PDA

View Full Version : Your Input On: Warzone Bonuses



Trivaldi
05-09-13, 12:45
Hello All,

While we're still discussing this internally, we'd also like to hear the community's opinion on this.

What ownership bonuses would you like to see from the new Faction Warzones (http://forum.neocron-game.com/showthread.php?152222-R-184-T-188-Test-Server-Patch-Notes) feature? What would make this a worthwhile alternative/addition to owning an outpost?

Remember: Warzones are owned by the Faction, not by an individual clan.

Cursed Shadow
05-09-13, 12:50
Hello All,

While we're still discussing this internally, we'd also like to hear the community's opinion on this.

What ownership bonuses would you like to see from the new Faction Warzones (http://forum.neocron-game.com/showthread.php?152222-R-184-T-188-Test-Server-Patch-Notes) feature? What would make this a worthwhile alternative/addition to owning an outpost?

Remember: Warzones are owned by the Faction, not by an individual clan.

I don't think the bonuses should be game destroying, but perhaps the Faction should be offered a choice of bonus on successful hack. The bonuses should apply for that faction regardless of where they are, not just within the War Zone.

Possible ideas:
+25% Exp Bonus
+50% Cash Bonus
+5% Movement Speed Bonus (5% increase to both Athletics and Agility)
+5% Health Bonus
+5% to all Trade Skills Bonus

Just kicking off some conversation here...

nabbl
05-09-13, 13:48
Maybe some kind of special ammuntion? Which does slightly more damage and has a different color?

Or PvP Points with some kind of ranking!

Cursed Shadow
05-09-13, 14:01
PvP Points with some kind of ranking!

Oh god, another can of worms :P

What rewards would be available to those with the most PvP points?
How often would these reset?
Would they only be earned in the WarZone?
Would these only be valid for enemies of your faction?
How could this be maintained as fair, and not exploited like similar systems in a majority of other online games?

RogerRamjet
05-09-13, 18:58
What about factions getting bonuses if they own all the OPs within their particular sphere of influence in the wastes. For example, CA would get additional bonuses for holding all the OPs close to NC, Simmons, Tyron, Krupp, Jeriko, McPherson, FA get a bonus owning Regant, Gravis, Redrock, Gabanium, Shirkan, Crest, TG get a bonus holding Grant, Cycrow, Tezla, Deveraux, and City Mercs get a bonus holding Jankins, Chester, Seiger, Rockshore, Drakhan. Have some of these spheres potentially over lap to create conflict, and you'd see the big factions (in lore terms, who have their own base) fighting over the wastes.

Here's a crude drawing of that idea. The key = TG are yellow, CA are light green, CM darker green, and FA are blue.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/1234984_10151709603290889_751890063_n.jpg

Drachenpaladin
05-09-13, 19:31
What about factions getting bonuses if they own all the OPs within their particular sphere of influence in the wastes. And ongoing...

You didn't really rad the OP?^^
The question was NOT about OP zones but the new feature soon to come in the next patch ;)

Torg
05-09-13, 21:37
RogerRamjet clearly didnt read the OP, but his idea is great: add a dominion/onslaught-mode (speaking in UT terms) to NC, so theres a "strategic" element in OP fights (and add areas for all other factions, plus boni.)

Warzone Boni should clearly be tradeskill ones, not combat. like Cursed Shadow said, 5% to all trade skills.

Divide
05-09-13, 21:54
For those who played vanilla WoW, you may recall the buff received by players in the capital when someone turned in the head of Onyxia. I believe this is a great method of application for a number of reasons:

Buff applied to characters in the zone at the time of capture - Encourages all members of the faction to get involved.



As for what the buff is, I'd suggest that it be PVP related. Capturing a faction warzone could be the rallying cry (see what I did there?) prior to a series of opwars.

Buff is applied to the character does not fade when entering/leaving certain areas - Runners can get involved then go back to what they were doing without feeling as if they lost time or participated in something frivolous.

Death of character ends buff - Further promotes the desire to play in a group. Can create rivalry between runners if buff is terminated due to being PK'd

The buff should be applied to all runners of the victorious faction in the zone each time it is captured.

flib
06-09-13, 03:20
Buff applied to characters in the zone at the time of capture - Encourages all members of the faction to get involved.
Death of character ends buff - Further promotes the desire to play in a group. Can create rivalry between runners if buff is terminated due to being PK'dBoth of these ideas would significantly devalue the Warzone. There should be a significant benefit to motivate people to fight over it.
I think the buff should be persistent between deaths for all faction members. However, an additional buff for those who contributed would motivated people to participate.

Divide
06-09-13, 03:33
Both of these ideas would significantly devalue the Warzone. There should be a significant benefit to motivate people to fight over it.
I think the buff should be persistent between deaths for all faction members. However, an additional buff for those who contributed would motivated people to participate.

I see what you're saying in at least one way. It would be a downer to only receive the effect on 1 character when most players presumably have 4.


Depending on the nature of the buff, I still disagree about the buff persisting. If it is pvp related, it needs to fade at some point if for no other reason than to make the fight for the warzone even next time it comes around. If it is tradeskill related, then I suppose there is no point.

Cursed Shadow
06-09-13, 10:33
I see what you're saying in at least one way. It would be a downer to only receive the effect on 1 character when most players presumably have 4.


Depending on the nature of the buff, I still disagree about the buff persisting. If it is pvp related, it needs to fade at some point if for no other reason than to make the fight for the warzone even next time it comes around. If it is tradeskill related, then I suppose there is no point.

It would fade when another faction wins the WarZone.

Ivan Eres
06-09-13, 10:43
I'd vote for no buff or bonus, at least combat-wise. Why should the owner get an advantage in defending if the fight should stay fair.

Just make it a zone with no beltdrop, no sl loss, and deactivated LE and hit it. Change the zone's position in the city every now an then. Move it to NC.

RogerRamjet
06-09-13, 15:09
Sorry, this is what happens when you flick between threads with similar sounding titles! Trivaldi would you move it to the thread about Outposts?

Divide
06-09-13, 17:55
It would fade when another faction wins the WarZone.

I think the majority of players would be ok with that if the buff had no impact on PVP. I initially imagined it would since this a PVP zone, but it obviously doesn't have to be.

I don't know if I really like or really dislike Ivan's idea about deactivated LE. On one hand I like the potential additional runners being involved in the fight and hopefully being inspired to remove their LE. On the other, I worry that it could encourage grown child syndrome (/60+ with LE in) because they can scratch the PVP itch whenever is convenient for them.

The zone should definitely be a no belt drop zone, but I do think SI should be applied on death to avoid constant respawn zerg. I imagine the same amount of SI applied to a droner when their drone is destroyed should be just fine for this purpose.

The idea about the zone moving is awesome. The environmental variety would really add some freshness to the whole process.

hatmankh
06-09-13, 22:38
One of the bonuses could be access to stores that sell discounted items like, parts, chems and drugs (None of the BD FSM drugs of course). If possible this discount could be applied to the faction's vendors at their HQ, you know the ones that sell tools, tool substances and drugs.

This isn't a huge incentive to fight at the warzones which is why I'd suggest it as an additional bonus not the only one.

Alduin
11-09-13, 23:28
One of the bonuses could be access to stores that sell discounted items like, parts, chems and drugs (None of the BD FSM drugs of course). If possible this discount could be applied to the faction's vendors at their HQ, you know the ones that sell tools, tool substances and drugs.

This isn't a huge incentive to fight at the warzones which is why I'd suggest it as an additional bonus not the only one.

The following is my opinion only and may not represent the opinion of the team as a whole!

I was thinking about new currencies to pay the folks at those stores (like e.g. faction points which you would also gain by doing missions so you are not forced to do PvP when trying to get those rewards). Like PvP rewards in other games, however I am a bit unsure about that. A crucial point in my opinion is to make sure that the best weapons and stuff is still obtained by trading with players. What do you people think?

Torg
12-09-13, 03:33
A crucial point in my opinion is to make sure that the best weapons and stuff is still obtained by trading with players. What do you people think?so this would be trophys or awards instead of regular weapons, right?

hatmankh
12-09-13, 09:08
What does everyone think of having cheap mass produced knockoff versions of rares? They could use the same assets but have worse stats like 10-20%* less damage or they could have the same stats but instead of 100-120 quality would start with 99% like regular weapons. They would take a ton of 'faction points' to buy and would act as a bridge between store weapons and epics to rare weapons. Some additional requirements could be added like having completed the epic of your faction and having max sympathy with it.

Another thing that's been suggested several times is cosmetic items like PA with different colours, some of the PAs are FSM so to make sure people still need to go through FSMs you'd be required to take an already existing PA to a npc and in exchange for some points have it modified only to look different.

Some of you might comment on this saying it's adding more grind to the game, my response to that is it's adding another option, no one has to grind in the warzones because the rare guns will still exist and are better so you could do the same thing you've always done and just hunt rares, ignoring this part of the game completely. Any PvPer will eventually want to own a real rare to be competitive anyway so this won't effect trade.

*This number is just an example, the idea would be to make them weaker than rares and stronger than store bought, perhaps equal to an epic or slightly better.

Agent L
12-09-13, 11:05
I was thinking about new currencies to pay the folks at those stores (...)
Please, everything but the gold/silver/copper coins silliness. We already have one currency for NPCs (nc), and another (unressed) for players - because of nc inflation.

There are numerous examples in history of trying to patch up crashing economy by having different currencies. If you want a modern one, look at Cuba.
More than one currency means only one thing - inability to make one hold it's value. If you can't keep one currency afloat, you're certainly unable to do it with two of them.



+25% Exp Bonus
+50% Cash Bonus
+5% Movement Speed Bonus (5% increase to both Athletics and Agility)
+5% Health Bonus
+5% to all Trade Skills BonusNow here's a proposition to do one thing without f**ing up 10 others in the process. +1 for voice of reason!

Start small. If it 's not enough then work it up.
Learn from past mistakes of "revolutionary" changes that did more harm than good.

hatmankh
12-09-13, 15:06
Agent L you seem to have misunderstood Alduin's idea, he's not talking about more cash currencies that work like credits, he means faction points you get only from doing missions participating in warzones and they can only be spent in one or a few special stores. Currency might not be the best word for it though. It's not comparable to copper, silver and gold at all because you can't convert them to credits or vice versa.

Cursed Shadow
12-09-13, 15:27
The following is my opinion only and may not represent the opinion of the team as a whole!

I was thinking about new currencies to pay the folks at those stores (like e.g. faction points which you would also gain by doing missions so you are not forced to do PvP when trying to get those rewards). Like PvP rewards in other games, however I am a bit unsure about that. A crucial point in my opinion is to make sure that the best weapons and stuff is still obtained by trading with players. What do you people think?

Some would say that WoC disks were intended as a currency, yet all that has done is create demand for WoC based items.

If you add a new currency system for Factions, you're just going to create a demand for items to purchase that are different to normal FSM items. When you eventually do crack and give people those special items, you're then isolating your non-PvP oriented runners.

Any system that provides physical rewards rather than temporary bonuses will be exploited to death, or the "if you can't beat em, join em" policy will out and everyone will roll into one faction.

Agent L
12-09-13, 16:15
Agent L you seem to have misunderstood Alduin's idea, he's not talking about more cash currencies that work like credits, he means faction points you get only from doing missions participating in warzones and they can only be spent in one or a few special stores. Currency might not be the best word for it though. It's not comparable to copper, silver and gold at all because you can't convert them to credits or vice versa.If it walks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, it is a duck.

The fact you call it "not a currency" does not change the fact it is currency.
Same goes for unressed - they ARE de facto currency, even if noone designed them for this role.

The whole point of multiple currencies it to make them not convertible officially and let free (and usually black) market drive the exchange ratio.


Any system that provides physical rewards rather than temporary bonuses will be exploited to death, or the "if you can't beat em, join em" policy will out and everyone will roll into one faction.My point exactly.

Torg
12-09-13, 22:50
ok. faction bonus points, to buy special armour, equipment, ships... it's been done in eve online, and not in the worst way.

Grunt
12-09-13, 23:39
There is the unbalanced faction population issue. The faction with an already healthy population and/or active PVP Clans will dominate the Warzones (and the special item market.)

Forge new faction relations and make the Warzones Alliance vs Alliance.

With the little information how Warzones work, except you have to hack a terminal four times, it just sounds like an OP fight. So the fight itself is nothing new and creating an artificial motivation to participate won't last in the long run or leads to a mass exodus to the already "big" factions.

Make the fight itself special or scale the whole thing up to Alliance Wars.

Drachenpaladin
13-09-13, 00:12
There is the unbalanced faction population issue. The faction with an already healthy population and/or active PVP Clans will dominate the Warzones (and the special item market.)

Forge new faction relations and make the Warzones Alliance vs Alliance.

With the little information how Warzones work, except you have to hack a terminal four times, it just sounds like an OP fight. So the fight itself is nothing new and creating an artificial motivation to participate won't last in the long run or leads to a mass exodus to the already "big" factions.

Make the fight itself special or scale the whole thing up to Alliance Wars.

^This.

Divide
13-09-13, 00:16
Maybe the solution to that would be that the buff bonus' effectiveness is divided across online players of the existing faction, effectively reducing the benefit of the buff in large factions-- hopefully as a way to encourage some variety. One of the problems with this is very typically, pvpers move factions to re-align friends/enemies as the population changes over time.

EG: 5% construction buff
10 players online - full 5% application
20 players online - 2.5%
50 players online - 1%

William Antrim
16-09-13, 07:28
I think that all this will do is make people flock to the faction that has the clan that owns all of the ops. If that happens the op fight scene will just die rapidly without opposition.


If you want warzone bonuses to work then factions need to be able to take over ops and zones much more easily than they currently can. Ninja hacking needs to come back. Make people ninja more and they will fight sometimes. This would be better than no ops getting taken at all.

Agent L
16-09-13, 16:42
hmm, what about warzone bonuses having a positive value OUTSIDE of warzone, but negative INSIDE it.
This way they would be desirable to obtain, but difficult to defend.

OFC another solution is to have them so miniscule that holding a warzone would be more a matter of pride than of actual profits.

Third idea: Warzone makes conquering nearby ops easier (or even possible at all) - kinda blend with concept brought up by RogerRamjet.

Exioce
18-05-14, 00:13
How about a bonus to PvE within the zone? Maybe a damage bonus against mobs? Maybe an xp bonus from killing mobs? Would encourage players to hunt in and around the zone they control rather than be "Oh yeah, some clan from my faction owns that, big deal"

It might get people out there.

Artricia.
12-06-14, 23:46
Interesting ideas!!!

I would love the uplink OPs let you retain the hack bonus when you enter hacknet...then the bonus would be...umm...worth something? And not just easier for your own faction to hack it from you?

I would also think a daily income from controlling a OP would be nice too...something along the lines of 50k per op per day....then people would be getting cash for capping ops. Adding another currency would be nice buuuuuuuut, really not necessary imo.

arthego
21-06-14, 10:23
What about rare/unique weapon and armor parts that are only available at particular OPs. Might require some effort to set up, but say you wanted to build some Omega weapon, armor, vehicle, imps etc. Maybe like WoCish strength gear. You might have to capture OP x, y, and z and have to hold them. Make the parts non research-able and limit the supply. Like 1 would randomly be available every 3 days or so from each of the OPs so you'd have to keep up on it. This would encourage clans to maintain control and fits into the games style already.

And I know this is off topic, but what about doing something similar with PvE by adding world bosses that grant anti-city or city faction bonuses for like a day depending on who kills them. This might be extreme but what if they gave one side say +65 imp skill then one side could re imp themselves. This would be like a PvP and PvE bonus without effecting balance in a dramatic way. Say 3 or so world bosses but only 1 spawns at a time and never while the last bonus is up. Make the spawns random in the world to encourage exploration/hunts.