Warning: Monk Thread

[Marzola]

Why should one character, PPU monks, be able to out heal all damage done to him? What's the point in fighting? And then when they get in combination with an APU monk the two of them have the best defense and the best offense, and the APU monk doesn't even have to worry that much about the PPU monk, since the PPU himself doesn't get a scratch when he has a holy heal on. Right now the team with the most monks wins. Why bother fighting an OP war if the team with the most monks win? you might as well just meet at the OP, Count the number of monks you have, and the team with more monks gets the OP. Fighting as a class other than a monk has become pointless unless you just duel.

APU's are unbalanced because they have extreme offense that no one really should have, and no defense.

PPU's are unbalanced because they have extreme defense and a lack of offense.

Right now Tanks and PE's are very close to balance (right now all I have a problem with is RoLH doing a lot more damage than I think it should and tanks AoE not beign very effective in PvP, but that's for another thread). So, if PE's and Tanks are balanced, why not make the entire monk class equal to them? A way to do that? well one could be removing the entire PPU subclass and giving APU's more defense while lowering their offense. Or, they could make monks Hybrids. I know it's been said time, and time again. And i'm going to say it again. Make monks hybrids. Either remove the holy level spells or make them be as effective as current blessed spells (also make it impossible to heal while fighting so monks can't use a blessed heal during the middle of combat and get back up to full health). Also maybe make it so the only spells that can be casted on other characters is heals and rezurects and the non-resist boosters (spy, pistol boost, ets). Some spells may need to be removed as well to keep them balanced. This will make the monk class for the people who prefer solo hinting, and make them balanced in PvP. I know that KK intended to have monks be pures, but that isn't working too well, now is it?Make monks Hybrids.

If KK has something planned for Monks, please, say so. It would save us from puting up ideas that you don't need, and make a lot of us happier and quite possibly keep people from leaving the game due to the monk inbalence.





Or you could just nerf PPU's into oblivion, which works for me too. But I think hybrids will make more people happy than a massive nerf.

[Jest]

Haha Marz you must really hate monks you make a thread like this, like once a week.

Oh and trust me, a PE has to make a lot of sacrifices to use the RoLH. I just switched back to BS/Libby.

[40$Poser]

seriously, if there's no ppus around, how do you expect to go to mc5 and actually live to get parts? I got a suggestion for KK to nerf complainers.

[g0rt]

*********************
PPUS MUST BE CHANGED
*********************

Yes..its a fact. The healer class SHOULD NOT, and CAN NOT be invulnerable in a *BALANCED* game.

We should have a game of HYBRIDS, balanced. Something KK doesnt know how to do. First they make hybrids INSANELY uber and unbeatable, and then they hit them so fucking hard with the nerf bat that they get a home run. HURAWW! Now hybrids aren't even viable.

KK's moto - One extreme to the other©

Parashock should be removed from the game, heals should be reduced and hybrids should be viable.

APUs are fine if they want to be weak as shit they can go ahead and have power, thats a tradeoff but with holy heal the way it is its unbalanced.

My 2cents



Originally posted by 40$Poser
seriously, if there's no ppus around, how do you expect to go to mc5 and actually live to get parts? I got a suggestion for KK to nerf complainers.

Omfg a challange. Thats right maybe mobs will actualy be tough to fight.

As it is, a level 40 can solo a level 120. Yes, a level 40 character can solo a level 120 mob. And it AINT HARD.

That sux. We need some challanges, mc5 would actually be tough without PPUs,....and need a group to take. Not just zone in and out stacking a few fire apocs on the commanders head wow so tough.

[Nixon]

Originally posted by g0rt
That sux. We need some challanges, mc5 would actually be tough without PPUs,....and need a group to take. Not just zone in and out stacking a few fire apocs on the commanders head wow so tough.

I'd really like to see you and your jolly group of tanks, pe's and
apus (spies too? you want a challenge so why not?) go in mc5
and pawn the base commander. Pfft..

Btw is duping for example, a tactic?

[QuantumDelta]

Originally posted by Jest
Haha Marz you must really hate monks you make a thread like this, like once a week.

Oh and trust me, a PE has to make a lot of sacrifices to use the RoLH. I just switched back to BS/Libby.

Correct.
I did the same

[Scikar]

Originally posted by 40$Poser
seriously, if there's no ppus around, how do you expect to go to mc5 and actually live to get parts? I got a suggestion for KK to nerf complainers.


Easy. If we nerf PPUs, KK will set the mobs back to their pre-PPU damage and health levels, and 120/120 mobs won't mean instant death and stupid time to kill them any more.

[Shadow Dancer]

Originally posted by Jest
Haha Marz you must really hate monks you make a thread like this, like once a week.




:confused:

I don't recall Marz making one thread a week.



I agree overall with Marz, except for his thoughts on apus.


Marz just a question for you, do you really think APUS are all that bad or unbalanced WITHOUT a ppu?


I remmeber my apu fighting some of the best tanks on the server, sometimes I won, sometimes they won. Or in the case of Smokey, we both died. LoL

But I didn't see any "grand" imbalance with the apu.



I think because apu is a monk, and since people often group them with ppus, their flaws go under a magnifying glass.


Originally posted by Marzola
know that KK intended to have monks be pures, but that isn't working too well, now is it?


Doesnt' mean it CAN'T work.

EDIT: Yes I think KK making an official statement about the "problem" would help. They could tell us what they plan to do, if their planning something, or if they don't think it's a problem at all. But the point is, they should SAY something.

[Jest]

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
:confused:

I don't recall Marz making one thread a week.

Ooo yah your right the last couple I was thinking about were by ZoneVortex haha.

[Mirco]

About the ROLH. Maybe it is overpowered in the hands of a PE, I wouldn`t know, but as a spyweapon it has to be powerfull if pistol spies are to be of any use. Doing the most damage over time is not an option for a pistol spy cause we dont last long enough. Pistolspies need to hit hard and fast. I hope they dont do anything to the Rolh.

[QuantumDelta]

Up it's DEX to 110, that'll fuck a lot of PEs.

[Shadow Dancer]

I STILL don't see the big deal about ray pistols.


:confused:

[Zokk]

Blah... just forget it. They're either not listening, or they don't care.

[Doc Holliday]

gort show me a level 40 runner any class who can solo a grim. without a ppu. thats what solo means. u make it sound like a ppu glued to your ass while soloing. thats not soloing. thats point click

[Marzola]

I'm probably wrong about the ROLH. The PE i was fighting earlier probably had PPU buffs or something.

I guess my statement about the APU was kinda vague. I don't even remember what I was trying to say anymore:p . Forget that whole statement about APU's.

I'm mostly fed up with PPU's. And for places like MC5, maybe they can tone it down so people can go there still? They have changed how hard the mobs are in the past, so i'm sure they can do it again. Or they can find a way to make monks be pure but not be overpowering. *thinks of holy heal nerf* hmm...Maybe all KK needs to do is nerf the Holy Heal now that I think about it. I just don't want ANYONE to be able to completley out heal damage done to them by even ONE person. For the people who are bound to say "use teamwork to take down a PPU" How about nerf the holy heal and make it take team work to keep a PPU alive.

I'm just really sick and tired of monk-o-cron. Theres really no point in going to an OP war as a Tank anymore because a APU/PPU combo will beat the Tank/PPU combo anyway due to them having the one tool needed to take down a PPU. Anyway, I need sleep. Sorry if anything doesn't make sence or if I sound like and idiot. Sleep depravation does that.

[KimmyG]

Originally posted by Nixon
I'd really like to see you and your jolly group of tanks, pe's and
apus (spies too? you want a challenge so why not?) go in mc5
and pawn the base commander. Pfft..

Btw is duping for example, a tactic?

Feild of death a true challendge

something like this?

http://www.brimstone.com/~jasona/DAoC/dragon/dragon_post_5.jpg


With PPU mc5 can be down with 1 apu 1 PPU and if you have 2 PPU it is an absolute joke. Best mob in the game a laughin matter real fun. The only hard part about mc-5 is making an appointment to get there and in my opinion that is rediculos.

PPU are way overpowered.

[JackScratch]

Marzola, what are you thinking. You are complaining because these classes are exactly what they are supposed to be. You know what, youre right, I wouldnt take it anymore. It's unfair, and you shouldn't have to stand for it. You aught to show them and just quit playing the game all together, then they would see, they would see that they were unfair and change the game for you. Just wait, and dont renew your account, I bet they will send you and email or something when they get it changed. Now don't give in and come back before they have it changed, that would be weak, no, stick to youre guns, wait em out. They'll change it, you'll see.

[KimmyG]

Originally posted by JackScratch
M You aught to show them and just quit playing the game all together, then they would see, they would see that they were unfair and change the game for you.

One to many have taken this stance not to good in my opinion.


As for it being there job no other support healer group is ever been an iron curtain. MOst healers are no the strongest in the game they ushally need protection for the assuallt players.

[JackScratch]

So, because every other game does it a particular way, then KK should just follow suit, hell save some time and just use the same code, why bother writeing new programs, slap a new cover art on the box and youre good to go , right? The way it is, is completely fair, the only thing that needs to be changed is the Spy, and I say they would be pretty well fixed just by fixing the clipping plane problem. Fact is, you and the others just want someone to solve your lack of abilities. The game is balanced, or very close. In a 2 on 2 fight APU/PPU against any other pair (baring spies) you have pretty close to even odds, and yes a stalemate is even odds. If you don't like the way the game is, you are corduly invited to go play another one.

[-=Blasehase=-]

Originally posted by QuantumDelta
Up it's DEX to 110, that'll fuck a lot of PEs. ´

this wouldnt change anything for my PE ;)

i use the slasher right now and it ROCKS...

same dmg like a liberator with higher frequency [i got it @ 420/min... and its just a 1slot with crap freq... the next we build is MINE hrhr] and a better hitrate in full run

and if i die [IF] u must kill my slasher too cause it doesnt stop shooting:D

i luv it

luv it luv it luv it luv it luv it :D :D :D

[Darken]

Marzola

Apus should be the dmg dealer and do more dmg than everyone else
but their very weak
PPus should be very strong but they cant dmg someone
and if u die due a parabolt ur just bad.

I hate all u ppl flaming about monks

omg omg CS is overpowered blab lab bal !1!!11oneone

[Kal]

if it was down to me this is what i would do (and i've played every character class to some extent)

1. nerf down holy heal to blessed heal level and add a new mid-level heal instead of blessed, leaving the low level heal as it is.

2. remove ALL para related objects from the game (freezers, spells etc) no one class can whine then.

3. give spys a rez tool, (advanced medikit for example) that has a limit of uses and can be used on other players to resurect or on themselves as a higher level medkit (so it would kinda work like bandages in uo)there would have to be a spy restriction on this, PEs having it would be ridiculus.

also i would NOT make all monks like hybrids, that would screw sooo many people and dumb the game down by a factor of 10.

(sarcasm)then again, why not just add wandering healers who rez you for free and a safe land where you cant be pked........(/sarcasm)

.....if it was down to me......

EDIT
i used to hate all monks with a passion, now i've played both i realise its just ppus who need work
NOTE: not just ppus but other classes (especially spys) in more minor ways to make it not quite so necessary to have ppus in the team

[KimmyG]

Originally posted by JackScratch
So, because every other game does it a particular way, then KK should just follow suit, hell save some time and just use the same code, why bother writeing new programs, slap a new cover art on the box and youre good to go , right? The way it is, is completely fair, the only thing that needs to be changed is the Spy, and I say they would be pretty well fixed just by fixing the clipping plane problem. Fact is, you and the others just want someone to solve your lack of abilities. The game is balanced, or very close. In a 2 on 2 fight APU/PPU against any other pair (baring spies) you have pretty close to even odds, and yes a stalemate is even odds. If you don't like the way the game is, you are corduly invited to go play another one.


What are you defective just cause those aggy cellar low ppus go down doesn't mean the high one do.

When you get a very good capped PPU they are near immortal im talking

Polarity
Gestra
Harvey Birdman
and so on

APU/PPU vs. 2 other non spy team they is just ignorant they got a good ppu and you dont your done. Hell and if they dont got a ppu on the other side that APU will have a field day with that team.


Even with anti-buff a PPU will still have near tank resist and over 400hp and with a Holy heal on that gives them ample time to rebuff. Only sure way to drop a high PPU is debuff-buff with shit shelter and hammer away.

[Original monk]

is this ppu whining ever gonna stop ? dont think so, put a sticky back up :P

[Marzola]

@Jack: I'm just throwing ideas arround. Fuck off. I have no intention of leaving this game.

I was sugjesting that a way to balance monks is to have them no longer be 2 different subclasses and give all monks an offense and a defense.

What I was trying to say about APU monks came over the wrong way. My entire IDEA seemed to come across the wrong way. I am sorry. Just forget what I said about APU monks. APU monks ARE balanced 1:1 with no PPU monk. I was just sugesting a new way of balance.

How can you say that one class being able to stay alive despite 5-8 people shooting him be balanced? Yea he has no offense, but he can resurect people while not being able to get killed which indirectly give him an offense. A team with just ONE PPU decent PPU monk can beat a team with no PPU monk that is much larger than the team with the PPU monk. PPU monks make it so that people don't have to put any effort into having a con setup as long as the person has a PPU monk on his ass all day and can say "haz or heat, S/D, Heal". A PPU monk also makes it so a person doesn't even know how to aim with Holy Paralysis. Just cast Holy Para and you can kill the person with little or no thought about losing a target lock while the other person can't evade, or even turn to fire his weapon at someone with out moving his mouse all the way across the desk. A PPU monk with catharsis sanctum is also unaffected by parashock. And with antipoison sanctum is immune to poison damage. Why should one subclass be able to do all that?

@ all the PPU monks: I'm sorry that I even dare sugest your class should even be toutched . But it needs to be done. there IS an imbalence with PPU monks. You may denie it, but it's there. Think of all the things your character can do and what the other classes can do against you. Yes there is holy antibuff that takes off your shields. But with the higer cast rates of shelter and deflector, a PPU monk can buff back up a lot faster than people can do damage or debuff again. And the other classes can't do a single thing to a PPU monk except wait untill a PPU monk messes up or lags out and wait for his shields to go out. If I start shooting a PPU, very often the PPU says "Why bother? You'll never kill me".

@ Origional: Maybe having a sticky back up would be a good thing. Maybe that will get the attention of the devs so they will know that there is an inbalence.

[Seezur001]

Im tired of people complaining about this crap, its not as bad as you guys make it to be. I have not died to a single PPU, ever. If you have you need to learn how to be prepared, bring antishock drugs and medkits. Hell a fucking medkit can almost out heal the damage a PPU does.

In a team its a different story, ill give you that, but maybee you should get a PPU to roll with you. They are support characters, they are just playing their roll in the game.

And instead of nerfing one class, why not boost the others, Drones NEED fixing, tanks need a boost in weapons and equipment, PEs seem ok to me but i dont play one so i really wouldnt know.

Its funny to me really cause all the people who complain make the PPU comunity actually feel invincible. I had a /37 PPU attack my /50 apu for no good reason, needles to say he died, so has every other PPU who has attacked me solo.

PPUs are not overpowered, they might need tweaking, but godlike they are not. Maybee you just need to learn every class has a weakness, learn it and use it.

[KimmyG]

Originally posted by Seezur001
Im tired of people complaining about this crap, its not as bad as you guys make it to be. I have not died to a single PPU, ever. If you have you need to learn how to be prepared, bring antishock drugs and medkits. Hell a fucking medkit can almost out heal the damage a PPU does.

PPUs are not overpowered, they might need tweaking, but godlike they are not. Maybee you just need to learn every class has a weakness, learn it and use it.

What weakness? What is the grand PPU weakness?

PPU's cant kill shit thats not the point the point is there annoyance factor and the fact that a team with a PPU is 50x better than a team with out.

[g0rt]

Originally posted by Nixon
I'd really like to see you and your jolly group of tanks, pe's and
apus (spies too? you want a challenge so why not?) go in mc5
and pawn the base commander. Pfft..

Btw is duping for example, a tactic?

Yes, a group of tanks, pes, apus and spies could do mc5 with toned down PPUs if there were enough of them....quite easy.

The mobs in this game are a joke. Plain and simple, a joke. The hardest shit in the game can be beaten easily with 2 players.

Btw my sig doesn't refer to duping, if you can't figure that out you need a lesson in common sense.

[JackScratch]

Marzola, I attacked a runner continuasly with 5 other PPUs, all of us useing Holy heal, and that runner just wouldn't go down. We attacked and attacked and attacked, and this was a spy. I think spies are overpowered. Spies need to be nerfed cause we couldnt Holy heal him to death. What do you think about that Marzola?

It's not my fault that dispite me telling you exactly how to kill a PPU you still don't know how. That's genetics, not game mechanics. You and your little friends inadiquicies aren't a good indicator of the problems with the game

[Artie]

Has anyone noticed the parashock beam look like big starry blue nuts with a little blue dick in the middle? I mean, honestly. It's like the gh3y spell.....o_O


'OMG I R KILL DAT PE!!! *whips out penis spell* hawr hawr! I R SLOWING YOU DOWN WITH MY BLUE BALLS OF DOOM! HAWR HAWR!"

....just thought i'd say that ^_^ :angel:

[Viduus[JBX]]

Originally posted by Doc Holliday
gort show me a level 40 runner any class who can solo a grim. without a ppu. thats what solo means. u make it sound like a ppu glued to your ass while soloing. thats not soloing. thats point click

@ lvl 39/43 I solod a grim with my APU... MIND YOU, i had awesome cover. I died 4 times trying to repeat the task.

[JackScratch]

If your concern is that the mobs being hunted in groups (PPU or no) are too easy, fear not, there are mobs that are murder, PPU or not. If you think those grims are too simple, head to MC5, and there is always point red and Sherman bay. If those are too easy for you, then I think it's time you found another game, you are screwing the bell curve.

[KRIMINAL99]

Originally posted by 40$Poser
seriously, if there's no ppus around, how do you expect to go to mc5 and actually live to get parts? I got a suggestion for KK to nerf complainers.

Oh thats brilliant... How about changing MC5 damage to match the PPU's new level...

I agree that the healer class should not be near invincible in any balanced game..