Just curious

[Zokk]

In every thread about PPUs I read, I often see that the PPUs say something along the lines of "Use tactics to kill a PPU" "Why do you have to use that lame TL3 heal exploit, use tactics to kill a PPU" "I hate anti-buff... people should have to use tactics to kill a PPU" "If you can't kill a PPU, you need to change your tactics" etc etc etc...

So I ask you, the PPUs of the game:

What are these tactics?


I look forward to your (lack of) responses.

[\\Fényx//]

the tactic is to log onto your APU alt (as it is now needed :rolleyes:) and to go anti-buff them...silleh


or to get the one use out of a tank, well 15 tanks, get 15 tanks and use their speed gun's on their PPU, while your army of PPU's paraspam's them into the ground, trying to over ride the cath sanct he has up :rolleyes:


overall the tactics are '':rolleyes:''

[NS_CHROME54]

apu with antibuff

OR

melee tank w/ paw of bear, coupled either a ppu, or another melee tank

[TheDuckMan]

Or stealth around for about 10 minutes. Then when they think your goin, snipe them with your ultimated pain easer












theres your lack of response

[BombShell]

Originally posted by TheDuckMan
Or stealth around for about 10 minutes. Then when they think your goin, snipe them with your ultimated pain easer












theres your lack of response

then watch it go 2 damage at a time

[naimex]

^^ antibuff is the fastest
^^ tl3 heal is actually hard to get in between the constant heal buffs of an experienced PPU..
^^ hardest way... but with lowest amount of attackers needed :: wait for buffs to run out on the ppu and hit it hard and fast before the new buffs come up.
^^ or just be an assload of peeps attacking.....

[Psycho_Soldier]

Originally posted by NS_CHROME54
apu with antibuff

OR

melee tank w/ paw of bear, coupled either a ppu, or another melee tank



Anyone actually take this post seriously? Melee tank vs PPU? :lol:

[Syntax-Error]

There is no way to kill a PPU who dosnt wana die. cos if they wana they can take an idle stoll over to a GR and GR out if they think its lost


and then theres the zoneing the 'Zone, heal, zone, buff, zone, heal, zone para, zone, heal, zone para and DB, zone buff, zone para para para para para para para watch as your team who could take the long way around kill the enemy with a needlegun as your enemy cant do jack all.'

[athon]

APUs with Antibuff
PPUs with Damage Buff
Tanks with speed guns
Spies & PEs with PEs, Silent Hunters and TL 3 heal.

Dmg buff owns a lone PPU because they cant take it off as fast as you can cast it, and while they're trying to take it off, their other buffs run out.

Athon Solo

[Jaggeh]

droners with 9 revenges in fast succession :D

[Oath]

question is, why does a ppu have to remove the damage buff when he can out heal almost everything in game?

of course teh 5 tank's with speedguns ploy seems to work also,

ive seen one ppu attacked by a whole clan, and not only survive, but to paraspam 2 of the apu's to death and laugh at the other 13 people heh.

Djingo................i wubb wou MUHAUHAHUAHA.

a really good ppu doesnt have to worry about damage buff. or even anti buff, but that makes the tl3 heal shit even worse. my lvl 28 ppu can outaheal 2 libbys, and im not using holy sanctum yet, so :p to all the UBA PPU KILLZORZ.

Oh.........and to reply to the question.

Masses of apu's tnks pes spys ppus etc.........but........thats just pathetic really, catch a bad ppu while he's rezzing someone, you normally take them down then.

[Ryuben]

/lamz0r tactics 101

1 pe
1 apu

add deflector sanc to PE
add holy anti buff to APU
cast def sanc
cast holy anti buff
after 3 seconds of the 6 second tick for holy anti buff, get said PE to
cast Shelter on monk
shoot with libby /PE
shoot with FA*

rince and repeat

maybe addding a TL3 heal /dmg bosot for your preferance


*this ingrediant can be subsitiuted for posion or HL

[icarium]

engage them in a conversation about euclidian geometry, when they have fallen asleep, kick em in the taters :)

[Omnituens]

Originally posted by icarium
engage them in a conversation about euclidian geometry, when they have fallen asleep, kick em in the taters :)
or second order differential equations :lol:

[Zokk]

So far I have gathered that:

I was more or less correct.

A lot of you have very false senses of what would kill a PPU. Stop kidding yourselves.

So far, the PPUs have only offered tl3 and antibuff... I asked for the "tactics" you keep talking about that aren't "lame."


Really... the only valid answer thus far was the 9 Revenge barrage (if that even works? I can't speak from experience on this one.)

[Judge]

Zokk>PPUs :P

Yeah I would also like to hear from some PPUs a non "lame" tactic of how to kill them. They are meant to be killed, obiouvlsy not with one person but they should be killable.

[Dribble Joy]

A good PPU simply cannot die without stupis numbers of melee/piercing weapon fire being poured onto them.
Holy heal and their self buffs make them immortal.

[Keiron]

2 Droners with Revenge and a Rifle/Pistol PE. PE Dmg boosts and tl-3 heals, falls back for a sec droners Revenge the PPU, PE finishes.

[Duder]

Zerg "rushing" is also "lame" in the eyes of the UB4R1337 ppus, so using a group of angry tanks and pes with piercing weapons and apus is considered a lame tactic, so you cant do that.



OH WELL. :rolleyes:

[Judge]

Duder.... just trying to kill a PPU is lame. Duh, didn't you know that?

:rolleyes:

[Mr Friendly]

Originally posted by Zokk
In every thread about PPUs I read, I often see that the PPUs say something along the lines of "Use tactics to kill a PPU" "Why do you have to use that lame TL3 heal exploit, use tactics to kill a PPU" "I hate anti-buff... people should have to use tactics to kill a PPU" "If you can't kill a PPU, you need to change your tactics" etc etc etc...

So I ask you, the PPUs of the game:

What are these tactics?


I look forward to your (lack of) responses.

i believe u made up "i hate antibuff..." cuz we dont hate it. the tactics is many things, dont stand still, dont waste ur time shootin him if hes buffed, anitbuff em......use spells(barrels) that will hurt him even with buffs, use TACTICS, such as laying down more than one type of barrel MEANWHILE having another apu antibuff em....

"ahhh iccc" .......o_O :rolleyes: :D

ppus are able to take the most dmg / apus are able to give the most dmg...*hint*

[Nish]

You take lots of people including 2-3 apus, have them all cast antibuffs on him a second or 2 after each other while a ppu paraspams/dboost spams him, and then all the other random classes hammer him.

but is paraspamming lame... no, it's too common for that

Basically there are no tactics besides shooting the crap into them when their pants are round their ankles.

[Kenjuten]

Acceptable or unacceptable tactics are all based upon one's values and beliefs...as such, most of the tactics that have been described such far can be seen as either acceptable or unacceptable tactics on numerous people.

Frankly......I believe there's a difference between tactics and strategy. Some of the tactics described here are rather strategy than tactics..

Strategy is a plan, usually made in advance. This tends to dictate how a person or a group handles things. The 'pack of melee tanks to rip up a PPU' line of thought is rather a strategy, for example.

Tactics either consists of HOW to go about a strategy, or of an improvisational action that you can lean on either in or outside a strategy. Taking advantage of someone's weakness rather than bringing the right kind of protection against someone's strength is a strategy, but how to take advantage or a weakness or how to protect against someone's strength is tactical.

Let's say you wish to be defensive rather than offensive. You then get into a gunfight, where someone relies on multiple shots of a gun and a large clip to destroy an opponent. You have a short clip and a pistol of a gun, where you believe accuracy is more important.

Your choice of gun and stance are strategic, and the same goes for your enemy.

You duck behind lots of objects to get by your opponent's shots, timing your jumps and repositioning accordingly so that you are in a safezone during a burst and relocating between bursts. Your opponent must reposition to get a better angle at you, like trying to get to where you are.

This is where strategy and tactics tend to merge. You have to use tactics to back up your strategy...gotta get cover in order to make your self count, while your opponent has to get at you in order to shoot you. While this can usually be thought of as leading the enemy, that would only be a glorification.

Your opponent suddenly runs out of ammo, and he has to reload. Whether he takes cover or not doesn't matter as you now have the advantage. Let's just say for sake of mutual minds the opponent does take cover. So he thinks he's escaped you. But you reposition yourself accordingly so that you have a clear shot at him. What do you want to do?

You wanted to be defensive, so you could either disarm him or shoot him dead where he stands.

Here is where skills, values, and tactics come together. Depending on how you feel, you could either kill him outright or just get rid of his means to kill. Depending on your skills, you can either use that pistol of yours and shoot or miss, OR know what you can do or cannot do, and do what you know you can do.

Depending on your tactics, if you wanted to kill him, you could either shoot his heart or his head. If you wanted to disarm him, you could either shoot the gun and make it become destroyed or simply inaccessible as you shot it out of his hand. Each choice has its own explanation, and the same goes for strategy.

When it comes to PPU, the TL3 Heal tactic, WHILE IT IS AN EXPLOIT, is a tactic in the game nonetheless until it is taken away. I want the option for higher level versions of spells to override the lower level versions, but alas, it will not come soon.

However, it is interesting to compare a PPU to a gun. When it is reloading (rebuffing and fixing itself up), you can short-circuit him just like you can destroy or make inaccessible a gun of your opponent. Now, skills is knowing your limits on top of what you can do, so you may not FEEL capable of defeating the PPU any other way. This does not make a tactic good in the eyes of the public, but it does attempt (attempt, I said) to justify.

There may be those of you saying "If you can kill a PPU without resorting to (random) tactic, why do you bother?", I can understand you wanting some people to learn better ways of fighting, but it not only takes time, it takes dedication, it takes skill, something that many people wish not to learn and it is something few people want to take the time for.

You may be aware that some ways are a lot easier than others. (Monkocron, anyone?). It will always be this way. Because there is always more than one way to go about something. Some people want to go through brick walls instead of go over them. Well, if they want to, let them be. I just find it amusing how the double standard works, actually. The people who want people to go through brick walls are those that lose to those that go over the brick walls.

(Note: The above paragraph was something I attempted to address, but it resulted in a semi-cryptic insight. I'll just leave it as is and hope the majority of you will understand just what I was trying to address. ^^; )

Another strategy, to put things into less controversial terms, is to have a PPU with you wherever you go. What you do with that PPU, however, is tactical. :)

I am not sure if I have portrayed the differences properly, but for my closing paragraph on that essay, I will ask those of you who are still interested to post your thoughts on what strategies are, what tactics are, the differences between the two, and examples of both within Neocron. I am sorry if my post does not agree with you, but to make it up to you I will allow you to post your thoughts as well.

My basic belief is that there is a fine line between tactics and strategy, and that is where they both come together.

In any case... :)

[Zokk]

Originally posted by Mr Friendly
i believe u made up "i hate antibuff..."

Nope... belive it or not, I've actually heard people say that... I don't remember names, but I'm pretty sure one of the people was a clanmate at one point.



So... more ideas have been offered, unfortunately none are original, they all involve antibuff or using lower TL spells on the PPU. And once again, I was in PP1 this morning, I confronted an enemy PPU. After I used some "techniques" I often use, I sent him running for the safezone with very little HP. Upon his returning he said something to the effect of:

"I hate [your clan] they would always rather use TL3 heals and prevent me from casting my better spells than use good combat strageties"

Upon asking him to enlighten me on what those "good combat strageties" were, he remained silent.

So I have come up with an additional question for you guys to answer:

If I am not an APU, and I have no APU with me, am I allowed to try to kill you?

[Duder]

Originally posted by Zokk

If I am not an APU, and I have no APU with me, am I allowed to try to kill you?


Answer: NO. If you see a PPU, just turn around and start walking.

See? Now everyone are balanced !!!

[Shadow Dancer]

Playing a spy has made me see the monk imbalance in a new light. I felt so useless in some fights. Shooting the ppu with my capped pain easer, as if that was actually gonna do something. At one point he was ressing his teammate over and over and me and 4 people kept shooting and weren't even scratching him. He was even DBed. We had no apu. He only left when I tl 3 healed him.

[Duder]

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Playing a spy has made me see the monk imbalance in a new light. I felt so useless in some fights. Shooting the ppu with my capped pain easer, as if that was actually gonna do something. At one point he was ressing his teammate over and over and me and 4 people kept shooting and weren't even scratching him. He was even DBed. We had no apu. He only left when I tl 3 healed him.


hahahah!

Yeah see, PPUs are balanced? Yup they are!

"Youre such a n00b, use piercing weapons, get some skills, blah blah blah." :rolleyes:

[VVerevvolf]

I always kill ppus before our attack force hits the enemy. They stay around unbuffed quite often, and my disruptor takes them down. Works quite well, but as soon as they are buffed, I can go home if I dont have some apu with me.

[hinch]

just killing a single ppu isnt really a problem

its killing a ppu when his clan has 6 other ppu`s and outnumbers you 5:1

[sanityislost]

Seduce the ppu with a drom and while the ppu is sexing it up ATTACK( + 1 parashock)

[Richard Slade]

Honestly. only good monkey killah is piercing weapons,
and against a good ppu that won't make a diff anyways
Monkeys need less pierce resist damnit, they don't even wear
metal armor for Christs sake!
Remove defl!