View Full Version : Remove Parashock...
This is coming from a ppu, who would like to see the parashock removed. I do understand that it kills pvp in a sense, and I am all for the removal of this spell. Yes, it is true that my main class is a ppu, and I would like to see it balanced. As stated in other thread, its not a ppu that kills pvp, its the para. So why not remove it?
So my question to the community is.... would you like to see the para removed from the game?
Im all for it.
ps. i dont know how to do a poll so if a mod could do one with a yes or no option i would wub it
yes, remova para. it got nerfed but now its worse then ever....
maybe a removal of para would get people off PPUs back for atleast a month......
Why not get a PPU with Antiparaspell. :rolleyes:
Shadow Dancer
06-01-04, 21:12
Originally posted by mehirc
Why not get a PPU
lol
Anyways I think parashock should just be made pvm. FFS it's been a long time coming. It needs to get permanently sorted already.
;o i have that.. but still get rid of it.....
or get rid of it in pvp and still have it for pvm
as i stated somewhere else i'll gladly loose my para if everyone does
if there was a option to vote for the removal of it then i would vote.
Originally posted by fatwreck
as i stated somewhere else i'll gladly loose my para if everyone does
same... so lets get rid of it for pvp...
i want it still for pvm :(
Andronicus
06-01-04, 21:15
Remove ppu's all together - man this game would be fun then; killing while you are the underdog in a fight would actually mean something.
Originally posted by Hamlet
Remove ppu's all together - man this game would be fun then; killing while you are the underdog in a fight would actually mean something.
ummm how about no.
oh and if you got rid of ppu's then pe's would be the new ppu
Originally posted by Hamlet
Remove ppu's all together - man this game would be fun then; killing while you are the underdog in a fight would actually mean something. although i proberbly would of gone with that a while ago, the fact that people have spent a lot of time invested in there PPUs so i dont think you could just remove them like that
Originally posted by Hamlet
Remove ppu's all together - man this game would be fun then; killing while you are the underdog in a fight would actually mean something. The funniest part of this quote is that he thinks that people in Neocron fight when an underdog. :rolleyes:
Andronicus
06-01-04, 21:22
Not that it would ever happen, but i myself have a capped ppu - i know how long it takes to level. So perhaps the option would be to allow all these PPUs instantly become APUs. Spells would be changed to match APU spells (ie a perfect 2 slot ppu spell would be changed to a perfect 2 slot APU spell of equal TL). 'Course this would just take tons of time and effort that will never happen... would make a great game tho.
i am not asking to remove ppu's
im asking if you guys want para removed..
Andronicus
06-01-04, 21:23
Originally posted by Strych9
The funniest part of this quote is that he thinks that people in Neocron fight when an underdog. :rolleyes:
I'm TG on Saturn - Fighting while being the underdog is all i do.
Originally posted by Ferabukoo
i am not asking to remove ppu's
im asking if you guys want para removed..
for some people ppus and para go hand in hand:rolleyes:
Originally posted by fatwreck
for some people ppus and para go hand in hand:rolleyes:
and thats the problem... so why not either get rid of pvp para
or fix it so you can still move while shocked... i dunno but if you get shocked.. you cant move at all not even your mouse
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
lol
Anyways I think parashock should just be made pvm. FFS it's been a long time coming. It needs to get permanently sorted already.
I dont like half of quotes.
The para is too strong atm and will be fixed next patch, dont forget that.
PPUs have their right to exist and para as well. If your PPU is too slow (or skillless) to free you from para you still have drugs you can use in emergency. Its not that you can do nothing against a stun.
Fights without PPUs arent possible anyway these days...
Originally posted by fatwreck
for some people ppus and para go hand in hand:rolleyes:
Likes its permently "Glued" in their hands :p
badabadom tscchhhhhh *watches the tumbleweed*
why not get rid of it mehirc
what are you scared of? Or why do you not want the parashock removed.. Yes drugs and anti spells are viable.. but what are you so scared of?
Para in PvM is fine, but it's been proven many times that Para for PvP is ..... wrong. It has no place.
Shadow Dancer
06-01-04, 21:34
Originally posted by mehirc
I dont like half
what?
j/k :p
Originally posted by mehirc
The para is too strong atm and will be fixed next patch, dont forget that.
I think para shouldn't be in pvp in the first place.
Originally posted by mehirc
PPUs have their right to exist
I totally agree. They DON'T have a right to dominate or control PvP to the point that they do.
Originally posted by mehirc
and para as well.
Para has a right to exist? It can still exist in PvM.
Originally posted by mehirc
PPUs have their right to exist and para as well. If your PPU is too slow (or skillless) to free you from para you still have drugs you can use in emergency. Its not that you can do nothing against a stun.
Again you're proving how insanely and rediculously important PPUs are. But that's a topic for another thread.
The point is that if you don't have a ppu, those 2-3 seconds of being immobolized can easily mean death. And ppus don't deserve parashock anyways. A so called "escape" spell. YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA RIGHT.
Originally posted by mehirc
Fights without PPUs arent possible anyway these days...
Shame isn't it?
Honestly, I can totally see why ppus don't want to be nerfed or have their shelter or skills nerfed, but parashock? Jesus, why are so many ppus so damn clingy to their parashock. They most certainly do not need it to survive.
Parashoch has to be the most offensive agressive "passive" spell i've ever seen.
you and your damn quotes shadow... sheesh:lol: :lol: :lol:
Originally posted by mehirc
Fights without PPUs arent possible anyway these days...
only because of para. if there was no para this game would be 100000000000x better. you could actually fight someone, keep aim, run, turn around, hell even walk. there would be no need to have 5 ppus at an op battle, we'd have more fighters on the "field", there wouldnt be the para then punch the TS gaurd method of killing that quite a few clans have taken a liking to doing,
Oh yeah, I am all for PvM para only. I have only used para once so far, and it was when a PKer came to the bunker and was killing noobs. Actually thats the only time I used para at all, and the only time I used damage boost on a player so far. :)
i go hunting and use para and dmg boost all the time for mobs
so i would like to keep in the game for that
just get rid of it for pvp
Originally posted by Ferabukoo
i go hunting and use para and dmg boost all the time for mobs
When was the last time? o_O Para absolutly sucks now as a mob killing weapon.
I say remove all paras except holy para. the stats on that spell are pretty balanced.
hmmm
you should use concentrated antishock fluid....
Dont remove para.... raise the cost of the para !!!
I think all guys that cry on parashock don't use drugs.... :rolleyes:
Parashock has been nerfed good for the frequency but too strong on the cost. If you use drug parashock is a joke...
One another thing...
Holy antiparalize... do you know ?
Holy catharsis sanctum ? do you know ?
actualy about 12 hours ago around.. 1am... i used it and para barrel...
was hunting where the mob needed to be parashocked
Originally posted by Archeus
When was the last time? o_O Para absolutly sucks now as a mob killing weapon. I dunno. My /40 level PPU can damage boost WBs three times and then deal decent damage with his noob parashock bolt. When out WB hunting in groups, I have taken down Mad Copbots and Spidebots solo using it and damageboost.
Originally posted by Ralendil
Holy antiparalize... do you know ?
Holy catharsis sanctum ? do you know ?
some people dont run around with ppus. i use the drugs, but holy para halo pwns more than para did and they can almost spam you with it... and after 2 or 3 of them you start getting a drug flash.
Originally posted by Ralendil
Holy antiparalize... do you know ?
Holy catharsis sanctum ? do you know ?
yeah, make them useable for my spy and ill be happy......
Originally posted by fatwreck
some people dont run around with ppus. i use the drugs, but holy para halo pwns more than para did and they can almost spam you with it... and after 2 or 3 of them you start getting a drug flash.
yes that's true :(
Halo are more dangerous than the holy paralysis...
I don't use now the rare that is too long to cast, and can't hit too far away...
I really think holy paralysis is fine now. Except for the cost that I find too high. But as you say, holy paralysis isn't the real problem...
it is Holy parashock halo now the problem. I don't think about nerf. I think the problem is cause of the last patch that has raised too much the beam's range and increased too much the range of other psi attacks.
only my opinion...
and I don't understand why beams' range has been nerfed...
Parashock needed a nerf. But only in frenquency.
Too much things has been changed in the last patch in my mind.
Make the PSI gauntlet (since all classes use this implant) give antiparalyze+1 or something. This way, all people PVP:ing will be immune to para, but it will still work in PvM, where it's really nice to have.
Nash_Brigham
06-01-04, 22:57
I haven't had the oppurtunity to face off against a parashocking PPU monk yet in PvP. Not really that powerful myself, so I haven't had an oppurtunity at PvP anyways :rolleyes: Anyways, I am all for PvP balance, and being an old UO player, one of the lamest tactics in teh world was teh para gank newbie, thinking he was powerful because of the paralyse spell.
Originally posted by phunqe
Make the PSI gauntlet (since all classes use this implant) give antiparalyze+1 or something. This way, all people PVP:ing will be immune to para, but it will still work in PvM, where it's really nice to have.
Until the melee/pistol/etc gloves start coming.
Actually an anti-para imp would be a good trade off and make for intresting loadouts.
Originally posted by Archeus
Actually an anti-para imp would be a good trade off and make for intresting loadouts.
Whoa.... that is a very interesting prospect... but it would have to be something like a bone or something like that.... not a brain imp.
Originally posted by Ferabukoo
why not get rid of it mehirc
what are you scared of? Or why do you not want the parashock removed.. Yes drugs and anti spells are viable.. but what are you so scared of?
I am not scared of anything, i just think that not every element of PvP in NC should get killed because the lack of skill. And it is skill to use Antistun-things that are ingame, especially in teamwork.
NC is more than a FPS where only aiming and movement are the key. Teamwork is the key.
The one who is scared is you of parashock.
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 00:22
Originally posted by Nash_Brigham
I haven't had the oppurtunity to face off against a parashocking PPU monk yet in PvP. Not really that powerful myself, so I haven't had an oppurtunity at PvP anyways :rolleyes: Anyways, I am all for PvP balance, and being an old UO player, one of the lamest tactics in teh world was teh para gank newbie, thinking he was powerful because of the paralyse spell.
UO had trapped pouches though.
PvM only...some dont realize it, but para helps in some situations in pvm...like fighting things like bats in caves...or slowing down a chaos lieutenant cuz he's coming for you and you and you and you...
it's like hitting someone with a cheapshot in pvp...
Originally posted by Hamlet
Not that it would ever happen, but i myself have a capped ppu - i know how long it takes to level. So perhaps the option would be to allow all these PPUs instantly become APUs. Spells would be changed to match APU spells (ie a perfect 2 slot ppu spell would be changed to a perfect 2 slot APU spell of equal TL). 'Course this would just take tons of time and effort that will never happen... would make a great game tho.
I have a 72/54 ppu that took me 7 days to get so dont say how long it takes to lvl, i have a capped apu, i have a FULLY capped tank, i have 1 capped pe and 1 very nearly capped pe....out of them all, the apu took the longest [well the tank did but im not putting 2nd main skill here]....if ur ppu and u dont have 1 single mate on nc then yes, u can say "it takes all day to lvl" other than that, what the fuck are u talking about? o_O and if u took a few seconds to read the thread u would see its about the removal of para's....not ppu's :lol: :rolleyes: and if u think a ppu needs a para that much then ur a complete n00b, u show me a ppu that gets shot at, freezes whoever shot him/her and runs of cuz there gunna die if they dont
REMOVE FREEZE
Tanks threw it away, Monks took it.... o_O
AWAY WITH FREEZE
Patch 1
remove parashock....
Patch 2
nerf PE stealth cause without parashock it will be the hell to kill them...
Patch 3
nerf APU damage cause as there's no PE to kill them quickly they are killling to much gentank and gentank can't do nothing against them if they are backed by a ppu.
Patch 4
nerf Tank cause all of us are gentank as it is the only pvp class at this time...
Is it what you want ?
For now I see something near a balanced thing if you consider this GLOBALLY.
Monk kill gentank and are killed by PE
Gentank kill PE and are killed by monk
PE kill monks and are killed by gentank
Spies can kill anything but can be killed by anything
off course a very skilled gentank can kill all classes as a very good skilled PE... but at this moment when you duel somebody (so 1 vs 1) you aren't at egality except if you have same class.
It is the reasons of the classes. To be differents and to complete each other... :rolleyes:
ralendil...you're saying that removing parashock from pvp will somehow gimp PPU's?
cuz that's stupid
Originally posted by gostly
ralendil...you're saying that removing parashock from pvp will somehow gimp PPU's?
cuz that's stupid
no only nerf call another nerf :lol:
remove parashock it for http://www.getsomeskills.com/system/smilies/Duhard.gif
Taking out parashock wont really hurt any class. It would make it harder to kill PPUs for one, and would be harder to kill all the other classes as well. All in all its just a good idea. Yayz! :D
well i dont consider this a nerf thread...parashock just needs to be removed from pvp
i consider it a nerf thread when someone wants to somehow gimp another class...then that's a nerf
and im sick of hearing nerf this and nerf that...people need to get over it already :rolleyes:
yes Gostly...
But I think there are the tools to deal with parashock: Holy catharsis sanctum, holy antiparalyse, drugs.
With these tools you can manage parashock.
I think also that holy parashock halo have a too long range and can be casted too quickly. But, maybe it will shock you, I also think 150 psi power points to launch an holy paralysis, it is too much. But as I have a PPU I really think the problem is the hoyl parashock halo. Why all ppu use it if it isn't better than the rare ?
Maybe the only thing that I would be agree with, would be to remove the drug flash effect when you use antishock fluid.
Use it one time, you will understand. 2 seconds to remove a para dot, it isn't a hell !
yes Gostly...
But I think there are the tools to deal with parashock: Holy catharsis sanctum, holy antiparalyse, drugs.
With these tools you can manage parashock.
I think also that holy parashock halo have a too long range and can be casted too quickly. But, maybe it will shock you, I also think 150 psi power points to launch an holy paralysis, it is too much. But as I have a PPU I really think the problem is the hoyl parashock halo. Why all ppu use it if it isn't better than the rare ?
Maybe the only thing that I would be agree with, would be to remove the drug flash effect when you use antishock fluid.
Use it one time, you will understand. 2 seconds to remove a para dot, it isn't a hell !
almost all solutions to parashock require a ppu...the drugs take time to kick-in (maybe 2 seconds like you said)...but nonetheless...that's time where people take free shots on you and if it's an apu that shoots you...you'll be almost dead or dead by the time the para drugs kick in...
also all parashock's are stronger then they should be atm...they werent supposed to make them stronger they did it on "accident" and then never released a hot fix...reguardless of that...they also had no intentions to bring parashocks effect down...which it needs to be...or atleast something needs to happen...
shodanjr_gr
07-01-04, 02:25
Remove Para. I was screaming for it when i was a PPU, i am screaming for it as an APU, i will always scream for it.
REMOVE PARA
Spectra260
07-01-04, 03:15
yes remove it...
PLEASE
edit:
looks like i was copying you:lol:
i didnt even read the posts though....SO I DIDNT!!!:angel:
8|
Nash_Brigham
07-01-04, 07:57
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
UO had trapped pouches though. Try exploding a trapped pouch with 2 or more mages paraing you. You see how fast trapped pouches mean squat, and in the end, unless you had magery, and UOA to begin with, a trapped pouch meant two things to you. Jack and Shit.
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 08:21
Originally posted by Nash_Brigham
Try exploding a trapped pouch with 2 or more mages paraing you. You see how fast trapped pouches mean squat, and in the end, unless you had magery, and UOA to begin with, a trapped pouch meant two things to you. Jack and Shit.
Yea but i always had tons of trapped pouches. And you could easily trap them again after you use them. Don't forget that in UO when you are HIT paralyze is taken off.
Trapped pouches may have not been the best, but it was still useful. And way better than the drugs in NC.
Nash_Brigham
07-01-04, 08:43
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Yea but i always had tons of trapped pouches. And you could easily trap them again after you use them. Don't forget that in UO when you are HIT paralyze is taken off.
Trapped pouches may have not been the best, but it was still useful. And way better than the drugs in NC. Yes, when youa re hit, but if two plus mages couldn't keep you para'd long enough in UO to kill you, then they plain sucked to begin with. And with UOA, all you needed were three or four pouches. You could have a macro set up for para fools in UOA, that popped the pouch and recast trap all in one push of a button.
However, even with that set up, you could not pop a pouch and recast fast enough to overcome being para ganked by two or more mages why a third blasts you.
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 09:02
Originally posted by Nash_Brigham
However, even with that set up, you could not pop a pouch and recast fast enough to overcome being para ganked by two or more mages why a third blasts you.
But that's three against one. what do you expect? :p
Although I always had reflect up, and I Did abuse the teleport+hide tactic. Man I loved that. :p
I was a stealther mage.
Nash_Brigham
07-01-04, 09:18
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
But that's three against one. what do you expect? :p
Although I always had reflect up, and I Did abuse the teleport+hide tactic. Man I loved that. :p
I was a stealther mage. As far as three on one, I would win about 80% of my fights, until the para gank newbies came around. As far as what type of mage I was, I was a scribe mage. As far as reflect, waste of mana for me, especially against gimp warriors.
Shadow Dancer
07-01-04, 09:21
Originally posted by Nash_Brigham
As far as three on one, I would win about 80% of my fights, until the para gank newbies came around. As far as what type of mage I was, I was a scribe mage. As far as reflect, waste of mana for me, especially against gimp warriors.
cool i had scribe as well.
I used reflect for when their were alot of mages and stuff.
I used to spend 90% of my time Pvping on the test server near the end of my UO career. :p
Nash_Brigham
07-01-04, 09:28
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
cool i had scribe as well.
I used reflect for when their were alot of mages and stuff.
I used to spend 90% of my time Pvping on the test server near the end of my UO career. :p I spent my time with protectio up, that way I was about 90% uninteruptable. However, with the AoS rule changes, i have dropped out of UO PvP. My account is stilla ctive, but since a lame ass paladin gimp can holy light me faster while running, it's jsut gotten stupid.
parashock does nothing but dumb down an uber player to that of a 6/6 small sewer rat
nuff said, kill it
I would like to see mjs comment on this..
About parashock, and its uses on pvp
Originally posted by gostly
almost all solutions to parashock require a ppu...the drugs take time to kick-in (maybe 2 seconds like you said)...but nonetheless...that's time where people take free shots on you and if it's an apu that shoots you...you'll be almost dead or dead by the time the para drugs kick in...
1-2 seconds I Find. You can beat the drug haze too if needs be. Point is as you point out quite well, para shock is useless unless your under fire by someone else at the same.
Call me crazy but in a 2vs1 fight (of equal people) the single player is always at a disadvantage. If without para you can take on and kill two people at the same time then it is your class that is unbalanced and would need 'tweaking' the moment para was removed.
Before someone says 'PPU can take 2 people'. No they can't. They could probably stop from dying but they most certainly couldn't win the fight.
Why all ppu use it if it isn't better than the rare ?
Because the effects of para on the spells is bugged. So they are going for the low level spell (less mana, faster) for equal/more glue then the holy one.
I don't think it should be removed, just made very crap, like the freezer pistol, rifle and cannon are now. Maybe if the para worked on mobs (an all freezer weapons) very wll but sucked in PvP it would be ok.
Originally posted by El Barto
I don't think it should be removed, just made very crap, like the freezer pistol, rifle and cannon are now. Maybe if the para worked on mobs (an all freezer weapons) very wll but sucked in PvP it would be ok.
oh yeah...
sorry to say that I found that as the worst thing that can be done...
too much things that are useless.
=> all freezers weapons... when I have bought one long time ago I was disgusting...
=> ppu spells: psi shield, catharsis, holy catharsis
=> ppu spells that are not good: provoke ennemy, distract mind
=> grenades are not very good...
=> fusion pistol that are a joke
=> psi attack spells.. what do you want to do with 285-988 frc damages ? :wtf:
=> Crahn Antibuff => forget it too long...
=> Healing light.. is there a worst rifle ? (3 x 196 enr DEX 110)
=> Beam of hell, wyatt eap... 92 by minutes... when you kill someone with these babies it is the shame for the victim...
=> low tech melee weapon with more than 2 slots.... what do you want putting as mod ???? or even low tech melee weapon with slots if you cap the damages on the weapon...
no i do not want to see more things being added to this shitty list :mad:
and i am sure i have forgotten many things...
PulsarBl0w
07-01-04, 13:05
Remove para and your remove the only way you have to kill a PPU.
- PPU run fast
- PPU cast fast
Parashock a PPU and
- PPU can't run away
- PPU can't cast fast (did u ever tried to cast when parashocked ? uh )
You will say that the parashocked PPU can then cast is H.C.S.
But the time he needs for casting is HCS, he can't cast his holy things (heal, def, sh).
As i said, remove para and you have no mean to stop and kill a PPU.
Your vision of things are soo tied... Lame
as of now i still cant be parashocked because of my anti spells.. but its the people without ppu's is where the prob is.. so just remove the para
Originally posted by Ferabukoo
as of now i still cant be parashocked because of my anti spells.. but its the people without ppu's is where the prob is.. so just remove the para
hmmm
false... even if you have HCS even with 120% in damage and an HCS capped you will be shocked for few seconds but you will be shocked until the HCS remove the para.
And that's why it can help to kill ppu.
But I don't think it is the problem... I live without ppu and can survive. But you must be realistic...when you see a group of ennemies with 2 ppu in it and you have no ppu you will be lucky to win...
So what you want is to let the PPU useless ? If all can fight without he will be useless. If he is useless nobody would take it...
Do you attack a fully capped gentank with your spy without a rare ?
It is the same here... if people go fighting without concentrated antishock fluid against ppu without ppu on their side they have to know that they will be para and be kicked quickly of the battlefield...
so maybe people have to make ppu...
and like that we won't have some "removes para" thread....
cause like that you will see how it is funny now the OP wars with a ppu... :mad:
can't rez, can't kill, para is uneseless against good players.
the work is heal, dboost, shields.... nothing that can be repeated to have effect (like parashock before patch or the guns of fighters) ... when you have done your work you wathc until the next phase... (it is quickly cause heal last 10s but when you support just one runner it is VERY boring)
You know, this is some funny shit. I don't read these boards for months, I come back to poke around for DoY info, and what do I see?
Same old damn Paracheese still in the game. Still ruining the whole mess.
It's a damn pity... :(
Mr Friendly
09-01-04, 06:53
perhaps KK didnt understand.....
it wasnt the freakin para spammers we wanted get rid of.....we want the freakin % stun to be dropped dramatically
no longer have it at 83%, drop it to like 50% for the holy paralysis er summin :\
keep the mana consumption, & casts/min etc
Originally posted by Ralendil
bla bla bla
im too lazy to edit the text to what i want it to be.
Yes HCS takes a few secs, good PPUs have the antifreeze spell also, so it takes like 0.5 secs before theyre unfrozen again.
this game would be so much better without parashock (atleast in pvp), and it would probably stop a lot of whiners too.......
remove para = true god mode for ppus
well everyone wants it removed...
everyone hates ppus for it so if its removed everyone will be happy.
but yes. ppus will be harder to hit..
onoz you might have to actualy aim for once
imagine that
Shadow Dancer
09-01-04, 19:24
You can still take down good ppus without parashock.
And i could care less if one of the UBER ppus now dies 3 times a month instead of 5.
The benefits to removing parasex outweigh the negatives IMO.
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