Vehicle speed and/or control dependant on VHC?

[Dribble Joy]

Basically, as anyone can drive pretty much anything, this means the speciallised drivers are a bit shafted. So.. as the title says; should vehicle control (turning speed) and maybe accelleration and top speed be dependant on VHC skilling?
Reaching the minimum would be rather sluggish, maybe similar or slightly worse than now.

[Panthoraxium]

No, another crap idea, tyvm DJ :) -

Not every1 can drive everything, infact only tanks can drive alot of vehicles now

[unreal]

Vehicle speed maybe, but most definitely not the control. As the man says, it's not like everyone can just skill a lot of VHC skill. Unless you're a tank it means you're pretty much shafted at doing anything else well. I definitely wouldn't have VHC as a PE, but then my characters don't have a tent inside NeoFrag and therefore runspeed is an importance. :p

[Mal]

I have a dedicated vehicle spy and I feel COMPLETELY shafted by 2.2 fullstop tbh

If they're going to keep VHC as a skill, then they should add some vehicles that require a much higher number of VHC points, OR they need to base the vehicles speed, acceleration, manouvering and perhaps even its armour on the VHC skill.

It would also be nice to see a faster moving vehicle taking more 'glancing' damage. A tank that's hurtling at full speed has a better chance of deflecting a shell then one that's completely stationary.

Another nice option would be if we could MOD the tanks and things.

Imagine if the tank had kind of like an implant screen. You can choose its turret (laser, aoe or a standard shell), the armour type (heavier armour=less speed/manouver) and other things. A co-axial or tertiary gun on the rhino would be nice - like a gatlin rifle or something to pick off runners.

[Logan_storm_03]

Maybe for a series of new, decent vehicals that need speicalisation. But leave the current ones for us guys who can't spare much to get our vehical fix.

[Apocalypsox]

Erm...all the vehicle imps and a DoY eye you can pretty damn near litterally drive anything ingame...those imps give you 60-70 or so vehicle...So dont say "Not everyone can drive stuff durdurdur" You can you just havnt thought about it.

I think its a great idea.

[unreal]

I rushed my post earlier and sort of couldn't be bothered typing a fair bit, but one thing to really note is it's one thing to drive them, but quite another in being able to gun them at the same time. It's excellent to see things like assault gliders that have rifle weapons on them being added to the game, it brings in so much extra fun.

For countless years, possibly since even the beginning for all I know, vehicles have always been lacking in Neocron. They have either been bugged, useless (in terms of armour/resists/damage output or a combination of those), too expensive, or had too high requirements. Now that they're somewhat more available and mostly usable, which increases the fun in-game considerably, you want them to be shafted to anyone who doesn't waste a character on speccing mostly VHC.

I would like to see things like a vehicle glove (or driving helmet :D - though a helmet would be too easy to switch, so maybe not) added that gave you a hefty bonus to VHC (say 50) so everyone can use the basic vehicles without needing to assign skills or nerf their setup. I flew around Neocron in a Scout Glider for the first time about a week or so ago on the Test Server and was amazed at why such vehicles weren't brought into the game more.

Lots of fun to be had there, but to many (me included) it was never an option because of something I just mentioned, wanting to keep the best PvP setup for your character. Because of either slow or bad aiming, the price yet again, or the almost instant death of you and your vehicle, PvP in vehicles other than the Reveler/Rhino (excluding the DoY bomber because it's not really PvP ;)) was non-existant.

I wouldn't mind any change in regards to skilling as long as the higher skilling isn't turned into an absolute requirement for using a vehicle to almost the best capacity and instead remains as optional skilling. Extra skilling should just be an extra bonus to give people who skill more a slightly higher advantage rather than an immense one.

So someone who skills higher could possibly get a slightly faster shot frequency, faster reload times, slightly faster driving/flying speed, turn speed, or something like that. As long as it doesn't make the minimal skiller twice as bad as the one who skills higher. Vehicles should be made use of after many years of inactivity.

Don't return vehicles to being useless like they nearly always have been.
Erm...all the vehicle imps and a DoY eye you can pretty damn near litterally drive anything ingame...those imps give you 60-70 or so vehicle...So dont say "Not everyone can drive stuff durdurdur" You can you just havnt thought about it.What sort of PvP character is going to switch his brain implants around on the fly to use vehicles then? You should try thinking as well. This is the reason I've always wanted a vehicle glove in-game that gave a considerable bonus to VHC, so that PvP characters can use most vehicles without extreme gimpage. Though now in 2.2 you can't exactly switch gloves fast anymore since they require poking, which leaves you somewhat gimped from not being able to switch instantly, but at least you wouldn't be wrecking your main implants.

[awkward silence]

Basically, as anyone can drive pretty much anything, this means the speciallised drivers are a bit shafted. So.. as the title says; should vehicle control (turning speed) and maybe accelleration and top speed be dependant on VHC skilling?
Reaching the minimum would be rather sluggish, maybe similar or slightly worse than now.

Why would we NEED specialized drivers?

[Dribble Joy]

Why would we NEED anything. My point is that as a sub-class, the driver is somewhat left out.

[nobby]

I don't feel the more points you have, the faster the vehicle goes... THAT'S SILLY !

A 4 year old child pressing the accelerator on his Uncle's car Doesn't mean a 17 year old would go faster... !

(If I make myself understood)...


Stupid idea !

[Dribble Joy]

Indeed, speed is only a possible factor that might alter, included only to provide additional distiction between those who spec and those without. I suppose you could argue (on a realism basis) that the extra speed would be represented by the character having more confidence with their driving ability and therefore reach closer to the vehicle's top speed.

Speed was a secondary, optional part of the idea, control was more the main part.

[Cerbious]

as i said before:



Ok enough mucking around now i logg my fav char, my combat driver spy.
Only to find that this specialized char which only had one purpose in life now isnt so specialist as a damn idiotic tank now can fly a complicated glider. Not just any glider like for example if it was only scouts then that cool as u would still need spies to fly assult gliders to shoot the tanks out of the air. Basicully a dumbwit tank with 69 vch use can drive all vechs bar the hoverbomber/carrier (dunno about scorps as i dont own one). Wow a spy still has rights on two vechs which can get blown up in seconds and cost shit loads to make!
plz tell me im missing somthing and that possibly the more vech use u have the better u can control the vech or less dmg it recives, then that would make all of us who has a driver spy not worthless.



A good thing to think about here is would u let a builder fly you across the pacific in an apache? My flat mate is a builder he is fine to drive me to the pub in a CAR as they are more simple but i wouldnt get in a cockpit with him of some flying vech lol

Constructers is a specialist char you wouldn't expect them to pvp (unless they called spoon lover)

Hacknet chars are specialist chars you wouldnt expect them to pvp without hacknet.

Combat vech drivers are specialist chars you wouldnt expect them to pvp without vech's.

Ok u say u want to drive yet dont want to make a specific char for it... tough? I want to be elite in hacknet but i dont want to make a specific char for it.... what do i do.. i live with that deicsion and stay out of hacknet lol

In the past the was few people who made the sacrifice of dedicating a char to driving so we can get others around, try make OP fights more interesting from the norm, and ofcaorse to show off. We also was the ones who paid through the nose on buying the vechs lol But because of all this we was also some of the privledged few who could enjoy flying around the map and most of all showing off to others not just ur gliders but the skill to gain in flying em.

Those of us also had a juggling act with our points to get the str, hc etc needed to gun our vechs.. where now a bone head tank can just get in and do both no probs oh and still get out and pvp (land).

Now if KK were to add more vech which would need spies to drive, then everyone would be happy. Or the suggestions about making amount of vech skill matter so everyone candrive yet there will still be a few specialists.

I mean all of us with combat driving spies might aswell delete the chars unless somthing going to be done as they worthless now.

[zii]

Crap idea. It would defeat the purpose of removing the INT/DEX reqs.

[Cerbious]

Crap idea. It would defeat the purpose of removing the INT/DEX reqs.


It defeats the purpose of many chars out there which are now only good for deletion.

How would it defeat that purpose? There is now more vechs people can drive, doesnt mean to say they should drive everything or as well as dedicated chars. Same with all the aspects of the game a dedicated char should do it better. A tank who specs HC, MC, RC and PC should not be able to hit as hard as someone who specs only HC. Or an even simplar term for ya, a hybrid monk should not be able to hit as hard as a dedicated apu.

Tanks started out only being able to drive mo-peds, they now gone up to cars and small planes in one swoop, leave spies to fly jumbo jets and spaceships. Bring in some new vechs with an int req, tanks master pvp why should they be able to master all driving aswell?

[awkward silence]

Whats worng with the vechs actually used? Specialize you vech spy to something else. I think KK finally made the right decidion to bring most vech into a situation where they dont need super specialization.

I also like the fact that droners that hide in unreachable places can be got more easily. Also I love the rifle reqs on some.

The argument "im pissed that everyone can fly shit now" is just stupid. Drivers are not shafted! They can just do many others things atm like...fight.

[Cerbious]

i have 4 spies in total= cst-rep / res-drone / rc-hack / driver no need to turn it into n e thing else except a different class.

Oh and please dont downgrade this topic by saying it an argument that is "im pissed that everyone can fly shit now". (thats not even an argument its a silly statement). This is a thread about whether or not VHC points should make a difference on the way somone can control a vech.

The idea of specing is so u can be individual from the person next to you. If two people fought each other in Rhinos why shouldnt a person with more vech skill have a slight advantage?

A person with higher RC will be able to hit harder why shouldnt a person with high VHC be able to driver better?

[Cerbious]

omg ffs i thought fuck it ill carry with my spy combat driver in defiance, atleast he will be able to have good repair to sort the vechs out. I get on start specing his points then i notice a real bombshell... not only have KK taken away the INT requirment, letting every tank fly, but they have increased the STR and HC requirments on the combat gliders so ONLY tanks can fly em!!

im left with only one depressing choice (and considering ive quit smoking last three days this anit even funny) im going to have to transfer all my vechs to my hc tank Cerbitank and change him into my pilot. Then as there no other type of spy i need nor want, delete a few months worth of hard work!

edit/ ah shit just relised the dex gliders, i better go test them first before i do n e thing rash!

[unreal]

Whats worng with the vechs actually used? Specialize you vech spy to something else. I think KK finally made the right decidion to bring most vech into a situation where they dont need super specialization.Exactly my point. Most of the 'worth-using' combat vehicles pretty much have the "gimpage" requirements for them to be used anyway (except for the Tank I guess). I don't see why people being able to use the handful of transport vehicles at ease (if you could say that), along with the odd combat vehicle is such a problem to people.

The people who want to keep specialization on vehicles to this extreme, why not explain what will happen if it's reverted to that type of configuration? As noted in my other post, the majority of the vehicles will barely be used, as it's been for many years because the requirements were too high. PvP is the main aspect of Neocron, not driving round in Vehicles the majority of which are only worth while for use in PvE.

Vehicles for the most part are just a fun transport option that nearly always force you to gimp your character, and being able to drive them still does typically gimp your character for that matter. This is the reason vehicles like the Quad were favoured for transport. Not only was it a cheap-to-repair transport vehicle you could respawn them again and again when they're destroyed. The requirements were low enough for people to use on a day to day basis.

Even in 2.2 speccing a pure VHC character is a plain and simple waste unless you don't particular enjoy PvP (why else would you want to waste your character?) and prefer sitting there shooting at slowly moving mobs all day long. It's best to cater for the majority of people playing and make things much more fun while making use of this existing content, rather than catering for the few who probably don't want to LOM and make better use of their character.

[gstyle40]

well, the way i see it is this. kk decided to make a proffesion called "driver". an engineer, scientist, assasin ect all must specialize in order to be great at there skill. with making the vehicles easier to use they basically killed the "driver" profession. i for one also had a driver spy that hunted for my tech parts in a heavy scorp trike (ill miss that) would bullseye wb's from the other side of a zone. now since it takes 8000 str to gun even the lowest tl of vehicles my poor little yahoo has no direction in life :( am i gonna delete him? HELLLLL NO but he has now become just another tradeskiller no type of combat for him at all now :( sad sad day indeed........ now i will b forced to roll a tank to fill this roll that my uber spy once filled for me. ill miss soloing chaos caves on a hc spy :( was funny when teams would come in and find me all alone with an atomsmelt goin to town on creepers cuz i was bored......memories......