View Full Version : Neocron Ping,
I get around 70-80 in NC and 120 on my American CS server..... but if i download a file over a torrent, dload is only 20kb/s and upload is only 10kb/s (Slow torrent) my NC ping shoots to 4 digit numbers where as my CS ping stays the same.
Why does dloading effect NC so much?
Scanner Darkly
15-05-06, 15:28
For me it was not only nc ping that got screwed by running p2p software (with lowered speed like you) it affected CS just as much... Although for me the ping jumped to 200-300 not to 1000s ms in both NC and CS:S.
The answer is don't run p2p software when gaming you muppet :rolleyes:
The upload speed in your bittorrent is killing your ping
Turn off your illegal warez tbh for later
For me it was not only nc ping that got screwed by running p2p software (with lowered speed like you) it affected CS just as much... Although for me the ping jumped to 200-300 not to 1000s ms in both NC and CS:S.
The answer is don't run p2p software when gaming you muppet :rolleyes:
Yes, but that wasnt the Q, the Q was why does it effect NC more than CS
Doesn't NC need more Ports open?
Because I'm a noob, I'd say that's why
havign more ports open does not mean it shoul ping spike to 4 digits. i could understand if i got he same ping in anarchy/armegtron/cs but nope just nc.
and its not illegal warez. only imamture assholes think Torrents are all warez. did you ether notice you get things like the neocron client in torrent
what is your line? it happens alot to DSL-Lines, but not so much to the cables. even if your download/upload of your torrent isnt so much, remember the overhead+the rest of the protocol u are using while your torrent is connected!
Dribble Joy
15-05-06, 18:02
NC is not an fps. It is an MMO with the interface of an fps. It uses FAR more bandwidth than CS ever will. Thus any reduction in your upload (and to an extent download) bandwidth will have a much larger impact on NC's ping.
Scanner Darkly
15-05-06, 20:46
Yes, but that wasnt the Q, the Q was why does it effect NC more than CS
My answer was that in my experience, the drop in ping seemed similar in both nc and cs. I was using different p2p softs and a different u/d rates than you tho...
Still, DJ's post makes sense...
NC is not an fps. It is an MMO with the interface of an fps. It uses FAR more bandwidth than CS ever will. Thus any reduction in your upload (and to an extent download) bandwidth will have a much larger impact on NC's ping.
QFT
Pantho, stop being a tit :p
It uses FAR more bandwidth than CS ever will. Thus any reduction in your upload (and to an extent download) bandwidth will have a much larger impact on NC's ping.That's not actually true, for a combination of reasons.
NC is not a true `hitscan` based trajectory engine so therefore has to do a hell of a lot less finegrained timeslice object position tracking, so that evens things out a bit.
CS default client bandwidth is actually higher than NCs, and can (at the discretion of server config) be set a lot higher.
NCs major handicap is that it's hard locked serverside to a very low bandwidth per client setting, a legacy of dialup modem capabilities that hasnt been changed in the 5+ years since the netcode was being configged.
As a consequence of this a whole variety of NC positional updates happen (comparatively) very infrequently, to keep within this very tight bandwidth restriction.
Client/server architecture differences aside, your second point is not true either.
Ping is just a measure of round-trip time for a packet - line saturation will affect both equally.
For what it's worth I don't see any difference in ping degradation between NC/CS/other-FPS when I have background net activity going. I'd suggest looking at your ISP and see if they are doing some sort of rate-shaping/QoS/throttling on your line when you are using P2P.
NC is not an fps. It is an MMO with the interface of an fps. It uses FAR more bandwidth than CS ever will. Thus any reduction in your upload (and to an extent download) bandwidth will have a much larger impact on NC's ping.
ty for a simple answer *_* :p
o kurai u and your gigantic networking skillz
NC is not a true `hitscan` based trajectory engine so therefore has to do a hell of a lot less finegrained timeslice object position tracking, so that evens things out a bit.
WHOOOOSH !!!
"What the fuck was that?!"
That went over my head faster than a jet.
:p
ty for a simple answer *_* :p
Even if it's wrong ;)
NCs major handicap is that it's hard locked serverside to a very low bandwidth per client setting, a legacy of dialup modem capabilities that hasnt been changed in the 5+ years since the netcode was being configged.
Actually, this has been tweaked a few times over the years. Also, I'd argue that a system that permits an MMO FPS environment even on a lowly 56K connection is a "handicap". :p
N
It's probably your router.
I've used a few different routers with NC and torrents - LinkSys, Wirespeed from Verizon, a Linux box, and now a m0n0wall (http://www.m0n0.ch/wall) machine.
LinkSys (WRT54G) and Wirespeed fall over. Too many connections, and everything slows down. It doesn't matter if it's a low upload/download speed, it's the sheer number of open connections that make it balk.
Linux doesn't have these issues. If anything, my Linux box in the past was the most efficient router I've used at home.
m0n0wall does a better job with connections, but when queueing is used to allocate available bandwidth, it does so at the cost of latency. However, there's a workaround - put your torrent traffic in its own pipe and make that pipe smaller than the actual size of your connection's rated upload/download speed. With my torrent traffic in its own pipe, there's no latency increase. It's the best solution I've found so far, allowing me to game on the same DSL line I download/upload with and incur only a minimal increase in latency (10 to 20 ms).
Actually, this has been tweaked a few times over the years. Also, I'd argue that a system that permits an MMO FPS environment even on a lowly 56K connection is a "handicap". :p
Nerm ... I presume you meant `argue that it isn't a handicap`, Shirley ? :angel:
Anyway - assuming that's the view you were promoting I can see how it might be spun as an "inclusivity" policy, *but* ... the world has moved on.
The balance has unequivocally shifted from dialup to broadband of one form or another.
There comes a time when a business decision has to be made. How long do you continue to run a sub-optimal service to cater to the lowest common denominator, when it adversely affects the majority of ones customer base ?
I am a realist. I appreciate that a change in the netcode would need investment from KK/10Tacel/partners (more bandwidth provision, and likely more serverside processing power to cope with the increased updates per second. With all the goodwill in the world just tweaking the netcode and keeping the same bandwidth cap isn't going to cut it any more.) - and that with the low userbase money is no doubt exceedingly tight.
Is that going to happen for a game that never really hit financial "critical mass" and, as the years drag on, is getting more and more outdated (argue fine detail, but the game is essentially unchanged in it's core mechanics from 2002) ?
At some point the churn/wastage of customers is going to outstrip new subscriptions by a margin big enough that no new investment will be sensible/feasible. Ever.
Putting in some resources/money now, before that happens might just extend the game's life for another couiple of years.
Here's hoping ;)
Why does dloading effect NC so much?
Simply because bitorrent is a P2P application and you will get tons.. I mean TONS of packets, filling your bandwidth capacity.
Dave_ThePe
16-05-06, 23:18
erm ... I presume you meant `argue that it isn't a handicap`, Shirley ? :angel:
Anyway - assuming that's the view you were promoting I can see how it might be spun as an "inclusivity" policy, *but* ... the world has moved on.
The balance has unequivocally shifted from dialup to broadband of one form or another.
There comes a time when a business decision has to be made. How long do you continue to run a sub-optimal service to cater to the lowest common denominator, when it adversely affects the majority of ones customer base ?
I am a realist. I appreciate that a change in the netcode would need investment from KK/10Tacel/partners (more bandwidth provision, and likely more serverside processing power to cope with the increased updates per second. With all the goodwill in the world just tweaking the netcode and keeping the same bandwidth cap isn't going to cut it any more.) - and that with the low userbase money is no doubt exceedingly tight.
Is that going to happen for a game that never really hit financial "critical mass" and, as the years drag on, is getting more and more outdated (argue fine detail, but the game is essentially unchanged in it's core mechanics from 2002) ?
At some point the churn/wastage of customers is going to outstrip new subscriptions by a margin big enough that no new investment will be sensible/feasible. Ever.
Putting in some resources/money now, before that happens might just extend the game's life for another couiple of years.
Here's hoping ;)
I would think the bolded part has already happened?
I always thought the spiral model was a good proccess for all MMO's in that you should keep the development cycles low (3/6 months to a year) and know when to quit.
Scanner Darkly
17-05-06, 02:08
I would think the bolded part has already happened?
I always thought the spiral model was a good proccess for all MMO's in that you should keep the development cycles low (3/6 months to a year) and know when to quit.
Noone can argue KK haven't got gumption and staying power :lol:
I would think the bolded part has already happened?
I always thought the spiral model was a good proccess for all MMO's in that you should keep the development cycles low (3/6 months to a year) and know when to quit.Well - personally I thought they were long past the point of no return prior to the NC2 launch ... then they pulled 10Tacel out of the bag and the life support process re-started (albeit they ended up with the millstone of Click2Pay tied round their neck as part of the deal)
I've mentioned before that I have a lot of experience with the business models and infrastructure of online corporate ventures - I know what the real world costbase is like.
Current populations, even assuming the paying but not playing headcount ratio is high, just don't seem to be able to cover anywhere near the overheads.
I think it's about time to pull another magic rabbit out of the hat, otherwise Neocron is finally going to stop circling the drain and just ... end. DNR.
My favoured theory is that it is all just some cunning corporate finance wheeze exploiting a loophole in EU/German tax laws and development grants, for big write-offs ;)
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