View Full Version : ot: Evidence of intellgent life on mars
http://www.phatbeans.net/pictures/Mars_Lander.jpg
:D
lol, took me a while to spot it, hehe
Such an anti-climax.
Scientists are debating the fact that life once existed on mars. They found focilised single cell organisms in a rock from mars, but there is the chance that they got there once they got to earth. Tests show that they where more likely there whilst on mars, but then there is still that there was life on mars once but it hitched a lift from a meteor rock or something, and that it orrigionally came from earth.
Anyway we should know by the end of the decade, England is sending up a probe doing research on the subject.
Basicly if the life is from mars, and it develped on mars, then there is a massive chance that the universe is teeming with intellegent lifeforms.
cool huh?
we did, it crashed in a crater that was spotted 30 mins before the probe landed:mad:
Originally posted by ben77890
we did, it crashed in a crater that was spotted 30 mins before the probe landed:mad:
what? really? I thought it hadn't been launched yet... that sucks. Thats even worse than the anticlimax. Damn this is a depressing thread. :(
unless you dont mean the beagle probe..
Originally posted by ben77890
unless you dont mean the beagle probe..
When was it launched?
couple of weeks ago it landed, not sure when beagle was launched
Why u want other life forms, there obviously gonna own us, thats if there was other forms of life, which it would be nice to think that there is.
funkeymonkey
19-01-04, 00:04
Was supposed to land on christmass day, dunno if it crashed that day though.
Originally posted by Sanch0s
Why u want other life forms, there obviously gonna own us, thats if there was other forms of life, which it would be nice to think that there is. Other life forms would not specifically indicate other "intelligent" life forms.
Originally posted by J. Folsom
Other life forms would not specifically indicate other "intelligent" life forms.
Take Humanity for example...
Originally posted by Benjie
Take Humanity for example... Which is why I put the intelligent in between quotation marks.
Beagle was launched about 6 months ago, and hasn't been heard from since it detatched from Mars Express, a few days before it was due to land on Christmas day
They actually built some of the probe where I work, real shame it looks like it failed. but then it did cost 10% of the US landers
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 00:36
If there were intelligent forms of life within reaching distance of us, we'd know about it already;
Why?
It's called the fermi-paradox.
http://www.sff.net/people/Geoffrey.Landis/percolation.htp
That link should help explain...
The probability of life being out there, looking at it in a purely statistical form, OTHER than including fermi-paradox observations says; There is most definatly some intelligent life out there somewhere.
What people were looking for on Mars was not intelligent life, but life of any shape or size.
Benjie is quite right about the meteor that prompted this interest in mars, microscopic organisms found in martian rock ....but was it there already? or was it earth organisms from after?
Since the rock was found in the arctic (I believe, it mighta been a desert ..?) it was supposed to be statistically unlikely that it had been contaminated, but then again, it was also assumed possible someone coughing on it could have done the same for a time being (eliminated because the remenets of the organisms were fossilised not recent).
the significance of life EVOLVING somewhere else in a different way from our own is MASSIVE it proves there is a high statistical probability that there will be intelligent life out there.
And trust me - dispite what hollywood tells you;
The chances of any race travelling (at least) 4 light years just to pwn us is low, any species that is capable of traversing an interstellar gap would have had to have evolved socially more than our own species ....
....Then again, there are chances of people finding other species technologies crashed on their planets and using that as a model.
There are chances of races like ours being wholely overcome in a war and as most of you know wars = arms races = technology races = when the war is done they may end up with an earth like social status from the 60s-80s but the drive to push their technology much much further (space flight).
... Adding to that last thought...the reason why the chances of that is low, is because any civilisation who have been so warlike amongst themselves would most likely destroy themselves before they ever found us....
final edit;
NASA has some myth about a Mars "monster" since most missions to mars have had some failures on some scale or another, almost all the early missions to mars failed either...like the beagle probe, or just splatted against the surface for retro/schute failure.
Sigh.
Psycho Killa
19-01-04, 00:39
Sort of like how we will probably destroy ourselves before we find anyone else.
World war 3: Nukes away :(
Real life neocron is only several hundred years away :eek:
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 00:44
"I don't know what they'll fight world war three with.
But world war four will be fought with sticks and stones."
Name the quoted :p
edit;
Scorp let me be the diplomat :p
Darth Slayer
19-01-04, 00:44
U know the sad thing is. We watch all these movies where mankind is always battling against the alien menace yes ?
We get out into space and WE will be the alien menace.
We are for the most part a warlike race ready willing and able to fight over the simplest provocation. So guess what our reaction will be to seeing the first bug eyed alien. It won't be Star Trek unless u replace the Klingons with the Humans.
Dribble Joy
19-01-04, 00:45
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
The chances of any race travelling (at least) 4 light years just to pwn us is low, any species that is capable of traversing an interstellar gap would have had to have evolved socially more than our own species ....
Though I generally agree, just because they are nice to each other and have a lovely social system, doesn't mean they will be nice to us. :p Our planet is covered in reasources that are not found in equal diversity, in the atral objects so far encountered by man.
The meteorite found in the artic/antartic, when it was examined, was subjected to the normal procedures for electron microscope analysis.
This involves spraying a very very fine layer of gold upon the surface. Normally this will do nothing to distort the features beneath, but occationally, it can form clumps and with the right surface features, could easily appear to be an object resembling a microbe.
Psycho Killa
19-01-04, 00:46
Hah i wouldnt be suprised if we found intelegent life if we pulled an independence day in reverse.
Hmm they have a plush planet with all the stuff we need for a habitat to expand.... Engh lets nuke em all.
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
"I don't know what they'll fight world war three with.
But world war four will be fought with sticks and stones."
Name the quoted :p Einstein? At least, thought that was Einstein.
Do I get a chocolate chip cookie now? :p
Originally posted by Darth Slayer
U know the sad thing is. We watch all these movies where mankind is always battling against the alien menace yes ?
We get out into space and WE will be the alien menace.
We are for the most part a warlike race ready willing and able to fight over the simplest provocation. So guess what our reaction will be to seeing the first bug eyed alien. It won't be Star Trek unless u replace the Klingons with the Humans.That's not entirely confirmable until we actually get some extraterrestrial contact.
Edit: Though it's likely it'll result in war due to human Xenophobia, which currently finds it's place in SF movies.
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 00:48
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
Hah i wouldnt be suprised if we found intelegent life if we pulled an independence day in reverse.
Hmm they have a plush planet with all the stuff we need for a habitat to expand.... Engh lets nuke em all.
And make it non-habitable o_O
Mr. Folsom gets teh cookie :D
Psycho Killa
19-01-04, 00:49
I didnt mean nuke as in literaly use nuclear bombs on them. I meant it like obliterate there race.
Dribble Joy
19-01-04, 00:49
Neutron bombs are your friends.
Darth Slayer
19-01-04, 00:52
Originally posted by Psycho Killa
Hah i wouldnt be suprised if we found intelegent life if we pulled an independence day in reverse.
Hmm they have a plush planet with all the stuff we need for a habitat to expand.... Engh lets nuke em all.
:lol: Thats what I reckon will happen. There was a trilogy of books called the Damned by Alan Dean Foster, where a bunch of Aliens had been fighting a war for thousands of years. The good guy aliens losing the war go off in search of possible allies and yup find the most warlike species ever encountered the Humans.
Heh the books are a lot better than I've described it here.
Book 1 A Call to Arms
Book 2 The False Mirror.
Book 3......Damn I've forgoten the name I'll try and find it out.
Darth Slayer
19-01-04, 00:54
Originally posted by Dribble Joy
Neutron bombs are your friends.
With a radioactive Half Life of several hundred years an ideal wpn considering the time to transverse Interstellar distances.
Originally posted by Dribble Joy
Neutron bombs are your friends.
Damn somebodys gotta quote that in there signature!
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 00:56
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutron_bomb
You should read that Scorpeh
If indeed there is intelegent life out there, why would they come talk to us.
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 01:03
Originally posted by Biznatchy
If indeed there is intelegent life out there, why would they come talk to us. Why do we study primates and other lower animals on our own planet?
To find better explanations for ourselves about ourselves and the world around us.
Studying the species of the universe would also bring a better understanding of your own species on some levels.
I wouldn't be suprised if there were a sort of galatic ecology :p
And I would be even less suprised if we one day took a route that would destroy this ecology...
Biznatchy: That's pretty simple to answer, just check that thing QD posted on the Fermi-Paradox.
To wrap it up a bit, while the general consensus amongst those life forms might be not to contact us, it is nearly impossible that all of them would think so, and thus a group would by now have contacted us.
I don't think we will nuke or enslave alien life.
We learn from our mistakes and we have made those two mistakes already.
If americans find life on eart, there will be mcdonalds, oil pumps and mars Ricki Lake discussing the topics of why 2 sexes isnt enough for a amoeba lifeform.
If the french finds life on mars they will probably eat em all as delicatesse.
If the Chinese finds life on earth, the mars planet will be very RED indeed.
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 01:08
You could easily see it happen with A.I (Matrix-esque in terms of the start of their "problems") and Aliens we deem as "lesser".
It was only up until recently that we recognised the aboriginies (Sp) as human ffs.
heh @ the communismphobia displayed above...
Americans are really odd o_O
Dribble Joy
19-01-04, 01:10
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
heh @ the communismphobia displayed above...
Americans are really odd o_O
Says the ardent anti-capitalist :p
Originally posted by CarniFlex
If americans find life on eart, there will be mcdonalds, oil pumps and mars Ricki Lake discussing the topics of why 2 sexes isnt enough for a amoeba lifeform.
If the french finds life on mars they will probably eat em all as delicatesse.
If the Chinese finds life on earth, the mars planet will be very RED indeed.
Who cares if the chinese find life on earth... I've found life on earth. :wtf:
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 01:12
Hey wait isn't Carni German?
meh.
I had a flash to an argument I had with a friend of mine in my clan (different SSC division tho), about communism and how just because it's "different" doesn't mean it's evil.
He couldn't see past it o_O
Then I know not every american is like that, I've met some people who hate stuff like this even more than me :p
Somewhat Ironic, in the quest for equality often those who would hope for equality the most see those who don't want equality as lesser -_-;;
Which is something easily tripped over in something like interspecie communication I suppose -- our first contact/warefell people are gonna have to be *GOOD* x_x
Psycho Killa
19-01-04, 01:14
Communism is only evil because "absolute power corrupts absolutely."
Dribble Joy
19-01-04, 01:16
Heh, crazy Yanks.
Communism would work wonderfully, assuming all people do as they are told, beleive in the same things, have the same goals, are of equal intelligence and are basically drones.
Unfortunately it don't work like that.
Abslute power does not corrupt absolutely, that is a saying brought up by those not in power, besides power is only corrupting if the person with the power is corruptable by power.
And that doesn't apply to communism, because in true communism, there is no leader.
Im not saying they wont study us, in fact i agree "they" might have already been here and decided we are not worthy of first contact so to speak.
If I was reading the report of our planet over just the last 500 years as an alien leader, I would stamp it "Do not Engauge" and file it in the one day maybe if they dont exterminate themselves.
Originally posted by Biznatchy
If indeed there is intelegent life out there, why would they come talk to us.
Because they want to play NC. Duh!
Darth Slayer
19-01-04, 01:32
Drat I got meh math wrong again.....:eek:
Anyways if you are saturation bombarding a planet with Neutron bombs there will be a shitload of radioactivity.
Bleh it's moot anyways we will be long dead before PAX Humanica conquers the galaxy.
It is Human nature to destroy that which we fear or do not understand.
Oh and the easist way to destroy your adversary.
Accelerate an asteroid to near light speed point at planet and kablooie
Blanketing a planet with neutron bombs would not be practical because of massive fallout, but because of the amount you would need to drop given their low yeilds.
And as Einstein stated with E=mc^2. Light travel is just not possible. And as by all the laws of physics known to man, faster than light travel is not possible either. Therefore, if this holds true for other races of the universe, they probably will never reach our planet, just as we will probably never reach theirs.
Unless of course, they are pure energy beings like in Titan AE....but thats just absurd really.
Just introduce them 2 a 'lil global warming, then fix the damages later.
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 04:01
Originally posted by StrongSad
Blanketing a planet with neutron bombs would not be practical because of massive fallout, but because of the amount you would need to drop given their low yeilds.
And as Einstein stated with E=mc^2. Light travel is just not possible. And as by all the laws of physics known to man, faster than light travel is not possible either. Therefore, if this holds true for other races of the universe, they probably will never reach our planet, just as we will probably never reach theirs.
Unless of course, they are pure energy beings like in Titan AE....but thats just absurd really.
There are a very large number of suggestions as to ways to work around this rule, while it is true, traveling at the speed of light in our dimension IS impossible, doesn't mean it's the only place this rule applies.
In the studies for UTF there are a lot of "possibles" it seems where there were previously "impossibles."
Sounds like interesting books darth... might pick em up. I find it funny that in every move/show/game about aliens and humans, humans are never the warlike ones and theres always a war like species... To be more warlike then humans you gotta be pretty damn violent....
I dont agree that a race would "evolve" to be anti capitalistic or anti war... why would they? If I had a huge powerful space fleet and found a planet with inteligent life forms that had a resourse I wanted, would I trade? No. Id kill them and take it... well, as long as the cost of blowing them away was less then the war. Not everyone is a bleeding heart liberal like the majority of people on these forums...
Maybe light speed is impossibl I dunno... but I doubt traveling the galaxy is impossible, 120 years ago power flight was "impossible" Now itsd so damn ewasy we have powered flying toys... so lets just wait and see.
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 04:51
No offence Vett, but, never get involved in the military, nor the government :p
Originally posted by VetteroX
No. Id kill them and take it... well, as long as the cost of blowing them away was less then the war.
The problem with always going to war is, when you have very powerful nations that are going to lose and have no alternatives, they will fire their nukes. Think about it, if aliens were going to kill everyone on the planet - why not fire every nuke/chem/bio weapon we have. Give em a good fuck-off sign as the planet goes boom/glows for the next 50,000 years.
Dribble Joy
19-01-04, 07:51
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
No offence Vett, but, never get involved in the military, nor the government :p
You will not believe how much fun the army is :p
But then that's coming from the guy wanting to spend the rest of his life in the REME.
Re. faster than light travel.
It is possible to go faster than the 'speed of light', it seems evident that the speed of light itself is relative to cirtain variables (so called DSR, doubly special relitivity) though at present the 'increase' in speed is minor a BEST and only subject to single particles.
Our understanding of the fabric of space (not space-time, time is relitive to space, and from new understandings, time is becoming more of a 'linear' thing once again.) is unsufficiant to speculate whether we can bend it to create wormholes/warpdrives (space can be bent, we just don't know how to do it with current technology)
There is the whole thing using a micro singularity to drag itself and a ship forward, in turn warping space so that it appears to travel faster than light, but energies involved are beyond comprehension.
QuantumDelta
19-01-04, 10:18
Very true but I don't think a lot of this discussion was based on near future events ;)
Original monk
19-01-04, 10:30
this is a very intresting and funny thread :) i miss beanie McChimp's response tough, hope he will post later on :)
LoL @ carniflexes theory about what will happen if diffrent country's would discover life on mars :)
TheGreatMilenko
19-01-04, 11:37
if these so called aliens r smarter then us why do they come and take away are farm animals lol:rolleyes:
o wait i think i c somthing out my window *looks out window*
ah its nothing jus a couple of green people taking my cow away
The great milenko wrote
if these so called aliens r smarter then us why do they come and take away are farm animals lol
That is the proof that the americans have been communicating with the aliens for years. Altough theyre not paying for it seems to indicate some chinese communication about sharing the wealth on earth to all species.
And im not german, im swedish. And if swedes would find life on mars, we probably would lift an eyebrow and say oh, life! then continue our sexual orgies were famous for :p
Richard Slade
19-01-04, 12:57
Originally posted by TheGreatMilenko
if these so called aliens r smarter then us why do they come and take away are farm animals lol:rolleyes:
o wait i think i c somthing out my window *looks out window*
ah its nothing jus a couple of green people taking my cow away
Well mr. Wannabe ICP :p (Gotcha! :D )
Isn't it just obvious?!
They're better than us
And also lazier just for the same reason
So why breed your own shit when u can have someone else do it?!
Kinda like making dinner.
You, your wife or mom?
It aint u...
@Carni.
Well how bout we go wash up and give the femmes a double ham now grabben?
http://home.hccnet.nl/nickless/mars.jpg
this would explain the missing cows....:rolleyes:
Darth Slayer
19-01-04, 20:26
OMFG I like that one Ben that is so funny.......:lol:
Anyways don't Tacyhons travel faster than Light ?
I heard somewhere that while u may not be able to travel at the speed of light u can actually go faster.
But don't mind me u students have all the brains.....:p
http://www.virtual-underground.com/funny/nasa.jpg
i reckon this is how nasa will raise the money to go there :D
if Canadians colonize Mars, there's going to be Tim Hortons around every rock
PaulVinten
19-01-04, 22:06
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
"I don't know what they'll fight world war three with.
But world war four will be fought with sticks and stones."
Name the quoted :p
edit;
Scorp let me be the diplomat :p
Albert Einstein
PaulVinten
19-01-04, 22:19
Originally posted by StrongSad
Blanketing a planet with neutron bombs would not be practical because of massive fallout, but because of the amount you would need to drop given their low yeilds.
And as Einstein stated with E=mc^2. Light travel is just not possible. And as by all the laws of physics known to man, faster than light travel is not possible either. Therefore, if this holds true for other races of the universe, they probably will never reach our planet, just as we will probably never reach theirs.
Unless of course, they are pure energy beings like in Titan AE....but thats just absurd really.
There are ways round this. Just cos you can't travel faster then light, doesn't mean you can't cross great distances.
theory's:
1) Warp travel. Current theory tells us that space is warped. As we only perceive space in 3 dimensions, it is hard for us to conceive this, but, an analogy would be to get a piece of paper, scrunch the end up in front of a point, pass through the point scrunched up, and unscrunch it behind us.
2) Worm holes. There is a great deal of study in the possibility of a worm hole connecting to points in space. Again, this goes on the space is curved theory. you fold a piece of paper over (not in half) and instead of traveling all round the paper, you simple dive through the paper, and out the other side.
any others? my mind is in pieces after a hard day at Uni
shodanjr_gr
19-01-04, 22:28
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
"I don't know what they'll fight world war three with.
But world war four will be fought with sticks and stones."
Name the quoted :p
edit;
Scorp let me be the diplomat :p
Its Albert Einstein (he>all of us), i think at least that he is.
But i dont agree. If we do get to do a WW3, i doubt there will be anyone to fight after that.
The human race is exhibiting a self destructional behavior.
Id give us 100-200 years before we wipe out ourselves completely (global warming, polution, wars).
shodanjr_gr
19-01-04, 22:35
Originally posted by Darth Slayer
Oh and the easist way to destroy your adversary.
Accelerate an asteroid to near light speed point at planet and kablooie
Who said you need an asteroid??
You can do this with much smaller stuff.
Lets say something in the size of a BMW car (1500kg)
E=(m*v^2)/2=(1.5*10^3*9*10^16)=6.75*10^19 Joules of energy.
Thats a lot of energy m8!!!!!
67.500.000.000.000.000.000 Joules
I wanna talk to an alien before I die :(
shodanjr_gr
19-01-04, 23:13
Originally posted by Zanathos
I wanna talk to an alien before I die :(
That makes 2 of us.
But i also wana sex a drom!!!!one!!111!!!one
BTW any of u believe all that conspiracy talk thats going on? About the Aliens being here and all that?
Dulce Base (Area 51x10) Book (http://eaglenet.enochgraphics.com/dulce/)
Read a bit!
Sir ramic hobbs
19-01-04, 23:51
Bah you guys clearly have neevr seen star trek :P aparently mars's atmosphere is dense in carbon dioxide meaning our earth plants would thrive there in ST time we have a colony there
Darth Slayer
20-01-04, 00:49
Originally posted by shodanjr_gr
Who said you need an asteroid??
You can do this with much smaller stuff.
Lets say something in the size of a BMW car (1500kg)
E=(m*v^2)/2=(1.5*10^3*9*10^16)=6.75*10^19 Joules of energy.
Thats a lot of energy m8!!!!!
67.500.000.000.000.000.000 Joules
Forgive my overwhelming ignorance and the fact the above went so far over my head it's in the Stratosphere...:D But would'nt that burn up in the atmosphere.
@ Curse u QD I just saw your edit, bleh who needs diplomats if it bleeds we can kill it.....:p
Heh Aliens Vs Predator the movie this summer.....:cool:
Nullifidian
20-01-04, 01:11
Einstein proved that it is impossible to ACCELERATE to the speed of light would require an infinite amount of energy.
However, it has already been proven empirically that it is possible for matter (not energy) to travel faster than the speed of light. The key is, they cannot accelerate there, they have to achieve such speeds without accelerating. So in order to go faster than the speed of light you have to have an instantaneous change in velocity without application of force, or at least without application of force in the direction of motion.
The current particles which travel faster than light are Hawking radiation. According to quantum physics, particles pairs are constantly popping into existance and cancelling each other out. This is constant and happening everywhere. Because these are matter/antimatter pairs, the cancellation happens at the moment of creation. However, if such a pair pops into existance on the edge of the event horizon of a Black Hole such that one particle is inside the event horizon and the other is not, the one outside instantly has a velocity greater than the speed of light by it's very nature. It has this velocity however for only an instant (literally 1 unit of time), after which it has a normal sublight velocity. Such particles have been seen to exist and mathematically explain how Black Holes actually "leak" over time.
Anyway, long story short: faster than light travel is most definitely possible; but achieving such speeds will be through means other than any kind of propulsion.
There is intelligent life in the universe other than us.
This is true if you accept that the universe is infinite, therefore infinite possibilities have happened/are happening as i type this reply.
If you accept this theory to be true... that actually means that there is another me out there who is actually good at PvP. This also means that the poor shite isn't as good as pulling women as I am.
[edited by the missus] Was. [/missus edit]
Richard Slade
20-01-04, 11:11
Originally posted by ]v[ortice
There is intelligent life in the universe other than us.
Umm "other than us"? Who proves we're even on the way to being intelligent?
Originally posted by ]v[ortice
This is true if you accept that the universe is infinite, therefore infinite possibilities have happened/are happening as i type this reply.
[/B]
You people gotta play Anachronox
Good explanation to the universe
And how it works.
Prolly true too IMHO
Originally posted by ]v[ortice
If you accept this theory to be true... that actually means that there is another me out there who is actually good at PvP. This also means that the poor shite isn't as good as pulling women as I am.
[edited by the missus] Was. [/missus edit] [/B]
Sorry man PvP and women isn't a combo that works
But since you assume both and have to be wrong in the fact that there's not a possibility
You're wrong in both cases
Ha!
http://www.callisto.si.usherb.ca/~gesate/image/pollution.jpg
The best evidence for intelligent life is that they didn't waste time trying to contact us.
shodanjr_gr
20-01-04, 12:52
Originally posted by ]v[ortice
This is true if you accept that the universe is infinite, therefore infinite possibilities have happened/are happening as i type this reply.
The universe is not exactly infinite. It has a particular ammount of energy and a particular amount of matter. But you cant create matter or energy. If the universe is made by a particular ammount of ingridients, how can it be infinite? Sure it expands, but that just is the distance between galaxies. It doesnt create new possibilities of alien life appearing. Still i do consider Alien life a possibility since i would be at least egoistical (aka Vet times 20) if i believed that the human race is the sole race to ever appear in the universe.
Richard Slade
20-01-04, 12:55
Originally posted by Dim
http://www.callisto.si.usherb.ca/~gesate/image/pollution.jpg
The best evidence for intelligent life is that they didn't waste time trying to contact us.
In case of that picture I'd just say they didn't even find us o_O
I love how we can say it's "impossible" to do one thing and that laws always work in a certain way etc... we know squat about anything - we just convince ourselves we do.
You know that when a star is labelled as being "50 million light years away" they actually mean "between 25 and 90 million light years away" because there is a strong possibility of reflected light interfearing.
Until we're up there and exploring we cannot say. We simply have no authority to do so.
Hell, we can't even control the flu.
compare mankind and the universe to a n00b in neocron thinking he's uber coz he killed a rat.
Richard Slade
20-01-04, 13:11
Originally posted by Dim
compare mankind and the universe to a n00b in neocron thinking he's uber coz he killed a rat.
I do hope by god noone's been THAT n00bish thinking he's uber coz o' a rat
On the other hand
What n00b would be able to think in lines of being uber at the rat lvl?
Hypothetically speaking... could just as well be coz he killed an aggie.
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