Un nerf spies and make pe's to a "nomal" class [Archive]

Brute Forced

13-10-03, 16:52

Why have KK made spies to total pussy class ? its like u c a spider and u have to beg for ur fokin life. And now with those new pw pa that dont give pes any notice able negative stats and then give spies -30 end and -INT wot the fok are KK thinking ???

I think they should nerf the pe armor and give them some noticeable negative stats on it... thats a start

And one other thing to do... MAKE STEALTH SPY CLASS ONLY FFS!
I have had enough of those pussy tgs that shoots u when hacking a wb or wot ever u do and then stealth away...

I can only say one thing to KK... if u keep make the game worse u wont get anymore players and the game WILL die out..

Dribble Joy

13-10-03, 17:00

Go away and make this a constructive thread rather than a rant.

Besides that.
PEPA cannot have negative effects for any other stat line. Otherwise WE WILL NOT USE IT. PEs are the most speciallised and hard to setup class in the game and rely on every single point they can get their mits on. Take even 10 AGL/ATL from PEs and the armour becomes useless.
The PEPA is a little to strong, and the lvl 4 is a tad low at dex 100.
Stealth 1 is crap. and only PEs who are very tech orientated use it.
With the 'emergance' of the black sun this of course has increased.
The PEPA negs are ignorable for dueling, but you can't really take it off in the middle of an OP fight to rebuff. lvl4 means you can't use shelter boots anyway.

I'm off to have a shower.

Lethys

13-10-03, 17:05

PE PA is overpowered?

If KK took the class reqs off Spy PA, I know which I'd rather be using.......

Lathuc

13-10-03, 17:06

eh what you talking about you are supposed to be weak rtfm

btw cool down take a deep breath and then post not like you just did. that is come shouting mad and make a rant post

Rith

13-10-03, 17:10

lmao

Why have KK made spies to total pussy class ? its like u c a spider and u have to beg for ur fokin life. And now with those new pw pa that dont give pes any notice able negative stats and then give spies -30 end and -INT wot the fok are KK thinking ???

That must have taken you days to compose.

If you think Spies are total pussys go pick a fight with Divide on Saturn.

About the only thing KK needs to change right now is the blacksun, it is comparitively overpowered. Its like a TPC being as effective as a CS in the hands of a capped Tank.

R

SorkZmok

13-10-03, 17:12

Originally posted by Brute Forced
Why have KK made spies to total pussy class ? its like u c a spider and u have to beg for ur fokin life. And now with those new pw pa that dont give pes any notice able negative stats and then give spies -30 end and -INT wot the fok are KK thinking ???

I think they should nerf the pe armor and give them some noticeable negative stats on it... thats a start

And one other thing to do... MAKE STEALTH SPY CLASS ONLY FFS!
I have had enough of those pussy tgs that shoots u when hacking a wb or wot ever u do and then stealth away...

I can only say one thing to KK... if u keep make the game worse u wont get anymore players and the game WILL die out..

Why does everyone think spies are the total pussy class? Its true when your a noob but the higher you get the stronger you become.
Thx to the PAs i now got fire, enr and xray somewhere above 100 and about 350 Health. That with a (crappy stat) shelter, a quite good (crappy TL) deflector and a disruptor with capped dmg and a RoF of nearly 200 can`t be called weak anymore.
Oh and dont you forget about my stealth 2...

Well it still needs 3 drugs to work but hey who cares :D

About the PE armor, i dont know how that will change the balance but i`m a bit worried about lots and lots of new RolH wielding PEs. And that gun truly is a bitch. o_O

Phiberdelic

13-10-03, 17:28

How can you say Spies are nerfed...I play a Spy nearly capped (7 INT & 1 DEX left) and I can't find any reason for your claims. With SPYPA 4 I can still use all heavy belts, I have 401 health 70 nat ENR, 30 nat FIRE, 3 gamma bone imps, I use battle3's but could change around a couple of imps and use Inq armor, I can Deflector and Shelter(with one desetrol forte), I have a capped FL, PE, ROG, (still need 2 more parts for Disruptor), I use stealth 1 for quick getaways if needed (which is not very often, only when someone tries to gank you while your in the middle of hunting), I have 115 hack so getting ppls belts and OPs isn't a problem, I have 80 PSU so my heals cast almost instantly which make for a very nice stop-click-run for heals on the go. I have taken out APU's, PE's, and TANKS...and as for mobs I have only found 3 mobs that I can't solo, COPBOTS, STORMIES, MC5 GUARDS(although I haven't tried them all, but Y's, DOY BOTS, GRIMS, FRENS, KRINAHKS, CREEPERS, etc)

so where is this so called Spy nerf???? IMO even before this armor and even before the stealth, spies have never been an underclass. They have always remained pretty well-balanced, there shouldn't be a god-class which is mostly the reason for these type of post (the poster feels that they aren't godly enough).

Spies Rock !!!!!

athon

13-10-03, 17:30

Because they don't play them.

<Warning: This post may be egotistical, but the fact still stands - Spies are not weak worthless players.>

I'm a rifle spy and I pwn!
With a PE and SH I can take out most classes and majorly help in the taking out of monks. I contribute much to every OP fight I attend.

People look for me and try to take me out - why? 'Cause I can hit them half a mile off, killing PEs and Spys and doing major damage to monks who are outside the OP.

Spies OWN!

Athon Solo

ericdraven

13-10-03, 17:35

Originally posted by athon
I contribute much to every OP fight I attend.

PLEASE write this again in all upcoming "OMG OMG!! only monks are useful in OP fights anymore!!!!11" threads :p

And i have to agree, a well set-up (rifle) spy really rocks.. and now with the new PAs even more... :)

athon

13-10-03, 17:39

Originally posted by ericdraven
PLEASE write this again in all upcoming "OMG OMG!! only monks are useful in OP fights anymore!!!!11" threads :p

And i have to agree, a well set-up (rifle) spy really rocks.. and now with the new PAs even more... :)

'Monkocron' MAKES Spies useful! Our speciality is piercing damage which HURTS monks badly. I can sit pounding away at a PPU. I don't care that he's buffed 'cause I know in a minute I'm gonna get a lucky shot thta sneaks through when his buffs wear off and take off half his health. With a little luck, a nearby tank or other fighter will notice and finish the monk for me (unfortunately I don't get to do it - wusses run behind the fences. Tho I have some possible tactics to try on that).

Athon Solo

ezza

13-10-03, 17:39

spys aint nerfed, if you use them right there leathel, PEs aint over powered, if you fight a good one you will die, but then you fight a crap one and they go down easy.

if your using your spy like a tank then your dumb cos thats not what a spy is for

PsiCorps

13-10-03, 18:04

Wyked

13-10-03, 21:03

actually i like the new armors very much.

im cool with PEs using the low stealth.

and i like my spy PA way more than the PE PA (except for the looks.. i wish the spy PA has more of a Predator look)

my spy can stick on that PA, mount up on his heavy assault trike, and absolutely rape several warbots at a time without any buffs.

ghandisfury

13-10-03, 21:18

KK thought this out perfectly imo. The PE PA has a negative req on the_most_usefull things a PE has.....his shelter/deflector, and boots. So this means that in a simple duel, the PE might still have an upper hand with speed, and buffs up....but he only has 2 minutes to kill you before he starts taking double the damage he normaly takes. As Dribble Joy said, you take away intel...PEs won't use it, you take away agility, PEs won't use it, strength....Nope, need all of that as well. Any negative stat that could be thougt of would destroy all of the work in coding the PE PA, because I know that I wouldn't use it (tell you honestly, I can't think of much of a use for it now).

Sounds to me like you got owned, and came to bitch. That's fine, you rally for a "real negative" as you put it, and all you will do is make it to where PEs don't wear PA.

One finall thought, I capped all of my weapons WITHOUT the PA.

Netphreak

13-10-03, 21:21

the only reason i would have to say wot where KK thinking is about SPY PA4 like c'mon 130 dex? wtf?

Any one knows to setup a spy with the 115 dex in mind!
So thats PA3, Disruptor, FL, SH, HL (really why try to use this? a RoG does more damage gives better exp...............), Red (such a disappointing weapon), RoG, PE. So the point of a 130 dex armor that gives 8 dex and -8 int? none.

Anyway backon topic i've been at many OP wars with Athlon Solo and i can say yeah he rocks and is certainly not weak.

Whiety Bulger

13-10-03, 22:47

Spies are supposed to be fragile they are supposed to be tradeskillers.

Clownst0pper

13-10-03, 23:37

Spies are supposed to be fragile they are supposed to be tradeskillers

Its that ignorance that drives me to the end of my sanity.

*All together*

BECAUSE THATS WHY THEY MADE FUCKING TL 115 RIFLES THAT A PRIVATE EYE COULD NEVER CAP, THAT ONLY A SPY COULD!!!!!!!!!

Jesus, the sheer ignorance of some people.

Wallen

14-10-03, 00:33

Umm, you say KK makes spies the pussy class, but then complain that you want stealth to be Spy only???????

....................................

I play a spy, and it seems to me like stealth would be considered a "pussy skill", so your statements seem a little contradictory...

BombShell

14-10-03, 03:09

only things i like for spies are

-45 str 15 psi
-darnit armor into dex armor
-AOE rifles and pistols
-More dex points at char plainin at start menu.

these r the only things mostly.

45/15 allows spies to use fire armor and harder for drugging to shelters.

darnit is the most useless for most str chars and shelter armor is more powerful for monks may as well let spys and pe's use it.

need aoe for lvling liek fusion and ray weapons same as nwo but with a aoe.

spies speed is a little gimp trying to capp rifles so having a little more dex like how tanks hav it in str and con or int and psi withmonks would help out the spys alot not saying a over load but this is my ideas.

some peeps think spies dont need armor like fire but really i think spies should at least get decent resis and 0 shelter and low life. still if the lowest defence in game

Birkoff

14-10-03, 03:38

OMG spies ahaven't been NERFed.. they have been blessed in the past week plus, what with kami chips, spy PA etc... and PE PA is far from gr8 lol.. I don't know if I'll even wear it on saturn.

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 06:35

Spies aren't as weak as people make them out to be.

japata

14-10-03, 06:47

PE PA good?! ARE YOU INSANE?! I truly don't understand why anyone would ever use the PA (well, maybe hunting WB's... and that's only maybe).

Places with different armour requirements:
- Outdoor Caves: Viperking, no PEPA's here.
- WB's: Shelter and b-deflector helps, no PEPA's here.
- Firemobs: Shelter needed, no PEPA's here either.
- Noobmobs, such as claunchers etc.: b-deflector helps, no PEPA's.
- PvP: Definetly shelter needed, how else can you take beating from the APU's holy lightning? Guess what, no PEPA's here.

Oh well, this is not supposed to be a rant about the armour. I for one think it's good looking and maybe useful for someone who wants to cap his weapon. Even though my HC PE doesn't get anything from the armour, she uses the rifle PA only for the cool lobster look. :)

Mantus

14-10-03, 07:47

Spy PA is awesome. You don’t have to wear the lvl 3 ones you know. Its perfectly possible for a spy to have inquisitor helmet + pant + boots, a heavy belt and still wear the PA lvl 2. Which is pretty damn decent if you ask me.

Spies may not take too much damage but with stealth its not an issue. Stealth is the best armor spies can have, all the other stuff is just there to make sure you survive a few hits while you pull out the stealth tool. Level 2 stealth is more then enough for any spy, so don’t think that you have to gimp yourself to be any good. Level 3 or the Obliterator is a novelty for lazy people.

Spies have a very important role on the battle field. I have had several occasions where my clan mates were cheering my name at the end of an OP fight. Funny thing is, my enemies probably never even saw me. =D

NeoChick

14-10-03, 07:47

Don't flame the guy he was just giving his opinion and probably learnt a lot fromt the anwers some people gave.

I can feel for him because I don't know a lot of things even though I have been playing the game for ages and occasionally or perhaps often i have misunderstood something about all this stuff and make a thread and ppl flame me, or not....

If we all knew everything we would not have to have a forum

Richard Slade

14-10-03, 10:07

Originally posted by NeoChick
Don't flame the guy he was just giving his opinion and probably learnt a lot fromt the anwers some people gave.

I can feel for him because I don't know a lot of things even though I have been playing the game for ages and occasionally or perhaps often i have misunderstood something about all this stuff and make a thread and ppl flame me, or not....

If we all knew everything we would not have to have a forum

true words true words
But something that's being discussed among the "Vet's" is something
THEY think everyone should know..
Although I gotta say the PE PA is a good one.
AND it's stupid that they get -PSI of all things.
However both Spy en PE are VERY hard to face in PvP if they're good
Just like the tanks
And APU, and even PPU
What does that make it?
A total hardness when your enemy knows how to play
And that makes it what?
Balanced 1v1

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 10:18

Um, IMO spies aren't very hard in combat even if their good. My apu has taken down many "good" spies without much of a problem.

Richard Slade

14-10-03, 10:20

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Um, IMO spies aren't very hard in combat even if their good. My apu has taken down many "good" spies without much of a problem.

Well then there's two options on that one I say
Either you're a damn good APU
or you haven't met a damn good Spy yet
I know for a fact both what I think and what you think
But we don't share the opinion here and won't change either
So I'll leave it at this :p

Wallen

14-10-03, 11:21

Speaking of APUs, I've noticed that I do the same amount of damage with my PE as my clan's APU, except he does it in one shot and mine comes in three round bursts. Like, he'll hit a mob for 120 dmg, and I'll do a burst of 3X70.

And he's a higher rank than me....

I don't think spies really need that much changing, just maybe a little more access to armor that gives other resists. Even with PA 2 on I can still only take 3 hits from DoY bot before I die, seems kinda ridiculous when I have 158 X-Ray Resist :( .

Richard Slade

14-10-03, 11:41

Originally posted by Wallen
Speaking of APUs, I've noticed that I do the same amount of damage with my PE as my clan's APU, except he does it in one shot and mine comes in three round bursts. Like, he'll hit a mob for 120 dmg, and I'll do a burst of 3X70.

And he's a higher rank than me....

I don't think spies really need that much changing, just maybe a little more access to armor that gives other resists. Even with PA 2 on I can still only take 3 hits from DoY bot before I die, seems kinda ridiculous when I have 158 X-Ray Resist :( .

120dmg with an apu?
Well take the first day I played in retail
the two monks taking me to MB the first time took down a hoverbot
Making 400-900dmg per shot
Don't know how they did it but it was INSANE to see

Clownst0pper

14-10-03, 11:51

I can only say people who think the PE PA is shite hasnt a clue on setting up a character.

I am so greatfull for it, MY PE can now use his capped judge without a Synaptic accelerator, and with a synpatic accelerator he can use his BOH/ROLH.

And all this moaning about u cant use shelter WTF you all on about? Course you can..:confused:

And it looks shit hot in black! :cool:

kurai

14-10-03, 11:54

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Um, IMO spies aren't very hard in combat even if their good. My apu has taken down many "good" spies without much of a problem. Yeah - APUs are a problem ... to put it mildly ;-)
(There's also the issue of 90% of them having a PPU nailed to their ass 90% of the time, but that's a whole other argument lol)

Tanks, PEs and other Spys aren't much much of a headache - if you get nailed by one of them it's your own fault for getting sloppy.

Pre PA you needed a somewhat gimped/drugged setup to be able to survive more than 3 seconds of a good APUs attention.

(That's not an exaggeration either ... a capped APU can drop 5 Holy Lightnings on your head in 3 seconds - if they all hit, then that would take out *any* non-sheltered Spy - guaranteed.
When you take into account the 264m range, no need for completely clear line of sight, and hit animation "lag" [i.e. By the time the target sees the hit from the 1st cast, there's another 4 on the way that will fry you, even if you are now totally behind cover/stealthed] ... bleurgh - horrible situation.)

Now matter how good my FPS "m4d sk!LLz" might or might not be, if a monkeh got to within 264 metres of me and I didn't notice *immediately*, then I was automatically fucked - no time to even select and use the stealth tool.

Out-ranging the PPU was the *only* viable tactic. You couldn't even sneak up close while stealthed, then let rip with a Ray of God/First Love or whatever - poor as an APUs defence is, it's good enough for them to last long enough to turn round, see you, and fry you before you can deal enough damage to drop them.

Most of the "skill" involved in an old style Spy vs APU fight was therefore simply to stay out of their range.

With the release of PA we should hopefully see that change - I'll still have to be damn careful - an APU will still *hurt* no doubt, but at least now I should be able to live that vital second or two longer to be able to drop him before he drops me.

Interesting times to come ... :D

\\Fényx//

14-10-03, 12:03

Originally posted by Clownst0pper
I can only say people who think the PE PA is shite hasnt a clue on setting up a character.

I am so greatfull for it, MY PE can now use his capped judge without a Synaptic accelerator, and with a synpatic accelerator he can use his BOH/ROLH.

And all this moaning about u cant use shelter WTF you all on about? Course you can..:confused:

And it looks shit hot in black! :cool:

agreed :) Im even getting used to the PE PA, well the back of it anyway o_O but yea im more than happy with the PC bonus, shame it doesent add to TC atall... shame you cant use blessed deflector... oh wait, armour off, buff, armour on... :rolleyes:

The PA rocks, seriously considering taking out my moveon, slapping in a exp ballistic and using a rolh :)

Dribble Joy

14-10-03, 16:49

Originally posted by \\Fényx//
agreed :) Im even getting used to the PE PA, well the back of it anyway o_O but yea im more than happy with the PC bonus, shame it doesent add to TC atall... shame you cant use blessed deflector... oh wait, armour off, buff, armour on... :rolleyes:

The PA rocks, seriously considering taking out my moveon, slapping in a exp ballistic and using a rolh :)

It doesnt give TC becuase that wil make you utterly dependant on the PA.
I considered going RoLH but.... I never was a cookie cutter and won't be one now :p

The one thing the PEPA did for my was to let me take out my dist3 and pop in a moveon, and still have an overall increase in PC. :D Judge is still capped, and my resists are insane.

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 19:17

Originally posted by kurai

Now matter how good my FPS "m4d sk!LLz" might or might not be, if a monkeh got to within 264 metres of me and I didn't notice *immediately*, then I was automatically fucked - no time to even select and use the stealth tool.

You're absolutely right. The only spies who got away from me were the ones who noticed me asap. But if for even 1 second they didn't notice, it was over. It was actually the same thing for other apus as well. The only thing it was very risky since they had my same range and firepower. :p

Perhaps higher stealth modules should have higher frequency so you can stealth faster.

Jest

14-10-03, 19:33

Last night in Neofrag a spy equipped with a Kami chip showed me the damage of his Silent Hunter and I was VERY impressed. His offense with other guns wasn't noticably different but his defense was actually still really good and the damage with that gun was massive. I'm gonna be scared to stand still in the wastelands now.

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 19:41

Jest

14-10-03, 20:12

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
:lol:

His defense was still really good? Yea ok. It was for a spy. He had over 400 hit points and to be honest the damage I was doing to him wasn't noticably better. I didn't think to myself "he is taking a lot of damage he must have a Kami chip in." It was about the same as another other spy. Which isn't great defense, but it seemed to me he had a nice raising of offense without a noticable lowering of defense. In my opinion, that makes it "really good."

kurai

14-10-03, 20:17

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Perhaps higher stealth modules should have higher frequency so you can stealth faster. I have a gut feeling it wouldn't be a very balanced thing to decrease stealth activation time - you'd have spies insta-vanishing all over the bloody place, as soon as an enemy even looked in their direction and no-one would *ever* kill one unless he was asleep at the keyboard, or you got lucky with AoE :D

The root of a spy's problems is that he simply dies too quickly - it's just accentuated versus APUs. The PA may have already solved this problem by giving us just enough defence to have a chance of competing in a more balanced way.

I think I'll wait and see how the new setup works out in a real battle first - haven't been in a decent OP fight since they were released.

SorkZmok

14-10-03, 20:20

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Perhaps higher stealth modules should have higher frequency so you can stealth faster.

I`d love that.
Most of the times i need to use stealth is when i get attacked from behind and half of the time i`m already dead before the fucking stealth kicks in...its like running away and klicking like mad while you get shot all the time.

THEN stealth kicks in, you get one last shot when youre already stealthed and *pow* you`re dead.

Even my Stealth2 takes more than 2 seconds to activate :(

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 20:21

Man I can't wait till I can use obliterator.

kurai

14-10-03, 20:25

Originally posted by Jest
Last night in Neofrag a spy equipped with a Kami chip showed me the damage of his Silent Hunter and I was VERY impressed. His offense with other guns wasn't noticably different but his defense was actually still really good and the damage with that gun was massive. I'm gonna be scared to stand still in the wastelands now. I'm surprised you saw any difference in SH damage at all.

The gun's main problem is that the single shot damage calc hit's the artificial limit designed to stop "one shot kills", therefore not all of it's potential damage gets registered on the target.

I capped an SH pre PA and pre Kami chips with no problem, and a non-gimped setup ... in fact (after having imps pop out etc) I did exactly the same shown dmg on an opponent with 155% gun dmg stat as with 178%.

The only time you'll see less than "one shot kill cap" damage on a first shot is when the target has *huge* pierce resist and a high level deflector running (or you get truly abysmal dmg% on the gun)

SorkZmok

14-10-03, 20:25

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Man I can't wait till I can use obliterator.

I thought about it but imo its a waste of skillpoints.

But i think its just cause i`m still used to crap stealth1, i'm fine with lvl2...still enough time to run away or change my location i think.

ericdraven

14-10-03, 20:26

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Man I can't wait till I can use obliterator.
You really want to gimp yourself for the Obliterator? Why?

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 20:27

Kurai do you hit the "3 hits to kill" mark for tanks?

I mean, I still think capping damage is important because then you still get more damage on leg hits. I didn't notice a damage difference on spies when I had psi 3 on apu, but when I hit their legs...........:p

Shadow Dancer

14-10-03, 20:28

Originally posted by ericdraven
You really want to gimp yourself for the Obliterator? Why?

Fun.

kurai

14-10-03, 20:33

Originally posted by SorkZmok
Even my Stealth2 takes more than 2 seconds to activate :( All the stealth tools have the same activation freq rating - 31/minute.
Add in the "weapon select" time, as it deselects after every use, and you have a value of about 2.5 seconds.

Personally I don't have a problem with that - any faster and I'd be practically unkillable, which would make the game no fun at all.
(For me too - since I cant use anything else while stealthed you might as well just call me Kasper, the Friendly [and Utterly Harmless] Ghost and ignore me at a fight.)

What I was trying to get at earlier is that spies need enough resist/armour/CON combination to be able to live longer than that crucial 2 or 3 seconds - since we have decent damage output, that would give us a more even chance of lasting long enough to actually get a kill .

kurai

14-10-03, 20:43

Originally posted by Shadow Dancer
Kurai do you hit the "3 hits to kill" mark for tanks?
It generally takes 4 shots (or more for a highly resistant tank) to kill anyone who starts at full health, because of the pesky artificial registered damage cap.

Assuming you cap RoF on SH (which is 24/min & needs approx 195 R-C) this means you need a reload (3 shot clip) to finish em off.

Total time to kill , if every shot hits, and you time the shots perfectly, and don't have to re-lock reticle, is 12 seconds :(

wolfwood

15-10-03, 02:31

hmm spies are not nerfed as bad as u think.

They do need work, but it helps when you know what your doing with them (no offense). What i mean is u cant just run up to a tank and close combat him unbuffed.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 02:50

How do you combat spies have 118 hack 80 PSU and still have enough points left over for wep lore?????

And 100 in all resists for a spy with over 300 health?? Am I reading this correct?

Since when can a spy use a full set of Inq armor?

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 03:02

Moveon, PPR, SA, SF, reflex 4 (either version) ?

Inq1 and a heavy belt plus the PA? Not hard.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 03:28

OK.....a spy caps str at 40. So a moveon adds 3. Thats 43. The boots need 45 and they have the lowest reqs of all inq. armor.

Second, the SF/SA give +20 wep lore combined. Therefore (with capped intel), with 118 hack and 80 PSU that leaves them with 95 for wep lore. Add the 20 and you get 115 wep lore. This person owns tank and PPUs? Can we say........NO?? Oh yea. With an exp reflex booster you can take away 10 weplore from that big ol' 115, which equals 105. I did that math...you can draw the conclusion.

VetteroX

15-10-03, 03:34

This forum has no shortage of stupid peope who have to complain because THEY cant build a good char. Its FULLY possible to make a spy that has 100 or over in the 4 "big" resits, force, energy, xray, and fire. on top of that they can use the best weapons like rolh and first love (FL is now really good with spy pa giving all that RC) with i drug they can use shelter.... you nothing about the game, learn or dont post.

kurai

15-10-03, 03:35

Originally posted by StrongSad
OK.....a spy caps str at 40. So a moveon adds 3. Thats 43. The boots need 45 and they have the lowest reqs of all inq. armor.

Second, the SF/SA give +20 wep lore combined. Therefore (with capped intel), with 118 hack and 80 PSU that leaves them with 95 for wep lore. Add the 20 and you get 115 wep lore. This person owns tank and PPUs? Can we say........NO?? Oh yea. With an exp reflex booster you can take away 10 weplore from that big ol' 115, which equals 105. I did that math...you can draw the conclusion. The setup he mentioned needs drugs to work. Adding shelter on top is only possible if you cannibalize most of the hack skill too.

@Vet : By the way - First Love is still as crap as it ever was. If you don't believe me, count up the number of spies you see using it in anything except Neofrag.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 03:46

Its not possible by my calculations to have over 100 in both fire and energy (thats with a PPR) when a spy caps at 40 con. Besides, you didnt clear my confusion with having 118 hack and 80 PSU.

I have only played NC for like 7 months. So dont get mad at me. I am simply trying to understand the game..

StrongSad

15-10-03, 03:46

Its not possible by my calculations to have over 100 in both fire and energy (thats with a PPR) when a spy caps at 40 con. Besides, you didnt clear my confusion with having 118 hack and 80 PSU or being able to use inq armor.

I have only played NC for like 7 months. So dont get mad at me. I am simply trying to understand the game..

PS- didnt mean to double post....I was trying to edit my 1st post :(

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 03:47

why you want 118 poke any way? get 111 and self-buff or get an IMP glove.
Spys have 100 dex, that 500 points.
50 to get to 50, 100 to get to 75, 175 to get to 100.

96 poke (163 points) + 19 from glove and buff
80 PSU (115 points)
that leaves 222 points to put in to lore.
175 reaches 100, 48/5 = 9 more in lore.
+20 from SA/SF, +10 from rifleeye3 -10 from reflex 4
Add a dist 3 and thats anther 15 lore.

=144 lore.

I think.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 03:50

You cant very well use a distance cpu if you already have a SA/SF, PPR, and moveon. Right?

And the person didnt say poke. They said hack, but that doesnt matter as much.

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 03:53

Originally posted by StrongSad
Its not possible by my calculations to have over 100 in both fire and energy (thats with a PPR) when a spy caps at 40 con. Besides, you didnt clear my confusion with having 118 hack and 80 PSU or being able to use inq armor.

I have only played NC for like 7 months. So dont get mad at me. I am simply trying to understand the game..

He means total Armour resist, this is separate from resists which add together with normal armour to give a final score.

Heavy energy belt : 70 armour
PA3: 101 xray?
inq1 helmet/legs/boots: approx. 75 armour

PPR adds 15 in fire/energy/xray/force
with about 15 from con in each total armour will be well above 100.

I'm not an experienced spy, so I may be wrong about all this. Yes above setup uses beast.

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 03:54

Originally posted by StrongSad
And the person didnt say poke. They said hack.

Sorry, my mistake.

Indeed I dunno how he did it.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 03:57

How can a spy use an inq helemt/pants with a str req of 49/48?

PS- thanks for working through this with me dirbble like a mature person. Rather than flaming me for not being educated. *cough*

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 03:59

Beast and a MOVEON - STR 48, all lvl1 inq is max str 48

StrongSad

15-10-03, 04:00

Oh..

The drugs.......guess I will never be uber than. I cant stand having to use drugs to wear amor. I dont know how anyone else can..

kurai

15-10-03, 04:02

Originally posted by StrongSad
Its not possible by my calculations to have over 100 in both fire and energy (thats with a PPR) when a spy caps at 40 con. Besides, you didnt clear my confusion with having 118 hack and 80 PSU or being able to use inq armor.

I have only played NC for like 7 months. So dont get mad at me. I am simply trying to understand the game.. It is perfectly possible to get over 100 in the main 4, even without a PPR and no need to gimp yourself on ATL. You also get a health pool aproaching 400, depending on exactly how your config is set up.

With the new PAs you don't even need to drug up to do it any more.

(The best new PA setup I've found gives INT102, CON 46, STR 49, DEX 115, PSI 20. The old pre-pa drug based setups have INT 104, CON 46, STR 50, DEX 115)

The PSI 25 shelter setup requires a drug, in either config, and you need a minimum of about 70 in PSU to get enough PSI pool to cast. You'd need to lose about 28 HCK or 18 WEP to get that.

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 04:02

Beast lasts as long as normal buffs, but yeah I don't use str drugs ever. I do use redflash on my PE to use the judge and subsequently the PEPA4, but other than that, no drugs outside of duels.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 04:05

(The best new PA setup I've found gives INT102, CON 46, STR 49, DEX 115, PSI 20. The old pre-pa drug based setups have INT 104, CON 46, STR 50, DEX 115)

How do you get that without drugs?

kurai

15-10-03, 04:07

Originally posted by Dribble Joy
Beast lasts as long as normal buffs, but yeah I don't use str drugs ever. I do use redflash on my PE to use the judge and subsequently the PEPA4, but other than that, no drugs outside of duels. Same for me - I tried the setup with X-Strong & Destrosol Forte, for INQ 1 armour & shelter - it *was* uber resistant, but you had to gimp too much on weapon stats, and the drug dependance annoyances got old *real* fast.

After a week or so I lommed back to a "standard" sniper setup until the +DEX/RC PAs arrived.

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 04:07

Originally posted by kurai
The old pre-pa drug based setups have INT 104, CON 46, STR 50, DEX 115)

kurai

15-10-03, 04:10

Originally posted by StrongSad
How do you get that without drugs?

SA/SF/MoveOn/Bez2/Str Booster 2/Experimental Heart 1/Spy PA 3

The old druggie non PA setup used SA/SF/Moveon/Bez2/Experimental Reflex 4/Experimental Heart 1 + X-Strong

StrongSad

15-10-03, 04:14

Wow.....sound pretty good to me.

Ill try.

Thanks for the advice :)

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 04:17

Thou must think outside the box.
Consider things that would normally seem doodah-silly-crazy-nuts.
Only then will you ascend into pwnage.

kurai

15-10-03, 04:19

Originally posted by StrongSad
Wow.....sound pretty good to me.

Ill try.

Thanks for the advice :) Oh - just reminded me - you *will* need to drug up with DEX one time, to get the armour on, but once it's on the +DEX bonus keeps it activated.

Zone or logout/resume to re-activate the bonus if you need to.

There are a couple of theoretical setups to keep the PA & the STR based armour on without drugs ever, but they *really* gimp you in other areas.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 04:26

hehe, dribble.....thats math crap....i cant think outside this "box"

When you gr doesnt that make the armor go away? But your saying if I zone it will come back on?

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 04:35

When the SI has gone and the armour is 'un-useable' but still in the slot, relogging will activate it's bonus and activate the armour, so redrugging is not required.

StrongSad

15-10-03, 04:36

awsome!

Dribble Joy

15-10-03, 04:40

Like with my PEs SA, I ahve dex 89 without it, so to get dex 90 I drug up, when the drug is gone the dex from the imp keeps it active. After I gr and SI is gone, I simply relog.
Same with the PEPA 4 too, with the SA i am only dex 95, I drug to use the judge, which was convienient for the PA, now when I relog I can use my Judge without the redflash. :D (but I still use the drug for it's insane AGL/ATL boost)

R.S.Savage

18-10-03, 21:02