Whats The Point?

[Genty]

As I lie here dead in the Cycrow Lab UG the very big question comes to mind. What is the point?

Seriously, what is the point of OP's? A small income for a big clan? Probably, but thats the thing, a BIG clan.

My clan is quite a small CM clan, we are never gonna control a lot of the OP's on the map especially when all you basically need to win is numbers.

So, on pluto, which clans have the OP's

NDA? 73+ Members
PIMP? 73+ Members
DR? 73+ Members
The Gang? 73+ Members
DARK? 73+ Members

Now, we all know that not all of them will be active but the fact of the matter is that clans with 80+ members can easily destroy the small clans. People complain about not enough OP wars going on, but with these big clans holding the globe why should any body bother to challenge them, it always ends the same way. We win when the big clan has around the same members and advance taking a few op's. Later on they come back...with 2 or 3 times the amount of members complete wiping out everything in their path.

So I ask you, as i lay getting rez'ed killed, what is the point? You want more op wars and a wider range of people holding Op's? Then fuck off and reduce your clan size's because soon there will be no one left to fight, and you will get bored, and you will leave.

I don't want to control the map, I want a fighting chance to control at least 1 for 24 hours without one of the big clans either hacking when we are not online, or having 2 x our numbers.

[Pitspawn]

Actually you complain about clans being too big, i think they are often too small. Very rarely has a clan ever hit a too high active player count. Clans like DR have well over a hundred members on their roster but they normally only have 10 or so actives online at any one time. We are very much the same, as are other clans.

The lack of population in neocron coupled with a system that allows a single player to create a clan condemns the community. On each server there are quite literally 100-200 minature clans made up by 1-5 people, total waste of space. Smaller clans hurt themselves by having a smaller community. They are unable to help each other but bigger clans can offer a wider degree of tradeskillers and general help. There is a balance to be met however, sometimes big can be too big. Too many people and group coordination goes out the window. Often a clan knows when its getting too big and will naturally stop recruiting more members. If they dont members will leave because of lack of personal attention that everyone seeks. It is for this reason that i think big clans arent the problem its the small ones.

> Neocron needs new faces and old faces into the game.
> We need a system that actually makes outposts worthwhile.
> We need neutral genreps that people can use to go leveling with. Being forced to bigger factions just to get exp sucks ass. I understand increasing the need for vehicles is a good idea but when speccing vhc gimps your char for combat it just doesnt work.
> You should need a minimum of say four people to found a clan. This discourages the current small antisocial community.

If neocron had twice the current population the division of outposts would be larger. As many as 15 different clans would occupy the map, and there would most probably be a wider spread of factions.

Ironically the new genrep system forces superclans to become even larger as players flock to the big factions just so they can level.

[zanzan]

many people in big clans have alt charactors for tradeskills etc, so u dont look at the clan members number, u look at the online numbers

[deac]

amen

[Genty]

thats the point, at the end of the day everyone will either just completely ignore OP's or there will be 2 big clans left to fight for them with the odd small clan being trampled on and eventually giving up and quitting the game.

How can clans recruit a "big clan" when there is simply not enough people on the servers to hold more than there currently is.

I say restrict Clans to 50 (or whatever) which will promote kicking of inactives, have more active people in the clan and hopefully more clans would be on the map

[Rade]

I actually agree with pit here, odd eh :P

[hnlecter]

We should just remove OPS and leave the GRs. OP battles are a snooze unless you get that win from a lose position that makes it worth while.

[RuButt]

skill > U

[CR@SH]

What needs to happen is the max cap on the number of players a clan can have is 50. That is more than enough active people for any clan to have. And all they must do is simply kick out their inactive people. And also set a minimum of 5 people to actually found a clan. Those two things alone would liven up things in my opinion.

Then you can add in a bunch of neutral genereps and then everything should be ok for a little while. Because face it KK vehicles right now are too weak, too slow, and too buggy to actually make people have to drive them around on a daily basis.

[ex-machina]

Originally posted by Pitspawn
Actually you complain about clans being too big, i think they are often too small. Very rarely has a clan ever hit a too high active player count. Clans like DR have well over a hundred members on their roster but they normally only have 10 or so actives online at any one time. We are very much the same, as are other clans.

It's all relative tho.

A clan with 100 members may have 10 online at one time, a clan with 10 members may have only 1 online.

And that's often been the case for my clan, even with timezones matching

[Heavyporker]

Why not just make things simpler? I actually rather like the idea of merging uranus with saturn (think of it as booty in a car, if you know what I mean (prolly only americans will)), then even with 4 chars, the lessening of numbers of servers means more people on each server at a given time. Sure, it might hurt at first glance, but it actually should improve Neocron, until a real influx of customers come in and bolsters the Neocronian population enough to warrant reopening another server.

edit - BTW, I quite like the idea of a minimum of 5 players (not characters, PLAYERS) to start a clan (this would solve the problem of truant clan leaders, another plus I would think), and topping i a clan out at 50 members... If you wanted a larger clan, as in the case of NDA or someshit, you could do "chapters", wouldn't that rock?! Thus, clans would become much more manageable, would have more room for clan equipment, and so on. I give two thumbs up to this idea. Let's make waves, guys.

[•Super|\|ova•]

I can't see what's the point in kicking the inactives out of the clan. If we all do that they surely wont come active again any sooner and join your smaller clan. And if Genty was talking about fights with The Gang last night, I thought we had way less people (like 15 vs 8 or so) at the first figths but when we got our teams even then we took over the OPs...

And for the smaller clans... don't just hang on to your small clan because it's yours. Try uniting with other small clans to form groups that can take over OPs and defend them. That's what I did with my small clan when The Gang wasnt so big.

[MadDog]

the point is to have FUN

yes boys and girls, OP battles are fun, sometimes.

no its not always about personal gain, or feeding your egos with l33t PKing.

OP battles require skill, tactics, taking cover, holding ground, attack the weak areas of your enemys. FUN STUFF!

[Heavyporker]

well, supes, a few obstacles persist in alliances, namely, no alliance chat (should be like clan/team chat - the clan can choose if they will ally with another clan, just like declaring war, but in this, it would enable a custom chat channel with the other allied clans. would be nice...), and OP sharing... I mean, sure the clans could just go and hack off each other with an arranged plan, but wouldn't that kind of be a hassle? Why not have a "Turn the OP Keys Over" clan function as a power of the clan's leader... if he so chooses, he can sign over an OP owned by his clan to the leader of another clan.

I suppose there are other obstacles (yeah... the pre-existing owners of OPs that won't like others taking them, LOL) but I can't think of them now at this late hour.

[Archeus]

Originally posted by Genty
So, on pluto, which clans have the OP's

NDA? 73+ Members
PIMP? 73+ Members
DR? 73+ Members
The Gang? 73+ Members
DARK? 73+ Members

How real are those numbers though? I mean go look at NDA's clan and you will see a large number of "Inactive" flagged people. They kicked them out thier total would be very different.

Likewise with Alt's, again taking NDA as an example Centuri points out that 2 or three in his clan all belong to him (in RP thread). So how many others have alts too?

I suppose you could have the clan automatically kick people out if they were not in the clan for more then say 2-3 weeks. For people away it wouldn't be a big deal to rejoin the clan.

Would give you more accurate figures.

[\\Fényx//]

Originally posted by Archeus
How real are those numbers though? I mean go look at NDA's clan and you will see a large number of "Inactive" flagged people. They kicked them out thier total would be very different.

Likewise with Alt's, again taking NDA as an example Centuri points out that 2 or three in his clan all belong to him (in RP thread). So how many others have alts too?

I suppose you could have the clan automatically kick people out if they were not in the clan for more then say 2-3 weeks. For people away it wouldn't be a big deal to rejoin the clan.

Would give you more accurate figures.


Me, Pitspawn, Demon, OL, Anima(:() and Cent make up for like half of NDA's members with like 3 chars each in the clan, yet all of Anima's are currently inactive,most people in the clan actually have 2 charachters

[Genty]

Originally posted by •Super|\|ova•
I can't see what's the point in kicking the inactives out of the clan. If we all do that they surely wont come active again any sooner and join your smaller clan. And if Genty was talking about fights with The Gang last night, I thought we had way less people (like 15 vs 8 or so) at the first figths but when we got our teams even then we took over the OPs...

As I recall the first fight at Cycrow we had around 12 or a little less, depending if you class the hackers who don't fight or not. Not sure how much you had, i had to log for a bit.

However at Tezla it was more than even, you had at least 12 (Which i counted while dead before the rest of my clan got there) and I think you could of had a few more. We had around 15 at that point.

At Blackhill we had around 13 - 15 and the gang seemed to have one hell of a lot more. which is when the flow switched and we were never at full strength from then as a few had to log and we were lacking pokes.

Even if we did win that Blackhill battle later on that night we would of been down to under 8 people on when you would of had 15 + so it would of happened then anyway.

[Lucjan]

Originally posted by CR@SH
What needs to happen is the max cap on the number of players a clan can have is 50. That is more than enough active people for any clan to have. And all they must do is simply kick out their inactive people. And also set a minimum of 5 people to actually found a clan. Those two things alone would liven up things in my opinion.



This limitation would work great in a power gamer only environment, but not in the "real world". It would most likely lead to not accepting people into the top clans who do not play day by day for several hours. The casual gamer's life is already hard in NC, that would make it even harder.

I think we would end up with even fewer, but way stronger clans controlling all OPs.

/EDIT: actually we could do something for ourselves. If a huge clans loses a battle to a smaller clan over an non critical OP, why just not leave them be and give them that 1 OP for a day or two?