View Full Version : Check the date ... ;)

19-10-06, 16:19
http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?p=1632640#post1632640 ( 05-10-04, 22:05 )


Better late [very, VERY, VERY late] than never ;)


While I think of it ... to Snowcrash and the rest of the team :- any plans to revamp the underlying RPOS mechanics for NC2.2 ?

I am assuming the core of the UI is the same, and all the buttons, active fields and window object boundaries haven't changed and it's just the overlay gfx you are `unlocking` ?

If so, is there any chance you could cast an eye over these old, old points before you finalise the UI for 2.2 ?
The gfx modding, while appreciated, is really only a band-aid on a pretty horrific core UI implementation.

http://forum.neocron.com/showthread.php?p=1631010&highlight=rpos#post1631010 (http://forum.neocron.com/showthread.php?p=1631010&highlight=rpos#post1631010) (05-10-04, 10:31 )

It's not quite as simple as that, I'm afraid.

The active areas, buttons, text fields, font handling and window bounding fields are hard coded separately from the overlay graphics (which are the only parts we can edit)

So although we can remove the messy and distracting frilly stuff the inherent ergonomic flaws are still there for the most part.

I've done a scheme and submited it, but it's just touching up the superficialities, in reality.

If there is a possibilty of a *proper* alternative from KK then please, please, please look at the ergonomics first, and design the artwork around that, rather than vice versa.

Some suggestions :-

Eliminate wasted space at the edge of the screen.

Make the active borders of the window much closer to the edges of the displayed information.

Choose a font/fonts that are *readable* at the available resolutions.

Choose a font that has greater distinction between similar looking characters.

Make buttons and widgets larger, or properly scaleable with resolution.

Place the buttons so that their location and use is intuitive rather than at the mercy of the spaces the artwork leaves.

Make the right click on player box larger or scaled to resolution, or as proper buttons.

Make the text areas actually large enough to accomodate the contained text at a given resolution, or at the very least make those boxes horizontally scrollable.

Put scroll arrows at the end of the scroll-bars, so you can click and hold to scroll down lists rather than have to solely use drag bars.

Make the subdivisions in the Custom list individually colourable.

Perhaps make the `critical` area of the HLT/STA/PSI start a little earlier so it turns red (or whatever you have chosen) earlier.

For that matter why not return to the old style wide vertical status bars, but with the new `value` colourings.
It was much easier to tell at a glance exactly what your status was.

Make the compass heading easier to distinguish.

Put an indication of `unspent` skill points on the left hand frame of the Skills window (an asterisk next to the main skill name perhaps) so that you don't have to look at the right hand pane for each skill.

And one last ergonomic thing - not strictly RPOS ...
Speed up the `scroll-reveal` of the name of whatver your reticle is hovering over. It's too slow currently.

That's rather a grab bag of ideas, in no particular structured order, and I'm sure others will have their own suggestions.
I've tried to offer constructive solutions that will actually increase utility and legibility instead of simply screaming "It's crap, change it !"

As it stands it's an ... interesting ... static work of art, but not a coherent or effective user interface.

I appreciate that someone put a fair bit of work into it and that some change elements might take a similar amount of work to adjust, but a Neocron player spends an *awful* lot of time looking at and using (or trying to, at least) the RPOS, so it's pretty essential it actually achieves the task it's there for.

Some of the mechanics changes from the NC1 version are very welcome ... please keep working on it :D

20-10-06, 12:00
Kurai - Thats not a bad RPOS mod at all, you going to get it sent to KK? ;)

So Kurai, you are saying (for example) the distance of the quickslots from the edge of the screen is hardcoded? As I would like to do a RPOS theme, with the quickslots closer to the edge of the screen.

20-10-06, 15:42
I sent it to Iorghe aaaaaaaaaaaaages ago, and to someone else some time last year, when I was still playing.

Dunno if I still have the files around anywhere. I'll have a look.

If I do find them they might need some tweaking for a full set. For example : I never played droners much after NC1, so I couldn't be arsed fiddling with those HUD files. I still can't be arsed now, so I'll need a volunteer to complete the set ;)

As for your second point ... yeah, exactly.

The bmp files are of a given dimension, and get overlaid onto specific screen co-ordinates as a block. All you can really do to edit them, in effect, is transparent out some of the more evil bits of the frilly shit.

The Help (?) and Close (x) buttons (well, all the buttons in fact) active areas are also hard coded positionally.
If you look close at the above image you can see them `floating free` of the upper right hand corner of the window graphics. You'll also run into annoying overlap of invisible window boundaries.


Here's a screenie that shows the issue more clearly :-


21-10-06, 16:17
my question is, where exactly is the community supposed to download the so far approved ones? (if any).

21-10-06, 17:18
i work on huds by myself atm and until they arnt rdy i dont send them to KK .. so i dont know what others do but i think it will take some weeks until KK can release some modded huds .. and if they will release them you will be able to download them from KK website



btw have a look into german forum there are some screens of new huds

22-10-06, 02:07
Deja Vu...