H-C / PSI Eyes

[naimex]

as many of you know.. a LOT of people have been asking about these babies for ages..

so just want statistics to show it.. maybe that will speed up the process..


So plz vote here if you want/mind that Tanks get heavy combat eyes, and monks get psi eyes.. AFAIK these are the only 2 types of eyes that simply DOES NOT EXIST..

[Rizzy]

I think its a good idea

[Serpent]

nonononono they are uberpowered then :D ok make it for tanks but not for monkehs

[Mumblyfish]

Because, as we all know, something that gave us a measly +5/10/15 PSI Use would make us unstoppable :rolleyes:

[Phiberdelic]

I can see Pistol/Rifle/Drone eyes as they have to have eyes for more aim/control/focus, but I'm not sure about having eyes for PSI and HC...how will an Eye help out PSI when that comes from the mind or HC when that is about a tanks strength, I just can't see Heavy Combat coming from an eyeball can You?

So I voted NOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....

[VetteroX]

Tanks have a spine that gives 15 hc, nobody else has a spine that boosts combat. A tank has over 200 hc with ease, any spies or pes have over 200 rc/pc? no? ok then.

And monks are powerful enough, and eyes wouldnt give psi...

Hurry up and get a glove out that gives psi use, then its all fine.

[Mumblyfish]

IRT Phib... Simple:

A H-C eye helps a tank improve his aiming due to targeting computers, and increases his efficiency (damage output) because of monitors in the eye which link directly to the weapon, allowing the GenTank to use said weapon to maximum effect.

A +PSU eye would be possible because it increases the monk's perceptions. Developed by Yakarma, the PSI Combat Eye would take advantage of the user's natural psionic abilities to pick up auras given off by nearby living creatures, allowing the monk to attack or heal the target with enhanced efficiency. Also, the combateye would link directly to the Crahn PSI-Gauntlet, automating some of the tasks a PSI Monk would have to do manually through the use of targeting and manipulation processors. This means less effort on the monk's part for quicker casts. Also, due to the automated nature of the gauntlet post-linkup with the combateye, range would increase due to the increased precision of the glove.

[Shadow Dancer]

lol Mumbly don't bother, people will use any excuse to say no.



Anyways, I voted yes.

[Mumblyfish]

Hell, at least I give valid reasons for a "yes".

How's about the naysayers do the same?

[StryfeX]

Originally posted by Phiberdelic
I can see Pistol/Rifle/Drone eyes as they have to have eyes for more aim/control/focus, but I'm not sure about having eyes for PSI and HC...how will an Eye help out PSI when that comes from the mind or HC when that is about a tanks strength, I just can't see Heavy Combat coming from an eyeball can You?

So I voted NOOOOOOOOOOOOO..... Pfft. How can you get Rifle Combat from an eye then? All it does (theoretically) is calculate where to aim (target leading) as well as what variables to take into effect like wind, tempurature, etc. It makes you better at using them. if you're against Heavy Combat eyes, then you're also against Rifle and Pistol eyes, as well.


Originally posted by VetteroX
Tanks have a spine that gives 15 hc, nobody else has a spine that boosts combat. A tank has over 200 hc with ease, any spies or pes have over 200 rc/pc? no? ok then.A even with all that, can said GenTank fully cap his weapons? (even the TL 105 CS) No. Your argument holds no water.

--Stryfe

[naimex]

Originally posted by Phiberdelic
I can see Pistol/Rifle/Drone eyes as they have to have eyes for more aim/control/focus, but I'm not sure about having eyes for PSI and HC...how will an Eye help out PSI when that comes from the mind or HC when that is about a tanks strength, I just can't see Heavy Combat coming from an eyeball can You?

So I voted NOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....


Well... let me just think about something to say to this =/ not easy ^^

Thinking :
*
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***
FATAL READ ERROR
Thinking :
*
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***
=***= Completed Succesfully

Ok.. here goes..

Weapon Lore : (which is given by the majority (if not all) of the eyes) gives more dmg/aim/range to all "regular" weapons.. this even the tank can benefit from in same way as pistol/rifle users can.

Heavy Combat : (not yet given by any eye) this is just another subskill as all others that affect ALL aspects of the tanks weaponry

Heavy Damage: 0.8(80%) HC + 0.2(20%) WPL

Heavy Frequency: 0.5(50%) HC + 0.2(20%) WPL + 0.3(30%) STR

Heavy Handling: 0.4(40%) HC + 0.2(20%) WPL + 0.4(40%) STR

Heavy Range: 0.3(30%) HC + 0.2(20%) WPL
if we compare these ::

Meele Damage: 0.7(70%) MC + 0.1(10%) STR

Meele Aiming: 0.2(20%) MC + 0.3(30%) AGL

Meele Handling: 0.3(30%) MC + 0.3(30%) AGL


Pistol Damage: 0.7(70%) PC + 0.2(20%) WPL

Pistol Aiming: 0.4(40%) PC + 0.6(60%) WPL

Pistol Frequency: 0.5(50%) PC + 0.3(30%) DEX

Pistol Handling: 0.5(50%) PC + 0.3(30%) DEX

Pistol Range: 0.25(25%) PC + 0.25(25%) WPL


Rifle Damage: 0.7(70%) RC + 0.2(20%) WPL

Rifle Aiming: 0.4(40%) RC + 0.6(60%) WPL

Rifle Frequency: 0.5(50%) RC + 0.4(40%) DEX

Rifle Handling: 0.4(40%) RC + 0.3(30%) DEX + 0.2(20%) STR

Rifle Range: 0.3(30%) RC + 0.5(50%) WPL

you will notice that EVERY weapon subskill gives amongst other things :: more damage..

when a rifle does more damage because its user has an eye in.. and a pistol also does more damage.. even melee gives more damage.. as per your post ::
HC when that is about a tanks strength, I just can't see Heavy Combat coming from an eyeball can You?

can you see rifles damage or pistols damage should be having an effect from eyes ??

so basically how i read it, what you are saying is that all weapon skills should be removed from eyes. thus removing the entire purpose of eyes inside the game.

but then if we think about the "fair balance" inside the game then you will notice that again there is a brain implant for practically everything.. but as the only one.. heavy combat is the only weapon skill that does NOT have an implant of its own.. as the zerker chip gives to melee there should be an imp that is to be the hc counterpart to mc. as melee users gain a few extra points above the heavy tank from the zerker.. so I can see your point in that these skills dont really belong to "eyes" but since they do.. dont you deep inside really think.. its only fair that a hc eye / hc standalone chip is implemented as seeing that everyother type has this.. and therefore i have to say i far from agree in your POW unless this is removed from all other eyes aswell. ^^

[naimex]

Originally posted by VetteroX
Tanks have a spine that gives 15 hc, nobody else has a spine that boosts combat. A tank has over 200 hc with ease, any spies or pes have over 200 rc/pc? no? ok then.

And monks are powerful enough, and eyes wouldnt give psi...

Hurry up and get a glove out that gives psi use, then its all fine.


note taken.. hadn´t even noticed the hardened backbone gave H-C..

that equals out for the missing hc brain imp.. but still the eye is a lack..

[Phiberdelic]

Originally posted by Mumblyfish
Hell, at least I give valid reasons for a "yes".

How's about the naysayers do the same?

hey...I did give a reason as to why I said no...and now reading your response I can see at least the PSI, however I still can't imagine an Eye implant that adds Heavy Combat, weapon lore yes since that is for aiming. So with that being said, I'd like to change my vote from No to Only PSI

[]v[ortice]

Can the TANK eyes give WEP too?

Tanks need WEP :)

[Jest]

I voted yes but after reading peoples posts I was convinced that there shouldn't be a Psi Eye. Mumbly I think you are stretching it with that "natural aura" stuff haha.

[StryfeX]

Originally posted by Phiberdelic
hey...I did give a reason as to why I said no...and now reading your response I can see at least the PSI, however I still can't imagine an Eye implant that adds Heavy Combat, weapon lore yes since that is for aiming. So with that being said, I'd like to change my vote from No to Only PSI Heavy combat isn't the strength to wield the weapon, it's the skill with which said weapon is wielded. For all the reasons mumbly stated, there should be a HC eye. If you're against a HC eye, you're essentially saying that you're against rifle and pistols eyes, too. o_O

Also, with that argument, melee weapon eyes shouldn't be ingame either. :rolleyes:

--Stryfe

[g0rt]

Only seems fair that there be a H-C eye and a PSI eye of some sort.

[Cruzbroker]

Then tanks could put some points to force resist etc. good points made, yes for that.

PSI, +1 +2 +3 eyes (nothing else, like memory chip), then Monks could use PA4 like every other class, yes for that.

APUs cap their spells anyway ;)

[kujikiri]

after reading all these reasons why a psi eye or a HC eye would not work then I have to vote to remove the melee eye. I mean, I can't imagine swinging a sword with ur eye, or even a targeting type eye that would help you hit what is right in front of you.

I think the real point is that the eye slot for a monk or a HC tank is pretty much not used and you know how we gamers are about a slot we have nothing useful in:)

[Mumblyfish]

Originally posted by Jest
I voted yes but after reading peoples posts I was convinced that there shouldn't be a Psi Eye. Mumbly I think you are stretching it with that "natural aura" stuff haha.

What's so wrong with that idea? If monks can make people's heads explode, after a short bout of hovering, may I add... they can definately use their senses to detect things before they are seen.

[Strych9]

Continually saying "if you are against x, that means you are against y" doesnt really answer anything.

If your only argument StryfeX is that because it exists for one type of weapon, it should exist for all, it doesnt take a genius to see how THAT line of reasoning could quickly ruin this game.

"Poison mods exist for flamers so they should exist for every other weapon in the game. If you are against poison mods on 5.56 rifle rounds, you are against poison mods on flamers."

"Gamma mods should exist for spells. If you are against adding x-ray damage to a fire barrel spell, you are against having x-ray damage on a CS."

Etc.

Now, once we are willing to move beyond the one line comebacks and actually look at what people are saying...

If this is ONLY about 'all things equal' then there are a lot of other things we would need to add- a HC eye wouldnt solve that problem. For example- a construction backbone, since we have a research one. But having all things equal would remove the need for choices really. It makes sense that some things have options that others dont- research has a backbone as does heavy combat, but construction and rifles do not have their own backbones. Heck, where the hell is my barter eye????? I have high barter, I should know how to spot a good deal... :p

Is this about being able to cap weapons? No, I dont think that holds up, in that we should look at respective damage done by players using weapons, rather than comparing the %s of those weapons. Does the CS suck in PvP as compared to a Wyatt Earp because the Earp can be capped but the CS cannot?

So I say look to a somewhat logical reason for it- weapon lore sure, I can see that in an eye. Regardless of RC or PC, how do you explain how an eye implant increases Heavy Combat skill? A strength based skill? (And yes, I agree Melee eyes dont make sense). Its hard to be dexterous without sight, and its hard to aim a gun without sight, but you can easily become strong without sight.

Using the same reasoning, the heavy combat backbone makes sense- we can see how a reinforced backbone could make you stronger and thus make you more capable of using heavy weapons, while a backbone wouldnt really make you any more skilled at rifle useage.

Also using the same reasoning, I dont understand how an eye (Smart Cybereye) can take AWAY HC skill.

So I guess to me its like this- if we admit that HC is a skill that can be affected AT ALL by an eye implant, as per the Smart Cyberye, then yes, there should be a HC eye. (Still no to the Psi Eye, since I am not sure what that would help since Psi doesnt take aim anyway). But otherwise, there should be no MC/HC eye and no other eye should take away from MC/HC. That would allow tanks to get the WPL boost they want without taking a penalty.

[Mirco]

Yes make a H-C eye for me. Im a H-C PE and really need it. Make sure it aint higher requirement than ohh lets say str 81. Thats as far as I can get without drugs.

[StryfeX]

Ok... Let's say that each weapon class eye has it's own set of data (stored onboard!) regarding how each weapon in that class performs (as well as generic characteristics). It has data on how the projectile/energy stream travels, ballistic arc, recoil generated, etc. It also has data and can compute data on how the current environs and weather can/will effect the flight patch of said projectile/energy stream (not so much on energy streams for flight path, obviously). They eye interfaces with the weapon to monitor such things as barrel heat and excess recoil via some sort of neural link.

The eye then calculates *all* that info and feeds it directly into the brain, where it is processed and the user can make his shots more accurate, aim faster, reduce recoil, know how much to lead his target (not ingame, but theoretically) due to wind and weather affecting the flight path. All this means that he is specialized in that particular weapon class and therefore simply wouldn't know how to use other weapon classes as well, especially because the data sets would be different for each weapon class, so if you tried to use a pistol while using a heavy combat eye, you would be fed incorrect data and hence miss more shots, not aim as fast, and have a harder time dealing with recoil.

Yes, I have too much time on my hands. Deal with it. (TM) :p

--Stryfe

St00pid spelling and grammar.

[Spoon]

"And for the Tanks......nothing."







(only Dune fans will understand that line)

[extract]

Originally posted by Phiberdelic
I can see Pistol/Rifle/Drone eyes as they have to have eyes for more aim/control/focus, but I'm not sure about having eyes for PSI and HC...how will an Eye help out PSI when that comes from the mind or HC when that is about a tanks strength, I just can't see Heavy Combat coming from an eyeball can You?

So I voted NOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....


I cant see a brain implant giving heavy combat either....

nor can i realistically beielve that someone has the power to summon a lighting bolt out of the sky into someones head

most things in this game arent realistic......whats the addition of other things gonna hurt



I vote yes please

[L0KI]

im with u on this one naimex... ;)

[Oath]

heavy combaty tanks are the most shitly kitted out class ingame.

they have 1 non-rare imp to boost heavy.

they need a spread of them its only fair.

monks also need eyes/spines, cs right now theres nothing.

[Scikar]

Originally posted by VetteroX
Tanks have a spine that gives 15 hc, nobody else has a spine that boosts combat. A tank has over 200 hc with ease, any spies or pes have over 200 rc/pc? no? ok then.

And monks are powerful enough, and eyes wouldnt give psi...

Hurry up and get a glove out that gives psi use, then its all fine.


No, the spine gives only +8 HC, and it takes away agility unlike the reflex boosters for spies and PEs, which give you +15 AGL, and your choicee of +5 ATH or +8 END.

[Parappa]

I would be more than happy with weaponlore eyes. Something along the lines of +15/+20/+25.
Dex requirment but low so that highest takes about 60 dex. Pleaaase, pretty pleaase :angel:

[Heavyporker]

We've been over eyes for PSIs before.

Realistically, for PSIs, eyes should give + Mental Steadiness (a req) - no problem since pretty much every other eye gives +tech combat/weapon lore. Now, a + to PSI level seems a bit suspect, but wouldn't be THAT bad since smart-cybereye gives +INT. +Psi Use on the eyes wouldn't be bad either. I'm all for PSI eyes, buyable only from the Crahn Church in the OZ.

Now, Heavy Combat eyes - I'm for them. You got melee-combat eyes, rifle eyes, pistol eyes. No reason not to put heavy weapon eyes in. +H-C and WeaponLore.

I'd orgasm if I ever saw Barter Eyes. They'd have magnifer lens, low intensity finescan tunneling radar, and perhaps a laser matrix scanner too - all this to analyze objects in front of you, the info would let you know how much to charge for the stuff. (laser matrix scanner - uses principles of holography to scan surfaces for interference patterns that tells you info about the condition of the object' surface. They use it to scan road surfaces to see if they need repair or something nowadays. )

Barter Eyes would have to give +BRT and + INT. Should, however, be - to combatskills PC, RC, MC, and HC. Pretty much a tradeskiller only thing.

[Jest]

Originally posted by Heavyporker
We've been over eyes for PSIs before.

Realistically, for PSIs, eyes should give + Mental Steadiness (a req) - no problem since pretty much every other eye gives +tech combat/weapon lore. Now, a + to PSI level seems a bit suspect, but wouldn't be THAT bad since smart-cybereye gives +INT. +Psi Use on the eyes wouldn't be bad either. I'm all for PSI eyes, buyable only from the Crahn Church in the OZ.

Now, Heavy Combat eyes - I'm for them. You got melee-combat eyes, rifle eyes, pistol eyes. No reason not to put heavy weapon eyes in. +H-C and WeaponLore.

I'd orgasm if I ever saw Barter Eyes. They'd have magnifer lens, low intensity finescan tunneling radar, and perhaps a laser matrix scanner too - all this to analyze objects in front of you, the info would let you know how much to charge for the stuff. (laser matrix scanner - uses principles of holography to scan surfaces for interference patterns that tells you info about the condition of the object' surface. They use it to scan road surfaces to see if they need repair or something nowadays. )

Barter Eyes would have to give +BRT and + INT. Should, however, be - to combatskills PC, RC, MC, and HC. Pretty much a tradeskiller only thing. Yah I don't see where peoples problem is in not having a heavy eye. There is absolutely no difference between heavy, rifle, and pistol.

I also liked the idea about a Psi eye giving something like mental steadiness. That makes sense to me, but making an eye that give likes PPU or APU would just be absurd imo.

As for the barter eye that would definitely be cool, in fact any tradeskill eyes would be cool. :)

[Lanigav]

Tradeskilling eyes would really make my day.

I'm all for HC combat eyes too, and PSI eyes that add PSI use and PSI power, but not APU or PPU.

[solling]

well i think tank couls use a lil help so give em a HC eye i would not really mind but jonestly i dont think psis really need to be any more powerfull

[Shadow Dancer]

Solling try thinking about solo apus needing a PSI eye :p.


Anyways, I think the PSI eye should give psi power.

[Spoon]

*cough*PSI Use*cough*

[Cruzbroker]

Psi eye, psi power or mst and psi or advanced nerves for psi

[naimex]

i really like this.. a lot of interesting ideas are being thrown in on how to make these eyes realistic...

however on the recent ideas on the psi eye i read i would like to say Psi Use and mental steadiness to be the most realistic.. since if you try looking for some time at a square wall with smaller squares inside even smaller squares and so on.. then your eyes will get confused, start to burn and cry.. this however if an eye could theoretically filter out the disturbing similar ongoing pattern then the amount of mental activity needed to focus on it would become less hence giving mental steadiness.. and since we are talking about a psi eye.. then psi use.. with a focused mind the use of the psi art will by no doubt be enhanced as a continual reaction to now more stable brain. (sort of in same way willpower would in reality give better results in construction and other tradeskills, as a person without the ability to wait for everything to fall into place will not make as fine a product as one with the will to make it perfect.. if you catch my drift..)

so I really like the PSU / MST enhancements to a future psi eye

[LVirus]

w0rd!

Please Callash, design these (Put some nice little mission, because we know you just love those stuff to piss.. err praise people :confused: )

5 stars!