View Full Version : Another ally pking thread
Well I just installed nc yesterday again to play a bit, after running around in the wastelands a bit, I saw some dead allies on the ground and stuff so I was extra careful by stealthing around all the time. So I suddenly see this group of allies, cityadmin's mostly. So I go up to them (unstealthed) and greet some of my fellow alliance members and they just kill me.
Then I understood that these guys didn't have a big manhood enough so they were running around killing allies without penalty (this was a warzone).
So.... Shouldn't they be punished even if it was a warzone, I mean, they are after all ruining the game totally by killing every green out there without penalty. And even if they would get some minor SL loss, they would probably just go and idle in their precious techhaven anyway.
So when can we expect a sort of fix to this problem? It's pretty obvious it doesn't work very well, and no I dont have LE in because my rank is way to high and I want to have the ability to kill foes....
I think this has come about due to the extremly low pops, when you spend hours looking for people to fight, and there all zone whoring at MB you get reduced to attacking anyone anywhere....
Id say its part of the game, and unfortunately you will have to get used to it. I know its not ideal but thats the way it works!
RogerRamjet
11-06-06, 13:06
Join FETISH, you can kill/be killed by anyone indiscriminately :D
Putting soullight penalties in warzones would be a bad idea imo. It wouldn't be very good for citymercs if they were actually being hired by a clan to do their job. In the past I've been involved with quite a lot of op fights with neutrals and even allies sometimes, I dont think you should be penalised for protecting your op, no matter who's attacking.
Best idea would be to stay out of warzones if you feel the ally killing is happening more there.
Nah I mean, come on, low pop is no excuse. They found me right? They could might as well just switch to a doy faction and they would still have found me. Well, I found them but whatever :P
So why make a thread about it? You got killed once, get over it and just retaliate.
I also find it funny that it's always the victims that sink to the level of personal insults.
My best advice is always be on the defensive.
Mighty Max
11-06-06, 13:46
I also find it funny that it's always the victims that sink to the level of personal insults.
That's simply not true. The other side tho' does not need to use open channels or the forum as they insult their victim in place. Espacially small groups tend to d o so.
But i agree, its a warzone. Keep your weapons ready.
So why make a thread about it? You got killed once, get over it and just retaliate.
I also find it funny that it's always the victims that sink to the level of personal insults.
Because there's that thing called the F6 window. If someone is murdered by someone they're supposed to be able to trust, then yeah, they're liable to be a bit pissed off.
The way it's going you'd get more done if KK just turned f6 entirely red.
well avoid people u dont know is good or bad or at least like pabz say be defensive assume people u dont know might shoot u or at least be rdy for it.
ask around to some people some clans are known to pk allies some are known to be cool with allies pretty easy to find wich is wich since most clans to kill allies get such a *reputation*
Well I didn't do any personal insults, I just thought they had small manhoods, where's the insult?! ;D.
Yeah I got a clue who to avoid now, just irritating that they are green, you don't know who to trust anymore which is kinda sad :/
Welcome, to neocron mr Rob444. :p
Well I didn't do any personal insults, I just thought they had small manhoods, where's the insult?! ;D.
Yeah I got a clue who to avoid now, just irritating that they are green, you don't know who to trust anymore which is kinda sad :/
The stupid part in all of this is that these people will actually cause others to leave the game... which makes populations even lower. If they really wanted more people to play, they wouldn't do this. They just aren't thinking honestly.
Yeah I got a clue who to avoid now, just irritating that they are green, you don't know who to trust anymore which is kinda sad :/
i'm sorry, this isnt an ordinary shooter like counterstrike, you got to be prepared for fight wherever you go.
some people will backstab you, some will take you by surprise.
those "ally pker" are playing their own role, like almost everyone does. and you want those people to get punished for them playing their role? just because you have problems in dealing with their role?
no, thx.
The stupid part in all of this is that these people will actually cause others to leave the game... leaving a pvp-game because of getting killed in pvp is really stupid.
So when can we expect a sort of fix to this problem? It's pretty obvious it doesn't work very well, and no I dont have LE in because my rank is way to high and I want to have the ability to kill foes....There was already a fix to a similar problem, only in levelling areas, apartments, city / outskirt sectors but NOT warzones. This was quoted in a previous thread about the CityMerc symp/SL issue where people....
The soullight and faction relations rules brought in with evo 2.1 are the worst version since NC1 went retail.
The person that came up with them probably made them up with a serious hangover on a monday morning.
....were whining about SL penalties being too harsh. An explanation was offered:
Please remember that for every runner now who claims the SL penalties are too harsh, there was a runner pre-evo who complained that SL penalties were a joke, and that PKers in leveling areas and elsewhere used to get off almost scot free. The SL system was changed to what it is now after long-standing demands from the community together with the desire to restrict 'newb killing'.and here was the response:
sorry, but thats just bullshit. the long-standing demands were from parts of the community, not from the community. I would call the people where those demands came from carebears.
you are a noob? you wanna level without having to watch your back? leave your LE in.
you don't want to have an LE in your brain? welcome to the brutal world of neocron. pack some ammo, grab a gun, and take care of your fucking self.
SL rules should only apply in cities, to prevent/punish ally killing. everything else is just stupid.So in other words, whichever way you want the SL system to be tweaked, you're just pissing into the wind. Increase SL penalties, you get the moaners like in Bugs' post. Decrease them, you get threads like this one. You can't win.
i'm sorry, this isnt an ordinary shooter like counterstrike, you got to be prepared for fight wherever you go.
some people will backstab you, some will take you by surprise.
those "ally pker" are playing their own role, like almost everyone does. and you want those people to get punished for them playing their role? just because you have problems in dealing with their role?
no, thx.
Of course people can backstab me, but I dont like that they are literally exploiting the system just to piss people off 24/7. And dont give me this roleplaying crap because they are NOT roleplaying.
exploiting the system? guess why the nc "green - red - system" is not similar to the eg. wow one.
independence is playing a big role.
take your blinders off.
and they dont play this way to piss people off, they play it because its fun.
its like i'd say people just use a ppu to piss me off.
they are not roleplaying? so they are not playing a certain role? interesting.
Independence - there should be a limit. You see it as roleplaying? Well fine, I dont and they probably don't either, they are just there to, as you said, "have fun", I totally agree. What can be more fun than killing unsuspecting allies, I mean, there is no competition at all!
They are IMO abusing the system. You could compare this with teamkilling in other games, I've heard it's VERY popular.
RogerRamjet
11-06-06, 18:37
Trust no-one except your friends.
How can you be friends with anyone if everyone is shooting at eachother? :lol:
The funny thing is if you ran into these people again they'd probably say that you attacked them first and they were defending themselves :lol:
sorry may seem harsh....but shut up!
To be honest allied pkers are a part of the game. And the current populations only make this situation more apparent.
I'm sure both sides have the same kind of problems.
Besides too many ppl have the mind set that neutral but in the same city (e.g. Tangent and Biotech) means allied.
As a purist 'none allied city' pker, assume that yellow means possible hostile unless u know them. That doesnt mean shoot first and ask questions later, but be cautious.
The stupid part in all of this is that these people will actually cause others to leave the game... which makes populations even lower. If they really wanted more people to play, they wouldn't do this. They just aren't thinking honestly.
If they leave the game then good riddance. Whiners who cry and post threads because they couldnt take gettin killed on the chin should not even contemplate playing this game.
And its not ally pk'n that causes people leave. Making plaza 1 a safezone, introducing the absurd new sl system that came with evo, people losing sl for killing enemies nevermind allies in hunting zones. This is what makes people leave the game not ally pk'n. [ edited ]
Independence - there should be a limit.
you dont want other people to chose enemies by their own measures? i'm glad that this is just your opinion.
You see it as roleplaying? Well fine, I dont and they probably don't either, they are just there to, as you said, "have fun", I totally agree. What can be more fun than killing unsuspecting allies, I mean, there is no competition at all!
just because you dont understand their point of view they are total idiots?
are you kidding?
They are IMO abusing the system. You could compare this with teamkilling in other games, I've heard it's VERY popular.
hell, dont compare neocron to counterstrike, its different, you know?
they are abusing the system in your opinion.
not in mine.
uh, what now?
leaving a pvp-game because of getting killed in pvp is really stupid.
Yeah, when you over simplify, everything is stupid. This is a PvP game, but killing every person in front of you, friendly or otherwise, should have ramifications, and it doesn't all the time. It only encourages such behavior, but that's not even the full story. You know, it wouldn't be that bad, things like ally-PKing, newbie-PKing, but it's even worse because of the bugs in the game and weird punishment system. Think about a noob for a second, at least 3 times an hour they encounter some crappy bug like the vehicle snap bug or fatal, or in general things just not working correctly. When the game does work correctly for them, they get blindsided by a high level friendly runner while leveling. People say "take out your LE" then kill.
People wonder why many people have LEs until overcapped now...
People wonder why many people open fire instantly on anyone that comes in range, because you can't trust anyone.
All these issues are a result of the game dynamics. People wouldn't care as much about any of these things if it weren't for the bugs and such that gives Neocron little staying power for true newbies.
So yes, you all can say "well good riddence to people", but don't blame them when theres nobody to fight anymore. If anything, we need to show the newbies the good points of the game to keep them in, not drive them away.
Clobber, I'm not sure what you consider whining but I'm trying to express my opinions. I am not "whining" about what happened in that warzone, I'm trying to make an opinion about ally pking in general. Sorry if I made it look the other way.
you dont want other people to chose enemies by their own measures? i'm glad that this is just your opinion.
Woah, slow down there, are we making assumptions? I have not said anything about that.
All I want is a fair deal to people killing allies all the time. I'm not talking about them not being able to kill allies at all, I just want them to get some sort of punishment because they are after all killing ALLIES.
just because you dont understand their point of view they are total idiots?
are you kidding?
Not sure where you got that idiot part from.
hell, dont compare neocron to counterstrike, its different, you know?
they are abusing the system in your opinion.
not in mine.
uh, what now?
I'm not comparing neocron to a specific game.
How is this different, it's all teamplay and a bunch of allies and foes, can't really see any major difference here.
People wonder why many people open fire instantly on anyone that comes in range, because you can't trust anyone.
drugdealers...
murderers ...
corrupt police ...
pimps ...
rowdies ...
********** ...
damn, would you trust anyone ?
i'd be prepared for fight wherever i go.
if you think everyone in here is your friend, just because his appartement is next to yours, then its not my problem.
rob444:
1. what makes you think they are all after allies? just because a few cityadmin killed a certain group of pro-cities??
you want ally-pkers to get punished.
because they kill their own (!) enemies.
no, thx.
2. you think you can compare neocron (mmorpg) to counterstrike (shooter)?
drugdealers...
murderers ...
corrupt police ...
pimps ...
rowdies ...
********** ...
damn, would you trust anyone ?
i'd be prepared for fight wherever i go.
if you think everyone in here is your friend, just because his appartement is next to yours, then its not my problem.
Well, if that's the case, then why didn't KK have a system where "red or green" is based on your sympathies and not just your faction? Why would they add tradeskilling if everyone was an enemy? The point I'm trying to make is there is a such thing as allies in this game, and using the system to trick others with no ramifications is not right.
When most people see someone that's green, they don't think "oh shit I better fight or run", and therein lies the problem. If KK really wanted this game to be 1 vs everybody, why design factions at all? Whats the point to people being in a faction when it means absolutely nothing? Why don't KK design a system where, if you wanted to fight everyone, you set all your sympathies low so you ended up red to everyone, hey then it would be fair. None of this "Oh sure m8, lets go kill that Warbot *shoots in the back*"
You know, Neocron is a PvP game, but it's not supposed to be a game full of tossers. If someones going to kill everyone on sight, the least they can do is not pretend they're someones ally when its convenient to do so. One minute they are all "Oh please I need a poke" and the next "You're dead bitch!", only because the system allows them to.
IAnd its not ally pk'n that causes people leave. Making plaza 1 a safezone, introducing the absurd new sl system that came with evo, people losing sl for killing enemies nevermind allies in hunting zones. This is what makes people leave the game not ally pk'n. [ edited ]
That's the biggest pile of shit since Biff Tannen crashed his car. KK changed Plaza 1 and other parts of the city when it changed to Neocron 2 and allies where killing allies non stop no matter what they were doing (shopping, talking etc). Guess what? There was a mass walkout because of those arseholes and the population hasn't been close to N1 pop's since then.
I will say that warzones are fine as they are though. There needs to be places where PvP'rs can fight, hold events and whatever without any punishment. There are plenty of areas already where they do get punished. I do think that there should be a better punishment for ally pk'ing than going afk for a few hours in TH.
Well, if that's the case, then why didn't KK have a system where "red or green" is based on your sympathies and not just your faction? Why would they add tradeskilling if everyone was an enemy?
why do we have the possibility to attack our allies?
When most people see someone that's green, they don't think "oh shit I better fight or run", and therein lies the problem. If KK really wanted this game to be 1 vs everybody, why design factions at all?
if you talk like that it sounds like there is a hell lot of ally pkers around ...
in that case you should think about your point of view.
maybe its you who is wrong. and not all those bad ally pkers.
You know, Neocron is a PvP game, but it's not supposed to be a game full of independent people who act in a way i dont really like.
i changed your post a little bit. now it shows what you really mean.
ppl who kill their enemies = tossers?
you're an idiot.
in a multiplayer game there might be players who act in way that you dislike.
but guess what ?! you have to deal with it.
drugdealers...
1. what makes you think they are all after allies? just because a few cityadmin killed a certain group of pro-cities??
Well, they were killing unclanned leveling people, these allies that got killed weren't in a team either, because they were far away from eachother and didn't seem to know about eachothers whereabouts. These unclanned people did not fight back either because they never saw them coming or they were '?' about the current situation.
you want ally-pkers to get punished.
because they kill their own (!) enemies.
If it's their enemies, why don't they switch factions instead of grinding on 'easy-to-get-low-level-people'.
you think you can compare neocron (mmorpg) to counterstrike (shooter)?
I'm not talking about Counter-Strike damnit. I'm talking about team games...
And when it comes about teams/alliances/groups, yes... Same shit.
Well, they were killing unclanned leveling people, these allies that got killed weren't in a team either, because they were far away from eachother and didn't seem to know about eachothers whereabouts. These unclanned people did not fight back either because they never saw them coming or they were '?' about the current situation.
a friend of mine who left the game a few month ago was known as a ally killer in the city.
almost everyone knew his 2 pe's. he got attacked by everyone. and he shot back. when he saw those people at crp or anywhere else he shot them asap.
he had good reasons to kill the ppl.
if you would have seen him killing his enemies i bet you say "what a lame ally pker.." just because you dont know that much about the background.
on the other hand -> boredom is a good reason.
why do we play this game? to have fun. if people are getting bored they either leave the game or like after an activity which makes fun.
ally pking is fun for some people. lifes a bitch, deal with it.
If it's their enemies, why don't they switch factions instead of grinding on 'easy-to-get-low-level-people'.
sure, they laeve all the reds alone and just kill the greens.
take your fucking blinders off!
where is the point in switching factions??
1.) waste money
2.) waste time in lvling symp
and still have the same ppl to kill.
awesome plan!
I'm not talking about Counter-Strike damnit. I'm talking about team games...
And when it comes about teams/alliances/groups, yes... Same shit.
looks like neocron is something special, isnt it?
why do we have the possibility to attack our allies?
So you have to be careful, not to shoot your friends in op wars etc, so the game wont be another Serious Sam type..
if you talk like that it sounds like there is a hell lot of ally pkers around ...
in that case you should think about your point of view.
maybe its you who is wrong. and not all those bad ally pkers.
tbh, you sound much like one of those ally pkers.
i changed your post a little bit. now it shows what you really mean.
ppl who kill their enemies = tossers?
you're an idiot.
Heh, he is trying to have an opinion and you call him an idiot? Guess who's the idiot.
in a multiplayer game there might be players who act in way that you dislike.
but guess what ?! you have to deal with it.
Haha, yeah that's right. We are here right now and we act in a way you dislike, but guess what ?! You have to deal with it.
why do we play this game? to have fun. if people are getting bored they either leave the game or like after an activity which makes fun.
ally pking is fun for some people. lifes a bitch, deal with it.
Ok, from the people who kills allies view:
1) Allies are easy to get, because they just don't run from an ally!
2) Allies will not suspect that you are going to attack.
3) No competition what so ever.
Even if I think ally pking is wrong, where is the skills in these guys? It's obvious they can't handle the real heat of battle.
sure, they laeve all the reds alone and just kill the greens.
take your fucking blinders off!
Who said they leave all reds alone?
where is the point in switching factions??
1.) waste money
2.) waste time in lvling symp
and still have the same ppl to kill.
awesome plan!
Do I detect lazyness here?
i find that a lot of people call neutral pking, ally pking 0o
Heh, he is trying to have an opinion and you call him an idiot? Guess who's the idiot.
trying to have an opinion :lol: ?
hey, imo he's an idiot, am i an idiot for having this opinion ;)?
Haha, yeah that's right. We are here right now and we act in a way you dislike, but guess what ?! You have to deal with it.
i have to deal with threads like this one? ok.
Ok, from the people who kills allies view:
1) Allies are easy to get, because they just don't run from an ally!
2) Allies will not suspect that you are going to attack.
3) No competition what so ever.
1.) next time they run.
2.) next time they will
3.) they dont shoot back and run?
well, next time they'll shoot back.
Even if I think ally pking is wrong, where is the skills in these guys? It's obvious they can't handle the real heat of battle.
ever thought about they might kill both green and red?
Who said they leave all reds alone?
maybe i got you wrong, but it sounds like you think they just pk allies, none else.
Do I detect lazyness here?
because some ppl are fighting pro and anti?
erm, lazyness? no, sorry.
man, why the hell should those ppl change faction??????????? there is no need to!
I only kill Allies in Self-defense or if i know that they will attack me tbh...so 1guy can go and start attacking people, die and then meet those people with friends and boom, there you go, the war is out.
trying to have an opinion :lol: ?
hey, imo he's an idiot, am i an idiot for having this opinion ;)?
Having an opinion that is having an opinion that is having an opinion, I think you know where this is going and it doesn't lead anywhere so let's drop that nonsense.
ever thought about they might kill both green and red?
Of course they do kill red people, not said that they kill ONLY green.
maybe i got you wrong, but it sounds like you think they just pk allies, none else.
See previous statement.
because some ppl are fighting pro and anti?
erm, lazyness? no, sorry.
man, why the hell should those ppl change faction??????????? there is no need to!
Then why are there any factions at all?
Then why are there any factions at all?
Agreed. As i said, there should be more of a punishment for killing allies and, perhaps, more of a reward for killing enemies. Otherwise its just Unreal Tournament or a Holomatch...
Crap 1 dimensional games imo
Agreed. As i said, there should be more of a punishment for killing allies and, perhaps, more of a reward for killing enemies. Otherwise its just Unreal Tournament or a Holomatch...
Crap 1 dimensional games imo
I totally agree with you.
Then why are there any factions at all?
i think its a roleplay feature.
so you have a problem with the ally pkers.
why?
because they kill their allies. and you.
so, its you who has got a problem.
why dont you change faction?
Crap 1 dimensional games imo
crap 1 dimensional thinking imo.
Gotterdammerung
11-06-06, 21:51
keep the egos in check plz
bah, its fine how it is...
now what really needs sorting is darn Anti helping out Pro....thats very annoying...like City Guards of the alliance KoS'n them for selling out....heh
This is a PvP game, but killing every person in front of you, friendly or otherwise, should have ramifications, and it doesn't all the time.
yes it does. whenever you kill someone, this guy will remember your name. piss off enough people, and you'll see there is consequences to your actions.
what you guys want is someone else (KK) to deal with your problems. deal with them yourself.
The majority of people who ally kill are just bored of the game stagnating for months, combined with the effect this is having of rapidly diminishing the active population and it's hard to find people to fight a lot of the time. The majority of what people call 'PvP' has been reduced to zonewhoring backwards and forwards from a safezone. People are therefore just killing anyone they come across to try and relive the monotony. Not saying it's right or wrong it's just the way things are at the moment. People are just bored. Though really people trying to justify it by claiming 'hey I'm roleplaying' is just laughable ;)
Out in the wastelands, some of my clan and alot of other pro's where fighting ceres mutants in a battle in J-01, as part of an event, during that event a sniper attacked us including the pro-nc runners so we hunted the git down and flat lined him, none of us whined about it in a thread though, and if you think this is bad, try being killed in plaza one by a huge clan of 120+ members, while your clan is ranking around 8.
The fact of the matter is you should learn who are your friends and who are arseholes, then go kill the arseholes weither or not they are allies. (just not in city sectors or dungeons).
That's the biggest pile of shit since Biff Tannen crashed his car. KK changed Plaza 1 and other parts of the city when it changed to Neocron 2 and allies where killing allies non stop no matter what they were doing (shopping, talking etc). Guess what? There was a mass walkout because of those arseholes and the population hasn't been close to N1 pop's since then.
I will say that warzones are fine as they are though. There needs to be places where PvP'rs can fight, hold events and whatever without any punishment. There are plenty of areas already where they do get punished. I do think that there should be a better punishment for ally pk'ing than going afk for a few hours in TH.
A mass walk out ? Utter bollocks. If plaza 1 was a safezone still and sl rules same as nc2 release more people would still be playing. P1 and P2 had people. People to kill. It was the nearest thing to our beloved TG canyon. What is this mass walkout you speak of, do tell im interested to know when this mass walkout or strike how you seem to make out took place.
Fact is ally pk'n has never been so low in nc history and to see whine threads like this (yes threadstarter you are a whiner) is just a mock on the current state of the game.
A mass walk out ? Utter bollocks. If plaza 1 was a safezone still and sl rules same as nc2 release more people would still be playing. P1 and P2 had people. People to kill. It was the nearest thing to our beloved TG canyon. What is this mass walkout you speak of, do tell im interested to know when this mass walkout or strike how you seem to make out took place.
Fact is ally pk'n has never been so low in nc history and to see whine threads like this (yes threadstarter you are a whiner) is just a mock on the current state of the game.
I was around at the time mate, I watched it happen and there were tons of leaving threads. Part of the problem was that noob gankers and ally pk'rs had much less places to hide and people remembered their names. :lol:
Another part was high ranked players had transferred at the time without LE's and weren't big on PvP or, didn't like getting killed when they were surrounded by "supposed" allies. Seriously, the population dropped just from the open beta version. So no, not bollocks, facts.
Fact is ally pk'n has never been so low in nc history and to see whine threads like this (yes threadstarter you are a whiner) is just a mock on the current state of the game.
Yeah I guess I'm a whiner then, doesn't it make you a whiner when whining at whiners? I guess we're on the same boat then. Thanks.
Scanner Darkly
11-06-06, 23:54
I only kill people who refuse to cooperate with my very REASONABLE demands. The background radiation may be finally starting to affect m
RogerRamjet
12-06-06, 00:23
The reason populations are low is because it isnt NC1.
Broken or delayed promises drove more people away, not allied killing.
The reason populations are low is because it isnt NC1.
Broken or delayed promises drove more people away, not allied killing.
saturn rollbacks, christmas 2004 server fuckups, evo 2.1. 2.5 second reload, and just generally not getting any patches for times of up to 6 months (!) are also causes of low pop.
I kill all i can find when on my SkullCult char, but thats a rollplay issue, Been insane Cultist's and all, Also my Fetish guy does, because he is just a perverted barstard. But My Tank is a good boy :) , he i Clanless and respects the F6 Window.
Meh. Allied killing is a take it or lave it. On the one hand, it's viable, whether it's through oversight, or intention. The feature exists, so I guess at the base level, yeah. You are going to find it.
That said, there's absolutely nothing wrong with venting your frustrations. It isn't a no-no to hav ome degree of trust in your allies. After all just because allied pking is possible doesn't mean everyone does it. It's perfectly alright to think someones an arse fr abusng your trust. :)
From the PKer point of view. Sometimes there's a reason. Sometimes they've scammed you, sometimes they've done smetingto upset you, sometimes they're just asking for it. In the right situations it's pretty good for creating random hilarity, as long as it's called for.
Again though... there ain't nothing to stop ya.
Personally, as long as it's justified, i don't mind allied PKing. I'll have a moan when I fall victim to it for no reason though.
Without a decent reason it, in my mind implies a few things...
1) he don't have the balls to PvP properly
2) He's afraid of losing
3) He gets a kick out of pissing people off ( sometimes it's fun, within limits!)
4) He got no skills!
Not every oneof those applies every time, but I think it's fair to apply them at times when there's plenty of reds around, yet it still happens.
A reasonable assumption, no?
Best lin of tinkin is that it's there, just be on the lookout. You might get slated for being a whiner if you complain, but who cares? It's annoying, yo have the right to vent. :)
Not every oneof those applies every time, but I think it's fair to apply them at times when there's plenty of reds around, yet it still happens.I had a really annoying ally once, swearing all the time. Racial things and so on... Whenever he turned up I ignored everything else and just shot him.
Me against 3 procitys and he turns up -> Me and 3 procitys against him.
Put my SL down in some bad situations but it was worth it for this idiot. At some point he deleted his char couse it pissed him off so much. He couldn't fight anywhere couse I was everywhere :D
Hell, even his clan paid me millions that I don't attack him anymore couse they don't wanted the trouble, but he just kept insulting me shortly after I recieved the money :rolleyes:
Turned out to be an app-scammer though..
Ok, late in this thread, and I just read the first post and shook my head...
Well I just installed nc yesterday again to play a bit, after running around in the wastelands a bit, I saw some dead allies on the ground and stuff so I was extra careful by stealthing around all the time. So I suddenly see this group of allies, cityadmin's mostly. So I go up to them (unstealthed) and greet some of my fellow alliance members and they just kill me.
I can probably guess to which clan this may be... If it was on the DoY side, I could also guess which clan it is.
Then I understood that these guys didn't have a big manhood enough so they were running around killing allies without penalty (this was a warzone).
...and this is the point where I go, it's a Warzone. The clan in question probably hold the op, and don't want anyone on their turf. To them you could be a spy. (And in general the CA clans tend to mis-trust their allies a lot)
So.... Shouldn't they be punished even if it was a warzone, I mean, they are after all ruining the game totally by killing every green out there without penalty. And even if they would get some minor SL loss, they would probably just go and idle in their precious techhaven anyway.
Not in warzones, elsewhere the rules are fine...(I know there are some zones which need tweaking, but I'm sticking to the warzones)
So when can we expect a sort of fix to this problem? It's pretty obvious it doesn't work very well, and no I dont have LE in because my rank is way to high and I want to have the ability to kill foes....
Since NC1 there has never been SL/FS penalties for killing allies in Warzones, so why is it a problem now? If you want to kill someone, you can. It's like when I visit F12. I expect to be killed by both allies and enermies.
If you are not clanned, get clanned so next time your allies gank you, call for backup, as I'm sure they will have itchy fingers as well.
All I know is muhammed ahkbar knows where you live
I'm sorry, but when I started the game, there were a mass of leaving threads stating Ally Killing as the specific cause for people quitting the game. Saying it hasn't hurt populations is utter BS. It has. So have all those other things you've menioned, true. Whats really more important? Who knows.
I think perhaps part of the problem is the way NC works. We're all required to align ourselves with a faction as runners. Now it only seems natural that if runners from one faction run around killing another, complaints are going to filter their way up the command (runners and factions engage in a sort of deal, the Runner does a faction's dirty work in exchange for payment and security) and there is going to be friction between the factions. Somebody is surley going to get into trouble for this - but soulight doesnt seem a good way of implementing this. I like DJ's idea of making it all symp based - and if you kill someone, you lose symp not only with them but also their allies.
The people who can't handle the fact that certain places are somewhat dodgy and they should be cautious, I don't sympathise with. The people who can't handle that the person next to them with a questionable reputation might turn on them, no sympathy.
But equally, the kind of people who want to be able to attack anybody, anywhere, I don't care for either. You are going to attack and kill people, possibly at random - deal with the fact thats going to effect how everyone treats you - nobody, not even your own faction should be happy to have a crazed murderer around. The people who just scream "OMG CAREBEAR" with no explanation or justification, I don't give a damn what you have to say either. The people who won't except responsibility for their actions "OMG -100 SL KK ITS ALL YOUR FAULT", can go be quiet, as can the ones who don't accept that their actions may annoy people to the point of abandoing the game.
Just for a bit of perspective - I've been on pretty much all sides here. I've certainly done my fair bit of PKing - and when I 'raid' somewhere, I'm ruthless. I don't fight fair and I don't expect fair back off my enemies. I certainly don't whinge about the "lack of 1 on 1 fights" when I attack the enemy stronghold. I've killed people on my side who have acted out of line (in my opinion) or caused me gried (scammed or stolen). I've had a RPed character who ended up in a vendetta with another clan, scrapping with them - for reasons based on events that actually happened - whenever I encounterd. I've driven off and been killed by random murders in the city, who'd be happily back as a legitimate citizen by lunchtime. I've squabbled with opposing clans over their behaviour.
So you know what? I've been an ally killer. I've been ally killed. I've been a random PKer. I've been a victim of such while minding my own business. I've even got involved in the politics sometimes, but there are too many people who just take up daft positions that tear any fun out of it.
But for all of you who do just want to be able to kill anybody you see, and pay some trivial price - just go play a proper FPS. Its less buggy, you don't have to waste time waiting off neg SL. For all those people who aren't happy with a world where you can't trust people 100%, go play a game with friendly fire off. Neocron is always going to be an 'edgy' world.
If it was on the DoY side, I could also guess which clan it is.
I hope your not talking about fetish, since what we do is neutral-killing which is an entirely different thing. Also note that as our faction objective our clan voted for being seperated from DoY, and seeing as we are pretty much the only BD clan and hold the most votes I can only assume that what we voted for won. I hope KK can get this sorted out soon :)
. I certainly don't whinge about the "lack of 1 on 1 fights" when I attack the enemy stronghold.
Concerning the lack of 1 vs 1 fights, all I can say is I'm looking forward to the day that bringing apu ppu teams won't give you guaranteed survival against solo PKers.
It's also worth noting that some a large amount of people complain whenever they are pked regardless of whether it was by ally or enemy. I had some droner who was sending kamis after my clannies complain when I killed him :wtf:.
...and this is the point where I go, it's a Warzone. The clan in question probably hold the op, and don't want anyone on their turf. To them you could be a spy. (And in general the CA clans tend to mis-trust their allies a lot)
I have to dissapoint you but they had nothing to do with the OP, the OP was owned by a DoY clan and they were a City clan. They weren't even close to the OP and they weren't there to grow in numbers to take the op either. They just left the op and no, they didn't plan to take another op...
Since NC1 there has never been SL/FS penalties for killing allies in Warzones, so why is it a problem now? If you want to kill someone, you can. It's like when I visit F12. I expect to be killed by both allies and enermies.
Well I expect some sort of punishment who abuses the zone rules just to kill allies 24/7 (close anyway).
If you are not clanned, get clanned so next time your allies gank you, call for backup, as I'm sure they will have itchy fingers as well.
I'm not clanned because all my 'fellow friends' have either left the game (because of paying issues) or went over to the blackdragons (enemies to me) :(
Well I expect some sort of punishment who abuses the zone rules just to kill allies 24/7 (close anyway).
where is the abuse?
its not any kind of abuse because you dont like the way they play.
so don't go into warzones. I think the name of the type of zone would make that pretty f***ing clear
So an irl warzone means that everyone is going to shoot eachother? hmm, maybe that's why wars never solve anything.
in real life you'd be dead after 1 shot...1 plasma shot :p ...
dont compare neocorn to real life, neocron is all about having fun, its a game as you might already know.
I have to dissapoint you but they had nothing to do with the OP, the OP was owned by a DoY clan and they were a City clan. They weren't even close to the OP and they weren't there to grow in numbers to take the op either. They just left the op and no, they didn't plan to take another op...
Not that makes any difference. I'll say it again...it's a Warzone And if they killed you how on earth could you tell if they was moving to take the op, (Which you say they wasn't) or tell that they went somewhere else?
Also, did you stop to ask these Ally PK'ers why they killed you?
Well I expect some sort of punishment who abuses the zone rules just to kill allies 24/7 (close anyway).
The zone rules for a warzone are no FS/SL loss, so how the hell are they abusing zone rules 24/7?
Since nc1 I have never assumed because someone is green or tan they are my friend, infact I usually assume they want to shoot me as much as I want to shoot them. Personally I have no idea why in a game like neocron you would walk up and talk to someone uncloaked as a spy, you talk equally as well behind a wall cloaked. Hell, outside of NC unless I am shooting someone in my spy I am cloaked.
so don't go into warzones. I think the name of the type of zone would make that pretty f***ing clear
/Agree. Coupled with the fact you don't actually lose anything but a few minutes and occasionally some poke lube and credits.
So an irl warzone means that everyone is going to shoot eachother? hmm, maybe that's why wars never solve anything. if you went to iraq there's always the chance that the US might shoot you. Or that brazillian guy who got shot 7 times in the head by UK police....
SorkZmok, yes it's a game but I think I have the right to have an opinion on certain things and I thought I needed to express my opinion on ally pking since I think it's very exxaggerated at the moment and it's sadly enough ruining other peoples "fun".
Not that makes any difference. I'll say it again...it's a Warzone And if they killed you how on earth could you tell if they was moving to take the op, (Which you say they wasn't) or tell that they went somewhere else?
Because I found them again and they weren't any op fighters....
Also, did you stop to ask these Ally PK'ers why they killed you?
*sigh* of course I frickin did! What do you expect after being killed like that? I directed several members of that clan and some name that wasn't in that clan that I remembered and asked what was up with the ally killing, all responses I got was "lol" "noob" or no replies at all.
The zone rules for a warzone are no FS/SL loss, so how the hell are they abusing zone rules 24/7?
I think they are abusing the zone rules because they are never doing this inside the city or anywhere else where they could have lost sl and sympathy, it's obvious they are just there to kill whoever appears and getting away with it, PERIOD.
I have no idea why in a game like neocron you would walk up and talk to someone uncloaked as a spy
Because last time I ran pass an ally while I was in stealth, they immediately thought I was a foe and used barrels to kill my weak spy instantly. And this ally happened to be one of my old clanmates as well :rolleyes: - bad accident but I was afraid it would happen all over again so I decided to not be stealthed.
I think they are abusing the zone rules because they are never doing this inside the city or anywhere else where they could have lost sl and sympathy, it's obvious they are just there to kill whoever appears and getting away with it, PERIOD.
why did they invent warzones?
SorkZmok, yes it's a game but I think I have the right to have an opinion on certain things and I thought I needed to express my opinion on ally pking since I think it's very exxaggerated at the moment and it's sadly enough ruining other peoples "fun".
i have an opinion on it as well.
such punishments would ruin my fun.
and since its not forbidden to pk your f6 allies there is nothing such as abusing the f6 system or anything like that concerning ally pk.
I think they are abusing the zone rules because they are never doing this inside the city or anywhere else where they could have lost sl and sympathy, it's obvious they are just there to kill whoever appears and getting away with it, PERIOD.
I call them smart ally killers, for not being stupid and killing you in City Zones, but I bet they are reading this thead... I'll leave to you to wonder what they are thinking.
So I've read about 3 pages of whine. Here's my sugguestion to fix the solution.
Next time you see them, kill them. You won't loose SL and FS over it as it will be in a warzone, and you will feel better about it too. Remember Revenge is a dish best served cold. ;)
Rob, there is a reason Reakktor created the City Mercs, saddly their arent many off us but feel free contact an LPN member. Ask them to get a hold of me if they can't help or you want to speak to someone english :)
why did they invent warzones?
Probably because you lost sl and sympathy for accidently hitting your mates while in op wars (not everyone can be in the same team)? It's not there to save you from intentional ally pking.
RogerRamjet
12-06-06, 19:55
Probably because you lost sl and sympathy for accidently hitting your mates while in op wars (not everyone can be in the same team)? It's not there to save you from intentional ally pking.
WRONG.
Its so any clan, regardless of faction, can fight people.
Without SL loss.
Probably because you lost sl and sympathy for accidently hitting your mates while in op wars (not everyone can be in the same team)? It's not there to save you from intentional ally pking.
and you cant accidently hit your mates somewhere else? eg. in caves, other zones, in neocron/the dome .. ?
in that case the name "warzone" doesnt really fit imo.
RogerRamjet
12-06-06, 20:14
I cant be arsed to read the thread, but i hope someones pointed out that you wont have lost a belt or anything either.
Can anyone answer to why they added the strict dungeon sector rules?
Can anyone answer to why they added the strict dungeon sector rules?
to make sure that people can level in peace in these leveling-areas.
can anyone aswer why there is the possibility to attack f6-allies?
Can anyone answer to why they added the strict dungeon sector rules?
Let me enlighten you as to the reason for the soul light rules ok?
Firstly to awnser your question, because noobs are stupid and remove their le's then get pk'd while fighting mobs, So Reakktor made it a penalty to kill anyone in a dungeon to stop you killing noobs or at least make you suffer for it.
Now for the reason as to the battle zone rules, Lets say Clan A (Biotech) takes an op from a DOY clan, now lets say a CA Clan (Clan B) ninja's the biotech op, and when biotech go to take it back the CA clan turn up and kill them, they suffer sl lose but use symp bitches and killing enemies to regain it, Now when ever clan A takes an op, clan B can simply ninja it and if clan b try and defend it they lose sl :)
Also for the story line reason, Tanget don't like Biotech (big surpize) So they are going to have little fights now and then, to stop this being in streets their are city sectors, but so they can their are battlezone rules.
Happy now? If not avoid wasteland sectors and battlezones
to make sure that people can level in peace in these leveling-areas.
And by what kind of people did these guys that got killed in dungeons all the time get killed by? Correct answer is... Both allies and hostiles. But by what kind of people did they got killed by mostly (I'm thinking of leveling areas within NC here)?
Cry me a river, build a bridge and get over it.
Honestly you are whining to the wrong people, people like me are annoyed at KK making this game the way it is. Who have slammed KK again and again about MB/zoneline pvp and city fights not being fun with hundreds of copbot and gaurds that PARRA !! you.
Untill I can get some good fights in areas I want to pvp in such as plaza 2 with out to many gaurds ruining it. I'll just have to kill all the carebears that were all for the stupid parra shock and huge amounts of gaurds. The red SL does not bother me no more, infact why don't they just make you go straight to -100 SL for killing a neutral.... :rolleyes:
And by what kind of people did these guys that got killed in dungeons all the time get killed by? Correct answer is... Both allies and hostiles. But by what kind of people did they got killed by mostly (I'm thinking of leveling areas within NC here)?
maybe i have to repeat myself :
can anyone aswer why there is the possibility to attack f6-allies?
why isnt the nc ally/hostile system similar to the eg. wow one?
wow one? *looks at rob's sig* maybe i understand this thread a little better now...
maybe i have to repeat myself :
can anyone aswer why there is the possibility to attack f6-allies?
why isnt the nc ally/hostile system similar to the eg. wow one?
Survival of the fittest - in case you get on my nerves I have the liberty to remove yours... as long as I accept the punishment that goes with this action (SL / FS). That kind of freedom made NC special in the first place and needs to stay!
This however has nothing to do with my stance on griefplay ... griefplay has to be kept down one way or the other and I do see a lack in this area (far too many possibilities to grief - slack enforcment of anti-griefing policies). Being able to attack anything that moves and has made the choice to participate in PvP isnt a major issue tho'.
As to why there is no punishment in Warzones... back in the days there were rivaling movements within single factions, striving for power... as well as OP Teams that were well past the team-limit ...number-wise and therefore not being punished for accidental "friendly fire" was a viable solution... still is.
*looks at rob's sig* maybe i understand this thread a little better now...
lol for your information, I've not played WoW for a very long time now and the only reason it's still in my sig and will be there for quite some time is because I play lots and lots of different games. I'm switching games all the time, so I don't give the games the chance to get on #1 of "all time" list. Besides, Xfire wont recognize Neocron. I am still wondering why they've not added neocron to their games list :(.
EDIT:
maybe i have to repeat myself :
can anyone aswer why there is the possibility to attack f6-allies?
why isnt the nc ally/hostile system similar to the eg. wow one?
I fail to see why you quoted me there.
Mighty Max
12-06-06, 22:54
maybe i have to repeat myself :
can anyone aswer why there is the possibility to attack f6-allies?
why isnt the nc ally/hostile system similar to the eg. wow one?
I'd guess due to the history of F6.
And tbh thats OK, there are subgroups that have been in fight with other groups of the same ally for some reasons.
The contraproductive only starts, when there is nothing. I mean the "big ones" of this business declare to have roleplay reasons to do so. Yet, the victim does not ever get a glimse on this. Not even a lil' line of text after the kill beside the random "sex". What do you expect them then?
I mean, that surely has to be fun and is great ...
... for some few.
Yes i know that this is a cyberpunk game, where the bad side of mankind turns out, yet we are all playing to grab some fun.
And allways when this comes up these ppl tell "keep your LE in" or "stay away" and shrink the abilities of ppl. Completely in oposition to the "Thats the good on NC, you can do whatever you want" told be the same poster.
SorkZmok: Does it need to be a vorbidden action to be an abuse? Isn't it the over way around? Abuse causes rules that vorbid them. PvP in the ally is indeed good, when it gives something to the game. Abuse jumps in, when these kills only drains the fun.
Making plaza 1 a safezone, introducing the absurd new sl system that came with evo, people losing sl for killing enemies nevermind allies in hunting zones. This is what makes people leave the game not ally pk'n.
If they leave the game then good riddance.You said it.
Works both ways ;)
I fail to see why you quoted me there.
you didnt answer my question, thats why.
but it has already been answered.
Asurmen Spec Op
13-06-06, 06:03
Shoot first and let the bullets sort the enemy out!
you didnt answer my question, thats why.
but it has already been answered.
I see, I didn't answer your question because you asked everyone. I'm glad someone has answered your question.
it would have been very stupid if you'd have answered the question.
because in that case you'd say "i'm ssshhhhtupid" ...
next time you start whining about f6 abusing ally pkers (maybe they're exploiter, because .. yea .. f6 and abusage .. xploit...) think why it is possible to attack your f6 allies.
and start an "ally-pking" search.
SorkZmok, I understand that you and others disagree with me here, especially so considering how much of a sensitive issue it is to many people. And it is perfectly true that not everyone is abusing it, so it could get much worse. But at the same time, I think you should take into consideration how much some people's fun is ruined by this great problem. And in fact, even those abusing it today might get abused tomorrow instead, as it gets more and more widespread. The risk is here, it's real, and unless we want more and more people to quit, we need to get the devs to do something about it!
as long as you are talking about "abusing" your post is cruft in my eyes.
I think you should take into consideration how much some people's fun is ruined by this great problem. And in fact, even those abusing it today might get abused tomorrow instead, as it gets more and more widespread. The risk is here, it's real, and unless we want more and more people to quit, we need to get the devs to do something about it!
If someones fun is been ruined by been killed then why on Earth is that perosn playing neocron. If yo cant take been killed you should not have took your le out, its as simple as that.
And stop throwing the word abuse about so much, the most abuse ingame is when you kill crying pathetic little whiners much like yourselsf and they hurtle abuse in a DM.
Death by Alliepk is a consequese of your own actions.
The majority of the playerbase, and this has been proven a large number of times even on these very boards, mostly wants to play [one kind of PvP]. The problem is that the gameplay mechanics change if they force them to engage in [another kind of PvP]. Such a thing has limited the potential playerbase of many games in the past, and it is crucial for the developers to realize that. I fully understand that from your own objective point of view, you might not agree with me, but plenty of others will. Heck, mostly everyone I know will, and I suspect many others too. I'd be surprised if you knew nobody having such a point of view. This board isn't a representation of the majority of the userbase, which I'm sure you understand. As such, a change is truly necessary.
our objevtive point of view?
1.) aly pking is allowed
2.) ally pking is not against any rules
3.) ally pking is not any kind of abuse
fact. proven.
objective.
your point of view is not very objective, you're whining about something which is 1.) allowed, 2.) not against any rules, 3.) not an abuse of the game mechanics.
a change would be truly necessery if f6 ally pking would be used eg for griefplaying.
but its not.
you just think people are abusing the system or maybe just kill f6 allies to grief them.
but you are wrong.
face the facts, if you can.
You indeed highlight two key facts in your reply: Ally PKing is currently allowed, and it's not against any current rule. The last point, however, is much more debatable. Just about any game mechanic can be abused if you're creative enough about it. As such, saying it is "not any kind of abuse" isn't quite objective at all, unlike your other ideas. You argue that people aren't abusing it. I don't think there's any reliable way for someone to know that for sure. - the only thing you can objectively say is that you haven't had anyone abusing it against you, or at least not in a too dishonorable way. In practice, however, plenty of people are abusing it to an extend or another, at least in the eyes of the "victims". What matters for the developers is to strive for a perfect balance, pleasing as many people as possible. Thus, if you say few people are abusing it, and that I claim that there still are a high number of victimes (hell should I know, considering how many I have seen!), why not let the developers do something about it? It doesn't have to be drastic, but at least giving a reason not to do it systematically would be a good idea...
DUDE its an opwar zone FFS clans fight each other in it regaurdless of faction, there is no abuse here, the game has been this way since release. If it was not a warzone they would have lost alot of SL because thats the punishment for random pking outside of warzones.
Just about any game mechanic can be abused if you're creative enough about it.
ok, why not being a smart one and either keep their names in mind or change faction?
As such, saying it is "not any kind of abuse" isn't quite objective at all, unlike your other ideas. You argue that people aren't abusing it. I don't think there's any reliable way for someone to know that for sure.
you want ppl to be punishment, coz the way they play can be used to grief ppl.
in that case every single runner in nc has to be punished :rolleyes: .
In practice, however, plenty of people are abusing it to an extend or another, at least in the eyes of the "victims".
i dont get it how ppl can feel griefed by getting killed in a pvp game.
if they kill you once it cant be griefing imo. next time you'll know who these ppl are, you'll know that they arent allied with you.
Thus, if you say few people are abusing it, and that I claim that there still are a high number of victimes (hell should I know, considering how many I have seen!), why not let the developers do something about it? It doesn't have to be drastic, but at least giving a reason not to do it systematically would be a good idea...
in op-fights alot of ppl are getting killed. and they dont like it, to be honest, they hate it to get killed. and i'm pretty sure some players are killing others to grief them, they abuse the pvp-system!
the developers should do something about it.
why? because .. alot of people dont like it!
we already gave you alot of reasons why a punishment (besides -sl, -fs) is senseless.
Meh, some of you just need to come out and say you're proud of ally killing, and you feel it's a priviledge you want to keep. That's alright, it's your opinion. And I perfectly well know not all of you are in that position either, so please don't feel insulted. Still, that makes you even more subjective than I am, so please, don't bother responding anymore - we got your point, and I disagree. In the end, let others judge how right or wrong we both are. I can only hope the silent majority will wake up for once.
"fight" between facts and opinions... and you want others to judge whats right or wrong? hokay, lets see whats going to happen.
Meh, some of you just need to come out and say you're proud of ally killing, and you feel it's a priviledge you want to keep. That's alright, it's your opinion. And I perfectly well know not all of you are in that position either, so please don't feel insulted. Still, that makes you even more subjective than I am, so please, don't bother responding anymore - we got your point, and I disagree. In the end, let others judge how right or wrong we both are. I can only hope the silent majority will wake up for once.
I hope you wake up to the fact that ally killing is here, always has been, and will stay.
P.S. BTW welcome to my KoS list, my reasons, your 8 pages of arguments thread crashed my RN Term. ;)
P.S. BTW welcome to my KoS list, my reasons, your 8 pages of arguments thread crashed my RN Term. ;)
Haha, sorry, not entirely my fault :(. Should I pm you my characters so you know who to kos? :D
i changed your post a little bit. now it shows what you really mean.
ppl who kill their enemies = tossers?
you're an idiot.
in a multiplayer game there might be players who act in way that you dislike.
but guess what ?! you have to deal with it.
Ah, see, I think we've had a misunderstanding from reading all your posts.
When I say "abuse" the system, I'm NOT talking about killing allies. I have nothing against being able to kill your allies. What I was suggesting was, many of the people that kill their allies don't really see themselves as allies - and the system can be more dynamic and accomidating for people that feel in such a way.
For example, instead of the strict faction system we have now, what if sympathy was dynamic in a way that, if you had a low sympathy with a faction - even an allied one, you would appear red to those players.
The "abuse" I was referring to, was the fact that some people hide behind a green box, and try to blindside their opponent instead of fighting them head on. I'm all for PvP and ally killing if you've got a problem with them... but that's not really the "abuse" I was talking about. I see the system as somewhat inflexible, if you're allied to another person's faction, you're green no matter what - but some people abuse this and ACT like an ally when its convenient to do so, and then turn coat. Wouldn't you rather like a system in which, if you wanted to kill everyone or some from another faction or clan, you can actually appear to them as red?
I mean, getting in a fight where both parties can see it coming in advance, like a red box person coming towards you is a more fun fight. It's not one sided for the first part. The goal is to have fun, and it's more fun to actually get in a fight than just kill the other without their responding. Likewise, I don't really see the fun in killing newbies, and by that I mean going out of your way to go where they are... not just from them being intermixed with other runners - in which case too bad for them.
What I'm saying is, everyone should remember names and know who not to trust, and be wary... but as long as there IS a system in place to identify "friend or foe" it should be more realistic and meaningful by not being so inflexible as to encourage abuse. Abuse meaning getting help from an ally one second and then turning on them, like a tradeskiller, or whatever.
Asurmen Spec Op
13-06-06, 20:08
KK should not limit allied PKing in any ways, it is not a mechanics issue it is a community issue!
If the MAJORITY of the community does NOT want allied PKing then they can try and stop it!
I never see anyone trying to put any effort into getting revenge against me after i've killed them. If i ever get killed i always make sure that the person who killed me dies within the hour, and maybe people should take the same approach to people who ally kill.
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