View Full Version : @ KK - Why don't you?
I'm not sure how much you guys (KK & rest of the community) follow the world of MMOs, but I do, religiously.
Free to Play is booming right now, and people are trying games they generally wouldn't touch.
So... in this one instance, why not FIX the new account system so that it does not require payment of any kind, and offer the game entirely free of charge to get the customer/player base back up. Once it's at a decent level, and you deem the game worthy of supporting, you can patch out the cheaters and consider a new payment model.
I am of the opinion that you could attract perhaps 100-200 new players (being realistic), and seeing noobs run around everywhere would be a joy.
I could get you an article on a certain major MMORPG.X website.
Plus, all the cool kids are doing it.
Since you're already on the topic I'll add my 2 cents.
I hate to bring up the devil here but Warcraft has some good examples of how to profit. They are in a sense double dipping with charging monthly subs aswell as extras, but those extra's are a great example of how a company like KK could make some extra profit on top of things they have going in BP atm which I think is just xp related.
For example they will, for a fee, grant you a one time ability to change server or change the gender of your charactor. They also sell ingame items for cash, not any items that effect ingame play but rather are cosmetic.
The gender change likely wont bring much if any money, but a server transfer could. Aswell ingame cosmetic items are usally a very good selling point, something like the babe suit or maybe even a common PA like woc1 with a different color set. A little imagination can go a long way.
With it free at the moment it certainly wont hurt to have some possible income from the game, and may be a good way to keep it free wile making money as everyone loves a free game. Truth be told I keep comming back and leaving over and over but if the game wasn't free I likely wouldn't be.
at this point, if they didn't fix most of the issues but still started charging for anything, the game would empty completely in seconds tbh, who wants to pay to be ignored...
there are three things that would need to happen for me to start paying:
- Anti-cheat patch with actual anti cheat (not just encoding the network data)
- Active GM's that are actually aware of things in-game, familiar with community and familiar with the cheats
- A content patch, doesn't have to be big, but do something to make melee tank/pe, HC pe and apu/hybrid at least feasible for more people.
if you want to have a good thing to charge for on a microtransaction level, make switching factions cost money, not much, but a little (.5-2 euro), but keep the system as it is now (taking ages of repetitive shitty mission system to gain sympathy)
Or make proper faction changing missions (some epic mission that makes u spy on ur old faction to gain trust with the new or something?).
i would pay for an orange woc3 pa or an john carpenter suit. DO IT
dodgefahrer
23-06-11, 17:33
Yeah some micropayoptions would be great esp. for faction change (which shouldnt be hard to do at all).
Wonder if some1 from KK still reading the NC forum or if they are all busy in BP.
Doc Holliday
24-06-11, 08:15
fix the cheater problem or no amount of free stuff will lure people back in. if anythin i can almost imagine more people would be encouraged to cheat. free to play games are more susceptible to people "trying" to cheat. APB has had this problem and has been very forthright in how they will come down very hard with their anticheat policies.
On a side note. paid for items. i know what i would pay for. a full size model in my appartment. the nc1 player models :) and the old model pain easer on my wall. (i know someones bound to go raw raw shitty models etc) but seriously. i would pay for that. i think it would be a nice piece of nostalgia without harming anyones gaming experience.
fix the cheater problem or no amount of free stuff will lure people back in. if anythin i can almost imagine more people would be encouraged to cheat. free to play games are more susceptible to people "trying" to cheat. APB has had this problem and has been very forthright in how they will come down very hard with their anticheat policies.
On a side note. paid for items. i know what i would pay for. a full size model in my appartment. the nc1 player models :) and the old model pain easer on my wall. (i know someones bound to go raw raw shitty models etc) but seriously. i would pay for that. i think it would be a nice piece of nostalgia without harming anyones gaming experience.
you might as well hang all your weapons on your app wall doc, its not like you could hit anything with them :D
Doc Holliday
24-06-11, 23:14
you might as well hang all your weapons on your app wall doc, its not like you could hit anything with them :D
LOL. yeah. totally true. nostalgia does that you huh :)
if timezone permits i will get on with you guys and see just how bad i am now. i havent played pc shooters in so long. im used to xbox now (and bad at it still)
It appears this thread will be totally ignored like the rest.
All I'm saying is, fixing your account system is easy. It's a PHP front end and a SQL back end. Just sort it, pretty please.
It's just laziness, and an absolute LACK of interest in the game and its success.
I support this idea. With Fallen Earth going down the sewage, Earthrise shown a horrible launch and SWG closing down at the end of this year, there are a lot of potential customers who might be interested in a game that offers optional full PVP, Housing and real territorial control.
For Europeans or people with previously existing accounts it's not much of an issue, but as been said, Americans have severe trouble with C2P.
It appears this thread will be totally ignored like the rest.
All I'm saying is, fixing your account system is easy. It's a PHP front end and a SQL back end. Just sort it, pretty please.
It's just laziness, and an absolute LACK of interest in the game and its success.
Sadly yes. I've noticed KK have announced a "massive" add-on for BP, where if you read the details, it doesn't look like much at all.
For Europeans or people with previously existing accounts it's not much of an issue, but as been said, Americans have severe trouble with C2P.
IIRC in the US, C2P is classified as a gambling website, and I gather it's illegal to use credit cards on those sites.
As for F2P, I think it's a good option for NC, if it's done right. Having seen what they did in Black Prophecy badly, I'm do worry they will apply some of the poor ideas to Neocron. (This is one example (http://blackprophecy.gamigo.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14586) )
Couple of ideas. Gold PA, make that available to buy.
Fast track tradeskill licenses - makes construction, repping and researching 2x fasters. (And if you could get a clan version that allow everyone in the clan to get the 2x speed-up, that would be cool as well!)
But first, KK needs a working game and a working accounts system.
You mean like clan apps like they have guild ones in wow where u have to lvl your clans to active them for X2 speed maybe something like 20% less si for GRing places
Doc Holliday
27-06-11, 12:10
no no no god no. dont do what wow did with the guild perk bullshit. small clans wouldnt have a prayer in this game. same as in wow. it totally sucked.
nice bp thread ;)
i would rather see NO micro payments but if it must be done make it simple stuff and not stuff that impacts heavily on the game. or if it does then make it worthwhile. ie skill releases w/out xp loss or something. even slot enhancers and stuff if they were worth using.
dont do the stuff being complained about on the bp forum. dont fuck up 2 games.
William Antrim
27-06-11, 20:55
Napper since when are you in nottingham?
also cool bp thread, I think i will give that a wide berth.
anyway back on topic.
Yes i would pay again for this game. I would buy shit in the game for stuff that looks unique to me. I am a 30 yr old male with a decent disposable income and a passion for pc games who just wants that something different from his games that he cannot get elsewhere.
That is what made neocron so great for me. You could tell people to fuck off after you killed them. That alone is worth paying some money for. I want this game to do so well. I really truly am a horribly fatalistic fanboi. After 9 years of playing this game it has become like part of my family.
I might as well admit it I just dont want to be the one turning the light off in the server room cos everyone else packed up and left.
i would resign from this game if it would become a f2p, to hell F2P micro-transaction system.
i would resign from this game if it would become a f2p, to hell F2P micro-transaction system.
...It pretty much already is. The idea of selling novelty items for money is about as good as it can get here. It wont impact you ingame and is a way for them to possibly make money to support the game without monthly sub costs comming back. Because lets face it, population already sucks and theres a good percent of people playing that wouldn't bother if they had to pay for it.
i would resign from this game if it would become a f2p, to hell F2P micro-transaction system.
I'm not talking about making it F2P with a crappy micro-transaction system.. actually read my thread.
I'm talking about fixing the new account system and actually advertising it as free to play FOR NOW, so we actually have some people to play with.
Doc Holliday
28-06-11, 12:26
i still prefer a monthly fee. the amount would depend on what they do with it. if it stays like it is then a minimal fee. if it gets improved somewhat then by all means charge a little more.
if it stays like it is, you would probably be the only one that would pay anything... an anticheat patch would make me play again (an anti-cheat patch only works if it is monitored constantly, else the cheats just change a bit and come right back), but it sure as hell wouldn't make me pay 5 euros a month again, unless things change in support, GMs and events, but how likely is that, knowing KK...
Doc Holliday
28-06-11, 12:47
if it stays like it is, you would probably be the only one that would pay anything... an anticheat patch would make me play again (an anti-cheat patch only works if it is monitored constantly, else the cheats just change a bit and come right back), but it sure as hell wouldn't make me pay 5 euros a month again, unless things change in support, GMs and events, but how likely is that, knowing KK...
sorry. i meant pops wise etc with JUST an anticheat patch thing sorted to clear out the shit. a big overhaul of the system would make me pay more but a minor few tweaks would make me feel a minimum sub is worth it.
pve needs redoing imo. i dont wanna have to stand a million miles away from a mob to have a chance of killing it. i want to be able to get in and mix it up and beat them one on one like in 2.0 or 2.1 what ever. i used to be able to fight against multiple warbots for example and not worry too much. that was fun. one shouldnt be a chore. its rare that i can pull one these days without pulling loads.
theres a myriad of things i would like to see changed. the imps etc i can live with for now but pve being one thing that should get a nerf and make it easier. easier = more accessible for solo players = more fun = more people.
dont make us team for the sake of it. let us team because we want to.
unnerf apus etc. the list goes on. get rid of cheats first tho.
ah right, totally agreed, make leveling outside of regants feasible ye.
ah right, totally agreed, make leveling outside of regants feasible ye.
THIS.
That was/is the most disappointing thing about the current version of NC... seeing everyone level in the same damn place.
Fix the poison caves I loved that place
Doc Holliday
28-06-11, 14:00
fix all of the pve. make it accessible.
CHANGE the gr rules. turn off the ability to lock them. make the game accessible to people or simplify the rules. right now clans have too much power. you want people to come back then make it easy for them to pick up and play it again and get back in to it. i have always been opposed to the gr rule changes. never liked it. i think it gives big clans too much power. making these changes back again would give the game some extra fun. there wont be factions that everyone flocks to or avoids on account of these.
not ten minutes ago a guy in game was saying how it sucked being black dragon because he cant use any gen reps. make it so he can. it will be a positive step forward.
I kinda agree with the gr rules, but only in the sense that there should be more public grs. i think its a bad idea to open up the grs in ops themselves, but for example make more public grs near things like crp, wetlands/regants, techhaven, mountains etc.
fix all of the pve. make it accessible.
CHANGE the gr rules. turn off the ability to lock them. make the game accessible to people or simplify the rules. right now clans have too much power. you want people to come back then make it easy for them to pick up and play it again and get back in to it. i have always been opposed to the gr rule changes. never liked it. i think it gives big clans too much power. making these changes back again would give the game some extra fun. there wont be factions that everyone flocks to or avoids on account of these.
not ten minutes ago a guy in game was saying how it sucked being black dragon because he cant use any gen reps. make it so he can. it will be a positive step forward.
Change the GR rules? Hell no!
Travelling in NC should be risky and dangerous. There are enough open GR's to allow you to travel to most zones easily, and most of the open GR's have a ASG close by to allow you to pick up a Quad. Also whether the GR is a open one, or an op GR, you still need to travel to activate it.
As for clans having the power to lock the GR's down, I think it's fine. I could take the whole map, and lock the GR's to clan only. That would certainly piss off my faction members, but what's stopping another clan from taking the op and running a open-GR policy?
Our Black Dragon player needs to know a little more about open GR's and Quads, hope you helped him! ;)
I think the GR rule is fine but to help the problem of not being able to GR anywhere. More free GRs are needed like to get to Doy u need to all to El Farid witch is like 8 zones away if not more.
People needing quads and stuff to get around would mess around with everyone's setup. So simple to fix MORE FREE GRs keep the ops same as.
MB, Outzone, Battle Dome and DRT are the only ones with ASGaree they not and I think theres only 7 free GRs that are in the wasteland I may be wrong bit I can't think of any others. There needs to be more
Nick
William Antrim
28-06-11, 19:42
PVE needs to be like it was in nc1. Caves/graves need to be uber unless youre in a team but the bosses need some decent loot...... a new gun or something or a weapon that can be used by multiple classes pitched at a certain level.
IE - swamp caves pitched at mid level runners dropping mid-high level guns, chaos caves dropping high end non rare guns with epic stats. ALL epic stats. Copbots in the mine need reworking, the storm bot needs to be WAY down the bottom after a massive run and that storm laser needs to hit harder than a water pistol. Not as good as the creed but still good.
Regants pa needs to be easier to get but it needs to be WORTH having.
All Epics need to be restored to how they used to be. CA pa needs to be as good as regular PA (as in copy the stats) so that CA runners can represent their faction and mix up the game a little.
Fire mobbing should be done in a rhino imo and there should be areas where it can be "suggested" that runners take their vehicles to fight with.
Drivers of vehicles should have some form of repair facility within their vehicle, so that they can repair the vehicle the same as we heal when we are fighting. However getting out and fixing your vehicle needs to work the way it does now, this would encourage more people to use vehicles without crippling their regular combat skills. This would also solve the gr problem cos we would all be driving again.
Even the lowest level of vehicle should have at least a automatic weapon on it. In the 20th century we were able to mount machine guns onto our trucks. This should be the case in the 26th.
We should have places to go solo levelling too, certain zones like the uplink we used to go to and hack warbots all those years ago. I forgot the name its right up the top near MB though... near drakkan fortress i think. Not sure but you get the idea i hope.
Pve should be fun, not just a necessity to get pvp guns. PVP guns should not all be needed by constant Pve either. I dont want to see the two split like in wow but I would like to see pvp happen much earlier. More guns should be viable. I have waxed lyrical on this subject before though so im not gonna bang on about it all again.
In short i would be happy if pve went back to NC1 quite honestly just go back to the original drop rate, not the 2004 nerf. 1 rare per warbot was fine if you confine it to just L and T rares. Make E rares drop from firemobs or anything over 100. Make the rares drop dependent on rank though, not mob type.
So for example a 70 mob would possibly drop L rares, 80 drops L and T, 90 drops T all the time and one in ten E, over 100 drops lots of T (sometimes 2 at a time) and E.
I think this would go some way to making the game somewhat fun again.
Oh yeah and double the XP gained for team levelling (or just 1.5x the gain) but make solo levelling still possible. Make all caves give the same xp per mob based on level. So if a cave is aimed at level 40-50 runners make it give the same xp as all other caves aimed at that level.
I dont know how much of this the engine can handle quite honestly as im not a techy.
It is mostly a wish list and its all i seem to do here any more but i loved this game. I grew up with it. I just want to see it return to its former glory, a cult classic.
fix all of the pve. make it accessible.
CHANGE the gr rules. turn off the ability to lock them. make the game accessible to people or simplify the rules. right now clans have too much power. you want people to come back then make it easy for them to pick up and play it again and get back in to it. i have always been opposed to the gr rule changes. never liked it. i think it gives big clans too much power. making these changes back again would give the game some extra fun. there wont be factions that everyone flocks to or avoids on account of these.
not ten minutes ago a guy in game was saying how it sucked being black dragon because he cant use any gen reps. make it so he can. it will be a positive step forward.
I can't comment too much on the PVE since I just recently returned and when I left the Firemobs near TG Canyon or the Warbots near Milbase shred you to pieces. Levelling was easier before.
As far as Outposts and Genreps, keep them as they are now. Seriously, coming from Fallen Earth PVP Towns and Factions were a joke there. In order to take control of a town you had to grind PVE Missions. Once you got into control, you had to grind more missions in order to upgrade vendors. The vendors sold stuff that you couldn't get from most other vendors, but are likely to drop from PVE mobs. On top of that, control over a town was coupled to a timer which then reset the town. Factions there, well let's say the Devs successfully abolished them by ongoing patches.
Except for crafting variance and graphics, Neocron is still superior to Fallen Earth.
Except for crafting variance and graphics, Neocron is still superior to Fallen Earth.
And we can replace 'Fallen Earth' with the name of pretty much every MMO on the market that attempts to offer a similar experience.
This is what annoys me so much. It seems the developers have absolutely no idea what huge potential they are sitting on here.
That's all they're doing, too; sitting and occasionally shitting and pissing on it.
Neocron is their toilet, and has been for years.
dodgefahrer
29-06-11, 14:50
For me GR system is pretty fine since:
1) u need to run across the whole map to activate em which is fun to explore
2) u cant "just" genrep to any location u want. So sometimes u have to run/drive thru some sectors which is fun since there is always a chance of getting PKed on the way.
btw skilling to be able to use a quad isnt that big deal at all.
William Antrim
29-06-11, 18:26
i know dodge, i just wanna see vehicle combat and other stuff too.
Manuel Moonez
30-06-11, 00:06
Oh my, you guys already contributed so many ideas again. I have no such things to say; only that iŽd do everything to get Neocron back. While iam perfectly comfortable even playing this game alone on the server, fixing the bugs would be something iŽd buy some vanity items for. Maybe even a little propeller hat.
And we can replace 'Fallen Earth' with the name of pretty much every MMO on the market that attempts to offer a similar experience.
This is what annoys me so much. It seems the developers have absolutely no idea what huge potential they are sitting on here.
That's all they're doing, too; sitting and occasionally shitting and pissing on it.
Neocron is their toilet, and has been for years.
in some ways your right, in more accurate ways id say your wrong.
id love KK to make this F2P with a few little items for sale that may cover server and advertising costs, then advertise the crap out of the game in one last huge push, to see if they can get a population back and take it from there.
but at the same time, i would like them to keep ther servers up for another 10 years.. which if they invest more money into the game and dont get any back, then bye bye NC. :(
Its a gem, but unfortunetly an unpolishable one by what has been posted here in the past, would be nice to get a comment on the state of the sourcecode from KK.
in some ways your right, in more accurate ways id say your wrong.
id love KK to make this F2P with a few little items for sale that may cover server and advertising costs, then advertise the crap out of the game in one last huge push, to see if they can get a population back and take it from there.
but at the same time, i would like them to keep ther servers up for another 10 years.. which if they invest more money into the game and dont get any back, then bye bye NC. :(
Its a gem, but unfortunetly an unpolishable one by what has been posted here in the past, would be nice to get a comment on the state of the sourcecode from KK.
just because we don't all agree on the exact nature of how the game should be balanced (i mean, which game is every balanced in everyone's favour), we pretty much all agree on a huge chunk of things that could be easily fixed to make the game more balanced, so it's far from unpolishable. It's just that KK don't care one bit about the game nor the players. This is simply fact, not even pessimism. No bug takes over a year to fix if they were working on it as they literally said they were (one of the indisputable facts about KK and it's community)
It's just that KK don't care one bit about the game nor the players. This is simply fact, not even pessimism. No bug takes over a year to fix if they were working on it as they literally said they were (one of the indisputable facts about KK and it's community)
He's absolutely right. It is fact.
We've been told lies over, and over, and over again.
i only said its unpolishable as in bug removal, of coarse they can redo balance.
However lies aside, you know the way KK do things, do you really want them doing another total overhaul and stuffing it up even more again? :P
unfortunetly, the same thing happens with bugs, they fix one, 3 more are added, then the one that was fixed breaks 3 days later so we end up with 4 bugs.
I do hope they do something, but i would rather they remade it keeping all the great points on a new engine - they better keep the same great feel for NC3 though, the feel is what makes the game, not just the great features, i think.
well I personally don't care much about the balance, I have fun with both melee tanks and apu's. But the biggest issue is simply the damn cheaters, and pve being boring. Just disabling the stupid changes they did to the mob damage would be a start, and doing the anti-cheat patch will keep the most common cheats at bay for a few weeks.
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