
good thing ive got one of each class so when they bugger one i can switch to the other god knows what they do on pluto, just cry i guess
and while im moaning boost the god damned REDEEMER its crap
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:07
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
and btw if u dont cap ur spells cept barrels without a DS, u SUCK
like that one....
my monk caps a apoc and HL without DS
yes u can lom the extra 5 points in mst but that will give u more then +15 in EXP PSI CON 3 depending on how much mana u have, kuz if u have +85 points it wont give u much unless u have like 100 in mst, wich i dont belive so.
im not goin to argue on this anymore, kuz simply u have no reason..........
all i said is that with the nerf, and with the dificult u have on getin one DS, is not worth it anymore
so only thing good that he gives is 5 apu or ppu and 5 int for heavy belts, the rest is useless
kthxbye
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - trolling ]
Originally posted by Devils Grace
[ edited ]
and btw if u dont cap ur spells cept barrels without a DS, u SUCK
like that one....
my monk caps a apoc and HL without DS
yes u can lom the extra 5 points in mst but that will give u more then +15 in EXP PSI CON 3 depending on how much mana u have, kuz if u have +85 points it wont give u much unless u have like 100 in mst, wich i dont belive so.
im not goin to argue on this anymore, kuz simply u have no reason..........
all i said is that with the nerf, and with the dificult u have on getin one DS, is not worth it anymore
so only thing good that he gives is 5 apu or ppu and 5 int for heavy belts, the rest is useless
kthxbye
[ edited ]
WTF is your problem? You think claiming to have killed someone somehow means what you post is true? You post more bullshit about fights and kills than anyone else on these forums. Your posts are just random nonsense which prove nothing and just make you look even more stupid. Even MayhemMike is at least funny, [ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:23
name one post i made to boost any ego i may have
acording to the asshole yes i am
u like to say buullshit, kuz im alowed to do so
almost all my posts are pure spam, as u can see, but at least im not talking about, acting like i am all brains, when in fact all he is doin its showing that he is dumb.
now if u scrool up u can see who started falming, and it wasnt me
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Originally posted by Scikar
WTF is your problem? You think claiming to have killed someone somehow means what you post is true? You post more bullshit about fights and kills than anyone else on these forums. Your posts are just random nonsense which prove nothing and just make you look even more stupid. Even MayhemMike is at least funny, [ edited ]
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Originally posted by Devils Grace
name one post i made to boost any ego i may have
acording to the asshole yes i am
u like to say buullshit, kuz im alowed to do so
almost all my posts are pure spam, as u can see, but at least im not talking about, acting like i am all brains, when in fact all he is doin its showing that he is dumb.
now if u scrool up u can see who started falming, and it wasnt me
[ edited ]
It's not people acting like they're all brains, the posts above are what happens when people think for at least 10 seconds before they post. Whereas yours are clearly not given much thought, so to back up your argument you have to throw in insults and try to intimidate people.
Frankly, I couldn't care less if you don't know me. You don't have a rank on my list of respect either. You are, seriously, like a mini MayhemMike - you're not as good as he is, you're not as funny, you don't have as much respect, you're not as well known, [ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Originally posted by -=Bl@de=-
[ edited ]
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - trolling ]
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - GM abuse ] lol jesus what is this community coming too?!
Did mike kill u again today cos u seem pretty intent on bringing him down.
Originally posted by -=Bl@de=-
[ edited ] lol jesus what is this community coming too?!
Did mike kill u again today cos u seem pretty intent on bringing him down.
f*e*w*r* chars get no respect nuff said
Originally posted by -=Bl@de=-
[ edited ] lol jesus what is this community coming too?!
Did mike kill u again today cos u seem pretty intent on bringing him down.
I don't have much of a problem with Mike - at least he's funny.
I see you also have the same problem as Devils Grace in that you think I'll be intimidated by [ edited for consistency ]. Do you have any idea at all how boring that gets after 6 months? I still can't believe that in all this time people are still calling each other noobs (oh sorry, nibs) because they can't think of anything original to say.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:33
Originally posted by Scikar
It's not people acting like they're all brains, the posts above are what happens when people think for at least 10 seconds before they post. Whereas yours are clearly not given much thought, so to back up your argument you have to throw in insults and try to intimidate people.
Frankly, I couldn't care less if you don't know me. You don't have a rank on my list of respect either. You are, seriously, like a mini MayhemMike - you're not as good as he is, you're not as funny, you don't have as much respect, you're not as well known, [ edited ]
on wich part of of my posts did u saw i want to be known.....:rolleyes:
now if u said that in all my posts i wana flame u are right, all the way, about mayhemmike, ur prob is that u wish u were half the man he is....., im not trying to be him kuz unlike u he always had my respect...........
fame and glory do not give good things
u in the other hand have 4000......sometin posts on wich u say what ???
ur trying to say sometin that we all know and i try my best to do....
and besides i think before i post
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Originally posted by Devils Grace
on wich part of of my posts did u saw i want to be known.....:rolleyes:
now if u said that in all my posts i wana flame u are right, all the way, about mayhemmike, ur prob is that u wish u were half the man he is....., im not trying to be him kuz unlike u he always had my respect...........
fame and glory do not give good things
u in the other hand have 4000......sometin posts on wich u say what ???
ur trying to say sometin that we all know and i try my best to do....
and besides i think before i post
[ edited ]
So says the guy who has yet to form a coherent sentence and shows little working knowledge of grammar or punctuation.
I have that many posts because I enjoy discussing this game here and because I would like to contribute to its future. It's surprising how much your post count increases when you don't just posts flames.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:39
Originally posted by Scikar
So says the guy who has yet to form a coherent sentence and shows little working knowledge of grammar or punctuation.
I have that many posts because I enjoy discussing this game here and because I would like to contribute to its future. It's surprising how much your post count increases when you don't just posts flames.
ill take that the minute u speak my language the way i speak urs
then u can say i lack on grammar or pontu wahtever...
no it seems u cant say nottin else...........
like i said u should try and think kuz its not goin to give u high fevers
and besides u got that high count kuz its simple u have loads of time in ur hands
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
MayhemMike
02-02-04, 04:39
Whats this about MayhemMike ?:rolleyes:
Originally posted by MayhemMike
Whats this about MayhemMike ?:rolleyes:
hes a nib thats what
SamuraiPizzaCat
02-02-04, 04:42
LooseScrew you on?
Originally posted by Devils Grace
ill take that the minute u speak my language the way i speak urs
then u can say i lack on grammar or pontu wahtever...
no it seems u cant say nottin else...........
like i said u should try and think kuz its not goin to give u high fevers
and besides u got that high count kuz its simple u have loads of time in ur hands
[ edited ]
The fact that you have enough of a grasp of english to understand the posts here and post replies yourself shows that you could post coherently if you actually thought about it. [ edited for violation of the forum rules - responding to a flame ]
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:47
Originally posted by Scikar
The fact that you have enough of a grasp of english to understand the posts here and post replies yourself shows that you could post coherently if you actually thought about it. [ edited ]
then again u r making suposions.
in where did i tryed to intimidate u...
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - trolling ]
Originally posted by Devils Grace
then again u r making suposions.
in where did i tryed to intimidate u...
[ edited ]
And there you go again. If you're not trying to intimidate me by saying [ edited for consistency ] then what are you trying to do?
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:51
Originally posted by Scikar
And there you go again. If you're not trying to intimidate me by saying [ edited ] then what are you trying to do?
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - trolling ]
Psyco Groupie
02-02-04, 04:51
saturn has alot of spamming children that
doesnt mean you have to write with double
spacing nidhogg wont be printing out your post
and marking between the lines of text
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 04:53
Originally posted by Psyco Groupie
saturn has alot of spamming children that
doesnt mean you have to write with double
spacing nidhogg wont be printing out your post
and marking between the lines of text
i do that kuz at work, in the emails or faxes i gota sent i have to do it that way
after each sentence i gota keep one line in betwen.
so im used and i do it like hmm....dunno how to say
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - responding to flames ]
MayhemMike
02-02-04, 04:59
Scikar, who is your ingame alts?
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 05:00
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - trolling ]
Originally posted by Devils Grace
[ edited ]
And why do you keep replying to me? Some things we will never know.
@Mike: My alts are Scikar, Sci, Scipher and Alaka Zam. You've killed my Pluto PE a few times and that's pretty much it.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 05:10
Originally posted by Scikar
And why do you keep replying to me? Some things we will never know.
@Mike: My alts are Scikar, Sci, Scipher and Alaka Zam. You've killed my Pluto PE a few times and that's pretty much it.
ahh well im goin to bed kuz its late, and I work tomorrow
i saw scikar once in tg just standing there talking the rest i aswell dunno, i will keep them in mind tho:lol: (if u play saturn)
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - trolling ]
Originally posted by Devils Grace
ahh well im goin to bed kuz its late, and I work tomorrow
i saw scikar once in tg just standing there talking the rest i aswell dunno, i will keep them in mind tho:lol: (if u play saturn)
[ edited ]
Oh I know full well what I'm talking about. I'm having more and more trouble working out what you're trying to say though. I will look out for you too, no doubt you'll kill me with a PPU friend and then tell me how much of a 'nib' I am because of it.
Goodnight.
Devil's I am not a native english speaker, but at least I try to make an effort to speak correctly respecting the official languaje here.
Believe me if I post in my natural languaje very few on this forum would understand what I say, even when the best dictionary in the world. Does that mean that I have to writte the worst I can? It's not even a bad excuse.
You entered this thread insulting, trying to make yourself the best. Funnily enought that's a defence mechanism of your kid ego, now believe me again, if I tried to disclaim you or to make you look like a dumbass (that I dont have any interest), I only would have to let you post all the nosense babbling you have posted.
You have brought ZERO facts to this thread, nothing but showing that you want to kill everyone in your server because we disagree with you... and you know why? because you are so frustrated that do not have even an argument to come with against mines.
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
Oh and to try to keep the thread in the topic [ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ]
My conclusion of the last monk changes and the mana issue:
- Monks' importance wont chance an inch with these changes, if KK wants to rest importance to the monk role, or add to the other classes, I suggest redirecting the tweaks and nerfs to the ammount of roles that monks can manage at the moment, which is the true root of the imbalance.
- The best step to make monks less important of the patch has been adding an anti-heal drone. Think about this.
- Monks without DS always will have less mana pool than the ones with, no matter what ammount of ppw they have DS will always give more OVERALL mana. Even if you have 75+ mana (yes, 75+ not 85+ dumbass) or 100+, DS will always give you more points to play with.
*Note that the difference can be neglective in terms of points, but there is a flip in points (that I'm sure our scholar friend knows where is it) where each ppw point gives you 12.5 mana points, quite a big advantage if you know where to spec it.
** Also speccing 100+ PPW is retarded for everyone who has implants at his disposal (the above is just counted in terms of study the point value of each chip), since at 122 ppw the mana pool should be capped with a relatively high ammount of PSU.
- So in conclusion:
1) the step of changing back the +14 ppw in the DS to +10 ppw is GOOD
2) leaving monks AGAIN with low psi energy pools is BAD
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 13:52
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ], ur right about the 85 (75)
so i just finished lomming my apu since i have implanted the DS.
and with 87 mst adding the +5 of the DS, after the lomming back to 87 u will have 12 points to spend, and that means + 4 in PPW
so DS 10 PPW + 4 from lomming = 14
and EXP PSI CON 3 = + 15 PPW and + 15 PSU (against the 10 PSU of DS )
ciau
if im wrong, pls correct me thx
[ edited ]
Flaming and trolling is against the forum rules. Responding is also against the rules and there are no excuses.
The next post that breaks the rules on this thread will result in its closure. If that post is from either Devils Grace or Scikar it will result in a temp ban for that poster. I hope I make myself clear.
N
Yes Devil's you are WRONG.
You neglect to mention the points you gain in apu/ppu (+5), so it is ALWAYS better to have a DS.
Look at it from the point of view you most like.
DS>Exp3 in every sense and point of its configuration.
It must be like this:
- DS -> 5*5 (apu/ppu) + [2*3 + 3*2] (mst) + 10*3 (ppw) = 67 points
- Exp3 -> 15*3 (ppw) = 45 points
5 points in psu are like 2 mana points iirc.
Enlighten yourself.
PS: btw I'm addressing only the DS in this thread for a reason, the Psi Core is something that I consider a 'must have' on any monk, however others might have a different opinion, and being a rare I cannot really disagree...
Overall then, the Psi Core and DS changes in ppw should be a good move, in the sense that monks shouldnt be doomed to have DS and Core to have good mana pools without gimping themselves, but the situation in which that leaves monks is with what I disagree.
Monks get a bit more balanced with the other classes (they are still more powerful than most) and all the monks whine lol
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 15:23
1st in case i got it wrong, dunno if ur assuming that apu gives mana pool and if ur assuming that u can lom the extra + ppu that DS gives (wich u cant if u have 0 in ppu)
apu do not gives mana pool, period.
my 1st statement, on wich i didnt flamed anyone was and i will repeat....
the only advantajes that a DS gives is + 5 apu or ppu and 5 INT to use heavy belts..... the rest a shity chip gives more.
SO my statement was that its so hard to get a DS nowdays that isnt worth it for a monk that already caps the spells without one...
i didnt said it wasnt good
and we will be stuck in the same, on wich A DS do not give more MANA then a EXP PSI CON 3.....of course it as others stats that make him better, but not much better to put all that work in MC5.... to get one, tho i got mine easy but it was pure luck, kuz in 15 techs in one week i got 5 parts to DS after ressed and i just needed to trade the last one
k ?
bah... is too hard admit your mistake in some numbers, aint it?
You did the formula of above well, lommed MST and counted the PPW, you just have to lom the APU or PPU depending if you are apu or ppu et voila... you gain a little more damage and a good deal of mana.
Minic explained it perfectly before me, it's not a mistery.. just what every monk does.
DS also has zero negatives, so even better in that sense.. c'mon you have to agree with me in that.
And YES I agree with you in that a monk already cap spells without a DS. What I point however is that our mana suck in order to cap HL and FA even with a DS, and we have to refuse to cap these (I cap HL) if we want to have 'decent' mana.
Btw you triggered an old idea.. apu doesnt give mana true, but if it gave... let's say from a certain ammount (like 140+) monks would have more mana... bleh just ideas.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 17:47
ur formula is correct if the apu do not need the extra +5 points in apu or ppu to cap spells.
u will incrise more the stats letting the 5 points in apu or ppu thne lom them and put in ppw.
ive tried that kuz of the barrels, and i incrised the stats letin the points remain in apu.......
so ist a tricky question, kuz u can have both ways, tho in fact u can only consider loming the mst and not the apu/ppu (wich in most cases are needed)
so in a chip thingy question EXP PSI CON 3 gives u more mana, wich i think its FUCKING LAME, kuz we are talking about a chip that drops from a MOB and god damn fucking hard chip to get.
i think raising the reqs on spells should be enough to balance the class, as it is now
we wont see anymore lvl **/40 apus pwning everyone.......wich i think its good
now reducing the mana in chips is bad, and totally pointless in my point of view.
btw as nottin to do with this thread, but somehow as everything to do aswell
hybrids arent that good as they were with the -30% penalty.........
Do you play a PE at all Devils Grace? Because it doesn't look like you've had to balance a PE's CON setup judging from the way you look at the points from the chips.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 18:35
Originally posted by Scikar
Do you play a PE at all Devils Grace? Because it doesn't look like you've had to balance a PE's CON setup judging from the way you look at the points from the chips.
:rolleyes:
and no i dont play a PE kuz i dont like PE's
im a monk lover, im a lamer aswell, kuz its easy for me point and click as some say, and monk is the easy class to play, so i can pretend i am a very good pvper, and bash everyone else in trade afet r i killed themo_O
what u asked again ?
Originally posted by Devils Grace
:rolleyes:
and no i dont play a PE kuz i dont like PE's
im a monk lover, im a lamer aswell, kuz its easy for me point and click as some say, and monk is the easy class to play, so i can pretend i am a very good pvper, and bash everyone else in trade afet r i killed themo_O
what u asked again ?
As a PE you have to make every point count, it's the difference between dying in 5 CS bursts and dying in 15. So once you've made a PE CON setup you tend to judge implants based on how many skillpoints they free up in your setup, rather than just what they give you. For example, 5 APU is worth 25 skillpoints if you have more than 100 base APU. 10 PPW, if you have above 75 base but less than 100, is worth 30 skillpoints. Based on this, a DS is worth more PSI skillpoints than Exp Cont 3:
DS
5 APU = 25 PSI skillpoints
5 MST = 15 PSI skillpoints
5 PPW (assuming this is what KK changed it to, I haven't seen one since the patch) = 15 PSI skillpoints
Total for DS to APU monk: 55 PSI skillpoints
Exp Psi Controller 3
15 PPW = 45 PSI skillpoints
Total for Exp Psi Cont 3 for APU monk: 45 PSI skillpoints.
They may not be exact, I don't know what your base MST or PPW is so they could be worth a little more or a little less, but to me, I would prefer 55 skillpoints to 45.
As you said before you dont need DS to cap spells, and actually is a fact that most of us, even without DS, preffer to have low mana and cap certain spell(s).. HL. Thus if you cap your main spells before having DS, then once you get it you can lom those 5 apu/ppu points away.
Anyway I tend to look at the chips on a different way.. there is a point that you no longer see apu, r-c, t-c, ppw, or whatever subskill, but the raw points you can play with.
I'm sure this is the case of most people, and the only way to take advantage of the maximun possibilities of your char.
Not sure if I want to enter in the fact of capping rare barrels tho.. I know you need an INSANE ammount of APU points to achieve this, in no way worthy from my POV. You lose so much mana and therefore so much versatility. Before the -4 ppw in each chip I didnt cap rare barrels, and I didnt cap mana either (390). Besides rare barrels are no biggie tbh, maybe Holy Firestorm in PvM but that's all.
Regarding Exp3 chip, that's Mr.Gimp chip in any sense. Look at the comparison between bonuses/negatives:
- It gives you +15 ppw and +15 psu good..
- But takes away strenght so you can wear less bones (-force resist), and still takes away 20 force resist more, so even worse.
The only time I used it was when I was hybrid, had a holy deflector always on me and a lot of health.
When KK cracked hybrids I stopped wearing it.. yea even when there was no monk PA I didnt wear the chip. It's awful.
All in all, whatever you do, DS always will improve you far more than an Exp3 chip in every aspect. You get more points to play with, thus you get an improvement, and as if this wasnt enought, it has no negatives, improving this way your other skills/subskills aswell over the rest of chips.
/edit: I have posted the formula above Sci, it's even better... 67 points versus 45.
Originally posted by Sleawer
/edit: I have posted the formula above Sci, it's even better... 67 points versus 45.
Was just trying to make it clear. Also are you aware that it's back to +5 PPW now? At least I think it is, the additional bonus which was added to offset the hybrid nerf effect has been removed.
Aye, originally Core and DS gave +10 ppw each (in that time every apu bitched at having low psi pools). When the hybrid malus was introduced both chips were improved to +14 ppw, hence giving us the chance to toy with more setups.
In fact I was playing with setups in testserver when I found the flip point for ppw, the ammount of mana each point gave past that point was amazing... I recall finding Rizzy testing hybrids there and I was so excited lol, now pures could cap RoF in all spells and damage on HL, FA... and at same time have good mana!
Either that or capping mana (416 psi) and having good damages in the main spells (640% for HL and 621% for FA) aswell as capping RoF on them.. tho not in rare barrels or HAB.
Now we are back with what we had before... not that I'm not used to it, but still I disagree.
/edit: that means +10 ppw for both of course.
Ah, I thought it was +8, down now to +5. Shows how much I play my monk doesn't it. :p
Shadow Dancer
02-02-04, 19:07
Mana is low on my list of priorities however.
I think having a TL 3 heal or making fire apoc and all the rare barrels useful is higher on my list.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 19:08
ok
im not making my self clear....
ur assuming that the monk can aford lomming the + 5 apu/ppu that the chip gives, in that case of course u will get more mana, but u wont incrise in significant way the stats on ur spels, U WONT.
so by not loming that apu/ppu points, and once again i say, exp psi con 3 gives u more mana, just for the points of it..........k
im not saying that the DS is not good, it is good
what im saying is that the diferences are not substancial anymore to justify the hard work u have to get one........k again ?
of course to a monk caps their spels without a DS it will mean that he sacrificies his mana pool (low PPW and more APU), and that way he will lom that 5 apu/ppu points, but at the end its goin to be the same, kuz if u put that all in mana its goin to be the same if u go for mana (PPW) and less apu/ppu, and u keep those 5 apu/ppu that the chip provides....
now what part of my stupidity of PE con balance u dont get
Shadow Dancer
02-02-04, 19:11
Originally posted by Devils Grace
im not saying that the DS is not good, it is good
what im saying is that the diferences are not substancial anymore to justify the hard work u have to get one........k again ?
yup, i totally agree.
Originally posted by Devils Grace
ok
im not making my self clear....
ur assuming that the monk can aford lomming the + 5 apu/ppu that the chip gives, in that case of course u will get more mana, but u wont incrise in significant way the stats on ur spels, U WONT.
so by not loming that apu/ppu points, and once again i say, exp psi con 3 gives u more mana, just for the points of it..........k
im not saying that the DS is not good, it is good
what im saying is that the diferences are not substancial anymore to justify the hard work u have to get one........k again ?
of course to a monk caps their spels without a DS it will mean that he sacrificies his mana pool (low PPW and more APU), and that way he will lom that 5 apu/ppu points, but at the end its goin to be the same, kuz if u put that all in mana its goin to be the same if u go for mana (PPW) and less apu/ppu, and u keep those 5 apu/ppu that the chip provides....
now what part of my stupidity of PE con balance u dont get
Well you're starting to make some sense now. If you are willing to lom the points and setup properly then DS is worth more than Exp Psi Cont 3 no matter which way you put it. But, you are very correct when you say it's not really worth spending hours in MC5 for a DS when you can put Exp Psi Cont 3 in.
Yea SD we all have our own list of priorities, which is not bad... here is mine :D
1) All monks, low and high lvl's, have good mana if setup properly and with the right implants (rares are a bonus, but not a necessity for having mana.
2) This might aswell go in first place too. FA and rare barrels made useful acording to their TL.
3) Give us a reticle and fizzle with no LoS. This must come with the proper changes in the casting-animation secuence to put us on par with all weapons.
Not sure about the heal... if that means that our damage is lowered then prolly I agree. I'm sure many will tell it is overpowering us tho.
Yea damn we came to agreement.
Just one thing, if you want to complain that DS is not good enought for the effort of doing MC-5 (with what in a first moment I agree) I suggest going to get facts.
I mean, what the other MC-5 chips give over the DS to make them worthwhile?
I havent stopped to look at the chips since a long time ago, last time I did Attack/Defence chips got a boost in PSI main skill +1/+2/+3 respectively (and triggered the agl nerf for PA rofl, damn you MJS :p)
But what I mean to tell you is that KK listens, and if you really think that DS is not worth the same as other MC-5 chips then you can make some tests, bring some facts, and try to change it.
And yea to remark it, atm DS gives us a a good deal of mana and a some damage (what ppw gives anyway)... also a lot of improvement in our force resist, but I thougth it was a PSI chip lol.
/edit: removed a number, it all depends of the setup anyway.
The only MC-5 chip which really makes a difference is the SA. The Herc gives a small HP boost and a welcome H-C boost as well as resist force, but when you have Moveon, PPR, Marine, and hardenbackbone already it's not so good - you can use that brain slot for a movement controller 3 instead, so Herc replaces the Moveon. So you take a chip with no negatives and small boosts, and replace it with another chip with no negatives and slightly larger boosts.
DS as we've looked at doesn't provide that much benefit over Exp 3 to make it really worthwhile. Rigger's Dream and Hawking I can't comment on. But overall it's only really the SA that makes a difference, and the main difference being to PEs - it gives them better access to higher TL weapons e.g. Judge which Exp Ballistic Weaponchip 3 does not.
TBH there's not much to do about them, make them better and they'll be overpowering to those who are able and willing to camp MC5 for hours, so the only real way to go is to make them easier to get, and I can't see much support for that.
Well I think I can agree with that... to be honest this aint Evercron, and it shouldnt be, so dont think is a good idea to give even more advantages to the ones that camp MC-5. Althought some will say MC-5 chips are easy to get and so on... I dont really have an opinion about it really.
That's also the main advantage of those chips, allow you to play with more setups, removing old chips etc... not a bad idea. I'm just encouraging however to those that think it is not worth to explain their reasons to make it better, and to do the proper tests of course.
As I said before the regression to +10 ppw doesnt seem bad as a start, but all monks should have good mana.. capped or not depending on their weapon damages/rof, but good mana nonetheless.
Devils Grace
02-02-04, 20:17
Originally posted by Scikar
The only MC-5 chip which really makes a difference is the SA. The Herc gives a small HP boost and a welcome H-C boost as well as resist force, but when you have Moveon, PPR, Marine, and hardenbackbone already it's not so good - you can use that brain slot for a movement controller 3 instead, so Herc replaces the Moveon. So you take a chip with no negatives and small boosts, and replace it with another chip with no negatives and slightly larger boosts.
DS as we've looked at doesn't provide that much benefit over Exp 3 to make it really worthwhile. Rigger's Dream and Hawking I can't comment on. But overall it's only really the SA that makes a difference, and the main difference being to PEs - it gives them better access to higher TL weapons e.g. Judge which Exp Ballistic Weaponchip 3 does not.
TBH there's not much to do about them, make them better and they'll be overpowering to those who are able and willing to camp MC5 for hours, so the only real way to go is to make them easier to get, and I can't see much support for that.
yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yeys yes yes yes yes:lol:
see my point exactly
so i think rasing the reqs on spells was a good thing, but lower the stats on DS and CORE wasnt that good
it doesnt make that much of a diference, but overall is not that good
shit this argue waas a hard kid being born;)
prob with pure monks now is you gotta choose:
- near 400 mana pool, uncapped spells, need psi3 in fights
- capped spells, 320-or-so mana pool, can use melee3 in fights
my apu and ppu alike are both on option #2 right now....i may lom my apu back to a nice mana pool and just rely on a buff in op wars :( was really nice not having to worry about boosters mid fight tho, being able to cap my spells no matter what boosts i got on
Heh.
Could live with the mana pool.
What about the range nerf? Stupid idea :)
I just want to add that I dont like how implants and character
setups currently looks like, just like scikar said, the SA is a huge
benefit to any spy or PE, no question about it. DS is a nice bonus
to monks, but it wont really change anything, and herc is pretty
pointless. It all comes from the fact that when speccing a PE or a
inq-1 spy or even a normal spy theres alot of tinkering with skills
and numbers but tanks really dont, and monks do it to alot lesser
extent. Now I dont think this is fair, because tinkering with
numbers can be alot of fun, and doing it well should reward you
buy giving you a stronger character build. Tanks cant really
become better because they have a well made setup, neither do
monks, but Spies and PEs are anything between useless to ubar
depending on how well set up they are.
I guess its this way because of two things, the fact that there are
alot of subskills in dex which needs to be taken pretty high, and
PEs and Spies weaponry is balanced accordingly, and that PEs
and spies need to work alot with their stats to reach the prereqs
for weapons or armors. For example, some people whine about
that some dex weapons have very high theoretical max damage,
but what you dont see is that PEs and Spies have on average 40-
50 less in their combat skill than Tanks do, so they still cant reach
their damage output, this is what it has been balanced around,
which means that spies and PEs can make setups which gets
more skill, thus gain a little more damage output but probably
suffering somewhere else. Whereas Tanks can only spec one
way, get their capped damage and almost capped freq and thats
it, theres nothing to change around to get a better setup, and
theres no tl125+ items which are really hard to reach and you
have to swap around implants and stuff to be able to use.
BORING. And the same should go for monks, they should have
choices in their setups too, wether or not to reach certain spells
or get uber damage on HL etc...
Originally posted by Strych9
All issues of balance and power at a given level aside, it really makes no sense that a TL 55 spell has the primary skill reqs of a TL 110 spell now.
Tanks wouldnt be happy if their Unlabeled Plasma Cannon (TL55) requires as much HC as a Moonstriker (TL110). And tanks dont have three vital subskills under Str.
PEs wouldnt be happy if a Unlabeled Sunray Raypistol required as much pistol to use as a ROLH. PEs would be stressed cause they at least have PC, TC, and Agility all in Dex.
To answer point for point :
Tanks do not have the heavy weapons equivalent of attack/defense chipsets, the only thing remotely like the monks in the implanting department is the marine/psicore style implants.
Hence, comparaison is not equal.
Also, PEs have a cap of 80 on dexterity, contrary to monks which have 100 on PSI.
Once again, comparaison is not equal.
I gotta disagree with you rade.
Lets take a look at LOWTECH RIFLE PE's setup to use the pain easer.
You want: 66 int for belt, 93 dex for weapon
sf(5) + ballistic3(3) + exp.reflex4(5) = 93
ok there we go, we can use our pain easer and still have enough head room for moveon/pp
sf(5) + ballistic3(3) - exp.reflex4(2) = 66
ok there we go, can use medium energy belt now
now, when it comes to str, the +3 you get from the MOVEON gets neg'd by the ballistic3. those three extra str points would allow to use TWO things:
1) heavy inq boots
2) inq3 or duranit3 chest
unfortunately, both are useless to a good pe setup, in my opinion...because I would either be using rifle PA or titan armor on my chest, and holy shelter boots. so that 3 str i lose from the ballistic3 do ABSOLUTELY nothing to my setup. if i had those extra 3 points, it would make no difference in the world.
when it comes down to it...adding a SA instead of ballistic3 to my setup would *HURT* my rifle pe. how?
ballistic3 = +15 weapon lore
synapacc. = +10 weapon lore
so I just lost 5 weapon lore...for nothing....no gain whatsoever. sure, its +5 more hightech and +10 more hacking...but wait, i don't need either.
ballistic3 > SA for lowtech rifle pe's
:)
That's fucking easy gort, you're using the most cookie cutter setup that can be done, the PE-PE.
Make a good setup for a high tech rifle PE, or a high techpistol PE and suddenly things are not so frikking easy.
My pistol PE setup involves for example :
SF, balance3, special riggers interface, and balistic3, with spinal slot taken by the experimental dexspine they sell at MB ( which i can't be arsed to remember the name). With my pistol 3 eyepiece, i could use stealth level 2 and cap my judge before they modified the reqs.
hrm. Im not talking about lowtech rifle PEs specifically, Im talking
about the PE class overall compared to the other classes and the
ability to spec differently to reach VERY different results, which
tanks cant do at all.
Originally posted by lullysing
SF, balance3, special riggers interface, and balistic3, with spinal slot taken by the experimental dexspine they sell at MB ( which i can't be arsed to remember the name). With my pistol 3 eyepiece, i could use stealth level 2 and cap my judge before they modified the reqs.
SA instead of balance and you can use RoLH/BoH/capped judge
and stealth 2 even after patch. Not to mention how ubar the t-c
and the p-c on SA is. See, it really makes a difference for PEs,
unlocks alot of new fun choice.
Originally posted by lullysing
That's fucking easy gort, you're using the most cookie cutter setup that can be done, the PE-PE.
Make a good setup for a high tech rifle PE, or a high techpistol PE and suddenly things are not so frikking easy.
My pistol PE setup involves for example :
SF, balance3, special riggers interface, and balistic3, with spinal slot taken by the experimental dexspine they sell at MB ( which i can't be arsed to remember the name). With my pistol 3 eyepiece, i could use stealth level 2 and cap my judge before they modified the reqs.
[ edited for violation of the forum rules - flaming ] i got 4 pe's all with different setups. PE is the one thing I have down perfectly, if you wanna see a little demo how "efficient" my pe's are just send me a dm ingame.
I saw just saying that SA doesn't ALWAYS make a PE setup better, it can actually hurt a PE setup in some cases. [ edited ]. Anyone with a special riggers interface in thier PE says one thing:
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Why is it that no one ever listens to warnings? Thread closed.
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