View Full Version : About NC:BDOY and the removal of Safe Zones
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 08:28
Ok. It is always difficult to release just a "bit" of information about something, when there's so much more to tell. As announced, we will release the full list of features for "Neocron: Beyond Dome of York" within this month (This is not some sort of torture, but a requirement since not everything has been decided upon yet).
The list of new features and changes will be massive and the removal of the current safe zones is just a tiny bit of NC:BDoY. However, this tiny bit only make sense when you know about all the other changes.
Here are some of the questions I've read about concerning the Safe Zones and my answers:
Q: Will all Safe Zones be removed?
A: No, the faction HQs and the clubs, bars, restaurants and malls (where players can use NPC-traders to trade their goods, e.g. while they are offline) will become the new safe zones.
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
Q: Will there be more guards in Neocron, when the safe zones are removed?
A: Yep, but we think about making them more fun to fight against. I.e. that a group of players will have a chance bringing a group of CopBots down.
Q: NC has Cop Bots... What will be their counterpart in DoY?
A: DoY gets defense (Y) replicants and cyborgs.
Q: Will there be other NPCs crowding the streets of the cities, besides the guards?
A: Yep, we will add a couple of NPC citizens. Also several other measures will be taken to make the cities look even more "alive".
Q: Will there be GeneReps in each safe zone?
A: That's something that has not yet been decided upon.
Q: What's the general intention behind removing the Safe Zones?
A: We think that we should give more responsibility about gameplay to the players. It is DEFINITELY not meant to boost PvP and to kill RP elements of the game. But this will make more sense, once you read the full list of features for NC:BDoY.
wow! MJS posts! Nice on Martin thankyou very much.
Q: Will all Safe Zones be removed?
A: No, the faction HQs and the clubs, bars, restaurants and malls (where players can use NPC-traders to trade their goods, e.g. while they are offline) will become the new safe zones.
Do you mean like player shops?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will there be more guards in Neocron, when the safe zones are removed?
A: Yep, but we think about making them more fun to fight against. I.e. that a group of players will have a chance bringing a group of CopBots down.
Thats how I orrigionally heard it was gonig to be. Nice on, I think this will add a lot of fun gameplay.
thanx for the update...
even small posts with partial details are good... mos def better than nothing...
i like the idea of having the safe zones removed that will give a more realistic touch to the game
but i dont like how it sounds the part of being easy to take out a group of copbots all that will bring lots of exploits :S
Originally posted by Bl1nd
i like the idea of having the safe zones removed that will give a more realistic touch to the game
but i dont like how it sounds the part of being easy to take out a group of copbots all that will bring lots of exploits :S
What exploits?
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 08:37
Originally posted by Benjie
Do you mean like player shops?
Yep. These NPC traders will take your goods and sell them at the price you set.
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 08:42
Originally posted by Bl1nd
but i dont like how it sounds the part of being easy to take out a group of copbots all that will bring lots of exploits :S That's why I said that "we think about" it. Not all pros and cons have been evaluated yet.
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 08:45
SEXY!
I want more!!! :p
will you remove the LE or put restrictions back on it? (please say yes)
FirestarXL
07-01-04, 08:50
Damn those legal issues or whatever is delaying the list. Nerf teh lawyers!
Thanks for the summary, still looking forward to the full announcement of course. :D
Originally posted by \\Fényx//
S
E
X
Fuck after finishing reading i ran out of kleenex, and ended up coating the ceiling 5 times. :eek: :eek: :eek:
KramerTheWeird
07-01-04, 08:59
About the traders, will npcs with their own merchandise be removed, so that the trade community solely relies on those who sell to npcs?
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 09:05
Originally posted by KramerTheWeird
About the traders, will npcs with their own merchandise be removed, so that the trade community solely relies on those who sell to npcs? Well, no... they will coexist. At least not right away. We will observe how well a player run econonmy will work and then we may decide to remove the NPC run traders.
However, seeing this concept fail in so many games, it is unlikely that we will take that step.
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 09:07
SO we can run throughout NC and fight? Like in plaza 1 and stuff?
KramerTheWeird
07-01-04, 09:08
Horizons atm has pawn brokers and consigners that deal only with player merchandise. All you need is to ensure some things can drop frequently, however Horizons did add to it by having resources availble to harvest, like trees and mineral deposists. Oh well, I think both can co-exist fine, some stuff is simply too rare or difficult to attain at shops, great idea!
I wouldn't take out all NPC traders.
We still need NPC traders for ammo, armor, implant parts, etc, etc.
But it will be cool to have vendors sell stuff that Runners can put from there inventory and then promote them in Trade. :)
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
SO we can run throughout NC and fight? Like in plaza 1 and stuff?
Yup! But expect to have guards on your ass.
I find it extremely cool they will nerf the guards just enough so big raids can happen on the city. :)
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
.. seeing this concept fail in so many games, it is unlikely that we will take that step. ]
Hear hear! :D
Just a little bit off-topic:
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
[...] DoY gets defense (Y) replicants and cyborgs. [...]I think it's hard to follow the storyline in every detail, but weren't the REPLICANTS the try of CA/Neocron to copy the original DoY-Troopers...? I did the DoY epic-run and I think I remember killing a replicant trooper for them ;)
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 09:20
Originally posted by Telepath
Just a little bit off-topic: I think it's hard to follow the storyline in every detail, but weren't the REPLICANTS the try of CA/Neocron to copy the original DoY-Troopers...? I did the DoY epic-run and I think I remember killing a replicant trooper for them ;)
I just gave that name to give you an idea about how they will look like. They will have a different (new) name and maybe a slightly altered look anyway.
FirestarXL
07-01-04, 09:24
Will there be some sort of mechanism to make "zone hopping" innefective on the safezone boundries at e.g. clubs? You know, where someone gives you umpteen poison stacks then zones to avoid retribution?
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 09:38
Originally posted by FirestarXL
Will there be some sort of mechanism to make "zone hopping" innefective on the safezone boundries at e.g. clubs? You know, where someone gives you umpteen poison stacks then zones to avoid retribution? Things like that are and will be hard to avoid. :(
Originally posted by FirestarXL
Will there be some sort of mechanism to make "zone hopping" innefective on the safezone boundries at e.g. clubs? You know, where someone gives you umpteen poison stacks then zones to avoid retribution?
yeah, like pp1 fights? please say something will be done about that, or I can see huge clans camping the exits to clubs 24/7. :(
Wow great, thanks for the teaser Martin, can't wait for the full list of features. :)
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 09:41
Originally posted by Varaem
yeah, like pp1 fights? please say something will be done about that, or I can see huge clans camping the exits to clubs 24/7. :( Uhmm... so what would you suggest to avoid someone slipping into safety after starting an attack?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Uhmm... so what would you suggest to avoid someone slipping into safety after starting an attack?
Well, some way of 'stacking' damage still being tied to the char that made that attack even after they zone, Will ALSO stop a certain barreling nublets and zoning exploit ;)
well i'd get flamed for saying this, but...
copbot-like guards on the outside of clubs, in the anarchy zone portion. Ones that shoot you if you draw weapons, but not if you have -SL like current copbots do. It'd give a sort of... buffer between safe zones and anarchy zones where you're relatively safe. Like, at least have a chance to either go back into the safe zone or stealth/run instead of just getting hit instantly by barrels/AOE or anything else really soon as you zone in.
Edit: oops, forgot... the point is that you don't fight right at the zone border, but someplace else, like a dozen meters away instead.
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Uhmm... so what would you suggest to avoid someone slipping into safety after starting an attack?
No safe zones at all
:p
Martin since your posting actively in this thread, and if this is totally off topic feel free to ignore it. What will be done about the massive faction hop that will take place to the DoY side? I was talking to an FC about this earlier and she seemed to think it wont be as bad as I do, but Im worried there wont be any one left on the NC side.
Addition:
Personally I think it'd do a lot if DoY was made a safe zone for the first couple of weeks of play. :p
maybe you could make it so if your char leaves the zone, any stacks you created, like fire/poison/xray/para/db go away. DAoC has something similar, but it's for friendly buffs instead.
Edit: Barrels stop too, that way you can eliminate a certain exploit while you're at it.
Spectra260
07-01-04, 09:52
this is kinda offtopic on the topic of safe zones,
but i was just thinking about this while i was using the ingame forums and thought they should be revamped with NC:BDOY
if they already are planned for that then never mind this...just a thought...
i was thinking like maybe a little better looking...and a search feature or somthing...make it more like these real forums...
thanks
kbye
mjs = leet:angel:
Tie DoT to the dealer's zone location. Different zone than the applied damage stack, stack removed from player, perhaps. Turns a nasty tactic into a harmless special effect.
Varaem's guard suggestion is probably more actionable, though.
but Im worried there wont be any one left on the NC side.
Hey! I resent that. Long as the LE stays, my Spy will remain N.E.X.T.!
My Monk, though... he may turn traitor. :-)
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 09:52
Originally posted by Jest
What will be done about the massive faction hop that will take place to the DoY side? I was talking to an FC about this earlier and she seemed to think it wont be as bad as I do, but Im worried there wont be any one left on the NC side. I don't think that that will be a problem. If everybody decides to be anti government (what I don't see), then a lot of people will take on the challenge and will change sides.
We consider a system that rewards players who play on the side with less "members".
Q: What's the general intention behind removing the Safe Zones?
A: We think that we should give more responsibility about gameplay to the players. It is DEFINITELY not meant to boost PvP and to kill RP elements of the game. But this will make more sense, once you read the full list of features for NC:BDoY.
i dont see how it could kill RP elements of the game, but only to boost them...it will make for some fun RP events tho...anti-city raiding the city...and the city having to defend itself...or vise versa...it should work out nicely...
ive been like constantly waiting pateintly for that list...lol...think im gunna take a vacation for a few weeks somewhere...and hope when i come back it'll be there...
good stuff
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
We consider a system that rewards players who play on the side with less "members". Oooo excellent. Good answer. Hehe. Definitely looking forward to it.
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 09:55
Originally posted by Spectra260
i was thinking like maybe a little better looking...and a search feature or somthing...make it more like these real forums...
You're right. But keep in mind that there are a lot of companies who only exist through creating (and selling) bulletin boards.
Now remember that the Neocron ingame forum is just a tiny element of the game. Then you will realize that an ingame forum could never be as good as a real bulletin board. ;)
Originally posted by IceStorm
Tie DoT to the dealer's zone location. Different zone than the applied damage stack, stack removed from player, perhaps. Turns a nasty tactic into a harmless special effect.
:) same thing I said a few min later.
Spectra260
07-01-04, 09:57
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
You're right. But keep in mind that there are a lot of companies who only exist through creating (and selling) bulletin boards.
Now remember that the Neocron ingame forum is just a tiny element of the game. Then you will realize that an ingame forum could never be as good as a real bulletin board. ;)
yea i understand it will never be as good, but maybeeeeeee it could get some improvments...
theres alot of little things that can be changed or made better by improving them that will make the game better in general and not piss people off as often :D
On bars, restaurants and malls becoming potential safe zones. These are currently a part of the zone itself, whichever zone they are in. Does this mean said potential safe zones will become seperate zones now? Meaning more synching and such?
Spectra260
07-01-04, 10:00
Originally posted by Sorin
On bars, restaurants and malls becoming potential safe zones. These are currently a part of the zone itself, whichever zone they are in. Does this mean said potential safe zones will become seperate zones now? Meaning more synching and such?
i think they pretty much mean like the clubs in pepper park which are already a whole new zone of there own, and you acn look foward to new bars and stuff with the reslease of DoY im sure...
Oh, and mr MJS, about Vet's LE question?
sanityislost
07-01-04, 10:18
Hey Mr MJS type dude thanx for the info but can u give the min specs for a comp needed to play BDoY cause im planing to get a new cpu,ram n mother board by the end of jan, just wana make sure its all gona run the game in the sweetest way possible
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 10:23
About zone hopping. Is it possible to prevent someone from zoning for 10 seconds after they have been hit?
Or if they recieve damage from ANOTHER player?
Martin J. Schwiezer
07-01-04, 10:25
@sorin and sanity: I'm sorry, but you'll have to wait for the full list.
Hrmm, come to think of it, as long as I have my LE, in it's current state, I don't care what becomes a safezone and what becomes a non-safe zone. Will just mean my constructor has 5 less cst skill ;) (removal of cst chip 1)
sanityislost
07-01-04, 10:29
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
@sorin and sanity: I'm sorry, but you'll have to wait for the full list.
okies young mister man of the making sweet games which keeps me up late and sleepy which forces me to buy caffine pills o_O
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
@sorin and sanity: I'm sorry, but you'll have to wait for the full list.
Gut feeling is screaming that means something bad is going to happen to my beloved LE :(
I can wait though.
Oh yeah, forgot...
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
:wtf: ............8| ..............................:D
MJS, if I remember (and translated) your post in the German thread about the same subject correctly, you also mentioned CityMerc bodyguards for hire for the support classes. Any more information? Or, failing that, at least the same information translated in English by you (Seeing as you're the one who knows what you really meant :p)?
FirestarXL
07-01-04, 10:58
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Things like that are and will be hard to avoid. :(
I reckon a brainstorming thread led by yourself could provide some good ideas. There's plenty of people here who have them, and I think they will be happy to help.
FirestarXL
07-01-04, 11:00
Crap, delete this please... :rolleyes:
FirestarXL
07-01-04, 11:03
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
You're right. But keep in mind that there are a lot of companies who only exist through creating (and selling) bulletin boards.
Now remember that the Neocron ingame forum is just a tiny element of the game. Then you will realize that an ingame forum could never be as good as a real bulletin board. ;)
Could you not actually integrate one of those forums into the game? Your people have access to the source code of these boards as well as the db, so I would think this is at least a possibility.
Of course, there might be licencing issues, but that would require negotiation by yourself, or simply the use of a GPL'd piece of software that allows this.
[i]
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
[/B]
So the Fallen Angels sort of become...refugees in DoY?
Or maybe they get disgruntled with CA and Reeza for some reason, start feeling unsafe being so close to NC, and decide to high tail it to the mighty Dome of York, where they can share technology with them as a side effect?
Woohaa this is all good. I liked the idea of TH and canyon being multihack ops. Well, he knows how to build up suspence that MJS. Keep`em wanting is the mantra eh?
Psycho_Soldier
07-01-04, 11:25
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
You're right. But keep in mind that there are a lot of companies who only exist through creating (and selling) bulletin boards.
Now remember that the Neocron ingame forum is just a tiny element of the game. Then you will realize that an ingame forum could never be as good as a real bulletin board. ;)
Why not a sort of ingame webbrowser that is locked to a specific domain? That could be just as good if possible.
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
(This is not some sort of torture)
LOL
Thanks for the info.
So bars are gonna be safe zones? It wouldnt make much sense if you couldnt pull a gun in pepper park bars...
Originally posted by Drake6k
So bars are gonna be safe zones? It wouldnt make much sense if you couldnt pull a gun in pepper park bars... Well, that could easily be implemented in an RPish way (Well, if the "DROP YOUR WEAPON!" copbot thing was removed anyway), by having an NPC at the entrance who only allows you in the bar if you agree to hand in your weapons.
This would actually just be the transition from safe zone to anarchy zone, but then handled in a neat way.
If that's going to be implemented though, maybe still allow people to use their fists, bar brawl!
Question to Martin:
You're saying that BDoY will change this game for many many many .... things we use t know on Neocron. But, BDoY is an add-on, no ?... so how will live together runners who have the add-on and players who do not have have it ?...
Will there be a xxMo Patch for Neocron ?
The add-on CD (or DL or something else) will then only add the Dome of York city zones compared to the patched Neocron we will all have ?
Please answer before end of this month :lol: (Yes it's a torture :angel: )
All Sounds very good.
In particular i do like the idea that is being thought of what to do with TH and TG Canyon.
I would very much like to see them as Full on Fortresses that have many areas to hack etc.
As for the possible Faction Hop to anti-City i don't think this will happen. There are always going to be the people who will stay loyal to the side they are on and those who always like to be the good guys :)
MJS, will there be a write up in story terms of how the world changes? And will this be experienced in-Game?
Thanks for the info; it is very much appreciated.
One comment. The zones in the southern third or so of the map do not contain a single mob capable of dropping tech parts while the northern zones are full of excellent WB and fire mob hunting spots. I suppose this made sense when most people started from the city and slowly pushed North from the Neocron gates towards better and better hunting grounds.
However, now that it will be more of a 2 empire world, it seems that each side deserves to have good hunting grounds near their home. It doesn't seem fair that the pro-city empire has to go into anti-city zones to do all their leveling and hunting.
Ray
VERY SEXY :D :D :D Very nice update as well MJS.
Originally posted by Varaem
maybe you could make it so if your char leaves the zone, any stacks you created, like fire/poison/xray/para/db go away. DAoC has something similar, but it's for friendly buffs instead.
Edit: Barrels stop too, that way you can eliminate a certain exploit while you're at it.
As long as it doesn't do the same for buffs. That would make MC5 impossible and a lot of caves seriously annoying.
Psycho_Soldier
07-01-04, 12:09
Originally posted by jernau
As long as it doesn't do the same for buffs. That would make MC5 impossible and a lot of caves seriously annoying.
How would that make MC5 impossible? Unless you are one of those people who zone in and out like crazy... I can't believe people actually do that. That itself should be considered a exploit.
Sounds good, about the LE as vet said, im not sure if it should be removed, but i think a penalty should be impossed on above a certain level.....or once un-implanted the penalty should be high if someone decides to go back to wearing an LE.
This would screw people who are Le users who wanted to do epics, but tbh why should people outside the city of NC be protected by a LE chip. It is after all a creation by Lion reeza and should not protect people anywhere but NC city
Jesterthegreat
07-01-04, 12:17
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
well im sure curious about what will happen to the apts / clan apts there... will they be moved to DoY too? will these 2 "subcentres" have apts still?
i imagine moving everyones apts and informing the owners wouldnt be easy... but if they are capturable, would you want you enemy gr'ing into the centre of the place (into his nice safe apt)
while we are on the subject of safe zones / apt's... can you stop apt's being safe zones? neocron apt's are right... not a safe zone, thats good.
however MB (and possibly TH and TG?) apts are currently safe zones too... that makes no sense and is annoying.
also could you confirm whether or not MB will have a safe zone as i have heard it will... but would prefer to hear it "straight from the horses mouth" as it were
Originally posted by Psycho_Soldier
How would that make MC5 impossible? Unless you are one of those people who zone in and out like crazy... I can't believe people actually do that. That itself should be considered a exploit.
Just the lag on zoning could kill an APU if he had no buffs, no shelter and no heal running.
As for the yoyo-method - I haven't been there for months precisely because that's the only sensible way to do it unless you are part of a monkey army.
You know, all those features are great and all, but, in reality, all this game needs is a bigger population. I remember when pluto had 550 people on at peak times, nobody cared about any of this stuff because it was so fun.
I think you should concentrate on advertising more than anything else. But I do like what I'm seeing - a big improvement :)
Hope this isn´t too much off topic ::
Here are some questions I would love to get answered ::
-Will ALL armors be visible now ?
-Will PowerArmors be divided into FULL sets, so you have to have all parts (boots-legs-belt-vest-helmet) on to make it be more than standard armor / make it give the POWER-boost that makes it into a powerarmor..
-Will armor colors be totally configurable ?
-Should there be some way of customizing your amor to make it stand out, ie.. slotted / modable armors ??
-Should the above mentioned mods for armors change look on armor ?
-|| MJS , you spoke of perhaps making TH and Canyon takeable since they will become secondary HQs.
Will other factions also have secondary HQs that can be sieged and hacked ?
Maybe make a Secondary HQ takeover trigger an event, where hacker gets a cube that he needs to get somewhere. and then he gets some money or faction loyalty or something ?
Sorry if it was too much off topic.
Original monk
07-01-04, 14:28
cool info all, good that we get some ;P
can ya reveal a bit more about the NPCtraders please, im lookin forward to em like crazy :)
good that ya remove safezones :) and with the clubs being safezones now we get crowded clubs and with some luck some gamblingstuff like roulette, poker, blackjack,craps and slots and stuff :)
add with that some new emotes and dOy will own yeah :P
Originally posted by Original monk
cool info all, good that we get some ;P
can ya reveal a bit more about the NPCtraders please, im lookin forward to em like crazy :)
good that ya remove safezones :) and with the clubs being safezones now we get crowded clubs and with some luck some gamblingstuff like roulette, poker, blackjack,craps and slots and stuff :)
add with that some new emotes and dOy will own yeah :P
*looks forward to play russian roulette with some n00b and my Doom Beamer ;)*
Well all u tradeskillers moaned when P1 was taken away from anti city now u can have a "Tradeskill Bar" and have a Drink while u get ur whatever u need done in a nice neutral area
ITS ALL GOOD MJS i'm sat at wrk buzzing my tits off at the thought of BDOY
/set subliminal message 1
POST THE BDOY LIST MJS
/set subliminal message 0
What subliminal message i didn't see one? :angel: :angel:
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: What's the general intention behind removing the Safe Zones?
A: We think that we should give more responsibility about gameplay to the players. It is DEFINITELY not meant to boost PvP and to kill RP elements of the game. But this will make more sense, once you read the full list of features for NC:BDoY.
Given the average maturity level of the NC player, and the amount of interest most players have in RP, I can only see this as a really really bad thing
It is fortunate the LE chip is staying in the game
/dribbles at new features...
Martin just to confirm do you have a new publisher?
If so can you tell us who it is?
And finally what sort of advertisment/publicity will be backing the release of DOY?
Deanus_willis
07-01-04, 15:50
Cheers for the info, we all look forward to reading that full list sometime this month.
You rule, and im sure DoY will too :D
THANK YOU :angel:
wow! im really impressed so far :) it seems like some ideas fromt he brainport have been adapted, as well as general vibes :)
good job!
Zone hopping is an issue that still needs to be addressed tho. especially barrel/stacking + zone.
Originally posted by El_MUERkO
/dribbles at new features...
Martin just to confirm do you have a new publisher?
If so can you tell us who it is?
And finally what sort of advertisment/publicity will be backing the release of DOY?
If you do a search I believe MJS or atleast one of the other Mods / KK employees unofficially confirmed that they do have a new publisher sorted. Same post that the official announcement was announced I believe.
And anyway - official announcement is this month (which would seem to confirm that they do indeed have a new publisher lined up) - so not long to wait now \o/
I'm sure that some nice magazine articles are lined up. Personally I would not expect the influx of new players to be instant, but to be a more gradual thing as more magazines and sites get reviews of DoY on them.
Athon Solo
Maximum of 24 days to go but my birthday is on the 11th so that would be a lovely birthday gift MJS wink wink nudge nudge say no more
So the player shops....is this like im thinking it is....e.g i give the npc my 4 slot cs and tell him i want 2.5 mill for it, and then ppl can browse the list and he will see my 4 slot cs with a 2.5 mill price tag on and buy it if he wants right there and then from the npc? :confused: if so then cool :D
if they nerf the stupid power of the guard in PP TH TG MB and the rest ill be happy, raiding is fun well it was not atm though.
as for everyone going to one side, if everyone went anti city, id go CA so i would have lots of peeps to fight against as much as id hate to leave my BD home
Can't wait.
Drool.
Now please! :D
The big hop to anti-city/DOY is why our clan started CA. To make sure we have plenty of people to fight. Hehe.
Regarding the LE:
In terms of RP, how could non-city faction runners even HAVE a LE??? How would it be enforced? So somehow the Neocron justice system could stop two DOY runners from attacking each other on the streets of DOY? Hardly.
Going by RP, if the LE stays in, I guess it SHOULD be that only city runners can use it, and its only effective vs. city runners. Meaning a ProtoPharma runner with an LE cannot attack a CA runner, but he could attack a DOY runner. And the DOY runner could attack all city runners, with or without a LE.
Frankly, I dont like that idea, in that fact that even though I dont use the LE, I like having it as an option for players. But what I said above would make more sense in terms of RP.
Where did you saw that both Doy and Neocron runners will start from the same zone ?... MC5 for Neocron and... ??? for DoY ;)
LE for Neocron... CI (cybernetic intelligence) for DoY :angel:
DigestiveBiscui
07-01-04, 16:41
sounds very good, but i will miss plaza 1
i always know where to go for pokes, ress jobs etc, but now with that not being safe im wondering where the tradeskillers will be?
Vampire222
07-01-04, 16:42
DoY info = Sexy, full changes sheet in BDoY will own even more... unless it doesnt include a new trade system.. anti-scam one...
how about we wipe which clans own which ops turn the servers off and the second we turn them on it is a race for clans to own the ops =D
DigestiveBiscui
07-01-04, 16:43
op wipe would = shit
the geeks of neocron who are on all the time will be there and just inja the lot of them......no point in it really
Wrt to a population shift to DoY there is an easy solution : don't add faction change NPCs for the DoY factions for a month or two after it comes out. That way people need to roll new chars there which takes more effort. Harness the laziness to do good.
Originally posted by Strych9
Regarding the LE:
In terms of RP, how could non-city faction runners even HAVE a LE??? How would it be enforced? So somehow the Neocron justice system could stop two DOY runners from attacking each other on the streets of DOY? Hardly.
Going by RP, if the LE stays in, I guess it SHOULD be that only city runners can use it, and its only effective vs. city runners. Meaning a ProtoPharma runner with an LE cannot attack a CA runner, but he could attack a DOY runner. And the DOY runner could attack all city runners, with or without a LE.
Frankly, I dont like that idea, in that fact that even though I dont use the LE, I like having it as an option for players. But what I said above would make more sense in terms of RP. Another possibility would be the inclusion of the Aggresive Impulse Reducer (AIR) for DOY, which is basically the LE, except for DOY :p
Both of those would be modified so that an LE'd runner could still attack anti-city runners, while anti-city runners with the AIR could attack pro-city runners.
This would allow people the choice to purely war against the other side.
Full protection would be given by using both.
Of course, you could simply make the AIR the DOY LE, with the same things applying to it as an LE.
wait a second.. something just struck me...
MJS !!
You cant make TH and Canyon "Takeable".. this will not work, since there are people with apts both places.. not to mention.. that it would be odd if MB or even NC.. not to mention DoY should be able to be taken then.. even tho TH and Canyon will become secondary HQs..
but still i cant make it make sense.. it would be too much of a rewrite, not to mention a too big deal to do.. ..
oh and uhmm.. are you gonna add more wasteland zones with DoY ?
it makes no difference if ur are moving to DoY u will be supplied with apt's there u just have to move ur stuff the interesting thing would be is what bonus's would TH and TG give i think it should be something uber cus they are more than regualr ops
Will the world map be enlarged by chance?? Any more places to lvl up and hunt different mobs?
Lisa Davitt
07-01-04, 17:07
Some of the promised changes seems good. But I remember DoY has been promised first to be released by around December 2002, more than 1 year later we are still waiting for it and we have not a confirmed released date.
Sombody has the phone number of Martin ?... he seems to be asleep..
You should sleep during night MJS, or in the day, but you should sleep from times to times :lol:
No more answer to our question or you prefer wait for the 'SUPER OFFICIAL DAY' ? :D
It's torture and i'm just thinking that you like it :lol:
give it till the end of jan then come back with ur negatism saying we ain't got a release date
Does this mean that FA will no longer be neutral to Neocron if their base moves to DOY?
Originally posted by J. Folsom
Another possibility would be the inclusion of the Aggresive Impulse Reducer (AIR) for DOY, which is basically the LE, except for DOY :p
Both of those would be modified so that an LE'd runner could still attack anti-city runners, while anti-city runners with the AIR could attack pro-city runners.
This would allow people the choice to purely war against the other side.
Full protection would be given by using both.
Of course, you could simply make the AIR the DOY LE, with the same things applying to it as an LE. I like the idea of having two different LEs... one to protect against city runners, and one against anti-city. So if you want total protection, in the newer, harsher world... you would need two brain implants.
That would be a good penalty I think for the runner that wants to avoid combat.
Lisa Davitt
07-01-04, 17:31
Originally posted by Candaman
give it till the end of jan then come back with ur negatism saying we ain't got a release date
your so loved MJS promised DoY was going to be released by Dec 2002 and was going to be free. Then it was said it was going to be released by March 2003 , later mid of 2003, again later 2003, and now that this month we are going to get a release date and it won't be free. I accept it won't be free if the expansion is big and worth as seems it may be, by what has been promised.
But I won't believe the expansion is here till I don't see it. Till now all what we have seen are promises nothing more.
Anyway I've been around for more than 1 year waiting for it and I'd a lot of fun playing Nc but
Jesterthegreat
07-01-04, 17:34
Originally posted by Candaman
the interesting thing would be is what bonus's would TH and TG give i think it should be something uber cus they are more than regualr ops
or keep the shops as is... the op controling TH controls the distribution of laser blades etc, and takes a % of the money earned in TH :D
Originally posted by Lisa Davitt
Anyway I've been around for more than 1 year waiting for it and I'd a lot of fun playing Nc but
you wre waiting for it, hmm the games fun as it is, no point in waiting for something to see if it can match your expectations.
at least its getting to the point where they can give us info on it come on ffs lighten up on the matter
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 17:40
Please Mr MJS sir, please don't make MB a safe zone.
PULEEEASE?!!!
I all seriousness though, MB FA and TG should be anarchy zones. As they are now.
umm he has already said they won't be safe zones because they are not faction hq's read first post second
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 17:52
On second reading, yes he did say TH and CS will not be safe zones. But he said faction HQs will be. MB is the Merc HQ.....
Jesterthegreat
07-01-04, 17:56
Originally posted by ezza
you wre waiting for it, hmm the games fun as it is, no point in waiting for something to see if it can match your expectations.
at least its getting to the point where they can give us info on it come on ffs lighten up on the matter
agree'd. thats why i have quit now. i wont continue playing on the hope that the expansion will save it. if you dont like the game currently (or like the game... but cant stand playing it :D) then no point waiting for DoY, paying, then quiting.
dont hang onto a theoretical expansion. i have heard too many people say:
"server pop will triple with DoY" - although its far better now, we still have rampent PK's on noobs (oh i thought it was an alt! honest!)
"DoY has loads of bug fixes" - yeah... they have loads of bug fixes... and refuse to release them until they release DoY... O_o
"DoY wll balance all classes perfectly" - do i even need to comment here? personally i think that the classes are more or less balanced. i think kk are doing a damn good job recently, however getting an expansion because you think it will balance classes, while in fact having no idea what will be added is just foolish
Junkie
Lisa Davitt
07-01-04, 17:56
Originally posted by Dribble Joy
On second reading, yes he did say TH and CS will not be safe zones. But he said faction HQs will be. MB is the Merc HQ.....
And TH is the FA HQ and the Canyon is the TG HQ.....
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 17:59
Originally posted by Lisa Davitt
And TH is the FA HQ and the Canyon is the TG HQ.....
They are, but not with DoY, they will be moved to DoY, which seems.... wrong. TH is the home of the angels, and the Canyon for the twiglets.
Jesterthegreat
07-01-04, 18:03
Originally posted by Lisa Davitt
And TH is the FA HQ and the Canyon is the TG HQ.....
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
i r teh leet copier / paster!
Originally posted by Jesterthegreat
....dont hang onto a theoretical expansion. i have heard too many people say....
Care to quote some of them?
I think most people have the sense to know BDOY wont cure all ills but many people lay their hopes for increased server populations due to the increased attention NC will get from its release.
As for bug fixes for all we know they could be completely re-writing the net code meaning we never have a sync crash again.
I for one put alot of my hopes behind BDOY because if it fails to bring in the numbers the game will die.
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will all Safe Zones be removed?
A: No, the faction HQs and the clubs, bars, restaurants and malls (where players can use NPC-traders to trade their goods, e.g. while they are offline) will become the new safe zones.
Excellent, the safezone idea ive been waiting for a long time!!
Make the streets unsafe (Make plaza and via rosso copbots and guards strong enough to take down a ppu. Maybe program the copbots and guards to attack the ones who has the most ppu skills, such as PPU's?)
About the outside settlements, how about making TH Sec-3 and MB Sec-2 a safezone instead? As for TG, how about an underground complex with a command center in the middle as a TG safezone? You never know when CA might drop some bombs.
How about removal of the Aggressor Cellars, and instead move them to Outzone Sector-3 & 2 and improve the Outzones with mobs, such as the Sec-5 Outzone with a SpiderMutant Mob as a mini boss for the newbs that drops good stuff?
And fix the Outzone Sec-4 have more Hurler spawns that are also faster to spawn aswell?
How about super strong Dragonfly and bat bosses in the mainsewers with random spawns? This will make people keep exploring the mainsewers and have city dwellers something to do..
In my opinion, the Aggies Cellars are one of the reasons to why no one is in the Outzone, at all.
Jesterthegreat
07-01-04, 18:12
Originally posted by El_MUERkO
Care to quote some of them?
I think most people have the sense to know BDOY wont cure all ills but many people lay their hopes for increased server populations due to the increased attention NC will get from its release.
As for bug fixes for all we know they could be completely re-writing the net code meaning we never have a sync crash again.
I for one put alot of my hopes behind BDOY because if it fails to bring in the numbers the game will die.
actually... no sorry :) im about to leave work.
also im not only talking about these forums (although it DOES happen here) im talking ingame. im talking IRL (i know 10-15 NC players IRL). im talking on IRC.
can you honestly tell me that no one has continued to pay / play on the hope that DoY will save the game? if so you are delusioned my friend.
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 18:15
Originally posted by Duder
how about making TH Sec-3 and MB Sec-2 a safezone instead? As for TG, how about an underground complex with a command center in the middle as a TG safezone?
You could make the core of TH a safe zone.
MB sec 3, or a new part of MB, literally a bunker, a safe zone.
Originally posted by Jesterthegreat
actually... no sorry :) im about to leave work.
also im not only talking about these forums (although it DOES happen here) im talking ingame. im talking IRL (i know 10-15 NC players IRL). im talking on IRC.
can you honestly tell me that no one has continued to pay / play on the hope that DoY will save the game? if so you are delusioned my friend.
I nearly agree with you but I think many people believe BDOY is the last chance Neocron has to be a BIG success rather than the guaranteed savior of it.
However what I disagree with is the quotes from your first thread, I dont think people are expecting instant prefection, total balance and a massive increase in server pops.
Originally posted by Ultazha
Question to Martin:
You're saying that BDoY will change this game for many many many .... things we use t know on Neocron. But, BDoY is an add-on, no ?... so how will live together runners who have the add-on and players who do not have have it ?...
Will there be a xxMo Patch for Neocron ?
The add-on CD (or DL or something else) will then only add the Dome of York city zones compared to the patched Neocron we will all have ?
Please answer before end of this month :lol: (Yes it's a torture :angel: )
It was already stated that BDoy is NOT a simple add-on anymore, but a whole new game. Chars from "old" neocron will be taken to NC:BDoY and active players will have the opportunity to purchase BDoY for a special price (IF there is no free version for download, which was not dicided officialy yet, afaik).
As far as I know you will not be able to play NC:BDoY with the "old" version of neocron only.
Lisa Davitt
07-01-04, 18:35
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Ok. It is always difficult to release just a "bit" of information about something, when there's so much more to tell. As announced, we will release the full list of features for "Neocron: Beyond Dome of York" within this month (This is not some sort of torture, but a requirement since not everything has been decided upon yet).
So it mean the dev/coder has not started working on it yet ?
Any idea when the definitive changes/additions will be decided?
Well, based on the last promises they should be decided befor this month finish.
Any idea how many months of work will be needed to do that?
3 months ? 4 ? 6 ?
Will we with some luck be able to get BDoY before mid 2004?
Will we have to wait till late 2004?
it may be they have the main section programmed they jsut have to set security zones and attack capabilities of guards and copbots and sort PARA out just putting the finishing touches on if u will
Load_HeavyLoad
07-01-04, 19:00
One Thing, Anything about Crahn HQs since the OZ one sucks and theres one in NC
AND
Black Dragon are allied to DoY Bots Does that mean we will be allowed into DoY, With TH and Twiglets (enemies) in there but In NC CA ( enemies) we're not allowed there either, which is OUR Empire???
Originally posted by Candaman
umm he has already said they won't be safe zones because they are not faction hq's read first post second
MB should be a safe zone for sure.. Think about it.. what enemy can walk into an "enemy" Military establishment let alone pull out a gun..?
Also there would be alot more safety etc.. not just the security guards..
Also.. MB (J_01) needs thinking about? Maybe sum NCP's standing by tanks etc..?
Anyways MJS.. thanx for the info. also think about the weak tradeskillers who are going walking through plaza "anarchy zone" to the Pub 2 do there jobs.. and keep getting gunned downo_O
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 19:10
As a merc, I don't want MB a safe zone.
Tbh I don't want ANY safezone ANYWHERE. Let the NPCs or the players defend their homes. As it is now. :D
Originally posted by Dribble Joy
As a merc, I don't want MB a safe zone.
Tbh I don't want ANY safezone ANYWHERE. Let the NPCs or the players defend their homes. As it is now. :D
I dont agree.. Im a Merc to and i think it should be a safe zone..
Any military area is sealed up like a tincan.. and should be extremely safe
[I don't want ANY safezone ANYWHERE]
Hard to get a Tradeskiller then
o_O
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 19:19
Pro city would still be able to trade in plaza, copbots will still shout at people who pull out guns and enemies would be shot.
MB should be very hard to get into, thats why there should be more guards (but much lower stats obviously.) but i still dont like the whole concept of safe zones.
A gat turret on top of the wall ends at the entrance would be cool.
Originally posted by Dribble Joy
Pro city would still be able to trade in plaza, copbots will still shout at people who pull out guns and enemies would be shot.
MB should be very hard to get into, thats why there should be more guards (but much lower stats obviously.) but i still dont like the whole concept of safe zones.
A gat turret on top of the wall ends at the entrance would be cool.
Maybe not safe zones yes.. But it should be armed to the teeth..
So that enemies can try..
Also get someting different in HQ's something that doesnt sound like "DROP THAT WEAPON"
personaly i think MB wont be completely a safe zone, and not all of it will be the HQ, as MB is getting an overhaul (talk to the CM guys in concentre ;) ) so i think lvl 1 wont be a safe zone but which ever lvl is made into the faction office / HQ will be a safe zone....
VERY nice stuff MJS, it's gonna be kick ass raiding Neocron and taking TH and TG, its gonna pwn.
Cant wait for the full list..
~T
Dribble Joy
07-01-04, 19:58
Not so much an overhaul, but part of the lower levels (sector 2 i believe) is being turned into the Faction office, as they did with the TH faction office in the Core.
I'm not sure of the details, I will ahev to talk with Vincent about it.
(IF HE EVER ANSWERS MY EMAIL)
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Things like that are and will be hard to avoid. :(
[ safezone-hopping, poison stacking and zoning ]
easy solution (already posted it in another thread) :
a person who has fired a weapon gets an 'aggressor' flag, and
is not able to enter safezones for 15 (or 10 or 20 ...) seconds after his last shot.
edit: this won't prevent poison stacking and then escaping in another war / anarchy / whatever zone,
but at least you can hunt that person down instead of someone camping at safezone syncs
greets, Lagos.
i sence no neptune....... :(
this is a great idea i mean but... quickbelts stay or go? safeslot stay or go?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Uhmm... so what would you suggest to avoid someone slipping into safety after starting an attack?
Sorry for the lateness of this but hows this:
Doors on zone with Agression timers... people who have commited agressive acts cannnot open the doors (or just sync?) for a couple of minutes?
Definitely a cool list of features. I can't wait for DoY personally. Guess I'll have to though....
Me love you looooong time
Mingoo
greendonkeyuk
07-01-04, 22:00
@ duder youre ideas ROCK!!!
@ heavy load - crahn and tg are allied atm, crahn and fa are not. I guess crahn will get stuck in the outzone for all time muhahaha! :D
Regards to the 2 le chip thing..... i like the idea except for one thing.... PE's and rares. Rifle pes will get..... um... the terminator only and pistol pes will get... um.... nothing, if current weapon reqs stay the same. Personally id rather have an le headbone as someone suggested in another thread a while back.
Other than that yes i love these ideas. i especially love the TH/Canyon lark.
P.s
www.rpgplanet.com/neocron
On here is a translation of a post on a german fansite or forum or something from MJS. It details a few points not listed here. For example MB WILL be getting one safezone (the core?) for the MB noobs and traders i expect. I personally do prefer this but i would also prefer if the poison stacks etc are removed when the aggressor zones out of the zone of battle. However PLEASE DONT do this with buffs, for reasons explained above.
Id jus like to say NC (potentially) > all.
Originally posted by greendonkeyuk
@ heavy load - crahn and tg are allied atm, crahn and fa are not. I guess crahn will get stuck in the outzone for all time muhahaha! :D
Correction, Crahn are allied with DOY, and are getting a nice big cathedral inside it, theres already been screen shots to prove this aswell, but i do think Crahn will also keep there OZ Church unless CA turf them out and demolish it, the only faction i dont see where there going is BD o_O as they are building that thing in OZ and yet are enemies to CA and one of DOY's allies.
Still cant wait for the list :p
~T
paolo escobar
07-01-04, 22:09
these will be my last words, as the excitment is giving me a heart attac...................................................................
[TgR]KILLER
07-01-04, 23:32
Din't read it all.. i dit read some.. and i think their good changes
only one thing is utterly fucked up..
i'm FA.. i live in TH.. TH is my home.. and the home we all live in.. the home we build up.. we defended.. and now.. we gotta abandom our great home to live in the bloody junk of DOY ?
christ martin check the story u made yourself.. FA lives in TH they build it its their home.. FA = the blue light of TH..
and i gues TG feels the same..
i'm totaly not happy with this..
and making TH a hackable outpost ? great make our home hackable hand have our enemy's feast in it.. great plan.. just great..
MayhemMike
07-01-04, 23:48
Good info, i scimmed through most of the posts but i got one question
In the Clubs right now, they are FULL of TS Guards. Will this change when Dome of York comes out?
All that i can think of for now :p
Are the Subways still going to be Safe zones, or not?
What TGR said - FA should stay in TH, we don't want no skeenking Dome.
Also - FA shouldn't be allied to DoY IMO, leave us neutral. We left NC to be independant, why on Earth would we want to move into DoY?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
ooc: @MJS - I've got about 5 (Or was it 6?) TH2 apartments full of stuff. Will I have to purchase new TH apartments in DoY? If I do, can you at least provide bigger TH apartments....please!
And also more importantly, what will happen to the Clan appts. As for the storyline for why the Angel loose their home, I'm looking forward to that...with a bit of sadness.
Also, I'm hoping that the notes that we're waiting on contain information about how businesses like Phoenix Ltd will be able to operate.
If we move from Tech Haven, will we get a new store in DoY or will we have just a crytons NPC standing with lots of other crytons NPC's ?
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
just great! now neocron turns into planetside!
i dont think moving FA out of TH is good or TG from the canyon, its there home FFS.
though putting them both togeather does make it easier for BD ;)
Originally posted by Flea
just great! now neocron turns into planetside!
Exactly. Red vs Blue childish crap. Please don't do this Martin.
yup i dont need my factions simplified into 2 "colors" i like it with the numerous allies neutral enemies.
i guess we just have to wait and see
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Yep. These NPC traders will take your goods and sell them at the price you set.
OMG SEX on a stick :D:D:D:D cool
MJS, HEAR ME!
Have a question about the vendors which you might or might not be able to answer.
If I hand the vendor 10 identical berzerk lvl 1's... Will they stack? Or no?
Stacking = sexy.
Non stacking = swg.
swg = devil.
;)
will there be forms of gambling ran by BD and TS?
new player skins?
120/120 droms? (LOL)
I know there are going to be some new items put out with BDOY but are there also going to be some new weapons available to people in neocron (to balance out)? AND are all weapons going to be available to both cities or will there be some "native" weapons associated with each city?
Originally posted by jernau
Exactly. Red vs Blue childish crap. Please don't do this Martin.
Neocron has always been Red vs Blue. Oh wait there are three colours. Planetside has three colours by the way. Red, Blue and Purple. :D
Originally posted by Kasumi
Neocron has always been Red vs Blue. Oh wait there are three colours.
Eh?
Unless you are talking about PA what do you mean?
There is "Red Enemies" "Green Allies" and "Neutral" Dont know their colour. Neocron has three colours. There maybe different factions but there are only 3 colours. SO.. You are basically fighting "Red vs Blue" :) Not matter on how many faction there are.
Dribble Joy
08-01-04, 07:23
Great, at this rate the only neutral faction left will be the mercs....
Please Martin, keep FA a neutral faction.
FA are neutral to CA but don't like the way they operate, and are allied to TG
CM are neutral to CA but don't like the way TG operate and are allied to TT (enemies of FA)
Perhaps FA will throw in thier lot with the Dome, but suddenly realise what a bunch of bong holes theye are and go back to being neutral again....
i dont like the idea that th and tg canyon will become hackable i really dont wanna play capture the flag in neocron :(
Originally posted by Kasumi
There is "Red Enemies" "Green Allies" and "Neutral" Dont know their colour. Neocron has three colours. There maybe different factions but there are only 3 colours. SO.. You are basically fighting "Red vs Blue" :) Not matter on how many faction there are.
Yes but my Red/Yellow/Green arent the same as my allies and the enemie of my enemy may not be my friend.
Saying that I dodnt think BDOY will turn it into red -v- green cause although FA and Crahn are both under the same roof they'll still be killing eachother as much as NC clans :)
I'd also like to point out Martin was just thinking out loud and nothign is set in stone, no wonder he doesnt post when people jump on his words and twist them like everyone seems to have done.
Originally posted by Kasumi
There is "Red Enemies" "Green Allies" and "Neutral" Dont know their colour. Neocron has three colours. There maybe different factions but there are only 3 colours. SO.. You are basically fighting "Red vs Blue" :) Not matter on how many faction there are.
I suppose that's one way to see it.
I was more referring to the fact that those relations are different to each faction. Most importantly - just because I am green to 2 other runners they don't have to be green to each other. It's that level of complexity that makes NC not "red vs blue" not the fact individual runners have allies and enemies.
/edit - @muerko : the FA allegiance thing has been looming for a while now actually so I think KK are seriously considering it. In that case we need to speak up to try and stop it. So far people are being civil, for once, so I can't see why Martin should feel hassled though I know this community has disgraced itself in similar circumstances before.
Thanks martin for info as always.
I'm hoping BDOY changes this game alot, just adding new content
is something that wont bring back my long lost inner neocron player
that flurished in the beginning of retail. Game mechanics, systems,
rules of the like changes will let me sorta re-learn the game while
i take advantage of the new content, but the game still needs that
"mojo" that makes it so special and not another cliche typical sucky
mmorpg :)
My Expectations:
1) Server counts increased (speaking of which, my server stat cgi
service will reopen soon peeps, i have alot of plans for them like
being featured on BDOY review sites so interested gamers/old
players of the game can see how much better the game has evolved)
2) Revived fun lost from the past because of repetition of the current
game mechanics, systems and rules.
I have my faith kk will come through, they worked on neocron far
too long to come short, for my expectations anyway.
FBI
Originally posted by jernau
Exactly. Red vs Blue childish crap. Please don't do this Martin.
well its not exactly Red vs Blue because we still have ppl that dont like each others living in the same city(side).
i really hope they keep different factions alife becaust thats what makes NC a little special.
: the FA allegiance thing has been looming for a while now actually so I think KK are seriously considering it. In that case we need to speak up to try and stop it.
wasnt callash talkin about FA stay neutral to CA but also is its main target because of his bad friends ?
jerrymaguire
08-01-04, 18:05
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
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I love what you have to say MJS, but this is gonna be something you are gonna have to talk about a hell of alot more. I will try to break it down;
1. TH and Canyon Safezones
Abosolutly not, and neither should MB. But Im glad to see the safezones within NC being dropped.
2. FA and TG being moved to DoY
Had a reason why it was a good idea, but totally disagreed with myself. This is a terrible idea. Everyone has their own base, TG=Canyon , FA=Tech Haven, CM-Military Base, CS=OZ Church and City factions=Neocron.
If Fa and TG were to be relocated to DoY and could loose the bases they have lived in and defended for so long, then it would only be fair for the City Mercs to be relocated to NC are able to loose the Military Base to other factions. MB, TH and Canyon are the same, bases created to be separate from NC, only fair whatever happens to one, should happen to the rest.
But I REALLY do think making Cayon and Tech Haven hackable, is a really BAD idea.
I do not like the te idea of this either.
Whats an RPG without cities to visit?
Every RPG I have ever seen or played has had more than 2 cities.
If this was done, there would be only 2 cities in Neocron.
The scattered villages dont count as they are pratically nothing.
Maybe if they were a little more organzied it would be, but they arent so they dont count.
Dont take away our other cities to go to!
Then again, diablo has 1 city.... but diablo II has 5 so HA!
Doc Holliday
08-01-04, 18:43
Ownage. nuff said. im well up for this. cant wait. i hope to god it pans out smooth and we all end up haveing a happy new year ;)
Slay mate dont worry more places for u to pk. hows that sound eh? :eek:
good job guys for the info. nice one
doc
I dont thinkthey should be turfed out, but i dont think this is what MJS means fully, i see it (after thinking about it) that this will happen.
In a roleplay way DOY would open its gates and welcome FA and TG into it as they would say that they have prepared a small HQ (like a faction office [so yes theyd have two but still so will MB] for them to use in the saftey of the dome) so then all of FA would still live in TH and TG in the canyon, and there new office/HQ in the dome would be linked in with there nice shiney new Epic.
This would mean that there would be more need for the gaurdian and the angels to stay within there true homes as they would then have even more reason to protect it, and a better way to do so, as this would invole a Faction vs Faction OP fight styly thing.
And if this were to be added, this would open up a great opportunity to add clan mission properly as for a massive reward a clan/or the whole faction could attempt to take back there home, mean while they are using their DOY base to operate from.
Another thing which i think should be set is that in a RP way type thing both TH and TGC (Twilight Gaurdian Canyon) wold have there internal systems working on getting the security back online which would then make the turrets come back to life and pwn the enemy retaking itself and giving a message to the faction to come help, this should happen after a real life week, and then it would be another real life week for it to be able to be hackerd again, stopping one faction (that isnt the home faction) from ALWAYS holding these facilities.
Just how i think it might work, or if not should work.
~T
EDIT//: Sorry for spelling grammer mistakes but i have the damn typer over bug so i cba changing and retyping stuff, lol,
Clownst0pper
08-01-04, 19:12
different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
*wipes his screen*
Anyone who doesnt find this appealing needs there balls cutting off :D
Huge armies fighting for the canyon = *wipes the screen again*
thewarrior008
08-01-04, 20:22
wooohaaaa if u release doy without deleting all the accnts ill come visit u :D
i think a massive fite inside th for ownership would be wikid
FA and TG should stay where they are. Who cares if DoY only has 4 factions and Neocron has 6. It's more important to have 3 neutral factions in the middle of the wastes people can join. City Mercs are a little more pro-CA. FA are neutral and TG is anti-CA but still independent from DoY. Didn't that leader of the TG say once they didn't need the DoY? Then why should they move in with them?
LE's should stay in the game. Period. Just change a few things. Like LE's won't work in warzones.
I'll comment further when the full list arrives.
Originally posted by Marx
MJS, HEAR ME!
Have a question about the vendors which you might or might not be able to answer.
If I hand the vendor 10 identical berzerk lvl 1's... Will they stack? Or no?
Stacking = sexy.
Non stacking = swg.
swg = devil.
;) rofl
______________________________-
Sweet info MJS:angel:
darkservent
08-01-04, 22:41
Originally posted by Tratos
Another thing which i think should be set is that in a RP way type thing both TH and TGC (Twilight Gaurdian Canyon) wold have there internal systems working on getting the security back online which would then make the turrets come back to life and pwn the enemy retaking itself and giving a message to the faction to come help, this should happen after a real life week, and then it would be another real life week for it to be able to be hackerd again, stopping one faction (that isnt the home faction) from ALWAYS holding these facilities.
Just how i think it might work, or if not should work.
This is a great idea but shorten the time to maybe 4 or 5 days. On top i just love this idea of takin TG and TH as a fortress. U guys wanna solve the apt crises then heres my idea:
1) simple all u have to do is keep all the keys to the apt and when DOY comes out have a NPC that changes the Keys to DOY apts and when the exchange is done then all the items will be moved automatically (though this can be risky if theres severe bugs) or maybe for a small fee to KK like 50pence to a pound KK can do this for u. Its a small price to pay but will be more reliable and quick and easy.
2) After this phase all the inacve members apts in thes zones will or be eliminated and then probably made into well lvls where additional services are available.
3) Now heres the good bit that make takin a fortress long and hard:- when the hacker hacks he will get a hackin combination which will tell the hacker wot terminals have to be hacked, how many times and in wot exact order for the fortress to be taken. See this will stop the exploit of multiple hackers hackin all the hack terminal to get the fortress in one go. And 1 hacker can only hack once the previously sequance has been done. On top the Security of the Base is all spawned and turrets may be put down if the takin clan wants to. Oh and the hackin combination changes randomly.
3) Might be wonderin wot bonuses to have: Well either have all the bonuses of the other OPs in one fortress OR be able to select a bonus - and if the clan want and additional skill the hack combination needs to be done again. But the fortress will be limited to 2 maybe 3 bonuses at the most.
4) ill Post any more ideas id i c an think of any later.:D :D :D :D
So are they going to turn regants into a city for the new runner class of Mutants?
darkservent
08-01-04, 23:11
This i think may happen and regents is a third faction to go against all factions too i think.
jerrymaguire
08-01-04, 23:31
Ohhhhhh This I would like to see, Another faction thats against ALL factions, well, maybe neutral to protopharma and or Biotech who created them by conducting experiments.
Would Have to give these poor chaps some edge to help them against the other factions, like Mutant LIVE Armour which is just that, alive. It could ajust according to what way you mod it, maybe.
Actually SL Factions would be nice.
You actively give up your Faction and become a soul lighter.
positive SL runner.
Have to maintain your SL to stay good
Neutral to all factions, Hostile to negative SL runners
Access to good items/weapons only usable by them.
negative SL runner
Hostile to all factions. Friendly to all negative SL people.
Thier own city.
QB drops are the same as normal runner.
Can kill anyone except red SL people (which causes XP loss).
Cannot recieve buffs from anyone except negative SL people.
So +SL would be kind of a real neutral faction (for Trades?)
I think that moving TG and FA to DOY is one of the best things about this for one incredibly overlooked reason. Even though it reccomends against starting as TG or FA, runners still do. Hell I've seen it loads. If TG and FA are moved to DOY then they will go straight from MC5 into the city and begin as part of the population. A much better first impression than starting in Teckhaven.
Going [MC5 -> City] is better than going [MC5 -> Faction HQ -> dying in the wastelands -> City]
Originally posted by Benjie
I think that moving TG and FA to DOY is one of the best things about this for one incredibly overlooked reason. Even though it reccomends against starting as TG or FA, runners still do. Hell I've seen it loads. If TG and FA are moved to DOY then they will go straight from MC5 into the city and begin as part of the population. A much better first impression than starting in Teckhaven.
Going [MC5 -> City] is better than going [MC5 -> Faction HQ -> dying in the wastelands -> City]
That hardly out-weighs the total stupidity of it in every other regard.
What is wrong with starting in Tech Haven? Do you even play an FA? Or just raid the place occasionaly?
Only real problem starting in TH is the spawn rates in the cores sometimes. The recent stealth-tweaks to the bots down there also don't help but both of those can easily be fixed. FA usually has enough people in it to help noobs out even with current server populations.
Also, I think that first run to NC is one of the coolest things a noob can do. I'm always happy to drive them there just to hear the "ooohs" and "aaaahs" on the way. There are so many cool things between TH and NC that it really gets people intrigued about the game which is a very good thing as they are about to spend the next week in the sewers.
Originally posted by Archeus
What is wrong with starting in Tech Haven? Do you even play an FA? Or just raid the place occasionaly?
My first character was TG. (this was pre-mc5) I remember going around asking people.
"which way to the city?"
"can you tell me where the high streets are please?"
"WTF I FORT NECRON WUZ U CITY NUT A CAVE!!111!One!!?"
I would like more information on how this will work though before I really make a comment. All I know is that other factions will be able to take them over, now as long as TH is still primerily a FA base then that actually might be cool. Still full of FA workers but you could loose controll to city clans. I just don't know enough yet.
S
E
X
Give meh the expansion pack list you nub!
I personally dont want TH, MB, TG to turn into outposts, why, cause then there are only 2 cities to be in.
WTF!
The villages dont count, there too disorganized and you couldnt live at any of them. (hint hint nudge nudge) o_O
*quotes from back of the BDoY box*
-Neocron like you've never witnessed it before!
-Be a stock broker, 1337 hax0r, spammer, lommer, banned user, drom sex0r, etc!
-Live in one of two massive megamatropolises, or in one of over 10 wasteland villages!
Yeah Zanathos I would love it if they made hideouts or something in the wasteland villages for "bad" people.
why dont you just narrow it down to 3 factions and call it neoside? ....
hum.. rough idea on price anyone?...
Originally posted by Benjie
Yeah Zanathos I would love it if they made hideouts or something in the wasteland villages for "bad" people.
Bad people are punished automaticaly, no need for such hideouts, as theyll just leave the game for something else.
LIEK PLAENTSIDE HURR HURR I WAS FUNNY I MADE A PLAENTSIDE JPKE HAWR HAWR YOU MUST BE DUMB NOT TO LAUGH TO SUCH COMEDIC POETRY THAT IS PLANETSIDE JOKES
duder the wastelands would house the evil bastards with -100 soulight, and they liek it, but thats way OT so nevermind.
Mmmm, perhaps I shall check out DoY after all ;)
They can just stay in their own safe city apts...this game only punishes people who kill, either in self defence or just beating the shit out of people for stuff...oh wait its locked in a safe little belt, and for some reason you cant take the belt so you can open it up later...just as strange as how people can deflect bullets when you shoot at them when they have a special chip inside, but ANYWAYS, MC doesnt make raiding and killing a lifestyle. It just dishes out punishment, minus soullight and thats that. Im guessing the only thing one can do in NC is hit some mobs, try to find tech parts for more guns so you can go out and shoot some mobs. Oh and tradeskillers are only there for the people who shoot mobs, so they can make better weapons with the techparts that the hunters collect, so they can dish out more damage and screw their chance of getting good loot again.
What am i saying? Dunno delete Soullight, make faction symps the only way, make copbots cityadmin, tweak mobs and guards, beat the monks with a nerf stick, lower specialization, able to pick belts up for more fun and games.
enigma_b17
10-01-04, 13:21
just wondering if u can say anything about what will happen with crahn, will they actually get a faction hq that isnt a rundown outhouse :P? also are there any plans to give crahn some decent apartments? ta
Originally posted by enigma_b17
just wondering if u can say anything about what will happen with crahn, will they actually get a faction hq that isnt a rundown outhouse :P? also are there any plans to give crahn some decent apartments? ta
Crahn is the hobo-cultist-loony faction. They don't get nice appartments.
enigma_b17
10-01-04, 13:48
Originally posted by jernau
Crahn is the hobo-cultist-loony faction. They don't get nice appartments.
lol i know what crahn are, but their apartments and their location dont suit crahn. I mean ideally their apps should be done up in a classy fashion, theyr not great atm. I think personally that a crahn app should be done up like a church, just smaller but thats just my opinion
Originally posted by enigma_b17
lol i know what crahn are, but their apartments and their location dont suit crahn. I mean ideally their apps should be done up in a classy fashion, theyr not great atm. I think personally that a crahn app should be done up like a church, just smaller but thats just my opinion ... Why?
The Crahn Sect doesn't live in the Outzone for fun and giggles, they were originally forced to live there when Reeza took over.
Besides, the Crahn Sect prefers the Outzone for another reason: It used to be the Via Rosso of back when they ruled, it's just become it's current abandoned state after the spaceship to Irata III was launched.
Originally posted by J. Folsom
Besides, the Crahn Sect prefers the Outzone for another reason: It used to be the Via Rosso of back when they ruled, it's just become it's current abandoned state after the spaceship to Irata III was launched.
Eh?
OZ was an industrial area.
VR is a financial district.
Originally posted by jernau
Eh?
OZ was an industrial area.
VR is a financial district. The Crahn Epic (Full one back when it was in on test), said something the outzone used to be glorious during the reign of the psi monks.
Perhaps my interpretation of it was wrong.
Crahn will be getting a HUGE monastry when in DoY when it comes out. :D
MJS says that it is his favourite place in DoY.
Originally posted by Judge
Crahn will be getting a HUGE monastry when in DoY when it comes out. :D
MJS says that it is his favourite place in DoY. but thats cos hes a monk lover:p
so should all the gm's be us monks are teh win
why the fcuk does fa and tg get forced into doy
Originally posted by ben77890
why the fcuk does fa and tg get forced into doy
cos they suck and need DOY to help em:p
will our appts dissapear? i got stuff to move
Originally posted by Tratos
I dont thinkthey should be turfed out, but i dont think this is what MJS means fully, i see it (after thinking about it) that this will happen.
In a roleplay way DOY would open its gates and welcome FA and TG into it as they would say that they have prepared a small HQ (like a faction office [so yes theyd have two but still so will MB] for them to use in the saftey of the dome) so then all of FA would still live in TH and TG in the canyon, and there new office/HQ in the dome would be linked in with there nice shiney new Epic.
This would mean that there would be more need for the gaurdian and the angels to stay within there true homes as they would then have even more reason to protect it, and a better way to do so, as this would invole a Faction vs Faction OP fight styly thing.
And if this were to be added, this would open up a great opportunity to add clan mission properly as for a massive reward a clan/or the whole faction could attempt to take back there home, mean while they are using their DOY base to operate from.
Another thing which i think should be set is that in a RP way type thing both TH and TGC (Twilight Gaurdian Canyon) wold have there internal systems working on getting the security back online which would then make the turrets come back to life and pwn the enemy retaking itself and giving a message to the faction to come help, this should happen after a real life week, and then it would be another real life week for it to be able to be hackerd again, stopping one faction (that isnt the home faction) from ALWAYS holding these facilities.
Just how i think it might work, or if not should work.
~T
EDIT//: Sorry for spelling grammer mistakes but i have the damn typer over bug so i cba changing and retyping stuff, lol,
The joys of the self quote. the way i think this will happen is basicly YOU are the law of your home, and YOU have to deffend your apps within these so all TG and FA will live in there true homes, like ive said in the above quote.
Dont worry fellow neocronians.
The neocron research focus group has ideas for a much better soul light and faction sympathy system.
Hopefully ReaKKtor will listen.
well if its left up to a bunch of non PvP happy hunters Pkers will get fucked over
Originally posted by ezza
well if its left up to a bunch of non PvP happy hunters Pkers will get fucked over
Actualy, i dont do so much PvP as most but the ideas we are milling over and putting down on paper are extremely good, and could give some reward to those who would normaly get fucked over by SL loss ;)
And have a good chance of being added to the game.
~T
RuriHoshino
13-01-04, 00:50
Originally posted by ben77890
will our appts dissapear? i got stuff to move
What I believe they said was that the HQ's would move to DoY, not the whole faction, lock stock and barrel.
Originally posted by Tratos
The joys of the self quote. the way i think this will happen is basicly YOU are the law of your home, and YOU have to deffend your apps within these so all TG and FA will live in there true homes, like ive said in the above quote.
I think he wants facts from MJS, not conjecture from other runners.
You may be right about it just being a faction office but that's not what Martin said, which is why we are worried.
We just have to hope that KK realise that FA want nothing to do with DoY and that it makes absolutley no sense at all for them to leave TH EVER.
I hate the idea of players being able to hack TG and TH - it just makes no sense at all to me and I can't see how any form of RP or story will survive a change like that.
@zanathos - Eh? Who? What?
Originally posted by jernau
@zanathos - Eh? Who? What?
MWA HA HA HA HA!
Guess you gotta wait and see if ReaKKtor likes it :)
F*CK! Wheres my disk!
:/
I'm sure I can think of the ideas again..... they really were quite simple.
Plenty of people have put good ideas to KK before. Don't get your hopes up.
I get the feeling that most of the decisions are made now for the next 6-12 months anyway. If I were the new publisher I'd certainly want that to be the case.
Originally posted by RuriHoshino
What I believe they said was that the HQ's would move to DoY, not the whole faction, lock stock and barrel.
I don't think so what was said that CS, TG, FA would be moving to DoY CS will have there church there and i think all will move over.
From a RP aspect jernau there are many story lines that could come with FA moving to DoY i ain't checked lately but are all those CA guards still outside TH if so there could be a raid by CA that would chase out FA. Many of other reasons aswell and the same could go for the Twiglit canyons.
I think making TH and TG hackable will bring a whole new aspect to the game it will be a op everyone will want to own no one will say oh thats our core op leave it alone it will be a uber fighting zone. Dunno if they will change it from a anarchy zone but that would add a aspect of danger to it.
Nice to have some info
Any word on possible server merges ?
Love the idea of player shops !!
Originally posted by jernau
Plenty of people have put good ideas to KK before. Don't get your hopes up.
I get the feeling that most of the decisions are made now for the next 6-12 months anyway. If I were the new publisher I'd certainly want that to be the case.
We have a little more influence than the "average" runner.
We dont expect to get anywhere quickly because of the current situation with ReaKKtor.
I'm not saying that ReaKKtor doesnt listen to any of the "average" runners ideas. We just have more strings to pull than you do. Due to MrBane's connections.
Originally posted by jernau
Plenty of people have put good ideas to KK before. Don't get your hopes up.
I get the feeling that most of the decisions are made now for the next 6-12 months anyway. If I were the new publisher I'd certainly want that to be the case.
I dunno about that. Threads like this are good for little ideas. I remember posting in one of Callash's threads that it would be cool to have more NPCs around the city to talk to and at a bit more to the background, and a short while later several NPCs were added (including the comedy one who takes all your money and doesn't tell you anything :p). Whether or not that was related to my post I'm not sure, but I'm fairly sure it did, and I think there have been a lot of small changes made which have come about from ideas in these threads.
Originally posted by Candaman
From a RP aspect jernau there are many story lines that could come with FA moving to DoY i ain't checked lately but are all those CA guards still outside TH if so there could be a raid by CA that would chase out FA. Many of other reasons aswell and the same could go for the Twiglit canyons.
I was obvious at the time that the reason for having those guards there was a pre-cursor to something like that but it was pretty clumsy IMO and was also some time ago now. Besides which, the whole raison d'etre of FA is that Freedom from a controlling government allows them to pursue uber-geekdom in peace. FA has generally good relations with NC it just doesn't want to be a part of it.
As I see it this is an attempt to dumb-down faction politics and turn it into a simplistic RvB game. That would be a huge mistake IMO, as would anything else that seeks to remove things which uniquely distinguish NC from other games out there. If NC turns into PS it will lose because PS already has that market, is prettier and has more cash.
KK have a history of kicking RP and their own back-story in the knackers regularly to apply idiotic and senseless ideas that do absolutley nothing good for the game. I imagine this will be another instance.
Originally posted by Candaman
I think making TH and TG hackable will bring a whole new aspect to the game it will be a op everyone will want to own no one will say oh thats our core op leave it alone it will be a uber fighting zone. Dunno if they will change it from a anarchy zone but that would add a aspect of danger to it.
IMO It'll lead to nothing of the kind. FA have rarely been a militarily strong faction ever and TG certainly aren't atm on Saturn. If this came into effect BD, TT or CM would take over TG and TH overnight and they would hold them until the faction hopping population hop on again.
All it will do is look retarded when a bunch of drug-dealers are living in the Tech Haven and a pro-reeza arms company are living in a terrorist hideout in the hills.
When that happens it will kill TH and TG dead because anyone rolling into those factions is immediately fucked.
Dribble Joy
13-01-04, 16:49
Exactly.
FA/TG should probably have a faction office/contact person in DoY, FA should also have one in NC, but FA not being in TH and TG not in the canyon is teh silly.
Originally posted by Scikar
I dunno about that. Threads like this are good for little ideas. I remember posting in one of Callash's threads that it would be cool to have more NPCs around the city to talk to and at a bit more to the background, and a short while later several NPCs were added (including the comedy one who takes all your money and doesn't tell you anything :p). Whether or not that was related to my post I'm not sure, but I'm fairly sure it did, and I think there have been a lot of small changes made which have come about from ideas in these threads.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying they don't listen. Just that I can think of about half a dozen occasions where well-meaning player groups have presented "we think...." lists to KK and I know how they were recieved. Those groups have included GMs and support staff in the past too and it didn't change anything.
Best of luck to them and all but I hope they don't get too upset if history repeats itself again.
I would also add that I'm somewhat glad at times that KK don't always listen to such self-appointed think-tanks. Who is to say they represent the best interests of the players and the game? A lot of KK's decisions are about business not gameplay whether we like it or not and these groups simply don't have the necessary information to assess those issues (I'm not saying KK always do either but they should do). Then there's the issue of bias......
Originally posted by jernau
All it will do is look retarded when a bunch of drug-dealers are living in the Tech Haven and a pro-reeza arms company are living in a terrorist hideout in the hills.
When that happens it will kill TH and TG dead because anyone rolling into those factions is immediately fucked.
On the contrary. CA have always wanted to kick TG out of the canyon. If they do so, then TG will move to DoY until they can take the canyon back. If Tangent take the canyon, then they could sell it to CA, or convert it into their own base of operations. The canyon would basically be a super fortress. TH could be a super lab/factory. It also leads to further RP oppurtunities - it wouldn't be unreasonable for TG to receive GM support in retaking the canyon.
In fact, each faction could have their own such outpost, which they don't rely on but provides a cool bonus for them, and a similar but reduced bonus if another faction holds it. For example, re-opening the OZ 7 factory and making that an OP, OZ Jail, NCPD, Bump Asylum, the Secret Passage, Crahn Abbey, the Clubs, all could become OPs aimed at specific factions, providing a large bonus for that faction and a smaller one if another faction owns it.
That's just "capture the flag" to me.
RP-wise if CA took TG they would destroy it and leave nothing but a crater. What use is it to them as a defensive position? DoY can go round it so it's just a logistic jugular waiting to be cut if a large-scale war were to start.
Also, why would CA attack FA? The nonsense about terrorists in TH was a dumb idea they threw in as the first stage of justifying what we are now seeing. That was clear at the time and plenty of people complained about it then too. FA and CA work together all the time even if they aren't closest allies. Why on earth would they fall out to the extent they would go to war. If they did go to war it's more likely FA would be destroyed than move to DoY who they have no allegiance to.
If KK do this they might as well delete all but two factions. That's going to be the ultimate outcome anyway.
Jernau, isnt a part of this business to make a good game that brings in more customers that makes them money?
Why would ReaKKtor not be worried about gameplay in the game? Its part of their business. If ReaKKtor screwed up the game and flipped it completly upside down and made half the population leave, then that was a very poor business decision. They would generate less funds or not enough to support them, and then Neocron will no longer be supported.
As it is, I suspect that ReaKKtor generates enough funds to pay everyone they have now and barely gain any money which could be used to hire more staff, use much more powerful servers, etc....
But of course, the final decision is up to ReaKKtor, we dont work for them.
I dont expect them to listen to us, I dont expect to get anywhere with this, but does it hurt to try? Does it hurt ReaKKtor for us to find better ways to do things in Neocron or simply ways to improve it? Its their choice to look at any of the files that we send them.
Its their choice to look at the brainport.
Who knows, maybe they never look at the brainport, maybe they never look at any ideas that are sent their way.
But its worth a try for a game that could be so much more.
This game is the best there is of its genre according to many people. This game will fail if it is handled improperly.
Originally posted by jernau
If KK do this they might as well delete all but two factions. That's going to be the ultimate outcome anyway.
The current system is hardly any different. The servers are essentially split into pro-city, anti-city, and criminal. Pro-city being CA, TT, CM, even if they aren't directly allied and don't directly fight with each other, they have the same enemies and don't fight against each other. Anti-city being TG, maybe Crahn. Fighting against the pro-city. Also FA helping out here when possible. There are many people who like FA because they want to be neutral, but in actuality most of FA are no different to any other faction, and just end up fighting allies/neutrals (CA and CM). Finally, the criminal factions, which don't seem to actually play much of a role. BD are neutral to the fairly strong TT while being enemies of the relatively weak TG, FA, and CA, also not being equal to CM.
Result? BD own Saturn because they have only weak enemies to fight against. TG have always had problems getting help from either of their two 'allies.' Crahn are allied to BD and aren't enemies of TT or CM, which means TG can only ever get help from Crahn against CA. TG's other allies are FA. FA can help against both BD and TT, which is good, but they're neutral to CA and the mercs. This means either FA get dragged into fighting neutrals or can't help, which is of course bad news for both TG and FA.
Basically, the current system doesn't work. It only encourages people to go against the faction alliances. Switching to a proper 2 or 3 sided system might not encourage RP directly, but IMO it would certainly be no worse than the current system. It might not fit the story perfectly but gameplay would improve.
I never understood why there are so many factions really.
And just think, there is probably gonna be another 3 added when BDoY come out. DoY, Trader Union, Anarcy Breed.
15 factions..... Wow.
Face of mankind has like... 8 or 9, cant remember.
Planetside, 3.
Any other game, no clue.
its what makes neocron what it is unique with all these factions there are so many different opportunities to ally, betray, stab in back u never know whats gonna happen next and personally i love it
enigma_b17
13-01-04, 17:52
just wondering if there are any plans to fix the lag on the servers for doy lol
shodanjr_gr
13-01-04, 17:55
Originally posted by Zanathos
I never understood why there are so many factions really.
And just think, there is probably gonna be another 3 added when BDoY come out. DoY, Trader Union, Anarcy Breed.
15 factions..... Wow.
Face of mankind has like... 8 or 9, cant remember.
Planetside, 3.
Any other game, no clue.
You arent supposed to talk about FoMK but anywayz.
Still i would like to see the factions reduced down to 3 or 4 as well. No point in having 13 factions and the player base splitting so much between them. What i would also like is that you could choose a faction with your first character on each server, then all your other chars on that server would have to be the same faction (DaoC and PS style). That way factions would definetely be more balanced and faction hopping would be far less.
@Zanathos - I'm not saying you shouldn't try just warning you of previous experience. It's also probably not wise to post cryptic "I know something" posts on here. There are a lot of people who will read too much into them and that won't do you any favours with KK or the community.
wrt DOY Factions - It was once stated that DoY would add 6 factions but that was a long time ago. Trader Union is an NPC faction so non-playable. Anarchy breed is likewise atm though that may change I suppose.
@Scikar - Even as you try to break the current system into 3 factions there it fails. FA aren't anti-city at all, the "criminal factions" hate each other and you've ignored NEXT, DRE and PP. Tthe relative strengths of the factions are a very fluid thing and vary from server to server. It would be a huge mistake to make a long-term change based on short-term politics.
Originally posted by Scikar
Result? BD own Saturn because they have only weak enemies to fight against. TG have always had problems getting help from either of their two 'allies.' Crahn are allied to BD and aren't enemies of TT or CM, which means TG can only ever get help from Crahn against CA. TG's other allies are FA. FA can help against both BD and TT, which is good, but they're neutral to CA and the mercs. This means either FA get dragged into fighting neutrals or can't help, which is of course bad news for both TG and FA.
BD hold 1/3 of the Saturn OPs (If that's what you mean by "own") because they are the faction-hoppers home of choice this month. A month or so back they had none and the map was 50:50 TG and CM. The rest of what you say here is exactly what makes NC better than RvB games. NC doesn't have to be childishly simplistic, it has the basis of a fantastic and fairly realistic political system in place. Destroying that would be a crime IMO. I can't see how a 2 or 3 sided system is "proper", it's different at best and compared to what it would replace it is very inferior.
Dribble Joy
13-01-04, 17:58
And it's down right boring.
RuriHoshino
13-01-04, 18:47
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
Q: Will TH and the canyon become safe zones?
A: No, but the main HQs for TG and FH will be relocated to DoY. TH and the canyon will be subcenters for these two factions. We currently consider whether these bases can be conquered by other factions/empires (Neocron and Dome of York will be considered two different empires), which would make TH and the canyon the two biggest "outposts" in the game with multiple terminals to hack and automated defense against enemy factions or the enemy empire.
This is the quote I was thinking of.
every time i read that i jsut think of this word in big sparkly lettering what is it umm.....
S E X
Eve Online had a similar problem with pirates warping in (read; zoning in), killing players in a 'safe zone', and then warping out. The solution they implemented was to prevent players from zoning once they had initiated an attack on another player for several minutes. This way the player who had been attacked had plenty of time to exact retribution, or rely on the police to do the same on his behalf....
I think this would work in neocron too...
Ill.
to martins orignal post;
Ive killed cops with just the aid of a PooPoo befor. They are just a little stronger then an mc5 guard.
Clownst0pper
14-01-04, 02:58
BD hold 1/3 of the Saturn OPs (If that's what you mean by "own") because they are the faction-hoppers home of choice this month. A month or so back they had none and the map was 50:50 TG and CM
Er, I take offence to that. The cartel was formed only as a result of alot of arguments in TG.
Myself, Mike, Twist3d, Blade, we were all Black Dragon for months and months prior. And in most instances still retained 1 or 2 Alts in BD.
Most of the 'big' ND have go protopharma and ASEN still remains.
If you think we faction hop, sure. We have to change factions to Black Dragon, I suppose that is a hop.
Are we short term? I very much doubt it, unless of course mike keeps calling us Gorts the gret kim.
Otherwise keep slander like that off these forums, I see it as slander that should remain in game, and between you and yourself. :mad:
MayhemMike
14-01-04, 05:17
gorts nuff said, gg no re.
I think hes forgetting about the templars on saturn
right now the map on saturn is usually divided by 1/3rd CM, 1/4th TT, 1/4th TG, and then like, 1/5th or 1/6th various other factions.
Originally posted by Zanathos
I think hes forgetting about the templars on saturn
right now the map on saturn is usually divided by 1/3rd CM, 1/4th TT, 1/4th TG, and then like, 1/5th or 1/6th various other factions.
where have you been for the last few months?
saturn is about 1/4 cm, 1/3 bd, 1/3 tt and tg/fa sneek thier heads in here and there but not much.
BD hold 1/3 of the Saturn OPs (If that's what you mean by "own") because they are the faction-hoppers home of choice this month. A month or so back they had none and the map was 50:50 TG and CM. The rest of what you say here is exactly what makes NC better than RvB games. NC doesn't have to be childishly simplistic, it has the basis of a fantastic and fairly realistic political system in place. Destroying that would be a crime IMO. I can't see how a 2 or 3 sided system is "proper", it's different at best and compared to what it would replace it is very inferior.
sorry, but some of us get bored with owning...aka in the big ND/TG days no one on the server could say ANYTHING to new dawn...it got boring being the absolute best, so we split up a few ways in order to fight each other
ill tell you right now i have alot more fun fighting the likes of NAT then a bunch of CM noobs that die in 2 seconds...that and they are the ultimate pussies, they sit in thier corner losing to just about every op fight they show up at..they just ninja the ops back and never have to bother moving out because TT protects them from the south.
may be faction hopping to you...to us its keeping the game interesting, because there was no challange left in TG...CM noobs always seem to have a challange tho ahha
....and finally, calling it the flavor of the month is quite ignorant, considering its been almost 3 months now....gimme a GG, gimme a NO, and gimme a RE
@scikar - crahn/fa/tg fight as 3v1 factions against BD, so you're absolutely wrong. BD is just a stacked faction atm, so most factions need to group up to fight us...aka TG, FA, crahn, CM, they all lose unless they bring multiple factions along. we kos crahn btw because they help TG, so how about that? also, CM is red to BD so i dunno where you got your information that BD is allied to cm...but you're wrong as all hell. BD has more enemies then anyone else, plain and simple..and as for our clan, theres only 3 rules ill tell you them right now:
1. no alts in enemy clans
2. no killing templars
3. no killing blood titans
everyone else is KOS, still think we got no enemies? :rolleyes: thats just a sorry excuse for why we don't lose.
either way, we came from nothing...BD was a dead faction....we made it one of the servers 3 powerhouses...if its so easy, lets see you do it...the other half of ND failed at bringing biotech into power, lets see what ya got....bring a dead faction to the top.... i've already been there and done that, so i'll just sit back and watch the magic
Originally posted by Clownst0pper
Myself, Mike, Twist3d, Blade, we were all Black Dragon for months and months prior. And in most instances still retained 1 or 2 Alts in BD.
@cl0wnstopper....zoneseek(pe) has also always been BD, hes actually hte one that PHYSICALLY started the clan due to being one of the only ones that had done the BD epic (doy epic), and started on saturn as BD.....
I stand by exactly what I said.
1) A few months ago BD were nowhere - Red Symphony would take one or two OPs every now and then and that was it.
2) The fact a few players with big egos were there made no difference at all to point 1.
3) The reason BD now hold OPs is because their population exploded overnight. This population boom is from faction-hopppers (unless you are telling me they are all new players). The same ones who previously swelled the ranks of TG.
4) "Flavour of the month" is an expression like "just a minute". It doesn't have to last one month exactly.:rolleyes:
If you want to take offence as simple facts you are going to have a very hard life.
Then again g0rt, I dont pay much attention to the world map in that aspect.
Basically all i ever really see is alot of shades of white mixed in with alot of green.
I should probably pay a little more attention but... meh.
I take an outpost if my clan tells me to, thats all :)
Originally posted by g0rt
@scikar - crahn/fa/tg fight as 3v1 factions against BD, so you're absolutely wrong. BD is just a stacked faction atm, so most factions need to group up to fight us...aka TG, FA, crahn, CM, they all lose unless they bring multiple factions along. we kos crahn btw because they help TG, so how about that? also, CM is red to BD so i dunno where you got your information that BD is allied to cm...but you're wrong as all hell. BD has more enemies then anyone else, plain and simple..and as for our clan, theres only 3 rules ill tell you them right now:
1. no alts in enemy clans
2. no killing templars
3. no killing blood titans
everyone else is KOS, still think we got no enemies? :rolleyes: thats just a sorry excuse for why we don't lose.
either way, we came from nothing...BD was a dead faction....we made it one of the servers 3 powerhouses...if its so easy, lets see you do it...the other half of ND failed at bringing biotech into power, lets see what ya got....bring a dead faction to the top.... i've already been there and done that, so i'll just sit back and watch the magic
Way to prove my point. You KoS everyone not in Templars or Blood Titans. Therefore doesn't that show that the current faction system does not function as it should?
Black Dragon was not dead. It wasn't as strong as TG or TT, but it did have a few half decent players in there, like Ezza, and Vet's BD too (though I can't exactly see Vet making an impact on the OP scene). You didn't make it powerful by yourself overnight. You made it powerful by bringing together and concentrating the powerplayers, people like yourself and Mike not only good players but players who have the time to play a lot of the time rather than just some of the time. If you want to kid yourself into thinking that because you activated the Cartel's clan key you somehow are the sole reason BD now has a few OPs then go ahead.
@Jernau: Look at the points you just made. Don't you think they highlight a few problems with the current faction system?
Clownst0pper
14-01-04, 12:14
@cl0wnstopper....zoneseek(pe) has also always been BD, hes actually hte one that PHYSICALLY started the clan due to being one of the only ones that had done the BD epic (doy epic), and started on saturn as BD.....
I know m8, forgot ur name off the list! DOH!
Sorry! :(
:angel:
Originally posted by Scikar
@Jernau: Look at the points you just made. Don't you think they highlight a few problems with the current faction system?
Yes. I'd rather not take this thread too far OT though.
Originally posted by jernau
Yes. I'd rather not take this thread too far OT though.
I'm only making the point that if the faction system was shrunk down to 2 or 3 'empires' then we wouldn't be any worse off. It would certainly solve a lot of problems.
Originally posted by Scikar
I'm only making the point that if the faction system was shrunk down to 2 or 3 'empires' then we wouldn't be any worse off. It would certainly solve a lot of problems.
and destroy a lot of what makes the game interesting. There are many better ways to control game populations by social and software engineering. Just deleting large elements of the game is a poor solution.
Alternately maybe the game is working fine and it's player mentality that's wrong. Just a thought.;)
Why is there a ProtoPharm and BioTech?
Why cant BioTech or ProtoPharm make both the drugs and implants?
I understand a need for City Admin.
Our weapons gotta come from somewhere, Tangent Technologies.
WHY is there a REAL ESTATE FACTION!
I understand the need for criminal organizations since this IS a cyber punk.
You got the City Admins arch rivals.
then theres the technological genius'
Why are there really City Mercs?
The anarcy breed is just another criminal organization.
The trader union is aparently an NPC faction.
of course theres gonna be a DoY faction.
Etc...
The factions could be further limited.
If you took out the anarcy breed, and trader union, biotech or protopharm, diamon real estate, then were down to about 11 factions I think.
There really are too many.
Now, if tehre were thousanda of people on teh servers, it would be better.
And you want to tell KK how to "fix" their game? :rolleyes:
im just spouting out nonsence.
Im livin off 2 and a half hour sleep and an extra large quad coffee from timmies ^_^ (Canadians know what I mean) :D
:p
Down with neutral factoins !
Really cant be bothered reading through the post just now but one of the things that caught my eye on the first page is the item about vendors that sell player built items for a price set by the player.
Just the other day I was reading a pre-release interview with NC's creators in PC-gamer. If the rest of the 'additions' to the game go like the above then it is exactly as I suspected. In the interview KK talked about that very same feature as being in the game by the time it was released. Obviously it was like 70% of neocrons supposed features and failed to make it in to the release.
It seems to me that we, make that YOU (as I am done with NC for good now thx to KK's sterling efforts to screw me over) are going to be made to pay for BDOY. For BDOY read FULL RELEASE version of NC. It seems that we have merely been playing the shareware version of NC, a sort of PAY-TO-PLAY Beta test of the game whilst they got round to finishing the full release version only a year or so behind schedule and after the supposed release.
[ Stop the flames ]
_ Ran
rubaduckythug
14-01-04, 21:30
WTF happend to redsympothy anyways?
Will you two please give it a rest?
N
Originally posted by rubaduckythug
WTF happend to redsympothy anyways? leader was busy with college i remember one of the members saying so the clan basically fell apart
Took out a few obvious posts. Keep the discussion on the bigger picture and... yeah, what N said.
rubaduckythug
16-01-04, 13:00
ok this post isnt rated :eek: im gonna rate it now
EDIT: WTF grrrrrr, not let me rate it ok, will see.... good idea 5 stars :)
Uhmm... so what would you suggest to avoid someone slipping into safety after starting an attack?
You could just have something that slows down the zoneing process (into a safe zone), like you have to put all your weapons into your inv from the quickbelt and not currently be damaging anyone (with poison stacks etc), or not have attacked anyone within a set time :D
Thanks for the news MJS
It is getting better and better
The only problem I have with it is
I can't wait for it to come............ really looking forward to it
It will ROCK
here here
>>Q: Will there be more guards in Neocron, when the safe zones
>>are removed?
>>A: Yep, but we think about making them more fun to fight
>>against. I.e. that a group of players will have a chance
>>bringing a group of CopBots down.
sounds fun, maybe also make it symmetric so people can do the same for y-reps and cyborgs. and massage the SL penalty so people don't have screwed up belt drops cause they are attacking the enemy in a role play kind of manner.
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