View Full Version : The failed PvP-server experiment
Theres a lot of talking recently about concentrating more on PvP and skipping or just fast-forwarding levelling up to cap (and PvP-status). Fortunately this diskussion didnt start like last week, but more than a decade ago. In september 05 KK (which still was somewhat alive that time) even set up an entirely new server ("Neptune") for the task. Way faster XP-gain, faster loss of synaptic impairment after genrepping, higher slotchance whan making new guns, faster regain of SL after a green kill, but still an LE ingame for the trader guys. Neptune was celebrated when it went live, but deserted, empty and closed down a mere 3 months later. In 2005 the playerbase was much bigger than today, so what happened? They're calling it "voting with your feet". If people dont like it, they'll go away. So its easy to understand that making Titan the next Neptune will simply make most people go away, leaving our vocal few PvP-forum-evangelists to guard an empty server. Good luck with that, guys.
To get back to a constructive discussion, heres the ruleset of Neptune (http://wiki.techhaven.org/Neptune). What would you change to prevent another dead server, and what would you do to bring new life to our fave MMO? Lets face it: There are way better MMOFPS out there. Games, that are built for fast action. Without all those confusing RP-parts. So what could we do to enhance the strong side of Neocron, the non-PvP one?
William Antrim
15-02-14, 20:21
Google sheep theory.
Nobody wanted to start over on another new server regardless of how fast they would be levelling when they already had capped chars and had brought all of their stuff over to the new server that was Terra. It didnt work for that reason. Solely that reason. No point levelling when youve already done it. Bang. That was the sound of the buck stopping.
this thread is just trolling again because you got smacked down in the other thread that had actually grown into a lively discussion about how to rekindle the fire in nc.
your sly digs and terrible sarcasm do nothing to ingratiate yourself with any member of the community and your own admission that you dont pvp just smacks you in the face when you try to get involved in pvp discussion.
Trying to start a semi-serious discussion about something that happened almost ten years ago does nothing for your credibility. The answers you will get here have already been recycled on this forum a hundred times over. I can predict even what the next four posters will say if this thread even gets that far. All you need to do is google any one of the other threads on the subject but i suspect you already knew that and have posted this one just to drag some of the limelight back to yourself.
Sorry but this is just flamebait.
Not much more to say on the subject but thanks for posting.
:)
i didnt expect you to discuss this subject without bias, willy, so have all the fun you want to. besides that: Neptune was populated, ppl were doing pvp. then it was empty. because they didnt like it. doesnt match your prejudice, i know. i wonder if you're able to have any discussion without any "ad hominem" attacks. well. no, i dont wonder. i care about neocron, not about your special needs, sorry.
i'd prefer to have a discussion among grown-ups, tho. anyone?
William Antrim
15-02-14, 20:53
If this is how you reply to a negative response no wonder nobody here takes you seriously. :)
Drachenpaladin
15-02-14, 20:56
I smell drama in here. Wonder how this will (d)evolve... #cheeky
William Antrim
15-02-14, 20:56
Again I refer you to the sheep theory. Player population on said server dwindled from an initial rush to start up to nothing because there were less people to fight as time went by. Some ran over there, levelled up a bit, tried it out and pvped at level 20 for a while maybe and then went back to their own servers.
I was playing regularly on Terra at that point and I cannot honestly say I remember Neptune ever being full. But then I have special needs, apparently. So it must be that.
Sorry friend doing my best to keep this civil but seriously you just need to open the window and get some fresh air occasionally.
as long as were all trying to stay at least loosely connected to the facts i'm fine with it. "i remember Neptune being populated" vs. "i remember Neptune being not" is an exchange of personal opinions. great. perfect. imho.
Doc Holliday
15-02-14, 22:45
Couldnt let this thread slide without getting a post in before the obvious lock.
Warning folks. this ones gonna be a long one. if anyone is of the tl;dr nature you might want to hop down to the next thread button and hit it.
Anyone whos still with me here we go.
First of all i don't recall Neptune. I left England in august 2005 and took off around the world travelling for 2+ years. I completely missed it so im not even going to bother with a discussion on that subject. All i can say relating to that time period is if this thread came up the way it is written today back then i think Nid2005 would have squashed it under the ban hammer as flame bait. Thats essentially what it is.
Now we fast forward to today. Before i go on i want to make one point clear. I am currently studying an MBA here in Sydney having graduated earlier this year with a Bachelors in Business here in Sydney. Im 33. Not a kid. Nor do i have special needs. I would consider myself an educated and well travelled man.
One of the things that was drummed in to me from day 1 semester 1 was to be analytical in business. I have been taught numerous models in business for analysis of a great many things. One of the most basic which is used time and time again is SWOT analysis. Strengths weaknesses opportunities and threats. This is taught in most decent high schools around the world and is driven home with each project i have undertaken as part of my MBA.
Neocrons greatest strength over and above all else is its control system. First person shooter. WASD. no tab targeting. nothing that plenty of other mmos have done. That lends itself to pvp. Simply put it is what drives this game. Labelling a few vocal people on this forum as "pvp evangelists" because you dont see that fact is like arguing whether the sky is blue when its a clear and sunny day.
The last line of your post torg about what should we do to improve the stronger non pvp side of neocron is the most damming of all. That is textbook trollbait if ever a book was written. Its like saying water isnt wet.
Lets be honest here and look at the facts. The community is tiny compared to what it once was. The game has survived and prospered due to a very unique grip it has had one some very talented individuals who have been able to pool resources and pull it off of life support and in to the Community edition we have today. The community is NOT hardcore. At the end of Terra and the beginning of Titan it was LE city. Zoltan summed it up himself when he said i dont think the community is hardcore enough to have played nc1. A runner who shall remain nameless was laughed at 2 nights ago (australian time) for saying im not removing my LE till i have rares and can fight back against pkers. He was laughed at because on australian night i am lucky to see 3% pop. No one in their right mind is going to go off on a ganking spree with it as low as that. The game is a ghost town at this time. yet still there is that 3% who play. Why? Its because of the unique draw neocron has. Its strength. Its combat system, setting, lore, familiarity, sheer bloody mindedness. and probably its refusal to die because of the small group who do still play and hold the game dear in their hearts such as the volunteers who run this game now
Suggesting that Neptune come back is as laughable as saying i have just seen a unicorn. The population currently cannot sustain it.
So we must again come back to the swot analysis. What can it do. What CANT it do. What are its opportunities to grow. What are the threats to it. Each one of these i can rattle of a great long list but i feel i would be insulting peoples intelligence if i were to do that.
However. With its limited resources in terms of what the NST can throw at it, plus the fact its still running on aging technology, and plenty of other things that affect it, we as a community must look not at what we cant do but what we can to help and support it. One of the most obvious is not to make stupid threads but here i am posting in one. We must play to its strengths. One of those is the PVP aspect. As mentioned in previous discussion the people dont come back (the returning vets) because they loved having an apartment filled with techs or trophies or some other stuff. No. They come back for the fights. For that adrenaline rush that no one who ever fought in a real fight in this game has honestly ever found in a great many other games.
THAT is the hook that neocron has over us. My forum join date is a testament to it. I started playing the game in december 2002. Its taken my 20s from me and i loved and hated it through the last 12ish years but i still have come back time and time again. So did so many others. Dismissing them out of hand and regarding those of us who have sought to bring some fresh ideas about how to rebait that hook and bring some of the older vets back to this beloved game to me is a slap in the face and i dont see how you have the grounds to actually post it.
Neocron does not have instances. It does not have raid bosses. It does not have amazing gear that you can show off on your avatar and stand around looking uber cool and having other people stare at you wishing they were you. To me it is much more cerebral. It hits you in a place most other games dont. Its the rush of combat and the fun from winning and beating your opponent. Again as i said its got a lot of things that hinder its development and the so called Pvp-forum-Evangellists are in my mind the most realest of the people on this forum because they can at least identify with this idea.
Play to the strengths of the game. No one is saying bring back neptune. No one mentioned it before you brought it up. It is simply a passionate community (whats left of it on the forum at least.) expressing itself because when all said and done we who play this game for the pvp are the only ones left here.
Anyone who says they came back because they love the pve is either A a masochist or B a very very big cyberpunk fan. As you quite rightly stated there are a million other games out there and a lot do pvp better than neocron. Funny how i havent found one that does though. What i do know is there are a million more that do the PVE better. Epic battles vs giant bosses. fully immersive crafting systems that let you become the greatest blacksmith that has ever lived etc. These things are all offered by wow and plenty of other games. Neocron offers something much more unique.
If you really wanted to start a proper discussion instead of another troll thread like your 99 dollar one you would have started it in the brainport.
Now please tell me im wrong on what i have said.
Because all i can read in the post of this thread when you cut through the bullshit is why game developers should NOT listen to community feedback.
Anyone who says they came back because they love the pve is either A a masochist or B a very very big cyberpunk fan.
Appart from the troll, I must be both of that.
I came back for the pve/craft and I am a great cyberpunk fan,
no other game of the 'type' of NC hooked me like that.
But perhaps i'll quit you soon, for a long time or not when Star Citizen (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/) will be release.
(Sorry for the ooc ad ^^).
Google sheep theory.
Nobody wanted to start over on another new server regardless of how fast they would be levelling when they already had capped chars and had brought all of their stuff over to the new server that was Terra. It didnt work for that reason. Solely that reason. No point levelling when youve already done it. Bang. That was the sound of the buck stopping.
^^ That..
i didnt expect you to discuss this subject without bias, willy, so have all the fun you want to. besides that: Neptune was populated, ppl were doing pvp. then it was empty. because they didnt like it. doesnt match your prejudice, i know. i wonder if you're able to have any discussion without any "ad hominem" attacks. well. no, i dont wonder. i care about neocron, not about your special needs, sorry.
i'd prefer to have a discussion among grown-ups, tho. anyone?
It died, because there wasent ENOUGH players that wanted to start over..
Sure, there was SOME players that moved over, but A LOT of players stayed on Terra (myself included - I just couldnt be arsed to level/farm shit again).
It had NOTHING to do if they liked it or not..
Lack of players to fight = no PvP = no population = dead server..
William Antrim
16-02-14, 09:57
There arent any facts to discuss in your threads though Torg. You never post facts. You post loosely disguised opinions intended to have a dig at one or another individual or section of the community in your self-righteous crusade to prove that we are all categorised into some broad stereotype.
Fasterbot you are clearly either the exception that proves the rule or the class clown who just disagrees with whatever the last person said just to be argumentative. The world is full of both but as I have not seen enough of your posts to quantify fully my opinion I am going to have to reserve judgement at this time.
Back to Torg, if you could please highlight the facts that are in any of your posts in this thread (besides the one that said I have special needs because that really stung me and I am not sure if we are friends any more, I am not sure I could bear it if not) in some other colour or underline them because I cant see any.
I see a lot of inflammatory opinion, designed to further an agenda that is as old and tired as methusela himself.
In the other thread that caused you to create this one Divide and respected members of the community were discussing bringing some of those aspects of neptune (faster levelling) to the main server with its bustling metropolis that is Plaza 1 on a weekend. The reason for that was to invite some of those old time players back to the game. Like last night when the pops went up to 15%.
So please before I hand you another length of rope will you just take a moment and think about - A) what your point actually is? and B) who is going to take you seriously if you post it.
When you have done that please will you come back here and post as the Torg who can make sound posts with well thought out discursive ideas because I know there are some in there. I have seen a few. :)
Dribble Joy
16-02-14, 13:10
I'm kinda in the middle.
Abandoning NC's RPG element would be a mistake as I see it. There is so much more potential in it and I do get a sense that there a good number of people who are, if not actively loathing of the atmosphere, at least those who want to immerse themselves in it. Actual RPers seem to be a genuine target for ridicule.
NC's community has changed, NC1 had much more in the way of RP because at the start, a higher proportion of people came to the game because it was an MMORPG. They came for the setting, the atmosphere and the interaction.
Alas the implementation of the setting was never very good; the mission system does little to immerse the player in NC's world, faction distinction is almost non-existent and the feeling of being part of the setting is minimal.
As a result, many of the more RP inclined players began to leave, this wasn't helped by the more dismissive elements of the community being exceptionally vocal in their disapproval of the 'carebear' section and colouring other people's perception of the player-base at large.
A mistake would be to segregate the community into two camps however, as much as people find it easier and more comforting to do otherwise, it's a sliding scale.
Like I said, I am in the middle somewhere. If pressed I would probably call myself a RP-PvPer. I like to get into my character and the NC world as much as possible, I like fighting other people, though I don't kill greens or yellows just because they're there, but I quite like doing PvE and running missions for the sake of them rather than as a means to an end. I'd like to see the removal of safe-zones, but I know the current symp/SL system and the population can't support it.
I also think part of the rush of NC's PvP is down to the fact that you have built up a character and it's effects. In CS there is no risk, no loss in loosing, there's also little to fight for.
People do seem to be getting more impatient though. NC1 leveling was slower than it is now, partly because people know the game inside-out, but also because of things like regants. However it didn't matter so much as unlike now, PvP viability (or at least the ability to reasonably take part in PvP) was not limited to capped chars and there was no WoC. Plenty of people (mainly PEs) used non-rares and many tanks used the Speed Gat.
The level progression could do with altering, in many spots it is slow, but in others it's crazy fast. It also doesn't help that missions are not an effective way of gaining xp (and they are short and boring) and PvE is dull, it does feel like a grind at times because of the AI and the general ease of play.
I also played Neocron for a long time now, and I can honestly say that I played all the different styles that Neocron offers for a long enough time but one.
When i started out as a noob me and my friends did the had no understanding of the game whatsoever, so we had plenty of time to spend on exploring and aventuring through the awesome gameworld and atmosphere that Neocron offered. We spent all of our time in the sewers of Neocron until we could find the way to were we wanted to go without a map up to the lowest levels of the sewers and basically mastered the knowlege of the noob areas until we were simply too "high level" to stay there. We moved on to the Outzone and then went out into the wide world of the Wastelands with Tech-Haven, the Canyon and the Military Base and everything out there to explore and it was absolutely awesome to experience that back then.(We also started the 17th squad for the first time back then when we were still huge noobs and you could simply take Jeriko with one hack :D)
When we were "high LvL" enough to go for endgame PvE and get rare weapons we joined a clan and mainly did high level PvE like WB farming, Ceres labs etc. etc. but we also did a lot of RP since we were in a kind of RP/PvE clan (cyberdyne) back then and there was actually a lot of action filled RP going on back then with the active storyline and events by KK. Back then i think most of the players did some kind of their own RP in the sense that even when the Black Dragon raided Tech Haven, they made it fit the storyline and didnt just kill greens or noobs, and the clans negotiatet with each other etc. etc.. I can honestly say i took part in a lot of RP back then, but it was never booring because it was never just sitting around talking, but always involved actually playing the game. At some point the mood in the clan changed and the leadership and most members started to disregard PvP as something bad and started calling some of our ememies griefplayers and didn't want us to fight back the DoY raids. But since back when we started, the first thing every noob did was to pull out his LE, PvP has always been a part of the game for us that we enjoyed and so we left the clan.
So the logical thing was to join a clan that actively engaged in PvP, and for a few years we fought for outposts almost every day, grinded up more characters to see how fighting was on any class and I actually won a PvP event and had to do WoC 3 on my PE. So back then we learned everything about PvP and though we still did PvE to level up and get our stuff, people like Torg would refer to us as PvPer/Griefplayers/Eploiters etc. etc..
Then the time came when the population dropped rapidly cheats became super popular and everything went down the toilet. At that time I didn't really play a lot, since most of the people that were left, weren't enjoyable to play with, and I never liked playing alone. So the only playstyle I didn't play since I dont enjoy it, is playing alone.
This is also the biggest reason why I hate the LE so much, since it gives people incentives to play alone and the LE ghosts who don't interact with other players at all that you sometimes see while farming disgust me.
What i can say is, that all of thoese playstyles are equally enjoyable but you should really not leave one out if you want the most fun Neocron has to offer.
In that reagerd I also think it's wrong when Doc says Neocrons biggest strength is the PvP aspect. I think all aspects belong in the top cetegory. But the big pro of Neocrons PvP is that it is currently the only aspect that offers any "replay fun". When you've played as much Neocron as I have, PvP is really the only thing at the moment that is still new excitement every fight.
So yeah, since the support team has limited time the top priority should still be the (broken) pvp balance, but in an ideal world I'm sure if you want the highest output, you would have to put your resources in all parts of the game, not just one or two. I'm going to spare you a list of the things that need to be changed to make all parts enjoyable and replayable but I'm going to say, that I think the support team has to involve the rest of the community much more if they want to achive anything meaningful.
[ edited ]
Dribble Joy
16-02-14, 20:11
What i can say is, that all of thoese playstyles are equally enjoyable but you should really not leave one out if you want the most fun Neocron has to offer.
Indeed. NC will always be niche due to the setting, but that doesn't mean it can't 'do a Tescos' and appeal to all types of people that enjoy it.
Fasterbot you are clearly either the exception that proves the rule or the class clown who just disagrees with whatever the last person said just to be argumentative. The world is full of both but as I have not seen enough of your posts to quantify fully my opinion I am going to have to reserve judgement at this time.
I can assure you that I am an exception, if you want to call me like that.
From my pov, NC is not the PvP game as it used to be anymore
and I don't want to play the game like that today,
but I used to love PvP back to NC1 when I was on Venus the french server
(It was another time, another 'setting', another mood, another poeple...).
But today, I still love NC like hell and continue to log in (yes, only during 2+X xp like now ^^),
only to try to cap all my tradeskillers, you sure have met at least one of them,
Ein (res), Zein (cst), Dein (brt in progress and capped rep) and Fasterbot (trophy hunter).
And I am doing this only to give free service to anyone want it.
ps : I think I am not the only one like that ;).
Long posts in here.
Sky is not blue, it is the way the light is dispersed by the atmosphere.
Sorry Doc. :)
Drachenpaladin
17-02-14, 03:58
Long posts in here.
Sky is not blue, it is the way the light is dispersed by the atmosphere.
Sorry Doc. :)
And yet, its blue.
Doc Holliday
17-02-14, 05:51
so we made it to page 2 with two huge posts which really didnt say a lot about anything other than a history lesson from dj and blue. Faster comes in and chips his part on about being an rper because he played venus which was a completely seperate entity from the main servers for a while and then we hop over to page 2 where we have descended in to some nitpicking :P
I guess this thread really did deliver.
Sky is clear, You bottle me some blue air Drachen, ill even pay you for it.
This is supposed to be a leisure activity, right? Something to relax by. Beyond that i'm fine with having started a discussion on what Neocron is, or could be. What we all agree on is that Neptune is neither. What we dont agree on is what Neocron should be instead. I say NC is a game still unfinished. Not fully developed. Plenty of space to explore, in game developing terms.
To me NC always was a theater stage to play on. Once i log in, i'm in-character. I never go there to shoot people, or to win a fight. I got plenty of competition in meatspace, so i wont need to compensate for that in the virtual world. To my understanding NC is lacking content. Dearly. And PvP is game content.
To a capped char theres not much else to do in NC but PvP, apart from WoC missions. So i sort of understand those chaps in the NC community insisting on PvP being "the only thing that matters". Of course its not, but it may appear to you that way, once you gained all the skillpoints and items you could ask for.
My solution for the "capped-char-problem" is to start a new toon. Going to new places, trying different weapons, playing along happily without a goal. You may want to do something different. Fine
As i've pointed out in various posts in this forum, it comes down to the basic question: "what do you want from Neocron?". If it's pure PvP, you'd probably better off with a pure PvP game. Have you tried Unreal Tournament's onslaught mode? Sometimes i wished Neocron could be like that. I'm really sure that Neocrons PvP is lacking, compared to other games - so why are people still coming to this world? I believe it's the atmosphere. So i believe we should care for enhancements of that atmosphere rather than faster levelling up to a status, where you PvP just to avoid the lurking boredom.
To my understanding we need more missions - and i'm happy that our Dev team took up the task. We need factions to be more significant, even faction NPCs and more background story to that. We need new items to struggle for, but what we need most is an upgrade to the story of Neocron. I don't think i'm only speaking for myself, but for quite some part of the playerbase: i need a reason for PvP. i can't be bored enough to just shoot. i did a good share of fighting in the past (both in NC 1 and 2), but those fights always had some story background, mostly faction tensions or city vs city (and i bemoan the loss of the Dome as a place to dwell).
But to bring back Neocron to at least some success, we need to have all kinds of players, all kinds of needs approached. concentrating on a single one will make this venture fail.
There arent any facts to discuss in your threads though Torg. You never post facts. You post loosely disguised opinions intended to have a dig at one or another individual or section of the community in your self-righteous crusade to prove that we are all categorised into some broad stereotype.[...]
Absolutely true.
To add something substantial to this thread: The rules for Neptune sound fucking awesome and I'd love to play a server like that. The only problem is that merely 1% of today's computer game players could take it. Not even the PvP guys would be in. Most of them only care for winning anyway, and not for the fight. That's the biggest problem for PvP, in my opinion. Not game mechanics.
Cursed Shadow
17-02-14, 14:36
People do seem to be getting more impatient though. NC1 leveling was slower than it is now, partly because people know the game inside-out, but also because of things like regants. However it didn't matter so much as unlike now, PvP viability (or at least the ability to reasonably take part in PvP) was not limited to capped chars and there was no WoC. Plenty of people (mainly PEs) used non-rares and many tanks used the Speed Gat.
The level progression could do with altering, in many spots it is slow, but in others it's crazy fast. It also doesn't help that missions are not an effective way of gaining xp (and they are short and boring) and PvE is dull, it does feel like a grind at times because of the AI and the general ease of play.
I agree with most of the things you're saying here, but I must say, we need to accept that Neocron has an ageing population.
People don't have the time for tedious leveling anymore, and that's why there is demand for faster leveling or "weekend exp", people just want to get back to either high-end farming or PvP (let's remember, most returning veterans will have been poked until they return by another runner).
Most other online games have upped the ante for experience gain, with either 'rested exp' bonuses or some other method which enables those who cannot play often to catch up.
I really would like some more immersive stories and events added to this game, to justify some back to basics Faction love, and I'm one of those who misses the Dome.
However, if we're going to assess the strength of this game, it really is in the PvP system. It is an MMO world with an FPS style of game-play, and even today I'd be hard-pressed to find a game that delivers that aspect better. If a Fallout Online came out, that would probably do it.
I do think that RP is a horse that is dead on it's legs nowadays. I think most of the true RP'ers have moved on, probably because the devs have fucked with their Factions so much, moved them around and made them live in a boring, shitty part of the Neocron City - Pepper Park which is fairly flavourless.
Devs even created favoritism among the ranks by introducing Mr Jones who only appears for a handful of Factions. You may as well have said no Private Eyes should go Anti-City. (How else would you get a Stealth Tool?)
I don't know what needs to be done to fix this game anymore, I tend to drift in and out of the game when I miss the PvP, but then I'm reminded immediately that there is nothing else to do. OP fights pretty much need to be organised among clans now, shooting Warbots repeatedly gets tiresome, trying to RP and find people to kill around Military Base is a meaningless exercise.
What we all agree on is that Neptune is neither.
http://bangshift.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/facepalm.jpeg
...The rules for Neptune sound fucking awesome and I'd love to play a server like that. The only problem is that merely 1% of today's computer game players could take it. Not even the PvP guys would be in...you're right. it didnt work. and probably never will. despite being more of a usual deathmatch-game than ever. to make NC a populated world it needs to be attractive not only to "hardcore players" but to all kinds. so?
MayhemMichael
18-02-14, 03:35
Now that double XP is off we all get to enjoy 5% pop again :)
RogerRamjet
18-02-14, 15:36
I haven't been in game massively lately but how are the Devs making Titan the new Neptune?
And the reason Neptune failed was not because it wasn't a good idea, but one which didn't come from the people who the community thought would use it. At the time FETISH was trolling the server (ah the good old days) and the OP scene was stagnant (in terms of clans), and there was much whine. The PVPers were for the most part happy as you could still get a fight any time you wanted, so why would they move? The answer wasn't a new server, but should have been to address the issue of content and RP potential which other parts of the community were unhappy with.
I can't remember any celebration of Neptune at the time, mainly because everyone I ran with (in NC Elite, R2K, FETISH on Terra, ATF on Mars and TNT on Mercury) ignored it. Part of the problem then, like you're doing nearly 10 years later, is trying to split the community into pvpers and non-pvpers. To improve this game both sides of the game needs to progress, they are not independent of each other.
But anyway, continue to drag up 10 year old ideas and follow your own agenda with regards the progress of this game. The reason the game almost went under is because of views of a narrow portion of the community and the exclusion of others, so I don't see why you're intent on repeating that.
William Antrim
18-02-14, 18:16
Well I'm glad that got settled. :)
Plain PVP - SPARTAthanks for making that clear. the OP was on a different subject, but well, you just cant start a new thread for every additional thought.
Doc Holliday
19-02-14, 06:31
The U-Turn in this thread from page 1 to page 2 by the OP was so good i can honestly say the only time i saw one better was by the black and whites in old episodes of TJ Hooker.
Doc, beautiful post earlier on.
Might I just add that I too am one that has always stuck around, all the way from beta till the community supported version of the game.
I never did much PvP in Neocron, I too was more of in it for the Cyber Punk, Post Apocolyptic vibes.
Always felt on the loosing side in that regard, as most of the population here is in fact here for the PvP, but it's never bothered me!
Just my 2 cents to a thread that should have died already, probably :)
William Antrim
06-04-14, 14:21
[ edited - so you decided to revive it again, two days later? ]
Drachenpaladin
06-04-14, 14:25
[ edited ]
[ edited - spam might be tasty but it's still spam. ]
Please, don't bump old long dead thread. Everyone else, report them instead of spamming them? :P
Closed.
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