View Full Version : Pluto Proposition
I believe this may be locked, but I wanted a public community notice so that the thread will be seen. It's to be taken seriously from a mostly-RP point of view so please answer maturely and without flame (if possible :p)
*sigh* last ditch efforts...
TG, mainly FF, please go here:
Balancing our own world! (http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?s=&threadid=80490)
-- Edit --
Oops, forgot to post the link, hehe.
Pluto is only dying because we can't even balance our own world :( There's a certainl level of responsibility and maturity that we have to execute for ourselves to keep our own servers alive!
pluto=dead, I have an almost capped PE there - and find it a boring server, much more prefer Uranus, and that's where I play ;)
oh yeah i really enjoy uranus, like the time i decided to log into my capped tank, to have a chat with a friend, and got ganked by 10 Syn for politics i havent been a part of for 4 months, yeah that was great.
then getting rezkilled when i went in with my monk to ask why they killed me.
yeah uranus rocks.....:rolleyes:
if you get res killed its your own fault for not selecting a genrep:rolleyes:
QuantumDelta
30-10-03, 13:20
Uranus is fine, there's just one single clan with a problem....
Syntax-Error
30-10-03, 13:42
Im pluto though and though and yes i work on other servers too.
No i think while right now pluto it near death
ill leave u with this quote:
"The old tiger is always at is fiercest when i knows its end is near"
Well to be honest, I have not played on Pluto for a week now and I am not missing it one bit.
Mumblyfish
30-10-03, 14:51
Well, this is all well and good proposing to FF... but why don't we (SXR) change factions first? To show that we're dead serious about bringing Pluto back from the dead?
I wouldn't say no to Fallen Angels :angel:
Originally posted by Mumblyfish
I wouldn't say no to Fallen Angels :angel:
Yeah but they would probably say no to you :D
I think you got to look at the very inactive factions. FA have some active clans already, even if they are not PvP strong or have numbers.
Originally posted by Genty
Yeah but they would probably say no to you :D
I think you got to look at the very inactive factions. FA have some active clans already, even if they are not PvP strong or have numbers.
Yeah, I think Biotech or DRE would be better.
Vampire222
30-10-03, 15:13
yes yes fn, we love you too
Originally posted by Genty
Yeah but they would probably say no to you :D
I think you got to look at the very inactive factions. FA have some active clans already, even if they are not PvP strong or have numbers.
I blinked when it was suggested that SXR could change faction.
FA have one large tradeskill clan (No prizes for guessing who) and about 4 to 5 smaller more PvP clans, who are slowly growing in size. We lost 2 big clans a while back, when Dark and THSC left.
Anyway...to my point, what happened to NDA and System Shock, they seem to be very quiet these days, and it was often heard of NDA taking on a large TG clan in Op-wars.
Read the thread and replied to it.
IF SXR does change faction, what would it be? Black Dragons would be my vote. But then again, I can't vote on it ^^
// Wannabe
Vampire222
30-10-03, 16:47
yes, id say emptiest factions on pluto in this order:
1. N.E.X.T.
2. Biotech
3. Black dragon
4. Fallen angels
Rest is filled:
Cityadmin: sxr/nda
Tangent: SS, all sorts of others
mercs: BRTF
tsunami: Pimp
Crahn: Dark
TG: guess?
BD is full, if anyone moves we PK j00 :p
Originally posted by Brammers
Anyway...to my point, what happened to NDA and System Shock, they seem to be very quiet these days, and it was often heard of NDA taking on a large TG clan in Op-wars.
#1) CA NDA != TT NDA
#2) SS seems to log in a day a week to take back an OP or two, but otherwise have NAPs with all the enemy clans on Pluto.
Heavyporker
30-10-03, 16:55
NExT on pluto is NOT empty, not at all.
Now, DRE, THATs empty. Hell, even Protopharma!
Now, I won't say no to people coming into NExT's employ, but under no circumstances is NExT empty.
Yeha Mercs BRTF.. We keep losing members to FF strangly enough..
Simply because we cant Op war with such a large offence and 24 hour players, because we are mostly all European..
its just a case of join the winning team..:wtf:
What im basically saying FF have the abilty to hold the Ops because they always have members online:confused:
FirestarXL
30-10-03, 16:59
Originally posted by Ascention
Yeha Mercs BRTF.. We keep losing members to FF strangly enough..
Simply because we cant Op war with such a large offence and 24 hour players, because we are mostly all European..
its just a case of join the winning team..:wtf:
Yeah, same problem with CA - on the times that i've been on in the wee hours, there's been hardly anyone CA there. And of course any non european player who tries CA CM etc is going to be put off by the lack of company first of all - so there goes another one. Ho hum.
Lets see - No one wants to play the underdogs.
Thats why you find most people switching to the unnamed TG clan. They don't fight for the glory of fighting, if they did they would show up with similar numbers instead of bulk to do their 'crunk smash' routine.
This clan doesn't OP fight for fun - they OP fight to win.
As long as they own most of the map, you won't see it change in size, and even if you do get people to leave it - you'll still have people flocking to it to counteract those leaving. In my opinion; it's an act of futility.
The only way to win this particular battle is for the smaller groups to band together and fight the bigger threat - once it's eliminated they can go back to their small time battles.
Originally posted by Ascention
Yeha Mercs BRTF.. We keep losing members to FF strangly enough..
Not to bash or anything, but I think BRTF members are getting tired of the "hack 1 layer, run to another op. Rinse and repeat" that has been going on.
Heck, we're getting tired of it too :\
But I still think that the "If you can't beat them, join them" is the current stance on pluto.
// Wannabe
KidWithStick
30-10-03, 17:52
just because FF has so many members doesnt mean that they are all on at once...
look at PIMP, it still has hella members in it, but only like 1 logs on at a time.
even then, with the numbers FF has, only 10-15 would go to a OP fight, because theres going to be a certain amount of people who
a)dont want to fight
b)are busy doing sotmhing else
c)are AFK.
last night with the OP fights against dark, they outnumberd us that one time, not by much, but if we didnt have the ammount of people we did we wouldnt of been able to take down there 5 PPU's (no joke there)
just because most of the server has left the game, doesnt mean that FF should have to split there forces to provide balance. there are things called alliances that city clans can do you know...
and CM are suppose to be guns for hire, why couldnt you just get SXR, NDA, and BRTF to team up and attack FF?
if it has to come down to that then let it, becuase it isnt FF's fault.
Originally posted by KidWithStick
if it has to come down to that then let it, becuase it isnt FF's fault. as per one of the other threads ...
"None so blind as those that will not see."
theres a couple of problems here,
1, there arent enough people to flesh out factions. because there arent enough people to fill every faction people will join the largest faction / clan because of...
2, the stupid fucking genrep rules meaning you cant get anywhere if u r an enemy faction to the bg clan on the server
Delete late post:rolleyes:
Originally posted by icarium
2, the stupid fucking genrep rules meaning you cant get anywhere if u r an enemy faction to the bg clan on the server *That* is a very big factor that many people haven't mentioned yet.
It gets awfully frustrating not being able to GR anywhere unless you switch to the dominant flavour of the moment.
ecxately why we have CRP open as it is good hunting spot we had gaba open as well when we owned it
Originally posted by -FN-
#2) SS seems to log in a day a week to take back an OP or two, but otherwise have NAPs with all the enemy clans on Pluto.
not dark =p
FirestarXL
30-10-03, 20:23
Originally posted by KidWithStick
and CM are suppose to be guns for hire, why couldnt you just get SXR, NDA, and BRTF to team up and attack FF?
Oh please, you know how that would go down, I can still hear the echos of all the whining when NATO was tried.
Kid, you can't have alliances when the opposing TG clan *will remain nameless* bitches at you for having allies. I can't count the number of times I've heard it already. So, yesterday, we just sat there and got our asses kicked over and over, because we didn't want to listen to them bitch about us using allies. Sadly enough, they have HALF the server (114 members currently, which is usually more than half of Pluto's population) in their clan. How can you expect someone to NOT use allies to help?
Why are u ppl so simple PPl complain when u ppl bring more an more clans to fight us when the fight was even numbers in the first place. You ppl are starting to believe ur own lies. We dont have 30 ppl at op wars EVER.
Listen real carefully - (apart from ops that were ninjad off us) Lore looks at numbers of the clan holding the op - if they have too few to defend we never attack - funny that he is one of the only leaders who actually bothers with that. If however the clan then decides most members are going to log off suddenly after we attack -nothing much we can do.
@ nvidia yesterday it would have been a lil stupid looking to call allies when u outnumbered us anyway AND had 5 or so ppus to our 3.
Originally posted by ZigZag
Listen real carefully - (apart from ops that were ninjad off us) Lore looks at numbers of the clan holding the op - if they have too few to defend we never attack - funny that he is one of the only leaders who actually bothers with that. If however the clan then decides most members are going to log off suddenly after we attack -nothing much we can do.
Don't make "holier than though" replies to my thread. We have screenshots of how many FF and how many SXR are online when you take Tyron and the clock in the corner to prove the times. Your clan is just as guilty of 'ninja-hacking' OPs as every other clan on Pluto, including SXR, but as I said before, we made it public that Tyron is our ONLY core factory and will do whatever it it is necessary to take it back. FF has multiples of every OP, so please tell me what your validation is for taking OPs when you heavily outnumber the opposition. It's certainly not for the fight.
yes FN u just forget to mention u took it form us night before with with 10 + guys when we had 3 online so no when u do that we are not even gonna look at what numbers u have
I'm glad to see you bothered to read my post past the first 5 words where I explained that yes even we do it and WHY
:rolleyes:
so why is it u dont bitch at dark and SS witch have ( or used to have ) as many ops as we do now ? go now shoo
I smell off topic bickering ;)
Cas, your info says student. How old are you?
Everyone else in this thread can see I'm not flat out bitching but only bringing to light a few points. I'm starting to think it's not the members of FF that are inconsiderate and unreasonable, but it's leadership. If you want to have a serious conversation in game, mail me. Otherwise, don't talk to me until you open your eyes. The answers to your question is incredibly obvious.
And yes, can we please stay on topic. This thread is just to get everyone's attention to the RP forum :D
sorry OT: amfest PM or something with an email addy...
FN - so u justify the ninja with the fact that u have "claimed" tyron? You expect to take it when we have 3 online - and expect us to say - ok fair fight ? The first time u called ss I personally counted 26 of u - there were nowhere near that number of us - What am I failing to see here?
You are the ones coming to the forums to complain that we overwhelm u with numbers - I have stated - really clearly and Ill state it again - If u want to arrrange even number op wars - dm Lore. We have been waiting on u - if fair numbers is what you want - and we have agreed, what is the problem now?
edit/ Ill explain why our replies are relevant to ur RP thread. These are the facts: We did not do what gang did or what NATO did ie. take the entire map - we offer u even number fights - we go out of our way to make sure there will be enough defenders - we have tried to help, in the past, FA clans to hold ops and will do so in the future. See how the above pertains to balancing the server at all?
Synergy .. now there was a good clan.
SXR teh SuXoR :D
funny as hell, reminds me of my old posts when NDA was strong in TT.
They always turned into a flame thread from either sides, old saying here "keep it ingame"
Originally posted by QuantumDelta
Uranus is fine, there's just one single clan with a problem....
actually there are 2,
and syn aren't one of them.
Lets keep this on topic please :)
Fafnir...
Originally posted by Fafnir
Lets keep this on topic please :)
Fafnir...
Hello Mr New Mod SIR!!!
And yeah, my bad.
ZzzZZzz who cares, Saturn has more people then Pluto!
QuantumDelta
31-10-03, 12:51
Hehehe
/Set Cheeky_mode 1
Welcome to the playground fafnir :p
Whoa, a new GM? New blood?
Fafnir, wasnt he that giant wolf who was destined to kill Odin?
heheheheh.....
Originally posted by Duder
Whoa, a new GM? New blood?
Fafnir, wasnt he that giant wolf who was destined to kill Odin?
heheheheh.....
Fafnir was a man who turned into a Dragon out of love of gold ;)
I belive Fenris was a Giant Wolf
Heh but it says youre a greedy Dragon...greeeeeedy!
Back on topic: Well Ive noticed this happens to all clans who challenge the Hordes of FF..
They take an op or to and as ZigZag said if they have to few to defend you leave em..
But if we attack another Op hold you off for a few shots then die..
You guys wait till you have more online and role over all our ops o_O
Ops or for tradeskilling and Gr's, BRTF only "endevoured" to hold a factory,lab,mine,uplink oh and maybe a fortress..
But its simply not possible with FF's greediness and overpowering attitude..
And then the members go round sayin everyone sux.. But with that many members o_O what do they expect..
Is it fun to win 9/10 ?
Try being the underdogs;) More forfilling when you win against FF..
But then they come back and outnumber you and take all ya ops, Thats the reason we lose members cos they get pissed off that we aint gonna go simply because we look at the citycom and theres 20 + online..
And as FN said this isnt a bitching thread its a thread to try and stop this.
-A
This isn't really a pluto specific problem, but something you will see on every server from time to time.
Most clans take the OPs they "need", that would be a lab and a factory pretty much. Usually there are enough factory/lab pairs for every major clan. Then they fight over the others for sport, but at the end of the day they more or less accept that this and that OP is "claimed" by some clan and don't make a big deal about it being "ninja hacked" back some time in the wee hours.
But then there will always be those clans who grow insanely big, and then becomes greedy. They take the whole map and do everything in their power to keep it, killing the "sport" in the process. This became even worse with the new GR rules, as the type of clan who does this also often is the type of clan who would want to lock the whole map off to their own faction. I think most people agree that this is bad for the game. In fact, KK should have made it so that there was a max limit for how many OPs a single clan can hold at one time, like 10. This would stop this monopolizing without really limiting anyone for any practical reasons.
Originally posted by Ascention
Back on topic: Well Ive noticed this happens to all clans who challenge the Hordes of FF..
They take an op or to and as ZigZag said if they have to few to defend you leave em..
But if we attack another Op hold you off for a few shots then die..
You guys wait till you have more online and role over all our ops o_O
Ops or for tradeskilling and Gr's, BRTF only "endevoured" to hold a factory,lab,mine,uplink oh and maybe a fortress..
But its simply not possible with FF's greediness and overpowering attitude..
And then the members go round sayin everyone sux.. But with that many members o_O what do they expect..
Is it fun to win 9/10 ?
Try being the underdogs;) More forfilling when you win against FF..
But then they come back and outnumber you and take all ya ops, Thats the reason we lose members cos they get pissed off that we aint gonna go simply because we look at the citycom and theres 20 + online..
And as FN said this isnt a bitching thread its a thread to try and stop this.
-A
rawr well we 2 times at male we spanked you guys silly with about half your nummbers soo :D
killed 3 ppus with their shields down when we rushed...that alone tells me you guys still have some practice to do :wtf:
Lol they were AFK:lol: so haha you dint keel me cos i logged out in the UG..
cos you took to long to come back..
o_O
But you may of got us at mal but you guys at cycrow o_O ..:lol:
But your turning this into a bitching thread keep it on Topic ie:
FF are F88king pluto over..:o
Mods, please feel free to edit out any remarks that make comments to SPECIFIC incidents in-game. I'm shooting for an overall arrangement out of this, not a "oh yeah well we beat you yesterday outnumbered" or "wtf, you hacked our OP on tuesday with 27 monks!" typed comments. Thanks.
But what Ascention and Hagbart say are very true. I am not getting why FF doens't care about how greedy they are and how it affects the overall gameplay.
Devastation_0
31-10-03, 14:35
can i just say this asc that FF suck:lol:
Originally posted by -FN-
Mods, please feel free to edit out any remarks that make comments to SPECIFIC incidents in-game. I'm shooting for an overall arrangement out of this, not a "oh yeah well we beat you yesterday outnumbered" or "wtf, you hacked our OP on tuesday with 27 monks!" typed comments. Thanks.
But what Ascention and Hagbart say are very true. I am not getting why FF doens't care about how greedy they are and how it affects the overall gameplay.
Can sum FF "glory supporters" tell me this IS it fun to be greedy..
and claim your all great just cos of the 24 our member band you have?:o
Originally posted by deac
rawr well we 2 times at male we spanked you guys silly with about half your nummbers soo :D
killed 3 ppus with their shields down when we rushed...that alone tells me you guys still have some practice to do :wtf:
Yeah but OMG we like killed 30 people with only 3 people and hacked your OP's like yeah, fuck, we owned you, hahaha, pwned....o_O
It's very easy to make claims of things from only one side of the facts and as usual people over exagerate things to make themselves look "good"....there is no point to threads like this because everyone will never cooperate, it's as simple as that.
The main problem is just that a lot of players are playing it safe and join the dominant side. Also all these non-agression treaties was unbalancing the politics on the server. Remember when TR owned the Pluto map and then everyone jumped ship to TG, well its happening again.
The Formula:
People don't like to lose + people want to have fun = join the winning side
What made NATO fall completely on its arse on Pluto was that the 2 most dominant pro-city clans at the time had non-agression treaties with all the main enemies. When DMA took a few OPs we only had a startup SXR clan as allies. Not an ounce of backup would be provided due to NAPs with Crackheads and PIMP.
If "playing it safe" was reduced by individuals then you'd see much more lively server and balancing out would occur.
FN u say greedy yes witch makes me belive u talk about us holding to many ops yes ?
witch again leads other strong clans holding just as many ops
being SS Spirit and Dark (true dark have lost their ops foster shirkan and crest now but had em for a long time and had more ops then FF) they have about as many ops as we do so should u not call them greedy as well ? or am i missing ur point here
they have about as many ops as we do so should u not call them greedy as well
8|
Have problems counting... Do we?
'EDIT - logged in quick, 6 crahn OP's 18 TG op's 9 tangent OP's 1 TS OP.
Wowzers... DarK's really close to owning the map.
just counted and here is what everyone have
FF 13
spirit 6
SS 9
Dark 5
dark used to have shirkan foster dev and then u STILL bitched
Ss used to have tezla and nemesis 11 ops with those 2 (and no u did not bitch)
so when we had 8 ops SS had 11 dark had 8 peops still bitched AT US none else
but i care about ops etc and for this server to have multiple ops and many colours on the map why we have talked to FA and is trying atm to get them on the map so that FA may prosper once again
if a clan started up to balance the server and had a lot of active euro peeps, i would move my char's across
probably
BRTF could Hold Ops all the time if they had U.S members:(
I guess its the same with SXR and NDA?
Solling... How many people can FF normally bring to an OP fight?
Alot more than pretty much every other Pluto. (hence... why clans bring allies?)
That's the problem - not OP's.
Tangle the shear size of your combat forces along with the fact that people within the clan still drop turrets and stuff even though you're already crushing the enemy...
marx u fight us jts 2 days ago qwe was liek 14-15 u was 17 so dont say we always bring more then others cuz we dont, but peops seem to think that we always broing 20+ peops to op war O_o :wtf:
why should u bring allies if u alrdy outnumber us:wtf:
Doc Holliday
31-10-03, 19:12
its pretty darn obvious why pluto is dead. its cof of people on pluto come here all the goddam time to have a dig at each other about this clan that clan or the other clan owning each other or bitching about each others politics. cant u do it like uranus does and just do it all on trade :lol: at least that ways the server counts would increase.
oh and oath which clans do u mean then buddy ;)
yeh do it like uranus Bring ur alt :D
Doc Holliday
31-10-03, 19:30
Originally posted by solling
yeh do it like uranus Bring ur alt :D
lol sad but true.
Originally posted by evs
if a clan started up to balance the server and had a lot of active euro peeps, i would move my char's across
probably
Well for a start, some TGs could move across to FA and join my clan :D
Darken has this saying "never argue with an idiot - he will only bring u down to his level and beat u with experience".
The most pertinent post in this thread was Anima"s - I could not understand at the time what on earth NDA did to warrant the constant bitching against them, I knew Centauri etc and they were fair and reasonable people. Then same thing applies here - all who know Lore know him to be completely reasonable and quite frankly too fair.
I dont know how to make u pro-city/crahn clans see this :
IF U WANT EVEN NUMBERED OP WARS DM LORE - U WILL FIND THAT IS WHAT HE WANTS AS WELL.
That visible?............could it be perhaps even numbered op wars are NOT what u want? This is the third time we offer this ....we are still waiting.
We bring on average 10 - 15 ppl to op wars AT PEAK TIMES - when has this EVER been classed as overwhelming numbers on pluto? Reading these posts and all these bash FF threads one could be forgive thinking we bring 25+ to every op war - at all times.
We do not ninja ops - unless u ninja them from us - ninja is lame.
Claiming an op as primary does NOT count as an excuse to ninja. Anyone and everyone may claim an op to be a primary op - you have to earn that right by holding this op for a resonable amount of time - this is a long established understanding on Pluto. PIMP swapped Tyron with us for Chester because they wanted a lab, as far as we know it was a PIMP op for the majority of the time b4 this. Maelstrond etc were NDA primary ops - never BTRFs.
FF do not have any primary ops - we we treat all ops (cept cycrow) the same - when FF was formed all ops close to TG were Gang ops. It only made sense to us to try claim ops close to TG - and when we tried to negotiate to try get hold of one - Cycrow - we were refused - so all ops = fair game. Cycrow we dare to see as a home - its one op but even then we do not, to this day "claim" it.
We are not interested in owning all the map - if we were and we had, as u claim, half the server in our clan and we had no scruples about ninja hacking we would surely by now easly own all the map - have u an explanation as to why we dont? Are we lazy - colour blind - what?
Simple facts are : - bring 10 - 15 ppl to op wars with us - we dont care how many clans that has to be (if u want exact numbers DM lore) - dont log off right after u hack and kill our scouting force - dont ninja - and all will be well.
We have arranged for FA clans once again to take and try keep some of our ops - lets see how u treat them.
Originally posted by solling
marx u fight us jts 2 days ago qwe was liek 14-15 u was 17
Yeah, we've been recruiting - can you tell? Is it bad for us to even the playing feild? I don't think so.
Originally posted by sollingso dont say we always bring more then others cuz we dont,
So the people in SXR, eXo (don't hate you guys as much as you think.), NDA etc are hallucinating when they see double to triple their number? Not including turrets of course.
Sure, DarK's been getting bigger - some of our inactive people are playing more, got some new members as well... From the way I see people acting I get the general impression that it was preferred we didn't grow, but we're forced to in order to keep possesion of OP's.
A wise woman once said: "... So don't go snapping your fingers in my face like a gangsta' bitch - 'cause frankly, you ain't got the goods sista'."
Peace homedoggy.
marx i dont mind u getting more peops online hell i like it and i dont mind u outnumbering us either cuz it was not by far
now what i do mind is u still bitching about us when u had us outnumbered etc
Erm, don't bring exo into this... We don't take ops anymore as a whole clan, just fyi
anyway
from the battles I've seen with FF while I was with NDA, they are reasonable in size, true, but all 100 members don't come to a op fight to stomp you down.
If I remember right, this was the issue with NDA that everyone bitched about, 'You can't beat us fairly, so you outnumber us'. Which was rarely true, and is the same with FF. Stop the bitching and moaning for once and do something constructive, like play the game for starters.
This thread had gone right off topic and into the realms of "keep it in game"
Thread closed!
Fafnir...
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