View Full Version : A few questions for KK
Serious_Sam
14-05-07, 18:22
Right, i'll get straight to the point. I have a few questions i would appreciate having answered.
How many people are actually working on NC now?
What areas specifically in NC are these people working on?
Are we still technically 'testing' 2.2?
If 2.2 is proving to be a major headache for both players and developers, what are the chances we can just revert back to 2.1?
and finally....How can you as a company convince us as a community that you haven't abandoned NC in favour of new projects?
Thank you all for your time.
ashley watts
14-05-07, 18:52
This thread probobly wont get answered :( some good questions to
What are you working on at the moment?
Are Weapons going to actually get balanced? *cough* creed, dev, freeman *cough*
When can we expect the next patch?
What will it contain?
Will tanks and monks get some nice new shiny PA?
Will you fix some err... graphics bugs? ....Freezer Rifles & Regants PA with weapons (doesn't look right)
They won't even respond, so don't bother. They haven't responded to any thread lately, which is a pretty bad thing !!
Serious_Sam
14-05-07, 23:54
*bump*
In fact what is the current headcount of KK coders and devs working on the game? We don't see them much on the board here to know who it is.
Good luck getting an answer on KK resources, I'm still waiting from 2005!
Are Weapons going to actually get balanced? *cough* creed, dev, freeman *cough**cough* Why haven't you mentioned the Crossbow? ;) It's still the most overpowered pistol in the game, dishing out far too much damage. Then there's the Ion Pistol, it looks all good on paper with the high damage output and low frequency, but when used in combination with any other weapon, it's very overpowering on its target. This is especially true if that person is using it in combination with the said overpowered pistols, namely the Freeman and Crossbow. :(
And aye, good luck getting tolerable answers to these questions. :mad:
ashley watts
15-05-07, 17:25
If the weapons mentioned above need balancing then balance the Ion weapons *Cough* Ion rifle and cannon, pistol isnt so bad as its 1 shit and the reload constantly bugs :p
Bishop Yutani
15-05-07, 18:03
When they had the Ask the CEO event, a few people, including me iirc, asked questions about personnel and they never got answered.
Assume what you want to from that...
Serious_Sam
15-05-07, 19:21
You know what? I'm going all the way with this. Until i get satisfactory answers, i shall continue bumping this thread until it has maximum pages, or it gets closed.
http://www.ashidakim.com/zenkoans/zenindex.html
Have some koans to contemplate as you await your answers.
*cough* Why haven't you mentioned the Crossbow? ;)
Haven't seen that many people with it, and I can take an Xbow PE with undies and cs so.. I didn't even have to resort to my creed or dev :D
Ofc I would much rather not have to switch my shiny woc PA for some shitty ionic undies, and I'd rather use my EOF rather than a creed or dev, but hell we dont play NC because it's fair and even, we play so we can bitch at each other :D
I think the Reakktor staff went on holiday and didn't mention it, imo the forums have died as far as replies from mods/dev are concerned.
I think they had the following meeting;
Dev; "what is the word from the forms?"
Mod; "They say you f*cked up 2.2"
Dev; "FFS SCREW THE KACKNOOBS IM ON HOLIDAY!"
Mod; "DON'T GIMMI SHITE FOR YOUR MISTAKES, AND IM GOING ON HOLIDAY TOO!"
*doors slamming*
End of meeting.
Death Dealers
15-05-07, 23:42
There are also questions in the Mall Event 1 Winners post to answered
Serious_Sam
17-05-07, 00:44
*attention seeking bump*
Gash jackel
17-05-07, 00:50
So they refuse to answer any questions regarding personel numbers? Wierd
TicketInspector
17-05-07, 10:51
Yup, this is kinda dissapointing. Lack of communication too is bad.
Thing is 2.2 is really buggy. The rate of fixes/tweaks will mean, in 5 years time, we may get it to NC 2.1 standards.
There are quite a few imballances too as regards APU's, Melee tanks, droners and other such classes which are too overpowered.
C'mon KK, talk to us. Talk to the customers. We all need to know whats going on because frankly, some are loosing faith.
Good luck getting an answer on KK resources, I'm still waiting from 2005!
Q - How many KK employees does it take to change a light-bulb?
A - Twenty. One to change the bulb and nineteen to say "Not bad, but I could've done better."
Serious_Sam
18-05-07, 22:14
Ok, maybe i should clarify the reasoning behind my questions. If anything, i want things to be put into perspective. If we are informed that only say, 6 people are on the NC dev team, then surely our demands wouldn't be so extensive.
It also just gives us as a community an idea what you guys are doing, if you're working on other games then there is no reason not to tell us. Hell, it might even do your business some good. Either way, this isn't a way for us to have more bitching fodder, so to speak, but a way for us to perhaps empathise with your position.
Again, i implore you all, give us some sort of coherent answer. Please.
Bozz-Von Mel
21-05-07, 17:23
So if you want everything perfectly balanced then why dont we just all have 1 type of weapon? Would you really want to spend countless hours on WOC to get a weapon perhaps only 5-10% better than its nearest rare competetitor? Overpowered, Underpowered....etc....etc...when is anyone ever satisfied?
If we are informed that only say, 6 people are on the NC dev team, then surely our demands wouldn't be so extensive.don't say a number as high as 6, you'll scare them.. that's why they never admit it's just a one man programming team (maybe 2 if you count darkfall the new guy, if he's not left? :p)
don't say a number as high as 6, you'll scare them.. that's why they never admit it's just a one man programming team (maybe 2 if you count darkfall the new guy, if he's not left? :p)
6 part time workers from linden labs :D
Serious_Sam
23-05-07, 18:22
*i haven't forgotten bump*
Serious_Sam
31-05-07, 20:49
*Yet another bump*
If you've not received an answer by now I'm afraid we're not prepared (or able) to give you one. Bumping further will only result in closure.
However, some things are clear:
We don't share resourcing details. We never have.
Yes, we still have people working on testing/balancing of 2.1
I think the announcement this week shows we are still committed to the game and its communityN
I would hope they'd be testing 2.2 too Nid :p
Serious_Sam
04-06-07, 23:52
If you've not received an answer by now I'm afraid we're not prepared (or able) to give you one. Bumping further will only result in closure.
However, some things are clear:
We don't share resourcing details. We never have.
Yes, we still have people working on testing/balancing of 2.1
I think the announcement this week shows we are still committed to the game and its communityN
And to think you could have said that weeks ago. Thanks.
And to think you could have said that weeks ago. Thanks.
If I'd leaked the announcement I wouldn't be here now. Without the announcement there really wasn't much point posting.
N
If I'd leaked the announcement I wouldn't be here now. Without the announcement there really wasn't much point posting.
N
Thats fair enough, but I keep saying the same thing when these sort of threads come up.
If someone just says "There is no news this week." is way better than silence. It just shows that you are caring about the community.
"No news" posts usually just cause more tension, and besides, you know by now that we care about the community or we wouldn't be here after however many years. ;)
Serious_Sam
05-06-07, 16:01
I cannot deny that. Thanks for your dedication despite difficult times. Feel free to close thread.
"No news" posts usually just cause more tension, and besides, you know by now that we care about the community or we wouldn't be here after however many years. ;)
Does this mean we get a new game engine? :angel:
Tekktonic engine really needs to retire. :p I mean it would make FREs and the current netcode problems and general growing pains of the old engine go away. Not to mention that anything that's done now is basically going on top of an old and flawed system, and probably puts even more stress on it. I can't see why else the "netcode" and databasing has steadily gotten worse as the game became more complex, yet the population was never too stressful on it's own. I mean, so much work has gone into trying to adapt it to Neocron/2 and hammering out the bugs, and now some of it is over 10 years old. I realize a lot has been changed and added, but the core of it is the problem now.
It would probably cost a lot to modify a new engine to suit Neocron's needs, but I imagine the monthly fees would be well spent on it. I think, when you get down to it, this game would be so much more popular if the game base itself were up to date and worked solidly. It feels like the game is now a mesh of glue and rubberbands trying desperately to hold it together. People are clipping everywhere, synching at random spots, crashing at zone lines, Fatal Runtime error, vehicle bugs in DX9 mode, etc, and that's when there's less than 100 people playing too. Surely an MMORPG should handle more, and they do, just not the ones that use such an old engine. ;)
I mean the artwork, sounds, scripts, map layouts, story, atmosphere, etc are all pretty good, and even if all of that were converted as best as possible to a new engine, the benefits even without redesigning all of it would be tremendous. A lot of the current balancing project is working out great, but even changing those scripts around and getting things balanced won't improve gameplay on that core level. Even if everything's balanced, combat will be annoying with everyone clipping and synching. I just don't think the game's engine can handle it all.
I think at this point, giving up on the thought of a new and improved engine is basically saying Neocron can only be where it's at now or go downhill, never better. You can even add a DX10 mode in the future and hammer more bugs out, but at it's core it's just not as capable as it should be. That's just from my experience.
Any thoughts?
specranator
05-06-07, 22:29
Any thoughts?
nailed it on the head? ;)
I think we've already stated that we won't be making any major changes to the engine. It would mean a complete re-write (i.e. a brand new game).
N
Gash jackel
05-06-07, 22:39
True. Maybe theres an updated version of Tekktonic that we can upgrade too?
Gash jackel
05-06-07, 22:41
Oh yeah one more thing. The staff have yet to notice that they have an abundant source of "free" labour available to them. There are most likely a number of players here who are sound programmers who could help work out bugs in the game code if you let them and chances are they'd work for free or for ingame rewards. Why not try using that to lighten the work load?
Tekktonic is our engine, so if there was a newer version you can bet we'd be using it. ;) I think we still compare favourably to our competitors. I've seen Tabula Rasa, for example, and I'm not that impressed to be perfectly honest.
N
/edit - "free" labour don't write game engines. I've still never seen a single community-driven MMORPG reach anything like retail quality (or even get off the ground to be honest).
Tabula Rasa - Doesn't look too bad from the screenshots - I would say it was slightly ahead of NC due to the fact it had higher res textures, but I'll leave the people who have played Tabula Rasa for their viewpoint.
As for the community-driven MMORPG, I'm sure I heard one project started recently, but the name escapes me.
Gash jackel
05-06-07, 23:54
Well second life is community driven. But though you should at least look into it.
The SL engine wasn't developed by its community.
N
I'm not sure my good friend Gash means free labour for just the engine. I believe he means for free labour for ANYTHING that would help the game develop. Tbh it sounds like a good idea.
Other than just giving our opinions on how the game progresses for us as players and testing things on the test server when needed is there anything that the computer savvy runners out there can help KK with? Because as Gash said, I'm sure they would be willing and able.
I'm probably just being an idiot and there's loads of red-tape that doesn't allow this sort of thing or at least makes the whole idea not worth implementing.
As far as "free labour" is concerned, it's foolish to expect Reakktor to even think about allowing random members of the community to get their hands on their source code, simply because of the risks (and possible legal issues?) involved, so it's a bit silly talking to them about getting help from the community with the engine, but it's worth a try all the same to see what reply you'll get.
On the other hand, I really can't see much a problem in allowing the community to produce actual content in one form or another, within reason. How can accepting a free gesture be wrong? NPC scripts are simple to create as the Lua language is very simple to understand, even for someone with minimal understanding of programming concepts. The functions being used within those scripts make it appear almost like pseudocode.
It still baffles me why a script wasn't written to do the implant swapping when 2.2 went retail, as it was better than forcing GM's to sit there doing it manually for a couple of hours (or was that the point, to allow GM's to be seen in their shiny PA for once? :p). Why couldn't they have been trying to get a simple event going instead, even logging Ironhead on and running around spawning things? ;) I won't keep going down that road again though, so carrying on...
I'm sure there are many members of the Neocron community that are gifted enough to create sexy 3D models and such; one person even offered to do just that many months ago, so why not accept the offer? I'm sure plenty of of other people could help create some nice funky tools, weapons, armours, and particularly new sectors and mobs, to go hand in hand with the storyline (which again, could be progressed upon by volunteers). Even getting some new clothing designed would make a nice change, and all people need is the opportunity, and approval to do it.
I'm a coder rather than a designer myself (it's still baffling to me how people create such stunning art on a computer. :p I frequently visit http://www.speed-painting.com/ and become mesmerized by Nico's insane artistic talent and hope he's released a new video to watch :D), and without going into any 'naughty' specifics, I've wanted to create various server-related utilities for a long while, to boost/aid the goings on in-game It would seem Thanatos may be the better person to speak to after all this time, I'm not entirely sure. Trying to contact Thanatos does seem a tad scary, as I would assume he would steal Nidhoggs banhammer and bash my account after reading the next paragraph alone. At least I was always honest about the idea and my intentions while knowing what may happen for even suggesting it, and there was never any malicious intent on my behalf, which hopefully counts for something.
My first main idea that I worked on, as I say, for a short while, was a Neocron Robot (ie, a standalone client; of which attempting to figure out the protocol breaks the Rules of Conduct, hence why I stopped working on it after making a some progress; my Neocron account is precious :o) to instantly respond to textual commands through either DIRECT or pre-specified channels (ie, Tech Haven - Runner Services, HELP, and BUDDY for operators as mentioned below) to return different responses. I guess you could call it the most primitive of AI.
One command was aimed to enlighten newcomers on various subjects while easing the load on us experienced players so we don't have to repeat the same old time consuming replies over and over, and make better use of our game time by being able to keep on firing at a mob, or constructing, etc.
How many times have we replied "To reset your position, type /set reset_position 1. If you can't move, it's working, and you just need to wait a couple of minutes" whenever a newbie says they've fallen down in hacknet or got stuck in a door? :lol: As used on IRC quite often, it would be much simpler to type !tell <runner> about reset to send a DIRECT message to <runner>, or just simply !tell reset to respond on the HELP channel if the person happens to be speaking there already.
Most of the other commands or features are there to bring a bit of interest to the server in one way or another. Here's a quick list of some of my other initial command ideas:
Trivia and other text-related events (all automated of course) would help shed the boredom of levelling/tradeskilling, especially if there's weekly, bi-weekly or monthly rewards involved for the people who get the most correct answers. I thought the Tech Haven - Runner Services channel would be appropriate for all the spam, seeing as it's an un-used channel). Something as simple and effortless as this would help boost the population by keeping people somewhat interested in staying logged in. Regular events is key to keeping the population up, and even ones like this help. Among a couple of other games, I used to run my own Subspace (currently named Continuum after the 'hacked' client - an old customizable 2D MMO asteroid-style game) server that had a higher population than Neocron currently has at peak time. And it was all down to regular events keeping the fun going. It's quite sad to say, but people would actually come online and beg me to do the trivia event because a) they would win credits to buy things, and b) some of the trivia questions were just damn funny or interesting.
Outpost ownership logs. Enables people to find out when an outpost was last taken over, and by whom, with possible ninja-hack detection as mentioned in the next idea. It could also be advertised on one of the channels (again, Tech Haven - Runner Services perhaps?) when an outpost is taken over to try and show where the recent PvP action is.
Clan logs. The clan list would be retrieved fairly often, and the 'known' active clans automatically checked upon in order to retrieve data, notably the online member count. This information be immediately retrieved if an outpost is taken over to be able to compare the online member count of the two clans. If the defending clan has just 1 or 2 members online, and the attacking clan has a considerable amount more members online, it would be classed as a ninja - unless one member from each clan confirms that it wasn't. I suppose there could be some sort of "karma", pointless as it is, to try and show which clans ninja and which don't. I say pointless because even if a ninja was falsely detected, it's unlikely either of the clans would confirm it wasn't a ninja just to spite one another. ;)
Runner online notification. In other words, frequent retrieval of the entire runner list, to determine if a runner has either logged in or gone offline, of which this information would then be relayed to various users at their request. Of course there would be all sorts of user determined preferences involved here, so people have the option to block or allow all notifications requests, or simply make the exception to block or allow the notifications for specific runners. Whenever privacy comes into question, as with the next command idea, the users privacy always comes first, and by default, the privacy is kept.
NCPD list viewer, of which the data is only retrieved every 30-60 seconds to avoid players being able to use the command as an instant-follow tool. You can travel across a two sectors in 30 seconds alone, or more if you GR. ;) I also thought about detecting and logging SL exploiters (ie, massive SL gain between the data retrievals) so Reakktor can finally be aware of how much of it is going on, as they don't seem to know; but it's not so people can be banned. Banning people for this is just a mistake, and instead they should make things fair (ie, allow everyone to kill NPC's) until they can improve the system. Of course the announced F6 reshuffle should help the situation somewhat, but how long that will be is another question altogether.
The ability to search the item/mission databases in-game. Most players may find not having to alt-tab to get bits of information fairly useful. There was going to be the ability to update your personal rares database by sending simple commands to either increase/decrease the various tech parts in the list. I mentioned this idea to h00ver, and sometime later I noticed the same thing got introduced to the ulTiMaTe networX Launcher. Bar steward, but the one on that launcher isn't bad and does the job. The only problem is, it requires people to use the launcher, whereas a standalone robot connected to the server is available to everyone without any extra effort by them. This is primarily the reason behind the whole idea.
Basic calculator with optional barter results shown. Clearly good for tradeskillers/anyone who can't be bothered finding a calculator. :p
Although events are somewhat of a rare occurrence in Neocron, there were plans for an automatic advert-type feature, so that the same messages could be automatically repeated on a specific channel (or channels) every so often. This is one good way of advertising events to people who either don't read the forum, or don't bother reading the launcher. Could also be a way of trying to boost the awareness of the storyline as it progresses and the respective articles in the Neocronicle/VoTR to go along with it. Most people pay no attention to the storyline because they either don't know where to look, or more importantly, can't be bothered to look in the first place. They need a bit of nudging.
I thought it was a nice idea to use the in-game BUDDY channel as the bots administration channel. That way all the operators could be added to the bots BUDDY list in order to receive frequent status broadcasts (not to mention alerts to possible SL exploiters. ;) Players I spoke to about that weren't happy to hear me even suggest it - but it's only intended to raise s awareness to the scale of the SL exploiting on the servers, rather than trying to get people banned for doing it. Mass bans for this reason would be devastating to the population and there should be more of a thought as to why people do it, which would hopefully bring improvements or other changes to the SL system (such as adding some extra checks to help stop this unwanted activity). The operators would of course be able to modify global settings, be it to disable, enable or update various features/plugins.
The next idea was a Neocron GPS (Global Positioning System), which would reveal a runners last known location (sector name) both plotted online via a dynamic world map as well as textually in-game upon request on a per-runner basis. To accomplish this, you would optionally run a program that automatically submits your runner name and location whenever you run across a zone line (using the HTTP POST method might be the most hassle free way of submitting the tiny chunk of data, unless a better means is offered (such as being given a library of some sort to make the Neocron client secretly attempt to message the robot with the new location)).
Again, since this is a privacy issue, players would always be able to disable the ablity for others to see this information, naturally. People often end up asking "Any fights anywhere?" on OOC, usually getting no response, so I thought it would be a good way for people to allow themselves to be tracked down in order to bring PvP to one another. Most people wouldn't care about giving their position away, and in fact, most people wanting to PvP would welcome it.
I'd carry on with a couple other ideas, but I'm pretty sure I'm reaching my maximum post length. :D Alas, it's unlikely those two ideas will ever get approved even though everyone I spoke to is all for it. I might try sending an email to Thanatos (or he should be able to get the idea without me creating a longer list of examples by just reading this) but as I say, I don't want to get bashed for even trying to get him to even think about these ideas. :(
PS. Sorry for the rather long post, and my sympathy to the moderators for being required to read all it, however boring it may be to you. :lol: I thought I might as well mention those two ideas imparticular regardless of whether I get slapped for talking about them. If the responses (if any) are good, it might help in getting some sort of approval, but still, it seems unlikely. Anyone else had their own ideas, or thoughts/views on what I've just mentioned?
I think we've already stated that we won't be making any major changes to the engine. It would mean a complete re-write (i.e. a brand new game).
N
I was under the impression that Reakktor, or 10tacle if they call all the shots, wanted Neocron to actually grow and not simply stagnate? Are they afraid to fund such a project because they feel Neocron is a sinking ship? If it's about the amount of work, is it that the people in charge simply refuse to allocate more labor? The thing is, assuming everyone wants Neocron to grow, it needs to take the online gaming community of 2007+ seriously. Using an engine started in 1995? that's having major problems noticable by newcomers will ensure this game will forever remain small and exclusive. If it's not done, I can't really see Neocron living much longer. Is that the fate of the game?
It's just upsetting, because this game has one of the best concepts, especially for an MMORPG, but poor execution. This game doesn't deserve to be small, it's a great idea, and plenty of great work has been done in every field but it's limited by what it's being put on top of (the engine). If this game worked solidly, allowing 100s if not 1000s of people to run around the game world and fight without crashing and unable to land a shot (clipping), even without improving the graphics all that much and similar, it would be a winner. Sci-fi MMORPGs take up a small percentage of the market as it is, so many people want to play a cyberpunk game like this, but they feel this isn't the game they want as it is today. Even if you started a massive advertizing campaign across the world, people would simply start the game and leave within a couple days because of the engine itself and the bugs it brings, like they've been doing already. By staying firm on ths decision, it guarantees Neocron will continue to stagnate, played by the few like me, who acknowledge the genius behind the game but realize it will never get better at it's core.
It would be a completely new game, so to speak, but it's been done before. You guys did the same thing when starting out, and back then you didn't even have anywhere near the capital you have now right? Nor did you have any major company backing you. You probably had less employees back then as well. Thousands of man hours have been spent trying to get this engine to work correctly, bugs have been squashed, some progress was made, but now it's 2007. It's time to let it die in peace.
Nobody in Reakktor agrees with me?
/edit - "free" labour don't write game engines. I've still never seen a single community-driven MMORPG reach anything like retail quality (or even get off the ground to be honest).
Project Visitor is a community-driven & created MMO(admittedly not RPG)RPS/RTS run out of a guy's garage in Texas, has been around longer than Neocron, I think.
If i won't experience a better netcode or won't even hear any news about the clipping issues and the netcode in general i seriously can't be arsed to play anymore.
This is so fucking screwing pvp, it's insane. More and more people use it to their advantage and there's fuck all i can do about it. Except for exploiting myself. :rolleyes:
If i won't experience a better netcode or won't even hear any news about the clipping issues and the netcode in general i seriously can't be arsed to play anymore.
This is so fucking screwing pvp, it's insane. More and more people use it to their advantage and there's fuck all i can do about it. Except for exploiting myself. :rolleyes:
Yep. Improving the game at it's core should be high priority right now.
Yep. Improving the game at it's core should be high priority right now.
I just wish they'd say something. Even a post saying "We're working on the clipping issues." would be good.
I haven't got much to do in NC apart from pvping but it just plain sucks these days.
And why the hell does it still say terra is offline? The announcement is long gone and the other servers are up again. :(
Project Visitor is a community-driven & created MMO(admittedly not RPG)RPS/RTS run out of a guy's garage in Texas, has been around longer than Neocron, I think.
Project Visitor was developed and released as a commercial game and only turned over to the community when it shut down after 2 years. It takes a professional (by that I mean paid) outfit to produce something as complex as an MMORPG.
N
If i won't experience a better netcode or won't even hear any news about the clipping issues and the netcode in general i seriously can't be arsed to play anymore.
Yea its not easy to enjoy the game anymore..
The clipping is so insane that its almost unplayable atm IMO :(
Still can find the MMORPG I was thinking of. It was on the BBC news website a month or 2 ago.
One thing I did spot while Googling, was a couple of software houses have released some of their tools that they use to produce their worlds. ID has been releasing their quake engines and Cryptic (City of Heros) have released their aminiation tool.
So I don't think it will be too long (A few more years) before we do start seeing community developed MMORPG's.
The biggest challenge will be getting someone to manage and run the project to keep it running smoothly, but that applies equally to any project.
pottburter
06-06-07, 11:19
/edit - "free" labour don't write game engines. I've still never seen a single community-driven MMORPG reach anything like retail quality (or even get off the ground to be honest).
Sorry, you're wrong :
http://www.planeshift.it/
And why the hell does it still say terra is offline? The announcement is long gone and the other servers are up again. :(
GIVE ME MY TERRA BACK!! Terra is still offline..? whats going on? :wtf:
Sorry, you're wrong :
http://www.planeshift.it/
It's still not there though is it? It's been in pre-alpha for how long? 3 years? I'm still impressed at how far they've got but my point still stands - MMORPGs aren't easy games to develop and they're not the kind of thing you can farm out to a community while they're still a commercial going concern.
N
/edit - let's be clear. I'm not having a go at Planescape or the community of people who developed it. It's a massive task and most fail very early on. I'm saying that to take a concept through to a commercial release within a realistic timeframe is a full-time job for a large team of people.
Nidhogg why is Terra down ? Answer me on that. And yes - a MMOPRG game i.e. Neocron is a full-time job.
Nidhogg why is Terra down ? Answer me on that. And yes - a MMOPRG game i.e. Neocron is a full-time job.
There's been an announcement now from SnowCrash, they are aware of the problems and are working on it.
These posts about Terra should be moved from this thread to the other. ;)
pottburter
06-06-07, 16:45
It's still not there though is it? It's been in pre-alpha for how long? 3 years? I'm still impressed at how far they've got but my point still stands - MMORPGs aren't easy games to develop and they're not the kind of thing you can farm out to a community while they're still a commercial going concern.
N
You said nothing about the development speed.
And it's not pre-alpha.. It's running, there's content, there's a bigger playerbase than neocron has.
It may be far from retail, but they definitely "got off the ground".
Gash jackel
06-06-07, 22:21
Sorry, you're wrong :
http://www.planeshift.it/
Urh planeshift is a nice guide on how NOT to do it lol
Its never really gotten off the ground and the interface is shit. Does it even have its combat system yet?
I've still never seen a single community-driven MMORPG reach anything like retail quality (or even get off the ground to be honest).
I've still never seen Neocron reach anything like retail quality.
Project Visitor was developed and released as a commercial game and only turned over to the community when it shut down after 2 years. It takes a professional (by that I mean paid) outfit to produce something as complex as an MMORPG.
N
I think we should do this with Neocron.
There are indeed MMOG projects where the community is deeply involved in ongoing development. These are mainly non-persistent FPS games e.g. Battlefield 2 or Half Live Source where the engine allows the development of modifications by the community.
In the case of Neocron such modifications are not possible, especially as it is a MMORPG with a persistent game world. Neocron has reached a very great age by now and so is based on "older" technology that does not allow an implementation of development tools that are necessary for the creation of modifications or a deeper involvement of the community. Involving you, the community, into the project, as most of you are asking for, is simply not possible as major parts of the game's source files would have to be released.
We are delighted to see that you want to involve yourself in the game and are we are trying realise that as often as possible in form of creative contests but you have to understand that this only possible to a certain degree. It is definitely not that we just don't want to accept your suggestions and ideas.
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