View Full Version : [Terra] Remove the Guards?
Been thinking about this for the last few days, and it seems (to me) like it would have more pros than cons.
I'm not talking about removing only the guards in PepperPark, I mean remove ALL the guards, NC and DoY, but keep the safe zones as they are for tradeskillers: HQs, Plaza1, and DoY CC.
Pros(the ones I can think of):
Tradeskillers have an easier time finding work, everyone else can find a tradeskiller easier ;) boosts the economy!( :rolleyes: whatever)
More PvP, easier to find someone to fight (still going to have zoneline camping, but you're going to have that anyway unless safe zones are removed, and all zones are merged into one giant zone 8| (not possible I know)
Well thats all the Pros I could think of right now, but those are some really big points!
Cons:
Zoneline camping, happens anyway, but it would happen more often around Plaza 1 (I think most traders would hang out there)
Griefing people that are trying to level in sewers and sidestreeets(err, noob killing, not sure if thats really considered griefing)
I dont think it would affect LE'd people too much, maybe it'd be better for them (well everyone really) because it would open up new leveling areas. And think of all the people who never get to explore the enemy's city because they remained true to their city with all their characters.
Im sure some people will think of some other Pros and Cons, but no one will really know for sure unless we try it out. Perhaps the GM team could run around removing the guards in each city (would they respawn?) until a majority of them are gone, and leave it like that for a week or so just to try it out. If its no good, causing more problems than doing good, then just restart the server to spawn all the guards and never speak of it again? ;)
I figured maybe we could at least try it out...?
There are definitely not enough people actually playing this game for this to work.
I love this idea, I wish it would work. However, without enough people, there will be nothing stopping people from just wandering around the enemy city.
[F6]Knight
24-04-07, 10:34
i dont think the guards should be completely removed but definately they need to be reduced ... there are simply too many atm
and imho i dont see why some parts of the game could not be merged into bigger zone
the whole of NC city for example. (apart from plaza 1)
keep plaza 1 as a safezone but turn the rest of the plaza sectors into 1 zone without synclines. same for pepper park and outzone (even though outzone has like 10 sectors i think it would work to turn it into 1 big zone because there almost no runners there most of the time)
for the dome, keep CC6 safezone (dont ask my why cause there is never anyone there doing tradeskilling anyway :p) and change the rest of the dome into 1 or 2 big zones.
but keep the old sector names
so even if you dont sync from plaza 3 to plaza 2, you still get a message on your screen when you go trough the tunnel saying 'now entering plaza 2'
and in the top left you also see plaza 3 change to plaza 2 for example.
especially plaza, via rosso and pepper park are perfect for a testproject on bigger zones since they each only have 3-4 sectors. if that goes well (no lag issues or whatever) then more and more zones could be merged (keep individual sector/zone names but remove some zonelines)
i think this would even work for the wastelands to turn them into 4 (2x2 grid) or 16 (4x4 grid) big zones because they simply dont have many runners in them most of the time ...
sorry for the long zoneline text but imho its related to the guard 'problem' for pvp
both ideas have merit tbh an would probably work to improve gameplay. removing gaurds would mean that it would be easier to raid enemy cities tho they would have to keep some gaurds so that anti or pro dont just camp each others cities, hell this mite even help bring ppl bak to DOY if pro could actually raid it safely, i certainly think that even if they wont remove gaurds from deeper in the city they should definitly remove all pepper park gaurds as it would mean when ppl are fighting in pp noob pro couldnt just run to a gaurd when they get low on hp, pp isnt rly a CA controlled zone anyway theres 2 anti HQs still in it and anti are always raiding it, they could just say that CA decided to pull out of pp because casualties to anti raids where getting to high. merging zones would also be a good idea because it would be easy to merge some zones (mayb i dont rly know technical stuff ill admit) but surly merging plaza viarosso and pepper park into there own single zones wouldnt be so hard, and if that works they could mayb later merge the entire city into 1 large zone (except p1 for traders tho they could perhaps jus make mega powerful gaurds to protect the traders or sumin). it would make pvp much more fun cos im always gettin ppl almost dead then they jus zone whore to either run away or heal up. also i have somthing to add to this, i think that if your above like rank /50 or sumin if sombody kills u in a hunting zone you shouldnt loose sl, its just stupid that if sum noob is guna die they can either hide in a hunting zone so u crnt kill em or else u have to loose 100sl for killing an enemy.
i think we all know KK dont listen to a word its players say wich is why NC is dying out but its still nice to think up this stuff so we know what neocron could be... and who knows mayb 1 day if we look up we will see a pig flying past an KK will actually listen to its customers and save NC cos certainly for zone merging an removing sl loss for killin high lvl ppl in hunting zones (as long as it is possible without lag etc) i see absolutly no reason anybody would complain unless they are a complete noob who needs zonelines or hunting zones to stay alive in pvp.
Hell yes. Remove the guards, bring back more vets :)
William Antrim
24-04-07, 10:57
Great idea but the zone line thing is never gonna happen.
Removing guards +1 to that thought.
I raided Plaza yesterday with an unclanned PPU by my side. I Ended up fighting Cream Cracker and Marksman Watts. Now, we did well on this occasion, but without that PPU, a lot of pro-city use the guards in there favour, like hiding behind them on low health, knowing full well what will happen.
The guards are ruining raids.
I think it's EXCELLENT now that cop-bots freeze barely slows you down, but the epic amount of guards just ruins all the fun.
I dont even think it necessary that all the guards are removed, just leave an open space in each zone, which is unprotected by guards and cop bots.
The zone lines etc, I am happy to be covered by guards.
Turning plaza into 1 big zone is NEVER EVER going to happen. The coding behind it would be a huge job, and frankly, KK have better things to be doing with their time.
[F6]Knight
24-04-07, 12:03
KK wants to balance the game. both pvp and pve
imho merging zones like plaza (except plaza 1 offcourse), pepper park and via rosso into their own big zones with minimal guards would be a big step towards balancing city raiding pvp
Knight']KK wants to balance the game. both pvp and pve
imho merging zones like plaza (except plaza 1 offcourse), pepper park and via rosso into their own big zones with minimal guards would be a big step towards balancing city raiding pvp
Easy to say, MUCH harder to actually code and accomplish
As I have already explained in a german thread with the same topic, I will evaluate the spawn density of the guards in the city sectors and adjust it if necessary.
As I have already explained in a german thread with the same topic, I will evaluate the spawn density of the guards in the city sectors and adjust it if necessary.
Excellent. I assume that means it will be lowered! The spawn density is hindering all our fun :)
Any idea on a timescale on this?
As I have already explained in a german thread with the same topic, I will evaluate the spawn density of the guards in the city sectors and adjust it if necessary.What's "if necessary"?
Is the CA guard right next to the pepper park 3 genrep necessary? Or the guards at the pp2/3 border? Or those at the pussy club entrance?
I can live with guards in plaza and via rosso but at least pp3 should not have guards. It's one of the best sectors to pvp yet the number of guards is constantly increasing. :(
So please at least get rid of those. Maybe move the crahn smuggler to pp2 then and leave pp3 to the pvpers. That'd be awesome.
Remove altogether from PP.
Half, or even reduce to 1/3 of the current amount of guards in Plaza and Via Rosso
"Necessary" means, 10 Guards hanging around at one spot talking about how to pwn the next runner passing by. :D ;)
Just remove guards all together :D let us runners defend our city!!!
Just remove guards all together :D let us runners defend our city!!!
/signed. Agreed etc.
Those whom dont want to get involved can keep their LE's in - After all, isn't that what they are for?
It wont happen, but i can but dream
William Antrim
24-04-07, 13:55
Just remove guards all together :D let us runners defend our city!!!
Thats the difference between and inch and a mile.
Its better to ask for something that MIGHT happen rather than make a statement like this.
Still you cant beat youthful optimism i guess. :lol:
As I have already explained in a german thread with the same topic, I will evaluate the spawn density of the guards in the city sectors and adjust it if necessary.
Thanks SnowCrash, will you need to patch/restart the server in order to remove some of the guards? Or can they be removed "on-the-fly" ?
Maybe you could also look at the DoY entrances that seem to have a small army posted outside. Maybe clear up just one entrance so it like a "secret" entrance like NC has.
2 Guards at every GR in DoY kinda sucks too... ;)
@ SNOWCRASH.
Just give us a chance to raid! That's all we are asking.
ie/ Leave one or two GR's in NC/DoY unguarded. Leave at least 1 or 2 parts of every zone without guards (At the minute, every corner you turn in plaza, theres a guard - you only get a couple of places to hide)
At this moment, a one on one is more like a three on one, due to the guards. It's a wind up when you are defending too - as you know full well that you arent winning the fight... The guards are.
lets face it these are all good ideas but like i said KK dont listen to ppl who play the game i mean wat do we know.. we only pay monthly to play the game why shud WE have any clue wat wud make it more fun no thats best left for sumbody in a office who has apparantly never played NC in his life
Doc Holliday
24-04-07, 21:18
Just remove guards all together :D let us runners defend our city!!!
it wont happen but please do this. at least for pp. maybe slim the guards down on other adjacent zones. give it somethin worth fighting for. do the same with doy (not familiar. ) and it could really be cool.
I'm just a noob, but when I switched to Black Dragon.. the whole thing seemed exciting because I could sneak into NC. It wouldnt be that exciting if no guards were there..
I'm just a noob, but when I switched to Black Dragon.. the whole thing seemed exciting because I could sneak into NC. It wouldnt be that exciting if no guards were there..
I would rather feel 'excited' about being hunted by runners than stupid copbots that just ruin everybodys fun and are round every corner.
I'm just a noob, but when I switched to Black Dragon.. the whole thing seemed exciting because I could sneak into NC. It wouldnt be that exciting if no guards were there..
The larger text of that statement provides us with ample evidence that your argument should not be taken seriously.
Seriously though. There's no sneaking involved at cap. I just run through, to wherever I can find that has no guards... and hope to god there's someone there to fight me. The guards are by no means over powered, they are purely an annoyance. :D
William Antrim
27-04-07, 20:39
Theyre at their most annoying when 3 shoot you at once and then the Terra-ists show up!
As happened to me a few nights ago *grumble grumble*.
However I agree wholeheartedly they shouldnt be in pp but they SHOULD be in plaza.
Bozz-Von Mel
28-04-07, 01:37
naa dont remove the guards...make them chase you into your apt like real police...then let them taze you and take you in. We could have new trade skill in NC.....LAWYERS!!!! BAILBONDSMAN....BOUNTY HUNTERS...
naa dont remove the guards...make them chase you into your apt like real police...then let them taze you and take you in. We could have new trade skill in NC.....LAWYERS!!!! BAILBONDSMAN....BOUNTY HUNTERS...sounds worse than hacknet :)
The FA sector GR is possibly the best sector in DoY, because it has so few guards. The GR has a quest sector just 2 steps directly opposite, and there's minimal guards or obstructions:
Two guards at the zone lines
Two guards at Gene Replicator
FA sentryguns outside the FA HQ which don't seem to do any damage at current (however the ones inside the FA HQ instagib you. :D)
The sector is almost guard-free, and it's great. That's how it should be in nearly all the non-critical sectors. Meaning Plaza 1, DoY CC, and MB should remain plagued with guards, which doesn't make much difference there because those sectors are still safezones.
The only place you need to place guards is at the typical clip whore/newbie levelling areas where people try to cheat death and/or gank low levels, though the latter of which admittedly doesn't happen too often anymore, since there isn't an influx of new players, most people are high level these days anyway. Then have the odd pair of guards or a single guard dotted around the sector. They should shoot the enemy as a deterrant instead of repelling them altogether. The repelling should be done by players. If enemies kill low levels, so be it, they need to learn to die instead of being carebear, Neocron isn't Super Mario and people should begin to realise it.
Death is an integral part of Neocron, and rezzing should take far longer than it does. It's one of the main factors in people being personally aggressive to one another over being killed and why half the so called PvPers choose not to leave their safezones without their friend buttplugging them on a PPU. Most likely so they don't have to GR out or lose condition on their implants, and not lose quickbelt items either, because the buttplugg will be teamed so he can instantly pick their friends belts up (of which that's one of my other annoyances (http://forum.neocron.com/showthread.php?t=136413&page=1) - remove the instant lootage god damn you. People need to stop caring about losing naff items ffs!).
I love this idea, I wish it would work. However, without enough people, there will be nothing stopping people from just wandering around the enemy city.
i allways wander around doy shoping for antigamabones ect. and i don't think i ever seen another person even when the pop was big >.<
i often raid DOY on my pro tank and just wander about and i never see anybody until i shout on OOC that im there.
Doc Holliday
02-05-07, 09:01
what would be nice if possible if somehow a report could pop up over alliance chats from some kind of system saying Doy invaders spotted in pepper park zone or NC Bandits spotted in fa sector or what ever. i cant imagine how this would be possible. maybe a report from a person using a gr (with a delay of course so people can get rid of the synaptic impairment)
At least it could lead to a bit of a man hunt and get the old blood boilin up a bit :) if this is even remotely possible (i have no clue as mentioned) its a nice thought dontcha think?
yea its a good idea if its possible =) but i doubt KK will listen to us unless were droners/traders seen as they seem to be the ppl they listened to when making most of changes to NC
yea its a good idea if its possible =) but i doubt KK will listen to us unless were droners/traders seen as they seem to be the ppl they listened to when making most of changes to NC
Thats because all of KK only plays tradeskillers, and when they lv up they use drones :lol:
yeah mby like a hack term or somthing like at ops that ppl could hack to get summing mby for a pvp mission if not then just to aleart ppl you are there like on the enimys aliance chat or something like on clan chat when first layer goes down....?
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