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View Full Version : IDEA: Very Indepth Look at Runner owned Shops



Sealdude
22-12-03, 06:41
Here are my ideas on runner owned shops and real estate. I know it is rife (sp?) with spelling errors but I dont have MS word on this comp and the online spell checkers take too long.



One major problem with Neocron is that no trade skillers or anyone for that matter, bothers to sell anything except rare chips and tech parts. Even if you do try to make a few bucks of a rare it is a long, boring, and tedious process to yell "WTS Rare Parts" every few minutes. This is where runner owned shops come in. You would be able to open a shop and have NPCs sell things when your not around. My ideas here extend way past the idea of simple shops though.



Where to Put Them


One major question about runner owned shops is where to put them. There is plenty of existing space that needs only to be slightly tweeked to acomodate runner owned shops. Also neocron can always be built up to the sky to allow room for shops or we could have underground shops. There is also plenty of room in MB, TH, and TG. One other idea is to have a large mall of all different shops where you can have a lot of virtual space for them.


How Much They Should Cost


Another issue with the creation of runner made shops is how much they should cost. I think that they should cost enough that not everyone but not too much that only big name people have them and no one makes noobie weapons. First off you have to buy or rent the floor space that you will use. The price of this should depend on location and Amman of space. A one room piece of junk in the outskirts of the the outzone should cost way less than a multistory complex in the heart of Plaza 1. Shops in the mall should cost less because they are plain and hidden with a lot of other shops (more on the mall later) Where you can buy shops should also be limited by content and owner of the shop. A TS member shouldn't be able to set up a strip club in ViaRossa but if he gets a TT buddy to open up a weapon store in ViaRossa for him it could work. The other costs should be for NPCs to run the shops, cabinets and such inside the shop, and general upkeep. More on these later. It shouldn't be too hard for someone to open up a small little shop with barely and room and one NPC but how many people would go to it? Also small shops should always be safe zones unless they are in the outzone or PP but very large places should be anarchy zones like they are now. Shops should be purchasable from Diamond real estate runners if they are in the city, TS or BD depending on the PP sector, Crahn for outzone and CM, FA, or TG depending on their respective HQs. Once you buy the key to the shop you have access to the shop and the control terminal so that you can begin building your shop up from the ground floor to suit your needs. The following are what factors into the price of shop space:


Location: As mentioned before location is key. The floor space should break down like this going from most expensive to least: ViaRossa, Plaza, MB/TH/TG, Mall, PP, Outzone.

Architecture: A nice multistory building with archs, bridges, and other good looking things will be more expensive than a square room. I dont have ideas for each and every price level but the most expensive should look the best and the cheapest should be a box

Floor Space: Somewhat related to architecture, floor space is the measure of how much room your store has and therefore how much you can put in it. Items should have to be a certain distance apart so that it is easy to navigate and people dont pack things in cheap places.

Restrictions: Certain areas have restrictions that factor into the price of the space you are buying. For example you can only own strip clubs in PP and you can only operate clean medicare facilitys in ViaRossa (but you can do so ileaglly in PP or outzone.)


The Main Shop Control Center


The main shop control center or MSCC for short is where everything in your shop is controlled from. It allows architects to make floor plans, lets you hire and fire workers, manage your expensies and serves as the virtual moneybox. The money box is where all the proftits from the shop go and where money for wages and items the shop has bought comes from. After a certain amount of money is put into it it becomes full and needs to be emptied before the shop can operate again. This is to prevent people from opening up a shop and then simpily logging off for a month and coming back rich. It also leads to such RP elements as robbing of a store. Say you are a criminal and you know that a certain store owner always collects his money at a certain time. You stake out his store and wait till he opens it and then you pounce and steal his money. The money box is also able to accept a password so that your business partner can add or remove money.



NPC Shopkeepers


The most important part of a runner owned shop is the NPC vendor. Sure you can buy a space and furnish it with the best of everything but if you dident have any vendors you would still have to stand there spamming the trade channel. Vendors can be purchased from certain "Human Resource Directors" who are a subdivions of Diamond realestate. Once you purchase the "Vendor DNA" you take it back to your shop where it is inputted in the MSCC and once that is done you can spawn your vendor. If your vendor is killed you must buy another unless you buy an expensive back up module that respawns the vendor 1,2,or 3 times after he has been killed depending on the module. Even though the DNA for the vendor may not be too expensive you still have to pay the vendors there salaries. DNA costs and salaries depend on the following:

Barter Level: When a runner goes to buy something from a vendor the barter of the runner is compared to that of the NPC. If the runners level is higher they get a dicount depending on how high above it is. If the levels are the same then the runner pays the ammount you had set for the item. If the level is lower then the vendor tacks on a slight increase to the price (not enought to exploit).


Item Specality: Every vendor that you hire has a limit on what they can sell wether it be based off of what the item is or what the TL of the item is. Based off of this you would have to hire different or better workers to sell high TL rifles then someone who wanted to sell low TL rifles. It makes sense because the guy who you hired who just got fired from working at YOs isent going to understand when someone asks him for a Plasma Rifle.


Selling Speed: This skill reflects how fast a vendor can move items and it does this by limiting how many spaces he has to sell items from. It works like this, all items that are being sold are stored in cabanites. The higher the selling speed the more items he can grab from the cabs and display to the people. So if the vendors selling speed was one he would only list one type of pistol. If he ran out of this then he would start selling pistol B and so on and so forth. If his speed had been two then he could have listed and sold pistol A and Pistol B at the same time.


Weapon Type and TL: Seeing as somepeople would want to harm vendors they can carry weapons as indicated in their profiles. If their profile says Pistol/50 Then they can use pistols up to TL 50. If it says Rifle/80 they can use up to TL80 rifles and so on. You must buy the weapons for your shop keepers.


NPC Model: Even though it does not affect the price of the vendor you are able to pick from various models for the NPC so you can change their look.

All of these stats are shown in the DNA cube when you buy it and in the MSCC when you bring the vendors back to your shop. The stats are also reflected in the overall rank of the vendor. Your workers wages are also based off of these skills. Wages are payed to the workers every real life week. If you miss one payment the worker stops doing anything until it get payed again. If this happens twice in a row or very often then they disappear and so does their DNA cube which represents them getting a new job.

Specailty NPCs: Some situations require the use of specailized NPCs. These NPCs cost more than normal NPCs but do much more important jobs. They are:

Rare Seller, Part: Due to the high technical nature of rare parts and also the fact that you dont want a person that would steal from you, you must hire special NPCs to handle your rare parts. They cost more than normal NPC vendors and can only sell rare parts, but all above stats apply.

Rare Seller, Weapon: Same as the above vendor except they cost even more because they are intrusted with the whole weapon. The reason these two vendors would cost so much is to keep rares rare.

Talking NPC: These NPCs have the ability to inteact with runners by using the dialogue screen. Their dialogue is set in the MSCC by the owner of the shop and they can further be customized by using the Vendor Scripting Language (more on that later) The only stats they share with normal vendors are weapon type and tl and model. Their new skill is:

Number of Lines: This dictates how many lines of dialogue they can have. The higher the skill the more lines.


Smuggler Vendors: One thing that this game needs more of is a clean line between criminals and the law. There should be certain drugs/imps/weapons that are considered ilegal and are not able to be sold in the city at all. Also CA runners should have faction missions to visit shops and make sure that they dont have any ilegal items and if so to confiscate them and arrest the owner. This is wehre smugglers would come in. They would look like any other vendor but would have a way to secretly tell them a password that would let you look at their ilegal items. They would also have a new skill called:

Smuggling Ability: The ability for vendors to hide ilegal items to hide items from CA runners. The skill of the vendor would be compared to either the skill of the runner (new skill) or the level of the scanner tool they have. The higher level they are the less likely they are to be found out.

Hookers: Good looking women with not a lot on. Perfect for stip clubs.


Guard: These are the muscle of your property. They can only be placed within shop boundaries and cannot shoot at anyone outside, only people who pass the line into your shop. They keep your vendors safe and keep out the riff raf. Their stats are:


Weapon Type and TL: Same as above

Strength: Dictates what type of armor they can use

Reaction Rate: How fast they react to a deal with intruders


Guards have varying levels of who they will target and kill with runners. These levels are:


Kill All: Kills everyone not listed in the "Do Not kill List" on the MSCC. Shop owners are always on that list

Kill Selected: Kills everyone on the "Kill List" The shop owner can never be on this list.

Kill Faction Enemy: Kills all faction enemies

Kill Clan Enemies: Kills anyone the owners clan has on their war list. The owning clan can never be on this list

Kill No One: Dosent Kill anyone


They also have a reaction rate setting. They are:


Kill Imediatly: Kills anyone on the selected setting as soon as they see them.


Give X Warnings then Kill: Gives whoever applies to the selected setting X number of warnings (set by owner) and then kills them. Depending on the guard it can either be one of a few preset voice commands (made by KK) or a chat warning.


Kill if Weapon is Visible: If whoever is effected by the current setting has a weapon drawn the guards will open fire. This can be combined with the warning command to give them a warning if they have a gun out.


Guards will always open fire if they themselves or a vendor or shop owner is fired at by anyone.



The Vendor Scripting System


Used mostly in conjuction with the talking NPCs or by Shop Owners who want to have complete control the Vendor Scripting System is an easy to learn language that is editied at the MSCC. The commands are very basic. Some of them would be:


Buy X for Y: Selected vendor buys X item for Y money.

Sell X for Y: Sells X item for Y money.

Trade X for Z: Trades X item for Z item

(Those three would already be able to be setup with out scripting)

And: Combines two things such as "Buy X AND Y"

If/Then: Says that IF one thing happens THEN do something else. "IF runner sets price of X item as Y THEN buy"

Less then / Greater than: Analyzes something to see if something else is less then or greater than. "If Runner A offers MORE THAN 2000 CR for X item then Sell

Send Email E: Sends an email to E name. "If X item is brought then SEND EMAIL BOB saying We got the gun!"

Kill: Tells selected NPC to kill a certain runner if something happens "If Runner A pays less than 2000 NC then KILL him.

Set Message M : Sets message M as what the talking NPC will say

Repeat Message M: Tells the NPC to repeat the previously set message "If runner uses NPC then REPEAT MESSAGE HI!"

List Messages: Lists message is the interface window that a runner can click on to further conversation

Ask: Brings up input window where a runner can input info. "ASK (Whats you name?)

Repeat: Repeats what ever was filled in on the ask forum. "REPEAT (Hi, X)
Where X would be whatever the runner filled in as their name.

(Programming freaks feel free to add commands/fix mine if I have made any mistakes. Also sorry if this dosent make sense but I am sure a coder could understand it/ explain it a lot better than I can)


A good example for this system would say a Runner wants to set up a hacking business. He wants a talking NPC to talk to runners when they click on him, tell them about the runners services, and contact the runner if they need a belt hacked. He sets is NPC as "IF Runner Uses NPC then REPEAT MESSAGE "Hi my prices are 10k per belt" IF runner clicks of message "I want a belt hacker" THEN ask "Whos belt and where" When runner Fills in location and name SEND EMAIL HACKER saying "Runners belt in PP needs hacking"

Sealdude
22-12-03, 06:42
What to Put in Them


Ok so know we have shop space, and we have people to sell items but that is not the only thing that shops need. They need chairs, cabs, storage rooms, etc... These things would only be able to be placed by a skilled architect (new skill) via the MSCC.


New Skill: Architecture Every building needs items placed inside but not every Joe off the street is able to do this in the most efficent way possible. That is where architects come in. Architects are skilled in making items for shops and other real estate and also placing it in the most economical way possible. They way this would work is each stores MSCC would have a section labeled items. Each item would have varying TLs based on the functionality and apperance of the item. Once a runner sets up a shop he/she would have to hire an architect to come with him to use this list to help set up the shop. To prevent abuse of this when you register a shop space you make a PW so that architects cant use it without the PW and you change it after he/she does work for you so that they dont mess everything up. The architect would use this menu to select and place objects in a 3D overhead view of the space. When placed in this mode they would appear transparent so that the owner knows nothing real has been placed yet. After everything was placed the architect hits the "Make Floorplan" button which spits out a data cube containing the Which piece of real estate it was made in, the objects placed and their prices. If they store owner selected the cube and selected "show info" he would see the transperent furniture again. Once he pressed "use" a dialogue box would come up saying "This floorplan costs XXX NC to fabricate, Do you wish to procede Y/N" if he/she clicked yes then all the objects would become soild and the money would be deducted from him and the cube would disappear. The skill of the architect determines which items he can use and how close to the original plan the objects will come out when actually placed.


Items that can be placed The following are items that should be able to be constructed with realative TLs (ie low high, highest, etc...) Feel free to add more or comment on the function.

Selling Cabaninets: The function of this cab is to hold the items that the NPCs are selling. If you remember from before the NPCs have speed ratings. So if you have a cab that holds five items but the rating of your vendor is only 1 then he can only sell one item from that cab at a time. Smallest ones are lowest biggest are high TL.

Storage Cabaninets: Have a much larger capaicty then selling cabs but cannot not be interfaced by NPC vendors to sell from. Password protected so business partners can access them. Smallest are lowest TL bigger are higher TL.

Chairs: Basic unit used to sit on. Better models can heal or recharge stamina slightly. Basic unit it lowest TL, better models are medium TL.

Benches: Same as chairs except more in one unit.

Medicare Tables: Used to quickly recharge PSI, Health, and stamina. Medium TL to High TL for better versions.

CityCom Terminals: Acess all parts of the CityCom system. 1 unit which is medium TL

Plants: Vegetation for visual beauty. Low TL

Tables: From two seaters to multiseaters. CityComs can be placed on them. Low to medium TL

Doors: Many types such as wooden, clear, clear sliding, metal sliding. Inside doors (not the entrance ones) can be hackable with skill level needed set by owner. Low to Medium TL.

Outfitter Terminal: Lets runners change cloths. High TL

Desks: Allow a place for NPCs to stand at or something for the back office. CityComs can be placed on them. Low to medium TL.

Gen-Rep: Allows teleporting to and from and the ability to gr lost backpacks to you. Lockable. High TL.

GoGuardian: Allows runners secure storage for their items. High TL.

Walls: Limited use inside to create small rooms but not too many can be made so that small spaces become multi room. High TL

Sewer Entrance: Acces certain dungeons or sewers. More on this later. High TL

Turrets: Function as automated guards. High TL

Display Cases: Small, see-through cabs that allow you to display models of your work in. Medium TL.

Models: Cheap replicas of real items used to display what is sold at your shop. TL relative to item TL

Glass Walls: Mostly used as display cases for large things. (Think of the PP3 ASG) High TL

Art Work: Various pre-set pictures for viewing pleaseure. Low TL.

Signs: Items which can be written on in preset writing styles and colors and can then be attached to windows/walls. Such as warning notices, price lists etc...

Electronic Signs: Neon signs that function the same as low tech signs except more flashy. High TL

Buttons and Switches: Connected to various objects as triggers for events. High TL

One way walls: Reprents a peep hole so that you can look out but they cant look in. High TL

Camera: Transmits images to a monitor for keeping tabs on people. High TL.


Before you start complaining that this would make the server restart every time someone did this consider that fact that everyone would already have info on these objects and the architect would basicly be using a modified version of the GM spawn command. Also the signs would be a font and color that everyone already had.


Store Dungeouns

One thing that would get people to visit a shop would be dungeous where they could fight and level and then possibly buy the products sold in that store. Money grubbers could set it up so that you would have to pay to enter their dungeous or that they would get a part of the money for every kill. As for how to set them up I am torn.


Idea 1: Let shop owners select from one of a few dungeoun styles and then let them populate them with their own mobs. Mobs would come it packs the cost a fair ammount of money so people dont exploit. Say a pack of 5 Aggie spawns would spawn 2 Aggies 5 times every 5 min or so but would cost 10k. Mobs should be limited so that people arent leveling off of WBs inside the city.


Idea 2: Let shop owners buy access to certain dungeouns. For instance if you bought acces to the Level 4 dungeoun it would have that size and shape dungeoun and every mob that normally spawns there but would have a rent of XXX NC per RL week.

Since I absoluetly love the underground travel idea there should be away for shop owners to secretly connect to the undergroun travel routes but it should be hard and expensive. This should also be one of the things that CA patrols check for.

The CyberMall

Not everyone wants to have a shop out in the city nor do they have the money. Other people dont want to wander around NC till they find the shop they are looking for. This is where the cybermall comes in. Bear in mind that this is in conjuction with the above and not instead of it.

Location: The cybermall should be somewhere in ViaRossa shift the focus away from Plaza 1. Once you walk in the entrance you are greeted by a small area with banks or APT like lift controls, a gogo and a GR or two, and either a map or a list of the stores in the mall.

Getting Around When you activate the lift controls a menu comes up that has two drop down menus one labeled "Item Type" and one leveled "TL Range" Say you were looking for a TL 30 rifle. You would select Rifle under Item Type and 16-30 Under TL Range. This would bring you to a floor where the stores sold rifles from TL 16-30. It dosent bring you directly to the floor because I feel that system detracts from the feel of "shopping" as well as makes people pass over many stores because if they went right to the store they would miss a whole lot they have never seen. If a certain Item and TL had more shops then would find in one line then there should be another lift and the end of the row that goes to the next set. The item type and TL would be determined by the Average of the TLs of all the items in the shop and the type of item the shop has most of. The TLs would break down as 0-15, 16-30, 31-45, 46-60 and the item types as Drones, Rifles, Pistols, Spells, Tools, Misc. I feel that it should be limited by having no vendors of TL 60 because then everyone would have a CyberMall shop and no one would have city stores.

Types of Stores

Kiosk: In the middle of a walkway with enough room for one Low TL Seller and maybe two cabs. Very cheap but only useful for people catering to noobs.

Basic Store: The most abundant and uniform store. A basic square with no much else. Limited in the items that can be put inside. Cheaper than most outside stores though, good for beginers.

End Stores: The stores and the ends of isles. Think of Macy's in real life malls. Much bigger than the basic store and a lot better looking but much more expensive.

Other things that go hand in hand with this

Large improvement to the trade skill system. Search for my "Serious look at trade skills" thread for some ideas about this.

Mobs should drop weapons but the drop rates should be variable so that sometimes they will be abundant and dirt cheap or rare and very expensive.

Different areas should be able to sell different things so that not everyone stays in plaza 1

Release runner owned shops at the same time as the current shops are up so that things can be bped and such. The remove all non runner shops so that people can become the new crytons or AW or such.

I think that is everything I wanted to list so now I am going to give some examples of what you could do with this limitless system.


Example 1 Say your a hacker who wants to see that hackers are able to level up and are able to connect to hacknet from your establishment. You recruit 5 hackers on the ingame forums who are noobs but want to level up. You buy a nice out of the way place in outzone, buy two guards to kill everyone but you and the 5 noobs, create a bunch of increasing TL hack doors, have a few new hackable mobs in your dungeoun and then have two hack uplinks hidden in the back. The doors and mobs provide ways for the hackers to lvl their skills and the uplinks provide a secret way to strike at enemies. But the CA found out about this and a team is coming to your door....


Example 2 You are a TS constructor but you are tired of making small change in plaza 2. You decide that the best thing for you is to have a front in PP that sells Snacks. Little does CA know but that button on the wall opens a panel in the back where a vendor selling 5 slotted beams of Doom :) ....


Example 3 You are a large clan owner and your current apt just isent cutting it. You need more of everything plus all these noobs are spamming you with emails and DMs to join the clan. Everyone pitches in and you buy a huge complex for your clan. You got guards to keep out the enemy clan, your clan policy is on the front window, you have a NPC that directs all players who are tanks (the one class that you clan dosent have very many of) above level 60 to fill out a form which auto emails to you and behind that locked door your constructors are making weapons every minute....


Example 4 You are a CA arrest team leader who needs to nab a group of certain group of BD felons who keep sliping out of your grasp. Yo get a loyal BD friend to buy you a space in PP where you make a bar to attract the convicts. It is a very seedy place with hookers and everything a criminal loves. You watch from your back room through the camera as they buy some ilegal weapons....


The above are all example sof what can be done through the scripting system and some basic architecture. But these are extreme examples. Most people would just use it to sell things, or would they? I have seen many a thread where people have asked that a certain sector be improved or a certain shop or bar be added. Rather then bother KK with making each and every new thing do it once by giving us these tools and then let our imaginations run wild. This would be a major selling point for the game if implemented. The box could read "If combat isent your thing open up your own business and furnish it would hundreds of items, limitless possibilities!" Combined with enhanced Trade skills pure trade skillers could emerge and RP opportunities would open up.

naimex
22-12-03, 06:45
i didnt bother to read through it all, but I have always thought and will always thnk this is a good idea.. even though i dont have any tradeskillers...

and the few things i noticed on my way down through it all looked really nice, so I think what you wrote sounded reasonable, not to say GREAT =)

KimmyG
22-12-03, 06:47
Perhaps you could sum it it like its

Its like UO's shop system
or
Shadowbanes shop system


anyway title and idea is good I just dont have the attention to read all that though:(

TheDuckMan
22-12-03, 06:47
I didnt bother reading those either =).... but this is what came to mind when i read the topics.


SWG meat NC .... NC meat SWG

naimex
22-12-03, 06:49
Originally posted by TheDuckMan
I didnt bother reading those either =).... but this is what came to mind when i read the topics.


SWG meat NC .... NC meat SWG

yup... sounds a bit like SWG with the "Vendors" and buildings, malls, Cloning facilities =P and such.. but still it would be an irreplaceable addition to neocron. it will pwn so much.. imagine.. tradeskillers can make money whilst they hunt more stuff to sell on their figher / hunter alt.

StrongSad
22-12-03, 06:59
Some parts sound good, but it is FAR FAR to complex. You could make a whole MMORPG out of that. I think a system similar to SWG would be fine. Just buy a special "store/vendor" appt. Inside it would be a safezone with NPC vendors just like regular shops. The store owner would put all the armor, for example, they want to sell in a cabinet. Then when someone came into the store and clicked on the correpsonding "armor" vendor a list with all the stuff the owner put in the cabinet would pop up....with set sell prices. A good way for newbs to buy implants.....guns.....armor....and such cheap without going through the annoying process of *buy....research....build*.

I think having player owned vendors that handle rares would be difficult since most of the time people want to trade and not sell.

I think simpler is better......as a very steep learning curve discourages many.

fatwreck
22-12-03, 07:06
i read the first 2 paragraphs and liked the idea... i'd like to get rid of my misc stuff while not online. would also be a good way to sell bad built (the 0 and 1 slot) rares you dotn want but no one ever wants to buy in nctrade... help newbs that log on at bad hours get decent stuff when they save enough money or whatever

TheDuckMan
22-12-03, 07:07
It would be simple just to use something like apartments. Just being able to buy special apartments that dont have a bed but instead have counters and tables. Then being able to place npc's just like you place vendors.

OORRRRR..........

If anyone has ever played SWG you've seen the bazaar. I think that would be easier and simpler to implement. Except you wouldnt have to go from place to place to pick up your purchase.

McEvoy
22-12-03, 09:16
have a store equal to a lvl one apartment, with a shop npc in it, the store owner gives this npc items to sell and sets there prices, people can come up if you advertise the address. The stores have a public door bell so you can enter and look at what that person is selling and pay the npc for it. when the store owner gets back to the store, he or she clicks on the npc and is able to see how much money they made and what items were bought.

kreal
22-12-03, 09:28
i'v have read it all and i most say you "own" :D Very good idea.

and you shuld really send this idea to Arbital or any other KK employie. Quicky

Netphreak
22-12-03, 19:08
Damn good explaination.
Well thought out. I always thought that there should be player shops or at least when you sell something at a shop (at a higher price than they are worth now) it would go into the shops inventory and could be bought be someone else.

TheDuckMan
22-12-03, 19:10
I think you should be able to place vendors like you place turrents. Then you could get really in depth and add security gaurds and decorations. Not just buy an app. and have everything laid out and it all looks the same.

[SP]Ostrich
22-12-03, 20:04
read a fair chunk of it, gonna print it off and use it as bedtime reading material ;)

EDIT: read it all, agree with it all, dont think it will be implemented though :(

msdong
22-12-03, 20:50
hmm, i like that key idea.
but all around is a little compex to start. not that its a bad idea but we all know or get a tast on how kk put things into the game. Step-by-Step

we should start with the shopkeeper keys that once activated it spawns a trader in a shop area.
you go there give you stuff to the vendor and set a minimum prize u want for it. the money is transfered to you bank account.

in a next step you can set a list of standart stuff you want to buy and what prize u want to give for it.
you give the trader some money and he buy all stuff in the list until he have no money left.

what if a trader is killed ?
well there can be several things happen.but the best i thinkis the killer gets xx% of the money and one of the 10 expencives items.
because of the traders have the faction Trader Union the lose FS and SL from the kill.


Edit:
because the traders a neutral its easy for anti CA to set up traders in NC and the other way around. all you need is to reach the trader to give him stuff or take from him.

Judge
22-12-03, 20:56
This has been asked for since the beginning of retail and even further back than that I think.... not sure I wasn't around much then... and it hasn't even been mentioned by MJS or anyone from KK in that time. I really like the idea, I even made a topic on it a while ago.... I just don't think that KK are gonna put it in any time soon. Maybe with DoY, who knows?

McEvoy
22-12-03, 20:59
Originally posted by TheDuckMan
I think you should be able to place vendors like you place turrents. Then you could get really in depth and add security gaurds and decorations. Not just buy an app. and have everything laid out and it all looks the same.

Yes KK definitly needs to finalize and re-release the dinamic objects
Dinamic objects that work aswell, like ability to buy more cabinets and recreation units decorations etc. :)

L0KI
22-12-03, 21:54
5 stars, great ideas there. Can tell youve thought hard about each one.

[SP]Ostrich
23-12-03, 00:32
hmm, it seems that this thread isn't getting as much attention as it should, sealdude, i think you should make a dumbed down version of this, so lazy people get the message too.

Keiron
23-12-03, 01:00
I am impressed. This guy has thought of just about everything. 5^345987345 stars:D

Martin J. Schwiezer
23-12-03, 02:42
NPC traders who exclusively sell runners's stuff (e.g. while the player is offline) will be introduced with NC:BDoY.

Keiron
23-12-03, 02:42
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
NPC traders who exclusively sell runners's stuff (e.g. while the player is offline) will be introduced with NC:BDoY.
OMG /me goes to clean the cream off his pants and monitor

naimex
23-12-03, 02:45
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
NPC traders who exclusively sell runners's stuff (e.g. while the player is offline) will be introduced with NC:BDoY.

Uhhm... MJS... u got a notepad or something i can borrow =/ run out of lines to put stars for your reputation with me in.. :D :D :D



That is sooooo c00l :D when it comes i wanna have a girlie standing somewhere selling dead droms in plaza 1 =D

IM GONNA BE RICH !!!

dbomb
23-12-03, 02:59
heh sounds like npc's would just sell whatever is in a runners inventory when theyre offline that feature would be funny

Sealdude
23-12-03, 03:42
MJS will NPC Vendors be in DOY because you got ideas from my thread? ;)



I dont believe that this system would to complex for new shop owners to set up. The three simple steps would be

1) Buy Shop Space- Like buying an apt it would be like ViaRossa 100,000 Sq Ft (Small) or Pepper Park 1 million sq ft (Large) and would then have some info about it


2) Buying Vendors- You goto the human rescource director located within the city and you would see vendor DNA that had the skills of the vendor:


Model Name: XXXX
Barter Level: XXXX
Speed Rating:XXXX
Item Spec:XXXX
Weapon Type TL: XXXX/NN


3) Populate: Bring in your architect, tell him what you want in it and where and then buy the floor plan and open your shop.



The only part that I think would be complex is the scripting system which would only be used by people who really want complete control over their shop. I did not want to make it too simple because while some people maybe happy with just a shop others may want to do something like in the examples I made.


Take for instance the thread about a bar in Plaza 1. I think that is a kickass idea and is very well layed out. The problem with that is KK would have to take time out of bug squishing and content developing to make something that maybe not everyone will visit. With this system it is alot of work, but then people can make all the bars they want :D :D

MoreDread
23-12-03, 10:11
Great idea, but I think it is a little bit too complex. At all, i would be happy to see it implemented. I´m curios how the shops will work Martin talk about.

JM

msdong
23-12-03, 10:36
Originally posted by Martin J. Schwiezer
NPC traders who exclusively sell runners's stuff (e.g. while the player is offline) will be introduced with NC:BDoY.

/emote sex

wow, that are happy news Santa MJS.

Archeus
23-12-03, 23:43
I always found tradebots to be the bane on existance of MMORPGs.

Syntax-Error
23-12-03, 23:45
No, they are great worked a treat in Ultima Online.

J. Folsom
23-12-03, 23:49
Originally posted by Archeus
I always found tradebots to be the bane on existance of MMORPGs. I sort of agree actually, it means there's less interaction between players, while usually interaction's a good thing.

Not to mention it encourages camp-o-cron, as people don't have to actively sell stuff, they just shove everything into the trader NPC, then head off to go kill more stuff so they have more to sell...

Archeus
24-12-03, 00:01
Originally posted by J. Folsom
Not to mention it encourages camp-o-cron, as people don't have to actively sell stuff, they just shove everything into the trader NPC, then head off to go kill more stuff so they have more to sell...

Exactly. No interaction with players. Not good for the community. I never bought from vendors in UO and they were a pox on the land (I guess NC will do a better job).

In AC they were even worse. It pretty much in the space of a month destroyed all player interaction when it came to trading.

On the other hand on a bandwidth issue for KK it helps a lot. First up it generates downtime for the player loading the NPC, by pricing thier goods.

Secondly it generates downtime for the buyer who isn't moving, just checking a list and buying.

Lastly it cuts down on spam.

Syntax-Error
24-12-03, 00:52
While freeing up people to enjoy the game who dont enjoy having to sit in plaza spamming "WTS BLAH BLAH BLAH" or "WTB BLAH BLAH BLAH" or even "WTT BLAH BLAH BLAH"

And for those who do run a shop already or want too with full play interaction. can, there is no rule to use it. and just because you didnt use them dosnt mean we didnt. i used them. and still had enough player to player trade at the banks (UO's version of plaza 1)

Archeus
24-12-03, 13:21
Originally posted by Syntax-Error
While freeing up people to enjoy the game who dont enjoy having to sit in plaza spamming "WTS BLAH BLAH BLAH" or "WTB BLAH BLAH BLAH" or even "WTT BLAH BLAH BLAH"

There is already a system to deal with player to player interaction without spam. The citycom forums. They work. Player posts an advert and arranges a time to meet.

With NPC traders, you never see who you dealt with. Maybe that 4 slot CS you sold was bought by a faction enemy and was used to kill many of your faction?

I guess the traders will be in set locations based on faction and you wont be globally selling to people.

Argent
24-12-03, 13:41
Didn't read the post (yes I'm lazy bastard right now) but it would be good to have request function on the NPC traders. Ie. people come and see what the trader has to sell but the trader doesn't have it, so then the you could request some item and the constructer could see what people want (quantity of items, number of slots...).

Don't say that this could be handled via e-mail. Of course it could, but such a function as I suggest would be so much more handy.

[TgR]KILLER
24-12-03, 14:01
damn i even dit read it all :p damn good idea.. i want a shop to resell techs for me :p just set a min price for it but don't show that.. just let the runner offer something.. if it meets the price or goes over it sell the tech. if not no deal :)

Sealdude
24-12-03, 17:34
@ Argent

Crap I knew I forgot something.


@ Archeus

Well the vendors do have your faction on them.

Xerxer
19-01-04, 04:18
This all sounds damn good :) if only people had the attention to implement this into the game, ah well.. i guess £6 a month just is'nt enough anymore :P
UO does have a kick ass vendor system, and NC should really take some hints from it, being a newer game and all. ;)