View Full Version : stop carebear-ism!
so, you're a trader, you were just trying to level up, got killed? here's what you'll hear:
"keep your LE in, stay in a safezone, use a stealthtool! neocron isn't for carebears."
right. so people will keep their LE in and give a damn about neocron's wonderful cyberpunk atmo. This will reduce neocron to a single type of MMOgamer, and will keep the social type out, people who just want to have a good time.
but, ok, you want a hard game, not for carebears? here it is:
(1) no more res- and cst-missions without res and cst skill (i.e. if you want to deliver very hard res missions, go there with a res skill of 150, or fail)
(2) make epic item usage dependent on faction symp. if your faction symp to crahn is negative, no gaya glove for you. same goes for pp-res-chip, move-on, tsunami rifle, reveller. this will bring action to the op zones.
if you still want to be an ally-noob-killer, fine, but be prepared to do 1000 cyclops before your own faction guards will like you again. and if some un-teamed noob dies in your barrel in a cave: bad luck. this game is not for carebears.
as soon as (1) and (2) are in place, let's get rid of (3) both safezones and the LE. we won't need that crap anymore. and no more howling, sync-laming, noobkilling carebears anymore, please.
so, you're a trader, you were just trying to level up, got killed? here's what you'll hear: "keep your LE in, stay in a safezone, use a stealthtool! neocron isn't for carebears."
he'll hear that only if he cries about getting killed all the time. if he can't handle the pk'ing, let him have his LE and still enjoy the game. why take the LE away and lose players that we can interact with to a certain level?
(1) no more res- and cst-missions without res and cst skill (i.e. if you want to deliver very hard res missions, go there with a res skill of 150, or fail)
why? selling BPs makes researchers and non-researchers interact more with each other instead of chars putting points into research and loming them out later on.
(2) make epic item usage dependent on faction symp. if your faction symp to crahn is negative, no gaya glove for you. same goes for pp-res-chip, move-on, tsunami rifle, reveller. this will bring action to the op zones.
that's like limiting items to certain classes. i know what you're saying, Proto clans will be known to have the PPR chip in most of the time, having better resists and so on.. but do you really think this is gonna make a difference? personally i like trying to max out a char in every way possible, either through doing an epic myself, trading, having a mate do me a favour.. the limitation would prevent that. and isn't the versatility the thing we like most about NC?
let's get rid of (3) both safezones
we've had that discussion already. plaza-1 for instance would not be plaza-1 if it wasn't a safezone. i could agree on reducing the amount of safezones so if you want to PK you just hang out where no safezones are nearby. but keep a few for hanging around and trading. if there are like 100 copbots, there is no way of that place being raided. the safezone is just a technical representation imho.
ok - I agree with -
The only safezone should be TH 2-
All other TH areas, have turrets that shoot if you draw a sexy weapon....
LE Chips should remove at /40 or maybe /50 depending how carebare you are.
And for gods sake, remove the "You Gained 5 SL from killing a enemy runner" ...
I mean, guys i do get ALOT of bad soulight... But i dont like the way we can obtain it so easily.... Id proberly hate having to get it but meh...
I would like to see 'Safezones' allow you to draw a weapon and be pretty full of guards (well as Plaza 1 is now) however the guards should act like those at the Twister in I-09 ;) So they'd shoot anyone with a weapon out. "what if i forget?!?!" well, that's your fault adapt, learn and remember - your life deppends on it! The guards have been given the order to target and eliminate any hostile action in that zone. Drawing a weapon is seen as hostility, even by friendly runners.
TH would then stay as a safezone but turrets in the facility would discourage anyone to draw a weapon, the TH turrets should also shoot negative SL runners in TH as it really annoys me that people with heavily negative SL can just leave their character in TH without fear of anything happening to them. Bad soullight runners shouldnt be able to hide in safezones. Their only 'secure' option should be their appartment, if they don't want to be stuck in their appartment for days they'd actually have to do something to fix their soullight.
I would like to see 'Safezones' allow you to draw a weapon and be pretty full of guards (well as Plaza 1 is now) however the guards should act like those at the Twister in I-09 ;) So they'd shoot anyone with a weapon out. "what if i forget?!?!" well, that's your fault adapt, learn and remember - your life deppends on it! The guards have been given the order to target and eliminate any hostile action in that zone. Drawing a weapon is seen as hostility, even by friendly runners.
TH would then stay as a safezone but turrets in the facility would discourage anyone to draw a weapon, the TH turrets should also shoot negative SL runners in TH as it really annoys me that people with heavily negative SL can just leave their character in TH without fear of anything happening to them. Bad soullight runners shouldnt be able to hide in safezones. Their only 'secure' option should be their appartment, if they don't want to be stuck in their appartment for days they'd actually have to do something to fix their soullight.
My guy never fixes his soulight, and still hangs in the Dome and Neocron, even MB...
Nice and easy to GR in FA HQ with red SL , Because they dont shoot red SL -
Lotek Neutron only fixes his soulight for op wars, its annoying being tracked on the NCPD for a op war....
All this anti-pkers stuff has led to the current sl rules we have, and even then the carebears still complain about them.
Anyone remember the neocron slogan :"danger around every corner" ?
Well, lately it seems there's a rather outspoken community of "safezone around every corner" people in neocron.
The problem is the other side, the pvpers don't get heard much, because they eather don't bother with the forums or they have banned forum acts.
Look, not even a "you can't enter any city, pay double for grs, 20 items drop with -1 sl or below etc..." ruleset will stop the so called noobkilling and ally killing. This game is a roleplay-pvp game, a shame too many people forget about the le chip and the pvp aspect of the game.
If you remove the LE, or force removal, I quit. I don't play this game to go through the trouble of dealing with immature children who think it's fun to gank me at a GR, or HL my Quad.
Plaza 1 without safezone status was already tried in retail. It made Neocron City a ghost town. Removing it again will simply have the same effect.
Changing TH doesn't take into account the accidental -SL events that occur in NC. Kill the wrong NPC during a mission - BOOM! Negtive SL. Accidentally kill an NPC while at an OP, BOOM! Negative SL.
Faction restriction on faction items reduces potential character setup options. Bad idea.
LE removal at Battlerank/Skill rank -
Make it need a battlerank and Skillrank , so tradeskillers are safe...
The removal method could be - Possibility to drop at death above XX/XX Rank
Accidentally kill an NPC while at an OP, BOOM! Negative SL.
When was the last time you went to an opwar? 1999?
Dribble Joy
14-09-06, 15:09
To expand on something pantho said and reiterate something I have been saying for a while:
SL/symp loss not only has little real effect on a runner's existance, but is too easy to reclaim. Sitting in your apt/TH gaining SL while you're in bed asleep just seems daft. Making a more proactive means of reclaiming SL/symp would discourage people to an extent, making SL/symp have a greater impact on runner life would enhance this.
As to P1, I dunno. I would like the 'pull your weapon and you get shot' system, but I dunno how this would actually affect things in reality.
As for TH, well I'd want it given back to FA. Make MB for cirtain a non-safe (though maybe with the weapon-out-get-shot restriction).
People would then have to congregate in DoY or NC. Seems such a shame DoY CC isn't used.
Epics being faction only? (btw using an item based on symp won't work, they tried but it didn't like it)
I twinkle not.
Unique faction only items that have little relevance to balance? Yes please.
uh, oh. this discussion is going... somewhere. in simple words: in order to bring more people to the occasional op-fight, we need to give the peaceful players more room to breath. so we need to make the loss of SL and facsymp more real. hanging out in your app, waiting for SL regain should take months, or at least weeks, same with fac symp. my point is: make neocron harder for people who want to play hard.
and dont listen to the power-whiners. i dont care if noob-killing will render your char useless.
To expand on something pantho said and reiterate something I have been saying for a while:
SL/symp loss not only has little real effect on a runner's existance, but is too easy to reclaim. Sitting in your apt/TH gaining SL while you're in bed asleep just seems daft. Making a more proactive means of reclaiming SL/symp would discourage people to an extent, making SL/symp have a greater impact on runner life would enhance this.
As to P1, I dunno. I would like the 'pull your weapon and you get shot' system, but I dunno how this would actually affect things in reality.
As for TH, well I'd want it given back to FA. Make MB for cirtain a non-safe (though maybe with the weapon-out-get-shot restriction).
People would then have to congregate in DoY or NC. Seems such a shame DoY CC isn't used.
Epics being faction only? (btw using an item based on symp won't work, they tried but it didn't like it)
I twinkle not.
Unique faction only items that have little relevance to balance? Yes please.
Not faction reqs,.... Tanks / PE's / Even spies would be fucked...
Make you have to run the EPIC is fine :), Bind when picked tbh - ....
My point on SL was its easy to get, but also i dont give a F*ck :) , Ill keep Lotek neutron at -99 soulight for all i care, i only get green for op fights...
uh, oh. this discussion is going... somewhere. in simple words: in order to bring more people to the occasional op-fight, we need to give the peaceful players more room to breath. so we need to make the loss of SL and facsymp more real. hanging out in your app, waiting for SL regain should take months, or at least weeks, same with fac symp. my point is: make neocron harder for people who want to play hard.
and dont listen to the power-whiners. i dont care if noob-killing will render your char useless.
Im goin take a wild guess here and say you play Mars ?
I'm going to make a 0/2 pro city, get him to mb, then pull his le and stay at the bunker.
Every enemy that kills him i will call a noobkiller and i think he should drop a 10 item red belt for even trying to get past any faction's guards.
On top of that i will tell every neutral and ally i'm a roleplayer, so shooting me will get them banned.
Cmon guys, there's an le chip it doesn't stop you from roleplaying or tradeskilling. The time you spend on complaining about it far outweighs the time you spend getting poked.
I would have loved Werner Von Braun running around in the battlefield during WWII shouting "don't shoot me, i'm a tradeskiller".......
I would have loved Werner Von Braun running around in the battlefield during WWII shouting "don't shoot me, i'm a tradeskiller".......
Gotta love your posts -
Nice humor, and they just hide, with no sig/avatar lol
If you remove the LE, or force removal, I quit. I don't play this game to go through the trouble of dealing with immature children who think it's fun to gank me at a GR, or HL my Quad.
Agree.
Plaza 1 without safezone status was already tried in retail. It made Neocron City a ghost town. Removing it again will simply have the same effect.
Agree, I do miss being raided by enemy factions though - it was really fun (something actually happened in nc...)
TH would then stay as a safezone but turrets in the facility would discourage anyone to draw a weapon, the TH turrets should also shoot negative SL runners in TH as it really annoys me that people with heavily negative SL can just leave their character in TH without fear of anything happening to them. Bad soullight runners shouldnt be able to hide in safezones. Their only 'secure' option should be their appartment, if they don't want to be stuck in their appartment for days they'd actually have to do something to fix their soullight.I think if you get lower than a certain level of SL (-64?) your apt should be openable by anyone :p as well as TH turrets ganking their asses and of course both cities arent safe cause guards shoot them... also the clubs don't need to be safezones at all.
Basicly if you're gonna go far enough to get -64 SL (you don't get that low from just one kill) then NO WHERE should be safe untill you've fixed your SL..
However one thing I think that should stay is getting +5 SL for killing enemy npcs in the enemies city.. imo it's the most realistic way of "fixing" your SL.. killing enemy runners to get SL is too easy in some cases.. if you're raiding an enemy city on red SL you're far from safe and everyone should know where you are from the NCPD list. But GRing into enemy faction HQs and main city sectors shouldn't be allowed, it's not that hard to (eg) run from el farid and into tsunami sector and kill some ncps, even without stealth.
edit/ oh and you nibs that NEED your le in cause the nasty pkers gank you while your lvling.. seriously you're missing out on a hell of a lot of the game and its atmosphere.. personally I remove my le on all new characters as soon as they're started.. and getting ganked by someone just gives me a name of someone to kill later on, sometimes i've even managed to outsmart and get away from someone whos trying to kill me, other times ive even killed them!
i think they should remove all LEs for above /50. Why? Because a) god mode is plain stupid b) it gives you an unfair advantage over people with LEs (no danger in none safe zones) c) it doesn't matter what type of char you are, because you can assist players without LEs by driving / csting / ressing / repairing / scouting / hunting without the people your working against being able to take actions against you
that's just my opinion so save the bs
it's a shame the most of the decent players didn't have as much patience with crap patches as i've had :(
Bishop Yutani
14-09-06, 17:24
Can't say i'd quit if they forced me to remove my LE, but I play this game far too casually to really accept getting shot at every time I leave MB.
@ Torg. Agreed - If those who think they are hard core actually had to do something hard core to get their SL up besides go to bed or sympwhore, they wouldnt be so quick to blast up noobs and tradeskillers.
Can't say i'd quit if they forced me to remove my LE, but I play this game far too casually to really accept getting shot at every time I leave MB.
@ Torg. Agreed - If those who think they are hard core actually had to do something hard core to get their SL up besides go to bed or sympwhore, they wouldnt be so quick to blast up noobs and tradeskillers.
I would, and people did - Wasnt soulight hard to get before the EVO SL rule change -
Didnt really PVP much till just after EVO
@ Torg. Agreed - If those who think they are hard core actually had to do something hard core to get their SL up besides go to bed or sympwhore, they wouldnt be so quick to blast up noobs and tradeskillers. what's wrong with killing tradeskillers? if they are making the tools that my enemies use to kill me then they deserve to die as much as the attackers :p
Are you all missing the fact that all these runners have an LE in for a reason? If you remove that option then you will have few tradeskillers left and it can be difficult to get pokes, rep's etc as it is. Now clearly the are a lot of PvP'rs posting on this thread and plenty more that aren't, soooo, why don't you all just kill each other?
Some months ago there was a Pro vs Anti Op war. Everyone who was online joined in and even some LE'd tradskillers helped out with pokes n stuff.
You all keep looking to KK to make your PvP experience better but if you all bothered to seek one another out surely there is enough to keep you interested? I can't help but get the impression that a lot of PvP'rs just want to gank someone without them knowing about it. Why else do you need tradeskillers to surrender their LE's?
And whoever called it GODMODE, have a think about what that is for a second will you. It means I can shoot you and others without the possibility of harm to myself. Is that what an LE enables me to do?
End rant. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j172/Jodo_Kast/RantingSmiley.gif
and getting ganked by someone just gives me a name of someone to kill later on
You need to distinguish between the casual and the power gamer though. Getting ganked on a regular basis by a PE solely built for PvP, with SA and stuff that is rather hard to obtain, and a player behind it with some experience.. It'll take the casual gamer many days to get his char to a comparable level, let alone the necessary skill.
I've been ganked a few times by uber chars, had them shooting my epic mission targets right in front of me, had them fire at me just out of boredom. I did neither complain nor whine, but sometimes when I come home from work, I just wanna enjoy NC without the fear of getting ganked upon. That's why I keep one LE'd char. And I think it's fine the way it is.
And whoever called it GODMODE, have a think about what that is for a second will you. It means I can shoot you and others without the possibility of harm to myself. Is that what an LE enables me to do?
End rant. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j172/Jodo_Kast/RantingSmiley.gif you must have some stupid interpretation of what god mode is.
God - i can't kill him, he can't kill me
Mode - a designated status or condition
Hmmm I must be doing this all wrong then.. I popped out my trader's LE at about /35. :rolleyes:
RogerRamjet
14-09-06, 18:23
This game is PVP based.
There is no room for "peaceful" players.
you must have some stupid interpretation of what god mode is.
God - i can't kill him, he can't kill me
Mode - a designated status or condition
Well, as its the computer game world we're talking about here my interpretation applies. It's been a cheat in games since Spectrum's, Atari's and Amiga's were about. If you're actually talking about God the divine being then that has no relevance whatsoever.
Roc-a-fella
14-09-06, 18:24
LE is a O.K. idea for new runners but it should come out at a certain rank because capped chars running around stealing kill/loot spying on other clans is retarded. This game seem sto be built around PvP so why let people keep a chip in that disabled pvp? Thats taking the cyber out of cyber punk. Punks.
LE is a O.K. idea for new runners but it should come out at a certain rank because capped chars running around stealing kill/loot spying on other clans is retarded. This game seem sto be built around PvP so why let people keep a chip in that disabled pvp? Thats taking the cyber out of cyber punk. Punks.
BF2 is based on PvP. Neocron has always been RPG mixed with PvP thats why we have storylines, events and we can build our own char's the way we want them.
Wasn't Neptune meant to be for the PvP population? That was received well. Why did you all abandon that?
Roc-a-fella
14-09-06, 19:05
BF2 is based on PvP. Neocron has always been RPG mixed with PvP thats why we have storylines, events and we can build our own char's the way we want them.
Wasn't Neptune meant to be for the PvP population? That was received well. Why did you all abandon that?
hah, i mean. Based on pvp as in........ thats the only thing to do.
The Ottoman
14-09-06, 19:05
No forced removal of LE. I have seven characters without an LE, even my tradeskillers. I don't mind getting killed cause I know the risks. Sometimes I even accept a fight of wich I'm sure I will die. No problema and I will still love you.
Sometimes though(about 20% of gaming time), I just don't feel like it and I want to play single player style. For that reason one of my chars is LE'ed and I mainly use him to hunt. It's something I want to do in peace. I don't want to get out of the hackscreen just to have to pick a genrepdestination of choice and to read a message 'You've been killed by xxxxx'.
Don't mess with the LE!
RogerRamjet
14-09-06, 19:29
BF2 is based on PvP. Neocron has always been RPG mixed with PvP thats why we have storylines, events and we can build our own char's the way we want them.
Wasn't Neptune meant to be for the PvP population? That was received well. Why did you all abandon that?
Neptune failed because of factors already ingame. People got sick of fighting blessed hybrids and Tsunami PEs just like they were sick of fighting them on Terra or where ever.
Neptune failed because of factors already ingame. People got sick of fighting blessed hybrids and Tsunami PEs just like they were sick of fighting them on Terra or where ever.
But Neptune has some features that PvP'rs want so why do something drastic on all servers like removing the LE, is what I'm getting at. If the problems you mentioned are across the board anyway, then removing the LE option would not make any of that better. You'll just lose more of the population. If KK removed the LE or if they removed PvP then this game would die on the same day.
hah, i mean. Based on pvp as in........ thats the only thing to do.
why do you run off when someone wants to fight you then, telling you're not setup for pvp and it's unfair that more than one person at a time uses the gr you're camping? :lol:
i think many ppl just confuse pk with pvp, especially these that rant about the load of victims that sit in safezones and tradeskill. :p
i say if you want protection, then bring a gun not an LE chip.
It's the 28th century and with your personally developed character you enter the City of Neocron. This empire of anarchy is divided into the unexplored wastelands and a vibrant metropolis. Here you will simultaneously co-exist or fight with thousands of other online players against horrible monsters and dreadful mutants for power and money.
Live your life the way you want to! Choose to be a bounty hunter, a hacker, a spy, an assasin, a collector or a broker... the list is endless.
In order to survive this urban jungle of crime and corruption, you will have to increase your powers. With close to an unlimited weapons arsenal on the one hand, and communications with other players on the other, you have all you need to survive. Alliance, intrigue, espionage... expect the unexpected
All I have to say is: fuck the LE, and fuck easy-mode.
Hey giga, is that the neocron 1 box? ;D
What is wrong with carebears?
Carebears are roleplayers, they are also a part of the game.
Without carebears there are no die-hard players.
Maybe the real "care bears" are that people who are swearing and complaining
on the global chats, after they got killed by an enemy with no reason.
Where the hell that word came from, "carebear"? a bear that takes care?
A metrosexual bear? :confused: whatever
I also remember a cartoon from the 80's , with stupid bears living on a rainbow,
are they called the carebears? :confused:
but keep one thing in mind:
Its just a game.... ;)
i say if you want protection, then bring a gun not an LE chip.Nonono TL10 sword and stealth like my trader. :D
Any tradeskiller can spec 100 TC for stealth 3... using an LE is dumb anyways, the best tradeskill imps are brain chips... and you don't need TL400 rep ffs. Oh you might have to pay attention to your surroundings.. onoz! O_o
Where the hell that word came from, "carebear"? a bear that takes care?
A metrosexual bear? :confused: whatever
I also remember a cartoon from the 80's , with stupid bears living on a rainbow,
are they called the carebears? :confused:
Oh yes! http://www.karashur.net/mmorpg-articles/carebear.jpg
Roc-a-fella
14-09-06, 21:40
why do you run off when someone wants to fight you then, telling you're not setup for pvp and it's unfair that more than one person at a time uses the gr you're camping? :lol:
i think many ppl just confuse pk with pvp, especially these that rant about the load of victims that sit in safezones and tradeskill. :p
1. I die in 2 HL hits because my setup has just enough pistol to equip my weps and i dont use drugs when i go looking for people to pk which also doesnt allow me to use any armor besides boots/belt/pa because my setup is kinda drug required. You just see me out there trying to PK people because i havent played in 4 years and i wanto pvp a little cause woc+1 is boring as fk, is that alright? If i see someone and im obviously gonna get owned in 2 shots then im going to stealth. You win. I lose. Your better than me. I suck. Your very good looking. Im very ugly.
edit; lol this was gonna be a list as you can tell by the one but then i went off on a rant because thats what i do.
Oh yes! http://www.karashur.net/mmorpg-articles/carebear.jpg your next task is to explain why he is a noob (and what a noob is) for asking what a carebear is :\
Apocalypsox
15-09-06, 00:00
the only safezone that needs to be in the game is TH for trading. all other zones should be fair game for whoever wants to kill who. but reduce the number of fucking guards so if you want to be an outlaw, you can still half manage to get around the city if your sneaky. and FUCKING reduce DoY guard damage so you can be sneaky in DoY without getting kapawned in 2 hits.
[COLOR=LightBlue]
make epic item usage dependent on faction symp. if your faction symp to crahn is negative, no gaya glove for you. same goes for pp-res-chip, move-on, tsunami rifle, reveller. this will bring action to the op zones.
if you still want to be an ally-noob-killer, fine, but be prepared to do 1000 cyclops before your own faction guards will like you again. and if some un-teamed noob dies in your barrel in a cave: bad luck. this game is not for carebears.
[COLOR]
that is shite mate if you drop to low soul light you cant use the epic stuff
thats bollock you wouldnt get any fights anywhere that would take all the fun away from the game say if your on the ncpd list and you are being chased by runners looking to kill a low sl guy to get your belt you wouldnt be able to fight back or be able to get your soul light bak up without doing rezz misssions and if you have bad sl you wouldnt be able to do the rezz missions anyway cos of your sypm with the faction your in plus you have to have a ppu all the time so you dont get your ass kicked by the guards
ok. some of us want to move Neocron to a real FPS. No or nearly no safezone, no or nearly no penalties for killing anyone, just like unreal tournament in a different setting. now tell me: why on earth is neptune a dead server?
i think there should be zones and opportunities in Neocron for mindless killing sprees, and zones and opportunities for advanced enlarged enhanced carebearing as well. do you get me? if you take away the RP fom NC, it will die. we need a balance, and we need more room for non-lethal activities.
any ideas?
I think KK should make a device that people can equip that prevents them from being part of the pvp scene, plus they should also not drop a belt.
This device will allow them to be pure roleplayers and safe tradeskillers.
I think KK should make a device that people can equip that prevents them from being part of the pvp scene, plus they should also not drop a belt.
This device will allow them to be pure roleplayers and safe tradeskillers.
This is what i think, the LE chip should be replaced with a system were you have to register with NCPD and that would be open for all lvls but would take 24 hours real time for it to work. Those people can create clans with others that have did the same, they don't get to take outposts, they don't get the bonus from an outpost zone. They can have all implants slots free, meaning they can have a pvp setup for if they want to goto neofrag but not opwars and no pvp outside of neofrag.
OP wars need redoing, the benifits of owning an outpost should be much better, hell if they got there finger out and made the neocron world much bigger. They could allow us to build our own outposts, with the function of mining minerals that are used to make the chemicals that are needed to contruct weapon parts. Then they could remove all weapon parts and chemicals from the npc shops and change the way rare weapons and implants are built. Making the rare weapons also require standard weapon parts, which must be manufactured from the stuff you need to mine, that would make outpost mean something.
/edit it would have to cost a fair bit to keep an outpost running, otherwise the owning clan will just keep raking in the money, so maybe they would have to buy other materals from other players to fuel it.
/edit 2
I'm just tierd of all these whining bitches, bringing up stupid ideas, like fuck the PVPers up make them suffer for having fun blahblahblah etc
Try comming up with a good solution other than trying to get the DEVs to totaly destroy all fun thats left in this game..
The Ottoman
15-09-06, 10:52
The source of all these cries for removing of LE or no safe zones is due to the low population. The fraggers in our community have severe itching fingers but are confronted with a lack of attainable targets. The result is pure frustration.
I must agree though to making certain areas less safe. Plaza 1 should stay as it is. The other Plaza zones should have significant fewer pigs around.
I'm a bit confused about Via Rosso. It's supposed to be the residential area so maintaining the law in those zones should be sufficient.
Pepper Park should be practically lawless. Just have one poor copbot in every zone on patrolduty.
Something similar should be done for the DoY area's.
Most importantly though is REMOVE PARA! :D
neptune should be turned into the LE server
I think KK should make a device that people can equip that prevents them from being part of the pvp scene, plus they should also not drop a belt.
This device will allow them to be pure roleplayers and safe tradeskillers.
What he said. I think it's fine the way it is. What we need is more players.
RogerRamjet
15-09-06, 14:06
I think KK should make a device that people can equip that prevents them from being part of the pvp scene, plus they should also not drop a belt.
This device will allow them to be pure roleplayers and safe tradeskillers.
[ edited ]
your next task is to explain why he is a noob (and what a noob is) for asking what a carebear is :\
Bah, I'll leave him for the rats.
ok. some of us want to move Neocron to a real FPS. No or nearly no safezone, no or nearly no penalties for killing anyone, just like unreal tournament in a different setting. now tell me: why on earth is neptune a dead server? neptune died because of LEs
back to my LE rant: i don't see why people need to option to be able to be un-killable by other players. even WoW doesn't have an option like this. part of the game is avoiding the enemy and finding ways to deal with them. as my sig implies, you should have to use the resources available to you to fight against the enemy, whether this is hiring people to protect you, only travelling in vehicles or avoiding dangerous zones.
i wouldn't even mind if ally killing was disabled if the LE was just removed.
RogerRamjet
15-09-06, 14:33
[ edited ]
Aww come on Trivaldi, you must understand what he's saying :D
When was the last time you went to an opwar? 1999?I never opwar. I never remove my LE. Even without removing my LE, I know about NPCs in ops being killed accidentally. All it takes is one stray shot, one AoE blast, and boom! Negative SL.
I think KK should make a device that people can equip that prevents them from being part of the pvp scene, plus they should also not drop a belt.
This device will allow them to be pure roleplayers and safe tradeskillers.I assume you're being sarcastic, since that's what the LE is for. :-)
i say if you want protection, then bring a gun not an LE chip.Doesn't work. Not all of us rolled cookie-cutter setups with high defense and offense as a priority. When I'm out hunting, when I GR to one of the few open GRs on the ma, I don't want to deal with having to make sure I have the best defense a 20% SI hit can give me.
This game is PVP based.
There is no room for "peaceful" players.My ass. This game has PVP as a core element, but it's not the only element. The LE's been in the game for the past five years, and for the past five years I've been using it.
Everyone who wants the LE out just wants to either gank people or doesn't want to go through the trouble of screenshotting and reporting abberant behavior. To me, these people have no legitimate ground to stand on. If you want to arbitrarily gank people, go play deathmatch. If you don't want to bother reporting problematic behavior, you're part of the problem.
me personally i think kk should just take another look at neptune.
make it no le or have it pop out at a certain lvl.
make epic weapons drop......could work but then you wasted your time doing the epic but hey at least everyone would think twice about making a tsunami pe.
instead of belts make the weapon/item drop on the floor like in nc1 2002.
remove guards??? that would be fun :lol:
old outpost rules would be nice but that wont happen.
keeping th sector 2 as the only safezone wouldn't be a bad idea cept where theres a safezone there is a zonewhore.
faster sl regain than before :lol: (hey i can dream cant i?)
RogerRamjet
15-09-06, 21:22
Don't worry Icestorm.
I can indiscriminately PK people in death match and in NC.
Just in NC, theres actually someone behind a screen somewhere getting incredibly annoyed :)
I never opwar. I never remove my LE. Even without removing my LE, I know about NPCs in ops being killed accidentally. All it takes is one stray shot, one AoE blast, and boom! Negative SL.
I literally lol'd at this comment. This thread delivers keep it up.
I never opwar. I never remove my LE. Even without removing my LE, I know about NPCs in ops being killed accidentally. All it takes is one stray shot, one AoE blast, and boom! Negative SL.I assume you're being sarcastic, since that's what the LE is for. :-)Doesn't work. Not all of us rolled cookie-cutter setups with high defense and offense as a priority. When I'm out hunting, when I GR to one of the few open GRs on the ma, I don't want to deal with having to make sure I have the best defense a 20% SI hit can give me.My ass. This game has PVP as a core element, but it's not the only element. The LE's been in the game for the past five years, and for the past five years I've been using it.
Everyone who wants the LE out just wants to either gank people or doesn't want to go through the trouble of screenshotting and reporting abberant behavior. To me, these people have no legitimate ground to stand on. If you want to arbitrarily gank people, go play deathmatch. If you don't want to bother reporting problematic behavior, you're part of the problem.No shit, but posting this just removed you from the list of people who actually know what theyre talking about.
Get out of this thread. Now. :lol:
/edit
To make this more clear and to not get edited by evil mods who never sleep..
- The thing with people accidently killing vendors in ops and loosing SL is long gone.
- People who take the LE out either have a) balls or b) knowledge.
/edit of the edit i edited
I know you never took the LE out and never will. Yet you fall into that category.
- You seem to be a c). No clue what you're doing. Theres always a c). Cannonfodder. No matter what game.
- I don't want to arbitrarily gank people. I just love the PvP in NC. And i don't have a fucking clue what arbitrarily means.
/next edit
dict.cc ftw!
As i said, i don't want to arbitrarily gank people. I just love the PvP in NC. :lol:
This is what i think, the LE chip should be replaced with a system were you have to register with NCPD and that would be open for all lvls but would take 24 hours real time for it to work. Those people can create clans with others that have did the same, they don't get to take outposts, they don't get the bonus from an outpost zone. They can have all implants slots free, meaning they can have a pvp setup for if they want to goto neofrag but not opwars and no pvp outside of neofrag.
OP wars need redoing, the benifits of owning an outpost should be much better, hell if they got there finger out and made the neocron world much bigger. They could allow us to build our own outposts, with the function of mining minerals that are used to make the chemicals that are needed to contruct weapon parts. Then they could remove all weapon parts and chemicals from the npc shops and change the way rare weapons and implants are built. Making the rare weapons also require standard weapon parts, which must be manufactured from the stuff you need to mine, that would make outpost mean something.
/edit it would have to cost a fair bit to keep an outpost running, otherwise the owning clan will just keep raking in the money, so maybe they would have to buy other materals from other players to fuel it.
/edit 2
I'm just tierd of all these whining bitches, bringing up stupid ideas, like fuck the PVPers up make them suffer for having fun blahblahblah etc
Try comming up with a good solution other than trying to get the DEVs to totaly destroy all fun thats left in this game..
[ot] it would be kool if you could make your own op and name it yourself
but i think your idea on the ncpd list thing is good where le'd peeps could make clans and just roleplay the fuck out of this game with out getting bothered by the pvp side of this game
I could alright if taking part in PVP = greater reward.
risk vs reward kind of thing.
I never opwar. I never remove my LE. Even without removing my LE, I know about NPCs in ops being killed accidentally. All it takes is one stray shot, one AoE blast, and boom! Negative SL.I assume you're being sarcastic, since that's what the LE is for. :-)Doesn't work. Not all of us rolled cookie-cutter setups with high defense and offense as a priority. When I'm out hunting, when I GR to one of the few open GRs on the ma, I don't want to deal with having to make sure I have the best defense a 20% SI hit can give me.My ass. This game has PVP as a core element, but it's not the only element. The LE's been in the game for the past five years, and for the past five years I've been using it.
Everyone who wants the LE out just wants to either gank people or doesn't want to go through the trouble of screenshotting and reporting abberant behavior. To me, these people have no legitimate ground to stand on. If you want to arbitrarily gank people, go play deathmatch. If you don't want to bother reporting problematic behavior, you're part of the problem.
You haven't been able to kill the NPCs at OPs for fawking ages :\
And secondly, while you might enjoy walking around being unkillable, i don't particularly enjoy the fact that you can build weapons for my enemies, supply them with items from hunting, spy on me for them, and say whatever you want without any consequences. I also can't prevent you from hunting certain places if I wanted a monopoly over certain items which means that you are ruining my neocron experience by unfairly preventing me from playing the game the way it's meant to be played. This is why we need a LE server and why we can't have none LEs and LEs on the same server :mad:
If you don't want to be killed, then stay in tech haven and don't go to dangerous places.
I think KK should make a device that people can equip that prevents them from being part of the pvp scene, plus they should also not drop a belt. This device will allow them to be pure roleplayers and safe tradeskillers.
you are talking about this LE thingy, right?
I'm just tired of all these whining bitches, bringing up stupid ideas, like fuck the PVPers up make them suffer for having fun ...
i think there should be more opportunities for PvP than hanging out in the MB staircase zone (like.. some people), waiting for victims or adversaries. and i think there should be rules to keep NC from being a pure FPS. like allies and severe penalties for killing them.
i think we should bring PvP back to OPs, but thats's another story.
you are talking about this LE thingy, right?
i think there should be more opportunities for PvP than hanging out in the MB staircase zone (like.. some people), waiting for victims or adversaries. and i think there should be rules to keep NC from being a pure FPS. like allies and severe penalties for killing them.
i think we should bring PvP back to OPs, but thats's another story.
Yes and thats why I'm on mars, plenty of targets outside of mb, get the idea? I'm sick of fighting the same stupid people at MB zone also.
And secondly, while you might enjoy walking around being unkillable, i don't particularly enjoy the fact that you can build weapons for my enemies, supply them with items from hunting, spy on me for them, and say whatever you want without any consequences. I also can't prevent you from hunting certain places if I wanted a monopoly over certain items which means that you are ruining my neocron experience by unfairly preventing me from playing the game the way it's meant to be played. This is why we need a LE server and why we can't have none LEs and LEs on the same server :mad:
If you don't want to be killed, then stay in tech haven and don't go to dangerous places.Very well put =)
I'll add a bit by pointing out a few examples of how LE's are cheating...
- Hunting WBs on my spy and an LE'd reveler team pretty much follow me around blasting all the WBs and hacking them with no risk what-so-ever
- LE'd droners in mc5..
- Camping the end of caveruns (particually crp) and kill/looting the 120/120 mob
- LE's following around your op team spying on you while on voice comms with the enemy telling them EVERYTHING
- Staying in caves when there's no mobs left to kill
and not a damn thing you can do about any of this.. and getting a GM to sort the problem generally takes a long time.. stop trying to defend yourself with it's better having people playing LE's than them quitting..
edit/ someone make a no-le's avatar (the usual sign - like mine) so i can steal it =]
- The thing with people accidently killing vendors in ops and loosing SL is long gone.I'll give it a try next time I'm at an op with an alt. Last time I was at Gabanium, (a few weeks ago), the vendor was taking pot shots at me, and I hadn't fired at him.
And secondly, while you might enjoy walking around being unkillable, i don't particularly enjoy the fact that you can build weapons for my enemies,So it's ok if an LE builds weapons for you, but not if they build weapons for all? If you don't want to trade with LEs, don't.
supply them with items from hunting,So it's ok if I supply you, but not others?
spy on me for them,I don't spy on anyone. I have never "spied" at an op war. The only time I've ever been in an op during a battle, I was there before the battle started and stuck around well after, ressing parts.
and say whatever you want without any consequences.The same applies to you...
I also can't prevent you from hunting certain places if I wanted a monopoly over certain itemsAnd the same holds true for me...
which means that you are ruining my neocron experience by unfairly preventing me from playing the game the way it's meant to be played.You are not the one who decides how the game is "meant to be played", KK is. KK's had the LE in the game since Beta 2.
This is why we need a LE server and why we can't have none LEs and LEs on the same serverWe've had both on the same servers for years. It's not the LE causing the problem.
- Hunting WBs on my spy and an LE'd reveler team pretty much follow me around blasting all the WBs and hacking them with no risk what-so-everReport them to abuse.
- LE'd droners in mc5..Report them to abuse.
- Camping the end of caveruns (particually crp) and kill/looting the 120/120 mobReport them to abuse.
- LE's following around your op team spying on you while on voice comms with the enemy telling them EVERYTHINGYou are aware that the original plan for NC was to lock out all other programs on the PC such that third party comms wouldn't be usable, correct? You see how well that worked out....
Oh, and report them to abuse.
- Staying in caves when there's no mobs left to killReport them to abuse.
and not a damn thing you can do about any of this.. and getting a GM to sort the problem generally takes a long time..If you don't report every violation you're part of the problem, not part of the solution.
stop trying to defend yourself with it's better having people playing LE's than them quitting..Who needs to defend themselves? KK implemented the LE for that reason at the request of CDV.
No shit, but posting this just removed you from the list of people who actually know what theyre talking about. Apparently, the only thing I didn't know about was that the NPCs at ops are now invulnerable. It doesn't invalidate the other problem, that of killing the wrong NPC for an epic (or accidentally killing another NPC in general).
the problem with les is that way too many ppl use it to exploit/cheat. if it wasn't for such ppl there wouldn't be much of a problem with it (there wouldn't be any big problems in this game at all (including netcode) if ppl wouldn't take their illegal advantages).
problem is how do you want to prove in a picture that the le'd repper repps a rhino that is killing ppl? that's why the le needs to be redone imo
IceStorm just because you havnt , doesnt mean 99% of LE people have
Scaramanga
17-09-06, 02:48
You can please some of the people all of time and all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time.
Good thing about having a 4 slot server, or the ability to have multiple accounts is that you can have both le and non le characters to both pvp and tradeskill with.
If the game mechanics mean that a non pvp setup player stands no chance in a fight then i vote let them use an le to keep their gaming viable. If you like PvP then have a PvP setup player without and le and go round shooting whoever you like and accept the consequences.
If there aren't enough people for you to shoot then tough shit. Who the fuck do you think you are to tell someone how to spend their time playing a game in their own time.
If the platform doesn't allow for a large playerbase to validate their time spent playing then that isn't the fault of a player.
im not sure if a forced LE romoval would work, but i think its a good idea as long as it relies on combat rank too, i mean how many LE'd chars do you see on terra nowadays that are between 50+/50 and 60+/60+, if they cant even defend themselves and need an LE to survive its a sad day. thats why ive moved to mars for a while, higher population, less LE'd people and ignoring the fact i cant speak german, there seems to be a less complaining (and as a side note i only have my le in on mars cos i got the droner bug and got -44 SL at **/10, as soon as its 0 again its coming out, i just didnt want to be a big alarm on the NCPD while lvling)
oh and IceStorm, you say report them to abuse, I have for most of those things listed, and the GMs have always said "ill look into it", or the person is long gone before the ticket is answered, so i get accused of wasting GMs time, so i cant win
Apocalypsox
17-09-06, 03:53
[ edited ]
lmfao!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: now THATS Funny :angel:
Doc Holliday
17-09-06, 11:13
I can indiscriminately PK people in death match and in NC.
Just in NC, theres actually someone behind a screen somewhere getting incredibly annoyed :)
There is in any other game roger after you get off single player and play on a proper internet server.
In other words.... "Turn the fucking bots off" ( i dont mean your aim bots tho you can keep those ^^)
So that's 2 servers so far that have been ruined by the LE....
and icestorm, i don't know if you've chosen to misunderstand me or if your just ignorant, but not trading with LEs isn't going to change the fact that they are still building weapons for enemies, and i don't care who the LEs are helping (even if it's me) it's not something that i want happening at all.
The only real solution in my mind is to have a LE only server, and offer a transfer to that server. That way they do not interfere at all with non-LEs and all the little annoying players [ edited ] can sit there and piss each other off.
Discuss the topic, not the people.
N
So that's 2 servers so far that have been ruined by the LE....i do not agree to your opinion, giga. neptune was not ruined by LEs, but by its wrong setup: free and unlimited killing. you'll find a lot of LEd players on terra as well, and that's not because they all would be wimps, cheaters or plain stupid, but because of mindless killing. mars does not have that high percentage of LEd players, just because there is more RP going on: you just do not expect to be attacked by an allied or neutral player, just for one single reason: he (she) is allied or neutral. and i do remember a time, when even enemy (F6 enemy) players did not kill someone without a RP story behind, and mostly not without warning.
even more simple: stop shooting people outside of OP wars (or RP-connected city raids) and everybody will gladly pop their LE out. Keep killing everybody because you mistake NC for one big quake map, and 90% of all players will keep their LE in. it is that simple.
let me predict one more thing: if there ever will be an "LE-server" where you can't kill anyone outside OP-wars, people will move there and leave mars and terra empty.
let me predict one more thing: if there ever will be an "LE-server" where you can't kill anyone outside OP-wars, people will move there and leave mars and terra empty.
......What a lame idea, this game is fun because of the mindless killing
i do not agree to your opinion, giga. neptune was not ruined by LEs, but by its wrong setup: free and unlimited killing.you're half right.. yes it was wrongly setup, but only because they allowed the LE (a device to disable PVP) on the PVP server :rolleyes:
stop shooting people outside of OP wars (or RP-connected city raids) and everybody will gladly pop their LE outOP fights are too zergy, ninja hacky and barrel spammy these days
i think most problems with les are on the multislotservers as ppl exploiting it's benefits are mostly unle'd and clanned on another alt, so i'd propose the le to be a setting you choose for your whole account, not for a single character. then ppl who want to fight can't just log on their le'd hunter to earn cash or their le'd driver to inspect the enemy forces in an op.
the point is there are not enuff safezones in the game to be interesting for a player that mainly wants to be a trader or sthing like that. one cannot expect these ppl to pay for a game in which they are restricted to 2 or 3 zones.
what i would propose is that le'd ppl can be attacked and then they should be able to defend themselves as if they had no le. if they get killed by a runner they could go to the ncpd or some tg revolutionary police force and make a report about it, which leads to a unit of copbots or doy guards being send to the murderer that kills him and his teammates and ofc loot their belts as evidence :p
this would give mean persons the ability to kill whoever they liked, but would also grant a certain amount of safety to ppl wearing a le.
(and would work exactly how a le should)
i think most problems with les are on the multislotservers as ppl exploiting it's benefits are mostly unle'd and clanned on another alt, so i'd propose the le to be a setting you choose for your whole account, not for a single character. then ppl who want to fight can't just log on their le'd hunter to earn cash or their le'd driver to inspect the enemy forces in an op.
the point is there are not enuff safezones in the game to be interesting for a player that mainly wants to be a trader or sthing like that. one cannot expect these ppl to pay for a game in which they are restricted to 2 or 3 zones.
yes i agree with the setting LE/no LE for your whole account. As for the lack of zones for none combat chars, i think that's total bullshit. If people would stop using the same zones all the time, then maybe they would get pked less :\
EDIT: just for the sake of it, here is a list of ways not to get yourself killed while in the wastelands:
Don't go to all the well known leveling places, pkers usually patroll these areas
Travel in a fast vehicle, to be even safer, travel in one where your character can't be targetted
Gene-rep to less used GRs, even if it means you need to travel a bit further
Try to avoid OP fights :\
Travel with other people who can PvP
i think LEed people are just lazy players
Dribble Joy
17-09-06, 15:12
......What a lame idea, this game is fun because of the mindless killing
For some people, yes. For others, it completely ruins the game.
I have no issue with mindless killing itself, NC's very free system compared to other games is what makes it great. The problem as I (probably in this very thread) and others have said is that the consequences don't equal the 'suffering'. I don't mindlessly kill. I don't kill without a valid RP reason, back in NC1 I often didn't attack enemies without due casue and set up several NAPs with hotile clans/factions. But that said I don't have any issue with people going on a killing spree, I just wish that doing so would actually impact on the life of the runner(s) that do so.
I just wish that doing so would actually impact on the life of the runner(s) that do so. SL should be hard to lose, but also hard to get back but only IF they remove the stupid rules where low SL players drop more items. Low SL should mean that you are KOS to guards so that you cannot go certain places (meaning that you can then remove safezones) and nothing else.
Dribble Joy
17-09-06, 15:24
SL should be hard to lose, but also hard to get back but only IF they remove the stupid rules where low SL players drop more items. Low SL should mean that you are KOS to guards so that you cannot go certain places (meaning that you can then remove safezones) and nothing else.
Indeed, thopugh personally I would do away with SL and (as I have parroted too many times) work off symps. Using them as SL for each faction. As/If faction relations become more complex (like NC1), then this will be needed (allready makes CM live a bit iffy, daft when you get shot at by TS when you killed a CA runner). Guard reaction would be based on the symp with that guard's faction.
Personally I'd extend the effects to other things, like GR price/access, vendor price (and maybe access) and stuff.
One of the main things I'd like to see an end to is the auto SL/symp regain. This makes it even worse as anyone with bad SL can sit in their apt/TH while they're in bed/wherever and get their SL back without any activity on their part. Just this would make people think a little more about killing.
Indeed, thopugh personally I would do away with SL and (as I have parroted too many times) work off symps. Using them as SL for each faction. As/If faction relations become more complex (like NC1), then this will be needed (allready makes CM live a bit iffy, daft when you get shot at by TS when you killed a CA runner). Guard reaction would be based on the symp with that guard's faction.
Personally I'd extend the effects to other things, like GR price/access, vendor price (and maybe access) and stuff.
One of the main things I'd like to see an end to is the auto SL/symp regain. This makes it even worse as anyone with bad SL can sit in their apt/TH while they're in bed/wherever and get their SL back without any activity on their part. Just this would make people think a little more about killing.
i definately agree with you on the auto SL gain, possibly sympathy gain too, though i only dont totally agree with that one cos its just annoying when your leveling and someone jumps into your barrel to get you -SL to later kill you. i like the idea of certain vendors not serving you if you had -SL, though i know most of the time when i have -SL, or even just generally, i dont use vendors that often.
i dont think would stop people killing however, those who want to just randomly gank people would still do it and either just stay at -SL or just be willing to get it up again to have the 'fun' of ganking again
the problem with les is that way too many ppl use it to exploit/cheat.And they use multipe accounts, and vent/teamspeak, and multiple PCs...
In the current game iteration, you can't just cut LE'ed players out of zones, just like you can't stop dead people from talking on Vent, just like you can't stop people from using multiple PCs to play NC. If you plug this one hole, it doesn't resolve all the other holes, you'll just shift your angst to other "unfair" behavior.
You're not going to get rid of vent/teamspeak. You're not going to get rid of multiple PCs per person playing NC. You're not going to get rid of multiple accounts. Unless you're going to address ALL the loopholes in NC, eliminating the LE isn't going to do anything but reduce the playerbase.
There will always be loopholes. There will always be people using those loopholes. Why not stop being so close-minded and just use the loopholes yourselves? If it's a loophole that KK has branded a prohibited action, report it. If it's not, quit yer bitching and play the game.
so, you're a trader, you were just trying to level up, got killed? here's what you'll hear:
"keep your LE in, stay in a safezone, use a stealthtool! neocron isn't for carebears."
You know, its all bollocks. My non-LE tradeskiller char armed with a nib stealth tool has only been gunned down once in the past year. Its a piece of piss not to die as a tradeskiller. And anyway, I expect my tradechar to run risks just like my tank and apu. Its my choice she's a tradechar. I could have made a rifle spy or rolled a ppu!
You're not going to get rid of vent/teamspeak. You're not going to get rid of multiple PCs per person playing NC. You're not going to get rid of multiple accounts. Unless you're going to address ALL the loopholes in NC, eliminating the LE isn't going to do anything but reduce the playerbase.Just wondering but while you're ranting are you gonna come up with any actual points? .. the simple fact is, if they don't have LE you can kill them so they can't follow you around to tell people stuff on vent, and if they're dead you can move them
edit/ also i love gigas idea on how SL should work, and it would effectivly be a good way of stopping evil red sl players from going to city zones (easily), and dribble joy is right it should work off faction symp and not SL anyway, SL should just be ditched.. If you're below -50 with an allied faction they should attack you, if you're below 0 with a neutral they should attack you, and in the rare case if you have 100 symp with an enemy they should let you live (imo)
Just wondering but while you're ranting are you gonna come up with any actual points?You mean like how removing the LE just removes one loophole - there are still plenty of others.
the simple fact is, if they don't have LE you can kill them so they can't follow you around to tell people stuff on vent, and if they're dead you can move themSo let's say the LE's removed. People could still:
- Create alts in the same faction/clan as the one being assaulted, then watch the battle and report on it via vent.
- Use a Spy with Obliterator.
- Respawn and redie near the battle after being moved too far away from the combat zone.
Like I said, if you don't like others using the LE in a manner KK has deemed acceptable, start doing it yourself. Your only other option appears to be whining about it...
You mean like how removing the LE just removes one loophole - there are still plenty of others.So let's say the LE's removed. People could still:
- Create alts in the same faction/clan as the one being assaulted, then watch the battle and report on it via vent.
- Use a Spy with Obliterator.
- Respawn and redie near the battle after being moved too far away from the combat zone.
Like I said, if you don't like others using the LE in a manner KK has deemed acceptable, start doing it yourself. Your only other option appears to be whining about it...
1)Create alts in the same faction/clan as the one being assaulted, then watch the battle and report on it via vent.
1)this one can happen but most big clans ask for pics of your alts or the names of them
2)Use a Spy with Obliterator.
2)ever heard of a true sight or a barrel
You know, its all bollocks. My non-LE tradeskiller char armed with a nib stealth tool has only been gunned down once in the past year. Its a piece of piss not to die as a tradeskiller. And anyway, I expect my tradechar to run risks just like my tank and apu. Its my choice she's a tradechar. I could have made a rifle spy or rolled a ppu!
i agree your tradeskiller shouldnt even die at all tbh you dont need to go in any zones that they can be killed in i
kept my le in till i had all 3 of the grs i mentioned below
a trade char should have th/mb/p1 and maybe drt if he/she can drive
- Create alts in the same faction/clan as the one being assaulted, then watch the battle and report on it via vent.
- Use a Spy with Obliterator.
- Respawn and redie near the battle after being moved too far away from the combat zone.
Like I said, if you don't like others using the LE in a manner KK has deemed acceptable, start doing it yourself. Your only other option appears to be whining about it...
erm actually kk never said that some usages of le's are acceptable, it's just very hard to prove these.
besides using a spy with an obli to spy in an opwar mebbe is a reason that class is called spy.
additionaly i can get rid of that spy by just killing him, same goes for the 'ally'
Doc Holliday
18-09-06, 06:57
Sorry if this classes as discussing an exploit and please remove it if it is but do turrets still shoot people with le chips in ? i remember it used to be a very naughty thing and was borderline ban material because players were killing the le runner intentionally but then the player with the le was basically abusing it.
This arguement has raged for years sad to say and its always the same old thing argued back and forth for and against the le. it helps people and it hinders others. the thing is people who abuse it are the ones who should get reprimanded imho.
i think it does doc cos when we (deathrow) took over cycrow they would but les in the ug so the turrets would not reset to the clan that owned the op and then we had led tradeskillers logging in and then they would died very fast to one of the turrets
i think if you make it so turrets dont attack led runners it would be like guards
not attacking led runners think about it a turret is like a guard in a way it attacks the enemy no matter the le or not so they should attack led chars tbh
i'm jealous of the darkfall dev team, here's a rough quote of how one them answered in a Q&A
If you don't like the way another player is playing, kill them
The LE is bad RP, bad for PvP and takes away a lot of possibilities for none LEed players to really shape the game world.
I think this whole system needs a review, so that one player always has the option of killing another player in dangerous zones, whether there are consequences or not. If players do not wish to participate in PvP, they should have to take realistic measures to avoid it such as the ones i mentioned above
The LE is bad RP, bad for PvP and takes away a lot of possibilities for none LEed players to really shape the game world.There is no way for players to "shape" the game world. The game world, other than op settings, is defined wholly by KK and the GM staff.
* Don't go to all the well known leveling places, pkers usually patroll these areasThis doesn't guarantee safety from assholes.
* Travel in a fast vehicle, to be even safer, travel in one where your character can't be targettedSo it's hovertec or watch one's Rhino be blown up?
* Gene-rep to less used GRs, even if it means you need to travel a bit furtherExactly how? There are a very limited number of GRs available to all in the wastes. The rest are clan controlled, and on Mars that means the majority are locked down.
* Try to avoid OP fights :\Why would an LE'ed player who was using the LE as intended, go to an op fight? The only one I've ever witnessed started well after I arrived to res parts and ended well before I finished resssing parts. This goes back to REPORTING things to KK instead of just whining about it here.
* Travel with other people who can PvPOn servers with populations of 10 to 40 in the off-peek hours, most of who are idling?
i think LEed people are just lazy playersAnd I think people who want the LE removed really want to go play deathmatch or just enjoy ruining other people's day. Go get your kicks elsewhere.
what the fucks wrong with looking for fights
Back on saturn we used to make it a sport to "catch" le'd runners at opfights by boxing them in with turrets :-)
There is no way for players to "shape" the game world. The game world, other than op settings, is defined wholly by KK and the GM staff. LEs also prevent clans from properly controlling their territories with LEs just walking all over the place despite it being enemy land. By the game world, i'm talking full controll of terrotiries as well as the game's economics.
This doesn't guarantee safety from assholes. Yes, it doesn't, but dying is not going to happen very often, and when it does, it's not the end of the world....
So it's hovertec or watch one's Rhino be blown up? you'd have to be pretty stupid to have it blown up, seeing as it can travel faster than any player.
Exactly how? There are a very limited number of GRs available to all in the wastes. The rest are clan controlled, and on Mars that means the majority are locked down.
it doesn't take more than 10-15 mins to travel from TH to anywhere else on a quad, i don't see the huge inconvenience. And considering that i am just as vunerable as a 0/2 after gring, i don't seem to get killed a lot by gring places.
Why would an LE'ed player who was using the LE as intended, go to an op fight? The only one I've ever witnessed started well after I arrived to res parts and ended well before I finished resssing parts. This goes back to REPORTING things to KK instead of just whining about it here.
seeing as my guide was supposed to help people survive without a LE, i'm not sure why you are asking what a LEed player would do. Yes, you are right that stumbling across an OP fight by accident is a rare occurance, but this just swings the arguement even more in favour of removing the LE.
On servers with populations of 10 to 40 in the off-peek hours, most of who are idling?
so surely it wouldn't be hard to avoid those 10 to 40 people and not get pked?
And I think people who want the LE removed really want to go play deathmatch or just enjoy ruining other people's day. Go get your kicks elsewhere.
i think the people who don't want pvp interaction should go play a single player game, go get your kicks elsewhere
If brammers, the un-LEed tradeskiller can survive in the NC world, i don't see why anyone wouldn't be able to...
EDIT: just to put things into perspective, i think that a LE type device is the most carebear thing you could possible do in a mmorpg, except for disabling pvp totally.
There is no way for players to "shape" the game world. The game world, other than op settings, is defined wholly by KK and the GM staff.
Wrong
This doesn't guarantee safety from assholes.
Umm yeah it won't but it will reduce the risk hugely, do you think i get pked much when I'm out hunting or lvling? No I don't cos I'm not stupid I don't sit in the middle of CRP saying hey come gank me...
So it's hovertec or watch one's Rhino be blown up?
So you wanna toy that never breaks even when its shoot at with a rocket launcher, give me a break :rolleyes: Besides there is a quad you can get from one of the noob missions for Mr jones, that breaks but its never gone and reps to full for pennies..
Exactly how? There are a very limited number of GRs available to all in the wastes. The rest are clan controlled, and on Mars that means the majority are locked down.
El farid, DRT, Battledome, MB, Crest village, Point red? ummmm Techhaven and outzone. Also any ops that are open and most are on mars so i don't know what you are going about there.. Also as i said above get a flipping quad, the whole map is reachable within minutes..
Why would an LE'ed player who was using the LE as intended, go to an op fight? The only one I've ever witnessed started well after I arrived to res parts and ended well before I finished resssing parts. This goes back to REPORTING things to KK instead of just whining about it here.
Well with that part, he was refering to non LE'd people, can't you read? Or do you just like to blabber crap. If your non LE'd and walk into the middle of an OP war one of those guys fighting is going to be 95% of the time enemy faction and will KILL YOU. So this was just some friendly advice but you just went off on one again.. :rolleyes:
On servers with populations of 10 to 40 in the off-peek hours, most of who are idling?
Are you an LE'd player or not? o_O If you are well this don't even effect you, again this was just his friendly advice, for those that want to combat pkers. Your complaining about the server population, I bet your gonna blame that on the PVPers to right?
And I think people who want the LE removed really want to go play deathmatch or just enjoy ruining other people's day. Go get your kicks elsewhere.
Nope I'll stay here and watch you bitch and moan and you do seem a bit lazy, complaining about no GR's and having to walk "oh boohoo I want everything in one place and no one to bother me"
looking back at the time when i first started playing NC, i am very happy that the first thing i did was to take out my LE. It made the game so much more exciting. I used to get killed a lot because it was saturn, but i soon learned how to avoid pkers, and i made some allies who could help me out if i got into trouble. Perhaps we need the lvling malus back
Anyone that comes up with the "killing npcs at outposts" argument has lost all validity to me.
It's not even worth replying to.
It's obvious he wants to play his game without the interference of being killed.
I suggest the sims online, although there is the chance of drowning in a pool there......
Anyone that comes up with the "killing npcs at outposts" argument has lost all validity to me.
It's not even worth replying to. i don't think he's just a one off either, most LEed players would be ignorant to most of the games mechanics due to the nature of the LE
the pvpers is NOT the only ones playing this game tho and their way is not always the only one as many of them seem to think so
i say keep the Le in
if people choose not to fight so be it, let them do whatever people who dont pvp do.
the explotation of the LE chip is another thing tho LE drives repaireres of rhinko etc. when they are used in said pvp now that should be dealt with.
As much as I like keeping the LE in game as an option - what do you guys think of zones where the LE simply doesn't have any effect? Say a large radioactive area in the middle of the wasteland? Put a few cool places like the jailhouse in there, add some nice levelling spots.. LE'd runners still can go there, but are prone to attacking and can shoot back.
the pvpers is NOT the only ones playing this game tho and their way is not always the only one as many of them seem to think so
i say keep the Le in
if people choose not to fight so be it, let them do whatever people who dont pvp do.
the explotation of the LE chip is another thing tho LE drives repaireres of rhinko etc. when they are used in said pvp now that should be dealt with.
Yeah but then we have little cry babys complaining on the forums they get killed cos they took the LE chip out. I Don't care if they don't want to PVP thats up to them but they should understand this is a game with PVP. It makes me laugh when these carebears say stuff like pehapes you should go play deathmatch. Erm no how about THEY go play the fucking sims online and shutup crying.
This doesn't guarantee safety from assholes.
Its makes the odds of gettin killed very very low. What more do you want other than be wrapped in cotton wool.
So it's hovertec or watch one's Rhino be blown up?
If you had any sense you would use a quad.
Exactly how? There are a very limited number of GRs available to all in the wastes. The rest are clan controlled, and on Mars that means the majority are locked down.
As for clan controlled GR's, well on Mars BIBO own most of the map. CRP is usually open, gravis and jankins always are. If you goin use points like that as an arguement at least know what you are on about, it might help you to stop looking like a complete jackass.
Why would an LE'ed player who was using the LE as intended, go to an op fight? The only one I've ever witnessed started well after I arrived to res parts and ended well before I finished resssing parts. This goes back to REPORTING things to KK instead of just whining about it here.
You say "the only one I have ever witnessed" as if you op a lot. You dont, you thought NPC's still died from aoe at ops. Again you have no idea what you are talking about. Ask someone from FF the uses of le runners at ops btw, was a favourite tactic for them.
Yeah but then we have little cry babys complaining on the forums they get killed cos they took the LE chip out. I Don't care if they don't want to PVP thats up to them but they should understand this is a game with PVP. It makes me laugh when these carebears say stuff like pehapes you should go play deathmatch. Erm no how about THEY go play the fucking sims online and shutup crying.
i agree 100%
and its equally funne when ally gankers etc start to whine and say OMG to many LEd player OMG WAAAAAAA.
just keep the le in game, and people who wanna fight can take it out, and people who dont can keep the le in simple one would think
i agree 100%
and its equally funne when ally gankers etc start to whine and say OMG to many LEd player OMG WAAAAAAA.
just keep the le in game, and people who wanna fight can take it out, and people who dont can keep the le in simple one would think
Yeah I think it works fine the way it is, though maybe they could change it back to when you can implant it at any level. But only if you have 100 faction symp with your faction and good SL
Yeah I think it works fine the way it is, though maybe they could change it back to when you can implant it at any level. But only if you have 100 faction symp with your faction and good SL
How about making people do an epic so they can reimplant it?
Bozz-Von Mel
18-09-06, 12:27
Oh great another 5 year old argument again.
Not all LE players are tradeskillers. In fact, there is some WoC spy on terra with an LE. My tradeskiller never has had an LE and he has 0 weapon skills. Does he get killed ? Yes. Do I care? No.
I am leveling a couple players with LE, and the only reason for that is currently I have to play with an avg 2000 ping. My success at PvP is kind of low. So I avoid it for now. (Goes back to my argument its more about internet connection than skill anyway.)
I do not think its a good idea to eliminate the LE chip or even complain that people have it. Sure its abused but not that often. If this game was purely PvP based then an LE would not be necessary. However, its a RPG too. Want a pure FPS with PvP? There are plenty out there. Please quit trying to turn this into a pure PvP game.
But the problem is then that there is very little that can do that has an influence on the actions of LE players, yet LE players can still affect the game's economy and the outcome of OP wars (even without direclt breaking the rules). One solution would be to make LEed players killable in warzones, but i would prefer a more thorough solution that covers all of the problems that have been discussed. The slower leveling would be acceptable too.
Additional comments:
In my mind, the LE was just made as a solution to bad rules. If or when these rules get fixed, the LE will be redundant and should undoubtedly be removed. The new rules should never allow wastelands to be safe, and they should always remain danger zones. Players who choose to RP a more 'evil' path for their characters should find it harder (not impossible) to enter what would be considered safer zones. These zones should include plaza, viarosso and tech haven, there should be very little protection from guards in any of the pepper park sectors, and OZ/industrial sectors should be relatively law-less. The SL rules should be constructed so that you have to make it clear (by actions) which path you choose, and it should be hard to switch from good to evil or vice versa. As mentioned above, dropping more items when you are low SL is not acceptable because it makes the evil path totally unviable. I think this should be a priority along with the OP war system revision after 2.2. has been completed. I believe that there is large amount of PvPers who would come back if decent rules were made, as shown by the 2.1. free trial, although they were unfortunately (yet understandably) disappointed with 2.1
There is no way for players to "shape" the game world. The game world, other than op settings, is defined wholly by KK and the GM staff.So if a clan was camping at el farid, killing anyone that comes thru the GR or anywhere near the underground (let alone inside), they're not "shaping" the game world..
Removing the LE completely would open up sooo many possibilities to do in the game.. hadden't really thought about it till now =]]
removing le will make some people quit, taking it out of game will make how many people come back and why ?
how can le people affect the outcome of an op war ? only thing i can think of is the rhino thing and when it have a non le gunner u can shoot it and damage it when he runs out u can kill him
sure its lame but it dont affect to much
removing le will make some people quit, taking it out of game will make how many people come back and why ?
how can le people affect the outcome of an op war ? only thing i can think of is the rhino thing and when it have a non le gunner u can shoot it and damage it when he runs out u can kill him
sure its lame but it dont affect to much
Euh and an le'd driver with hc pe gunning the rhino.....
Rhino near dead, pe jumps out with rhino as cover , then stealths while le'd driver reps somewhere safe. Then gets back in and he comes in for more action.
With the speeds at which a stambooster eating driver with high rep reps you can take out a LOT of people.
Also bringing 4 le'd rhinos to park around the ug while people just barrel works nicely.
or just spying and supplying the enemy with items/money
removing le will make some people quit, taking it out of game will make how many people come back and why ?
how can le people affect the outcome of an op war ? only thing i can think of is the rhino thing and when it have a non le gunner u can shoot it and damage it when he runs out u can kill him
sure its lame but it dont affect to much
True removing LE is not goin to make a load of people come back. A whole load of other things to be done to draw people back before you remove the le.
As for affectin outcome of a war? Well maybe it does not affect the outcome but parking a rhino in front of a ug or over a body so it cannot be rezzed or using a le repper/driver is really pathetic and annoying. Its something ive seen your clan do a hell of a lot at Cycrow.
Mighty Max
18-09-06, 14:07
@carecare, report these actions to abuse. You can't blame ppl that decide to keep away from pvp for using abusive tactics in pvp.
or just spying and supplying the enemy with items/money
Items and money can be safely feed by non-LE's within safe-zones. So a point thats going to both sides.
Spying can be done the same way with corpses or real spying actions that involve infiltrating. Again a point that both sides can do, or refuse to do.
Items and money can be safely feed by non-LE's within safe-zones. So a point thats going to both sides.It's more a point that they can safely collect this money + rares + stuff then give it to people who otherwise we'd be able to stop completely
Mighty Max
18-09-06, 14:24
OK granted.
But when was resupply a problem to anyone anyways? Even with the chars that are too afraid to fight back and die like flies, money and items are no problem.
The clan appartments filled with dozens of cabinets containing only 4+ slotters and the info in citycom about clanmoney tells me that it can be only a very small effect.
I have for a long time not seen a single LE Trader/Hunter that has done business with a Clan PvP clan. They simply don't need it. Do you need it?
you just have to ask yourself what are the chances of actually making a difference in the neocron world, if people can just ignore their enemies and walk right past them? if i've fought and won an OP, i don't want some guy to stand there fucking around on my territory. If i raid the city with a large party, i don't want some neocron citizen looking right through me as if it makes no difference. If i set up a blockade in a hunting zone to create a monopoly, i don't want a LE to hunt right in front of me like i'm not there.
Basicly they're playing neocron in pretty much a single player way.. which agreed it's still a cool game single player. But they can go play single player nc on their own server, then remove LE from the others so we can have the real neocron with it's real atmosphere.
LEs also prevent clans from properly controlling their territories with LEs just walking all over the place despite it being enemy land.Turrets, when working (don't recall if they're fixed again or not) shoot LEs. When GR and Security are set to Clan, all an "op" becomes is some nice scenery to one with an LE.
You don't seriously expect owning an OP to mean the entire sector is off limits, do you? The clipping range on the engine alone makes that laughable.
Yes, it doesn't, but dying is not going to happen very often,Wrong. Assuming clan-controlled OPs locked down like on Mars (and they have been when I've been there recently), there are a very limited number of points one can GR to. It won't take more than 10 or so capped players to make life very difficult for anyone lower level. There simply aren't that many GRs that need to be guarded. El Farid, DRT, Battledome, the exits of TH, Mil Base stairwell. It doesn't take much to seriously impede the progress of mid-level chars looking for decent hunting grounds.
it doesn't take more than 10-15 mins to travel from TH to anywhere else on a quad,Unless you crash while zoning, zone into water, drive into water accidentally, or TH is being camped by assholes.
i think the people who don't want pvp interaction should go play a single player game, go get your kicks elsewhereIf there was a comparable game that didn't involve fantasy bullshit, I probably would have left long ago.
what do you guys think of zones where the LE simply doesn't have any effect?It would negate the purpose of the LE. The LE is a PvP switch, as per KK. If it's in, PvP's not an option.
But the problem is then that there is very little that can do that has an influence on the actions of LE players, yet LE players can still affect the game's economy and the outcome of OP wars (even without direclt breaking the rules).Exactly what is the problem with LE'ed players having an impact on the gaming world? Supply roles, backing the clan who caters best to one's op requirements, backing a clan that provides a particular service - these are all things that LEs can do to support non-LE'ed players. There's nothing wrong with this. NC is more than just a deathmatch arena. There is a player interaction element to it, something you seem to be forgetting.
So if a clan was camping at el farid, killing anyone that comes thru the GR or anywhere near the underground (let alone inside), they're not "shaping" the game world..No, they wouldn't. They'd be temporarily irritating some people. Soon as the clan logged off or got bored, the GR would be again open to anyone.
you just have to ask yourself what are the chances of actually making a difference in the neocron world, if people can just ignore their enemies and walk right past them?You can't make any difference outside the realm of ops, period.
if i've fought and won an OP, i don't want some guy to stand there fucking around on my territory.Lock down the OP to C/C. That's all you can do, anyway. LE or no LE can still stand at the corner of the sector and not be seen by you or your clan.
If i raid the city with a large party, i don't want some neocron citizen looking right through me as if it makes no difference.They wouldn't have to. They could log an alt.
If i set up a blockade in a hunting zone to create a monopoly, i don't want a LE to hunt right in front of me like i'm not there.All you'd do is delay whoever wanted to hunt in the zone, or they'd just log an alt and hunt anyway.
then remove LE from the others so we can have the real neocron with it's real atmosphere.If that's all you want, then go play on Neptune, prove to KK the server's worth keeping, then get them to remove the LE there. That was the whole point of Neptune to begin with...
RogerRamjet
18-09-06, 18:21
I like to
disassemble
peoples arguments
like this.
Annoying isnt it?
:angel:
http://www.mantris.net/darkana/zeltarg-le.jpg
Taken during one of the last events on Saturn (short before the move to NC2). Dunno if I got better shots somewhere; too lazy to check through all of them, but you know very well you weren't a newbie back then anymore :p
I wish martin j schwiezer was here to help me kick some ass :D
I miss the days when people like icestorm would have been flamed so bad by 50 people simultaneously for his comments that he would leave the forums and never post again, but i suppose all this carebearisation has driven away those players :(
I don't think this arguement will be settled before KK do something so stupid that everybody leaves, or fixes the rules. Maybe i won't be here for longer either if DF online is as good as it sounds, or maybe the LEs will leave if there is someone else dumb enough to make a game with LE like devices...
EDIT: oh yeh! i remember that event, we killed a doy bot and got a rifle ultima then :D . Whether or not i was a noobie back then is debatable, i was a noobie for a very very long time. I didn't even realise that multiple hit boxes existed until NC2. I still did quite well in NF with zeltarg tho (even with tl72 plasma cannon). Back then, even winnoc (gunnar) was a carebear (altho none LEed). Anyone else remember giga191, Kellogs, 13, Zeltarg, Jiga, Edward IV from NC1?
good old saturn days :(
RogerRamjet
18-09-06, 19:13
If i compare my NC2 self to my NC1 self, i was a complete noob in NC1.
However a noob that had infinitely more fun than I do now.
yeh, i've done pretty much everything that i can do, including getting my PE (zeltarg) to woc 3....
hmm maybe lvling isn't that hard without LE after all, i hardly got killed while lvling woc.
Turrets, when working (don't recall if they're fixed again or not) shoot LEs. When GR and Security are set to Clan, all an "op" becomes is some nice scenery to one with an LE.No one is using them so I think they're still unallowed, not certain tho as I missed a few months of nc.
You don't seriously expect owning an OP to mean the entire sector is off limits, do you? The clipping range on the engine alone makes that laughable.if the clan wants to control an entire sector they can patrol the zone, killing anything moving except LE's
Wrong. Assuming clan-controlled OPs locked down like on Mars (and they have been when I've been there recently)I'm getting the impression you consider an op thats not allied to you as a locked down op..
there are a very limited number of points one can GR to. It won't take more than 10 or so capped players to make life very difficult for anyone lower level. There simply aren't that many GRs that need to be guarded. El Farid, DRT, Battledome, the exits of TH, Mil Base stairwell. It doesn't take much to seriously impede the progress of mid-level chars looking for decent hunting grounds.There's too many exits to the wastelands, and even if they do all get camped, you can use venture warp? stop making stupid excuses, it's never going to happen anyway.
Unless you crash while zoning, zone into water, drive into water accidentally or TH is being camped by assholes.You sound like you're going to burst into tears =]
Learn the map, avoid zoning towards where water is, it's very simple.. I swear if you wasn't an LE'd player you wouldn't be anywhere near as bad at nc as you sound.
Exactly what is the problem with LE'ed players having an impact on the gaming world? Supply roles, backing the clan who caters best to one's op requirements, backing a clan that provides a particular service - these are all things that LEs can do to support non-LE'ed players.and yet you can't stop them =[
There's nothing wrong with this.It ruins the rollplay of the game.. and the atmosphere.
NC is more than just a deathmatch arena. There is a player interaction element to it, something you seem to be forgetting.isn't being able to kill someone part of player interaction, imo the most important player interaction (not just speaking in pvp terms), otherwise people can do whatever the fk they want..
No, they wouldn't. They'd be temporarily irritating some people. Soon as the clan logged off or got bored, the GR would be again open to anyone.by camped, i didn't mean temporarily i mean CAMPING it 24-7 (or at least all the time the server is above 2/3% etc) and not letting anyone near the place. that would be changing the map.
You can't make any difference outside the realm of ops, period.then why were you whining about people camping all of the public genreps above?
Lock down the OP to C/C. That's all you can do, anyway. LE or no LE can still stand at the corner of the sector and not be seen by you or your clan.They can stand in the corner, as long as they don't come through the main parts of the sector =p
They wouldn't have to. They could log an alt.okay you're in plaza2 on an anti city guy and you've killed all the pro city's there except for an le.. okay say this le guy doesnt have le, hes dead, now he logs on an alt like you said... if his alt is anti city he'll have to get here on his own, and in which case he can be killed if we know its the same person
All you'd do is delay whoever wanted to hunt in the zone, or they'd just log an alt and hunt anyway.by a blockade i think he meant the same as i said, not allowing anyone to hunt there ever.. and logging an alt won't help in the slightest :p
If that's all you want, then go play on Neptune, prove to KK the server's worth keeping, then get them to remove the LE there. That was the whole point of Neptune to begin with...Neptune was ruined because everyone had LE in, someone said that back on page 2 or something? don't you listen....
Just wondering but would you actually be against an le-server and the other servers not being LE, this is ignoring stuff like you'll lose your stuff, imagine you will have all your stuff and everything all on your own little single-player (or close enough to) server.
Just wondering but would you actually be against an le-server and the other servers not being LE, this is ignoring stuff like you'll lose your stuff, imagine you will have all your stuff and everything all on your own little single-player (or close enough to) server. do you think anyone would talk to each other on that server? i struggle to communicate with LEed players, they generally seem to be lone wolves, or just keep all channel muted. The exception of course is darkana, who seemed quite helpful when it came to keeping my LEed nib alive :D
The exception of course is darkana, who seemed quite helpful when it came to keeping my LEed nib alive :Ddarkana is teh win, she helped me when i was nib too =]
Unless you crash while zoning, zone into water, drive into water accidentally, or TH is being camped by assholes.
This arguement is funny. I crash a lot in nc but I can get around everhwere easily, please dry your eyes. As for zoning into water I think that just means you are a retard. And th even been camped? seriously when has th been camped in nc2?
How many of your chars dont have a le in btw ?
the longer i watch what's being said in this thread i started, the more i am convinced that we need a real neptune: everyone starts from zero (0/2, that is) single slot, no LE, no safezone, no soullight (just facsymp). more quake than ever, more PvP than you can ask for. do you think this will be the most populated server?
the longer i watch what's being said in this thread i started, the more i am convinced that we need a real neptune: everyone starts from zero (0/2, that is) single slot, no LE, no safezone, no soullight (just facsymp). more quake than ever, more PvP than you can ask for. do you think this will be the most populated server?
personally i think thats a great idea, but i dont think it would be very popular just cos of the sheer fact neptune isnt
RogerRamjet
19-09-06, 00:54
the longer i watch what's being said in this thread i started, the more i am convinced that we need a real neptune: everyone starts from zero (0/2, that is) single slot, no LE, no safezone, no soullight (just facsymp). more quake than ever, more PvP than you can ask for. do you think this will be the most populated server?
Certainly sound like an interesting idea.
Apocalypsox
19-09-06, 01:02
Certainly sound like an interesting idea.
yeah it does...but start us at /60...leveling despite it being neptune is still slightly time consuming. i like the test server idea. you can copy a character, but you can buy everything you need for like 2 credits.
the longer i watch what's being said in this thread i started, the more i am convinced that we need a real neptune: everyone starts from zero (0/2, that is) single slot, no LE, no safezone, no soullight (just facsymp). more quake than ever, more PvP than you can ask for. do you think this will be the most populated server? leave the safezones in, remove guards.. 2 slots so we can have a trade char to support ourselves/each other, and everyone starting from scratch would be damn fun.. when was the last time there were NO capped chars anywhere? pking from 0/2 and almost being balanced between everyone :D
oh and icestorm has 16 chars, all of which have fucking le's =]
we had a newptune went fine for a month then everyone quit
was there a le on neptune ? cant remember but if there wasent and u dont liek it then go play there please dont try to force other people not to use it
u dont see them trying to make U wear the le
i really dont think le is that bad, i can see tho people with a big ego going OMG I CANT KILL HIM ARG HAX AAAAHHH must be frustrating :p
Unless you crash while zoning, zone into water, drive into water accidentally, or TH is being camped by assholes.
I stoped reading there.
i thought neptune was quite good tbh. the main problems were: LEs, people were hesitant to move server without maintaining their OPs on their 'normal' server, LEs, APU-PPU teams (and PPUs in general) <-- personally i quite like taking on PPUed players for a challenge but i rarely see other people trying this out and there were way too many people with LEs in.
If 2.2. is good then hopefully more people will play, and the quality of the PvP will improve thus making FF's monk zerg useless :D. In fact, i'm rather excited about 2.2., with all the new viable (i hope) weapons and new possible setups + if KK balance it properly, then people with PPUs will no longer be a problem for me to take out.
Hmm... i really hope they take out the LE with 2.2., because i don't want all those PPU reliant pussies running around with LEs coz:
I AM COMING TO GET YOU MUAHHAHHAHAHA
making FF's monk zerg useless
making overpowered XBOW pes GONE :D hehe im quite looking forward to playing my tank more, and having more then monks at an op fight would make it more fun for all
imagine that u can play ur favorite class in an op fight in stead of the usual monks with a couple of tanks now that is fun
i myself liked op wars AND the game in general a LOT better back when there where no ppus (yes i have played that long :p )
making overpowered XBOW pes GONE :D lol here we go again :rolleyes: :p
i suppose that's the problem with inbalance. You can either choose a setup that allows you to fight the other good setups, but have boring fights against people who choose worse setups, or you can choose a bad setup, get owned by the good classes but have decent fights against other bad setups.
if balancing is good then there won't be any obvious setup choices any more, and i might have to make a tl83 fusion pistol PE again
making overpowered XBOW pes GONE :D hehe im quite looking forward to playing my tank more, and having more then monks at an op fight would make it more fun for all
imagine that u can play ur favorite class in an op fight in stead of the usual monks with a couple of tanks now that is fun
i myself liked op wars AND the game in general a LOT better back when there where no ppus (yes i have played that long :p )
how the fuck can you say that you used to bring about 7 ppus annd 6 apus and the rest of them you alone had 2 ppus ppuing
you having more then just monks at a op fight ah dont fucking make me laugh and a couple of tanks you had like 1 tank and the rest was monks last time deathrow vs you and i think you had about 23 people online
23 ? i wish we had atleast 1/4th of that amount active.
Good thing we have people like napper to entertain us once in a while.
Sometimes,i must admit, smacktalk is fun.
so your saying like 4 to 5 months ago deathrow and ff wasnt very active we would go up to i think the highest was 25 /26 and you i can remember had 29 at one point i didnt fight you then cos we had no peeps online you have to admit though you do have hell of alot of monks in ff
erm solling said it would be nice if it was different in the future, not that his clan fights with alot of pes and spies in an opfight at the moment
Napper i thank you for great amusement ... realy. :D
what was the topic of this thread again?
lore said it would be great if there was not so many ppus in a op fight how can he say that if he used to have 2 ppus just for him hmmmmmmm
its about les why you ask look up the post i didnt take it off topic
how the fuck can you say that you used to bring about 7 ppus annd 6 apus and the rest of them you alone had 2 ppus ppuing
And thats just for 1 or 2 spies and pe's raiding Cycrow :lol:
:p im sure all clans including urs clobber used a lot of ppus i remember when fighting u wasent u a monk as well mostley ?
deathrow have all monks as well with the occational tank so does all or used to at least, atm its more tanks cuz there is less people it seems.
anyways it would be more fun if there was less monks but since everyone plays to win and monk teams is better then other teams ( again used to ) then everyone used monks including ur clan napper and urs clobber, funny how people seem to forget the monks on thier side :rolleyes:
we use monks as well sadly its the most efficient class with a ppu (tanks close followup now tho)
but like i said HOPEFULLY the balancing will fix that so that its not easiest playing monks at an op fight
someone should really start a thread "who brings the most monks to an op fight". this thread is about: "can we think of a ruleset to make the LE would be unneccessary?" your comments on this topic are welcome.
Hmm... i really hope they take out the LE with 2.2., because i don't want all those PPU reliant pussies running around with LEs coz:
I AM COMING TO GET YOU MUAHHAHHAHAHA
Tbh I really don’t think they will take the le away when 2.2 comes out cos of the new players coming to this game they would just be high lvl runners raiding the city/wasteland and the new player will be ganked a lot and he/she will be like well fuck this I cant even lvl with out getting killed
Or you can make it so if you have a high rank and the player you are fighting ganking has got a gray rank compared to you you will lose soul light
SO simple... After Rank /40 or /50 Make it so LE drops out upon death... or % of dropping out.... Treat as normal imp after that
ok. so what about making the LE fall out at 45 (55, if you want) AND stopping SL gain from kills AND slowing SL gain from waiting online to 1 tick every 8 hours?
Liebestoter
24-09-06, 11:01
Make ever zone a war zone.
Remove PPUs or nerf them.
Make belts not require hack.
Impliment a bounty system.
Make guards worth killing, and not such a pain to kill.
Give us Anarchy Breed.
Abolish LEs.
:angel:
...and do all this on neptune. amen.
Make ever zone a war zone.
Remove PPUs or nerf them.
Make belts not require hack.
Impliment a bounty system.
Make guards worth killing, and not such a pain to kill.
Give us Anarchy Breed.
Abolish LEs.
:angel:
That’s fine for Neptune but it would never happen on any of the other servers
and to remove ppus would be shit yeah remove para but you cant remove a class from a game that’s just dumb tbh and what’s wrong if people what to keep the les in let them have the option if they want to keep it in let them you cant force someone to fight plus if it dropped out they would just run to the zone line to get away anyway. and for them who keep the les in that role-play would become spy’s to stealth away from anyone that he/she would come across if I have said in early posts on this thread that the le should come out at whatever lvl am sorry but I have changed my mind its up to the player on the game if they want the le or not its not fair to the new player that start this game you think if you have someone that has been playing for bout 3 years and there they just fed up and they see someone to kill there not bothered about if they are new or not they will just kill them
Anyway that’s what I think and I is sticking to it
NAPPER
Liebestoter
25-09-06, 06:26
Make it so you can zap spies while stealthed, maybe revamp the aiming system so it's not this 'if i'm not aiming at you the shots hitting you do nothing' trash.. but that'd require a revamp of the already pretty chopping networking code.. packets and all that trash. I agree stealth whores are annoying. But uh yeah last time I played which admittedly was a long ass time ago pvp was almost pointless because someone always busted out the M269 Field Expedient PPU Buttplug. It's stupid, we all know it's stupid, and I'm not gunna elaborate on it any further than that. Some day maybe it'll be balanced. Maybe..
Maybe.
Make ever zone a war zone.
Remove PPUs or nerf them.
Make belts not require hack.
Impliment a bounty system.
Make guards worth killing, and not such a pain to kill.
Give us Anarchy Breed.
Abolish LEs.
there's a game called quake you might wanna try. :p
Liebestoter
26-09-06, 06:27
there's a game called quake you might wanna try. :p
Been there, done that, went to qcon and all I got was some prizes and a stupid t-shirt or three. I like Neocron better.
Apocalypsox
26-09-06, 07:09
Been there, done that, went to qcon and all I got was some prizes and a stupid t-shirt or three. I like Neocron better.
amen. Neocron > ALL fps's and ALL MMOs. cept maybe BF2 which i havnt personally tried. and thats only cause you dont crash every time you zone with a fully decked out and loaded APC :lol:
amen. Neocron > ALL fps
I agree with the NC > other MMOs part, but are you saying NC is a better FPS than any other real FPS? With it's rather improvable netcode, clipping errors, random hitboxes, etc.? What exactly makes NC so good in terms of FPS?
Sometimes I have the feeling some people play NC simply because they suck at real FPS games. Whenever I get PK'ed by some WOC armour wearing PE at MB that shoots me in the back three times all of a sudden (me being **/44) and thus kills me, I think - wow, he really must've gotten his kicks out of this.
Then again I have reds stop shooting me in PP3 and say "sorry - didn't see you were low level". But this is a rare occasion. Most people appear to be trying to be as mean as possible. No wonder there are times when I bump into LE'd people only.
people are bored is why most people just shoot randomly.
a monk who gets LAID tbh :p ..now back to the intention of this thread
Liebestoter
27-09-06, 07:00
The reason people get bored and shoot randomly is that there's no real incentive to actually do PvP against enemy factions. Ops are all fine and well but there's so much money in-game that it really doesn't matter. There needs to be something more. Honestly. More faction exclusive items, perks, missions, SOMETHING. I could go on for a bit longer but I'm going to go drink beer and watch a movie, playing with guns all day in the sun irl is kinda tiring. :]
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