Changes to local

[Mirco]

This subject came up in Mr.Fényx`s drone post. As you probably know droners have long dreamed of the ability to remove themselves from local while droning. I for one cant find one good reason for local to be usable during combat. I dont think this is something that should be droner only even though droners arguably would have the most use for it. All should be able to remove themselves from local.

So I decided to make a poll to find out what you guys think.

I also propose to cut stealthtime in half for all tools and perhaps increase time between stealths. Together with local removal stealth would serve more as a real emergency getaway at the start of a retreat and then its more up to playerskill, taking advantage of terrain and mindgames which is all good. It would nerfe PE`s, but spies would still have an extra edge, though at a higher cost.

[Ryuben]

this post confuses me :confused:

[Rade]

I like the local thingie as it is because it makes for more fights, in
places with alot of obstructed view there would be alot of
opportunities for fighting missed if there were no local... ack, we
cant have that.

Altho Im in favor of cutting stealth times by 1/2 or 1/3.

[Mirco]

Originally posted by Rade
I like the local thingie as it is because it makes for more fights, in
places with alot of obstructed view there would be alot of
opportunities for fighting missed if there were no local... ack, we
cant have that.

Altho Im in favor of cutting stealth times by 1/2 or 1/3.

Well you could get your fights, if it is a toggle key, leave yours on Rade. Though you might get more than you bargained for when you are the only one showing and also considering your reputation :p .

[[TgR]KILLER]

we got 3 droners in the clan and more in the faction so picked the dead droners option ^^

[jernau]

I can't vote for any of the options.

Stealth is fine atm for spies. It may need some tweaking wrt PEs (eg class restriction on >Stealth 1) but if those changes hit spies I'd be very annoyed.

Local needs to be fixed for droners - no question. The obvious option is to just remove the droner when the drone is launched. They also need to change it so the drone's location defines "local" for purposes of team XP and comms as well as give the drone a local list relative to itself. All of this has been said since beta though and none of it has even been attempted.:mad:

Other than droners I'd leave local as it is. IME of games that don't have something similar to a local list you always end up cursing it's absence.

[Mirco]

I see your point jernau and should have put it up in the poll. One reason I wanted it to be changed for all is that it would be fair and also that I think it would bring more fun into the game. I`ve never thought it the terms that rade or you do cause Ì`ve always considered local a problem. Probably because I started out as a droner. Jernau would you care to tell me in what ways the lack of local becomes a problem? I might be a bit locked in the way im thinking. Or maybe I refuse to see it cause I want a toggle key to much.

[jernau]

Well, the main reason is just ease-of-use. I'll try to explain by comparing to another game I recently tried without local though I think it's hard to explain the level of frustration unless you experience it first hand.

In crowded areas it was often tricky to identify anyone because (like Neocron) it has a rather limited number of player skins. This meant even if I could only see one person that looked like the person I wanted I couldn't be sure it was them. Many times when someone was trying to show me something I ended up following the wrong person miles out of my way then had to go back and meet up again (the chat system didn't help tbh). In NC it's very quickly obvious if you lose someone.

Similarly in open areas where player run-speeds vary and lag can often displace people, losing line-of-sight to someone can be a major pain without a local scanner.

Finding traders is also a mare - you go to the P1 equivalent then have to run around for ages highlighting every player looking for one you trust. This also means that upcoming tradeskillers don't get known as quickly because people don't really see them.

The game in question has no PvP yet (main reason I got bored) but I still got that twitchy feeling whenever I saw someone running up to me in the wilderness. Local is a reasonable friend-or-foe system in those situations. If anything I'd rather see local range enlarged for this reason.


Another reason for having local is that it tells you if you are near enough to your team-mates to share XP.



I realise that a lot of these things could be worked around with a toggle but I can't see an advantage big enough to make it worth while adding one. Bearing in mind how many people don't realise they have alt-K on unintentionally and how often the game bugs out and changes it for you without reason I'm in no hurry to risk losing a very handy feature.

[Mirco]

I have to say I`m a bit surprised. I thought this thread would generate more discussion. I guess this isnt a big a problem for people as I thought. I just cant help it. I think PvP local is bad,bad,bad.

Jernau: I want local to be a toggle key. That would in my mind solve the problem with finding people in crowded areas. I dont really think remembering to turn on local when needed would be a problem because you would depend on it more as a tradeskiller.
As for feeling twitchy when someone runs up to you, this a thing I would like. If you see a person before he is on you, you can aim at him and find out who he is anyways. If you dont see him, he get the element of surprise. When leveling people usually stand so close anyways that imho you dont need local to know wether or not you are close enough. If its a problem all in team can put local on and you would be set. I`ve never tried in a game so I`m only speculating of course.

The good things with removing local as I can see is:

1. Droning gets alot safer and finding a clever spot to hide is rewarded better. I have fought a few droners and once when I noticed the drone I stealthed right away and my eyes locked on local. I had a fairly small search radius, but still managed to find him thanks to local. I can only speculate, but as I was about to turn the other way when I found him, it saved me atleast more than a minute. As a former droner I actually thought of sparing him, just for a second, cause I felt a bit like cheating.

2. Spies can become more sneaky and not so dependant on stealth.

3. Easier to ambush and get ambushed.

4. Removing local and nerfing stealth 1/2 or 1/3 would better the situation with PE`s and stealth without having to bring in class restrictions.

5. If you are attacking someone you dont get an early warning if his friends show up. Would increase the need for battlefield awareness and require more skill of the player.

6. Fighting in places with buildings I think would be more fun because it would make for some interesting hide and seek gameplay.

[NeoSpartan]

there's nothign wrong .. quit crying :) and there are ways to hide you name from the list... i used to hide in elevators at TG and shoot poor bastards as they were running inbetween the gr/caves... and nothing is wrong w/ stealth except for the complete lame PE's that abuse it.. :)

[Mirco]

Originally posted by NeoSpartan
there's nothign wrong .. quit crying :) and there are ways to hide you name from the list... i used to hide in elevators at TG and shoot poor bastards as they were running inbetween the gr/caves... and nothing is wrong w/ stealth except for the complete lame PE's that abuse it.. :)

For a droner I think there is something very wrong with local and there are no elevators in the areas I fight btw. For droners I see a very good use for not being on local. For all others, well, I think it just would be more fun that way.

[jj dynomite]

I'm a droner.

With the current system i think droners should stay on a persons' local list.

A change i would like to see with the system would be local in safe zones only. With the upcoming changes to safe zones it would make sense for safe zones to be the only place with a local list. People generally only use the list to look for tradeskillers or to add people to direct. Well....with the new changes tradeskillers will probably be in a faction hq or another safe zone, so it stands to reason.

BTW....you should have only put 1 idea on this thread....very confusing with the mixture.

[MayhemMike]

Ryuben, your sig is the win tbh.