Neo LoneWolf
12-09-03, 00:04
People whine about monks. People cry nerf at over-powered Hybrids. People moan about unkillable PPUs.
Why?
It's always the same cause to the problem - and it is that PPU is exceptionally badly implemented.
Hinch recently decided to draw a parallel to other MMORPGs wrt his beloved hybrids[0], so maybe I should start here. Psi-Monks represent both the mage-class (APU), and the cleric-class (PPU) in one class. All well and good.
Mage characters in most other RPGs will normally have a high damage-output combined with range, limited by resources (most common being mana & cast-time), and also denied armour to a greater or lesser degree.
Clerics, on the other hand, (beyond being comparitively more rare) will have a great support ability (including, most commonly, healing), with little/no armour restriction and tiny offensive output. Resource-limitation is there to stop the support getting out of hand.
Back to Neocron.
In order to have the same class carry out both careers, the PPU gains most of its defensive capabilities from PPU (as they can both wear the same armour - game-backstory wouldn't support an armour-affects-APU-but-not-PPU kinda game-gimp). In order to prevent the APU being protected by PPU (hybrids), chips that add largely to one, but negatively to the other were introduced. Hybrids came about without using these chips & were overpowered.
So +1 APU = -0.3 PPU (or whatever . . .) was introduced to once more segregate the two Monk worlds.
As combat skills, equated to other classes' combat skills, yeah, it kinda works. Ish.
Thing is - should it work like the other classes' combat skills?
Change the subject a bit:
Let's look at PSI from outside the Monk-PoV for a change, as I haven't seen it done recently.
Whenever a non-Monk looks to PSI, they see one thing - PPU.
Well, what are the other options?
APU? Let's see - a combat skill I can never do any real damage in
PSR? Yes . . . well . . .
Self-boosting and healing stands somewhat way-ahead of other options.
Am I trying to make a point here? Not really. But things are flawed with monks, and it's a fundamental problem with the whole APU/PPU dynamic.
I didn't write this post to put ideas out, but I'm a little bored.
So, here are a few ideas that will never be implemented due to the drastic changes that are required,. but might provoke some thought.
Firstly, getting rid of the +APU = -PPU is mandatory. I see it as a quick-fix type affair, and just limits the potential of the monk class entirely.
#1)
Mulling it over, it occurs that making MST more of a T-C like skill is an option. Split the APU and PPU spell-pools into two each, and make one of each require MST. Lots of stats & reqs would need altering, of course. Basic intention of the idea: Give monks pure APUs, PPUs and Hybrids. Hybrids would be those who use bothe APU and PPU, but in order to get any proficiency in either has to abandon the MST-req'ed spells. Basically, this doesn't do much other than bring back hybrids. Surprisingly, I came up with this idea when hybrids were still running around slaughtering everybody whole-sale.
#2)
Drop the whole idea of APU/PPU, replace it with something else, known for now as XPU & YPU. Split offensive & defensive spells between them (so one has, say, energy and the other fire, or one halos, and the other barrels, and so on . . . or whatever divide you like; and one can have shelter, the other deflector; both could have a heal (maybe . . .)). This will essentially bring Monks in-line with the other classes, each combat path will have it's own distinctive attacks, and defenses. Non-monks in particular will gain greatly in choice. Unfortunately, standard buffs (XXX boost) lose a home, which is kinda sad.
This leads to:
#3)
My favorite idea - Bring back EPU (Exotic Psi Use). Drop MST. Reduce the number of spells in the APU pool (there are *way* too many anyway). Make the EPU spell pool full of all the current anti-buff/debuff spells (Antibuff; Antiheal; Antishield; Antideflector; True Sight (?); Paralysis[1]; Provoke Enemy (?); Damage Boost), plus some more created just for hurting others' capabilities.
It should probably be intended for all monks to use two of the three (APU/PPU/EPU) skills to form APU/EPUs (High-power, no defense, ie current APU), PPU/EPU (unkillable, but unable to kill ie, current PPU), and APU/PPU (the original hybrid, minus damage boost, paralysis . . . ). Pures become far more interesting, and hybrids become easier to balance with them. In addition, non-monks gain a choice of PPU or EPU (and PSR, heh).
As I said above, these are purely ideas, and none will make it into the game short of a miracle. My main reason for posting is to highlight the real problem with PSI as a whole (and not just Monks) - PPU.
'k, I'm done.
[0] Although, from what I read of the link, it was about Fighter/Mages, not Mage/Clerics *shrug*
[1] Yes, freeze needs to not affect turnspeed. Still.
Why?
It's always the same cause to the problem - and it is that PPU is exceptionally badly implemented.
Hinch recently decided to draw a parallel to other MMORPGs wrt his beloved hybrids[0], so maybe I should start here. Psi-Monks represent both the mage-class (APU), and the cleric-class (PPU) in one class. All well and good.
Mage characters in most other RPGs will normally have a high damage-output combined with range, limited by resources (most common being mana & cast-time), and also denied armour to a greater or lesser degree.
Clerics, on the other hand, (beyond being comparitively more rare) will have a great support ability (including, most commonly, healing), with little/no armour restriction and tiny offensive output. Resource-limitation is there to stop the support getting out of hand.
Back to Neocron.
In order to have the same class carry out both careers, the PPU gains most of its defensive capabilities from PPU (as they can both wear the same armour - game-backstory wouldn't support an armour-affects-APU-but-not-PPU kinda game-gimp). In order to prevent the APU being protected by PPU (hybrids), chips that add largely to one, but negatively to the other were introduced. Hybrids came about without using these chips & were overpowered.
So +1 APU = -0.3 PPU (or whatever . . .) was introduced to once more segregate the two Monk worlds.
As combat skills, equated to other classes' combat skills, yeah, it kinda works. Ish.
Thing is - should it work like the other classes' combat skills?
Change the subject a bit:
Let's look at PSI from outside the Monk-PoV for a change, as I haven't seen it done recently.
Whenever a non-Monk looks to PSI, they see one thing - PPU.
Well, what are the other options?
APU? Let's see - a combat skill I can never do any real damage in
PSR? Yes . . . well . . .
Self-boosting and healing stands somewhat way-ahead of other options.
Am I trying to make a point here? Not really. But things are flawed with monks, and it's a fundamental problem with the whole APU/PPU dynamic.
I didn't write this post to put ideas out, but I'm a little bored.
So, here are a few ideas that will never be implemented due to the drastic changes that are required,. but might provoke some thought.
Firstly, getting rid of the +APU = -PPU is mandatory. I see it as a quick-fix type affair, and just limits the potential of the monk class entirely.
#1)
Mulling it over, it occurs that making MST more of a T-C like skill is an option. Split the APU and PPU spell-pools into two each, and make one of each require MST. Lots of stats & reqs would need altering, of course. Basic intention of the idea: Give monks pure APUs, PPUs and Hybrids. Hybrids would be those who use bothe APU and PPU, but in order to get any proficiency in either has to abandon the MST-req'ed spells. Basically, this doesn't do much other than bring back hybrids. Surprisingly, I came up with this idea when hybrids were still running around slaughtering everybody whole-sale.
#2)
Drop the whole idea of APU/PPU, replace it with something else, known for now as XPU & YPU. Split offensive & defensive spells between them (so one has, say, energy and the other fire, or one halos, and the other barrels, and so on . . . or whatever divide you like; and one can have shelter, the other deflector; both could have a heal (maybe . . .)). This will essentially bring Monks in-line with the other classes, each combat path will have it's own distinctive attacks, and defenses. Non-monks in particular will gain greatly in choice. Unfortunately, standard buffs (XXX boost) lose a home, which is kinda sad.
This leads to:
#3)
My favorite idea - Bring back EPU (Exotic Psi Use). Drop MST. Reduce the number of spells in the APU pool (there are *way* too many anyway). Make the EPU spell pool full of all the current anti-buff/debuff spells (Antibuff; Antiheal; Antishield; Antideflector; True Sight (?); Paralysis[1]; Provoke Enemy (?); Damage Boost), plus some more created just for hurting others' capabilities.
It should probably be intended for all monks to use two of the three (APU/PPU/EPU) skills to form APU/EPUs (High-power, no defense, ie current APU), PPU/EPU (unkillable, but unable to kill ie, current PPU), and APU/PPU (the original hybrid, minus damage boost, paralysis . . . ). Pures become far more interesting, and hybrids become easier to balance with them. In addition, non-monks gain a choice of PPU or EPU (and PSR, heh).
As I said above, these are purely ideas, and none will make it into the game short of a miracle. My main reason for posting is to highlight the real problem with PSI as a whole (and not just Monks) - PPU.
'k, I'm done.
[0] Although, from what I read of the link, it was about Fighter/Mages, not Mage/Clerics *shrug*
[1] Yes, freeze needs to not affect turnspeed. Still.