View Full Version : Holy Paralysis -> Holy Mantellum Invisibilis
-=Blasehase=-
18-10-03, 13:40
i started this poll in the german forum too:link (http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?s=&threadid=79170)
the idea behind is:
the holy paralysis is too strong, but if it get nerfed, the PPU hasnt a right chance against agressors
he cant kill him, and he cant run away cause the enemys has nearly the same runspeed or is faster... and the shelter holds not for the eternity
so my idea is that the holy paralysis should REPLACED [not removed] with a spell wich is kinda the stealthtools
with HP even noobs becomes uber, and that is the only thing in the whole game... so it doesnt fit into the game... everywhere the battle decides on ur playerskill AND ur charskill except when the enemy is freezed...
so here the details:
TL:
a smaller with lower steathtime in nonrare and the big one with the same as the HP
stealthtime:
selfcast 60 seconds, cast to others 30 seconds [my oppinion... lower times are good too]
this brings a new tactical: cast ur mates to stealth behind the enemy, or stealth the enemy so that he cant attack [but has a chance to run away and not be a turret like with the HP]
others:
the same functions as the Stealthtools, EXCEPT the dmg boost sanctum... so the PPU cant stealth and dmg boost the enemys... so it sould turn off when stealth starts
those who cant fight without stealth can use the parashock beam wich freezes strong enought but gives the other a chance
remember... most of the no sayers dont give ideas like this to a discussion... its easy to say no, but its hard to find a solution [PLZ make *** in ur post if u read this post completely]
***
I like it, stealthing is perhaps a little uber for monks, but its a good idea.
Ill post some ideas later also.
Peace.
if you look in one of the older plan files, stealth was ment to be a tool AND a spell.
hence why the graphics are in the game files, it was just never implemented.
i think its a great idea, but i also think that if this gets implamented, we should get rid of the lower level paras also, because a capped para beam hes about the same effect as a holy para with bad stats.
so imo, lower level paras should be replaced with lower level stealth spells (ignore the TL 2 etc etc paras)
No. Monks should NOT get stealth. If they do then:
It should DEFINITELY only be self-cast.
It should have a VERY low ROF.
It should have a VERY high mana cost.
It should drain all of the monks buffs.
I think PPUs already have an easy way to escape aggressors. It's called Holy Heal.
Originally posted by Scikar
I think PPUs already have an easy way to escape aggressors. It's called Holy Heal.
yeah, but when an apu use holy antibuff on the ppu, he doesnt have holy heal anymore, nor shelter or deflector. a nice stealth spell would be nice now :D
Originally posted by Furion
yeah, but when an apu use holy antibuff on the ppu, he doesnt have holy heal anymore, nor shelter or deflector. a nice stealth spell would be nice now :D
To make them completely invincible yeah?
PPUs should be killable, but not just by one person obviously, but giving them stealth would be possibly even worse than parashock itself.
-=Blasehase=-
18-10-03, 15:29
Originally posted by Judge
To make them completely invincible yeah?
PPUs should be killable, but not just by one person obviously, but giving them stealth would be possibly even worse than parashock itself.
dont think so... u can kill stealthed runners with area weapons...
so its POSSIBLE
Originally posted by Judge
To make them completely invincible yeah?
PPUs should be killable, but not just by one person obviously, but giving them stealth would be possibly even worse than parashock itself.
Just make the PPUs shields automatically be removed when he stealths. i know someone has suggested this in another thread. if his shields are disabled, all he can really do with the stealth is get the hell outta there....
couldnt we just get the para out and implement runcasting and overriding buffs for ppus???
Aye a ppu will never be able to kill anybody. so epics are going to be a bitch to do unless you want to pay your way out of them. but then again in pvp this will probably fit in nicely. Since now you wont have ppus standing and laughing theyll be running to avoid damage and rebuff.
this stealth thing is a nice alternative. the stealthing of others will never get implemented though. detracts too much from the value of stealth for pe's and spies IMO. and if it removes buffs sure find someone who will use it.
Only Spies should have Stealth. Holy Paralysis does need something done to it but Stealth for monks is NOT the answer.
PPU can stealth and heal up indefinitely..
Nothing could kill em..
If the monk gets antibuffed he just stealths and rebuffs himself.
I dont think youre supposed to be able to cast spells while in stealth you could just get away.
But again id prolly never use it. i cant buff and i cant help my team either. so no im prolly not going too use it.
I think that runcast and overide buffs for PPUs is alot better of an alternative than stealth.
QuantumDelta
18-10-03, 17:49
Originally posted by Judge
I think that runcast and overide buffs for PPUs is alot better of an alternative than stealth.
One or the other :p
So wait... so wait... let me get this straight.
The problem with parashock is that it makes you 95% unable to fight. But now you're saying that a PPU can cast stealth on YOU so you are 100% unable to fight, and that they can keep doing so untill they are able to deal with you.
I can see the OP wars now. Stealth everyone but one of the enemies. Kill that enemy. Wait 30 seconds (30 seconds?!?!) Stealth everyone except one enemy again (assuming the rest haven't already logged off and quit the game). Nope... that has to be the most poorly thought-out idea I have ever heard.
As far as stealth as a defensive tool for the PPU -- are you crazy? They already have little risk of dying. Do you want to make them immortal -- and for a whole minute? And yes, area effect weapons... right. Cause you can aim blindly at ground with one trying to find the stealthed PPU and kill him... when you can't with an AOE weapon when you can see him.
No, horrible idea.
Way too unbalanced...you can stealth your APU teammate and get him behind the enemy? This would be SOOOO overpowered it's unbelievable...stealth is meant for spies and spies alone. It's bad enough PEs have it...
Shadow Dancer
18-10-03, 18:24
Um no thanks, ppus have enough roles as it is. We don't need them leeching off spies now. :rolleyes:
Originally posted by VoxteX
Way too unbalanced...you can stealth your APU teammate and get him behind the enemy? This would be SOOOO overpowered it's unbelievable...stealth is meant for spies and spies alone. It's bad enough PEs have it...
Exactly.
Psycho_Soldier
18-10-03, 18:32
Why not make it so the PPU can't cast it on another player, and all the PPU's buffs are taken off including heals. It last for 30 seconds, and has the same penalty as the current stealth for spies, except true sight sanctum wont work and niether will anti-stealth drugs, which makes the PPU stuck in stealth for 30 seconds which would make it pretty much make it a last resort option then the PPU can be killed like a stealthing spy can.
Shadow Dancer
18-10-03, 18:36
Sure, why not give spies holy heal? Or holy "medkit" as well?
Psycho_Soldier
18-10-03, 18:42
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Sure, why not give spies holy heal? Or holy "medkit" as well?
You do know that this suggestion was made as a alternative to holy para right?
Shadow Dancer
18-10-03, 18:45
Originally posted by Psycho_Soldier
You do know that this suggestion was made as a alternative to holy para right?
Yup. But the ppu shouldn't steal(and get for free) a unique ability of another class just to balance holy para. IMO ppus holy para shoudl be PvM only with ppus getting nothing in return. I don't know why ppus feel they should get even MORE defensive/escape procedures, it's outrageous.
ghandisfury
18-10-03, 18:54
Originally posted by Psycho_Soldier
Why not make it so the PPU can't cast it on another player, and all the PPU's buffs are taken off including heals. It last for 30 seconds, and has the same penalty as the current stealth for spies, except true sight sanctum wont work and niether will anti-stealth drugs, which makes the PPU stuck in stealth for 30 seconds which would make it pretty much make it a last resort option then the PPU can be killed like a stealthing spy can.
Yes, we need another useless rare added to the game.
I think this is a horrible way to get rid of parashock, and I've already given my balance ideas (and I know they will balance without nerf) but nobody wants them added.
Psycho_Soldier
18-10-03, 18:57
Originally posted by ghandisfury
Yes, we need another useless rare added to the game.
Who said it had to be a rare? Really though, I don't really like my suggestion either. I think it would be just better to get rid of holy para and not replace it with anything, but if it had to be replaced...
If this is implemented, I think that as soon as the stealth spell is cast, *ALL* buffs (other than the stealth spell, or course) should automatically be deactivated. That's the only way I can see this being balanced.
--Stryfe
we all agree that we want holy para out of the game right? well, PPUs want some new toys also, cuz if u remove holy para all the PPU has left is those dumbass sanctums. and frankly, this seems like a good suggestion, if u dont like it, come up with ur own.....
Shadow Dancer
18-10-03, 21:02
Originally posted by Furion
we all agree that we want holy para out of the game right? well, PPUs want some new toys also, cuz if u remove holy para all the PPU has left is those dumbass sanctums. and frankly, this seems like a good suggestion, if u dont like it, come up with ur own.....
wtf you talking about? PPus have like a billion spells they use, isn't that what their always complaining about, too many spells to manage? Yet when you think of removing ONE spell they say now they have nothing to do, nothing to use, their useless, etc.... :rolleyes:
PPUs have enough defense as it is. They already have a means of escape. How much more defense do they want? They don't DESERVE another defensive spell.
Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
wtf you talking about? PPus have like a billion spells they use, isn't that what their always complaining about, too many spells to manage? Yet when you think of removing ONE spell they say now they have nothing to do, nothing to use, their useless, etc.... :rolleyes:
PPUs have enough defense as it is. They already have a means of escape. How much more defense do they want? They don't DESERVE another defensive spell.
im talking about rares. yes, we have a helluva lot of spells, but if holy para gets removed the only rares we have left is holy catharsis sanctum (im not mentioning the other catharsis spells cuz theyre a waste of space, time and money), truesight sanctum and antipoison sanctum. they all need loads of mana to cast, and take long time.....
Shadow Dancer
18-10-03, 21:08
Holy para doesn't have to be removed, it could be made PvM only.
I think they should simply remove the ppu class, so all aggressive class tank/spy/APU will be able to fight happilywithout being disturb...
Mind one thing: The day they nerf PPU really hard, there will be even fewer ppus out there, good look to Xp in caves, forget about the so precious rez and so on :)... you are begging for KK to dig a hole into your own boat and make it sink.
Btw I'm ppu, and if i only have the boosters and rez left to do, i'll charge 10k for the boost, 50k for the rez..that would be fun. Make the PPU a tradeskiller :D that is one nice idea.
There is a spell called holy antipara, and an ultimate holy catharsis sanctum, you'd better equip your ppus and help them level up instead.
Anyway i just felt dropping by, please keep on with this, nevermind my post.
NERF THE PPU !!
NERF THE PPU !!
NERF THE PPU !!
NERF THE PPU !!
NERF THE PPU !!
NERF THE PPU !!
instead of:
leveling our ppus and equip them !
leveling our ppus and equip them !
leveling our ppus and equip them !
leveling our ppus and equip them !
Use the usual rambling :p lol
I don't know what it is with you people... sometimes you make ABSOLUTELY no sense. This suggestion has been made in the past. Stealth is the role of the spy, not yet another role the PPU needs to have.
I said this before, and I'll say it again. If you give Stealth to PPU's, then give Spies HOLY-level buffs. Does that sound fair to you PPU monks? No, I bet it doesn't. You have to look at these things from both sides, not just your own.
This is not the way to balance Parashock. There's got to be another way to do this. I just can't see stealth as the solution.
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